Shownotes
We dive into what separates great customer service from terrible experiences using Steve's recent dealership visits as an example.
On this episode we discuss how behavioral styles impact sales performance, why most customer service failures are actually leadership problems, and the critical difference between selling to someone versus letting them buy from you.
We explore how sales managers can better support different personality types on their teams and why rigid scripts often create more problems than they solve.
If you've ever wondered why your sales team isn't converting or why customers walk away frustrated, this conversation will give you the answers you need.
Highlights:
- Understanding behavioral styles in sales roles and why putting the wrong personality type under pressure with rigid processes sets everyone up for failure.
- The sales manager mirror test because when your team isn't performing, look at how you're leading them before blaming the individual.
- Serving versus selling and why giving value through meaningful connections beats aggressive sales tactics every time.
- When scripts work and when they don't, plus how to balance process with empathy in customer facing roles.
- Why letting people buy from you creates better relationships and more sustainable business than always be closing ever will.
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Transcripts
Hey everyone. Welcome back to this episode of the blue collar BS. am the B Brad and
Steve Doyle (:I'm the S Steve.
Brad Herda (:Perfect. Good to see you again, Mr. Doyle. How is life in the great Motor City of Detroit?
Steve Doyle (:Yeah.
Steve Doyle (:You know, it's great times here. It's fall. It's, you know, can't ask for any better weather. It's barely sunny, nice and cool. Perfect.
Brad Herda (:So this episode is actually recording on Halloween, October 31st, probably airing here, I would assume sometime in early to mid December. So it is fall, things are good. Detroit Lions are looking good. Unfortunately, the fucking Packers can't lose a game. So that's really pissing me off. But that's okay.
Steve Doyle (:Yep.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:You
It's all right.
Brad Herda (:And I had a conversation with a young lady that's in Toronto. So I'm hoping the Blue Jays can win the World Series tonight in game six and put that to bed. And she's a soon to be guest here. Another, she's a steam fitter, young lady steam fitter in the union up in Ontario. Darryl Granick's would probably like her a lot. He's in that up in Canada as well. So.
Steve Doyle (:Ooh, all right.
Steve Doyle (:No?
Steve Doyle (:Yep.
Brad Herda (:So pre show we were talking either old white guy rant at Costco, which we opted not to go with or customer service in the automotive industry. Let's go with option B.
Steve Doyle (:Yeah.
Steve Doyle (:Yeah. All right. Let's go down that route. So, so yeah, my, my daughter, we just upgraded some vehicles. Said goodbye to Clifford, my big red truck after, what almost 13 years, 12, 13 years. It's time to put Clifford off to have somebody else deal with them. Clifford did go to the farm.
Brad Herda (:Clifford went to the farm. What happened to the dog? we took him to the farm.
Steve Doyle (:Yep. Yep. And which was good. But what came out of it was very interesting. my wife was kind of leading the charge. She's like, no, it's time. No, she don't. No, she don't. No, she don't. It doesn't matter if she's listening or not. Doesn't matter. Facts are facts. Right. And so she was taking it. She was leading the charge with the whole car thing. I was traveling.
Brad Herda (:She hasn't listened to the show, does she? Okay, good, just checking. Before we go down this path.
Facts are facts, right?
Steve Doyle (:for work so she was contacting dealerships for work air quotes for work. Not air quotes, real. anyways, she was leading the charge. So she's typically doing everything on her phone. So everything is going to be internet searches. Hey, who's you know, and contacting dealerships. This is the type of vehicle I'm looking for blah blah blah. She's 47.
Brad Herda (:work.
Brad Herda (:How old's your wife?
Brad Herda (:So she's adapting to technology as a Gen X.
Steve Doyle (:Correct. Yep, correct. So wait, you just identified her as Gen X. I am older than she is. So perfect. Got it cleared. it cleared. Got it cleared. Got it cleared. Got it cleared. All right, anyways. Anyways, so she's reaching out online. Had a dealership contact her. She's like, okay, they're like, come in. And.
Brad Herda (:You're a millennial. It's OK. You're a millennial, Steve. Don't worry about it. She behaves.
Steve Doyle (:So I got, when I got back on the weekend, we go into the dealership. She's like, it's with the sales rep. Everything's fine. Person starts asking some certain questions says, I'm to get back with you. I'll get back with you, you know, in a couple, you know, within, within the day, I'll get back with you with, know, what the deliverables that he said he was going to get back with. Okay, fine. Day goes by nothing. Sunday come, you know, Sunday is coming on nothing. I leave again, travel.
Brad Herda (:Are you guys open on Sundays? Are your dealers open Sundays in Michigan?
Steve Doyle (:I don't know if they are or not. I don't pay attention, honestly. They could be.
Brad Herda (:they know in Wisconsin, we're not by law that our dealerships aren't open on Sundays.
Steve Doyle (:Yeah, I don't I don't know. I don't pay attention to that. I did well, I mean if it was me and I said I was by a deliverable, I would deliver on it. On that yeah, there's other like if I had made that type of commitment. Yeah, I mean like there's. Yeah, well that's different. Anyways, you get you get the point. So.
Brad Herda (:I was just curious, you threw Sunday out there, but if they're closed then they're
Brad Herda (:You've made some commitments on this show on the pet for this show on the path that's all a little short
Brad Herda (:I get your point.
Steve Doyle (:I go, I fly out the next week, heard nothing. Wednesday comes around, so midweek, Wednesday comes around, salesperson comes back and says, hey, can you send me, and it was all the stuff that we had talked about on Saturday. And that starts throwing up flags for anyone. So, you know, my wife, she's like, okay, I'll send all this stuff. And she's like, are you going to send me?
What you said you were going to send me. Didn't send nothing that day. The next day came back and said, you're going to need to come back in. I can't. I'm not going to send it over to you. You need to come in and meet with me. And she immediately sends me a text while I'm gone. She's like, we're not dealing with this at all. I don't need to go in to have a conversation. This is what I want. And I said, okay.
Well, do you want to have a different sales experience? Because when I bought my truck a year ago, we'll see if the sales rep is still there, but it was all done via email. And I some phone calls. And she's like, yeah. So Shannon just told the person, look, thanks for your like thanks, but no, we're not doing this.
Brad Herda (:Thanks, but you suck. I'm going to move on to the next person to help me out.
Steve Doyle (:Yeah, and it's just like we don't need to go in and all it was why they want you to go in is to make a hard sales pitch to you. It's like you haven't even sent me the number like I want to know is this in the ballpark or not. That's it. And if you can't do those simple things, then why should I even consider following up with you? I don't have time to waste. I don't have 30 minutes to drive there. I don't have. Good up, but.
Brad Herda (:Should have gone to Carvana. Get it out of the car vending machine.
Steve Doyle (:Could have, that's a little too, that's definitely not Gen X. Definitely not. Definitely not. So go to this other dealership and completely opposite experience. Person is extremely responsive.
Brad Herda (:No, definitely not. Definitely not.
Brad Herda (:What was the generation of the service person upon which that was not committing to the expectations that were set?
Steve Doyle (:I'm going to assume Gen X.
Brad Herda (:You didn't go in to see them on Saturday or no? I thought you said you.
Steve Doyle (:Yeah, yeah, but I didn't ask that. Yes, I was there, but I'm going to assume they're our age. The person was our age. Could it have been a millennial? Could have. Right? You're in that, like, yeah, it could be in that tweener spot, right? But I mean, I'm just gonna put it out there. Based on how the person shook my hand, I already knew this person was not going to move and make things happen.
Brad Herda (:tweener spot.
Okay. Mid to late, mid to late forties is what you're saying.
Steve Doyle (:just in how the person walked up, presented themselves, shook my hand. Now, person head on the regular polo, know, head on all the stuff, but did not talk confidently to me or my wife.
Brad Herda (:So a lot of negative, not I shouldn't say negative, but a of, a lot of passive verbiage.
Steve Doyle (:There's no, what?
Steve Doyle (:Very passive, very passive vibes and behaviors coming off the salesperson. 100%. All right.
Brad Herda (:So when you walk past the sales manager's office or the counter of things, did you happen to go and find out how many X's this person had on his book in the month? Because usually the sales tally is very out open in the present.
Steve Doyle (:To be honest, I was more watching how all the sales reps did not interact with anybody but themselves. So people outside, there's people outside looking at vehicles. All the sales rep are inside talking to themselves.
Brad Herda (:It have been interesting to see where your person was on the the hierarchy of X's.
Steve Doyle (:I, my gut tells me they were not very high on that list.
just all based on how they presented themselves.
Right? nothing, I mean, that's just the way certain things are. But I will tell you the other dealership. So so and we're going to put in gender into this. So I'm going to put this out there. That at that dealership, I if there was a woman on the floor, I have no idea. It was very much male dominated.
on the sales floor. Other dealership opposite. Mostly female. There are there were male sales reps, but mostly female.
Brad Herda (:Okay.
Brad Herda (:What age bracket?
Steve Doyle (:All age brackets, but the one that helped us. I am going to venture to say young millennial, older Gen Z.
Brad Herda (:Get around the show.
Steve Doyle (:We'll see. Could be a guest, potentially.
Absolutely. So let's talk about how different they were. Because this person was extremely responsive via email. could call you when you call this person up. Absolutely answer. Yep, I'll have that to you in 30 minutes. You'd have it in 16 minutes.
when you.
Brad Herda (:So a poor expectation setting.
Overdeliver.
Steve Doyle (:no.
I would say, yeah, you could say knowing how long things actually take to actually generate work. mean, yeah, 30 minutes because if you got a phone call and things like normal, right? But when you come back and you're like, boom, nope, here it is. Because the person wanted to move on to get other things done. This person, like, she would actually make things happen. If things weren't moving fast enough, she's going to make things happen.
Brad Herda (:So as the behavioral therapist that you are, undocumented behavioral therapist.
Steve Doyle (:I do have letters I can put after my name.
Brad Herda (:Where are, where was, where was Mr. Soft Hands on the, on the, on the disc profile?
Steve Doyle (:you
Definitely going on the s with some
Brad Herda (:S with a little I, and then where is, we're not going to talk about his little eye. We don't want slander here. Um, and then where is, uh, where is miss miss? I'm going to go get it done.
Steve Doyle (:a little light, but not much.
Steve Doyle (:Yeah anyways,
Steve Doyle (:Definitely mostly I with some D.
Brad Herda (:and natural or adaptive behaviors.
Steve Doyle (:both natural.
Adaptive, would say the
The first, the male sales rep, when adapting, way more scared. So operating under stress and scared definitely pulls back into S, 100%. Definitely pulls back like, okay. And the other sales rep, she is definitely, when adapting, 100%, pulls out the big D. Let's go.
Let's go. Yep, Wow, OK. Not going there. So but yeah, I was just just a complete 180, but even just how responsive she was. You. I find it more amazing about how many people are not responsive.
Brad Herda (:Little I and a big D. Welcome to 2025,
Brad Herda (:Nope.
Steve Doyle (:people and they just just ask a simple question. That's all I want to know. I'm not here to shop and price against anybody else. I just want to know what are my what are the expectations and if you can't deliver them clearly and quickly why should I do business with you?
Why? I don't have time to go through your quote unquote sales training that tells me that, you have to be, you have to come in here so I can do a hard pitch to you. Piss off.
Right? I'm not. I was.
Brad Herda (:You were in UK recently, weren't you? That's where the piss off came from.
Steve Doyle (:I was, was. But yeah, it just shocks me when you sit back and yeah, we deliver sales training and stuff and. It's so surprising of how. I would say more traditional things. Don't factor in the human aspect of hate. People don't have time to waste to sit there and drive from point A to point B.
sit and listen to you try to sell them for two hours when all they wanted to know is what are my expect like what are the what are the numbers and what are my payment expectations how hard is that
Brad Herda (:So when my wife decided to buy her cute little car, her cute little CHR, which was a horrible purchase, terrible, terrible, but it was cute and I gotta have it. It looked so cute, but it was just too fucking small for anything.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:We're there December 31st, 2019. So we're end of month, end of year, right? We're there. We get this awesome young sales guy. He's 18 years old. He's graduated already. He started out in the dealership, working, working the lots, doing the things, blah, blah. And they gave him the shot to, to go sell.
Steve Doyle (:Hmm. yeah. Yeah.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:Now that particular dealership this was car number seven I was buying from this dealership. So I know the routine pretty well of what they're trying to do. And I don't want to go through the entire routine. I just want to get to the end. So I don't have to spend the four hours of all the other things and this isn't that's so like, okay, dude, here's what I got. I got I want this car. I want
Steve Doyle (:Okay.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:to trade in this car with the new vehicle, I want the, this extended warranty, this, that, the other thing that happens at the finance guy, not the right. like, and this is what I like the end number to be in this range. Can you do that?
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:He goes back to the sales manager and does the thing. I'm like, no, no, no, you're not paying. You're not listening to me. I know you're I know you're new here. I got it. But this is what I'm working to do. Then one of the not the actual sales manager, but like the assistant sales manager, she comes over to help much. Sir, is there a problem here? Like, no, there is no problem. This is what I'm trying to accomplish.
Steve Doyle (:Yep.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:Why are we making this more difficult than it's been if you look up my records you look up all the things this is like number seven like I write this isn't I'm not really trying to do anything. I just trying to get through the process here. I know it's busy I know it's all these other things but the guy in the finance department that has a little sheet he should be able to tell you what those things can go for and put the numbers in there and That's all but we don't do that here in the sales in the sales department. I'm like, I don't give a fuck
Steve Doyle (:That's not, that's not our process. Right.
Brad Herda (:I, I, I don't care. Then get me in. Right. And so they gave me another guy that's been there forever in a day. And I'm dude, you cannot punish this kid for this. You need to give him the commission on this. Cause I'm not doing the deal with you if, because he did his job. He was trying to do his job and learn. And he was polite and he was awesome. And he was a great kid. And like, I'm not taking his commission out of his pocket because I'm over here with you.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Yep. You guys can't get out of your own way. Yeah.
Brad Herda (:can you agree with that? he's like, yes, I can agree with that. And he's like, OK, cool. And let's continue this and let's get the fuck out of here.
Steve Doyle (:Right. Yeah. It's like we shouldn't have to be there for hours. For something simple like it's not that hard. It's just I want to give you money to take this vehicle from you that you're paying interest on. how can we make this how you know I think dealerships actually think of how can we make this way more painful for everyone involved? Like it doesn't have to be that way.
Brad Herda (:No, it doesn't. And when I got my when I got my rack with the RAV4 and went and bought my my impulsive vehicle that I have slight remorse for. But it's like, you know, Bob,
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Brad Herda (18:17.34)
Bob Hill, who is my sales guy. I'm like, Bob, this is what we need to do. Here's what it is. And he would go, he went and walked out of the finance department. He knew the deal. He knew what I was looking forward to. This what we can do. This is that here's the trading. Can we make this work? Is this a number that's going to work for you? Here's the things. Great. Let's go. Still took some time, but the amount of paperwork that's required for a new vehicle is just insane. It's worse than buying a house.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Correct. It's pretty close. It's pretty close to the signing day that you do for a mortgage.
Brad Herda (:It's like, it's like sign this sign. I'm like, this shouldn't be that hard.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm. But we make it hard, for sure.
Brad Herda (:So what could the SI individual have done or adapted to, or what advice would you give somebody that's of that more?
passive behavioral styles.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:to potentially be more successful in a customer service sales role.
Steve Doyle (:That's a great question, Brad. For me personally, that's what I do know. For me personally, just breaking it down, it's the relationship that matters. You don't have to have like, hey, we got to become best buddies. But people are going to buy from somebody they know, like, trust. And if you haven't earned the respect to get to know somebody,
Brad Herda (:That's what I do. You know this already. That's what I do.
Brad Herda (:Okay, but that SI behavioral style is so, let's just stay on the disc for a little bit and we're going to lose some, we're going to probably lose some members here, but let's just stay there for a second. Cause I think we can get, we're going to probably get into a little bit of argument, but that's okay. It could be our first fight. Um, so I got an S I got an SI that's in a sales role, right?
Steve Doyle (:You know, through what you've Correct. Correct.
Steve Doyle (:Okay.
We're not going to get into it anymore, even. this is... Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:Historically, it's a bad match for a sales role because no is not a typical opportunity an S likes to hear or an I.
Steve Doyle (:Mmm.
Steve Doyle (:Correct. Sure, we can go down that route.
Brad Herda (:So being told no is not one of the things that gets them really excited because they want to make...
Steve Doyle (:Yeah, rejection, rejections runs, know, rejection rates are high. Yep. Yep.
Brad Herda (:correct. And that's not something that typically makes those two behavioral styles excited. So, so how so how would you have so primary S secondary I
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm. Okay. I agree.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:What would you ask them to do differently in his his transaction with you?
Steve Doyle (:in
Brad Herda (:to make it more to to get over the the inhibitions to get into the we're going to make this right to to remove the steadiness portion of his behavioral style or fear maybe what given that it appears your bride was probably more on a D side of things you're definitely going to be on the D side of things going through that
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:presenting that way to them because you're coming to him with wants. Right? So you're already on a very... You're coming in from his perspective aggressive, your perspective not. Just facts.
Steve Doyle (:Thank
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Okay, yeah, it's facts. Okay, I agree with those.
Brad Herda (:how would you suggest that that S behavior change or adapt or get out of the way in order to convert the sale?
Steve Doyle (:Easy enough. Just be a servant. You know, one of the traits for an ad is how can I be the best at serving you right then and there? Right? How can I do that? And if I do, if I'm serving, I'm not getting told yes or I'm not getting told no.
But in this case, I would say there was almost a lack of service. Because you're not, somebody asks for something and you don't deliver it. You're like, okay, and you walk away and then you come back. So what was it that you wanted again? So number one, we didn't listen.
to be able to serve. All we knew is we were so caught up in the, I've got to perform, I've got to do this, I've got to check the box, I've got to do this. We couldn't be present in the moment to actually just be there.
Brad Herda (:So, so let's I'm going to dial this back another layer of this onion here. Okay, so so that is your that that's your interaction there. So now we kind of we kind of joked around where his exes were on the board for the month and where his job performance pressure might be and
Steve Doyle (:Yeah, okay.
Steve Doyle (:Yep.
Steve Doyle (:Correct.
Steve Doyle (:Correct.
Brad Herda (:high turnover rates in an automotive industry from a sales perspective. And if you don't, right, I'm not, I'm not going to spend the time if I can't make any change on it. And so if he's, if, that individual, let's assume that individuals in that lower third of performers at this point, and now it's mid month, you're there and what
Steve Doyle (:Correct.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:What suggestions or opportunities would you give the sales manager to support that type of behavior to be successful? Because to me, this is a sales manager problem, not that employees problem. That's how I'm looking at this.
Steve Doyle (:I think it's two way street. Two way street, but from a salesman, you're not disagreeing.
Brad Herda (:I'm not, it is a two way street, but I'm going to say that my assumption, I'm going to, it's a bold assumption. You were there. I was not. My assumption though, is that the pressure of the entity and the performance of the individual contributor to satisfy the sir, to be the servant to the sales manager outweighed his potential mindset of serving, observing you. And that to me is a sales manager issue, not the sales persons issue.
Steve Doyle (:Yep.
Steve Doyle (:Oh, 100%. Correct, 100%. Correct.
Correct. I would assume, so let's talk sales manager perspective first before, well, I'm going to lose the thought anyways. from a, just facts, facts. Okay. So, but from a sales manager perspective, obviously they're not catering to what the person's strengths are. They're catered, they're looking at it going, hey, I need to watch this person because clearly
they're not doing what they need to be. They're not following the book of what we tell them they need to do. So I need to understand what it is they're doing. So I need to be here to witness 100 % of what they're doing.
which when you're doing that from that perspective for that type of person, all you're doing is sucking all their confidence away from them, clearly telling them, you have no clue of what you're doing, you're in the bottom, you're gonna be on your way out. Part of me just wants to confirm in our meetings that yeah, you're clearly just not cut out for what this job needs. And so I'm just, now you're at a measuring stick to go, yep, you're out.
Or you can use it as a training perspective to say, this person, this S, what is it that you really need and would like? Yeah, you'd like to have everybody teed up on a silver spoon, and they come in and they're willing to throw money at you just to, and all you gotta do is process paperwork. We can't even get that person to do that.
Brad Herda (:They got paperwork at those types of shows at those times. Oh, nevermind. You were a dealership. People throw it. You got you had me lost at people throwing money at you. So I was confused from that. I thought you were at a different thought you were at a different establishment.
Steve Doyle (:Yeah.
Yeah, well, mean, but they. Yeah. Not that one. Not that type. But really start to think about that from how they're being trained. Like, what does this person really need? They need that support system to give them the confidence. That they can go serve the customer.
Right? And that's not what they're getting. They're getting you need to follow X, Y, and Z step by step by step. And if you don't do that, you're not going to get a sale. So now this person in their mind is going, OK, I got to do this. I have to do this. I'm going to pause because if I don't do it right, then I'm going to piss off my boss. I got to make sure I'm doing this. And now. There's that lack of confidence that's coming through. And that lack of confidence gets passed on to the to the client and the clients walking away.
And what's the salesperson like? I don't know what I didn't do. They didn't come in. couldn't. I couldn't sell him. No, it started because you couldn't deliver on basic function on the basic stuff. When you said you're going to go do it and you didn't do it.
Brad Herda (:That's why I wanted to take it back to the sales manager. Cause I, I, I truly believe that as a training and a sale, a leadership problem, not the now, now it might be that he is truly not cut out for the role and for the volume and for the pace and for the pressure. he might do really well on a HVAC organization taking service calls and, or supporting people on the phone.
Steve Doyle (:Yes.
Steve Doyle (:Correct.
Yeah.
Steve Doyle (:or an inside sales role.
Brad Herda (:to do something along the way or an inside customer service or whatever, versus a direct sales type scenario. But I wanted to have that conversation just to help people understand that when you are talking to your sales team and you are trying to identify why the performance isn't there, you need to turn that mirror around and look at yourself as to how are you
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:How are you empowering your team to do the thing versus here's the stuff, right? And, and, and I, and I know some of our, our members of the organization upon which we belong to listen to some of these episodes here and there and are out there, but that is one of the fatal flaws of our organization is, well, it's a three step call. And this is what you do. And you do this and you go through the curious coat, you do the SBR and then you do this. And then you ask them for the business right away.
Steve Doyle (:Right. Absolutely.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:I'm going home.
Brad Herda (:That doesn't fucking work in many industries. It might work in some instances for some services, but not even close to most of the things that we go out and try to perform.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Yeah, so if you focus more on how you can serve, you would be more amazed at all the opportunities that are immediately available.
Brad Herda (:Right. I met a guy. I had a connection with somebody from the builders association, saw them at a breakfast. I was having another meeting, saw them at breakfast, connected with her, said, hi, how's it going? He introduced me to the guy that she was talking to. And we went on. Her and I had a conversation a couple of weeks later. I should introduce you to him. Okay, great. So I just had breakfast with him last week and we're just talking.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:He's telling me about his business, about his lighting business, about what's happening and what's going on and what he's thinking about. And he's using the word franchise and all this other stuff. like, probably wrist, da da da. And just saying, okay, have you thought about and what's going on? And he's, he's a year or two older than I am. And he's like, Hey, I got to try to figure this out. okay. And then he's like, well, so what do you do? I'm like, I just stuff, right?
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:What does an engagement look like? What happens? And I gave him the range, gave him something like, I'm not there to sell him. I'm there to have a conversation to feel how, how can, how can he go out and what, and what can I give him from an introduction to support him along the way? And part of that is my, my intention every year is to provide 100 meaningful introductions every year to people that might make sense. And I believe this year I'm right around 80 ish right now.
Steve Doyle (:Right.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Hmm
Brad Herda (:through LinkedIn and other things. it's like, okay, cool. Like, Ann and Anush, we're gonna make that introduction to them and away we go. But those are the things. How can we make the connections to serve? Because then you're always going to be remembered for what you did for them because you wanted to, not because you were part of the process. And people can feel it and they can know it and it's...
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Correct.
Brad Herda (:There's a reason why everybody's frustrated with cable companies when you call the service hotline, when you call customer service, my cable's out and they go through the script. There's a reason why people are frustrated with the script. Unfortunately, most of the time that script solves most of the problems. But when you'd been through the script and you know it's not the problem, they still have to go through the script, so don't get pissed at them.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:Right? And you can go through and say, Hey, you know, this is the fourth time I've called. There should be notes on it. Here's the situation. Yes, I've done all these things that it's time that we, cause you, it, you just need, if you know what's going on, be patient with the person on the other side. They're not trying to be an asshole to you. They're, they're, doing their job because the calls are being recorded.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Mm-hmm.
Brad Herda (:their performance is being there. And once they get past those steps and you get through some of that stuff, you can then say, okay, great. And once in a while you get somebody that's willing to do the right thing and not follow the process because they have the clout within the organization. And unfortunately, sometimes it's a random act of who picks up the phone.
Steve Doyle (:Mm hmm. Right.
Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Yep. Mm-hmm. So.
Brad Herda (:So customer service 101.
Steve Doyle (:Yep, just serve. That's it. Just serve.
Brad Herda (:That's why it's in the name. It's called customer service.
Steve Doyle (:Disserve.
Brad Herda (:And one of the things I try to get people like my clients and networking partners and other folks in our own organization, I'm like, why are you selling to them? Let them buy from you. What do mean let them buy from you? Just let them buy from you. Because the moment you're selling, I've got a newer client, younger guy starting a bookkeeping business. like, dude, why are you selling all the time?
Steve Doyle (:Correct.
Steve Doyle (:Yep. Well, that's what I'm told. Always be selling.
Brad Herda (:let people buy from you. Let them go be curious, be understanding, understand what the situation is because you have a customizable service based business. How can you sell something you don't know what they need?
Steve Doyle (:Give. Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Steve Doyle (:Mm hmm. But I know they need it. They don't. You don't know anything. So
Brad Herda (:Well, go enjoy your Halloween dressing up as a lumberjack going trick or treat, whatever you're going to do this weekend.
Steve Doyle (:I will try sir, I will try. yeah, you have a good one.
Brad Herda (:All right. And until we meet again, our our actual next show that you and I are going to do is going to be in two weeks. It's going to be the day after Christmas. December 26th is our next show. So I can't wait to see how we're going to record that one and talk about the holiday season. so so that can be that could be your commitment to the show is come up with another
Steve Doyle (:yeah baby!
Steve Doyle (:Oh, I can't wait. Let's go. All right.
Brad Herda (:fruitful idea.
Steve Doyle (:Another fruitful idea. Yeah, another fruitful idea on it.
Brad Herda (:That would be more than that would be the next one.
Steve Doyle (:On it. All right, Yeah, you too.
Brad Herda (:Perfect. All right. Have a great weekend, Thanks.