I've known Dave Hooper (host of Build a Big Podcast and Author of Big Podcast) since he put on the radio for the first time on Music Business Radio. When I heard that Dave had scored a job at Sirius I wanted the inside scoop on what it's like to work there, and what the heck is a "Producer."

Dave explains that he got the job while being in "a funk" and he used that situation to introduce more "real" topics to channel 146 at 7 AM and Road Dog Trucking.

I also share one sentence that jumped out at me from the Taylor Swift appearance on the new heights show.

Takeaways:

• Ever wondered what it’s like at Sirius Satellite Radio? Well, buckle up, buddy, because David Hooper is here to spill the tea on some wild stories, including a hilarious instance of dead air that’ll make you cringe. Seriously, it’s gold.
• So, David’s job is basically a mix of five different roles. I mean, booking guests, prepping shows, running the board, cutting promos—what's next, making coffee? It’s a circus behind the scenes, folks!
• We all know live radio can be a hot mess, right? David shares how he’s had to dust off some old skills and navigate the chaos of live broadcasting. Spoiler: mistakes happen, and dead air is just part of the fun!
• Turns out, podcasting and satellite radio aren’t that different after all. Both have their own unique challenges, but the real magic lies in connecting with the audience and building that sweet community vibe.
• David’s new gig at Sirius has taught him some serious life skills, like staying calm and collected under pressure. Who knew being a radio producer would be like a masterclass in Zen?
• At the end of the day, it's all about community and connection. David’s show is like a virtual truck stop, bringing people together to chat about everything from addiction to marriage on the road. Seriously, where else can you get that kind of therapy?

Links Mentioned

Build a Big Podcast

Big Podcast Book

Channel 146

School of Podcasting

Power of Podcasting

Mentioned in this episode:

Help When You Don't Know Where To Start

I get it. I talk to people looking to launch or grow their podcast. "“There’s too much gear/software — I don’t know what I need.” Microphones, mixers, hosting platforms, editing software — it’s easy to get lost. Analysis paralysis kicks in fast. I help podcasters. I've been doing it 20 years. Let me help. Dave Jackson schoolofpodcasting.com/join

School of Podcasting

Live Appearances

I will be at the Empower Podcasting Conference in Charlotte NC September 26-28 This is going to be a great conference. I'll be speaking and I can't wait to see you there.

Where Will I Be?

Question of the Month

This month's question comes from Todd the Gator of the Gaurdian Downcast (guardiandowncast.com). He wants to know: How long did it take to go from idea to podcast? Also how long did it take to find your community? I need your answers by September 26th

Question of the Month

Ever wonder what it's like behind the scenes at Siri Satellite Radio?

Well, buddy David Hooper landed a job there and the stories he's going to tell are a little on the wild side, especially about that time there was some dead air. Hit it, ladies.

The school of podcasting with Dave Jackson.

And if you want to monetize your podcast, my website, skoolpodcasting.com use the coupon code listnr when you sign up for either a monthly, yearly or quarterly subscription. And of course, that comes with a 30 day money back guarantee.

Today on the show, David Hooper giving us the behind the scenes of Sirius Satellite Radio. David Hooper is a great guy I've known for a long time.

He's a great author, he's a great podcaster, he's a great radio guy, and now he's a great guy on Sirius Satellite Radio. When I heard he had gotten a job at Sirius, I wanted the behind the scenes and so I reached out to Dave.

Man, I'm so excited to talk to you. Dude, we go way, way back. I was just thinking about that before we connected.

You're the first guy that I knew to do a podcast and probably the first podcast that I ever heard. Definitely the reason that I'm here. So it's good to have kept in touch with you and to drop in every once in a while.

And so I wanted to hear what he was doing at Sirius.

Well, yeah, I'm a producer for talk radio content. Sirius is the largest audio first content creator in the world.

So I'm one of those stations called Road Dog Trucking, which is the last station place I thought I would end up. But we can dive into that how I ended up there.

And I know in podcasting the word producer can mean many things. And when you're in satellite radio, it means a whole lot of things.

The job that I got on for is not only booking guests, prepping guests, prepping the show, making sure the ads are read, running the board, scheduling the promos, cutting the promos. I mean, it's basically everything.

It's probably five jobs, which is much different from any work that I did at N are definitely different from what I've done with music business radio. And in podcasting, it's probably five different jobs.

And so when I asked Dave, like, what was the biggest difference we get into this in a few different places. He brought up this point well, and.

It'S live radio, which I haven't done for a long time.

And when you're doing new things or dusting off some rust of something you haven't done in a while, you might have a few mistakes here and there.

We can talk about the mistakes that I've made. Dead air being one of them.

Like, oops, like I was answering the phone, talking to a guy, realized that we were on the air about 20 seconds afterwards and oops, you know, didn't cue the music. We're back. Like that kind of thing, dead air. And the phone started ringing from dc. Everything okay? Everything okay?

Because they know it, they're watching you and a lot can go wrong. But yeah, it's definitely a good way to be present and that's kind of exciting.

And so Dave is the producer in Nashville and is occasionally on air. He's Dispatch Dave and the host is in Mississippi. And so I wanted to know the tech on how they were connected.

Strangely enough, my host is using Zoom, which I can't rail about Zoom any longer. It used to be, ah, it's amateur hour, but they have the like industrial strength Zoom with better.

It's a commercial grade level Zoom, but it's just easier. And also some of these guys come in through something called Comrex.

And if you've been to podcasting shows, you've probably seen Comrex, and it's basically a box that plugs into the Internet. And it's more or less, it's not any different than maybe a Focus Right. Interface or something, but a little more.

I mean, I can't say it's not any different, but it changes analog to digital and I don't know, syncs up. But yeah, there's a lot to it.

And being live is way different. And Dave is the guy that is making the callers and letting them go through to the air.

So what was the criteria of that when it comes to choosing who goes on the air and who doesn't?

Yeah, that's. That's a good question. Well, we've got an eight second delay and if somebody says something that is also. It's not, it's not like broadcast radio.

So they can say anything, although we keep it clean. But if they say something that, like an off color joke or something like that, we can dump it.

And with AI creeping into podcasting, one of the things that may stand out, may stand out in the future is doing a live show because, well, AI can't do that. And doing a live show is a completely different set of skills.

Yeah, I mean, I think it's just like being cool with mistakes.

Like, we lose callers because a lot of these guys that are calling in, they're going over a mountain pass or something, they're calling in on a mobile connection, even guest.

The Friday the 13th episode that we did, we made a joke about it, but this speaks to your point about kind of thinking on your feet and the new muscle that you're flexing that didn't get edited out. We just made a joke like, hey, it's Friday the 13th strikes again, you know, and lost the guest. We'll get her back on.

And I think just being quick, taking a deep breath, remaining calm under pressure. There's been a few different things. When I go in there again, I'm the first person, I kind of still learn what I'm doing.

So one time, like, the board was dead, and they're just like, we gotta go live. We're gonna count you down by phone. And it's like 8, 7. And you just hope it goes. And every time I press that button, here we go.

You just hope that the guy in Ocean Springs, Mississippi, comes through there. So I think it's really helped my presence and patience and breathing through things.

And, you know, it's fun, but it's also a lot more stressful than podcasting. You cannot wait. When the clock strikes, boom, it's go time, whether you want to go or not.

So when you're doing live, you know, there's a lot of things going on at the same time.

Well, that's like me on the phone, you know, I'm talking with the engineering department. Another phone's ringing from another engineering department, and they're like, we gotta go. I'm counting you in. I'm like, we don't have time.

And I just hope I know, because it's a huge board. It's called a ruby, and you can look it up. It's on BSW or something like that. But it's.

I'm working with four computers, four monitors, a telephone system, just a huge board, a remote guest. And that's the reason for that dead air, because I'm on the phone trying to focus on one guy.

I can't hear him because he's on a mobile connection and that clock is ticking because then I've got to do documents for the ads that were read, sign off on those, clip those, get those to what they call traffic, which is a, that's in any radio station, they call it traffic. And it's just the guys who program the ads. It's not anything to do with like car traffic or truck traffic in this case.

And yeah, there's just like a lot of paperwork and you're the guy who's in charge of it.

And one of the things I feel that got Dave the job is, well, Dave and his ability to get along kind of with everyone. And so when I asked him about getting the job, well, this is a.

Longer story but so 25 years of self employment and this is not a full time thing by the way. So I'm still music, business, radio, big podcast, all the stuff that I do. So this isn't like I'm retiring from that at all, but about a year ago.

And this is a, this is a deeper thing. We can go there, but I think it's important to get out. There was just one moment when I couldn't get out of bed.

I was, I was burnt out, I was exhausted. Went into it, I would argue it was a deep depression and it was, it was very, very scary to me.

And I had to look at like what I was doing and how I was working and I was like, oh man. And I started looking at other things that I could do, you know, just to get my mental health in order. So, you know, I threw out some resumes.

But what I soon found out, and this is even more depressing than the depression, is like you're 50 something year old guy that has done his own thing. And strangely enough, when I had the background check for serious, like they couldn't find anything because again, self employed for like 25 years.

Like dude, you have something from the 90s that you can send us or something. Like it was like having a guy with no credit or something, you know.

But I put some resumes out and then I would just kind of get back on my feet through, you know, some psychiatry and you know what I mean? I was really trying to work on myself to become, become who I wanted to be, like David 2.0 and kind of figure out my new path.

And yeah, so they had my stuff and called up, they said, are you interested in this?

And that's one of the Reasons I actually took the job because I told myself when I was in that depression, sitting there in a fetal position in bed, like oh God, you know, listening to guided meditations or whatever I was doing. I said if I ever get out of this, I'm going to help guys that need this.

And when I thought about the trucker channel, I was like, what better way to reach a bunch of middle aged guys than a trucker channel? And I pitched him on it. I said, I said it's a brand new show. I said I would love to come in and work with you but I've got ideas for it.

Would you be open to talking about these topics? And I knew a little bit about being isolated and I knew a little bit about from self employment because a lot of these guys.

And you can maybe talk to this too, Dave, like if you're not, you know, if your wheels aren't turning, you're not making money and some of these guys are working one load to the next. So I know what it's like to do that and I can connect with these guys on that level.

But I also know what it's like to be isolated and away from your family or working too much or workaholism. And I said can we talk about those issues? And they said yes. So I said I'm in.

And it was a way for me to have impact in that way to get back into live radio, which I've always loved and just to learn like I wanted to after having really nobody interested in me as far as like a real job.

You know, it's like my boss is at wnyc, I'm working with some really talented talk radio programmers and I thought, you know, this is a great way for me to learn because I never want to be static.

And one of the great things about David is his insane curiosity. He is always trying to learn things and he is definitely dedicated.

So I'm waking up at 4:15 every morning right now and for me that's a hard pass. Think about this though, think about the dedication you've got to have on it.

And it really was like me traveling to a different country because I was, you know, music business related. I'm sleeping until 10 and it's changed the way that I have to work with my wife and things and you know what I mean?

Yeah, things are definitely weird for the family.

My dad would come home, he would leave on Sunday, come back maybe on Thursday, pass out on the couch and that was the time during don't poke the bear. Definitely do not wake him up. And one of my favorites was one Sunday we went and got a dog from my uncle and drove back home and my dad had to leave.

And so when he came back on Thursday, the dog didn't recognize him, didn't remember him. He knew us because we'd been with him all week.

And my dad got halfway down the hallway and the dog stopped him and he's out there screaming, hey, somebody come get the dog. Things are weird, especially with sleeping.

We got something called the nap room because we would just take naps in the middle of the day. So if one of us is upstairs, we can sleep upstairs and one of us is downstairs.

So I'm basically in the nap room because I don't want to wake her up, mess up her schedule. So.

So that's an adjustment. Plus, you got to remember, Dave's been self employed for a very long time.

Ironically, the last day job that I had was in this same building 26 years ago.

And radio people, much like podcasters that are really into it to make great content, truly are dedicated.

There is a dedication to it.

And you certainly see these guys in radio though, and you've known guys who have been in radio and you're one of these guys as far as podcasting and you keep showing up and they love it. But there's not a guy that I'm working with in that office that hasn't moved around the country and been fired or rehired or.

That's the old joke in radio. They say that two people in radio, you've either been fired or you will be fired. And everybody gets that. And yeah, it's, it's fun.

And in Dave's case, because his audience is truck drivers, they can talk about topics that are open and might be educational or entertaining to the general public, but it's through the lens of a.

Truck driver, trucker related, because that's the audience. But we're also talking about very specific things. Like for example, I've got an addiction guy coming in this week.

We've got somebody talking about like a marriage and family therapist to talk about how to manage a relationship on the road. So it's specifically for that audience, but it could be a topic you might hear on a general show.

There's one that's caller driven where he'll talk about cussing and discussing whatever the topic is. And it could be something like tariffs. Right now is a big one for these guys.

Fuel prices, clean air and energy, because they've all got opinions on electricity, self driving trucks, they're afraid of AI too. So Elon's running self driving trucks in Texas now and they've all got opinions on that. Then they got thoughts on Amazon and, you know, safety.

These guys are real big on safety.

And when you get a bunch of people that are doing the same thing with the same interests, we often call that a community.

No, that's exactly right. Well, and they, and they know me.

They're, hey, dispatch.

Like, they're how things in Nashville. I know them. And we have these inside jokes. That's the other thing.

You realize that if you want to talk about the similarities between what Sirius is doing compared to what we do as podcasters, the same thing. We've got inside jokes. I mean, they've got inside jokes that have been going on for 20 years.

If you say biscuits and gravy on the show, boom, you get kicked. That's the deal. And they'll try to sneak it in on him. Callers will call in with trivia. They'll try to stump me and stump Tim.

Yeah.

Callers will talk to each other. They know each other, they become friends outside of every, you know, that's very podcasting. Oh my gosh.

It is the most niched out thing that there is. There's arguments, but instead of like, what's the best microphone? Re 320 or 20 or SM7B, they're talking about his Freightliner. Better than Volvo.

They hate Volvo. Volvo is like the blue Yeti of trucking. They make jokes about Volvo all the time.

So in some ways you just gotta laugh and you're like, well, people are people, you know.

Yeah.

And so while we love having people with a common goal and common ideas together, there is this thing called politics in the divided states of America. And so how does Dave handle that? Because it is a live show.

That's a good point. And the answer is no, Policy, not politics.

So if it's something about California EV laws, they've got different rules as far as dot, the Department of Transportation. Like your truck would have to have certain standards to run in California, for example. That's fine.

But the great thing about Sirius that's really interesting is they don't mind if you mention other stations because they just want you to subscribe. It's not any different than Spotify having podcast or music or whatever. Just listen to Spotify. So no politics.

There are specific stations for that and.

That helps to keep that community feel.

What we're trying to do with this show, and this is kind of a little bit of insider, like the Problem was that a lot of the independent truck stops, the mom and pop kind of things, have gone by the wayside and you don't have that camaraderie. The other thing that they've got now is they've got to work with what they call electronic logs.

So it's not like paper books like they used to back in the day. You'd. You just. They called it like a comic book or they double book where you could drive more than you were legally supposed to.

You know what I mean? And you didn't have to watch your hours. So these guys can't connect in a coffee shop like they would have at one time.

And there's lack of truck parking. And there's a lot of reasons why these guys feel like they're disrespected. And I would agree with them. They're pretty.

There's no truck stop in Nashville where you can park in Nashville, in the whole city. And that's a big deal now because these guys are having to park on the street and it's causing problems for a lot of people.

So what we try to do is be that community. Even if you listen to the show that I'm on, the Tim Ridley show, and again, it's 7 to 9am Eastern. It's like a virtual truck stop.

And Tim's kind of a folks out here. He was like, come in, sit a spill, have you some vittles. We just have some good old trucker conversation.

He's an army chaplain, just a really sweet, sweet guy. And he's trying to get these guys talking to each other like they would have when your father was driving.

And that's really one of the key ingredients of really any podcast when you can solve a problem. So in this case, they are solving the problem of there's no place for us to get together and hang out. And that's what Dave's show is doing.

So that's definitely something that's the same as podcasting. What are some other similarities and differences?

So right after the live episode goes out, part of what I do, we're going to the app, so I've got to publish the show. So in that way, it's just like a podcast, but it's streaming. Gotta put the thing together.

It's not like podcasting that we can use AI so it can go through the transcript. It can kind of help me figure out a description of it. It can help me figure out. So in that case, like, it's. It's the same.

Now what I will say is There are different systems. It's not that you're basically a fader jockey, you know, it's a huge board though. It's very complicated.

You're live, so there's a stress level of that. Part of it, I think is just being a good hanging, you know what I mean? It's like, can you get along with, you know, Cheese Whiz in Wisconsin?

When he calls up, are you going to be cool with him, get him on the air, make him feel heard. So there's getting along with people, there's booking guests, there's working under pressure with me.

I'm on the air with Tim sometimes, so those hosting skills have certainly helped. I use Audacity, believe it or not, to edit the promos, even though they've got me a subscription to Adobe Tools, you know, cleaning up the stuff.

That's not that much different.

I think it's just kind of a different format, you know, and I would love to have more pre interview time with these guys because we've got five to 10 guests on a week. But it's just, you just can't do it. And you just have to trust that Tim's gonna do his job, I'm gonna do my job, and we work well.

I feel so blessed to be working with this man. He is amazing. But yeah, all this stuff like remotely just like we're doing this, it's not any different. It's just arguably a bigger audience.

And so as working at Sirius, how has it helped your podcast?

Yeah, I think just being calm. I think looking at how these guys, you know, because podcasters, I think like we learn from other podcasters, like, here's the way to do it.

And you do this and remember back in the day, Dave, I know you do, when all the podcasters had like a 14 channel board and all this equipment. Oh, mix minus. And that was the way we did things. And Everybody had a PR40 and everybody had. And then other things. Then everybody had ATR20,100.

Now everybody's got a SM7. You know, I mean, I think it's just, it was nice for me to get out of my. It's not a rut, but just it showed you a different way of doing things.

By the way, Sirius uses PR 40s for anyone who's interested in the mics they use, they've got probably a hundred of them in the studio that I'm in. And I think it's just a different way of doing things. But I think what really makes us great as podcasters and you can Appreciate this.

Doing, like, Ask the Podcast Coach, which is a live stream, or doing remote interviews, or it's like there are these underlying skills that you have. Like, I know how to edit audio and take out the boring parts.

And whether I'm doing that for a commercial or promo or whether I'm doing that for a full episode, that helped. I think that a podcaster, if you wanted to get in with Sirius, I think you could do it.

I will say this, that they basically throw you in there and be like, swim. I was doing it on my own, I think, within a couple weeks.

That is crazy. I said at the beginning, Dave Hooper is a good hang. He and I don't probably agree on everything, but I know how he thinks and he knows how I think.

So instead of focusing on the things we're different, we focus on the things that we actually agree on. And that's actually a great skill to have.

Yeah, I think seeing the humanity in people, I think is important. And, you know, you're working with guys that are under a lot of stress and because, you know, that's like a huge difference, I think.

I think that's probably the number one thing, truthfully. Like, I've worked. I've been in situations, live recording situations, where there's that. That guy, like an engineer who's stressed out or.

And you certainly saw it in live sound. I'm sure Dave, when you were in a band, like, that guy was like, don't touch my mics. Don't touch my st. And that poisoned the whole vibe.

I think just being a good hang is good. But, yeah, I mean, I think radio probably helped. I think it helped that I had done, like. See, this is part of.

And this is another reason that I decided to take this on, because I realized last year when I was in my funk and I was reaching out just to see if anybody would be interested in me. I think, unfortunately, a lot of people don't really respect podcasts. Like, they would.

Like, if you come in with Sirius or Clear Channel or I Heart, they automatically, like, they know what box that fits in, and somebody's already done the vetting. They're like, oh, okay.

But the reality is, I would say that most podcasters, especially if you've been doing it a few years, are probably doing stuff that's a lot more advanced as far as editing, as far as really thinking about an audience getting to know because we're living and dying by our decisions. It's a whole lot different from when you're on a.

A flamethrower and you're broadcasting coast to coast, and even for music business radio, because we have arguably the top adult alternative station in the country that I don't have to work that hard to get guests. Guests come to me. Dolly Parton came to me. I didn't have to go beg her. Now, I did try to beg her, ironically, a few years before, and she ignored me.

I think a side effect of podcasting is you get to learn to roll with the punches.

I mean, that's true. And I think that's the great thing about, like, doing a daily show. It's like, not every episode is gonna be great, but there's always tomorrow.

And I guess you could say that with a weekly show. It's just not as drastic, though, right? It's like you go, ah, man, today just. It just wasn't clicking.

And I hung up on a dude, and there was dead air for 20 seconds, you know, just. But a trucker actually said this. This dude had crashed his truck. And it's such a great analogy for podcasting. He said. He said, yeah.

And I went back to my boss. He said, well, show up tomorrow. You're driving this one.

And the story was basically the boss said, if you overthink this, you will never get back on the road. And he got back on the next day, and he's been a safe driver ever since.

There you go. One of the things Dave mentioned earlier about, as he called it, his funk. I want to thank him for being so transparent about that.

June is Men's Mental Health Month, but there are other things that are being celebrated in June that people are very proud about, and it kind of gets swept under the rug many times. And so I wanted to ask him if this new position helped pull him out of his funk.

Dude, you know, I think the scariest thing about depression is. And I was. I was working my way out of it. I was like, okay, I'm back in. You know, I'm back. Back in the game, among the living.

But I think the scariest thing is because I never experienced this before. I'd heard people talk about it, and I was like, no, man, it's all great. Like, I.

There were a lot of holes in my life that I didn't realize, and having experienced this once, you realize it can happen again. I've said the same thing about panic attacks. Like, once I experienced a panic attack on stage, and I knew it was possible.

So it's kind of like a terrorist. It's always there. Like, ha, ha, here you go. You know?

But, yeah, I would say that was nice, but really, when it comes to depression, it wasn't like external stuff, it was internal stuff that I had to look at. And a friend of mine told me this, and it was some sports guy, had a great quote. He said, success is a great deodorant.

And that if you've got some stuff on the outside that looks great, maybe you don't have to look at the inside. And I realized that I wasn't, you know, I was like, living life. Not really, you know, I was kind of paving over some stuff.

And you can drive on three wheels for a while in rims, but eventually you're gonna have to pull over on the side of the road. So I did. But, you know, it's a reboot. I'm back and more dedicated than ever, and I think I'm a better person.

I'm at the point now where I'm glad I went through it. And it's totally changed my empathy for people. It has totally changed my ability to how I do interviews, music, business, radio, and not.

And it's changed the direction of the show, which I think is. Let's extrapolate that. 1.3 million people listen to the station every week. So that's a lot of people.

And when they hear something about human trafficking or keeping your marriage together or addiction or some of the deeper topics that we're talking about, and we have fun, too, but even the fun, I mean, there's value there. I mean, that. That's life changing.

But even if it were just a few people like me having this conversation with you, or somebody listening to this, let's say one person heard it, that was helped by it. That's worth it to me.

And that's one of the things I've always wondered. I'm glad to have a guy on the inside now. How does Sirius go about figuring out how many people are listening, etc.

This is my understanding. So this is just what I understand. They know how many subscribers they have.

They don't know who's listening to what at any given time via the satellite. But because so much of it is app driven now, they've got all that data, just like Spotify would. So they have a ton of data.

And I guess what they do is they extrapolate it based on subscribers and they know, you know, what, what people are doing where via that. And they can even get it down to the show level. Plus the other thing they're looking at is interaction, like callers. So, yeah, mail.

I mean, and let me Let me tell you this story. This is wild. Speaking of the power of this, you know, Howard Stern is on Sirius, but even the.

The country station where that we broadcast here in Nashville, the highway, they call it, they did some kind of giveaway, and a guy was telling me they had to fortify the phones. They got 50,000 calls in like an hour, and the whole thing melted down for like a week. Like the phone system. Is that not insane?

So they look at stuff like that. I don't know how they do it.

I'm sure there is probably a bunch of magic math and things in there, but they have a lot more data than they used to back when we were just. It used to be. I'll tell you a funny radio story.

It used to be they would send out these surveys and you would write down what you'd heard of or like a call letter, like, it's 107 the fox or whatever, and people would say, the Fox. And a guy. There was a. They called it a border blaster.

Do you know these stations they used to put in Mexico, and they were angled up at the United States. The antenna looked like an arrow. Literally. They were 1 million watts. Where in the United States we have 100,000 watts max?

It used to be 400,000 watts. So what these guys did, it was called, like, Radio Fiesta or something like that. It's a border blaster out of Mexico. One million watts. Radio Fiesta.

Anyway, the American station started using the name Radio Fiesta and all the books. All of a sudden, they shot to number one because people were saying, oh, yeah, I heard Radio Fiesta.

But it was an unlicensed station, so it wasn't on the. It wasn't in the books. So, you know, I think it is a bit of smoke and mirrors. We really don't know. We just hope for the best.

And, you know, even with podcasts, we got our number of downloads. But are people really listening? They've just downloaded it.

Oh, that is a topic for another day. David Hooper, author of the book Big Podcast. Grow your podcast audience. Build listener loyalty and get everybody talking about your show.

Of course, you can also check out his other book, 101 podcast episode templates. So if you're stuck, you're having a bit of a brain drain on coming up with content. It's powerful done for you. Episode templates.

To grow your podcast audience. I'll have links to a show. Build a big podcast out in the show. Notes. Mr. Hooper, thanks for coming on the show.

The best man. It's been so much fun to come and talk to a guy like you. He's been there with me since day one. And love what you're doing and what we're doing.

I think we're making good things happen. Dave.

Thank you, Dispatch Dave.

Thank you, Dave. Smiling Dave Jackson, come back.

And there he goes. Dispatch Dave. And thanks so much for that. I appreciate it.

It's interesting how everything always comes back to community, and people want a place where they can gather together. I'm going to podcast movement in. Well, tomorrow I'm getting on a plane and going to podcast movement.

And one of the things I love about any kind of event is the fact that we are all doing the same thing, trying to do the same things, trying to get to the same places. And the thing I love about the podcast community is we are all very helpful to just share what's working.

I recently got to speak in Nashville thanks to two things. One was focusrite. Thank you, Dan. If you're looking for an interface, check out focusrite stuff. And the other one was David Hooper.

He was like, hey, if you need somebody to talk about podcasting, because Dave was going to be there. He's like, dave Jackson will drive to Nashville in a heartbeat.

And if you're within seven hours of Akron, Ohio, I'll drive just about anywhere to talk about podcasting, because, well, that's what I do. So I thought it was interesting, the different things there.

And, you know, when you learn a new skill, you're not going to be perfect at it right away, but you figure it out and you move on. And then you got a new item on your resume. And I thought I would throw this in here. I talked about it on my Saturday show, but it's worth repeating.

And that is. Taylor Swift announced her new album on her boyfriend's podcast, and everybody went bonkers because she's got a super passionate fan base.

But she said something out of the two hours, and it jumped out at me, and I was like, that's profound. And that is I'm in the business of human emotion. And I thought that was very profound. She knows who her audience is.

She knows what they want, and she gives it to them. And I was thinking about that because almost everything I share, and I've really been studying that, what am I sharing?

What are people sharing with me and why? And I'm here to tell you, emotions come into that. And so, like, today's emotion might be not that Dave is old, but he's older.

And, you know, apparently older dogs can learn new tricks. And for me, I've been in an environment since I got out of college that if I don't keep learning, I'm going backwards.

And so I'm always trying to learn new things. And maybe you should too, because it's a lot of fun. I just watched welcome to Wrexham on Hulu and the team.

This is a team that Ryan Reynolds and the other guy from It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia, they own this team. They sunk a lot of money into it and they've gone from pretty much last to they keep going up and up through the ranks. And he said, you know what?

He goes on this almost championship game, play for yourself. Play like you did when you were 10 years old. Do it because it's fun. And spoiler alert, they won, which was really, really cool.

And so sometimes you just want to learn something new and sometimes you just want to have some fun. You don't always have to make money with your podcast. In fact, most podcasters don't.

Anytime I do an episode on monetization, I always have to say, by the way, you don't have to make money with your podcast. You can get paid in fun, you can get paid in relationships, you can get paid and opportunities. So keep that in mind.

If you need help with it, you know where to find me. Schoolofpodcasting.com use the coupon code listener. That's L I S T E N E R when you sign up for either a monthly, quarterly or yearly subscription.

And that comes with a 30 day money back guarantee. I'm Dave Jackson. I help podcasters. Been doing it for 20 years and I can't wait to see what we're going to do together. And until next week, take care.

God bless. Class is dismissed. And so I wanted to know kind of the behind the scenes, how did that happen? Did you being a podcaster.

And of course Dave does the syndicated road. The syndicated road. What's a syndicated road? I don't know. Why did my mouth do that? Why did my brain do that?

You. You.

You have failed me. And we're not even two. Two minutes into the podcast and my brain has left the building. This podcast is part of the power of Podcasting Network.

Find it at powerofpodcasting.com changing the world one download at a time.