Money can be one of the biggest reasons we stay in work that no longer fits. But how much of that is financial reality — and how much is financial fear?

In this conversation, Lucia Knight talks with Barney Whiter, The Escape Artist, about the beliefs and anxieties that can make staying put feel safer than making a change.

Barney explains why status, lifestyle expectations, debt and financial uncertainty can contribute to a “freeze” response — and why getting clear on your actual financial position can help you make better decisions about what comes next.

You’ll hear:

• Why financial anxiety can keep you stuck at work
• How status and lifestyle expectations influence career decisions
• Why knowing your numbers matters before making a career change
• The three financial numbers Barney recommends getting clear on: your emergency fund, accessible net worth and spending
• How those numbers can help you understand the runway you actually have

Ready to understand what could make work feel better for you?

Take the Joy at Work Quiz to discover your Joy Readiness Score, your easiest quick win and the biggest blind spot that may be keeping you stuck.

https://lucia-trqb5gnw.scoreapp.com

Learn more about Barney Whiter and The Escape Artist:

https://theescapeartist.me/about/

https://theescapeartist1.substack.com/

Barney Whiter - The Escape Artist: That is what's happening when people

are stuck in jobs often, not always, but often they are stuck where they are

from a essentially a biological freeze response triggered by financial anxiety.

Lucia Knight - CEO Midlife Unstuck: This is the second conversation

I had with Barney Whiter.

Barney is one of the most knowledgeable people I know who speaks with such

authority, knowledge, and experience.

I think you're gonna enjoy this.

Let's dive in

What financial beliefs do you see holding people back from making

work-life changes in and around our age at this halfway point of our lives?

Barney Whiter - The Escape Artist: What we've just been talking about is

the most obvious one, which is status.

It is ego.

It is the desire to conform.

It is the desire to fit in with your tribe.

And there's that classic phrase in self-help, You're the average of the

five people you spend most time with."

Who does a lawyer spend most time with?

Other lawyers.

Not their family.

Lucia Knight - CEO Midlife Unstuck: Yeah

Barney Whiter - The Escape Artist: They spend most time with the other lawyers.

And so, that desire to conform is so powerful.

It's so powerful.

The social element is real.

I need to stay in this job to earn this much money to send my

children to these schools or to have this house or have these things.

So that would be the first one.

I think the next biggest one is fear.

Lucia Knight - CEO Midlife Unstuck: Yeah.

Barney Whiter - The Escape Artist: The fear of change, the fear of

uncertainty just financial anxiety.

I see a lot of people that have financial anxiety hardwired into them.

I'm one of those people, by the way.

'cause my parents, when I was 11, They bought the biggest house they

could, borrowed the most money, and in 1981, interest rates went to 17%.

And so ever since then, I've had a horror of debt.

And debt ensnares, debt traps you, debt keeps you chained to your current job

because all change has some element of risk, and all change has some element

of I'm gonna have to, be brave and take somewhat of a leap in the dark here.

And if you have any financial anxiety that fear will keep you, stuck where you are.

The final thing I would add there is that, is the concept of like scarcity

mindset versus abundance mindset.

So when we are worried about resources, the ability to buy food, shelter, water

these are the most basic of requisites.

And so when that is threatened, either actually or in your perception,

you're triggering the lizard brain.

And when the lizard senses scarcity, it goes into fight or flight

Lucia Knight - CEO Midlife Unstuck: Yeah.

And, so therefore all of those beliefs mean that we feel that it's safer to

stay put than to go out behind the hedge because we don't know what's out there.

We need the water, we need the safety, we stay stuck.

Yeah

Barney Whiter - The Escape Artist: Exactly that.

And it's actually even just to double-click on that point,

people talk about fight or flight.

The correct phrase if you actually look at nature is freeze, fight or flight.

So the most common response in nature to, if you're a rabbit and you sense there's

a fox over there, is you just freeze.

Because movement gives your position away.

Movement attracts the predator.

So a rabbit is more likely just to freeze, hence rabbit in the headlights

than it is to run away or fight the fox.

And so That is what's happening where when people are stuck in

jobs often, not always, but often they are stuck where they are from

a essentially a biological freeze response triggered by financial anxiety.

Lucia Knight - CEO Midlife Unstuck: If someone is listening and

everything you've said absolutely

resonates, what could they do practically this week to position themselves

better so that they can, either soon or in the future, they can achieve

their new work dreams or life dreams?

Barney Whiter - The Escape Artist: So practically, the thing that

they can do, I would summarize it as stop being an ostrich.

So what does an ostrich do?

Os- the ostrich buries its head in the sand, and that is comforting

to the ostrich on some level.

That's the worst thing you can do.

The best thing you can do is stop being an ostrich and examine your situation.

Know your numbers, know your position, know where you are, because if you

haven't got that basic information, then how can you make informed

decisions on your ability to make a career change that involves some risk,

some uncertainty, maybe some time out of the market, some retraining?

And so I just think you have to know your numbers

Lucia Knight - CEO Midlife Unstuck: Okay, can I ask you something about numbers?

Can you give a list of, let's say, three to five numbers that they

could go off this week and nail down

Barney Whiter - The Escape Artist: One, your emergency fund

So that's have you got whatever, three months, six months cash in

a bank account that says break glass in case of emergency on it?

So know your emergency fund, and then broader than that is know your

accessible financial net worth.

Let's say you've got a million pound net worth, b-but that's

mostly the family house and money in a pension, and you're 40.

Hmm, Doesn't really help.

So what you're interested in is not total net worth, it's actually

financially accessible net worth.

So that's your emergency fund plus perhaps, your stocks and shares ISAs,

plus your, your gold coins, plus your buy-to-let rental property or whatever

it is, or whatever assets you might be able to lay your hands on and

convert into cash and liquidity and something that can fund your runway.

Point one, know your emergency fund.

Point two, know your accessible net worth.

Point three, you can't know your runway.

Unless you know your spending.

So you have to know what your burn rate is.

I do financial coaching and no one wants to like do the really boring,

mundane work of, "Oh, let's download my last three bank statements

and examine where did it all go?

That you need to do to know your burn rate, and you need to know

your burn rate to know your runway

Lucia Knight - CEO Midlife Unstuck: And all of that could be done

this week if you prioritized it.

Yeah?

Barney Whiter - The Escape Artist: Yes

Lucia Knight - CEO Midlife Unstuck: Brilliant.

When you're ready for more, take the Boost Your Joy at Work Quiz.

I built it for experienced people who know that more joy at work is possible,

but they're just not sure where to start.

This is where to start.

You'll discover your joy readiness score, your easiest quick win, and

your biggest blind spot so that you can start moving immediately towards

work that you might want to do forever.

except I've got one more question for you

I'm really interested in what joy at work for Barney Whiter looks like,

sounds like, feels like, smells like.

Barney Whiter - The Escape Artist: For me it is the ability to be self-employed.

For me it is the ability to be master of your own They do say the problem

with being self-employed is that the boss is an idiot, but I would rather

take my own idiocy than someone else's.

Lucia Knight - CEO Midlife Unstuck: Okay.

So that freedom, that autonomy is super important to your sense of joyful work

Barney Whiter - The Escape Artist: So my schedule, I just I

like living an off-peak life.

So I like to go to the gym when it's not rammed.

I like to go to the body pump class at 9:30 rather than 6:30 in the morning.

I like to be master of my own diary as well as master of my own destiny.

And that's not an easy place to get to.

It takes years of either saving or carving out career capital where you

earn the right and the black book and the contact and the reputation

to be able to survive outside of the, the sort of institutionalized world.

But for me your mileage may vary, but for me, that is the benefit.

That is what I want to achieve from joy at work.

It's the personal connection.

It's the personal connection with the clients.

It's the, the meaning that comes from you are on your own golden path.

You have all the meaning and the purpose in the world.