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Starting A Side Hustle with Sarah Crews - Ep. 27
Episode 27 β€’ 21st July 2025 β€’ Lessons From Your Hairstylist β€’ Sarah Crews
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In this solo episode, Sarah Crews shares the real, unfiltered story of how she built her hair and makeup company, Black Tie and Blush, from scratch, starting with a passion for wedding and special occasion styling and turning it into a full fledged business with a remote team and thriving artist network.

From navigating messy systems, overwhelming growth, and finally building a streamlined, sustainable business, Sarah takes you behind the scenes of what it really looks like to launch and run a beauty based business without a roadmap.

Whether you are a stylist dreaming of doing your own thing or a creative with a side hustle idea that won’t let go, this episode is full of honesty, encouragement, and valuable lessons.

πŸ’„ Learn more about Black Tie and Blush: www.blacktieandblush.com

πŸŽ₯ Mandy’s YouTube Channel: Mandy Davis MUA

πŸ“© Have questions or thinking of starting your own thing? Reach out via social or through the website.

Transcripts

Sarah Crews (:

Well hello and welcome to the Lessons from Your Hairstylist podcast. I'm your host and hairstylist friend, Sarah Cruz. Have you ever wanted to start your own

side hustle or your own business and

had a job for years that you go to day in and day out or maybe you've stayed home and taken care of kids and you just kind of want your own thing.

l, this is what I did back in:

that everybody would send the special occasion hairstyles to because nobody else wanted to do them and I was just always in the mood to do a bridal style or...

some sort of like special occasion hairstyle. I just absolutely loved it. I loved it since the time I was a kid. But you don't get a chance to do that a lot in the salon. And so I found myself going out and doing on location work for photo shoots or film, TV. I would do red carpet. I would do weddings, of course, because I loved weddings. And I did a lot of work like that.

And I thought to myself, I could just start my own company.

it sounds exciting at first you know and and when you launch into entrepreneurship sometimes it's sometimes ignorance is bliss because I think if I would have known then what I know now

Well, I would have done things differently for sure, but it was...

really a monumental amount of work and not to discourage because we're going to talk about today the steps that I took to start my own hair and makeup company which is called Black Tie and Blush but I do want to just preface it and say that it is an enormous amount of work and I really don't think that it's for the week. I

I think I had any clue what it was that I was going to be learning, how much I was going to be growing, and all of the different skill sets that I would develop over the years once I started my hair and makeup business. It seemed like it was going to be very simple. And I think a lot of times these ideas start out where they're very simple and at least in theory. you think to yourself, here's the product I want to produce.

here is, what I would have to do in order to produce this and, you know, like we're off to the races kind of thing. But there are so many things that go into running even a small business, even something that you would call a side hustle, which that's almost kind of like a diminishing term, I think for those of us that actually have a business that

it's actually turning a profit, making some money, and it's gotten some legs. It's got some steam behind it, it's doing well. But something like that could seem like a side hustle, but it's no joke. It's actually a job, it's actually work. So I just wanna go into sharing a little bit about...

how I started my hair and makeup company from really the ground up when I didn't know what I was doing. So if you're somebody who is listening and you've thought about that idea that's been rolling around in the back of your head for so long and you thought, yeah, there's something that I want to do with this particular thing that I'm so good at and ⁓ I want to see it through. I'm going to start something. I encourage you to listen to this episode

because

gonna dive into all of the steps that happened for me and my business would be different than what your business would be but just to give you a little bit of insight and some things to think about if you are deciding that you want to venture into the waters of entrepreneurship. So I'm gonna dive in I'm gonna tell you the

about how it all started and where we are now and a lot of the stuff that went in between the things that we learned the things that and I say we because I'm a I'm a team now with two virtual assistants so virtual assistant is somebody who works remotely who helps to run your business so I have two of those ladies that that contract out with me and then I have

a whole network of hair and makeup artists that we work with regularly. So there's a lot of different moving parts in a business like this may not be that way for you where you would be contracting out. But eventually if your business grew, you would have to bring on maybe an employee. At first it might be somebody who's contracted, but eventually it may even be that you have to have actual employees and then that's just a whole other ball of wax. So how it started for me,

was

I would teach hair styling classes at our local supply store classroom. And I would go around also to schools and I would teach workshops.

I was doing a lot of teaching. In one class that I had in particular, I was teaching a braiding class. And I had put the class out there online on social media.

offering at the local supply store classroom. And I had a way for people to go to a link and then they could pay for the class and then they could come to the class and I had a pretty good turnout And one of the students that

had in particular was a makeup artist and she had come to the class because she was trying to hone her skills on hair. She didn't love to do hair. She didn't want to do hair really, but here in Nashville at the time we really a lot of people tried to do both hair and makeup because it just made you more bookable, more marketable. So I was also, I was doing makeup even though I didn't really want to be doing makeup. I was

doing makeup. So it was so funny to have somebody in the classroom who was on the opposite end of that where she was a makeup artist and she was feeling like she needed to get her skills more in line with doing hair as well so that she could feel like she could go out and do more jobs. So this is why she took the class. So she took the class to learn more about like how to braid and how to do these different

types of wedding styles and special occasion styles. So she was in my class. And so at the end of the class we were talking and she said, my husband is never gonna believe that I did this particular braid. And she said, I've never been able to braid, I've never been a hair person, I'm a makeup person, I don't like doing hair, but I feel like, you I took this class because yada yada, right? She felt like she needed to do it. And I was like, that is so funny because I actually did the same thing.

I was doing makeup and I was doing makeup at the time that I was telling her this I said, you know, I do makeup and I don't really love it But I kind of feel like I have to be able to offer it and she was like, my gosh That's so funny. And we were like, you know, it's funny. We should really tag team

and then that way we could do the thing that we wanted to do when we wouldn't have to do the thing we didn't want to do. So, her name was Mandy Davis. She's an amazing makeup artist here in the Nashville area. She's got an incredible YouTube channel.

She's such a talented artist and a really great teacher on her YouTube channel. She has so much valuable information on her YouTube channel, so you'll want to check that out. I'll put the link to her YouTube in the show notes. She's actually been on the podcast here before where I interviewed her and we were talking about different bridal looks and just about makeup in general, the do's, the don'ts, all of that. If you have not listened to that episode, go back and listen to

Mandy Davis. So Mandy, I met her when I was doing this class. So we actually did start working together. Mandy and I started taking jobs together and where she would get a referral, she would bring me on to work with her and where I would get a job, I would bring her on to work with me and she would do makeup and I would do hair.

So we did that for a while, but it got to where we were getting larger and larger groups and she and I together just couldn't really handle such large groups, just the two of us. So we started to bring other people on to assist with us and it was very informal. We didn't have any sort of a structure or a system in place at all, but we were just bringing people on to work with us and we were paying them out, that kind of thing. And I thought to myself,

I see other actual hair and makeup teams around Nashville that I feel like I could do that. You know, I thought I feel like I could have a hair and makeup team because I didn't necessarily want to have like a physical location, but I thought to have like an agency type of a structure.

Kind of would be a great thing. It could be a good source of income. I could hire artists to do certain jobs on a case by case basis and then, you know, pay them out and then I would take a commission. So this could be, you know, this could be a good revenue source. And so what I did was I just started looking on Instagram for other makeup artists and people who did hair and I would look at their work and ⁓

I reached out to one girl and her name was Katherine and she's also a part of our team as well now but she was one of the first people and I saw her work and I saw what she was doing and I saw the way that she posted and I loved how she was presenting online and I loved her messaging and she was all about like health and wellness and just mental health and wellness as well and she was about

Just being beautiful from the inside out and that was also like her Instagram name. It was something like I think like Beauty inside out or something like that. I don't remember. It's not the same now, but I loved her I just loved what I was seeing from her. So I reached out to her she and I had coffee and She started with me on the team. She was like one of the first team members and

And so, now it was like, there was Mandy, there was also Catherine, and it just went on from there. I started seeking out other artists, connecting with them, working with them, and again, it was very informal. But it started to get busy, and it started to overtake the time that I had to be able to keep up with the different accounts that I had, and the different clients, and their different profiles, and all of the details that go

along with each one for their wedding and it became very overwhelming very quickly because the more artists I brought on the more that I posted on Instagram the more I was putting the word out there the more SEO was building the more that people were finding me and it was just it was me by myself running the whole show and I had come up with somewhat of a crude system but I really couldn't run it from just Google anymore it was gonna be like I needed

some software. needed to upgrade. I needed an email list. I needed all these different things. And so, that's what I did. I started just little by little learning about how to keep all of these details straight. How to keep all of these different accounts in order. How to have a complete system and a framework so that things would roll smoothly for each one of our clients.

ld say probably I guess since:

And there has been a lot of headache in the whole thing. It has not been easy. And I used to spend my days just building and building and building this system and this framework. Because I knew it was very important. I'm very disorganized in my brain. don't...people...everyone claims they have ADHD. I don't know if I have ADHD, but I know that my brain is a disorganized place many times.

And so I could just have things all over the place and then I wouldn't be able to find things and I wouldn't have the same protocol for everything I was doing and nothing was consistent and I really did not want to end up Messing up somebody's wedding. That was my worst nightmare So I had all these clients had all of these dates that were on the books and I'm just over here behind a computer screen trying to run it all it became very very very

overwhelming and so I as I said I just little by little

learned from online. I took classes. I found articles. I taught myself. It was through just relentless trial and error for every little part of my system that I have. It was really grueling in a lot of ways. It was fun because I was seeing that I was making progress and I was growing, but it was tough. And even though there are other hair and makeup companies here

Nashville, no one's really giving you all the information on how to run your business. It's almost like you kind of have to figure it out for yourself. I will say one of the big hair and makeup companies here in Nashville

The lady who runs that is someone that I know through other circles and I saw her at a training for a salon training once and we were chatting and she said I know you're starting your business and I just want you to know that if I can help you in any way I would love to take you to lunch and sit you down and show you my

process. Like just open up my books and just show you what it's all about. Show you our protocol from beginning to end. When I tell you that was one of the kindest things that anybody has ever, ever done for me in business or maybe in life in general. You take somebody who is running a business and they help someone who is starting a business that could compete with them and you sit them down and you

commit to help them succeed asking nothing from them. And it's just, it was something that really I have never forgotten. And it was very helpful to me. She showed me how they did things. She showed me how they kept things organized. She showed me how the clients booked and how they kept everything straight. she showed me about...

policies that they have in place about things that they have in their contract about Ways that they work that I could not have

conceptualized of those things all on my own. So when I tell you that in the course of starting a side hustle or your small business, having mentors and people who are willing to help you is everything. That is so huge. So if you can find somebody that will take the time to take you under their wing,

there's no better gift in life. I never forgot it, and I never will forget it. It was one of the kindest things anyone has ever done for me. And sometimes it chokes me up a little bit because she took me to lunch, she spent two hours, she opened her computer, and she just showed me the entire thing, knowing I was gonna turn around.

And emulate that. It's exactly what she wanted me to do. She didn't want me to struggle. And I just thought... ⁓

That takes a certain kind of person to me, I think. That's just beyond kind. So, that's a real gem if you can find somebody to take you under their wing like that. Somebody to help you, somebody to advise you. Because you need people in a business like entrepreneurship. Like I said, it's not for the faint.

But through the trial and error and through what it was that she had gifted me with the knowledge of how to go about actually running the back end of this, I was feeling very overwhelmed. I never went to business school. I didn't know anything about finance. I have always been a hairstylist and they don't teach you about those things in beauty school. So everything that I have learned, whether it's anything about marketing,

about business, anything having to do with accounting or bookkeeping or anything like that. All of that stuff has been just me teaching myself.

or having someone to help me, to advise me. And I've worn every hat in this business up until the last couple of years. Now, of course, I have people in place who do things much better than I do. So, and thank goodness for that because now I think where we are now, I can definitely ruin the whole, I can take the whole thing down. I can just take it whole, I can just take it down by myself. I try not to get in middle of it because that's

where we are now. like, I've got amazing team members who know exactly what to do and I know if I start getting in the middle of it, like things are, the wheels are gonna come off the bus. So I try not to do that too much and I have been able to pull back and not be the person that's doing all the work in my business. Even this podcast, my...

Virtual assistants they are responsible for most of the work that goes into just getting this out every week I'm doing the recording and I might do a first-round edit but everything else from getting it up onto YouTube to posting it on Apple and on Spotify and you know getting show notes and and the the web pages and all that I mean Somebody does that for me and it's I could not do it without them

so the time came where I was before the podcast, but the time did come where I Could not do it. It was beyond me. It was beyond me. It was a full-time job I was working at it all day and into the night half the time so I Realized it is time to bring someone on now at that time. I had never

brought someone on into an actual position. I don't have employees, they are contracted, but it is a consistent position. This isn't like I'm just calling on them every so often to do some work. They're working every week as as an employee would. I have...

My first contracted virtual assistant, Allie, lives in the Philippines. And she was actually not the first virtual assistant that I brought on. I had actually brought someone else on when I was first looking for help. I was looking for somebody to help me in

But who I had brought on originally to help me with those things was someone who was more of a systems builder. And at that time, I didn't really realize that...

what she was going to do was not exactly what I needed. This is where you're very green when you're starting out and you're making all kinds of mistakes. And I'm not saying that my first virtual assistant was a mistake. I wanted someone who lived in the United States so that they could...

have the access to texting our clients, not just emailing them. I wanted them to be able to have phone calls and text with the clients. And so that was important to me. And I also thought that someone in the US, they would be more familiar with culture and the language

But I did interview some people that were not in the United States when I was first looking for a virtual assistant. Now, just to go back for a second, how do you find a virtual assistant?

There are many different ways that you can seek one out what I did was I used a Facebook group where virtual assistants are on that group and So people go and join the group that are looking for virtual assistants But virtual assistants are on there as well and they're connecting with each other. They're supporting each other. They're sharing information and

They're sharing their areas of expertise. There are a million different types of virtual assistants everybody has a different skill set and there are a million different programs out there to run a business and so virtual assistants tend to have their Specialties that they work with them so you could get a podcasting virtual assistant you could get like an administrative virtual assistant

you could do like a copywriting virtual assistant. So somebody who writes sales copy, somebody who writes copy that will draw someone in, Someone who is good with getting messaging across through Somebody who ⁓ has a background and an expertise in sales.

That's a whole different type of thing. So you have so many different types of virtual assistants and you have a lot of people on something like say this Facebook group

and you would post your job posting and what pay you would be able to offer and you would see who would be interested in that and who might have availability. So people would email you, they would respond to your post, they would send over their resumes and then you could set up say like a Zoom interview with them. And so you would post on your posting what skills they would need to have, what exactly they would be doing.

what programs and software they would be working with and then those who work within those particular parameters would reach out to you and then set up an interview that type of thing.

So I got a lot of response when I first put the feelers out there for a virtual assistant on this Facebook group. And I didn't really know exactly what I needed. just knew that I could not do everything. And so I put that I needed someone to work with the clients and someone to help build the funnel. So the funnel is like the experience

the potential client goes through, starting at the inquiry when they find your information online, they're looking for hair and makeup, they send in an inquiry form, anywhere from the inquiry form to the first consultation call, to the booking, there's a whole workflow to that and it can be automated in a lot of ways, but you have to set it up. So I needed someone who had some expertise in

the client management system software that I was using to

Create some fairly complex workflows for all of the different steps that would need to be taken in order to get a client a potential client from point a which is the ⁓ Inquiry form all the way to the end of you know their booking which would be their wedding day and their hair and makeup so that was that is a complex sort of web that I really felt like even though I had

Created some workflows myself learned how to do it learned how to work with that software I couldn't be doing it anymore, and it wasn't my it wasn't my specialty And I needed someone to help, I also needed somebody to take the weight off my shoulders when it came to Booking and the administrative work, and I was really looking for her to be doing both of those things But that was not really what she

was all about. She was really more of the systems person. She was okay to build the workflows, but she was not gonna be able to be available to me and to clients just whenever they needed her. so that portion still was on my shoulders and I really knew that I was gonna need for somebody to take that part off of me as well.

And so I had her for a while and she did build several workflows for me. But what I realized as an entrepreneur and the person that was building my own individual business the way that I wanted it to be,

There are some things that you can't just hand off. There's some things that you do have to be able to do very well yourself first and then give specific instruction on what it is you need somebody else to be able to replicate so that you no longer have to do it anymore. But you've got to figure that out and there's a lot of trial and error. That workflow, I reworked that a million times. I spent just countless months and probably

a couple of years working and reworking the perfect workflow. And there are so many different parts to that puzzle that all have to work together and then go off without a hitch without the tech getting crazy and people getting emails they're not supposed to get, payments not going through or reminders getting sent out that don't need to get sent out. I mean there's a lot of things that can go wrong in a client management workflow.

So, even though she built a couple of those for me, they weren't exactly what needed to happen because I knew the experience that I wanted the client to go through and she did not have the background of

Knowing exactly what that journey needed to look like so in the end I wound up where I had to let her go and have someone who could truly help me with the client management portion of things the communication with the clients take the administration part off of my shoulders, but also work

with the framework and the system in this workflow. So while I had my first virtual assistant though,

I was realizing very quickly that she wasn't going to be able to do the administrative things that I needed her to do. And although I had been looking for a virtual assistant who was in the United States, I had still had applicants from countries all over the world, including the Philippines. And the Philippines is quite a hot country for a virtual assistant. There are a lot of people that do virtual assistants.

don't work there, they do it very, well. And I had a girl reach out to me about the position and she was in the Philippines and because of her resume and because her presence was so impressive, I was like, I'm gonna interview this girl and I did. I loved her. I had interviewed her at the time that I interviewed my first virtual assistant and I loved her so much.

And the only thing that held me back was that she wasn't in the US. So I went ahead and I went with my first virtual assistant first.

But once I realized I needed somebody else to actually take the administration off of my shoulders I couldn't stop thinking about my alley and alley is with me to this day. I I reached out to her again even after I had said the position is filled. Thank you very much I reached back out to her was probably two or three months later and I was like hey listen, would you consider maybe You know coming on even though I know I don't know what you're doing now, but even

I know I said that it was not open. I would like to look at maybe you coming on She was very gracious about it. She said yes, she would love to she was you know gonna be able to work within The budget that I had the hours that I could give her she was willing to start At a rate that was probably not what she would normally be getting and since then we have raised we have raised her pay several times, but At that time with her starting out. I was brand new didn't really know

I was doing she was working with someone who was brand new in this entrepreneur space She was extremely understanding very very patient and she caught on so quickly I didn't know how I was gonna teach somebody to do what I was doing like how do you teach somebody to? To be you I guess in in a way I thought

have to do it if I'm ever gonna survive this because there's no way I can do this myself. So I thought we have to figure it out. And so what I did at that time was I basically just screen recorded every single process I did. Every single thing that I did for the most part, I screen recorded it and I put it into a Google folder and it was so crude

Our training materials are probably still crude, well, maybe they're not because my amazing team members have been able to untangle the actual mess that I had to begin with but once she learned through all of my crude tutorials and my screen recordings and me explaining what I did and through just like back and forth communication on what

She was asking me questions every day. We were doing it together in essence until she was just rolling on her own and at that point she was doing everything so well. I was able to let the first virtual assistant go and just have her and she really became the backbone of the entire business. When I tell you is magical, that is such an understatement. She has

than an absolute godsend and we have actually, I feel like I've become close to her even though she lives across the world, she's in the Philippines, she's 13 hours ahead into the future and it's funny because to feel like you have a friend that you've actually never laid eyes on physically is such, it's such a strange feeling but it's so cool as well. So we grew,

I'm still working in the salon. you know this again kind of a side hustle But it started to it started to have legs, you know, I built the website I taught myself how to build the website I did that, I did every single thing from start to finish and Since Ali has been with me, of course those things are now maintained and have been improved upon and are Kept in a way that you know, I could not do it, but she knows

the business now backwards and forwards she runs it better than I do like I say I I don't even feel like

I could do half the job that she does doing this. I would, I don't know what I would do. I mean, well thankfully we have the training now. All of those training materials are in, you know, a Google Drive and so, I mean, you could train somebody which is great. I mean, having your system in place that somebody could learn without too much trouble should someone get sick or somebody leave.

You know we've established that there's kind of a training system a training manual I guess if you will within those folders But you know she was the one that created that organized it put it all together when I say it's crude it's because it's it's been my doing that she's had to untangle and You know polish up and put together so but we do have that and that's very very important

to the extent that as

Went along and I saw that you know, Ali can't work six days seven days a week I need someone to to be able to communicate with the clients and Do work actually on the weekend. So I went back to the Facebook group again, and I sought out someone else Who would be interested in just working weekend hours just the weekend hours. So now my ally she works Monday through Friday

and I needed somebody to work late Friday, Saturday, Sunday. So we would always have support for clients. So we would always have hands on someone to, you know, jump in there and do what needs to be done pretty much on any day of the week. And so I found, once again, they say that lightning doesn't strike twice, but I swear

I found my crystal on this Facebook group as well. ⁓

Could not have been a better fit the three of us together could not be a better team We absolutely love each other crystal as well has become a great friend crystal is in Illinois and So we all get together You know once a month or so and we catch up and we have you know our team meetings We do planning and things like that so we have an actual business that runs basically remote

No physical location. We have a great network of artists which has just grown and grown and as we've made more and more connections we have a bigger and bigger repertoire of incredible artists here in the Nashville area. All of them I consider friends and family as well. it's really just...

a great big feel good project basically. My hair and makeup company is just, that's what it is. feels, and even though I'm not working in it so much, and there's so much more that we could do. I mean, I could grow it bigger, you know. could spend tons of time and tons of money on marketing and growing it and getting a physical location and going into different cities and markets, which I thought about doing at one time.

You just have to ask yourself what are you willing to put into it? How much time are you willing to spend on your side hustle? Like how much sweat equity do you want to put into this thing and how big do you want to take it? I used to think that if I didn't blow this thing up and make it like a national brand that I wouldn't be a success, but I've learned now at 53 years old that having something

that at this point basically runs itself with very little to do from me. I have calls with clients sometimes, so maybe once a week I'll have a call with a client, a potential client, and I will be the person who is that first contact person of sitting down with them, going over the entire process, you know, what will it be like letting them ask me questions, and then I hand it over to Allie and Crystal and they've got it.

touch it again. And I couldn't, if I did not have them, it wouldn't happen. This couldn't happen anymore. There's no way I could do it. It has grown to be out of my hands and there's no way can do it. So for that I'm grateful and I think, you know, maybe if I was 20 years younger I would want to, you know, invest a ton of time and money into it and, you know, grow it into this, you know, this national thing and ...

every state across America, I don't know. But now I think I've decided that it's okay and it's still a success to have it be local and have it just run and enjoy the fruits of the labor. know, it's like sometimes I think we forget to stop striving or to at least take a beat and celebrate what it is that we've created. And I do finally kind of think that I'm

in that season now. I started a podcast because it's sort of a passion project as well.

not great with marketing it or posting about it or anything like that because it's kind of a trial and error thing for me right now just to be honest with you I mean I love the connection I love coming on and talking to you and being here with you each week but there's kind of not a rhyme or reason it's like I'm trying some different things out I've done this is my second solo episode in two weeks which normally I have guests on but I'm just playing with some

Different approaches and so that's kind of what this episode has been about today, too Not sure if it's anything that is gonna be interesting to a listener I don't know if it's something that you know anybody will want to hear about but you know Hopefully it resonates and it helps someone and there is some value that's been taken away I don't know if this podcast is Lessons or if it's more like a personal blog or if it's just interviews. I don't know I

I know, it's just something that I've always wanted to do and I love being here with you and hopefully I will be able to do more with promoting it and getting more of the guests' faces out there onto the different platforms so people can see the clips and then they can go back and listen to a lot of these episodes because

been some fascinating people on the podcast really and I'm very proud of the body of work up into this point. So I do want to say that and if you are someone who has been following along and listening each week, I can't tell you how much that really means to me because I know it's kind of been haphazard and a little bit all over the place in a lot of ways but you know it's mine, it's my creative project and that's where we are with it right now.

And you know for that I would encourage you Just because something may not be perfectly polished Maybe it's not completely put together in the way that you foresee that it should be don't let that hold you back from just doing it because I I think that the growth comes in the actual doing you getting good at something comes with you actually just Doing it while you're not good at it my first episodes of this podcast

are painful for me to listen to. But...

you know they had to happen and where I am right now you know I'll look back one of these days and be thinking the same thing about today's podcast like wow there was no rhyme or reason to that I was just like going off the cuff maybe I'll just cringe I don't know or who knows if we'll have a podcast in a year I have no idea I have no idea I'm just this is one thing that I'm allowing to just play out and be what it is and not have the experience

Expectations of it. I'm enjoying it. I love being here with you each week and for that I just I want to thank you for listening and ⁓ You know if you have any questions about starting up your own business or you're thinking about Launching into a new creative project or something like that, and you're not sure I would encourage you to reach out to me you can get me on Instagram Facebook tick tock or

send an email through the website as well. I can be reached there, but I would love to hear from you. And the other thing I'd like to say is if you haven't done so already and you've been listening along, I'd appreciate it if you could just take a moment to share this episode and leave me a rating or review. It helps me tremendously with getting the podcast out there for other people to be able to listen to it. So the more reviews I have, the more positive reviews

views that that's gonna that's gonna help me a lot I really appreciate if you just take the time to do that that would mean so much to me for now I'm gonna say thank you again for being here and I will see you on the next one

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