Transcripts
In this episode of The Pricing Lady
Podcast, I sit down with Glasa Gottschalk
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:life and Business Mindset coach to
talk about her Pricing journey and
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:how to price your coaching services.
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:Sit back, relax, and enjoy the episode.
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:Janene: Welcome to The
Pricing Lady podcast.
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:I'm Janene Liston, your hostess.
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:This is where smart business owners
price with purpose and profit with
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:clarity Today, I'm very excited
to have a special guest with us.
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:Please help me welcome Glasa Gottschalk.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yay.
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:Janene: right, Glasa?
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yes.
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:Perfect.
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:Janene: Excellent.
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:Welcome.
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:I'm super excited to have
you here with me today.
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:Where are you joining us from?
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:Glasa Gottschalk: I am joining
from Rockford, Illinois in the us.
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:We're about 60 minutes
northwest of Chicago.
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:Janene: Okay, excellent.
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:What would you describe as your
personal or professional superpower?
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Ooh.
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:I would definitely say my determination.
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:That's one.
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:No matter what, I'm the person I
am going to like figure it out.
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:I'm gonna decide what I want and
really find the path to go get it.
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:Janene: I love that.
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:So you're an intrepid spirit.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: I've never
heard it explained that way, but
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:Janene: No.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: that.
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:Yeah.
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:Janene: It's a great word.
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:What's one thing that most people
don't know about you that you'd
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:like to share with us today?
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Interesting.
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:I actually started my career
in a small business running a
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:record store and used to DJ.
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:Like records and play at
parties and things like that.
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:And it's something that still lives close
to my heart because I love electronic
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:music and house music and techno.
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:My husband actually says if I ever
come home and there's house music
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:on, I know to leave you alone 'cause
you're in a mode to get stuff done.
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:But it's one of my favorites and I
love sharing my music too, online.
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:Just things that, you know,
inspire me or keep me motivated.
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:Janene: Super.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yeah.
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:Janene: To give us a bit of context, why
don't you tell us about what kind of work
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:you do and how you got started in that?
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:Glasa Gottschalk: I am a life and
business mindset coach, and I work
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:with women leaders and entrepreneurs
that wanna show up bolder and braver
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:in life or in their career or business.
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:In 2017, when I had left my last job,
I was headed for a sabbatical year.
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:And in that year was just saying
yes to anything that really
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:energized me and lit me up.
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:During that time I started a consulting
business where I was consulting business
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:owners and leaders on ways to increase
their profitability and revenues.
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:Leadership and business
development has always been a
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:part of my background, so it's.
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:It felt natural and motivating
to help folks with that.
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:it wasn't long into that journey that
I really understood this thread of your
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:business or your organization or your
team will only grow to the aspect that
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:you're willing to grow as an individual.
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:And so I started to sit with
this question of how do I get
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:folks to become more self-aware.
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:And this led me to get
curious about coaching.
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:I ended up doing a year long certification
program that totally opened my eyes
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:to a different, a different world.
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:And I came to understand that without
this work, without, adopting a growth
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:mindset and leaning into coaching tools
everything else that we do in business
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:or in life becomes more difficult.
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:And so this became the foundational
work, that creates everything
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:else that we want in life.
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:I've done it since 2019.
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:And it's been something that has
brought me so much joy and fulfillment.
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:Janene: excellent.
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:When you first started your business
and you had to price what you were
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:offering, what was that like for you?
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yeah,
this was a challenging one.
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:When I started my original consulting
business in:
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:lot of knowledge in terms of how to price
things and to say that it was something
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:that I master quickly would be false.
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:It's definitely something
that was a journey for me.
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:But the journey was really about
understanding the value that you have to
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:offer, what that creates for your clients.
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:And then Pricing appropriately.
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:One of the biggest hurdles I faced
in the beginning is not really
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:understanding the total aspect of the
work that you bring to the client.
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:Sometimes we only think about initial
stages or the time that we're front
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:facing with the client, and there's
so much more, so much more time
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:and energy that actually goes in.
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:And so I had to really make the switch
from charging for my time to charging for
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:the value that I'm bringing to the client.
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:And that was one that
was eye-opening for me.
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:Janene: Right, right.
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:When you made this shift into
coaching, what felt most uncomfortable
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:or confusing to you about how to
go about charging for your work?
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Oh, I think the
confusing thing for me when I switched
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:Janene: Hmm.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: to coaching was that
everywhere I looked in the coaching
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:industry, there was a variation of
pricing, methods, pricing cadences,
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:pricing like some coaches were pricing
for sessions, some coaches were doing
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:recurring retainers where it was
just like you paid a monthly fee.
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:Some coaches were doing like
a timeframe, like we worked
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:together for X amount of time.
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:So it was really confusing
because there was no real
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:template out there in terms of.
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:These are the things that you
should be looking at for you to
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:decide on how you want to price.
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:Everywhere you look, you know, there's
everything from folks charging $50 a
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:session on up to $50,000 a year for
program, and you have to kind of tune into
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:yourself and understand, how do I define
what is the right pricing package for me?
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:Janene: Mm-hmm.
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:Yeah.
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:Was there a moment when you realized
that, the way I'm Pricing right now isn't
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:working for me anymore and or working
for your clients and what happened?
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yeah, I think one
of the best things that happened
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:for me was shifting out of the time
aspect and focusing more on what
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:it, what creates a win-win scenario.
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:What is a win for my client
and also what is a win for me.
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:So often sometimes I think we look
at it through one lens just in terms
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:of here's what I wanna make and
here's how I wanna break it down.
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:But we don't think what actually
creates a win for the client as well.
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:that was something, when I really
started to explore it, it helped me
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:build confidence in presenting it
because I understood the value and
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:I understood the win for the client
outside of just the win for my business.
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:Janene: Right, right.
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:Now, it sounds like, maybe I'm wrong
here, but it sounds like you've
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:experimented with a lot of different
ways to charge clients over the years.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yes.
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:Janene: which one taught
you the toughest lesson?
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Ah.
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:Probably.
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:The hour, the hourly when
I switched from, yeah.
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:So I used to think in terms of, okay,
I am gonna do a 60 minute session
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:and I'm gonna charge this much.
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:It's an hour of my time.
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:Janene: Mm-hmm.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: But there was a lot
more context that went into that in
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:terms of preparing for sessions, in
terms of follow up to sessions, in
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:terms of sharing resources or tools
with my client outside of that session.
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:Janene: Mm-hmm.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: and that was a really
eye-opening experience to understand
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:that the time that I'm allotting for
this is not just within the session and
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:the value that clients are receiving
is not just within the session.
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:So how do I broaden my scope to,
to focus on the value that I'm
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:offering versus just the time there.
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:And I think when we're.
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:Especially in the US we come up in a
system that teaches us to be employees.
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:We're taught to go for the higher
per hour or the higher salary every
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:year, and we don't really think about
once we switch to a business that
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:is no longer the primary factor.
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:Janene: Yeah, that's a
very, very good point.
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:One thing that you and I had talked about
when we had a conversation earlier on,
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:I think what even sort of prompted us
bringing, having you come on the show was
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:around some of the guidance that coaching
programs might be providing people in
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:terms of how they should price themselves.
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:And one of the things that I see and
hear all the time, you see very, a lot,
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:especially with women, but also with men.
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:They come out of a 15, 20 year corporate
career and they get a coaching credential.
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:And when they're setting their prices,
they're not always considering,
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:that corporate experience into
the context of the value that they
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:bring to the table as a coach.
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:And I'm curious what your
thoughts are on that, because
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:I find, I personally find that.
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:A disturb to themselves and to their
clients, but maybe I've got it all wrong.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yeah.
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:It is of my philosophy that when
you switch into business ownership,
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:you're not starting from scratch.
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:A lot of the folks who go through
coaching certification, they've
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:come from leadership experience.
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:They've come from developing
businesses in terms of like working for
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:organizations and, and building books
of business and building them out, and
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:we seem to forget that when we make.
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:Leap as if, because I
am, I'm doing coaching.
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:None of that stuff matters, but it
does because all of that experience is
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:valuable and has and translatable skills
that you can apply to your business.
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:Another one just 'cause you bring this
one up that I always hear is like,
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:charge your worth and then add tax.
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:Janene: Ah, you can't see my face
everyone, but that one Charge your worth.
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:I know, and it's so terrible because
I have to confess, when I started
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:my business, my program was called
Speak Even Charge Your Worth.
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:And now when I hear that
phrase, it just makes me cringe.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yeah, it's,
and when you think about that.
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:You know, some of that is
pulling in your experience.
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:So I get where it comes from of like
wanting to take all of that experience
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:with you as valuable, but I think it's it
attaches something to our identity that.
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:Does it need to be?
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:Right?
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:Our worth is inherent as an individual.
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:The experience and skills that we
bring, and maybe even the certifications
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:are the things that we want to add
that value on are the things that
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:we want to price accordingly on.
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:Janene: Right.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: And in the beginning,
because we don't yet have the
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:experience, it can feel really hard to
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:Janene: Yeah.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: out.
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:What are the skills and values that
I wanna bring into this business
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:ownership journey that are going to
make me feel like it's a valuable
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:use of my time, that it's a valuable
use for the client, and that it's
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:creating a sustainable, livable income.
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:Janene: Yes, yes, it has.
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:It has to meet a lot of different
criteria, or actually I boil it
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:down to three usually with people.
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:The prices you set, they need to be
enough people willing to pay for it.
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:Reflect it needs to reflect
the value you deliver.
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:Not your personal human worth.
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:As a val, you know your value as a human
being and it needs to be profitable
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:enough and you know, it's not for me
to judge what's profitable enough.
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:That's between you and your tax person.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yes.
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:Janene: No, I'm just kidding.
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:But you know, you're right.
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:There is an aspect of, yes, it needs to
reflect the value that's delivered, but
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:also it needs to be profitable enough
to make sense for you financially.
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:Otherwise, you know, I had a, a client,
one of my very first clients, she
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:goes, if you're not making a profit,
it's just a hobby and that one stings,
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:Glasa Gottschalk: I've heard that one.
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:Yeah, it does sting, but
it's the truth, right?
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:Janene: it's.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: in business
because you need to make a living
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:Janene: Yeah.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: You know, we have
to figure that out for ourselves
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:in terms of, or work with someone
like you to really determine like
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:how do we, how do we price that?
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:How do we understand the
value that we're delivering?
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:How do we understand the market that is
available for that particular service?
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:Janene: Mm-hmm.
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:Yeah.
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:Yeah.
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:So.
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:Also, when we were talking before,
you mentioned about how clients
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:sometimes are bringing more to
the session than what you expect.
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:And that changes, especially in coaching,
that will often change what you deliver
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:or how you need to deliver that.
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:And what I hear from a lot of my
coaching clients is they're like, oh,
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:it's too hard to price based on value,
because I can't determine that upfront.
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:I'm curious what your takes are on, on
that and the scope and the boundaries
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:aspect of working with a client,
especially on something, you know,
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:like mindset, which is, let's say some
people would say less quantifiable.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Intangible.
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:Janene: know, how, how have you dealt
with that and come to terms with that
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:in your own business and Pricing?
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:Glasa Gottschalk: One of the things that
I've adopted in my own personal business
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:is a client agreement, which basically
defines the scope of work, what I'm
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:responsible for, what they're responsible
for, and the expectations in terms of
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:what is the outcome that they're seeking.
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:Having this agreement helps us
create kind of the sandbox that
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:we're gonna play inside of so that
clients understand if, if that scope
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:does expand right, that's okay.
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:There's no issue.
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:However, the, the Pricing and the
package that we've worked on and agreed
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:to together has very clear boundaries.
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:so there have been times in the past
where we've had to shift a little.
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:of re-agree on Pricing package and scope.
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:Those, those conversations
sometimes can feel uncomfortable.
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:Most oftentimes than not.
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:I feel like it's more uncomfortable
from the consultant or the coaches side.
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:But when you have those
agreements in place.
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:It helps both parties come to the
table understanding what is the
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:expected outcome, what's expected
of me, and what is expected of them.
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:I will say, and this was prior to
coaching, but in consulting this was.
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:This was definitely a hard lesson for
me because they, I would work with
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:clients, they would have success in their
business or organization, and then they
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:would be asking, can you help me here?
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:Can you help me with this?
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:Can you help me with this?
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:And while I was happy to do so, at
that point in my business, I started.
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:To understand that the things that they
were asking me to help with were outside
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:of the package and Pricing that we had
agreed upon and the scope originally.
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:So having that client agreement
where you're both on the same
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:Janene: Right.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: with what's on the
table, I think is a very essential
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:piece to make sure that your boundaries
aren't being pushed as the coach and
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:Janene: Yes.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: that.
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:If that does happen to expand that,
you can come back to that document
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:and say, okay, this is a great time
to tune in to what we agreed to and
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:Janene: Mm-hmm.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: just align on how
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:Janene: Right.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: to move
forward Purposefully.
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:Janene: Right, right.
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:No, that's very true.
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:I share with people that if you
get nervous in those situations,
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:when people ask you those things
and then you find yourself saying,
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:oh yeah, I'll do it for free.
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:You can always say Yes.
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:Why don't I send you an offer?
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yes.
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:Janene: Right.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: yeah.
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:Janene: Because then you're very kindly
signaling that this is outside of scope
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:but in a way that's still very positive.
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:And because I know some people get really
tongue tied in those situations as well.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yeah.
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:Janene: Yeah.
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:So today it sounds like your,
your Pricing model feels really
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:good for you and your clients.
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:If you look back.
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:What do you understand now about coaching
and value and Pricing that you simply
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:could not have known at the beginning?
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Ooh,
this is a good question.
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:Janene: Yeah.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: I think one, of
the things that I know now that I.
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:Was trying to work through, very
early on in my business was that
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:there folks who are willing to pay for
intangible results, like things that
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:we are trying to experience inside.
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:When I first transitioned to focus
on coaching in my business, because
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:I was on the consulting realm of
helping them increase profitability and
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:revenues, which we can metric, right?
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:Janene: Mm-hmm.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: how do we, how do we.
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:Create value on things that are maybe
not so tangible on feeling more energized
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:in your day on having less stress in
your life, on feeling more connected
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:to your team or your coworkers in
understanding what it takes to actually
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:move up and get a raise or a promotion.
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:In my organization, in developing
my leadership network, you know, in.
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:Finding more joy and balance in my life.
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:These things, when I first started,
I did not understand the value that
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:they actually create for people.
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:Although it comes in intangible ways, in
terms of the coaching that I sell, it does
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:have a return on investment when we apply
it to more tangible areas of life, right?
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:When we talk about actually getting
more salary at your job, because now
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:you feel more confident about what it
takes to get there, how to get there,
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:and when you're gonna have those
conversations with your boss, right?
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:When it comes to having more balance,
it comes out in tangible ways about
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:having more space for the things
that are actually important to you.
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:Spending more time with kids,
spending more time with family,
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:friends things of that sort.
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:So, we discount sometimes the power
and impact of intangible results
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:and what they have in creating
tangible results in our life.
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:And I think that was a huge shift
for me in, in understanding.
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:only that, there is a market
for that, but how to actually
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:talk about those things in a
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:Janene: Right.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: feel like it is
worth spending money on for them.
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:Janene: Yeah.
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:Yeah, I think that's really important.
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:I know a lot of my clients struggle
with that intangible aspect as, as well.
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:Part of our journey working together
is helping them to, to find I'm not
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:finding the right word here to find.
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:Almost what's tangible in the intangibles,
if that makes any sense whatsoever.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yeah, it's
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:Janene: Yeah.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: if you feel like
you're more clear and confident
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:internally, what tangible result
does that actually create in your
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:Janene: Right, right,
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yeah.
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:Janene: right.
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:Yeah.
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:What did you need to unlearn before
Pricing your work started to feel more
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:sustainable and more honest for you.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Ooh, I
have to think about this one.
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:What did I have to learn,
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:Janene: Unlearn,
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:Glasa Gottschalk: unlearn?
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:Janene: that you had to unlearn
in your Pricing journey?
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:No.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Well, one
thing that I've spoke on is I
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:had to unlearn charging hourly.
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:That was something in the beginning
that was a huge shift for me.
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:I think another thing I had to
unlearn, so in my past there was
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:always product or a service that I
was selling, so it felt very easy
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:to price the product or the service
when it was something outside of me.
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:Janene: Mm-hmm.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: think one of
the things for me that I had to.
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:Unlearn is that as a coach, I'm not,
yes, I am the brand, you know, as the
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:coach, but I think there was a lot of
connection between I'm out here selling me
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:as the coach versus I'm out here selling,
the container, the result, the service
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:Janene: Mm-hmm.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: and.
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:I don't know if you see this with women
especially, but when we attach that
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:identity to what we're selling, it can
be a lot harder to show up for marketing.
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:It could be a lot harder to speak
about what we do because we're tying
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:it to a sense of that worth, right.
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:That identity.
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:And that was one of
the things I had to do.
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:A little bit of untethering.
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:I do understand there is in terms
of branding, right, a presentation
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:of me as the brand, but.
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:The coaching skill, right?
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:The coaching container is something
that I feel like is value in its own.
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:Am I explaining it?
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:Like
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:Janene: Yeah.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: there's
There's this, yeah.
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:There's like this
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:Janene: There is a, there
is a connection there.
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:Absolutely.
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:And I think, you know, that's where the
phrase charge your worth comes from for
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:a lot of people because we tend to...
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:the reason I don't like that phrase is
because it implies there's a connection
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:between, between your personal value
or your personal worth and what you're
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:offering or what you're charging for.
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:And I think that.
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:That is a connection that we need to, you
don't have to sever it, but we should put
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:those things in, in the right perspective.
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:'cause it's not about your
value as an individual.
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:I think that's sort of what
you're alluding to there.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yeah, there's the word
that I keep thinking about is like, we
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:have to be aware of it and observe it
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:Janene: Mm-hmm.
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:Mm-hmm.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Because if we
don't it can keep us from showing up
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:powerfully to put our business and
market our business out into the world.
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:So that was, that was definitely something
that I had to unlearn in my journey.
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:Yeah.
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:Janene: Which is an important one.
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:And a hard, it's a hard one because it's
not always happening at a conscious level.
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:I remember there was a lady years ago,
Michelle Masters, who I attended a program
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:of hers and she was talking about worth.
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:We all have issues with money,
success, and worthiness.
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:And one of the examples she gave, she
goes, okay, so if you feel you're not
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:worthy, when did you stop being worthy?
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:You were worthy when you
came into this world.
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:Is that correct?
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:And you were worry worthy a year later and
a year after that, and a year after that.
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:And at some point in time your
brain decided you weren't worthy.
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:When, when did you become unworthy?
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:And when you look at that in, in that
context, you can see that there's no
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:justifiable reason for you to think
that you're unworthy in any way.
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:And that always stuck with me
because it's some sort of construct
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:that we come up with in our, in
our own minds, through our lived
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:experiences and, and things like that.
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:But when you kind of give it the
the BS test, it doesn't pass.
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:Must,
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yeah,
that is a great exercise.
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:I love that.
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:Janene: yeah.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: when was it
that you started feeling unworthy?
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:My guess is there is a point in
there for business owners when
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:they finally let reins of like
the working for an organization,
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:there's a shift that happens, right?
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:In that aspect
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:Janene: Yeah.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: you
know, can I really do this?
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:Am I really worthy of this?
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:You know?
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:Janene: Yeah, yeah.
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:Okay.
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:I've got two more questions for you.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yeah.
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:Janene: If someone listening is Pricing in
a way that kind of works but doesn't feel
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:right, what is it you want them to know?
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:I.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Listen.
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:There's a reason that
it does not feel right.
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:And the longer.
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:That you continue down that road,
the more painful it's gonna get.
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:A hundred percent.
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:There's this principle I learned in our
coaching certification, which is, pain
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:is inevitable, but suffering is a choice.
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:And it really.
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:Tunes into, you know, we can experience
these things and if we try to shove
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:them down when they're trying to
tell us something, right, we're
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:gonna continue that painful journey.
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:And so listen, if that's coming up
for you, so that you can really get
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:to the root of why does this not
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:Janene: Yeah.
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:Glasa Gottschalk: feel aligned
and congruent with the stage of my
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:business and where I'm at right now?
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:Janene: Yeah.
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:No, I couldn't have said that better.
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:It's very true.
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:Listen, that's a great advice.
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:Where should people go if they'd like to
connect with you, find out more about you?
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:Glasa Gottschalk: Yeah.
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:I am most active on LinkedIn, so you
can find me there at glac Gotchu.
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:I would love to connect with folks there.
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:I'm also a business owner
that loves connecting with
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:people, so reach out to me.
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:I'd love to connect with you and just.
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:Learn more about you.
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:I love connecting with folks.
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:Excellent.
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:Thank you for joining me, Glasa.
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:It's a pleasure having you here
with us today, and thank you to
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:those of you who are listening.
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:If you wanna support the show,
the number one thing you can do is
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:share this episode on social media
and tag me and Glasa today's guest
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:that really helps get the word out.
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:I wish you a wonderful day,
and as always, enjoy Pricing.
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:Okay.