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What do accounting students and emerging professionals want from their careers?

In the fourth episode of this five-part series on rewriting the story of accounting, Rob Brown speaks with Alex Romero, director of CPA Pipeline at AICPA, about how the next generation views the profession and what firms can do to attract and retain future CPAs.

Romero discusses the appeal of accounting as a stable, flexible career, as well as persistent concerns about long hours, the CPA exam and the effects of AI. She also explains why firms need to communicate career paths more clearly, give emerging professionals greater visibility into advancement opportunities and create space for employees to influence how work gets done.

Learn more about INSIDE Public Accounting: https://insidepublicaccounting.com

So the thing that I would love for all the managing partners to understand is that while the pipeline is improving, we're not done with that work yet. That we still need to have students not only going into enrolling and then they need to get through to graduation, get into the career, pass their CPA. But the exciting thing and the thing that I see that I think needs to be the most understood is that our students today are really full of passion, creativity and they really have the desire to make a difference.

Welcome to the Inside Public Accounting Podcast. I'm Rob Brown, co-host of the show. And we're in a series right now. One of the biggest questions facing the accounting profession today is how we attract and develop the next generation of accountants. You all know that fan leaders are continuing to grapple with talent shortages and evolving employee and client expectations. And the growing concerns about the long-term pipeline coming into the career of the kind of thing, but how much do we really understand about what these students who young professionals are looking for? We know somebody that does. Today's guest is Alex Romero, director of CPA Pipeline at the AICPA. Alex, welcome to the show.

Hello. Thank you so much for having me here today.

It is a pleasure. Let me just educate our audience a little bit for them, Alex, to talk about your pedigree here, because I know you lead the strategy and execution for initiatives designed to strengthen the awareness, the access, the pathways into the accounting profession. And you work a lot with the educators, the state societies, the all the stakeholders, the employers, the student organizations. And your job is to promote accounting careers, build the brand of accounting, support students, CPA candidates through their journey to licensure. It sounds like a very exciting job. Is it as glamorous as it sounds?

It absolutely is. I love it. I love being able to share about the CPA profession and get students and then candidates to go through the process. So yes, it really is a wonderful position.

Well, it's great for us because you bring a unique perspective to the talent conversation. Chelsea and I have done an episode on it already and you are our second in the season, a series of four. I know you spend a lot of time talking to the people that matter, the educators, the emerging professionals, the students themselves. So you are in the conversation. You have a front row seat. We're in a sense looking at it from the outside. So you've got all the different perceptions and the misconceptions that still exist on what firms can do better to connect with future talent. We're going to be talking about what these students really think about the profession as they come into it and how firms can challenge what we've got to say are outdated stereotypes about accounting careers and what these young professionals are looking for in a workplace culture and advancement opportunities. We want to really know how they think, Alex, and you know that. So it's great to have you with us. Let's start by asking you this. You you seem very passionate about your job. What do you love about it the most?

What I love about it the most is being able to go out there and speaking to students and candidates and really bringing people to the profession. It is something that I have been passionate about for a long time. I've been in this space for a little over seven years, more on the volunteer side, but I just love being able to share my passion and bring others into this great profession and have them see all the possibilities and everything that they can do as CPA.

Yeah. Would it be fair to say I've heard this from some heads of state societies, but you'd be the definitive answer, Alex. That the accounting profession has a brand or an image problem. Would that be fair?

Say that is fair, and that's why we really were looking at it when we were doing the pipeline initiatives to really understand what that perception is and helping students and candidates out there realize that a lot of that is a stereotype, but we are working on it, and that isn't true everywhere, and there's a lot of different spaces that you can go into that aren't gonna be what maybe you've heard out there as kind of the norm in the CPA profession.

Yeah, well we're gonna bust some myths today. we know that there's lots of defining challenges and disruptors facing the accounting profession. Talent gets talked about a lot. Fan leaders don't often seem to resonate with this younger generation who are deciding on a career path. When you talk to students and CPA candidates, how do they view the accounting profession today? What kind of shape is it in in their eyes?

So I think that a lot of the students and the CPA candidates, they are thinking really positively about the profession. Part of that is that if they are already students in accounting, they have kind they kind of have already some buy-in into it. So they're not gonna look at it and think, I I don't wanna do this. I'm thinking negatively about it, because they have chosen it as what their major is gonna be. So predominantly those students and CPA candidates are looking at the profession as being positive. They also see it as something that is stable. And we are seeing that more and more with the younger generation that they are wanting to have a career that is stable. Not stable in the sense that they are locked into one spot, one location, or one area of the profession, but they see that accounting is something that has been around for a long time. And even though there's changes, we have changed with that. And even though they might see some different concerns, they hear different perceptions. They are able to see that accounting has been there tried and true through all these different seasons. And they do, they see the flexibility. So they really appreciate that, that there's a lot involved with the accounting profession. You can do industry, you can go into public accounting, nonprofits, so many different things. You can be a staff accountant all the way up to a CFO in industry all way to a partner. So there's a long-term career there that they are excited about, that there's those possibilities. One thing is, I mean, I do want to not just shed only rainbows and sunshines and loltops and everybody thinks it's wonderful. They are still concerned about the CPA exam. They've heard that it's difficult. They have questions about it. They're figuring it out. They also have heard that the profession is difficult. And I won't say it's difficult, but yes, you have to be aware you need to make sure that you understand what you're doing, really being able to apply what you're learning and really do the analysis part. And they're also afraid of those long hours. I mean, they see the memes out there, and that's why it's so important for us to be telling the compelling story so that they don't only see the negative side of, my goodness, how much am I gonna have to work to be able to move up? And I will say this, you know, we've been in the podcast for a couple minutes now, so we haven't really talked about technology yet, but that is a concern, especially since they hear a lot about AI. And the thing that we are telling a lot of our students and candidates is that yes, we know that AI is gonna be involved in the profession, but it's gonna be doing more of those routine tasks. So that's gonna allow them to be able to do more analysis, strategic insight. It's not taking their jobs away. It's just going to change maybe how they are doing it. So I think that's a big point, is that even these things that they might hear that are stereotypes or they're concerned about, that we talk about what they might really see in the profession and to not be worried about some of these things they might see in in the public or in society.

Yeah. So Alex, you you mentioned the work life balance there. That is a stereotype that is in accounting, that it it requires long hours, constant stress, sacrifice in mental health, and you talked about technology. We're trying to address those concerns, flexible scheduling, spreading more work evenly throughout the year. From what you're hearing, how much does this busy season stereotype influence students' career choices?

I think it still influences them. I don't think it's maybe as much as it has been in the past because they do see that we are trying to address this. They have heard about the spreading of work, but they also see what's out there on social media, those tax memes of people that are doing hours upon hours. They maybe turn into a skeleton at their desk during tax season. They hear about people missing out during busy season. So that's one of the big pieces that we need to think about as a profession is that if we are out there and we're talking about we're going to be spraying the work, we're looking at having more of a balance, we all need to be communicating that because it is going to influence our students into thinking, do I want to go into public accounting? What segment, if I see that they are doing long hours for tax season, even though I might have a passion for tax, is that something that I really want to do? I'm nervous about that. So it absolutely makes a difference. And so I think that really when we're looking at the pipeline, it's all of us that need to come together to not only change that within the firms, but change that story so that we aren't laughing about, yes, I know you you're working eighty hours. No, that's not what we need to be communicating. We need to be doing better to bring that balance.

There's a badge of honour aspect to this, Alex, that we've got to overcome. Particularly the the big offense, the big four, if we can put them in that box. The bill of goods sold there is that yes, you will work hard and you'll do seventy, eighty hours a week for a period of time. You'll get rich doing it, but there's a price to pay for that. And you must talk to a lot of people that don't want to pay that price.

Yes, absolutely. And that is something that we are seeing from the younger generation is that they don't want to spend the time at the office and building up their career. They're really looking at how can I do this and balance it out as I first start out. So the thing that I am kind of encouraging them and that all of us are kind of out there saying is that they do have more influence than they realize. And it makes sense to set boundaries but communicate them professionally. So when I went into public accounting, I was nervous about setting boundaries or saying, I don't really want to work that day. But somebody told me early on, they said, you know, make it clear that you don't want to work on Sundays. And I was like, Okay, is that okay? And they said, Yeah, just, you know, you need to communicate it though, and not be like, I'm not gonna work on Sundays, but be like, I would like to reserve Sundays for a day that I can be at home with my family and catch up. And so I did it professionally and I set that boundary. So I think that's part of it. You need to ensure that you are looking at what's going to work for you, but you communicate it. And you also find people in the office that also agree with you. Are there other people, allies, mentors, maybe some managers and partners that feel the same way that you can kind of work with and talk to about this so that you don't feel like you are really putting yourself out there and maybe doing something that's an unwritten rule by saying, Hey, this isn't gonna work for me. Is there a different way that we can go about getting the work done without having the long hours?

Hm. I'm just thinking even God took a day off, didn't he, after all of his work. So if God can have a day off

Right, right. We we all need a day off.

That's right. But I I like where you're going with helping these young people build their influence. We're doing a bonus episode. I wrote a book called Build Your Reputation, which is on Amazon. And it's about having this voice, having a saying things and wielding that influence and being able to impact culture and strategy. That's an important thing for these young people beyond their technical expertise, isn't it?

Yes, absolutely. That's some of the skills that they need to develop is that they need to be able to find their voice, but also do it appropriately. Not just go forward and say, I don't want to do this or I'm not doing this, but also come to the table with solutions. They are also a lot more tech savvy than a lot of people that may be in a firm for a while. So is there ideas for technology innovation that can increase efficiency that they can put forward? As a suggestion to maybe not have the longer hours. So that loops us all the way back to AI. If we're able to do stuff that's more efficient, then maybe we would need to have the long hours because we're still able to get the work done just in a shorter period of time. Yeah.

Two of the great strengths of a career in accounting, you've hinted at them here, Alex. One is the stability of it. We hear so much about redundancies and layoffs and and people finding it hard to get jobs. So that stability of being in a secure career. But the other aspect of it is it's such a gateway to so many of the different careers, isn't it? These promotion paths, the different access points to lots of other different roles, that's strengths that we've got to play on.

Yes, absolutely. And that's part of it. So many of our students and even our CPA candidates, they just don't have that awareness. And especially if we have students that haven't decided where they're gonna go to college, what their major is, we need them to be aware of all the different possibilities. They might have only heard of maybe a tax accountant, and that's just one segment. And you can even look at public accounting and how many things are there. There's more advisory, but then one of the things that we're trying to really talk about as well is that accounting is everywhere. So you can do some really cool things. I was a director of finance for a city and one of the things I was able to do was break ground for a new fire station because I helped put the package together to be able to fund that. You need accountants in fashion and sports and Hollywood. I mean, some of these really cool. Aspects in different industries that maybe students don't even think about. And it's like, yes, they need accountants and CPAs there. So I think that's one thing we really need to highlight is all the different things you can do as a CPA in all the different places. You can be anywhere across the US, especially now that we have more remote positions. You don't even have to live in a certain area, or you can work in your community. And really help businesses prosper and your neighbors prosper in your local economy as well. We know many of you listen to this podcast on the go, driving to work, working out, even doing chores.

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Yeah. Alex, you're a walking billboard for the career of accounting. You really are selling it well. And and that's great for the students that haven't stepped into a role, but there's a there's a recruitment and attraction piece, of course, bringing people into accounting, but also for the firms themselves and the young professionals that you talk to that are in firms. There perhaps is a lack of transparency within firms about career paths and development and having the hands on the steering wheel of your own career. Leaders could do that better, couldn't they, inside firms and keep them in the accounting profession.

Yes, that's one of the biggest things is that we are really concerned in my team about the attraction and then getting them started, but the retention is huge. And part of that is making it clear to those that are in the firms that there is growth and what does that growth look like? So one of the things that I always give up as a suggestion is creating those role-specific competency frameworks. So looking at what a senior manager is gonna be doing. Technically, but also the leadership skills that are needed there. And you need that to be accessible to everybody. So I say put it on your share drive so that anybody at any time can go open that up and see what is it going to take for me to be an intern now to move to a staff, then to a senior, all the way up to partner. And one of the biggest things that I have seen in firms is that there's people that are at that senior manager level. And they choose to walk away because they don't know what it means to be a partner. What's the buy-in? Sometimes people don't even understand that a lot of partnerships do require a buy-in. So we need to communicate that so that we can have our emerging professionals understand how they can grow in a firm and what is gonna be asked of them and required of them, and that we can start building those skills so that we do have these future professionals that are gonna be leading our firms.

And you bring up an excellent point, Alex. The partner path. We know that business models, operating models of firms are changing. The traditional partner path doesn't appeal to a lot of young people. They don't want to be on a career trajectory and maybe have to buy into it. But there are other ways to keep your career enriched and rewarding and financially good for you, aren't they?

Mm-hmm. Yes. And that's part of it is that some firms have non equity partners where you aren't buying into it. A lot of times people look at maybe I don't want to be a partner. I want to be a director or a principal or something else within the firm. So it's wonderful to be able to see the different options and also your earning potential in each of those. I think for a long time that was more taboo. We're not going to talk about that, but it is going to help keeping emerging professionals in if they know. If I get to this level, I I'm gonna be able to have a successful career. But they they don't they're not gonna have so many unknowns that they're gonna be able to feel like, okay, I understand what my growth path can be and this is where I wanna end up and how do I get there.

Yeah. One of the criticisms, if we can call it that, about the CPA licensure, the educational paths, is that they're not fit for purpose. And this is not just the US. In the UK we may have the chartered accounting qualification or the chartered management accounting. And it's how we're equipping these young people for jobs in today's firms. Sometimes you hear leaders say that that the people coming in now, these grads have a different mix of skills than they did five, ten years ago, and they're not doing all the things we want them to do. From your perspective, are these accounting programs evolving enough to better align with the realities of work today in an accounting firm?

Yes, I think they are. I think that they are trying to incorporate more technology and soft skills into the assignments and the classrooms. And one of the things I think is really great in this area is that what we're seeing is educators are reaching out to firms, to the AI CPA and asking what is a student needing to be successful on day one in a position. So they are aware that maybe they're not getting all the skills that they need to be able to be a successful employee. They're learning about concepts and different types of accounting. They're learning about all the different types of depreciation and all these different things, but it's really looking at what is going to be used and needed when they get out there and they are trying to get their first position. So that is, I think, a huge step that we are seeing that engagement going both ways where educators are asking. And also the profession is asking what what's happening in this education space? How can we better align and give you resources so that you are taking care of making sure that they know the academic side, the technical side, but all the other pieces as well.

Yeah, that's beautifully put. Now you talked about AI and technology. We can't escape it. It is changing the game. Are fans expecting grads to come into roles being AI ready, or is that something they learn on the job, Alex? Where do you sit on that?

Think a little bit of both. So students are using it, but not as much in schools because the thing is when you're a student, you're not allowed to use it. They're checking for that. They want to make sure. And I think we even saw in this graduation season in the spring, a lot of students are not really on board with AI right now because they don't want them to take over their positions. They want to see people that are in the profession of writing and thinks that we are paying for those services and we're not using AI to do that. So I think they do have an understanding, they know how to use it, but really it's when they come into their position and they see, okay, how am I going to use it? It's not so it's replacing the work, but I can tell the AI system, can you go through all these invoices and be able to pull those ones out that are unique that were done maybe outside of business hours? And so that makes it so much easier instead of somebody going through and manually doing that. So I think that it's really gonna be a lot of learning on the job. AI can do a lot, but what do we want it to do within our specific firm and how are we going to handle that technology? Yeah.

Is it fair to say the leaders, firm owners, managing partners, the hiring people don't necessarily understand fully what these young people want?

Yes and no. I I feel like they are a lot more in tune to that than maybe even ten years ago. They are thinking about the pipeline because that has been more of a concern now is how are we attracting people. So I think they are trying. They maybe not know all the aspects. And of course the thing is with students and younger people, they have changes in what they like and what they appreciate. Fairly quickly. So it's hard to stay on top of that. But I think again, just as I said with the educators, the fact that the profession is asking and wanting to understand what is important to our younger generations, those entering the profession. And understanding that, as you said, that they might not want to get to that partner stage. They want to have flexibility so that they can try different things out and really being able to adapt to that. And really bringing in the professionals that are gonna be leading the firms in the future with that expectation, okay, what is it that you wanna see? How do you want your career to be? What is it that you like in the firms? What is something that you wanna maybe change? All those different kinds of conversations so that we are really embracing the new ideas that are coming in.

Yeah. If I could have a magic wand, Alex, and and give you carte blanche over the whole accounting profession. So you had access to every managing partner, every leader, every owner, every person of influence in the accounting world, what would you want to change or have them know about this these new people coming through?

So the thing that I would love for all the managing partners to understand is that while the pipeline is improving, we're not done with that work yet. That we still need to have students not only going into enrolling and then they need to get through to graduation, get into the career, pass their CPA. But the exciting thing and the thing that I see that I think needs to be the most understood is that our students today are really full of passion, creativity, and they really have the desire to make a difference. So the thing that I would love for all the managing partners to understand is that while the pipeline is improving, we're not done with that work yet. That we still need to have students not only going into enrolling and then they need to get through to graduation, get into the career, pass their CPA. But the exciting thing and the thing that I see that I think needs to be the most understood is that our students today are really full of passion, creativity, and they really have the desire to make a difference. So we really need to just communicate with them all the opportunities that are available to them, what those career paths and advancements are gonna be, and that they are gonna be able to have meaningful careers that are full of impact for different organizations, businesses, their communities, and that they're gonna be able to succeed as a CPA.

Yeah. Well, Alex Romero, I've got one more question to ask you in a moment, but as director of the CPA pipeline at the AI C P I it's great having you on as such a a wonderful ambassador for the brand of accounting. It's much needed. One of the themes that stood out for me today is that these families think they know the next generation, but there's things that they don't know and the game is still on. The pipeline is not done yet. It's not a done deal. And students, for their part, they're seeing accounting as a an opportunity rich profession. They're seeing it as stable, but they're looking for transparency, flexibility, a clear understanding of how they can build their own careers. For the firm leaders, your your message is clear, Alex. They need to strengthen the pipeline by not just attracting more students, but creating workplaces where these professionals inside and coming in see these opportunities for growth, development, long term success. They have a voice, they're part of something meaningful, and there's a lot of different ways they can go. So I want to ask you this just in closing. Alex, what excites you most about the next few years in the accounting world?

What excites me the most is all the possibilities out there. So I think as we are incorporating technology, it is going to allow us to just do more value and give more back to our society, to our clients, and to our organizations and customers. And I also see our younger generation coming in and really taking ownership of their careers and bringing in their insights and some of what they have seen and learned in. Their college years and into taking the exams. So I think there's just a world of possibilities. And I think this is a great time to be involved with accounting. It is a point where we can really see a change of doing more of those routine tasks to really being able to do deeper analysis and really giving insight and value to the society as a whole.

Sold. Where do I sign up? I want to become an accountant right now. That's tremendous. Thank you so much, Alex. That's been wonderful today. We really appreciate your passion and your insights.

Yes. Thank you so much for having me.

And to our wonderful audience, if you'd like to learn more about the AI CPA's work on the CPA pipeline and talent development initiatives, we'll include those resources in the show notes. To you all, thank you so much for joining us for another episode of the Inside Public Accounting Podcast. Next episode, Chelsea and I are going to be talking about the cultural shift that's already happening inside accounting firms to tell a better story about how great accounting is. We'll see you all next time.