What exactly does a publicist spend their days doing? Pitching the media, confirming (and re-confirming) interviews/appearances/events, managing author egos, putting out fires, etc. But if you’re someone who works with NYT bestselling authors like Jennifer Weiner and Fredrik Backman, you also get to go on tour! Ariele Fredman Stewart began her publishing career interning for Bloomsbury and mocking up Harry Potter posters, and now works as the Associate Director of Publicity in the Atria imprint at Simon & Schuster. Corinne talked to Ariele about just how much publicity has changed since the advent of digital media, why her role on book tours is that of a (friendly) cop, how the role of a publicist is always evolving, and whether or not viral fame has changed her toddler.

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Foreign Welcome to the hybrid pub Scout podcast, where

we're mapping the frontier between traditional and indie

publishing. This is Emily einlander, and today, my co host

Corinne kolasky will be interviewing Ariel Fredman

Stewart. Enjoy. Tonight. We're talking to Ariel Fredman

Stewart, who is a book publicist who has launched New York Times

Best Selling campaigns for Frederick Bachman, Jennifer

Weiner, Colleen Hoover and many others, including YouTube

sensation Shane Dawson and Connor Franta. She loves cheese

crafting and reading duh, and lives with her husband and

daughter in Queens New York. Find her on Instagram at at

Arielle Stewart, welcome Ariel. Hello. Thank you for talking to

us. I appreciate it. Yeah, so Ariel and I have had a lot, I

wouldn't say, like, a story in past, but a long

time. Yeah, like, how does so? Let's talk about maybe, like,

quickly, like, how we first sort of met, yeah, that's true. So I

think it's so interesting. I was I graduated from college into

the recession,

sure. So you were leaving your job and I got your job, yes? So,

yeah, so we've known each other for now. What like 10 of those

2008

11 years? Yeah, yeah, a very long time. So, yeah, yeah, yeah,

over a decade, over a decade. It's insane. I know, I know so

much has happened in that decade. The intervening years

been okay to us? Yeah, it has been for the most part. It's

true, yeah.

All right, I'm gonna jump into our questions here now. So what

made you want to get into a career in publishing in the

first place?

So I guess I was always pegged in school as a book nerd because

I was good at reading and felt compelled to answer questions

whenever a teacher, you know, asked them, because, right,

right? Yeah, you know, that's just what people do, right? And

then when I was in high school, I was lucky enough to spend the

summer in London one summer, and I got an internship at

Bloomsbury, who publishes Harry Potter in the UK. And before

that, yeah, I had no idea that you could work in publishing.

It's just one of those things where, like, I still envision

the mail, just like winging through the air. Yeah, people

know, right? You know, carry the mail, but people actually work

on books and acquire them and edit them and publish them and

do all the things. So, you know, wow, who knew? Yeah, yeah,

that's crazy. So now, when you were at Bloomsbury, were you an

editorial intern or publicity intern? It was like a weird

reputational thing where I worked in the rights department

and I worked in the publicity department, but what they had me

doing was actually physically making posters to mail out to

store events. So I would like, cut up covers and then paste

them on. And they were like, Wow, you're good at arts and

crafts. I feel like, Yes, I am, yeah. But also briefing books

early. So that was fun. Yeah, yeah. So now, when you worked,

like, in the publicity department or interned, there

was that kind of, what first sort of, like, turned your mind

towards publicity as, like, a possible part of the industry

that you'd want to work you'd want to work in? Yeah,

absolutely, because I had no idea. Like, I think most people

just think, when you work in book publishing, you read books

at your desk, and then that's what you do. But you know, until

you actually dive into it, you don't understand that there's so

many other components. There's copy editors and managing

editors who make sure, like, covers are turned in on time and

edited manuscripts and it's read out to the right retailers, and

all this other stuff that no one like, you know, someone sells

the books to the retailers, like someone signs the cover. So many

things that no one even thinks about that are so cool, right,

right? Totally, yeah, yeah. That's why I was like, Yeah,

publicity, because you can be fun to, like, use your powers of

persuasion and still read the books and think critically about

them. And, you know, sometimes go to the Today Show, yeah,

right. Every once, yeah,

it's true.

All right. So did you consider any other industries before you

got into publishing? Or were you kind of like, nope. Like, this

is exactly what I want to do. You know, I did. I was looking I

interned in advertising, and I I vaguely, I looked at this, yeah,

yeah. Like, maybe, like, more corporate sure publicity for a

period of time. But I also had such a liberal arts education

that, despite.

That good education, I wasn't super duper prepared for, like,

Oh, I really want to do this after college, so I kind of

defaulted to what I knew I liked, right, right? Yeah, yeah.

That makes sense. That's like, I think there's a way to do it.

That's the way to choose a career. So, you know, yeah,

yeah, without an eye towards, towards finances, no, not at

all. Not even thinking about, yeah. It's funny I think about

that now, because, like, I kind of had the same thing. Like,

when I was in my mid 20s, I was 20s, I was just like, I interned

for like, a literary agent in Seattle, and I was like, Oh, my

God, I love this. I'm gonna move to New York and, like, do this

whole thing. And, yeah, like, looking back, I'm like, I'm glad

that I obviously, I'm really glad that I did that, because I

love publishing. But yeah, I mean, it's just like, wow. Like,

I could have chosen an industry where I'd have made a lot more

money, but, you know, yeah, you do, right? We're financial or

financially sound in our hearts. We are exactly, it's true. Yeah,

we're like, rich in our careers and then poor in our bank

accounts, so, whatever, exactly.

All right, so you tour every now and again with very popular

authors like Jennifer Weiner and Frederick Bachman. What is that

experience like? And what do you spend most of your time on tour

doing?

Ooh, fun question. The experience is really fun and

interesting and great, because you get to go out to bookstores

that you send your authors to all the time and actually see

what they're doing on the ground. Yeah, and beyond that,

you're actually meeting the people who come to book events

and getting to understand, like, what what they want out of the

experience, which I think makes you better at coming up with an

experience that's good for future readers. So yeah, like, I

love that. I've made friends with booksellers at Joseph

because I get to go out to Cincinnati a good bit, and,

like, I know people now all over the country, and I've been to

these amazing independents, and I've been really lucky to do

that. And then also just going on tour with authors. You get to

know them better. What makes them tick, it is definitely

being like a glorified camp counselor, because, like, you're

like, you need to be at this place at this time. And you also

have a little bit of a police officer role where you're

stepping in, especially for more famous authors, you're stepping

in to be like you're too close. You need to back up, right? Or,

you know, you you've had a two minute conversation now, and

there's 1100 other people in line, we need you to keep

moving. Yeah? So that's that's hard, because we just want to be

nice. And I always try and be nice until you are very nice,

I'm sure you thank you. You are, yeah, I'm a good police officer,

but no, it's, it's really fun, and I really, I love going on

tour, but you also it's tiring, and that's another thing you

learn. Like you're putting your authors through a lot when they

go on tour, but that's what advances are for, right, right.

Yes, very true. Wait, what was the second part of that

question? I forgot her. Oh no, that's okay. I said, What do you

spend most of your time on tour doing, which I think you just,

oh yeah, explained. So, yeah, that's pretty police officer,

yeah, right, right. So do you have, like, a favorite city that

you've been to on tour, or

a favorite city, yeah, or maybe what's been your best tour

experience, or something like that. You know what? I had a

really good trip with Frederick Bachmann in Minneapolis, where

we we did, like an amazing few stock signings leading up to

this event that was a community reads pick for his Brit Marie

was here, because they also chose a man called UVA. And so

this giant state, like, not stadium, auditorium of like, 300

people was filled and think it was the first time he really

saw, Wow. People are coming out for me, and, like, I have an

audience in the US that I had no idea about. And he was like,

whoa. This is, you know, really cool. And for me, it was really

seeing this small community come together for this event that it

seemed like people didn't really hang out together. And, yeah,

maybe it was. It was like, kind of a community that had, like,

some drug fractures and things were like, not the best, but

like, everybody came out to see this cool author from Sweden,

and I was just super touched by the experience. And I think he

had a great time too. Yeah, yeah. That's awesome. That is a

great event. That's like, that's why you do it, you know? Yeah,

yeah. It's true for moments like that. That's very true. Yeah,

yeah.

All right, so now that you've been in the publicity game for

over 10 years, how would you say, and I feel like this is in

a million ways that it's changed, but what are some,

like, I don't know, really obvious ways that publicity has

changed in the past 10 years? Yeah. I mean, everything is

digital now, and I feel like,

you know, the magazines still hold their weight and the print

papers still hold their weight like everyone would die for

something in the New York Times, if it's positive. But you're

also trying to get on the New York Times podcast. You're

trying to get on pod save America with like, a political

book, and you're trying to do so much more to reach people in

every way, because everybody's reading while they're watching

TV and like texting on their phones. So like, you have to

find, to find a way to hit people multiple times where they

live online, right? So, so hard, because everybody's attention is

super just, you know.

Divided, yeah, absolutely, yeah. And I would think it's, I mean,

it's so much harder now too, because it feels like there's so

much more content out there too, than there was 10 years ago, you

know. So it's, yeah, yeah, yeah. And, you know, Audible is coming

up with original stories now. So you're, if it, you're an audio

listener, you can only, you know, you could do that. You

could only do that. And yeah, you don't ever have to touch a

book or, you know, an ebook, which is interesting. But when

we, when you and I met, ebooks were becoming, like, the thing,

right? And now they've plateaued. So that's Yeah, yeah,

definitely, yeah, yeah. Well, and I don't remember, like,

exactly when the panic took hold that, like, ebooks were just

going to completely overtake print books and nobody was gonna

read print books anymore. But it's just, I mean, it's, it's

very, as someone who only reads print books, I feel like that's

a little like victory for me, a little bit, I guess that eBooks

are kind of like, you know, people read them, whatever, but

they're not going to destroy print books. So, yeah, exactly,

yeah, yeah, we'll always have a nice medley of both. I really,

truly believe that? Yeah, I think so definitely. Yeah, yeah.

All right, so you've worked with some blockbuster authors like

the aforementioned Frederick Bachman, so who have been some

of your favorites to work with, and why? Apart from him and

Jennifer, I assume too, yeah, no, she's great. I love Colleen

Hoover. Oh, yeah, nice. Yeah. I think she is an underappreciated

author, despite having like, you know, a reach of, you know,

three quarters of a million people online, and people just

don't know her, and I think that kind of plays into the whole

romance. Isn't really reading situation that a lot of people

feel. But yeah, romance is contemporary fiction. And if you

like contemporary fiction, and you're reading Jojo Moyes like

you can read any romance author and still have a great time and

and sometimes you come away with a better understanding of issues

that you might not have experienced yourself. And that's

what I love about Colleen, because even though she doesn't

try to and to educate, sometimes she does by accident. And sure,

I think that's great.

I loved, I loved working with Kunal Nayar, who was Raj on The

Big Bang Theory. Okay, yeah. He wrote a great book called Yes,

My accent is real. It's about where he came from in India, and

how he ended up in the United States, and how he, you know,

really worked hard to get to where he is. And he's just such

a humble, smart, let full of light. Person like, yeah, the

nicest guy, yeah. I'm

trying to think of people that are like, less well known. Sure,

I love this jewel, if you like domestic suspense thrillers,

like I've This is my funny, crazy publishing story. When I

was an intern at Harper Collins, I grabbed her book, Vince and

joy in galley form, and I read it, and then I left it at my my

parents house, and then, you know, years later, I start to

work at atria in 2010

and I went home to my parents house, and I saw this book,

Vincent joy by Lisa Jewell. And I was like, Holy crap, I'm her

publicist. Now, yeah, she had moved over to atria, and that

was maybe her first book with atria, right? And now it's been,

we're launching our 10th book together in November, and it's

gonna go bonkers. Yeah? Like, wow, what a crazy story. That is

insane. Yeah, yeah. That's really, like, the universe

coming together somehow it really, that's awesome, yeah,

yeah. I've been, been trying for years and years to make her into

this, like, household name, and I feel like we're almost there.

I was gonna say, I mean, yeah, I feel like she's very

recognizable, name wise, definitely, like, and I know

what, I don't even read that kind of fiction, but I know what

she writes, you know, like, I mean, I feel like she's very

Yeah, so you're doing an amazing job. Because Thank you. Yeah,

amazing, sweetie.

All right. So what have been some of the most fun campaigns

you've worked on, and why?

Okay, well, every, every, any time I've gone on a bus tour,

yeah, that has been super fun. We put together this mystery bus

tour with several authors in 2000

something, 1210, 11, and went all across the country, just

like rocking it out with these, like young boys hoofing books

and these, like very well known authors being like, where are

we? Why can't we use the bathroom?

That was, I just thought that was a really creative way to get

the word out about our mystery,

our mystery books at Adria. And I thought that was super fun,

yeah, trying to think of, like, overall campaigns, because

sometimes my brain goes backwards and forwards, or only

forwards, because, like, right now, what are we living in?

Like, 2020 21 Yeah, for sure. Yeah, right. But um, no, I think

I loved, I've loved my romance campaigns. Jen Weiner was so

amazing last year, this year, oh my gosh. 2019, yeah, because she

hadn't written a novel in four years, almost four years, and

everyone was like, Oh my God. She's back with this amazing

book. And basically every single.

Outlet came to the table and we got new coverage for her, and it

was her first real experience doing a lot of the like,

Instagrammy digital stuff, yeah. And I really, I love that space.

I work with a lot of like, books to grammars, or I love, like

finding podcasts, obviously, you know, through Instagram and

right, it's just, I think it's really fun to see somebody,

like, learn something new. And I felt like, you know, look at me.

I'm just like, this, you know, young publicist, and Jen Weiner

is this amazing powerhouse, and I got to help her, yeah, break

out. And I thought that was amazing. Yeah, that's very cool.

Yeah, yeah. Well, and I guess that's something else that I

think, like, I feel like there's kind of, you know, a pro and con

probably, to the way publicity has shifted in the past 10

years, where there are all these bookstagrammers, and they're all

these podcasts and stuff that you're pitching, it's like,

yeah, you can have fun with them in a way that you maybe couldn't

have fun when you're pitching to like the Atlantic or something

like that. Yes, it's a very different landscape. Yeah, yeah.

But, and also, she's just such a big proponent of, like, gender

equality and literature coverage and show some places like I

said, if you don't take women seriously, fine, but there's

tons of other places that are going to do a better job than,

you know, the old guard at selling right, sometimes right.

Rewarding for us. I think, yeah. Oh, absolutely. I think so too.

Yeah, yeah. All right. So you have worked for both Harper

Collins and Simon and Schuster since you began your career.

Would you have any interest in working for a smaller or

independent publisher someday, or moving into another facet of

the industry?

Yeah, I love indie publishers. There's a freelancer I work with

who's publishing with Flash books soon, and I just, I think

that they are able to give a level of personalized attention

that sometimes really hard in the traditional publishing. Oh,

because, you know, that's really, there's just so many

books being put out, yep. And there's obviously benefits to

both, but I think that's like a really unique experience, and I

think independent bookstores appreciate that so much more.

Yeah, for sure.

And I've worked with authors who do both, you know, self

publishing and traditional publishing, which I I think is

an interesting, like go to market thing. Yeah, I've learned

about and I've learned about price sensitivity, and, yeah, I

would definitely go, I mean, I'm not leaving my job. Yeah, I'm

gonna choose your overhead. Overweight,

but yeah, and, and I don't know, I'm maybe like exploring a

children's book based on my daughter. Yeah, thing to do,

like, later, and, you know, I don't know, we'll see, yeah, but

totally, I think I like marketing. I like publicity.

I've always been interested in talking to indie booksellers, so

but like the people who do that, the sales teams who talk to

indies, are so cool, and I would, I would love to do that

too. Yeah, yeah. Okay, all right. Awesome, yeah.

Okay. So you have also worked on publicity campaigns for some

YouTube personalities. So how different? Yeah, so how

different do those campaigns look from a quote, unquote,

normal book campaign? You know, it's like the publicity is kind

of the side point to the events. I Okay, I'm not saying that

properly, but, like, I know what you mean, though it's so fun

because I've never seen more people come to bookstores,

really, and bond with each other. Yeah, have a great time,

just like, have this whole fun experience. Make a day of it,

yeah, and yeah, and just lose their absolute weight. Can I

curse? Yeah, of course, they just lose their shit over seeing

these people. And it's so interesting, and I've learned so

much about understanding audiences and who was actually

going to do a great job. Yeah,

selling books. Yeah? No, I love seeing all these kids walking

into stores and buying books, and the youtubers themselves,

like you might get, like teenager publicity or the

entertainment things. Yeah, you can break through. But when we

first started doing it, people really didn't take them

seriously. Yeah, so we were, like, trying to pitch New York

Times profiles and things like that. And actually, one of my

authors, like, sold more books than anyone else who hit the

best seller list one week, but he wasn't on the list because

of,

you know, bias or whatever they were, yeah, snobbery, yeah, it's

just the power that these people have is amazing. And they're

actually, for the most part, really sweet people who maybe

been through a lot or, yeah, are just trying to, like, reach out

to their fans in a new way. And I think that was really cool,

because so many kids would leave reviews, like, I don't read a

lot, but now I'm gonna start reading again, because I really

enjoyed reading, you know, Shane Dawson's book, yeah,

yeah, that's very cool. That was amazing. And truly, like, we

would limit the number of people that could come into this.

Tour, and it was hundreds, wow,

2000 people, and I had to cut it off, and I got in a fight with a

mom.

It

was great. Yeah, yeah, it sounds that way. Oh, my God, that's

crazy. Yeah. And that type of touring is, is hugely fun too,

yeah, oh, I'm sure, yeah. So how many tours do you go on a year?

Or does it kind of depend? I think it really depends on the

author and the year. I think it's slowed down a little bit,

especially since I've become a mom, I think, yeah, sure. But I

would say, like, once or twice a year I'm traveling with people

or going to a conference or something. Yeah,

yeah, it's good to get out there and show your face on the ground

and let people know that you care about what they're doing.

Yeah, of course. Right, right, yeah, that's very cool. All

right. Um, so okay, if you had your pick of genres, which genre

would you choose to work on, like, exclusively, or is there

one?

Well, yeah, no. I mean, if you could go as broad as to say

fiction, I think that's where I live, yeah.

And I I like the line between contempt, like just commercial

fiction and slightly literary, like I like accessible literary

fiction, yeah, yeah. And I think I can do well there. But I also,

like,

I like celebrities, I have to say it like, yeah, to work with

publicity is fun. Be creative in ways that you can't really be

with, just like a debut novel, sure,

but what I love the most is just finding a book that you love,

and maybe you've cried over and just being like, I'm gonna give

this everything I can, yeah, and and go to like, you know, go to

bat for it. And when that's successful, it's so obviously,

you know, it's like, so rewarding. Oh, totally Yeah,

yeah, yeah, that's awesome. All right, um, let's see. And can

you tell us what you are reading right now?

I am reading a book called The Majesty's by Tiffany Tao, okay,

and some people have described it as like a mash up between

Crazy Rich Asians and like it Gillian Flynn had written it.

Oh, okay, yeah.

So it's like a

it's like a crazy Asian family, and there's murder,

but, like, I can't really say more that's pausing for a

second, yeah, anymore is like, totally, totally, totally

gorgeous, yeah, so I love that. And what else am I reading?

No, are you read? Sorry, go ahead. Oh, no, I was just gonna

ask, Are you reading this stuff for work, or is this for fun?

That's a work one and a fun one was we read elevation by Ted

Chiang, okay, yeah, yeah, like a collection of short stories for

my book club. And I Oh, cool. It was so weird, and I loved it.

And a lot of our book club members were like, I didn't

think I liked sci fi, and maybe I could give it a try. Yeah,

yeah, that is cool. Awesome. All right. So are there any books

coming down the pike that we should be watching out for from

SNS, or anything else that you know about, that you can talk

about, I guess? Okay, well, I'm working on a book that's coming

out in March 2020, called five years by Rebecca Searle, okay?

And it's, it's a book that totally subverts your

expectations, because you go in thinking it's gonna be a love

story, and then it's kind of a friendship story. Oh, most

people that I've sent it to have come back and been like, I was

not expecting to cry so much. And, yeah, really, she really

messed me up there. Yeah, yeah. It's like a beautiful meditation

on friendship and, you know, fate and free will and where you

see yourself in the future. And I think, I think it's gonna go

bonkers, hopefully, yeah. And then, of course, I'm eagerly

anticipating Frederick Bachmann next novel, which is hopefully

coming in the fall of 2020, and it's anxious people, okay, all

right, that seems perfect for these times. So yes, it's

perfect for our anxious fall 20 Yes.

So now, do you like is Frederick, one of those authors,

too, that, like, whenever he has a book coming out, you

automatically get to work on it, because you've worked on all his

others. Yeah, yeah, as long as I'm living and breathing and

working at me, yeah, you could think, yeah, yeah, that's very

nice, yeah, yeah,

yeah, it's great. I hope I don't do anything to mess it up. But

like, Yeah, as long as I get to

stay at Adria and yeah, work on fiction,

yeah, yeah. That's very cool. That's awesome. All right, those

are all I think, the like industry related questions that

I had. My last question is about your daughter, Millie, who is

How old is she? Like, two? Is she two and a half? Yeah, two

and a half. Okay, so she just had this sort of brush with.

Same. What was this, like, a month ago? Maybe, yeah, like, in

September, yeah, yeah, yeah. We're like, Okay, can you

describe exactly what the video that you took was, yeah, okay,

so Millie is super weird, and I love her so much. That's like,

smart and weird, and it's hilarious. She is, she is, yeah,

thank you. And she like, she, you know, i What i i wake up

with her at like, six o'clock in the morning. So, like, what else

am I doing but putting her on my Instagram stories, like waiting

for the garbage truck, right? So thanks her life. So she just

started moving into the preschool room at her daycare,

and she was kind of ornery about going. And then finally, she was

super excited to go, yeah, and I don't know, I guess she just

learned how to walk backwards, or has discovered that she's

able to so she decided to walk backwards down the street with

her dad on the way to school. I started filming, because that

was super weird, yeah, but then she remembered that she forgot

to give me a kiss, and she like, yelled, wait, kiss. And she ran

back at me and

gave me a kiss, and she said, I love you and I trust you, and I

love you and I love you, okay,

which is, it's funny, because she definitely, she understands

trust a little bit she, but she definitely doesn't use it right

all the time, yeah? But the video kind of like went viral,

yeah? Friend tweeted it like a YouTuber that I know, like

Connor Franta retweeted it, like, you know that happened,

yeah? And then, like, Parents Magazine reached out and

motherly and Pop Sugar, and then Good Morning America. Was like,

Can we run this online? And I was like, okay, sure,

uh huh, please confirm that date and what, what social it's

going, Yes,

right? But,

yeah, that was, that was crazy. It was, like, a fun moment, and

she had no idea what was going on, of course, right, right,

yeah, yeah. Well, that was, I gotta say, a very delightful but

a thing to see go viral. It's like, for once, you know, for

once in like a blue moon or something. It's like something

good is actually acute, is actually happening in the world,

instead of just one terrible thing after another. So thank

you, Millie, thank

you, Billy. No, I and like, truly, as a publicist, I was

like, should I be allowing this to be out of there on the

internet? But then so many people are like, this, true.

This made my day. Yeah. I was like, okay, it's fine, yeah,

don't worry. Well, I think people are really hungry for

anything good in this day and age. You know what? I mean? It's

like, anything that warms your heart for like, 10 seconds. It's

like, give me more of that. So, yeah, oh my god, wow, I smiled

Right exactly. Yes, yes, when my day is full of frowns, mostly.

So, yeah, yeah,

that's how people feel. Yeah. All right, I think that's the

end of our question list. Do you have anything that you want to

plug, or anything else you'd like to talk about. Maybe any

books you have coming up that people should look out for,

anything like that. Okay, so I said the Rebecca sterle, yes.

And I said Frederick is coming. I think Jen Weiner has a new

book coming in the summer. Oh, cool. Big summer. But I don't

know if I'm like, Cool to announce the date, sure, yeah,

yeah, that's okay. That's, I don't want to get you in trouble

for revealing. I feel like, I feel like Rebecca and Frederick

are very exciting, and then Jen will have her do and then, yeah,

I don't, I can't even think about what else is happening

past that. I'm still like, Yeah, I'm no, I'm still, like, right

now in November 5, when I have Lisa jewels, the family upstairs

coming out. Oh, okay. Oh, God, so you're really crazy right

now. Yeah, and you know indivisible, the like,

Indivisible Project that has, like, it's a grassroots

organizing. I don't think I do know.

I This doesn't have to be on podcast, but, oh, it will be.

Yeah.

So indivisible launched in 2017

when a guide to defeating Trump kind of went viral, okay? And

now it's millions of members across the country who have

indivisible groups in every single state and in so many

cities, organizing town halls and running for office and all

these other things. And, yeah, they have a book coming out

called we are indivisible on November 5 as well. And it's

kind of just like, how you can help, you know, what?

What political reforms we actually need? Like, what's the

cause of Trumpism at its root, you know? And, and, you know,

even if things don't change in 2020 it's like, what else we can

be doing, yeah, to make a difference in your own

community. Okay, that sounds awesome. Yeah, that's fine,

yeah, yeah. Like, that's a good cause, yeah, my mind absolutely,

I totally agree, yeah, we'll definitely, we'll put that.

We'll probably put a link to it, like, on the website and in the

newsletter, like and in our post about this episode and stuff. So

yeah, we'll definitely include that. If you're cool with it.

We'll also include the video of Millie, so more people get a

taste of that, because, as I said, it will definitely make

you smile. So yeah, and if it doesn't help you, so you know,

oh my god, yeah, that's huge.

All that have found me on the internet. I'm like, okay, you've

got whatever that video. Are you kidding me? Can you imagine some

people are like,

Oh, they're like, I love you and I trust you. That's probably

what Mommy says to daddy when he leaves for a business trip. Oh,

my God. What the fuck that's insane. Well, like, Are you

kidding me? Yeah, I'm like, Honey, I'm the one who goes on

business trip, yeah?

Oh, my God. Well, I'm sorry you've had to deal with it. But

I can't say I'm surprised, though, because, like, people

literally anything to criticize. So you know, yeah, whatever,

yeah, yeah, even the purest video in the history of video.

So,

yeah,

yeah. So, all right, well, I think we're done. I can't think

of anything, anything else you want to talk about, but no, this

has been so fun, cool, awesome. Yeah. Thank you so much for

doing this too. I super appreciate it. And you can find

us@hybridpubscout.com

on Facebook at hybrid pub, scout on Twitter at hybrid pub, scout

on Instagram at hybrid pub, Scout pod and please find us on

your favorite podcast app and give us a five star rating and

review. Thanks for listening, and thanks for giving a rip

about books. You you.