Mastering Visual Storytelling for Your Brand with John Demato

Summary

In this episode of 'Present Influence,' John delves into the art of visual storytelling with expert photographer John Demato.

They discuss how images and photos on websites and social channels contribute to brand identity, moving beyond superficial appearances.

John Demato shares valuable insights on creating strategic, intentional imagery that builds credibility and fosters audience connections.

The conversation also covers essential visual elements for coaches, speakers, and authors, explaining why professional photos are a worthwhile investment.

From ideal shoot setups to common pitfalls, this episode offers a comprehensive guide for anyone looking to strengthen their visual branding.

Tune in to learn actionable tips on photo variety, authenticity, and why professional aesthetics matter.

Visit John Demato's Website here: https://www.johndemato.com/ and check out John's blog here

Let me know if you're going to be upping your game with visual storytelling after this episode.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to Visual Storytelling

00:17 Meet John Demato: Visual Storytelling Expert

00:52 The Importance of Visual Branding

01:13 Welcome to Present Influence

02:13 Understanding Visual Storytelling

04:30 Strategic Planning for Visual Branding

06:05 Practical Tips for Visual Storytelling

13:19 Essential Images for Your Website

21:57 Maximising Your Photo Shoot

24:07 Leveraging Your Visual Content

27:14 Common Mistakes and How to Avoid Them

39:20 The Never-Ending Story of Visual Branding

42:27 Conclusion and Final Thoughts

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What do your visual images or photos say about you and your brand?

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Continuing with the theme of visual

storytelling that we started last week,

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in this episode, we're going to take a

look at the story, our website and our

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online images tell about who we are.

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My guest today is professional

photographer and visual storytelling

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expert John Demato, and John helps

speakers, trainers, consultants,

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and authors, and coaches create

compelling imagery that elevates

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their brand, builds credibility, and

connects deeply with your audience.

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He's gonna share with us how you can best

tell your visual brand story and have

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compelling visual story elements in all

the right places, in all the right ways.

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It's not always easy knowing what

images you need or, how you should

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be appearing for your audience.

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If you want to feel confident that your

visual storytelling isn't letting you

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down or potentially damaging trust,

then you'll find out exactly how to do

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that, how much to invest in it, what

pictures you'll need, and why, if you

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have a book, you should have some good

photos instead of digital mockups.

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This episode covers it all.

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So welcome to Present Influence the

show that helps coaches, speakers, and

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communication professionals develop the

skills to impact, influence, and inspire.

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My name's John Ball, keynote

coach, professional speaker,

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and your guide on the journey.

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Two mastery level presentation skills.

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My mission is to provide professional

communicators like you with

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everything you need to maximize your

impact and present with influence.

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Welcome to Present Influence,

John, and I'm particularly

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excited to be talking to you.

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I recently had an episode where we're

talking about visual storytelling, but

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from maybe a different perspective to

yours, where that was about slideshows.

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to me the elements of visual

storytelling that you work with.

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John Demato: First of all,

thanks for having me on.

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I appreciate it.

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John, I like your name.

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Visual storytelling is the opportunity

for those that are experts who speak,

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coach, train consultant, write books to

share who they are, who they serve, the

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problems they solve, and how they solve

those problems through the photos that

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they share with their audience online.

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And that involves branding images, where

they're looking into the camera, or we're

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recreating day-to-day moments in their

life and how they serve their people.

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Or if it's actual events, be

it a keynote or mastermind.

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Coaching session, retreat, whatever that

case may be, they share those photos.

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Or if for authors, it could involve photos

of their book and not just the digital

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mockup of the cover, it would be actual

photos in an environment of the book

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Spine and Cover, as well as the inside

pages that are focused on section headers

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and chapter titles, illustrations and

poll quotes, and other design elements.

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Basically, visual storytelling is the

opportunity for people to prove what

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they say is true by how they show up

and what they share in their photos.

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John: Yeah, because no matter what we do.

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How we appear to other people is always

gonna be judged a particular way.

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I dunno what my visual

storytelling is right now.

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Probably not great.

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how we come across to our audiences,

how we show up with we are tidy

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or scruffy if we're well dressed.

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If we're not these things matter and

people will pick up on it and judge it.

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They may not be aware that they're.

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Doing that, but they will.

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And so what guidance would you

have for coaches and speakers and

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consultants to help them just figure

out how they should be appearing?

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John Demato: The first step is

before you set foot in front of a

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camera to actually have a strategic

and intentional plan, meaning.

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Understand how you want to be perceived

by your audience, whether it's

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intelligent, knowledgeable, experienced,

fill in the blank there as well as what

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are the aspects of your personality

that you want to share with them.

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Are you funny?

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Are you irreverent?

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Are you direct and honest?

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Whatever those words happen

to be, and you start from.

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There.

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Now you mentioned Scruffy.

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For some people, that actually is

exactly what they should look like.

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They should look scruffy.

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The point being is you need to be uniquely

yourself because when you show up in

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a room of people and you don't look

like the photos that you have online.

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Congratulations.

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You've just lost the

trust of that entire room.

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As a result, whatever it is that

your life looks like outside of

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that photo session, it needs to be

represented in that photo session.

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John: So let's say for me, and

this is certainly probably not

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represented by how I'm dressed today,

but let's say I'm aiming for Warmth

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competence, humor, and intelligence.

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What would I want to be thinking of to

make sure I'm representing that with

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my public image, with my pictures?

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John Demato: The first step is

thinking about what you're gonna wear.

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And the answer to that question is,

go to your closet, look what you

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have, and pick out the stuff that

you wear in front of people who pay

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you money, and that part is covered.

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Then the second part to get

more into that you described.

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The way that you convey that through

your images, specifically during a

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branding session, would be the way

in which you present yourself in

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front of the camera through your

facial expression, the movement

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of your eyes, eyebrows, and mouth.

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As well as your body language.

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What are you doing with your posture,

your hands, your arms all of that stuff

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combined creates the sentiments that

you describe on top of the fact that the

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photographer's aesthetic with lighting

and composition in different frames

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also contribute to that sentiment.

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So all of that, together during a

branding session will create those

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sentiments you're looking for.

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And then in any live scenario,

regardless if you're on stage in front

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of the room or talking to participants

after the fact, you're going to

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naturally convey these things because

that's who you are in those moments.

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And those photos are candid.

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You're not putting on a show

for the camera, so they're

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gonna naturally come out anyway.

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John: Which makes a lot of sense.

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So really if we want to come across

professionally we do need to have

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professional photos that we're gonna use.

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John Demato: Yes,

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John: okay.

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John Demato: yes, you need professional

images as the front door to your

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online presence, and you need them

for different promotional vehicles,

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different marketing assets that you're

going to create, and there is a certain

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level of perception that you create

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from leveraging these high

quality professional photos.

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At the same time, you also are not

gonna have a paparazzi following you

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around 24 7 during your day to day.

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And there are moments that happen

throughout your day, regardless of

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your business, that you want to share

with your audience because they're

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relevant and relatable to them.

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Having that camera in

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your pocket 24 7 is a valuable asset

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and you need

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to be able

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to use it in a way to create images that

are going to connect with your audience

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because regardless of what your expertise

is, regardless of what your business

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looks like, you are in the business

of building relationships If you are a

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service-based business.

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John: Do you have any best

practices for doing that?

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Is it more about spontaneity

or what would you say?

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John Demato: Something is better than

nothing because if a moment happens

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and you don't have a photo of it.

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The moment never happened.

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So there is that.

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With that being said, there are some

best practices and probably one of

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the best ones would be to actually

I could say two right off the bat.

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Pay attention to where the

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lighting is.

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If you're standing in front of a

window and you look like you're

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a hostage victim because you're

silhouetted, that's a bad photo.

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Don't do that.

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Find the light.

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Let the light be on you so

that you are bright enough and

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whomever you're standing with.

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Is lit as well.

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We want to be able to see your face,

see the expression, see that moment.

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So make sure you pay attention

to where your lighting source is.

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And the second big one is a lot of

people like to, where's my phone?

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Here's my phone.

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So I like to grab their phone and

then instead of having it eye level.

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Looking right at the camera.

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They, for, some reason wanna post

it where they're looking straight

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up as if a helicopter is taking it's

from a helicopter vantage point.

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Don't do that because the higher

that you bring the phone as

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you're taking the photo, the more.

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Subconsciously, you're telling your

audience that you're insecure about

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how you look, and if you want to convey

a level of confidence, competence,

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and expertise, the more insecure you

look could be one of the subconscious

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determining factors for a potential

client to say, you know what?

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I don't buy the fact that this person

is really comfortable in their own

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skin and potentially not comfortable

being the expert that they are.

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So I'm gonna go start

looking for someone else.

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John: All right.

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That definitely makes

a lot of sense to me.

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And so it is really far better to

own what you perceive as your flaws.

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I've seen this a lot in speaking

particularly, and I just yesterday was

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speaking to a awesome lady who teaches

like comedy workshops, license, and

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that's very much what she was saying.

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You have to own your flaws for people

to laugh with you rather than at you.

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And so you have to be vulnerable to

that degree and just say, this is me.

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This is who I am.

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There's nothing really to hide there.

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And you can go out and deliver that.

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So that does make a lot of sense to me.

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John Demato: Yeah, I put it

a little bit differently.

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I'm definitely aligned

with that sentiment.

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It's more about creating a reframe in

your mind as an expert to understand the

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purpose of what These photos are for.

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These photos are to present you

as a relevant expert that has done

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this before, done it recently, and

done it for people just like them.

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As a result, these photos are not for you.

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These photos for the opportunity

for someone who needs what you can,

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solve for them to help them get

past what's holding them back.

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Get over yourself.

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Get over these perceived flaws that

you have because I can tell you, as

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someone who has hired experts, the

last thing that I care about is if

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their left ear lobe is bigger than

their right, that 30 pounds overweight,

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that they're older and have wrinkles,

that one eye is bigger than the other.

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I could care less if they had a.

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Third eye literally blinking at me while

they were helping me get past my problem.

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And that's exactly what

your people are thinking.

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And that means you have to look

from within and own yourself.

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Own your flaws, however

you wanna label it.

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Just own who you are in

that moment and get to work.

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John: Yeah, I think some of these are

essentially similar principles for getting

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over stage fright, let alone know, being

camera shy and really valuable ones

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is that we do absolutely need to own

ourselves and remember that it's not.

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Even really about us.

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It's about serving our audience and

being able to make a difference there.

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So sometimes we just need to

get over it and get on with it.

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Let me ask you, web websites are

very important for coaches and

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speakers and pretty much everyone

these days despite I've seen a few

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people around saying otherwise, I

don't really believe that's the case.

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But what are some of the essential

images that, we probably should

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have on our professional websites?

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John Demato: It depends upon

who we're talking about.

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Are we talking about an

expert who speaks on stages?

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Then yes, we need to see

photos of you on stages.

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Are you a consultant?

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Then we need to see images of

you consulting, whether it's on a

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screen, on the phone, in a boardroom.

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In a conference room with some

really crappy panel walls we need

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to see that, or it needs to be

recreated during a branding session.

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If you're an author.

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Where's your book?

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We need to see what that

looks like if you're a coach.

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Same thing as a consultant.

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If it's on a screen, in person on

the phone, we need to see that.

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The point being is whatever you

do and whatever the tentacles

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of your services look like.

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We need to see them and they need

to be on the pages in which you're

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talking about what that service is.

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In addition to those images, what

we also need to see is the before

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and after all of those moments.

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What do those.

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Engagements look like.

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Those conversations look like talking

with participants, talking with

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the AV crew, talking to the event

planners, talking to the person that

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hired you, whatever that looks like.

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We need to see those moments.

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Your prep moments, you're sitting

there mulling over a speech.

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You have a book signing,

you're setting up.

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Area.

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We wanna see all of that stuff.

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Bring people into your world so that

they feel more connected to you,

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because that helps the buying decision.

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It helps you stand out from other

experts in your space because

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there's 9 million of them.

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And then of course, at the very top.

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The fundamentals.

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We need to see the headshot, the

tightly cropped shot from the top

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of the head to the top of the chest.

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We need to see some wider portraits.

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We need to see a couple

of vertical portraits.

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Those images go everywhere as your calling

card for your media speaker PR kit.

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They go on all your social

profiles as well as your website.

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So long story short, you need a lot

of damn photos to be able to present

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yourself as the expert that you are.

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And that command is the

premium prices that you do.

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John: I can understand that.

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How many photos would you say roughly

that someone would need to have available

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and ready for, at least from a website?

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John Demato: The better question is

how many holes on your pages do you

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actually have First the key is to

understand that, number one, are we going

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with video or photos for the banner?

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Start there.

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What do you wanna lead with in

terms of what your service is?

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If you're A Slashy, being a speaker,

coach, trainer, consultant, author, the.

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different tentacles and

what do you wanna lead with?

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And then on each of those pages,

after you've figured out the top of

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the fold banner, you wanna look and

say, okay, do I have 97,000 graphics

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and a whole hell of a lot of logos

from companies that I'm trusted by?

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Where can I add in some images to add some

humanity, break up the text and visually

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punctuate the sentiment of that text.

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So it really begins and ends with

understanding where the holes are, how

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many images you want, what are the, what

are you speaking about on each of those

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pages, and then you reverse engineer.

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From there, the amount of

photos that you would need.

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But what I will tell you is the more

visual variety, the better meaning.

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Don't just be in a studio and don't

just shoot stuff against the blank wall.

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Be in environments in which you serve

your people, and you're conveying

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that, those perception words and

those personality words that we

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discussed earlier in the conversation.

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And then that way It breaks up the pages

and it creates a little more you and

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more genuine opportunities for people

to, connect with you outside of the

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fact that you can solve their problem.

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John: Yeah, I think that makes sense.

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I've only worked with

people in the past who.

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Have had professional photo shoots

done and then because they've had

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it, done, they've used as many

photos as they can on their website.

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'cause they were already

happy they got it done.

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And sometimes even that's been

with the exact same outfit, just

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in different poses, but in the same

studio it definitely looks too much.

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And sometimes we've even seen that

mixed in with stock images on the

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website, which I think probably need

to be somewhat careful about when

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we're using stock images as well.

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John Demato: I would, so when it

comes to wearing the same outfit

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in every shot, you look cheap.

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You don't look like you're

befitting that of an expert or

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a go-to authority in your space.

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It looks like you shot everything

on the same day, and while that is

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something that everyone understands,

you don't wanna create that perception.

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It looks like you didn't care

enough to think more deeply about.

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How you wanna present yourself visually,

because that, again, subconsciously

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tells people if they don't care about

that, are they gonna care about me?

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And you don't want that kind of doubt

in their minds because it's gonna make

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the buying decision far more difficult.

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and then in terms of overdoing

it, here's the reality.

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You don't need to overdo it because The

truth is, you have so many other places

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that you can leverage these images.

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It's not even funny.

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Aside from the fact that you

have online content and a

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newsletter and your PR media kit.

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You also have all of those printed

materials that you have when you are

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at a conference, you have your training

materials, as well as other marketing

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assets that you used throughout

the year for different campaigns.

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You can leverage these photos in a

wide variety of places, and if you

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just overload it on your website, it

looks like you're trying too hard.

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And we don't want to do that either.

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John: Yeah, absolutely.

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And certainly that was my advice.

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'cause I'm not.

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Expert on this, like you but it was very

obvious that it was just a bit too much

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of the same thing over and over again.

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When someone comes to you for, a

photo shoot, are they generally

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gonna be expecting to have website

pictures, social media, pictures?

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What's the range of photos that.

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professionals would

generally come to you to get?

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John Demato: The general rule on

that is I meet people where they are.

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For some folks, they have absolutely no

idea what the hell they need because,

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okay I'm getting a new branding package

and part of it includes the website

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and I don't know what I need, but they

just said I need to look professional.

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Okay, great.

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Duh.

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We know that.

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John: Yeah.

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John Demato: Aside from that.

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What I'm basically trying to do in that

initial call is not just understand

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what their short-term needs are,

because there are some folks who

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do have a firm understanding of the

value of these images and are ready

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to implement all over the place, but.

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For many they just have

a piece of the story.

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So what I'm doing is illuminating all

of the aforementioned areas I mentioned

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before, aside from 10 other ones that

I didn't mention to let them know, Hey,

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With these images, it's not just about

what you need for tomorrow, it's also

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about what you need for next week, six

months from now and up to and including

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a year, depending upon the volume of

the amount of images that you plan on

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using throughout your social content

and your newsletters and thumbnails

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for videos, et cetera, et cetera.

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So everybody's customized.

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but it always starts with the

what do you need for tomorrow?

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Question.

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And then we go from there.

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John: What would be the average

amount of outfits that someone

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should bring with them for a good

quality professional photo shoot.

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John Demato: It depends.

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It depends on what they're going for.

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If they just need one quick headshot,

for something that they need for

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tomorrow, it'll be two outfits.

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The number is based on the amount of

time that we have for a branding session.

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So for example, I did a four hour

session yesterday and I told her

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to bring 12 to 16 different tops.

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And three to four pants

and a couple of dresses.

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She didn't bring that much.

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We ended up having to play, mix

and match for some of her layers

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to be able to create that variety.

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And that actually is a very

important thing to keep in mind.

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For folks that wear blazers, jackets,

cardigans, anything that's a layer.

365

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You can take photos with it on, and

that's one look, and then you're

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using it for, say, a headshot,

at the beginning of the session.

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And then we need to recreate you

facilitating a training session

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with slides two hours later.

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Grab that cardigan, change the shirt

underneath and now it's a new look.

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Or use the same shirt you used in that

first headshot without the cardigan and

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now all of a sudden it's a different look.

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So it's a bit of strategy

when you're in the room.

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But the most important thing is

to understand how many different

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scenarios you have that you're

creating during your branding session.

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How many promotional shots, the head

shots, the wider portraits you're

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aiming to get within your time.

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The timeframe of the session, and

then how many different day-to-day

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lifestyle scenarios are we capturing?

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How, shooting on working on your

computer or having a one-on-one

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consultation with someone or doing a

virtual session, something like that.

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Get all the numbers and make sure that you

have enough for each of those scenarios

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and always bring a little extra because

you never know when that extra layer

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or that extra piece that you bring.

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Could come into play.

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00:24:07,396 --> 00:24:12,941

John: Most of my coaching and

speaking friends and clients, will

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have a lot of social media presence.

387

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Now, some especially

do a really great job.

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They seem to have this amazing

library of photos that they pull

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from, that always look like they've

been done in professional photo

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00:24:24,461 --> 00:24:25,631

shoots from different reasons.

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00:24:25,741 --> 00:24:29,791

So if you wanted like maybe enough

images that you could probably use

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throughout, maybe not in every social

media thing that you do, but in, in

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enough to maybe have you going through.

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12 months without having to overuse

the same ni how many would be

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within a range of optimal for that,

396

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John Demato: It's not the

amount, it's the variety.

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John: right?

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John Demato: And what I mean by that is.

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The variety in the way that the photos

are composed wide, medium close.

400

00:24:56,612 --> 00:25:00,512

I don't just mean photos

that involve your face.

401

00:25:00,842 --> 00:25:02,402

Let's see The details.

402

00:25:02,402 --> 00:25:04,502

The devil is in the details.

403

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If you're, Someone who writes

in a day planner or a journal.

404

00:25:10,697 --> 00:25:11,207

Let's see.

405

00:25:11,207 --> 00:25:16,387

Closeups of that pen when you're working

on your laptop or your tablet, let's see.

406

00:25:16,387 --> 00:25:24,027

Closeups of what that looks like if

there are certain pieces of swag that

407

00:25:24,027 --> 00:25:26,277

you use or that you give to clients.

408

00:25:26,277 --> 00:25:31,977

Let's see what that looks like if there

are mementos or tchotchkes or other

409

00:25:31,977 --> 00:25:36,802

types of different props that you could

bring to the session, that you can have

410

00:25:36,802 --> 00:25:42,652

photos taken of and then shared with your

audience in a relevant and valuable way.

411

00:25:42,742 --> 00:25:44,392

Let's see what that looks like.

412

00:25:44,662 --> 00:25:48,892

Do you have books or manuals that

are important to what you do for a

413

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living that are absolute essentials

and would be relevant in valuable

414

00:25:53,332 --> 00:25:54,742

to share with your audience?

415

00:25:54,742 --> 00:25:57,742

Get photos of that stuff as well.

416

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And then when it comes to

the person and their face.

417

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Get them in black and white as well.

418

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And the reason is because it breaks

up the visual pattern of the same

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types of shots over and over again.

420

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And hearkening back to what

was said before that camera

421

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that's your pocket 24 7.

422

00:26:19,707 --> 00:26:25,287

That also comes into play and breaks it

up in addition to the fact that there

423

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are posts that you can create that

also can include text on the image.

424

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So then that also breaks it up.

425

00:26:33,567 --> 00:26:39,327

The other idea is to use posts without

images and just use text and quotes

426

00:26:39,477 --> 00:26:44,667

from your book or from your speech or

from other articles that you've created.

427

00:26:45,187 --> 00:26:50,197

You don't wanna bore your audience with

the same shots over and over again.

428

00:26:50,497 --> 00:26:53,527

You wanna break it up so that

you don't become noise, and

429

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that you stay a clear signal.

430

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And by being strategic and intentional

about how you leverage your image

431

00:26:59,827 --> 00:27:04,417

content portfolio, you are gonna

be able to achieve that goal.

432

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John: Yeah, that's good.

433

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I think we do need to look as

good as we can manage to make

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ourselves look on social media.

435

00:27:10,681 --> 00:27:12,661

It's certainly something I

need to get better at myself.

436

00:27:13,181 --> 00:27:13,781

Are there any.

437

00:27:14,791 --> 00:27:18,206

common mistakes that are actually

easily avoidable that you see people do.

438

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John Demato: One of 'em I

mentioned before, which is.

439

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If a moment happens and you don't have a

photo of it, that moment never happened.

440

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So that's definitely one of them.

441

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Another one that drives me absolutely

insane is now tell me if you've

442

00:27:36,927 --> 00:27:38,547

seen this kind of photo before.

443

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So let's say the person

is on their laptop, right?

444

00:27:42,827 --> 00:27:43,517

They're sitting.

445

00:27:44,267 --> 00:27:46,127

They have a coffee cup in their hand.

446

00:27:46,427 --> 00:27:52,277

They have one hand on the keyboard, and

instead of looking at the laptop, at

447

00:27:52,277 --> 00:27:57,047

the typing that they're pretending to

do, they look straight into the camera.

448

00:27:57,527 --> 00:27:58,517

Have you seen that photo

449

00:27:58,821 --> 00:27:59,456

John: Oh yeah.

450

00:27:59,546 --> 00:28:00,176

Even today, I

451

00:28:00,176 --> 00:28:00,446

think.

452

00:28:00,496 --> 00:28:05,161

John Demato: Yeah, so those photos

drive me up a wall because you're

453

00:28:05,161 --> 00:28:10,741

confusing your audience because you're

unnecessarily breaking the fourth wall.

454

00:28:11,371 --> 00:28:17,701

And what I mean, by that is you're

doing the, I am candidly working and

455

00:28:17,701 --> 00:28:21,361

I have my coffee cup and I'm doing my

thing and I'm working hard for you.

456

00:28:21,835 --> 00:28:22,185

John: Right.

457

00:28:22,291 --> 00:28:24,571

John Demato: at the same

time it's, Hey, look at me.

458

00:28:24,571 --> 00:28:25,051

Look at me.

459

00:28:25,051 --> 00:28:25,591

Look at me.

460

00:28:26,611 --> 00:28:27,751

Make a choice.

461

00:28:27,901 --> 00:28:28,531

yeah, go

462

00:28:28,695 --> 00:28:31,995

John: They're trying to connect

with you at the same time, but

463

00:28:32,085 --> 00:28:34,935

look, ultimately looking really

staged and fake because of it.

464

00:28:34,985 --> 00:28:38,105

John Demato: You're multitasking and

looking really stupid is what it is.

465

00:28:38,155 --> 00:28:43,975

So the solution to that problem is

this, either A, during your branding

466

00:28:43,975 --> 00:28:48,375

session you focus on getting the

promotional images, the ones where

467

00:28:48,375 --> 00:28:50,235

you're looking directly into the camera.

468

00:28:50,835 --> 00:28:56,965

Or B, you're doing candid, recreated

candid day-to-day lifestyle

469

00:28:56,965 --> 00:29:01,645

images, or you're working, you're

brainstorming, you're having moments

470

00:29:01,645 --> 00:29:05,695

of reflection, you're facilitating

and training, whatever that is.

471

00:29:05,875 --> 00:29:08,485

It's either A or B, not C.

472

00:29:08,545 --> 00:29:09,835

C doesn't exist.

473

00:29:09,895 --> 00:29:11,005

It looks dumb.

474

00:29:11,095 --> 00:29:12,805

Stop doing that.

475

00:29:13,465 --> 00:29:14,815

It's unnecessary.

476

00:29:16,540 --> 00:29:19,270

John: You may or may not have come across

this, you might have some awareness.

477

00:29:19,270 --> 00:29:19,720

I don't know.

478

00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:24,470

But there's this thing that was often

taught in a lot of, nLP based presentation

479

00:29:24,470 --> 00:29:27,080

classes of these five essential.

480

00:29:27,500 --> 00:29:33,900

Movements or body positions that represent

a particular emotion, like the, arms?

481

00:29:33,900 --> 00:29:38,350

crossed and finger on the chin, the

thinker or, they call the ator, which

482

00:29:38,350 --> 00:29:43,579

is the hands pointed upwards in front

of you, do those sorts of stances kind

483

00:29:43,579 --> 00:29:46,129

of work or do they just seem ridiculous?

484

00:29:46,679 --> 00:29:53,799

John Demato: I am not actually

familiar with that staged posturing.

485

00:29:54,129 --> 00:29:59,289

But the one rule that I live by

is I do not pose people ever.

486

00:30:00,039 --> 00:30:06,249

What I do is place a person in

a scenario, and then I tell them

487

00:30:06,249 --> 00:30:09,694

within that given scenario, what

would you be doing with your arms?

488

00:30:10,454 --> 00:30:12,374

What would you be doing with your hands?

489

00:30:13,004 --> 00:30:18,584

And then let them make the first move

and then I optimize it for the camera.

490

00:30:19,064 --> 00:30:20,294

Why is that important?

491

00:30:20,924 --> 00:30:26,564

Because they need to feel natural

in these images in order to

492

00:30:26,564 --> 00:30:28,454

convey that to their audience.

493

00:30:28,454 --> 00:30:32,564

If it's staged or posed like it's

a fashion or beauty shoot, it's

494

00:30:32,564 --> 00:30:34,964

gonna come off as inauthentic.

495

00:30:35,024 --> 00:30:38,564

And on top of that, they're not

gonna do those movements while

496

00:30:38,564 --> 00:30:41,444

they're in the room with these people

while they're paying the money.

497

00:30:42,064 --> 00:30:46,534

And the whole goal is to create

that genuine connection with your

498

00:30:46,534 --> 00:30:50,614

audience in a way that's gonna show

them what it looks like when they

499

00:30:50,614 --> 00:30:53,224

are in the room with you as a result.

500

00:30:53,354 --> 00:30:57,388

I honestly don't care what all of

that stuff . Is that you just said?

501

00:30:57,418 --> 00:31:02,128

Because what's more important is

what the person does in the room when

502

00:31:02,128 --> 00:31:04,498

they are in that particular scenario.

503

00:31:04,498 --> 00:31:09,028

For example, yesterday with the

woman that I was working with, I

504

00:31:09,028 --> 00:31:11,098

had her sitting at a lot of tables.

505

00:31:11,818 --> 00:31:15,628

And I would ask her, if you were

sitting across the table from a client

506

00:31:15,628 --> 00:31:19,768

right now having a conversation, what

would you be doing with your hands?

507

00:31:19,768 --> 00:31:22,348

Would you actually lean on your chin?

508

00:31:22,378 --> 00:31:23,398

And she did.

509

00:31:23,398 --> 00:31:25,438

And she had a couple of

different ways to do that.

510

00:31:25,438 --> 00:31:27,658

And I'm like, okay, let's

do another position.

511

00:31:27,658 --> 00:31:29,578

What would you do if

your hands were at rest?

512

00:31:29,818 --> 00:31:33,968

Are they, like clamp together

or the fingers intertwined?

513

00:31:33,968 --> 00:31:35,078

What does that look like?

514

00:31:35,138 --> 00:31:36,938

And then she would react.

515

00:31:36,938 --> 00:31:39,573

To that, and then I would photograph that.

516

00:31:39,963 --> 00:31:41,553

That's all it needs to be.

517

00:31:41,553 --> 00:31:43,593

This is not rocket science people.

518

00:31:43,683 --> 00:31:45,273

This is just photos.

519

00:31:45,363 --> 00:31:49,023

And you, if you just allow

yourself to be uniquely yourself,

520

00:31:49,593 --> 00:31:50,613

you're doing the right thing.

521

00:31:51,653 --> 00:31:56,153

John: It's one of those things I think

is, it's always hard to act natural when

522

00:31:56,153 --> 00:31:59,363

you're almost being asked to act natural.

523

00:31:59,363 --> 00:32:00,288

Do you know what I mean?

524

00:32:00,618 --> 00:32:02,508

John Demato: And John,

that's a great point.

525

00:32:02,758 --> 00:32:07,258

Qualify your photographer during that

discovery call to determine whether

526

00:32:07,258 --> 00:32:12,178

or not he or she is the right fit for

you to be in the same room with for a

527

00:32:12,178 --> 00:32:14,398

couple of hours during this session.

528

00:32:14,758 --> 00:32:17,938

Because rapport is everything.

529

00:32:18,448 --> 00:32:21,898

If you do not feel comfortable

with that person, it's going to

530

00:32:21,898 --> 00:32:28,048

feel very unnatural and it's going

to show up in every single photo.

531

00:32:28,108 --> 00:32:28,978

And guess what?

532

00:32:29,288 --> 00:32:32,438

Those photos are gonna suck, and

you know what you're gonna do

533

00:32:32,438 --> 00:32:34,778

with them absolutely nothing.

534

00:32:35,078 --> 00:32:40,928

So be very discerning with the people that

you hire That are standing in front of

535

00:32:40,928 --> 00:32:46,838

you with a lens pointed at your face, and

that's gonna go a very long way to making

536

00:32:46,838 --> 00:32:52,208

that uneasiness go away over time during

that session when you get used to them.

537

00:32:52,298 --> 00:32:56,948

And then what you'll do is drop your

guard, feel more present, and be more

538

00:32:56,948 --> 00:33:00,128

apt to share natural expressions.

539

00:33:00,923 --> 00:33:01,223

John: Yeah.

540

00:33:01,283 --> 00:33:04,043

that which may, you may have just

answered another question I had, which

541

00:33:04,043 --> 00:33:08,293

is about I, I'm someone who definitely

does not, I'm not camera shy, but I don't

542

00:33:08,293 --> 00:33:10,223

enjoy photo sessions get bored, I felt.

543

00:33:10,223 --> 00:33:13,583

But if you've got that rapport with a

photographer is that the main thing that

544

00:33:13,583 --> 00:33:16,013

will make the difference for that or are

there any other things that could help

545

00:33:16,013 --> 00:33:18,353

make it a better experience, do you think?

546

00:33:18,928 --> 00:33:20,783

John Demato: First of

all, congratulations.

547

00:33:20,783 --> 00:33:22,163

You're just like most people.

548

00:33:24,478 --> 00:33:32,638

Rapport definitely is at the top of that

list, what else really helps create that

549

00:33:32,638 --> 00:33:37,528

level of feeling comfortable and confident

in front of the camera is preparation.

550

00:33:38,428 --> 00:33:42,538

It's hearkening back to what I said

before about strategy and intention.

551

00:33:42,868 --> 00:33:47,278

If you know what you're shooting, if

you know where you're shooting it, if

552

00:33:47,278 --> 00:33:53,068

you know what outfits to bring, what

props you need to bring, what to expect,

553

00:33:53,368 --> 00:33:57,598

understand that you feel comfortable with

the person that was on the phone with you

554

00:33:57,598 --> 00:34:02,008

or on the Zoom during the strategy call

and the inquiry call and all of that.

555

00:34:02,863 --> 00:34:07,033

A lot of your hesitation is,

gonna go down significantly.

556

00:34:07,153 --> 00:34:12,172

Ultimately, when the rubber meets the

road, it could be a little bumpy at the

557

00:34:12,172 --> 00:34:18,103

beginning, but the truth is you're gonna

be able to get past it with knowing

558

00:34:18,583 --> 00:34:25,513

all of the ducks are in a row and that

you're able to be not on autopilot, but

559

00:34:25,513 --> 00:34:29,793

feel comfortable in knowing that you

have someone that has their hands on the

560

00:34:29,793 --> 00:34:34,803

wheel at 10 and two, and they're driving

this thing for you and you trust them.

561

00:34:35,058 --> 00:34:39,243

That's gonna really help you get

past that hesitation and anxiety

562

00:34:39,243 --> 00:34:40,563

being in front of the camera.

563

00:34:41,253 --> 00:34:41,913

John: Yeah, that's cool.

564

00:34:42,603 --> 00:34:47,072

When you have clients who are in

coaching and speaking and consulting

565

00:34:47,072 --> 00:34:50,402

who want website stuff, they want

social media images, are there any

566

00:34:50,402 --> 00:34:53,373

other things you recommend that they

might want to include in that package?

567

00:34:54,873 --> 00:34:59,073

John Demato: Before I mentioned a whole

list of other types of images that would

568

00:34:59,073 --> 00:35:01,263

be relevant and valuable to your audience.

569

00:35:01,263 --> 00:35:05,373

So I would refer back

to all of those pieces.

570

00:35:05,503 --> 00:35:07,153

I would also think about.

571

00:35:07,972 --> 00:35:12,322

Some of the stuff that happens outside

of your life and outside of your

572

00:35:12,322 --> 00:35:15,172

business, depending upon your brand.

573

00:35:15,262 --> 00:35:19,042

It always ties back to how do

you wanna position yourself and

574

00:35:19,042 --> 00:35:20,872

be perceived by your audience?

575

00:35:21,352 --> 00:35:26,842

And for some people, they don't need

to share anything outside of their.

576

00:35:27,442 --> 00:35:30,262

Professional lives, they want

to keep it very straight down

577

00:35:30,262 --> 00:35:32,387

the middle and go that route.

578

00:35:32,627 --> 00:35:35,987

But for some other people, I

photographed them on their boats.

579

00:35:36,077 --> 00:35:41,047

I've photographed them, dancing and

going out and doing different types of

580

00:35:41,047 --> 00:35:47,137

hobbies and meditation, wellness practices

because it was relevant to their audience.

581

00:35:47,527 --> 00:35:48,457

So what I would say is

582

00:35:49,492 --> 00:35:54,982

what are the other things in your life

that A, you feel comfortable sharing

583

00:35:55,102 --> 00:36:01,912

and B, is relevant and valuable to

share with your audience and consider

584

00:36:01,912 --> 00:36:07,732

making time in your portrait session

for those things to be captured as well.

585

00:36:08,092 --> 00:36:13,097

Obviously, the priorities are everything

that were discussed before, but.

586

00:36:13,987 --> 00:36:19,447

Those could be the yes, and, and

if you do not have time to capture

587

00:36:19,447 --> 00:36:21,217

them during the branding session.

588

00:36:21,847 --> 00:36:24,637

You use your camera in your pocket.

589

00:36:24,637 --> 00:36:28,717

For example, a client I photographed

in South Carolina a couple of weeks

590

00:36:28,717 --> 00:36:30,937

ago, he owns a couple of airplanes.

591

00:36:31,507 --> 00:36:34,807

We didn't have time to go to

the hangar and shoot him and

592

00:36:34,897 --> 00:36:36,217

do all that kind of stuff.

593

00:36:36,217 --> 00:36:41,437

So what I did was I briefed his

social media person who also does

594

00:36:41,437 --> 00:36:44,767

his video and snaps some behind

the scenes stuff of him at events.

595

00:36:45,037 --> 00:36:49,767

And I gave him a blueprint as

to how to capture, my client.

596

00:36:50,217 --> 00:36:56,677

His client with the airplane and used

those images, across his online presence.

597

00:36:58,236 --> 00:36:58,416

John: Right.

598

00:36:58,506 --> 00:36:59,406

Very, very helpful.

599

00:37:00,216 --> 00:37:07,386

Could you give some sort of idea of what

an average or reasonable expectation

600

00:37:07,386 --> 00:37:10,296

of investment in something like this

would look like for most people?

601

00:37:11,107 --> 00:37:12,992

John Demato: Well, I'd be happy

to share what my rates are.

602

00:37:13,746 --> 00:37:13,956

John: Yeah.

603

00:37:14,016 --> 00:37:15,186

If you are, if you're okay to do that.

604

00:37:15,186 --> 00:37:15,246

I.

605

00:37:15,382 --> 00:37:15,592

John Demato: oh.

606

00:37:15,892 --> 00:37:19,012

My rates are on my website,

so they're already out there.

607

00:37:19,012 --> 00:37:24,022

But for a branding session, it could

average anywhere from $3,000 to

608

00:37:24,052 --> 00:37:31,102

9,500 us and it depends upon how much

time you are in front of the camera.

609

00:37:32,232 --> 00:37:37,422

in terms of the grand scale of life, I'm

somewhere probably in the middle with

610

00:37:37,422 --> 00:37:39,822

regards to other branding photographers.

611

00:37:40,542 --> 00:37:42,282

but what I would say is.

612

00:37:43,357 --> 00:37:47,917

when you're thinking about what the

financial investment is in these

613

00:37:47,917 --> 00:37:53,227

branding photos in this session, and

then thinking long term about how many

614

00:37:53,227 --> 00:37:55,747

times a year do I need to refresh them?

615

00:37:56,687 --> 00:37:59,117

what's the cost of not

having these images?

616

00:37:59,117 --> 00:38:02,387

What's the cost of just

sharing photos from your phone?

617

00:38:02,442 --> 00:38:06,862

Only what's, what do you

generally get paid for a keynote?

618

00:38:06,922 --> 00:38:11,182

What's that in relation to what you're

spending on these branding images or

619

00:38:11,182 --> 00:38:16,252

even photos of the keynote itself, or

a training session or other type of

620

00:38:16,446 --> 00:38:16,526

John: Yeah.

621

00:38:17,752 --> 00:38:20,122

John Demato: weigh the pros

and cons with regards to what

622

00:38:20,122 --> 00:38:21,712

you're getting paid right now.

623

00:38:21,712 --> 00:38:23,282

And then, think.

624

00:38:23,307 --> 00:38:26,517

More critically about who that

person is behind the camera.

625

00:38:26,517 --> 00:38:32,577

Are they the right fit for you in terms

of the rapport factor we talked about,

626

00:38:32,817 --> 00:38:35,877

but also in terms of their expertise?

627

00:38:36,177 --> 00:38:39,837

Do they think like someone who just

wants to capture pretty photos of

628

00:38:39,837 --> 00:38:42,027

you while that is the foundation?

629

00:38:42,937 --> 00:38:44,527

That is not the objective.

630

00:38:44,527 --> 00:38:49,687

The objective is to capture as much

variety as possible with a high quality

631

00:38:49,687 --> 00:38:54,397

bend that gives you opportunities

to leverage these images everywhere.

632

00:38:54,787 --> 00:38:58,957

So you want your photographer

basically to think like a marketer, not

633

00:38:58,957 --> 00:39:00,847

thinking like a portrait photographer.

634

00:39:01,401 --> 00:39:04,341

John: We probably don't wanna get

abstract or overly creative with

635

00:39:04,341 --> 00:39:05,421

these things either, I guess.

636

00:39:05,911 --> 00:39:06,721

that's great advice.

637

00:39:06,721 --> 00:39:10,221

I think it is, a longer term investment

for most coaches and speakers.

638

00:39:10,271 --> 00:39:14,351

one new client or your next

keynote more than adequately cover

639

00:39:14,801 --> 00:39:16,801

the, the cost of, investment.

640

00:39:16,831 --> 00:39:17,841

So, yeah.

641

00:39:18,307 --> 00:39:20,142

John Demato: you know, here's

the other thing about that, John.

642

00:39:21,007 --> 00:39:25,717

When you are an expert that speaks,

coaches, trains, consult and write

643

00:39:25,717 --> 00:39:31,027

books, and you don't plan on retiring

anytime soon, it's never ending.

644

00:39:31,087 --> 00:39:34,897

You are sharing the never ending story.

645

00:39:35,137 --> 00:39:38,317

These photos that you got

today will be out of date in

646

00:39:38,317 --> 00:39:40,747

two years for various reasons.

647

00:39:40,897 --> 00:39:44,917

Whether you look different, whether

your business is in a different place.

648

00:39:45,287 --> 00:39:50,507

Whatever the case may be, and as a

result, in order to stay relevant in the

649

00:39:50,507 --> 00:39:55,937

eyes of those that you serve, to still

stay in the pecking order to where you

650

00:39:56,147 --> 00:40:01,847

fit right now, and to elevate yourself

beyond that, you have to keep up with

651

00:40:01,847 --> 00:40:08,087

your never ending story with fresh images

over and over and over again until you

652

00:40:08,087 --> 00:40:09,827

decide to stop doing what you're doing.

653

00:40:11,586 --> 00:40:11,886

John: John.

654

00:40:11,886 --> 00:40:13,506

John, you also have a blog.

655

00:40:13,536 --> 00:40:14,826

Can you tell us a bit about that?

656

00:40:15,337 --> 00:40:15,787

John Demato: Sure.

657

00:40:16,957 --> 00:40:18,097

So I write a lot.

658

00:40:19,837 --> 00:40:20,467

I write three.

659

00:40:20,647 --> 00:40:24,277

I write three blogs a week, every

Monday, Wednesday, and Friday.

660

00:40:24,457 --> 00:40:31,927

And it shares a lot of valuable insights

with regards to the how, what and

661

00:40:31,927 --> 00:40:34,957

why behind visual storytelling and.

662

00:40:36,337 --> 00:40:43,447

It's, it's an opportunity for me to give

people more context into the reasoning

663

00:40:43,447 --> 00:40:48,157

behind the importance of investing your

time and money into this stuff, because

664

00:40:48,157 --> 00:40:52,717

it's not just about getting these images,

it's also about implementing them.

665

00:40:53,107 --> 00:40:57,397

And I write a lot about the

entire process to just give a full

666

00:40:57,397 --> 00:41:00,367

scope view into its importance.

667

00:41:02,016 --> 00:41:05,616

John: If, uh, our audience would

like to check that out, where

668

00:41:05,616 --> 00:41:07,236

can they get a hold of your blog?

669

00:41:08,227 --> 00:41:10,897

John Demato: You can go to john dato.com,

670

00:41:10,897 --> 00:41:14,737

scroll all the way to the bottom of

the homepage, and there is a signup

671

00:41:14,737 --> 00:41:16,537

form right there waiting for you.

672

00:41:17,736 --> 00:41:18,246

John: Awesome.

673

00:41:18,246 --> 00:41:19,326

So great.

674

00:41:19,326 --> 00:41:23,266

Anyone who wants to go and check

out, John's content and blog, You'll

675

00:41:23,266 --> 00:41:26,496

find the link in the show notes but

John, any final thoughts or words of

676

00:41:26,496 --> 00:41:30,816

advice for those of us who are looking

to improve our visual image online?

677

00:41:31,312 --> 00:41:32,092

John Demato: Absolutely.

678

00:41:32,992 --> 00:41:36,772

The best time to start thinking about

your visual storytelling and how

679

00:41:36,772 --> 00:41:42,772

you present yourself through images

is right now, get started on it.

680

00:41:43,162 --> 00:41:45,592

Start being strategic and intentional.

681

00:41:45,682 --> 00:41:49,942

Hire the right people to help support

this goal of you putting yourself out

682

00:41:49,942 --> 00:41:54,022

there in the way you want to be seen,

perceived, and all that good stuff.

683

00:41:54,322 --> 00:41:54,592

And.

684

00:41:54,702 --> 00:41:58,452

That will help you get in front of

the people who really, really need

685

00:41:58,452 --> 00:42:03,852

your help and also are a fit for you

based on who they are as a person.

686

00:42:04,906 --> 00:42:05,396

John: Awesome.

687

00:42:05,396 --> 00:42:05,398

Great advice.

688

00:42:06,036 --> 00:42:06,246

John.

689

00:42:06,486 --> 00:42:07,956

It's been really fun

chatting to you today.

690

00:42:08,016 --> 00:42:10,746

I certainly learned a lot and

I'm gonna be having a good think

691

00:42:10,746 --> 00:42:14,466

about my visual storytelling and

my image as well after this chat.

692

00:42:14,466 --> 00:42:16,386

I really appreciate

you coming on the show.

693

00:42:16,596 --> 00:42:18,786

And I'll go and take a

look at your blog myself.

694

00:42:19,056 --> 00:42:21,106

But, uh, thank you for being

my guest today, John Demato.

695

00:42:21,562 --> 00:42:22,552

John Demato: Thank you, fab Abby.

696

00:42:22,552 --> 00:42:25,582

The pleasure was all on this

side of the lines my friend.

697

00:42:26,101 --> 00:42:26,671

John: Glad to hear.

698

00:42:27,392 --> 00:42:32,242

So a few final thoughts on the episode

with John today, and I know I have to pay

699

00:42:32,242 --> 00:42:34,252

attention to my own visual storytelling.

700

00:42:34,302 --> 00:42:37,902

This is certainly not something that

I have mastered and will be working

701

00:42:37,902 --> 00:42:41,952

on, but I think there's some really

solid advice in what John said today.

702

00:42:42,387 --> 00:42:45,777

That we should make sure we, even

if we don't have the money right now

703

00:42:45,777 --> 00:42:50,007

to invest in a high quality photo

shoot, that we could start having

704

00:42:50,007 --> 00:42:52,167

a bit more variety in our images.

705

00:42:52,167 --> 00:42:55,437

That we should appear in more

outfits, that if we are a speaker,

706

00:42:55,437 --> 00:42:56,817

we should be seen on stage.

707

00:42:56,817 --> 00:42:59,817

If we are a coach or a

consultant, we should be seen.

708

00:43:00,077 --> 00:43:03,347

Doing the things that we are

advertising ourselves for.

709

00:43:03,557 --> 00:43:09,017

So these are critical elements and

get the best photos you can right now.

710

00:43:09,227 --> 00:43:13,007

Now, I've said this to clients, I've

worked with particularly speakers, about

711

00:43:13,007 --> 00:43:16,877

getting, grabbing these kinds of images

that it's not necessarily always gonna

712

00:43:16,877 --> 00:43:22,337

be a case that you have to start by

hiring a top quality photographer, but

713

00:43:22,367 --> 00:43:27,527

if you have those resources available

to you, then someone like John could be,

714

00:43:27,582 --> 00:43:29,802

great for you to hire and help you out.

715

00:43:30,132 --> 00:43:35,262

However, it may be that there's

somebody in your friend circle, your

716

00:43:35,262 --> 00:43:41,482

family, your network, who is a very

good photographer, maybe professional,

717

00:43:41,482 --> 00:43:46,582

maybe semi-professional, maybe a really

good amateur who could get you started

718

00:43:46,582 --> 00:43:50,132

with some good images and might be

willing with the right incentive,

719

00:43:50,132 --> 00:43:54,792

whether that's gonna be money or, , a

bottle of wine or treat treating them to

720

00:43:54,852 --> 00:43:56,472

lunch or dinner or something like that.

721

00:43:56,652 --> 00:44:00,342

Maybe with the right incentive,

you can get them to do some photos

722

00:44:00,342 --> 00:44:01,842

for you and have a photo shoot.

723

00:44:02,997 --> 00:44:07,907

As I said to John, I do not enjoy

having my photo taken and doing photo

724

00:44:07,907 --> 00:44:09,917

shoots, and I have done some before.

725

00:44:09,967 --> 00:44:13,787

They're kind of boring, so as John

said, you have to be somewhat prepared

726

00:44:13,787 --> 00:44:16,637

for it and that's gonna help you

and having good rapport with your

727

00:44:16,637 --> 00:44:19,337

photographer, not letting yourself

get too bored while you're there.

728

00:44:19,337 --> 00:44:23,447

Don't get frustrated with them or with

yourself While you're doing all of this.

729

00:44:23,987 --> 00:44:27,647

Have the preparation of knowing

what images you really want to

730

00:44:27,647 --> 00:44:31,337

have, the different looks you want

to have and the different settings.

731

00:44:31,337 --> 00:44:35,087

I think there's a lot of really good stuff

there and more besides, so do go and check

732

00:44:35,087 --> 00:44:39,287

out John's blog and John's website, all

the links for that in the show notes.

733

00:44:39,707 --> 00:44:44,477

If you are currently looking for some help

to develop yourself as the speaker and

734

00:44:44,477 --> 00:44:48,317

make sure that your keynotes are really

killing it or that you're turning up

735

00:44:48,317 --> 00:44:53,207

the dials on your energy and charisma on

the platform to really connect more with

736

00:44:53,207 --> 00:44:56,237

your audiences and have a greater impact.

737

00:44:56,507 --> 00:44:58,877

Do go and check out present influence.com

738

00:44:59,147 --> 00:45:00,467

and see what's available for there.

739

00:45:00,467 --> 00:45:04,397

At the very least, you can go and

download My Free Guide to Leveraging

740

00:45:04,397 --> 00:45:09,557

Podcasts for getting you more

lead generation without it costing

741

00:45:09,557 --> 00:45:11,837

you any money really whatsoever.

742

00:45:12,292 --> 00:45:14,002

But it will cost you some time.

743

00:45:14,332 --> 00:45:18,742

But I give you a great visual

guide to being an excellent

744

00:45:18,742 --> 00:45:22,102

podcast guest and to being really

strategic about how to do that.

745

00:45:22,102 --> 00:45:25,862

And you can download that

for [email protected],

746

00:45:26,222 --> 00:45:29,222

and you can find out more about

what's on offer in terms of coaching.

747

00:45:29,702 --> 00:45:33,362

And even speaking, if you are

looking for a speaker right now.

748

00:45:34,297 --> 00:45:37,527

That's pretty much it from me

for this week, On Friday, I'll

749

00:45:37,527 --> 00:45:38,547

be back with another episode.

750

00:45:38,547 --> 00:45:41,157

Is this gonna be me by myself

sharing some thoughts and insights?

751

00:45:41,307 --> 00:45:42,657

Hope you'll come and join me for that.

752

00:45:42,657 --> 00:45:45,417

In the meantime, wherever you're going,

whatever you're doing, have an amazing

753

00:45:45,417 --> 00:45:47,302

rest of your day and see you next time.