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In this episode...

Parenting, Work, and Building the Next Generation of Leaders With Olaolu Ogunyemi

https://faithfulontheclock.com/parenting-work-and-building-the-next-generation-of-leaders-with-olaolu-ogunyemi

Parenting while also trying to work is tough! In Episode 154 of Faithful on the Clock, Olaolu Ogunyemi shares insights about how to balance those tasks and raise the next generation of leaders.

Timestamps:

[00:04] - Intro

[00:41] - Olaolu’s background

[02:40] - What got Olaolu interested in working with kids

[04:12] - The main pain points Olaolu sees parents and kids having

[07:15] - The reality of how much people use technology; recommendations for parents who want boundaries but are stuck using tech to a high degree

[11:13] - Addressing the psychological conflict of setting tech limits but needing the tech to provide

[13:25] - What parents can do to show kids they care and be present despite work responsibilities

[18:15] - The difference between real and online presence; Olaolu’s real-life example supporting his daughter in band; the importance of small, consistent moments of being there in building trust

[24:37] - What parents can do to model confidence and practice good mental health even if they are still developing themselves

[32:36] - How faith has played into Olaolu’s leadership

[36:53] - Advice on how parents can give kids hope and a deeper sense of purpose

[41:48] - The importance of community and the reality that kids and parents need a full network of support

[46:10] - How to learn more about and connect with Olaolu

[46:47] - Prayer

[47:56] - Outro/What’s coming up next

Key takeaways:

• Parenting today requires new strategies, not recycled ones. Today’s children are growing up in a radically different technological environment than their parents did. Old parenting defaults often don’t translate well, which means parents need intentional awareness of the digital world shaping their kids
• Screen boundaries begin with parent self-awareness. Before correcting children’s tech habits, parents need honest insight into their own screen usage. Tracking your tech habits creates clarity about whether your screen time is truly productive or mostly recreational distraction.
• Transparency builds trust. Children need context for why parents are using technology for work. Explaining work responsibilities and creating visible “work zones” helps children distinguish healthy digital responsibility from mindless consumption.
• Leadership starts with modeling. Children learn leadership by watching adults prioritize physical health, emotional regulation, spiritual discipline, and mental growth. Parents who consistently invest in themselves teach resilience without ever giving a lecture.
• Kids notice more than parents realize. Children often detect parental stress long before adults admit it. Their observations can become valuable feedback that helps parents course-correct emotionally and spiritually.
• Conversations create protection. If parents don’t help children process current events, media narratives, and faith questions, outside voices will shape those conclusions instead. Providing context for what kids are seeing prevents overwhelm and helps them cope.
• Parenting was never meant to be isolated. Strong parenting depends on healthy community. Mentors, neighbors, teachers, and trusted adults expand a child’s support system and reinforce shared values.

CTAs:

• Audit your screen time this week. Open your phone’s screen report and evaluate how much of your usage is work or distraction. What patterns need adjusting?
• Create one intentional connection ritual with your child (e.g., tea time, reading, cooking). Small repeated moments create long-term trust.
• Start one deeper conversation this week. Ask your child, “What’s something happening in the world that’s confusing or frustrating to you right now?” Then help provide perspective and context.

What’s coming up next:

In Episode 155 of Faithful on the Clock, guest Daniel Simon emphasizes why it’s critical for us to provide teens and young adults early career and faith guidance.

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[Thibodeaux]

It’s that time, everybody — time to hit another episode of Faithful on the Clock, the podcast for Christian professionals where every microphone gets soundchecked to get your faith and work aligned. Statistically, there’s a huge chunk of the workforce that has kids, and juggling parenting and faith and a job at the same time has real challenges. Today, we’re welcoming guest Olaolu Ogunyemi to address those challenges so all you parents and caregivers out there have some guidance. Let’s hear his wisdom, listeners.

[Thibodeaux]

Hello, everybody. It’s good to have you listening again to Faithful on the Clock. With me today is writer, US Marine, and the founder of Parent Child Connect — Olaolu Ogunyemi. Olaolu is doing this show for two big reasons: first, because there is a genuine need to prepare the next generation of leaders, but also because there are so many parents who are genuinely struggling to manage the work and parenting responsibilities that we have. We wanna just acknowledge how genuinely tough that is. So, he’s going to share some of his insights to just give us some footing. So, Olaolu, welcome to Faithful on the Clock. Thanks for being with me.

[Ogunyemi]

Hey, Wanda, thank you so much for having me. I’m very excited to have this conversation. I’ve been looking forward to it, so, I’m ready to dive in.

[Thibodeaux]

Okay. So, just to get us started, usually what I have guests do is just give us a little bit about yourself. You know, not everybody is familiar with every guest, so, I just want to give you the opportunity to share about yourself a little bit.

[Ogunyemi]

Yeah, absolutely. So, like you said, I’m Olaolu Ogunyemi. I’m the fifth of six children, and grew up in Ruston, Louisiana, which is a very small town — about 26,000 people, for those who didn’t know. But we do, in fact, have a Walmart, so very excited about that, growing up, for sure. I started Parent Child Connect after being in the Marine Corps for about — somewhere about eight, nine years, and decided to start something that would allow us to connect with our children. So, that’s what Parent Child Connect is all about. It’s about providing resources so that parents, teachers, mentors, and caregivers can really start to connect with their children and help raise the next generation of impactful leaders. And so, that’s really what I do throughout the day. Like I said, I’m active duty, so that keeps me busy. The other thing that keeps me busy — my other hat that I wear — is, I’m a husband and a father of three wonderful children and a wonderful wife. And currently, we’re in the Washington, DC, DMV area, and we’ll be here for the next few years. So, that’s a lot about me, and like I said, I’m just excited to be here, and I appreciate the opportunity.

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah, of course. So, can you tell me a little bit about what got you interested with working with parents and kids? Just a little bit.

[Ogunyemi]

Yeah, absolutely. So, I was a very young parent — I still am, obviously. But I graduated from college, I was 22, married with a three-year-old. And so, I started at a very early age. And one thing I realized is that I was just as clueless as they come, just trying to, you know, figure it out as it goes. And just those things helped inspire me to want to be a better father for my child. That was really where all this stuff came from. It’s like, I want to be a better father, a better supportive husband, and making sure I’m being there for my family. So, I started thinking, it’s like, well, if I’m having that struggle, I know I’m not the only one. So, I decided, you know, why not? As I started to do my research and collect my resources, and writing my children’s books, which is what this all started on — I wanted to make sure that I — I pushed out resources that other people can use as well. And that’s really what started it. It started from a desire to want to connect with my own children and lead them, and then it sort of grew from there.

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah. I definitely think that, you know, our personal experiences play into what we get into, so, I can totally relate. I can relate as well — kind of starting early. I think I was 26 when I had my first child. So, and that’s not horribly young, but it’s young enough. You know, it was pretty tough, so, I — I totally understand that. And I think a lot of people, like you said, are in that position. Certainly, now, I think there are people who are waiting to have kids, but it’s tough anyway. Doesn’t matter what age you are. For sure.

So, that being said — you know, in your work, what are you kind of seeing as the pain points that parents and kids are kind of having?

[Ogunyemi]

Well, some of it — a few things. Number one is our children are dealing with different things than we dealt with growing up. So, for example, I didn’t get my first cell phone until my senior year of high school, and even then, it was one of those phones that was a pay-as-you-go phone. And I believe text messages were 10 cents a minute, and I think the internet was like 25 cents a minute, or something crazy like that.

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah.

[Ogunyemi]

And so, I didn’t get free calls unless it was Singular to Singular, or later AT&T —

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah.

[Ogunyemi]

— or if you called me after nine o’clock, right? So, you know, I just wasn’t as connected. We had dial-up, but I grew up in the country, so dial-up was just as slow as it could be. And, you know, if somebody wanted to make a phone call, that broke your connection, and then you just didn’t have the ability to get out.

[Thibodeaux]

So, I was just gonna say, some — some people out there, they’re like, what? Like, they can’t imagine that. But go ahead.

[Ogunyemi]

Yeah, it’s such a new world, it’s crazy, because obviously it’s not that long ago, but that is just such a weird world to some people. They’re like, what in the world is dial-up? Well, to put it in perspective, if you’ve ever been in the middle of the country and you have like half a bar, that’s about how fast dial-up is. So, just imagine trying to do anything with that, you know — aside from, you know, Ask Jeeves and maybe getting an answer within five minutes, that’s about as good as it’s gonna get. So, that’s how we grew up, right? That’s just our upbringing. But then you have these children who are coming up in a much faster information age, so, information is constantly coming to them. And that’s one of the pain points for parents — they’re starting to realize that our children are being influenced in so many different directions, and they’re like, well, how in the world do I embed myself, or find a way to either combat or collaborate with these influences? And what they’re saying is, it actually is tough. You know, it’s not something that you can just do, that we can just reach back into our toolkit and say, okay, well, my parents did this, so, I’m going to do that. Well, it’s not that easy. And so, some of the things that we’re starting to see is that we just have to learn how to connect with our children in different ways than we might have been comfortable with. It could be as much as, you know, understanding what trending things are going on. Now, I’m not saying go out there and try to be a trendy parent, because that’s not my recommendation. But I am saying, understand what those trends are. Understand the root of them. All you have to do is Google it. There’s usually some influencer out there that’s going to tell you what’s going on. But find a way to understand what’s going on in their lives.

So, that’s one. And then the other is just trying to balance, you know, being a purpose-driven leader, or careers, or professional, with being a parent. And again, that’s sort of hard, because when you’re starting to wear multiple hats — you know, as I introduced myself, I said I’m active duty Marine. I have this Parent Child Connect business that I’m running, and I have — I’m a husband and father, and I have all these hats. And I’m not alone in this endeavor. Obviously, you’re podcasting, you’re a parent — you have — everybody has a lot of things that they’re doing, and it’s trying to find a way to balance that. And I will say those are the two major pain points that I see when I talk to parents.

[Thibodeaux]

So, just to tack on a little bit to that technology idea — one of the things that we had talked about in our pre-interview was how, you know, you can’t get away from technology now. The parents are using it, the kids are using it. Like, it’s everywhere. And we had talked about how it’s — like, even my son has told me, you know, “Mom, it’s not realistic to, like, not have me on a screen,” right? But in a way, he’s right. He’s so right. Like, everything that we do for work, so much of it — oh, you’ve got to send an email, oh, you’ve got to make a pitch deck — like, everything, you have to be on a screen. I certainly — you know, there are some professions where it’s not as much the case, but I’m really wondering what you recommend for — you know — we — we can say all day long, you know, that we’ve gotta have these boundaries, but what do you recommend for parents who, you know, they — they’re kind of stuck. They have to use it, and their — their kids are seeing them on the screen all day long, but they — they don’t really know how to like, walk the walk that way, because — does that make sense?

[Ogunyemi]

Oh, yeah, it does. And that was one of my favorite conversations in our pre-interview, because it made me start to think about, like, how many times have I picked up my phone just this week? And I think that’s where it starts. It starts with gaining an understanding of how much you’re doing — sort of log it. Don’t do anything about it. Don’t try to change it, don’t feel bad, or try to condemn yourself, or anything like that. I would say, start with just logging it every time you pick up your phone. And you — phones nowadays actually have an application or setting where you can go in and see what your screen time is, see where you’re spending your time on your applications. So, I — I recommend that you start there by logging the hours, understanding like, how you spend your time on your phone. And for many of us, especially as you’re talking about, it’s our business, right? We — we wanna answer that email, because we know that if you — if you delay too long, sometimes there are bosses out there, or there are opportunities that would just say, well, you took too long to respond, so, you know, I went with something else or I went to somebody else to get the answer I needed.

And so, what I recommend is, after you are able to log it and understand how you spend your time, start to figure out — is that time truly spent on working, or is there other things that you’re starting to spend more time in your screen time doing? Because what I started finding when I talked to parents, and even in my own type of real self-introspective look, I realized that I was using the phone more for recreational things than I was for actual business. Right? And once I realized that, I’m like, oof. I — you know, I thought it was the other way around. You know, I thought, you know, I’m writing articles, I’m doing all these great things. And you know, I just thought I was doing something more than I was.

So, once you do that, though, you realize it. The next thing is, you have to set the example. And I believe that the way you do that is by communicating. You tell the child — especially once you’re actually working — if you can, go to a work location, like if you have a setup that you can do in your bedroom or your office if you have it, whatever you have, go to a set location where you’re working. So, that way, the child, when they see you in that area, they know, okay, mom or dad is working. That’s what they’re doing. That’s why they’re sitting there with their phone, their device. Because what you’re teaching them is, yes, there are boundaries, but at the same time, I have to provide for you. I have to make money in some way. So, while you’re setting yourself in that position, you’re telling them, hey, I am working. And then you’re also demonstrating to them, because obviously from a distance, they don’t see the difference between what you’re doing and what you’re saying and what you’re — you know, how you’re using your screen time.

So, those are things I recommend. Just try to set the example as much as you can, and then communicate what you’re doing and be completely transparent about it. Hey, you know, I spend, you know 30 minutes, or whatever the time is, on my phone with recreational things, and I spend about an hour doing work things. Just be communicative and transparent.

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah. I think part of it for me, too — like you said, realizing how much entertainment and stuff you’re actually doing. But I think part of that is having alternatives on deck. Like, if you’re not gonna use the phone for your entertainment or whatever it is, what are you gonna use? And be active and intentional about going to those things, because otherwise you’re gonna default to the tech, you know? So, I think that’s a really easy guardrail that you can do and just kind of think through those.

But the other thing that I thought of as you were talking is that — you know, you had mentioned, kind of, you know, you do have to provide. And I think, I know for me, that has been one of the biggest psychological hangups with the technology, and, you know, teaching my kids about how to be leaders. Because in my head, the two things are combined — like, if I’m working and I’m on the tech and I’m doing all the things, then therefore I’m doing a good thing. So, how can doing a good thing be bad, right? And I think we kind of have to address that. So, what would you say to that?

[Ogunyemi]

Yeah, so, it’s funny — I just had this conversation with a psychologist last night, and one of the things they were — they said is that there’s never been a child who said, man, I wish dad worked more. And so, that’s why the transparency — or dad or mom, any parent — that’s why the transparency is key. That’s why it’s — it’s good to explain to them what it means to provide. It’s good to sit down with the — with the budget, show them the bills. Show them the — you know, and you’re not doing this to overwhelm them, off course. You’re not getting them to feel bad. Because I know that sometimes we do that — it’s like, well, here’s the bills, you know, here’s — you see this? This is you. No, we’re not trying to do that.

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah. Give them a bill, right?

[Ogunyemi]

Exactly. It’s like, you see this light bill? You’re the one who’s causing this. No. No. That’s not what we’re doing. We’re trying to just introduce them to some of the concepts of life, because — because they’re not necessarily exposed to that. There’s no true class that teaches them life lessons — how to pay bills, or talking about utilities, or budgeting. It doesn’t exist in all the schools yet. And those things are really important for us as parents, to have the opportunity to sit down and talk to the children so that way they know that, hey, you know, this is not something that I enjoy doing every single day, all day. I would much rather spend time with you. But in order for me to pay this bill, I have to do this. And I think the more you expose children to that and have that conversation — just in a normal, over tea, over hot chocolate, or whatever it is — not — not in — not in a tense moment. I wouldn’t recommend doing that if you’re confronting about screen time and they’re like, well, you’re on your phone. It’s like, well, I’ve got to pay bills.

[Thibodeaux]

Right. Right. Right.

[Ogunyemi]

Choose the time very wisely that you bring it up, so that way your children can understand — in that moment, you’re mentoring and teaching them, and honestly preparing them for the next step while you set the example for them.

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah. Well, one thing that I can connect to that too is that we had talked a little bit about how — to — just to come back to that idea of provision — about how there is more than one way to provide. You know, when we work, we think about, like, the tangibles: Do you have food and clothes? Can you eat? All of those things. But we had talked a little bit about just being present and being, you know, emotionally there. And I think, again, that is one of the things that, if kids are gonna be leaders, they need that, because that is where their sense of worth comes from. It’s their sense of confidence. If you’re not there, then really they are not there inside themselves. Like, they don’t know where to go. They don’t know what they can do. So, I wonder if you can just talk to that a little bit about what we can do, even though we’ve gotta clock in. Right? So, what are some really practical ways that we can show our kids — we care about you, we love you, even though maybe we’ve got to deploy, or do whatever it is. We want to be there. We are doing this for you. We — we still see you.

[Ogunyemi]

Yeah, that’s a beautiful question. It ties right back to how our children — children are being influenced. Because right now, sometimes when you’re connected constantly with technology, especially in their world, they’re not learning the true idea behind physical presence and the value in it. They’re learning what people want them to see, right? So, if you’re connecting over social media, even if I’m the best influencer and I’m doing whatever — reality, social media, website, or whatever I may be doing — I’m still giving you what I want you to see, which means I’m not truly connected with the human being. I’m not having that authentic connection. And so, that’s more why it’s important for us to get into their world and to find out — or to teach them — how to connect on a physical layer.

So, one of the things I — I like to encourage — and I learned this from my oldest, and again, our children teach us the best lessons ever — she taught me how to just have “tea time,” right? And I put that in quotation marks, because it’s not necessarily us sipping tea, although I may be drinking tea. It’s actually the tea she’s talking about — all the things that are going on. It started in, like, junior high, maybe sixth grade — all the things that are going on in her whole world. And I just started laughing as I’m sitting there listening to her, like, man, this is — this is what it’s like to have a daughter. I’m just learning about everybody. I have no idea who these kids are, who these people are. I’m learning about things. And it’s just that moment of communication when she knows that, okay, well, I’m just gonna go to Dad, we’re gonna have a conversation, and he’s going to be listening to me. And then later on, you know, two months later, when I bring up this person, he’s going to be able to connect who those people are. So, I feel like he’s a part of my world. And that’s what we have to do — it’s finding those moments. Whatever that may be — for my youngest, it’s probably reading. If she were to say that — she loves cuddling, and I love that because she — she’s the only one that still wants to cuddle with me. Other than that, I have to force it. But she loves cuddling, she loves reading. And my son, he loves — you know, sports and things of that nature, and just spending time gaming and things. So, it’s finding something to bond with them. And yes, sometimes it’s introducing technology, but really, it’s when the thing gets turned off and when the book gets put down. It’s really, now you’re having that heart-to-heart conversation, that eye-to-eye. Or you’re doing something that’s enjoyable that they’re not — they can actually relate to. What I like to call the core memories — I got this from Inside Out — it’s one of those core memories that you’re creating for them, because you’re just making it one of those moments.

So, that’s what it is. It’s finding those everyday, those small things that we think are — are — are insignificant. Whether it be cooking and you’re — like, a lot of us get focused. When we cook, I’m like, man, okay, I want to do it this way. But the second one of my children walks in and says, “Hey, can I help you, dad?” I could easily say, “Nah, if you help me, I’m gonna mess up — I’m trying this new recipe for the first time.” But the best thing to do is say, “Okay, come on in.” Because that’s a perfect opportunity to create one of those moments. All those moments usually exist throughout the day. It’s sometimes those day-to-day things that we just do without even thinking about that. We can bring them into our world and allow them to share that moment with us.

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah, I love that you bring that up, though — like, about the cooking and stuff. Because I think especially for professionals, what are we taught? We’re taught be efficient, right? And so, that goes through our head all the time. I know, especially for me, I’m like, well, if I let them help, then, you know, that’ll take an extra however many minutes. I start doing all these calculations in my head, you know? And sometimes it’s really hard, because if it’s gonna take, like, 15 minutes and I’ve got, like, 10. Okay, you know, like, that is — it — it’s hard. I will admit it. But I like that you bring it up, because the — then we — it’s a value cost. You know, do you value the efficiency more, or do you value the relationship more? And quite frankly, you have to choose. And I — I — I’m trying very hard to choose the relationships over the efficiency now. I’ve learned. You know, I’m certainly not perfect at it, but I like that you bring it up.

And the other thing that I wanted to bring up is that — this idea of presence. Again, we — in the business world, we have this idea of — it’s — like, we can build an online presence. We hear that all the time, and we think that more is better. And really, I think what we’re talking about here is that — it’s — one-on-one presence doesn’t mean a number of followers. It doesn’t mean how big you are. It means how connected you are, right? And so, I just want to emphasize that, because I know that’s gonna come up. Because that’s what kids do now — they’re on social. You know, parents too, for work. And we try to build that. That’s what makes our brand look good, that’s why we get sponsors. It’s how many. But that’s not really what it is. It’s about how — how well are you connecting with people.

So, yeah. And the other thing, too, is you had this really beautiful story about how you were supporting that with your daughter. I think it was with the marching band. So, I just want to give this as a tangible example. Go ahead and tell me about that.

[Ogunyemi]

So, that was — I never did marching band growing up. I do play instruments. I played — from playing at church. But I never did marching band. I played sports — you know, all the — all the sports that you can think of. And, you know, one thing that I realized is that, okay, well, my — my daughter, you know, she’s going to be participating in this thing, so, I need to be there. Right? That — that was just ingrained in my mind from my parents. My parents were — were there supporting me in sports, they traveled with me and all those things. And I always thought that was funny, because I was like, I guess that’s just the norm. And so, I’ll show up and we’ll just make it a thing. Just show up.

I go to the games, and it’s always funny because I’d find myself cheering for the football team, but I don’t know a single person on the team, because really what I’m waiting on for is the halftime show, which is when my daughter would go out there with the band and play. But the fun thing about it is, I always wanted to make my presence felt, you know, in a way that you would for any other sports team. And so, instead of doing it, you know, during the performance, where I can mess her up on her count or anything like that, I just wait till after, when they’re marching off. And I — at first it was just a thing I was trying to be, you know — I was just gonna make it like a quick fun thing one time, just to try to embarrass her. But then it became a normal thing, right? So, she’ll walk by, and I was like, there she is. I would make this big hoopla about it. And what’s funny is, after the first couple of times, you could see the other band members looking for me after — after it’s over. And I’m standing there, like, to the side, usually by myself after everybody’s already gone, the band’s, like, marching off, and I’m just standing there. And you can see them looking around. And out of the corner of their eyes, in some cases, some of the guys will say, “Briley’s dad! Look, here she is!” And it’s sort of funny, because it’s like, I was like, man, you know, the impact that that makes. And now you have other parents standing there with me, just sort of laughing and having a good time, because it just creates this environment where we’re like, hey, we’re here to support you no matter what you’re doing, right?

And that’s just, again — it’s those moments of finding a way to connect with your children. That wouldn’t work for everybody. My daughter is one of those that she’s just hard to embarrass. She — I’ve been trying. I can embarrass my son easily. I can even embarrass my younger daughter easily. My oldest — I can’t embarrass that much, as much as I try.

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah.

[Ogunyemi]

So, little things like that just become the norm. It becomes our thing. So, that — that’s really my take on — on just being there for the band. I don’t do it in concerts. I do my best to — I wait till everybody else is cheering. But I will do it after a live performance.

[Thibodeaux]

Sure. Well, one of the reasons why I bring that up — and we had kind of talked about — you know, I refer to myself as a band geek, too, because that’s what I am. I was a double music major. But, you know, I know what it has been like to, you know, you go to those kinds of events and maybe there’s not somebody there cheering for you like you were for her. And I — we had talked about how that really does make a difference. And it’s not necessarily — like, you know, you — you supporting her in band, maybe you’re not a band person, but you come to her band events, you know? And we had talked about how it’s not necessarily that, you know, you share the hobby, but it’s that you share the relationship, and you value that. So, if they don’t — you know, enjoy the things that you enjoy — you know, I know some parents, you’re like, what the heck is that that they’re doing? Right? And it’s like, what? And like, it totally doesn’t appeal to you, but you show up anyway, because you care about your kid. And you learn. And again, like you said, it’s about learning who they are, and they can be the source of information about what’s going on in the next generation for you. So, just being open to that, I think, is a really beautiful thing.

[Ogunyemi]

I 100% agree. And I — I think that sometimes a lot of us parents are looking for that home-run moment. It’s like we’re looking for that big thing. You know, I can take you to Disneyland, I can surprise you with this big gift, or something like that. When in reality, they’re looking for those — maybe those singles, those at-bats. And I use that expression because when I started playing, you know, T-ball, I wanted to hit a home run, you know, every time I stepped up to the plate. I wanted to hit a home run because I was watching Mark McGwire and Sammy Sosa and that crew, and I’m like, man, I want to be like them. And every time I swung, I swung for the fences. And then the coach would come up to me and say, hey, man, just get on the bag. Just get on the bag. And I started learning that. I started applying that to my own life. It’s like, well, you know what? Sometimes, it’s just about the single. It’s about making contact with the ball and getting to the base, and that’s all you need to do. Your batting average — you see some of the most high-paid — highest-paid baseball players have a high batting average. Why? Because that’s just — they’ve learned how when they are at bat, they’re going to connect with the ball. That’s just how it works. It’s not necessarily the guy like me who would just go swinging for the fences and miss, you know, 19 times out of 20, and finally connect, and I have this one home run. I’ll be sitting on the bench or not even in the league. And so, that’s really what we have to learn. It’s that — it’s not necessarily always about the home-run moments. It’s about those small daily actions that truly create that connection. And it starts with, as you said, understanding who that child is and getting to know them on a personal level, and then building that relationship from there.

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah. Well, the thing that strikes me about that is — because if you’ve read any of the books about it, we know that’s how you build trust: one little interaction at a time. Because that’s how we show the other person’s brain that this person is not a threat, that they are a dependable person. Small, consistent actions. So, you don’t have to get it right all the time, but that’s all leadership is — is, small interactions every single day that teach people that you can be consistent and that you’re gonna be reliable. And that’s what our kids need too. So, if we give that to them, you are teaching leadership, even if you never call it that. You know, they — they will learn that, right?

[Ogunyemi]

Exactly.

[Thibodeaux]

So, I kind of just want to pivot just a little bit. You know, we’ve been talking about kind of, you know, what the kids need, but what do you think — just a little bit, we know that kids are having such a struggle right now, like, with mental health and self-concept. So, we had talked just a touch about how that ties into our — the self-concept ties to leadership. Like, you’ve got to have that confidence. So, what can parents do to make sure that they themselves are — like, you know, because work is tough, so when we don’t have that confidence, how can we model that confidence for them? How can we take care of our own mental health so that our kids see — see us doing that?

[Ogunyemi]

Oh, yeah. So, the first thing is — I — I always call them the non-negotiables. And it’s — it’s four things I do every single morning, and that’s something to improve my physical, mental, emotional, and spiritual health. And so, I wake up a little bit earlier than — than most people would. My alarm goes off at four. Not that I recommend that, but I do recommend at least 10 minutes in each of those categories. And you can combine them if you want, but that’s just 40 minutes a day improving upon your physical, mental, emotional, and spiritual health.

And the way that looks for me is, I wake up and the first thing I do is meditate and do my devotion. And then I go into some form of writing. I go into — try to stimulate the mind, journal, and all that stuff, which is to improve my spiritual and emotional health. And then I go into my physical training. I go for — now, I’m doing walks until I fully recover from my knee surgery, but I will go into some kind of walk. And during that walk, I may be listening to music or listening to an audiobook or something that’s stimulating the mind. So, these are the ways I’m setting myself up, even before everybody else wakes up for the day or starts to interact with me for the day.

And I truly believe that when you start building yourself up in those areas and working on improving your health in those areas, just being consistent with that, you’ll start to see that, you know, your children get on board. They’re starting to see, okay, I can see that mom is doing this. I saw mom sitting down with a book. You know, I see her with her journal — though she won’t let me read it. I see her writing in her journal. I see dad working out, and so on and so forth. And you start to be this example for them of what right looks like.

And then again, this goes back to technology — they see you not using that technology, perhaps, and they see you actually doing things to improve upon yourself. And so, I think that’s really where it starts. It starts with, you know, investing in yourself every single day, finding time — making time, because you have to — making time to improve upon your physical, mental, emotional health. Listening to podcasts just like this one, or doing these kinds of things just to stimulate your mind and grow yourself. Because, again, that’s the only way to do it. It — it’s — you have to find the time to do it.

And some things that I always recommend is to disconnect. There — there’s times when we just have to — to disconnect. So, if you were to look at my algorithm for social media and — and anything, you’ll just see sports. You’ll most likely see some guys cutting grass — which, I made fun of kids — just a sidebar — made fun of my kids for watching other kids play with toys, but I watch other guys cut grass. Just — not that — think that’s weird.

[Thibodeaux]

No, actually, I kind of get it. I can kind of infer, so —

[Ogunyemi]

Yeah, it’s just — that’s my algorithm. You see some kind of scientific thing, things like that, that are just entertaining to me. But you won’t see a lot of just negative media. I do my best to stay away from it. You know, I watch the news to be informed. I may find a couple of articles here and there, but for the most part, it’s — you know, it’s — when I’m trying to use my phone to be entertained, or technology to be entertained, I just do it to decompress. I’m not going to turn on something negative. And that’s something we have to be intentional about — what we’re allowing ourselves to be fed with, whether it be through our shows or whether it be through the news we’re watching, or whatever it is. There’s always something that’s pulling on us to — to be negative. And you don’t know how much that weighs on you until after you continue to do it over and over and you’re lashing out and you can’t figure out why you’re lashing out. Well, for one, you may be exhausted. And then for two, you may being fueled by some of that negativity that you’re watching and reading and — and allowing to come into your body.

[Thibodeaux]

I can tell you myself — you know, like, there have been plenty of times, well — I guess my first point is that we don’t always realize how well our children are paying attention. Like, we say it, but oh my goodness, they do. They do. Because there have been so many times where I’m like, oh, I’m keeping it together, right? And then my son, you know, like, he’ll come to me like, “Mom, do you need a pill? Do we need to tape you to the chair?” Like, they’ll say that, you know? And then I’m like, okay, yeah, maybe I better chill out or get away from this stuff. You know, so they can — but I guess the point there, too, is like, they can hold us accountable more than we realize, too — not that that’s a responsibility of theirs, but just that we can be open to their feedback and just be aware. Like, — like, what they are giving back to us in that feedback isn’t necessarily inaccurate. So, if they say, mom, you seem stressed out — oh no, no, no, no. Yes, you are. Like, that’s — that’s what you are giving out into the world. And so, I think as Christians, you know, our goal is to give out into the world — we wanna be bearers of light, right? And if that’s what we’re giving out into the world, maybe we need to take a step back, especially as parents, if we are going to prepare new leaders. We have to give them the — the right model. Does that make sense?

[Ogunyemi]

No, that makes perfect sense. And I love that you said that, because that is the mark of a true leader — one who can receive feedback. And — and one of the things I love — one of — I love reading about Jesus in the Bible, because one of the examples that He provided for us is He went and asked His disciples, “Who do people say I am?” And sometimes it’s like, man, that’s a — that’s a strange thing for Him to say, right? Is He being self-conscious? No, maybe He just wants them to understand who He is, and He’s getting feedback in that moment. He’s starting to understand that, you know, if people are now saying that He’s a tyrant or He’s a rebel or that He’s doing everything, that perhaps He needs to adjust, and He were to have to adjust to how He’s doing things — which, of course, we know that that’s not what the case was. But that’s just an example for us to understand that there’s nothing wrong with asking. In fact, it’s encouraged to ask for feedback and say, okay, what do you think? What do you think is going on? How do you feel about X, Y, and Z? How do you feel about me podcasting, or — or doing this thing?

My dad was a pastor my entire life, and one of the most impactful conversations that we had was him just talking to me about why he’s doing what he’s doing. Because there were times he missed games, and there were times that he missed key events. And you look in the stands and it’s like, man, is that church really that important? I know that’s coming from a child’s perspective — seemingly selfish — but that’s still the perspective of the child. But it’s only until you have that conversation to say, hey, you know what, this is important, and here’s why. Because you have it every single day. But that guy out there — once he leaves this court, he goes to a home with no hope. His mom is not — she’s working three jobs. His dad’s not in the picture. And so on and so forth. So, because you have that, what I’m trying to do is help somebody else. And once you start explaining that over and over, it becomes a thing, and you’re like, man, that’s — that’s really impactful. Right? You know, so this game that I’m playing is only temporary. You know, even if I played in college, I’m not going pro in this. But what you’re doing is going to last — potentially last that individual a lifetime and keep them from behind bars. Okay, now I get it. I — I started understanding a little bit more, instead of just allowing that to drift by. So, that’s a wonderful thing that you — you were saying there. I just wanted to add that on.

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah, sure. Well, I think, too — you know, when we’re looking at feedback, sometimes that’s scary, because we have in our minds what we want to be, and sometimes the feedback doesn’t match. And then, if we get that feedback and it doesn’t match, then we have to figure out what to do with that, and we might not have a plan for that, right? You know, we talk about flexibility all the time, but yeah, that’s — that can be really, really tough. And I think that’s part of where, like, the faith comes in, because that — that can be very grounding. Like, you don’t necessarily have to have the plan, because God does, right? He will help you figure it out.

But that does lead me to ask — like, how has faith played into your own leadership? And — and what do you think parents can do to, like, bring the faith element into what they are teaching their kids to be leaders?

[Ogunyemi]

Yeah, so for me — once I became a parent, I think that’s when I truly learned what faith was. Because I started thinking — you know, I was looking at my kids, and I’m like, man, I’m really proud of them. And you know, they do some off-the-wall stuff, and it’s like, ah, man, that’s — they shouldn’t be doing that. But it was — I was just sitting there almost in tears one day, just thinking about how proud I am of my children. And it — it — that’s when it was like a light bulb that hit me. And I’m like, wow, that’s what faith is all about. That’s what this whole relationship with God is all about. It’s about how proud He is of us, and how much He wants to set us up for success, and He wants us to pursue our purpose. And that’s where my faith came in —comes into place. It reminds me that I’m here for a higher calling. I have a higher purpose on my life. And that the more I pursue that purpose, the more proud of Him — of me He is — of me. So, I’m just like, man, this is — that’s what the faith has been for me. It’s been understanding, knowing that there’s nothing crazy that I could do to — to truly just — just make God stop liking me.

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah.

[Ogunyemi]

But there was also this thing that I’m born for a purpose. I was born intentionally. I was born on purpose, for purpose — is what I always say. And one of the things that I — I really love that about it is because I grew up very insecure. A lot of the things I did as a young teenager, preteen, teenager, were because I was trying to fit in. You know, I didn’t like — you know, to be honest with you — I didn’t like my name in Louisiana because people made fun of it. I — you know, I didn’t like my way — the way I looked in the mirror. I didn’t like the gap. All these things that I didn’t like about myself, that I was just like, okay, I’m gonna go out here and I’m gonna show out. I’m gonna fit in with the crowd. And the times that they were accepting me, I felt like I was — I was just part of something bigger, right? And that goes back to why faith is important to me, because it does make me feel like I’m a part of something bigger.

And so, to tie it back to what parents can do — it’s — number one, don’t be afraid to teach your children values. Don’t be afraid to be open with your faith and share verses and bring — like, when you’re talking to them, there’s absolutely nothing wrong with talking about a scripture or bringing the scripture into the conversation. I think at times, you know, I was talking to parents, at times, they don’t wanna lecture their child, or they don’t wanna seem like they’re preaching to them and things of that nature. But you can talk to them in a very natural way and then weave in the scripture in a way that they can understand. Because you never know that when you’re doing that how much that light bulb may go off for them, and they’re like, oh, now I made that connection. Because I always tell people that you are that Jesus for them, right?

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah.

[Ogunyemi]

A lot of times, for a lot of people, they don’t have that connection. They don’t know what it’s like until you provide that example for them, and you stand in as their perception of what Christianity should be. And so, that’s really what I encourage people to do — is, to get out and study, read with their children if you can, really try to exemplify a lifestyle that — that’s purposeful, and continue to encourage them and tell them, hey, you know what? There’s nothing that you can do about me loving you. I tell — I love — one of — my pastor used to say that — I love you, and there’s nothing you can do about it. And the more you tell people that — the more you tell them that, your children that, and encourage them and — and push them towards shared values, I think the more that you truly would train them up and help them to create their own faith journey along the way.

[Thibodeaux]

Well, first of all, I just wanna say thank you for admitting that as a young person, you were insecure — as a young man. Because I think a lot of young guys, like, they — they wanna be tough, you know, the traditional masculinity, and so, like — they need to understand that other guys are going through that, too. Like, everybody’s struggling with it. Doesn’t matter, you know, what gender you are — it’s everywhere. That’s just growing up. And even as adults, it does not end. It does not. Sorry to tell you. So, that’s the first thing.

But I wanted to come back to that — that idea of purpose and — and faith, because one of the things that we had talked about — well, first of all, I always say that calling and purpose are slightly different. Calling is the path to your purpose. That’s your vocation, right? That’s how you get there. But your purpose is always just to give God joy, because He is a God of joy, and we’re supposed to reflect that back to Him. So, we all have the same purpose, but we have different callings. Okay? So, I just want to clarify that.

But the idea that when we have that purpose — one of the things we talked about, again, just to kind of circle back to mental health, is that one of the things you have been seeing is that the young people don’t have a lot of hope, that they don’t know what their sense of purpose is. So, I wonder if you can just give some parents some advice or encouragement on how to kind of address that, because I think that is a really big issue that they are struggling with.

[Ogunyemi]

Yeah, so that was one of the tough ones. And that’s what — I think we talked about this in the pre-interview — is that, the — when I was talking to people, it’s not just the fact that they’re not — they’re not believers in Christ. It’s the fact that they don’t believe in anything, and that truly is no hope whatsoever. Right? Because that means that you are just here for yourself, and — and there’s nothing else to live for. And I think that’s truly where we see a lot of our — our youth now, because some of them — a lot of them — are just trying to make it through life, and they’re trying to understand the world in context, and they have all these other things around them that could be confusing. Right? That’s — that’s where we have to be as parents — understanding, again, what’s going on in the world. What are they being told about Christianity, and what are the — what are the narratives out there? I saw one — there’s this big article going on right now where somebody went to a church asking for formula. Our children are seeing that, because they said the church turned them around, and it — it’s just one of those things that — you know, children see that, and that becomes their perception of what it looks like, what the church is. And they’re like, well, why didn’t the church do that? And they can quickly take sides, and you never know what’s being influenced. So, it’s understanding, okay, if there’s something going on in the media, if you see it, then just make the assumption that your child may have seen it, too.

[Thibodeaux]

Oh, yeah.

[Ogunyemi]

And don’t be afraid to bring it up and talk to them about it. Because those things, if left unchecked, they’re forming their opinions about what it truly is. And even though they could be a part of a church that’s doing global impact, they’re seeing something right in their face — on their cell phones or wherever it may be — that’s saying, maybe not. You know, maybe it’s, you know the church isn’t doing this, the church didn’t give them — that person milk when they needed it, or whatever it is. So, it’s truly explaining to them, using current events, and explaining to them, you know, what it looks like. Or if there’s some event — maybe there was a scandal in the church — explaining that, hey, that’s just one individual. And here’s the fact — that individual still has their own relationship with God. It’s not our place to tell them, you know, to try to say that they, you know, whether or not they are going to make it to heaven or something like that. You don’t know what’s going on in their household. So, it’s really using current events to try to teach them what’s going on, and teach them the fundamentals of Christianity, and really teach them about relationship.

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah. I like that you are recommending to actually talk about the stuff that’s going on, though. Because one of the things that I have kind of seen too is — well, my hypothesis, I guess I would say, based on what — what I’ve seen — I kind of think that, you know, if — part — if kids are seeing all of this stuff going on in the world, they’re not real sure, you know, does God exist? You know, they haven’t — they haven’t centered on that yet. They’re seeing all this stuff, maybe in the church or wherever. But if you don’t have any direction, if you don’t have that sense of hope and purpose with that, doesn’t it stand to reason that you would wanna seek all of these little dopamine hits in other places? So, why wouldn’t you turn to a screen? Why wouldn’t you just hole up in your room? And I think — I guess what I’m trying to say is I think those things are related. Like, the withdrawal that kids have, and, you know, just kind of being depressed, and like, the things that they do to seek the happiness that they don’t see. You know, they’re trying to find it, but they don’t see it, so, they’re trying to kind of manufacture it. And I think as parents, if we recognize that — and quite frankly, I think adults do it, too. We do. Especially if we are in a job that, quite frankly, you know the word I wanna use, it’s just not great. You know, if we — if we are in those situations, we are going to use every distraction possible to, like, get away from that hurt. And so, I just want to encourage — you know, like I said, have those conversations. Like, yeah, it’s tough. But did you know that this good thing happened? Did you — and, like, put the perspective around it. Because if you don’t — like, oh man — you’re going to try and distract yourself all the time. And you get so busy doing all the distraction stuff that you don’t focus on God. You have — like, you don’t make the time.

[Ogunyemi]

That’s exactly right. It’s adding context to their world. And that’s — I think, again — this is — goes back to when I started writing children’s books. I learned that a lot of the publishers want children to just sit down and come to their own conclusion, almost like their own enlightenment. And I’m like, no. Parents have to sit down with their children and add context to what they’re hearing and learning. That’s our role as parents, and — and really as mentors, teachers, and caregivers — whatever it is. Our role is to provide context, based upon our experience in this world, to what our children are learning. It’s not to — not to — to restrict their creative thought. But it does help them to — when you add context, instead of allowing them to learn something from somebody who just doesn’t have their best interest at heart.

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah. So, when you get into the idea of providing that context and having those — that mentorship, one thing, again, that we had talked about in our pre-interview is about the idea of community. So, it’s not just, like, parents need the mentors, too, and that the parents don’t always have to be the only mentor for their children. Like, we all need to connect to each other to make this work. So, I wonder if you can just, you know, very quickly — talk about that and what you’re seeing.

[Ogunyemi]

Oh, yeah. And that’s — that’s one of the biggest things. You don’t have to do much as far as going out and starting a team, you know, get a big funding, or anything like that. You could just start with crocheting. I use the example that my mom crocheted and she taught people how to crochet. She taught us. You could teach financial literacy classes at the library. You can, you know, offer it up — or AI classes, whatever it may be. Go to your local library and ask. You could take a soccer — out in your backyard or to a local — local soccer field or playground and teach children how to play soccer. Those are the kinds of things that when you bring them in and you start having those connective moments, then you are able to mentor and guide them. And as parents, we just have to be okay with allowing people to extend our message and our values. Of course, that means you need to get to know the people who your children are going to be around, but you have to make sure they — you know, you’re sharing those values with those children and those adults, and allowing them to share those moments with your children, as well.

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah. Well, one of the reasons why I bring this up is because I think it kind of counterweights this idea of American capitalism that we have. Because American ideology basically — and people have heard this from me before — but it really promotes this idea that we are independent. And a lot of it, underneath it all, I think is quite frankly some fear mongering. You can’t trust other people. They’re — they’re, you know, going to do this to you. Watch your back. That’s an undercurrent that’s underneath that. Because nobody’s going to save you, you have to. Right? And that interferes with the idea that we can actually connect with people so that, to get some help. So, if a parent is struggling — you know, like, they’re barely able to breathe, and they’re like, oh my gosh, I am so overwhelmed, right — that interferes with their ability to say, hey, I’m gonna go knock on my neighbor’s door, can you watch my kid for, like, you know, 10 minutes, just so I can take a breath, get a shower. Right? Like, we don’t — like, that’s not our first instinct, I think. I think if we get desperate enough, maybe, but we gotta be pretty desperate, I think. I know at least for me, that was — that was the case for me. Like, I didn’t — I didn’t wanna do that. I didn’t want to bother people.

Yeah, I mean, like I had really had this idea that I could not take help from anybody. And so, the way that, like, that can interfere with parenting I guess the big thing that I want to get across there is, just take the help. Just ask for it. There is no shame in taking help. It will make you better as a parent and as an overall leader. But it also — because you are then feeding that into your kids, teaching them to take help — that plays into their leadership, too, because then they can delegate well. They — they can take the time that they need for themselves, reach out when they need it. Like, it — again, it’s that modeling that we need to see.

[Ogunyemi]

Oh, yeah. And like I said, I grew up in a large family. That means I have — I was the fifth of six. That means I have four older siblings, plus I have my parents that were there to mentor and guide me. And I still required coaches and mentors and community leaders to help me. Otherwise, I wouldn’t be where I am today. And I think that’s — that’s just really what you’re describing there. It’s knowing that that community has to exist. And if you don’t have it, then you may — if you’re protecting your child, in a way, you’re creating a bubble around them, and you don’t want to allow someone to come in and help — you may be restricting that child’s ability to grow and learn. So, it is scary. There’s a lot of things going on in the world, and I understand. But we have to be comfortable and know that yes, there are other people out there that truly want to help our children develop and grow.

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah. Well, I think that ties, though, to teaching — having those conversations about what does a safe person look like, and being able to recognize who can you lean on and who you maybe stay away from, you know? But again, that ties back to the whole idea of you will know them by their fruits, and teaching people to look that way and say, who — who — who do you see that in? Those are your people. You know what I mean? And teaching them, like, you don’t have to stay away from everybody. It’s not everybody that’s, you know, harsh. You know, I think that’s just something that we can teach our kids. Like, just look for — as Mr. Rogers would say on Mr. Rogers’ Neighborhood — look for the helpers, because they are there. They are. Right?

[Ogunyemi]

That’s exactly right.

[Thibodeaux]

Yeah. All right. Well, as we are wrapping up here, I just want to ask a little bit more about your work. If people are — wanna know more about you, they want to figure out a little bit more what you’re doing, connect with you — where can they go?

[Ogunyemi]

Yeah, so the best way to find me is parent-child-connect.com. You’ll see my blog there. You’ll see my books, you’ll see my partnership with YouVersion — all those kinds of things you’ll see there. Again, if you just go to parent-child-connect.com, I would love for people to come and contact me. I love meeting new people and networking, and that’s just where I like to be. So, that’s where you’ll find everything there is to know about me.

[Thibodeaux]

Oh, perfect. So, I always like to close the show by praying for my guests if I can. So, would that be all right if I did that?

[Ogunyemi]

Please, yes.

[Thibodeaux]

Alright.

God, I know that You are the Father of us all, so You know what it is like to be a parent — to struggle with all the things that come with having children. And so, I ask that You bless Olaolu and his ministry and all of the work that he’s doing through his organization, because parents really do need that support. They need to know how to be the good parent that You model for us. So give him the insights that the parents are needing, help him connect with the communities, give him the connections that he needs to keep doing the work that he does. And just help our kids to understand that we are rooting for them, just in the same way that You always root for us. In Jesus’ name, I pray.

[Ogunyemi]

Thank you so much.

[Thibodeaux]

Of course. Thank you, Olaolu. This has been a wonderful conversation. I really appreciate your time as a guest. Thank you so much.

[Ogunyemi]

Thank you so much for the opportunity. I loved it.

[Thibodeaux]

Thank you.

[Thibodeaux]

Listeners, I know that as a parent myself, I found Olaolu’s insights to be incredibly grounded and heartening. And I hope they give you the courage to do what Scripture says and to raise up children in the way they should go. In our next episode in two weeks, we’re going to continue the theme of building the next generation of leaders with academic and career coach Daniel Simon, who’ll be sharing why it’s so important for us to guide teens and young adults in faith, leadership, and career decisions right out of the gate. Sign up for our email list at faithfulontheclock.com to make sure you don’t miss that episode, and be blessed.