Gabriella Angeleti is a writer for the Art Newspaper. When the Utah Monolith story broke, she was one of the early reporters on the story as it went viral. She shares her insight on which artists may have been responsible for the monolith and its place in Utah's larger land art movement.

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Gabriella Angeleti - The Art Newspaper

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Sergey Cheremisinov

[00:00:03] Gabriella Angeleti: My name is Gabriella Angeleti and I'm a staff writer for The Art Newspaper, and I'm based in New York.

[00:00:21] Gabriella: Well, I have a personal connection to Utah because I primarily grew up in the southwest. I still spend a lot of time in Utah. I heard about the monolith while I was camped out there in a cabin during the pandemic. I think I just thought it was really interesting, and the perfect story close out a pretty bleak year. I heard initially about it from a pretty brief local news piece about how the Utah division of wildlife discovered this structure, when they rode past it on a helicopter. The location was undisclosed at that time, but it was later revealed to be a Needles District in Canyonlands National Park.

That piqued my interest because I go hiking in Canyonlands a lot. It's a really massive remote place. It would be really easy for someone to just leave something there, and it go unnoticed for several years like this did. I spoke to my editor about it. We were one of the first non-local publications to report on it. At least one of the first ones to, I think, contextualize it from an art standpoint. Then that same week, things escalated really quickly and the monolith was just everywhere.

[00:01:41] Gabriella: No, I never went there myself and it actually was taken down before I ever even had a chance to drive out there.

[00:01:51] Gabriella: Definitely, yes. I think speaking of driving out there, one important thing to know about this story is that, it really stems from the subreddit that was formed to find the monolith. There was a user called Bear Fucker, who posted the coordinates of the monolith online. Then that post just prompted thousands of people to go out there and take selfies and destroy the landscape and piss off all the locals and all that. Shame on you, Bear Fucker for posting the coordinates.

[00:02:27] Gabriella: I want to believe that there's no way that he could have known what his actions would lead to, and that it would blow up like this.

[00:03:09] Gabriella: Sure. The Utah monolith was a freestanding sheet metal structure that was discovered in December last year. It was around 10 to 12 feet tall, and it was installed on the sandstone floor in a remote cove in Canyonlands. According to Reddit investigators who use Google Earth view, it was installed sometime between August 2015 and October 2016.

[00:03:46] Gabriella: I guess it just appeared during that time out of nowhere. It was fairly recently [crosstalk]

[00:03:55] Gabriella: Yes. It's just pretty recently. It's interesting that no one was ever able to find out who did it.

[00:04:20] Gabriella: No, it's definitely pretty unusual. Canyonlands is just a colossal place. It's one of the most beautiful places in the world but it's actually one of the most remote national parks that there are. Until not too long ago, I think they were only issuing-- You have to fact check this but they issue a really limited number of camping tickets out there. It's for outdoorsy people. It's really not a major national park, like a more popular national park like arches or something. There's no facilities or any artwork there or really anything around it.

[00:05:40] Gabriella: There were people off roading and leaving trash there and just generally being obnoxious about the monolith on Instagram and on social media. Eventually, it just got dismantled by a group of these outdoorsy types, who as a form of protest against all the hundreds of cars that were coming to the site and damaging the landscape. It's interesting to note that the town that leads into Canyonlands, Moab survives on tourism but it's really been negatively impacted by tourists. There's people causing damage to petroglyphs, that's constantly on the news.

Just people really being trashy and not really respecting the landscape, which I think is what happened with the monolith.

[00:06:33] Gabriella: Yes. For my piece I Interviewed the photographer, who saw the group who took down the monolith, and he didn't stop them because he told me he had this overwhelming moment of guilt that he himself was being out there and causing this problem and didn't fit into his whole philosophy as an outdoor photographer.

[00:07:15] Gabriella: No, not that I know of. There were a few artists who came out and then tripping early joked and they take credit for it, but nothing was ever confirmed.

[00:07:38] Gabriella: Yes. There were hundreds of other monoliths that popped up all around the world right after that, all over Europe. Some are found in really remote field. One popped up on Fremont Street in Las Vegas. It was really just all over the place. We initially did run a few stories, following up on some of the monolith that first appeared. Then we actually had to stop keeping track and the whole thing died down.

[00:08:23] Gabriella: It's hard to say because the monolith, it was a pretty rudimentary structure. It would be really easy to build similar versions of it with sheet metal or any other similar material.

[00:08:52] Gabriella: I think, most of them are removed. A lot of them were on public property. A lot of them are just called jokes. The list is really, really extensive. I would be surprised if there are any standing right now.

[00:09:41] Gabriella: I have 100% believe that it could have been aliens.

[00:09:52] Gabriella: I think that just added to people's fascination with this. There's something really mysterious about the structure appearing out of nowhere and no one being able to claim it.

[00:10:30] Gabriella: Oh, yes, definitely because it does look like those monoliths and maybe it was part of a music video or a film shoot, who knows?

[00:10:54] Gabriella: Oh, really? No, I hadn't heard about that.

[00:11:23] Gabriella: Oh, interesting. Yes, I hadn't heard that theory but it could make sense. I guess definitely the monolith was illegal because it was installed on public land. It would be difficult to imagine that a major film would do that.

[00:12:12] Gabriella: Yes. John McCracken was a minimalist American artist. He spent a big part of his life living out in the West. In the mid 1960s, he started making these free standing French sculptures, sort of resembled the monolith structurally but they don't have the same luster as his work. His works had a really reflective surface. He made these sculptures from really finely polished stainless steel. Sometimes they're made from wood coated with fiberglass and resin to achieve that really reflective surface.

[00:13:22] Gabriella: Definitely. I spoke with Almine Rech, who's represented him, who's represented John McCracken since 1990s. She told me that, first of all, he would never put bolts on any of his sculptures, that the sculpture was very crudely built, and that actually she didn't even believe that it was art. That McCracken was always very attentive to this reflective element of his work. She said something interesting that he had this very poetic idea that the work would reflect the changes in the world for decades and centuries to come. She completely after our first article came out when David Zwirner, who also deals in his work told us that, that it wasn't.

Then he told The New York Times that he was divided on whether it was or wasn't, but he did believe that it was John McCracken's work. Almine reached out to me actually to completely rolled out that idea. I can see why the comparison was made and why maybe people believe that it could be because he worked, he lived in Santa Fe, Las Vegas, Reno. He was in that part of the world.

[00:15:12] Interviewer: No, keep going. I'd love to hear what you have to say.

[00:15:29] Interviewer: Why did they shut down those theories?

[00:15:49] Interviewer: Right. It seems like, what you're saying is a lot of the art world maybe has shunned the piece a little bit. Why do you think that is? You just said that somebody didn't even think it was art at all. Do you share that same view?

[00:16:37] Interviewer: That's great. I want to kind of circle back on-- If you could actually give me a second, my dog is whining to be let out right now. Give me one sec. I'm back. Sorry about that. Anyways, where was I? Yes. In terms of John McCracken, you said that he was a minimalist artist, as well as the other artists that you mentioned. What is minimalism when it comes to art? If you could explain that movement a little bit?

[00:18:12] Interviewer: Is there any common traits between the artists that would make it distinctly minimalist? It's funny because I think that the name of minimalism, it's just very interesting because it seems like, it's very based out of simplicity and more taking things away. Would that be a good way to characterize it?

[00:18:55] Interviewer: I like that a lot. I really like that. With John McCracken, also you spoke about-- you just mentioned a little bit how he wanted to break out into other areas. Do you have any insight on his views on extraterrestrials or other dimensions?

[00:20:03] Interviewer: Do you know how he claims to have traveled to all these places?

[00:20:12] Interviewer: Yes, I'm sure. Moving on, do you have any other thoughts on John McCracken, before I move on to somebody else?

[00:20:25] Interviewer: Yes, great. The next person I wanted to talk to who's mentioned in your article is William Fox, and why do people think he was involved with the monolith?

In his book that I really recommend, it's called The Void, The Grid & The Sign, he shares some really interesting anecdotes about how Michael Heizer's work, City, which is a massive series of complexes in the Nevada desert that Heizer has been building since the 1970s. Heizer's work actually also attracted a lot of UFO enthusiasts and people who believe that extraterrestrials were working through Michael Heizer to create the sculpture in the desert.

He also talks about how it's curious that the desert does seem to allow people to feel closer to the cosmos in a way and that things like petroglyphs and different earthworks tends to create a conflation between the ancient and the alien, the desert can really expand people's imaginations and attracts UFO watchers, definitely, and maybe some people believe that attracts the aliens themselves.

[00:22:29] Gabriella: Yes.

[00:22:52] Gabriella: Yes, Utah is just a really inspiring, beautiful vast place. It's very alien-like in some places. There's a Martian landscape in some corners of it. Also, the land is cheap, which is why a lot of land artists created work out there, and then the surrounding area in Nevada. Yes, I think that Utah and that whole area of the world, in general, really influential to some of the most interesting people and eccentrics in history. Everyone from Edward Abbey to Michael Heizer, even people like Art Bell, who actually your podcasts really reminds me of.

[00:23:49] Gabriella: Oh, sure. In the '80s or late '70s, he did a paranormal radio show where he would interview people who claim to have seen UFOs and other centric, out of the norm things and he actually, he did this out of Pahrump, in Nevada, so he's another desert person.

[00:24:41] Gabriella: Definitely.

[00:24:49] Gabriella: Yes, long story short, my family has a cabin out there and when the pandemic hit in New York and at the end of March, I just went out there and stayed out there. I just didn't know what the city was going to be like, and so I spent a lot of months last year, getting real close and personal with Utah in a way I hadn't before. It was really interesting to write this story at the end of that year because I had spent most of the pandemic isolated in this cabin, and then something from Utah came out of it, it was a strange synchronicity there.

[00:25:59] Gabriella: Yes. There was one time where I was sitting in the cabin, and you would see this strange light sign overhead all the time. People say it's from the military planes or something like that, but Utah is a very, very creepy place. There's the Mormon aspect of it, which is really interesting. It has a really deep history. I think that, especially if you're sitting in a cabin for five months, losing their mind like I did [laughs] maybe more like six or seven months, then, yes, you're likely to be more perceptive to the strange happenings around you.

[00:26:59] Gabriella: Yes, it really is.

[00:27:29] Gabriella: Yes, so I wasn't actually aware of Matty Mo but I did my research, he is a digital artist, painter, and now is getting into the NFT game, like a lot of people. Yes, he's really on the periphery-

[00:27:49] Gabriella: -of this blue-chip art world. I think he was smart to try to get some type of recognition for it and for taking credit for the monolith. I saw he was even interviewed by Heidi Zuckerman, who's the former director of the Aspen Art Museum, so yes. I think it worked out in his favor. [laughs]

[00:28:15] Gabriella: I think it's more likely that the monolith was made by aliens, than it was made by Matty Mo.

[laughter]

[00:28:50] Gabriella: I guess, notoriety, the 15 minutes of fame, and money probably, attention to his work, definitely.

[00:29:25] Gabriella: No, there's definitely no artistic merit, but I think that as the working artists if someone is willing to pay you $45,000 for your work, then God bless. It's interesting what people are actually willing to buy in a moment of meme frenzy like the monolith became. I can see someone buying it as an inside joke, something to put in your house to amuse your friends and whatnot.

[00:30:29] Gabriella: No, that's a good analysis. Yes, there's definitely something very Andy Warhol-ish about it. If Andy Warhol was alive, he would definitely be making monolith silkscreens.

[laughter]

[00:31:08] Gabriella: Yes, I think it's just going to remain a mystery, the comparisons to John McCracken, or Richard Serra, Donald Judd, et cetera. I just think these artists, their work was so well-documented throughout their whole careers such that I think it would be really unlikely for something to surface, especially from a big-name artist.

[00:31:48] Gabriella: Yes, it definitely does resemble a work by John McCracken. David Zwirner had really similar plans installed in his gallery in Chelsea. I'm not sure if it's still up there. It was really, really similar. I remember he joked at the time that the portal to the Utah monolith was at his Chelsea gallery in the lobby.

[00:33:06] Gabriella: Yes, it is really interesting. I think that if that was his ultimate goal, then he achieved it and it would be actually less interesting to find out that he did it.

[00:33:42] Gabriella: I think that we were just still in the thick of the pandemic and it was a great fun distraction. The Reddit buzz around it also propelled things a little bit. I think anything that forces people to think about aliens, or the unknown gives them some existential questions that I'm sure we all had at the end of last year, would really become popular and take off the way it did.

It was interesting, honestly, because people were having really strong reactions to the monolith. It made them curious and it made them angry in a funny way, as all viral things do. Maybe another aspect that of it was that it was installed in this beautiful Red Cove in Canyonlands, so the pictures are really strong. I can definitely see why people went out there in droves and wanted a photograph it and be a part of this. It was really a global thing. We were all experiencing the monolith together after a year of being very divided.

[00:35:31] Gabriella: Yes, definitely. I think that we were all just really hungry for something that didn't relate to Coronavirus, didn't relate to death, didn't relate to very heavy issues around social justice. I think we all needed something to melt our brains a little bit. [chuckles]

[00:36:05] Gabriella: Same.

[00:36:28] Gabriella: I think, social media has really influenced how we engage with art. For example, I noticed several examples of people who don't work in the art world, or have any art background, but they've managed to really carve out a space for themselves online as authorities on art, just by virtue of being an influencer and being mega popular. It's interesting, that can sometimes feel a little bit empty and the monolith became a unique example of that.

For a moment, it captured people's imagination, people in the art world and people who couldn't care less about art. Then as it became the social media frenzy, it became less interesting. I think, social media really has the power to steal an artwork. You see that list, Yayoi Kusama’s Infinity Rooms, which are essentially selfie chambers. They don't feel like a pure art experience in a way. It's something actually that William Fox mentioned when we spoke, that this monolith started out as a pure gesture by the artist or whoever did it. Then it was discovered and then it just became something that it was never meant to be. Then it wasn't so good anymore.

People gather to these spots to literally take pictures. This is just speaking from LA, you see things like the Museum of Ice Cream. There was a Museum of Selfies. All of these things that are built literally to be consumed, not so much in-person, but on social media. I know that you said that it dulls the effect, but conversely, do you think that there's something nice about-- Maybe this is playing 100% devil's advocate, because I actually tend to agree with you.

That there is something more freeing that people are able to view some of these pieces in more-- What am I trying to get at? It's a little more democratized now. Then having to go to a gallery and experience it in person. Do you think that the marketization takes away from the art? Because some art, you can't get the full experience without being there. Where do you land on that?

Because you look at other amazing art experiences like the Rothko Chapel. It doesn't have the same-- Teenagers aren't flocking to the Rothko Chapel to [chuckles] take selfies. I think things like these are a great way to sell tickets, and I'm all for people experiencing art however they choose to.

[00:41:39] Gabriella: Maybe saying that it dulls the artwork is just me being an art world elitist a little bit too. [laughs]

[00:42:36] Gabriella: Definitely. I guess going back to the selfie aspect of these experiences, that's what happened with the monolith, whether it was art or not, it became a centerpiece for Instagram photos. It's interesting how-

[00:42:59] Gabriella: -how as humans, we're just compelled to do that. [chuckles]

[00:43:47] Gabriella: That's interesting because I'm totally guilty of living on my phone too, but I definitely don't want to sound like a person going, "Oh, those damn kids with their cell phones."

[laughter]

[00:44:47] Interviewer: Oh, yes. I would have loved a picture with the monolith.

[00:44:51] Interviewer: [laughs] I would have definitely got a picture with the monolith. Like I said, Brett the pilot, sent me all of his pictures and videos from that day of then discovering the monolith. There's something that's very fun and innocent about hearing these guys discover when they actually discovered it and the fun that they were having just exploring it in person. Even his first reaction is to pull out his phone and start recording and taking pictures.

[00:46:08] Interviewer: That's horrible to think about, but probably not what happened either before, because it does come down-- I think there is a video that exists of the monolith coming down. It comes down pretty easy. You're correct. I know that the reason that it was torn down was because of environmental reasons. What are your feelings of land art and its impact on the environment? Is it positive to have the land art there or is it negative?

[00:48:05] Interviewer: Interesting. Great. I think we've really covered everything. Do you have any last thoughts on the monolith at all or aliens or anything?

[laughter]

[00:49:14] Gabriella: Definitely. I hope that as part of these alien files that the government is releasing, that there's some monolith content in there.

[00:49:37] Gabriella: Sure.

[00:49:50] Gabriella: Yes. I do think it's art. Like William Fox said, I think it was a pure gesture that no one wanted to claim credit for. It was just done for the sake of it.

[00:50:44] Gabriella: No, I don't have anything in particular to plug, but also let me know if you need to re-record any of that because I struggle with saying, like and um, too much.

[00:51:15] Gabriella: Thank you so much. This was really fun.

[00:51:36] Gabriella: Awesome. Thank you. Speak soon. You too. Bye.