In this episode of our podcast, we're tuning into Kristen Hallinan's incredibly moving and faith-filled story. It's a real-life example of how God can turn even the most challenging childhoods into futures full of hope and promise.

What You'll Discover In This Episode:

• The Impact of a Father-Daughter Relationship: Kristen opens up about the 12-year silence between her and her father following her parents' tumultuous divorce. She discusses the void this left in her life and her courageous decision to reach out and mend their relationship.
• Healing and Forgiveness: Learn how Kristen navigated the complex path of healing from her past wounds and the crucial role forgiveness played in her journey towards a brighter future.
• The Role of Faith in Transformation: Kristen shares how her faith was instrumental in her personal growth and how turning to God helped her rewrite her life's narrative from one of emptiness to one of redemption.
• Becoming a Legacy Changer: Discover how Kristen broke the cycle of her past to create a new legacy for her family, focusing on love, acceptance, and the power of faith.
• Insights on Family Dynamics: Gain insights into the power of chosen family and how acts of love and acceptance can have a transformative effect on those who are hurting.
• Practical Steps to Change Your Legacy: Kristen offers tangible advice for anyone looking to overcome their past and make positive changes in their own lives and the lives of future generations.

Episode Highlights:

1. A Journey to Reconciliation: Kristen's heartfelt story of reaching out to her father after 12 years of silence and the lessons learned from this experience.
2. The Importance of Voice: How finding her voice and using it to heal her relationships and shape her future became a key part of Kristen's journey.
3. Creating a New Legacy: Kristen discusses how she and her husband, Sean, are working to create a different, more hopeful legacy for their children, emphasising the importance of family and faith.

Connect with Kristen Hallinan:

• Follow Kristen on Instagram
• Visit Kristen's website for more insights and resources
• Check out Kristen's book, "Legacy Changer"

Kristen Hallinan's story is a powerful reminder that no matter our past, with faith, forgiveness, and a heart open to change, we can all become legacy changers. Her journey from an empty childhood to a redeemed future is not just inspiring; it's a call to action for anyone longing to rewrite their story and create a lasting impact on the generations to come.

#LegacyChanger #HealingJourneys #FamilyRedemption #FaithTransformation #PodcastInspiration

Tune in to this inspiring episode and let Kristen's story motivate you to examine your life and relationships and consider how you can become a legacy changer in your own right.

Hey there and welcome to What s the Story.

We re an inquisitive bunch of hosts on a mission to uncover stories about

faith and courage from everyday people.

In doing that, we get the privilege of chatting with amazing guests and

have the opportunity to delve into their faith journey, the hurdles

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They would love to connect with you.

And now, let's meet your host and our special guest for today.

So I am with Kristen Hallinan.

Oh yes.

Welcome to What's The Story.

Kristen is a sought after writer and speaker who is passionate about helping

women redeem the pain of their past and move towards a healthier and more

hopeful future, which to me sounds.

Like an awesome thing to do, I'm not going to lie.

She's on a mission to equip women and support families, has previously

worked as the Director of Development for MOPS International, we'll get into

that because I didn't know what it was.

And she enjoys working with teen mums, or moms, at crisis pregnancy centres

and serving as a premarital mentor with her husband, Sean, in Dallas.

Texas.

Cue the music if you're from a certain era.

Now, "Legacy Changer" is Kristen's debut book that is about to come out.

We're going to chat about that and you can find her other writings

and publications like Relevant Magazine and The Joyful Life.

Laughing with her and chasing her helps, we're chasing her four children, should

I say four children, I think that's more than enough helps burn off the

calories she consumes of her favourite treat, homemade gluten free churros.

Now, Kristen, welcome to What's The Story?

I've been looking forward to this and chatting to you since we

met, so thank you for coming on.

me too.

Thanks for having me.

Now, that gluten free churros.

is your favourite treat, I'm not gonna lie, you've not sold it to me, yet

I've been diagnosed with celiac for about 20 years now.

So gluten free is something I'm used to and I miss churros so bad.

So when I learned how to make them at home, I was a happy camper.

you'll have to send me the recipe, because there are members

of my family that are also gluten free and there are certain food groups which

I fully appreciate you do miss if you can't eat gluten I'm excited to see what

that actually, or to, to taste those.

So if you send me the recipe, I'm going to, I'm going to

ask my daughter to make them.

So you're, oh yeah, do it, totally do it.

So you're in Dallas, Texas.

Have you always been in Dallas, Texas?

No, we lived here for about five years.

We lived in Colorado for the rest of our marriage and I

was in California before that.

California.

So you've gone from California to Colorado to Dallas, Texas.

That's quite a, that's quite a change.

Yes.

Wildly different cultures and it's like completely different countries.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's having been to all three, I can see that.

Now, Dallas is obviously the home of barbecue basically, isn't it?

It's just it's, every time I go to Dallas there's a place that a

friend of mine, I go stay with a friend of mine, a guy called Rich

Rising, who is an absolute legend.

He lives in Dallas, Texas.

And we always go to this barbie.

I wish I could remember the name of it, but I really can't.

But it's this place where, They, there are the sort of the, you've

got to remember I'm British, right?

I just, I'm not used to the sheer size of these things.

And they have barbecues, which are the size of small sheds, don't they?

And they, the, just the fact that they have 20 of them side by side.

Is extraordinary and you walk around them to get into the restaurant and

I think I know the one you're talking about.

Yep.

What's the name of it?

Because I've

Is it called heart eight?

Yes!

Oh yeah, that's one of our favorites.

We learned that barbecue is a whole food group here that we knew nothing about.

Yeah, a whole food group.

I love that.

So yeah I, when I was over there, the first, very first time I went to Dallas.

Rich said to me, what do you want to do?

And I said, honestly, I want to go dance on the lawn of South Fork Ranch.

Just because of the team.

I grew up in a certain era where Dallas was on TV every weekend.

We used to watch JR and Bobby and all that sort of stuff when we were kids.

And and yeah, I went to visit South Fork and I managed to dance on the grass.

And there's a video of me somewhere on social media doing this.

I love it.

That's awesome.

You should do it too, it's quite cathartic.

Yes, I should.

So tell me about your Your Christian journey.

Obviously we, you've gone from California to Colorado to Dallas, but Christian wise,

did you grow up in a Christian family?

Was there maybe an event for you later in life?

How did that happen?

Yeah, I did not grow up in a house of believers.

My dad was and still is an atheist today.

And my mom, she was raised Catholic, but we never heard

the name of Jesus in our house.

It wasn't something that she brought into our childhood.

And I truly thought that Christmas was Santa Claus.

I had never heard anything other than that.

And so it wasn't until I was in seventh grade and got invited over to

sleepovers on Saturday nights with my friend, we'd go on Sunday mornings.

Her dad was a pastor of a little church that was planting in a local high school.

And so we'd go and set up all the chairs.

I'd sit there and listen and had no clue what he was talking about and felt

a mixture of nervous about it because I knew my parents were uncomfortable

that I was going and hearing all these things and then also like the strange

draw towards it that I just knew there was something here that I was totally

fascinated by and wanted to learn about.

But I.

I never ended up really understanding at that juncture in my life.

It was more the way that family loved me that stuck with me because

it was just so different than anything I'd ever experienced.

That impacts on you then, just going to church, not really

understanding, but being invited along, being loved by a family.

That was a profound thing for you, or was

Yeah, it was because my house that I grew up in was pretty

just emotionally cold and distant and my parents had a lot of big feelings, but my

sister and I weren't really allowed to.

And a lot of just hypervigilance, looking over our shoulder, taking the

temperature of the room at all times are we in a good mood today, or are

we in a bad mood, and what can I do to try to circumvent this mood that

is walking into the room right now?

And it was like walking on eggshells all the time in our house.

And at my friend's house, in contrast, they would sit and play

family games and they would laugh and they had nicknames for each other

and they had inside family jokes.

And just all of this was so foreign to me.

And even the discipline was done in love in their house and they

included me in that discipline.

And I felt so loved by those loving boundaries that they put in place.

And so it was just.

An experience that opened my eyes for the first time, but like maybe

all families don't have to look like the way my family looks like.

I know we're going to get into this in some more detail, but the,

how old were you when you, sorry, when you were going to church with your friend?

Seventh grade, so I think 12.

Okay.

So 12, about 12 years old.

So is that when you?

As Evangelicals like to say, became a Christian or was there more to the story?

Yeah.

There was more to the story.

So shortly after that, my mom and sister and I moved to Colorado to

move in with my grandparents when my parents were getting a divorce.

And so I did high school there and more or less forgot about everything

that I had heard during that time in the church because it hadn't

really settled into my heart yet and was not until I went to college in

Colorado and was totally rebelling.

Just living an out of control life that I used to say I don't know what got

ahold of me, but now I know it's the Holy Spirit got ahold of me and was

like, you got to knock this off and turn this around because this story

doesn't end well the way you're going.

And so I took myself to church.

I had just remembered, that's what, my friends family had done, and

they seemed to be living the life that I really wanted on the inside.

And so maybe I'm going to find something there.

And so I didn't have an invitation.

I didn't have a friend to go with.

I just started showing up and.

The school I went to is CU Boulder, and it was the number one party school in

America at the time, and so when people hear that I became a Christian at CU

Boulder, like that is not a normal story.

Okay.

But that is where the Lord got a hold of me.

That's super powerful.

So how old are you at this point?

I was 19 at that point.

Okay.

So you've moved to Colorado, your parents got divorced,

you get into the party scene.

And.

God gets a hold of you when you're 19.

I just love this, and in the most unusual of places, and

you come to this realization, life's not on a good trajectory.

So you just take yourself to church, no one invited you, you just went along.

Wow.

Wow.

So how did you feel?

There's so many questions around this, right?

Because I, and the reason why I've got so many questions is

because I have a similar story.

Okay but I'm curious, how did you choose what church to go to?

Because there's so many different types of church, and what was

that sort of first experience like for you going into the building?

I'd heard of a campus ministry that would hold just like a

college church night on Tuesday nights.

And it was in a really old, like hundreds of year old church building.

It was a first Presbyterian of Boulder.

And I, so I showed up to the Tuesday nights and walked in

and didn't recognize a soul.

And so just sat in the very back corner by myself and, on the outside

felt like super uncomfortable.

Just felt like everyone must know that I don't know what to do here.

But also there's such a depth of sadness on the inside that it was almost

like, I don't care how silly I look.

Like I've got to figure out.

Something else has to be the answer.

So you go into the college campus, how long were you

going to that for, the Tuesday night?

Was it?

Was it a case of the first week, God totally zapped you, or was it more

of a gradual kind of introduction?

gradual.

Yeah.

It took I would say a couple months until I was ready to say,

I believe full heartedly and I'm on board and I'm not turning back.

Wow.

So if someone had said to you, were you a Christian before you

went to school and started going to those kinds of things, would you?

How would you have answered that question?

I'm curious there because I would have said I was because of the

country that I had grown up in and because of the assumed I'm a Christian

because I'm British and therefore a member of the Anglican Church here.

Looking back, I would say that I had some element of faith.

Whether it was enough to call myself a Christian or not, I don't know.

But for you.

What would you have said had someone asked you that question?

I would say for sure.

No, I just, I couldn't even have told you like what does it mean to be a Christian?

What is a Christian?

I would have had no clue.

So yeah, I would say no.

There was no element of me praying or me, even legalistically, like me trying to

behave because I wanted to be a Christian.

There was just none of that.

So when you did, then you go to the college campus does life

in it takes a couple months, right?

But after, during those couple of months, is the does life change dramatically?

Are you at peace with yourself?

Has God done a work in you?

Has the pottying stopped or is life.

Still the same mess, but there's a bit more hope somewhere in the middle of it.

Kind of somewhere in between.

I would say I was freed from my addiction to chasing boys as validation of my worth.

And so that was healed.

And it was not long after that I started dating who now is my husband

and he was raised a believer.

So I feel like God, and I had known him for years and years, but

God didn't give me a blessing on that becoming a relationship until

I had a relationship with him.

And.

So in that sense, life was very different because I wasn't chasing anymore, but

I still had so much pain that I just didn't even understand at the time.

And it would be years from then until I really started to unpack it.

when you say you had so much pain, if you don't

mind me asking what was the pain?

Was that from the house?

You mentioned about growing up and seeing a difference with the

Christian friend when you were 12.

Was it from that, was it from something else?

Was it a combination of things?

What was the pain?

from that and from my parents divorce it was a

really messy divorce and there were threats and restraining orders and.

All sorts of, it was just a really long, drawn out, ugly process.

And I didn't talk to my dad for 12 years after that.

And so the just the feeling of betrayal and abandonment,

and then in combination with.

Here's my mom, not trying to take care of these girls, but she herself has so many

wounds from her own childhood and from her marriage that was a mess and just falling

apart, and she just became even more emotionally distant to my sister and I,

so there was really not a lot of anywhere for me to understand what was going on

or a soft place to land, and so I put on a tough girl badge, like I'm, this just

all means I'm really tough and I'm really strong and I can get through anything,

and I think really it just meant.

I'm really wounded and I haven't dealt with any of it.

yeah, it's amazing how those two things go together, isn't it?

And having, when my parents got divorced, this was back in the eight,

I appreciate I'm probably a little bit older than you, Kristen when I was a

teenager during the eighties, which I have to say was the best decade.

Ever.

I just want to point that out.

But my parents got divorced when I was, what I was quite young, maybe

nine, 10, I think somewhere around now.

I don't really remember it.

It wasn't, it was different to yours in the sense that there

was no restraining orders.

There was no, they tried their best to look still.

Friends, in front of me and my brother, behind the scenes, maybe things were

a little bit different, but on the whole they, they worked really hard to

try and create some sense of, we don't love enough, each other enough to stay

married, we'll be civil to, to each other and we would visit my dad once a week,

but the rest of the time we spent with my mum, and I think my parents divorce

changed how I viewed my mum I think I became much closer to my mum yeah.

More so than my dad in many ways.

So my, I think my experience in a lot of ways was different to yours.

So I, but it was hard enough in the eighties saying, my parents are

getting divorced when you're at school.

It must've been horrific if that divorce then was.

was angry and bitter and all kinds of stuff mixed in as well.

Yeah, my dad showed up at one point and the truth I'll

never really know, but what we were told was that he was threatening

to kill my mom and my grandma.

And so that's when the restraining order came in place and he wasn't paying child

support and I think got pulled over on a traffic stop and they knew this.

So he got tossed in jail and rights were terminated and.

from there on out, we just didn't speak of him.

And there was just this piece of me that was so confused.

And I think Satan just used that to speak lies to me.

Like he didn't stay because you weren't worth staying for.

You weren't worth loving.

And I just.

I took those narratives into the rest of my life and into the rest

of the relationships I was in.

And even into my young marriage, it was really affecting me because I just

expected my husband to leave all the time.

Wow.

Wow.

I was going to say, I had, see, I think that your dad, I have

two sons and I have one daughter.

So we stopped at three.

Three was more than enough for me.

I think you're very brave now for and to be fair, if I'd have had

my daughter first, I don't know if we'd have had any more children.

I love the bones of her, but for the first two years of

her life, she was a nightmare.

And she quite enjoys me telling that to people now.

She's quite proud of that fact.

But what I can say is my daughter is now.

Just about to turn 17.

And so I, the relationship with my boys is different to the relationship

with my daughter which I think is an obvious statement, when you think it

through, it's of course, I'm going to be different, not in terms of favoritism,

kids might argue differently, if I'm honest, but I don't know, not in terms

of favoritism, but just in terms of.

I think how you are with them.

So my boys was, we were boisterous.

We would wrestle a lot.

We still banter each other.

And my youngest son, my middle child, Zak always makes fun that he can, his muscles

are bigger than mine now and all that.

It's just good fun.

And and I'm super proud of both my boys.

But I think how a dad is with his daughter is different.

And I think in many ways how a dad is with his daughter defines how she

sees men going forward, and I think that relationship is super powerful.

So here you are.

Your dad's had a restraining order against him, he's in jail, things are not great.

Were they great before the divorce, did you, would you

Yeah, they were, my parents were always

at each other's throats.

We had, my sister and I had suitcases packed in our closets that we would take

when Things just got yucky again, and we were going to leave for a couple of days.

So it was always chaotic.

My dad would often retreat away during Christmas or a birthday

celebration because he just didn't want to be with anybody.

So dad would be in the room and we would pretend everything was fine without him.

So no, it was not good before either.

So you see your friend then, when your Christian

friend, who I'm assuming had a pretty reasonable relationship with

her dad and you're thinking this is what family could look like.

Was that really the first time you saw that actually maybe you

are missing something and maybe life isn't normal in your house?

Yeah.

Cause when you're a kid, you just assume this is what a family is.

This is how life goes.

And yeah, that was the first time that I had spent enough time and

had been relationally invested enough with another family to

see that this feels so different.

It's super powerful this because we, Sharon and I, we've been

married 26 years this year and she's not killed me yet, which I feel like

is a win on both levels if I'm honest

That's a major win.

Yeah.

A super win, especially for me.

And we've had a pretty open house throughout our marriage.

In other words, we've, we're we've always got people around and sometimes

Have keys to the house that I don't even know and they just turn up and it's

all hello and it's that kind of thing and I remember we've always tried to do

family We've always tried to do extended family and I appreciate in the church.

There's often quite broken people, you know the And so I've always tried

to adopt is the wrong phrase, but do you know what I mean, just welcome

in, do the extended family thing and just get people in the house.

And so we've done that.

And I remember one time a girl had been coming around our house

for a little while, a young girl.

She was lovely student age.

She brought a friend.

And her friend came round, and actually not too dissimilar story to

yours in terms of family background.

And she sat there, and it was Easter, and I remember saying,

oh, did you get an Easter egg?

She's no.

And she was maybe in her early twenties at this point.

I'm like, no, that's just totally wrong.

So we went and I got some chocolate and did all kinds of stuff.

And we invited her back round, but she never came back.

To the house and I was really curious, this really struck me actually, it was

a really powerful moment for me because I asked a friend, I said, why is she not

coming back did we upset her in some way?

And she went, no, not at all.

She just couldn't cope with the fact that you were such a loving

family because it's totally not her experience, and all it's done is

shown her what she's not had growing

up.

Yeah.

breaks in situations like that because There is just, I think

in Christian terms, we, especially in evangelical church you, we talk a lot

about winning the lost and all this sort of stuff and how are we going to do

that and do we, are we inviting people to church and do we take people to an

alpha course and that sort of stuff.

And actually one of the most powerful things I've seen happen is when

Christian families invite people around to their house and just be family.

Do you know what I mean?

And I think that's super, and this is what I'm hearing you say when you were

around at your friend's house, right?

We have tried to take exactly that stance because

of that reason that I don't know.

Where I would have ended up, I would think that God would get a hold of me somehow

in a different way if it hadn't been that way, but I wouldn't have taken myself

to church back when I was in college if it hadn't been for that experience.

And especially when our kids bring around friends that are a little bit harder to

love or a little bit harder to have in the house I am just taken back there because

I'm like, They need it more than anyone and we are just going to radically accept

them and show them what love looks like.

How old are your kids?

6, 10, 14, and 16.

Oh wow, great ages.

We did this thing when our kids were growing up, because I was super keen

that if my boys especially, and my daughter, were going to hang out with

their friends, and their friends were like, where should we go hang out?

I wanted their friends to be able to go, let's go to your house,

let's go hang out there, because they felt like it was a safe space.

And so we started doing all kinds of crazy things like fridge rights was a really

good thing for us in the sense that just saying to kids when they've been around

a couple of times, you have fridge rights in my house now, which means you can go

to the, you can go to the fridge and you can take anything out of the fridge, as

long as it's not alcoholic, obviously and when you're 18, you can do that.

I don't mind, but but until then, just anything else is fine and

you don't need my permission.

And I remember, yeah.

I remember one guy going to the fridge, he was like 13, and I said to him,

you've now got fridge rights to my house.

And I remember him going to the fridge, he opened it, looked inside

the fridge, then he looked at me, because I was watching him, and he

said, I've got fridge rights, right?

And I said, you've totally got fridge rights.

And so they did, they would all come around the house, they would hang

out, they would help themselves to stuff in the fridge, and we made

a bit of a song and dance band.

And to be fair, when I look back over it.

Christian, I think they bought more food round to my house than they consumed.

They would bring these cheap, nasty frozen pizzas and cook them in the freezer

because I would refuse to stock them.

But just having that environment where your kids feel like this is

a cool place to, my, my friends want to come and hang out here, I

think is just, is radically awesome.

Yeah.

That's so good.

We try to do the same.

And so our kids are just emerging into those ages, but they, yeah,

we, sometimes I'm like, Oh, I wish I knew how many table or places we're

going to set at the table tonight.

It would I just knew that everyone was going to fit in the car when

we were going to go somewhere.

The uncertainty of having a mixture of kids in your house all the time

is a little bit stressful sometimes, but to me, it's totally worth it.

it's a bit chaotic, but totally worth it, because it's

just a short time as well, and it's so you're, you become a Christian you,

God sort of deals with you on the boy thing which is fascinating because

one of the first things that happened to me when I became a Christian was

the opposite, obviously with girls.

I was, how old was I, 18, a similar age, 18, 19 when I became a Christian.

And I, it was a big work in me, I think that God did.

He's just no, I'm totally dealing with this first, dude you, there's just the

rest of it will come, but this, no.

And so you're like, okay.

And so how, you mentioned you bought in some of that baggage, right?

That rejection, that hurt, that betrayal from growing up into your marriage.

What did that look like in the early years?

It looked like a, the idea of attachment, like we are

attached to our caregivers early on.

And if we don't do that, then we're either constantly trying to avoid conflict and

avoid people and avoid vulnerability.

Or we're like.

Desperately seeking it.

I think I was some combination of the two.

I was desperately seeking validation and just wanting to know that I was worthy

and that I was loved and I was seen cause I never really felt those things before.

But then the minute somebody would get close, I was like no don't get too close

and know all my things because then you're definitely going to leave me.

So it was a lot of that in my marriage, a lot of anxious.

Seeking validation from my husband and then also some stonewalling and

putting up barriers of not really letting him see me because I was so

afraid that he was going to leave.

So it just created a lot of unnecessary conflict and confusion for him because

he didn't come from a house like that.

He had two married parents and he didn't have those same feelings.

And so he was often like.

What am I dealing with here?

And and then we started to have kids right away.

And so you add kids to that.

And I think that just magnifies whatever issues are already going on.

And I quickly realized that I was repeating a lot of the ugly behaviors

that I saw in my house, just like.

It's because I didn't know a different way to love and I didn't know a different

way to handle conflict and I didn't know a different way to communicate

and so I was falling into those same traps and they were not working so

I had a lot of work ahead of me.

There's no surprise they weren't working.

It's . So when you were you and your husband Sean, right?

His name's Sean.

When you and Sean were I dunno how you, we would call it courting, it's very posh.

Just a romantic term, isn't it?

But courting and it's all very nice and cute and lovely.

And then I take it one day, Sean just pops the question and

you're like, Oh my gosh, yes.

Totally.

Did you mentioned, we mentioned in the bio that you do this sort of

pre marriage counseling with Sean.

Did you have that before you got married?

Did somebody draw your attention to any of this or was it a case of

we're just young, naive and just believe everything's going to be fine?

Yeah, no one did this.

And we often joke now say, who let those babies get married?

Because were so young.

Yeah.

On top of us being young, and to me, not having a great model

for marriage, his dad was passing away, and we wanted him to be at the wedding.

And so we started sped up our engagement and got married pretty fast.

And so we still had a year left of college for both of us to

do and and we were married.

So we had zero of this and we, that's why we're so passionate about it now

because we're like, do you know how different our first 10 years of marriage

could have been if someone had knocked us upside the head with just having

to think through some of these things and answer some of these questions?

So how old were you when you got married, in your early twenties?

20.

I was 20 and he was 21.

Stone the crows.

So actually you got married quite quickly after becoming a Christian.

So you've gone from this chasing boys for validation thing, to that whole

script being switched up and you're going, no, yeah, marriage is cool.

That's quite a radical change quite quickly, I would have thought.

Yeah too quickly, probably, I could

have used some mentorship and guidance and learning in between.

So what did your mum and dad make of this when you came

back in your early 20s and you're like, yeah, I'm getting married.

My dad still wasn't in the picture, so he didn't know about

it my mom was not thrilled and tried to convince me over and over to not

go through with it we marched ahead.

And we sure showed them.

So the book that you've written then, "Legacy Changer", is all

about this experience, isn't it?

It's all about the lessons that you have learned bringing this level of

baggage into both your marriage and your parenting, because you said you started

to have kids pretty much straight away.

I'm curious, Kristen, as you're going, at what point is the realisation dawning

on you that actually there are some things which aren't right and some

things God needs to do a work on here?

It was between our second and third kiddos.

We lost a baby and I was just not okay.

I had been many months and I was still just, so not okay that I was

not being able to care for the kiddos that we did have and I was a wreck.

So growing up.

My family had made fun of or shamed anything to do with mental health.

So going to counseling or seeing a therapist or taking medicine or

anything like that was for fools.

They were getting scammed into that.

And but I finally reached a point where I was like, I don't care if

I'm a fool, at least maybe I'm going to be a fool that can function.

So I'm going to counseling.

And so I showed up in a counselor's office and then.

I was shocked how relatively quickly compared to what I had been going

through that I began to grieve the baby and I was really healing from that and

realized, okay, God has me here for healing for much more than the baby

that, she kept going back to but let's talk about your mom again and let's

talk about how you feel about your dad.

And I was so confused at first I don't.

We're here for the baby.

Why does she want to talk about that?

And so when we got past the baby and we started to unpack that, it

was my first realization that Okay.

I have some really deep wounds that I have not been acknowledging.

Wow.

Wow.

Wow.

So When you started to acknowledge them and it started to come up in

counseling, what was that like?

Was that quite a traumatic thing to deal with?

Did you have to let yourself be vulnerable to that for a little while or was

it a case of, okay I appreciate that they're there, but I've got these kids

to look after and I'll sort this out in, in five years time kind of a thing.

I would say it was a slow burn.

I really wanted to heal it once I was aware of it, but I just, I

wasn't sure I was strong enough.

I didn't know how, and it took me like a very slow drip to just release a

little bit more and a little bit more.

And it really took a lot of years for me to even fully.

Admit and recognize how unhealthy the relationships were.

And my family was, and my upbringing was it was honestly many years.

I'm trying to think exactly how many, I think maybe eight or nine years until I.

I hit more of a rock bottom relationally with my family and

decided to do some trauma work.

Cause you can do talk therapy all day long, but if you're not targeting

like those memories that are held deep in your nervous system, then

you're not releasing that trauma.

And I was still, I was just always operating up here was my baseline.

And so any amount of stress just pushed me right over the

edge cause I was always up here.

And what the trauma therapy did was really like bring my baseline back down.

And so I had a much bigger tolerance for, just the stress that kids

and marriage and life brings on.

How is your how is Sean with all of this?

Because here you are, you get married as I don't mean to be disparaging,

but you got married as kids, right?

And,

I think

and I'm imagining, especially if he grew up in a Christian

house, and he had parents that loved each other and modeled that, which is

obviously a different one to what you had.

He's going to have a, he's going to have expectations, isn't he?

Really?

That sound like maybe weren't quite met in that way.

So I'm curious how was he dealing with all of this?

expectations is the word that nails it.

Like our expectations of each other could not have been more.

Far off and not at all well communicated.

And so he's constantly expecting one thing from me and what are these, all these

enormous feelings she has all the time.

'cause his family, while it was significantly healthier than mine, it was.

Veering on the edge of everything's fine.

We don't really have big feelings that we discuss.

And so he was like, no, thank you to all your feelings.

And I was like, I desperately need somebody to hold these feelings

for me and expecting him to be more than he was supposed to be.

That should have been a role for.

Probably some friends, definitely the counselor, and God that I was like

totally not letting him in on it because I saw God like I saw my dad, like I

better put on a buttoned up, polished version of myself for him to love me

and wanna accept me, and so I better not tell God, like all these ugly

things that I'm thinking of feeling.

As if he doesn't already know, but I held that view or like that

fear with God for way too long.

Yeah.

It's interesting.

It's so prevalent in the church in terms of how we view God that we

have to put our best face forward.

Yeah, when you read the Psalms and you read David and you even just read the

book of Ruth and the way Naomi talks about how rubbish everything is, you're just

actually, these are people quite real.

And God's recorded this in scripture for us to read.

No, it's okay.

It's okay if you just want to just, don't stay there, but it's okay, and I

think it's one of the hardest lessons for Christians to learn in a lot of

ways, is that authentic realness with a God who is not mad at you if you

just have some emotional feelings that you want to talk to him about,

yeah.

And that he's big enough to handle it.

There's nothing that I'm going to say that's going to make

him be like I actually made a mistake adopting you as a child.

I'm done with you.

That's it, you're out.

Sorry, I'm out.

Yeah.

So you didn't talk to your dad for 12 years.

What happened to, what happened there?

Because that's obviously past tense, the way you talk about it.

So I'm assuming you're talking to dad now.

Yeah.

We, Sean and I were doing a class at church and we had some mentors

and I just began to unpack the whole situation with them and felt convicted

that I wanted to reach out to him.

Like I didn't know where he was, I didn't know what his situation was,

and I just wanted to let him know that.

I wasn't harboring like any act of resentment, and I just wanted

to clear the air a little bit.

I reached out to him and it was super slow building back of communication.

And I think there was an element of me that assumed that because I had changed so

The last time he and I were in a relationship that my hope was that

he had to o and I think there's some element of healing, but not

what I was wishing and hoping for.

It wasn't a new, going to be a newfound loyalty to me and love that I just really.

Had wanted.

So I think there was an element of grieving, probably what I had never

really grieved in the first place that this is a relationship that's not

going to ever be what I wish it was.

We have some communication now, but I also hold a lot of really strong boundaries

because I care most about my kids experience and want to protect them from.

A relationship that they can depend on

yeah.

Wow man, sorry to hear it, it's just, my heart breaks when the bond between a dad

and his daughter is It's shattered in a lot of ways, and I so don't want that

with my own kids in any way, but I get how that alters how you view God, right?

I'm my, I guess my question here for you, Kristen, is fast

forward to the modern day, right?

So we're recording this early 2024, your book's about to come out and.

I'm guessing, and I don't want to put words in your mouth, so correct me if

I'm wrong, I'm guessing your marriage is in a stronger place now than when

you were in your early twenties.

significantly.

Yeah.

And your marriage is better, I'm assuming as well, as in much more fulfilling.

You've obviously had to work through a whole bunch of stuff.

I guess my point here is for anybody that's listening, actually going through

the hard stuff is often quite worth it.

Do you know what I mean it's a painful process, but for you it

seems that actually now this has been a worthwhile journey, both in

terms of marriage and parenting.

100%.

Yeah.

We, and we have some kiddos with ADHD.

We have a kiddo on the autism spectrum.

So we have some just different dynamics too

That if we hadn't figured out how to get on the same page and I hadn't been

willing to do the work of healing, there is just no way I could be showing up

as the parent that these kiddos need.

And.

God has just been wildly faithful because he knew the

parent that these kiddos needed.

And he also knew that I wasn't that parent yet and that I needed to grow into it.

And he's just been so kind and faithful every single step of the way.

My therapist said, Kristen, stories that start like yours

don't usually end like yours.

And I just think.

That, put my story on a timeline.

You can just point to so many spots where God was there.

God was there.

Even before I was having awareness, even before I was, having a relationship

with him before I was putting him in the proper spot in my life.

Like he was just protecting me and protecting me.

And I think that is the really cool part of doing the hard, messy work is until

you're willing to do that, you also can't.

See the full depth of how faithful God

That's so powerful.

So what are some of the key, some of the things that you have learned along

the way, obviously you're going to go into much more detail in the book about

these things, and I appreciate that, but what, for you, what are some of the top

things that God has really taught you?

Forgiveness sounds like it would be one of them.

But what are some of the big changes that you have seen God doing you?

What were the lessons he taught,

One of them is just about voice and relationally, because

I just always felt like my voice didn't matter in my house growing up.

And so it took me a long time to realize that God wants me to use

my voice and that my voice matters.

And.

I think he has taught me that in a way that's allowed me to parent my

kids differently and to hear their voice, because I was not doing that in

the beginning of my mothering years.

But I think also a lot of the things that he's taught me about the

brain and trauma and knowing that hard things happen to every single

person, but why are some people left with trauma when others aren't?

And it's a matter of how they're cared for.

And if they were felt any sense of agency did my voice matter in the situation?

Did I have an opportunity to get out of the situation?

Did I have choices or was I just stuck to.

tolerate this harm.

And so helping my kids like identify their feelings and know what's

happening around them and know that they have some agency over their body

and their words that come out of their mouth and that they can affect the

situation and that we're listening and that we care what they have to say.

So all those relational things that I think God's been teaching us all

along throughout the Bible, this is how God interacts with his people.

And he gives people a voice who had none and.

Those lessons are all throughout scripture.

But it's just taken me a long time to learn them for my own self.

And I think that was really my heart with the book was all these things

that I learned about myself because I finally learned about God is I just want

people to have these tools much quicker.

Then I had them.

Yeah, it's interesting, isn't it?

I'm listening to you talk and I'm trying to picture in my head

the sort of 19 year old Christian sat in the back of the church.

And then I'm trying to picture that today's Christians stood

at the front of the church.

And I'm curious what the sermon would be.

Do you know what I mean?

What would you what would that be about?

Would it be about voice?

Would it be about forgiveness?

Would it be about all of those things?

What would you say?

And how to yourself in that church.

That's a really great question.

I think it would have a lot to do with story.

I think God teaches us through so much through story.

And it's also a really profound impact of us understanding our own story.

Cause it's hard to know.

where we want to go or reorient our life to head somewhere else if we don't really

understand where we've come from and what has brought us to the point we're at.

And like over and over the stones in the Jordan and holding the jar of manna and.

Over and over, God tells us to remember and to teach the next generation.

And I, the things that I inherited into my story were really hard things

and they weren't taught to me well.

And I just really want to be teaching the stories to the next generation of

my kids of a God that's so faithful.

And yeah, it's true.

That I went through all these hard things, but it's also true

that God carried me through them.

and it's one of those where the thing I like about your story

is it's one of redemption, and the things which, I suppose the enemy meant for

good for evil, God has turned for back.

And you look at that and you go, that's just I'm sorry that you

went through what you went through.

But at the same time, I'm I'm grateful that God had brought you

through it and here you are to tell the story to help others I think

is quite extraordinary really.

So what's next for you because I'm aware in my own life.

If I'm, if, if I'm on a scale of one to 10, 10 being totally sorted out, God,

you don't need to do any more work in me.

I don't I'm definitely not there.

But neither am I where I was.

And so I'm on a journey.

I'm curious for you, Kristen, what's next?

Fantastic.

Fantastic.

I always say that I'm never going to arrive under the sign

that says you've arrived to healing.

Like you are healed.

That doesn't exist until the other side of heaven.

And so I think there will always be more healing yet to have.

And that's what sanctification is.

Like walking more like Jesus the whole time.

And I love writing and I love speaking.

to Women, but I really love getting into their stories with them too.

So I'm going to be doing some coaching and some one on one work and some

mentorship because they're every, no matter what your story looks like,

there are things that you can say.

I love my family and I am.

I want to be honoring to them, but also there are things that they did that didn't

serve me well and that I can do different and better for the next generation.

And so I think finding where you are on that scale and unpacking that

has profound generational impact.

And so when we're working with one women doing that, we're working with

generations to come of what their stories are going to look like different.

I'm starting my own podcast and getting into more of these stories.

Yep.

And so we'll just keep seeing where God takes me, but getting into

it with women, doing the dirty work with them is important to me

podcast

up until now, because we're talking about all these things

might've been true up until now, but they don't have to be going forward because

God is in the business of redemption.

Love, love that.

That's fantastic.

Where can people find your book?

Tell us a bit more about that, and how do people get hold of

you if they want to do that?

Yeah.

Amazon, christianbook.com.

Barnes and Nobles.

It's available just about anywhere for pre-order right now.

It launches February 20th and I'm on Instagram at @kristen.hallinan.

My website's the same kristenhallinan.com.

Kristen Hallinan, spelt Hallinan if you're in the UK.

Ha!

Hall I Nan.

Nan being a colloquial term here in the UK for your grandmother.

Just, yeah.

you just taught me something

I try.

Ha!

What do British people call their grandmas?

Nan.

That's what they call them.

Nan, nana.

Nanny.

No, not nanny.

Nan.

Although my kids call my grand their, my mum, they call her Nan.

They couldn't quite say Nan, so they went Nan.

That was cute and that stuck yeah.

super cute.

Christian, listen, so appreciate you coming on the show and

sharing your story and I if you're listening to the show and you want

to reach out to Christian, do that.

I'm sure she'd love to hear from you.

Do check out the book but a super powerful testimony, man.

So grateful for, what God's done in you and in the family and just hearing the

story of redemption is super encouraging.

So bless you.

And thank you for coming on.

Thank you so much for having me.

And just like that, we've reached the end of

another fascinating conversation.

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