Building Relationships in Coaching and Authentic Marketing Techniques

In this episode, John and Angie delve into effective and authentic methods for bringing new clients into your coaching world.

They emphasize relationship marketing over traditional hard-sell techniques.

The conversation covers the importance of warm and cold leads, the pitfalls of spammy marketing, the value of building trust, and strategies to maintain authentic connections with potential clients.

They also discuss the role of podcasts and referrals in client acquisition.

John and Angie agree that while building relationships is paramount, the approach and communication strategy should align with one's true self for genuine client engagement.

Do you have something to say on this topic or questions we didn't cover? Leave us a voicemail. It's free to do and if we like it we might feature you on the show. Go to https://speakpipe.com/thecoachingclinicpodcast and we look forward to hearing from you.

keywords

coaching business, building relationships, curated professional image, selling the outcome, authenticity, relatability, referrals, believing in yourself

takeaways

• Building relationships and creating a curated professional image are key to bringing new clients into your coaching business.
• Sell the desired outcome to clients and focus on being authentic and relatable.
• Referrals are a powerful way to bring in new clients, so ask for them in the right way.
• Believe in yourself and your ability to help others, and communicate that belief to potential clients.
• Stay tuned for a big surprise that John and Angie have in the works!

titles

• The Power of Referrals
• A Big Surprise in the Works

Sound Bites

• "I grab my lasso, I jump on my horse and I go wrangle me some clients."
• "The most important thing you can do is to focus on building the relationship."
• "Sell the destination and not the flight."

00:00 Introduction and Unusual Client Acquisition Methods

01:49 The Importance of Relationship Building in Business

02:44 Differentiating Between Cold and Warm Leads

03:46 Creating Valuable Content and Avoiding the Content Treadmill

04:27 The Role of Authenticity and Vulnerability in Marketing

04:46 The Power of Person-to-Person Marketing

09:13 Selling the Destination, Not the Flight

13:27 The Challenges of Maintaining Client Relationships

14:42 The Impact of Podcasting and Guest Appearances

16:22 Navigating the Digital Age of Marketing

30:26 The Importance of Referrals and Recommendations

35:18 Conclusion and Upcoming Surprises

John?

2

John: Angie.

3

Angie: How do you bring new

clients into your world?

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John: I'm glad you asked me that, Angie.

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My methods are unusual but effective.

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I grab my lasso, I jump on my horse,

and I go wrangle me some clients

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.

Angie: Metaphorically, you mean.

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John: No, literally, Angie.

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Angie: Oh, but you don't

have a horse in Spain.

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John: Oh, well, I don't love

this negativity from you.

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I will not be stopped by minor details.

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Angie: Can you even ride a horse?

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John: Minor details, Angie.

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Let's start the show.

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Angie: That's hilarious.

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And I love the visual of like, Hey,

we're just going to go out there and,

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hop on our horses and just start,

dragging people into our business.

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Oh, look, if you could see him right

now, he's doing the whole lasso movement.

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Oh my gosh.

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Hilarious.

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But obviously we're poking fun, right?

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That just simply doesn't work.

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John: No, no, I haven't actually

tried that but I can imagine

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the results would be very poor.

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Very poor, indeed.

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Angie: I don't think you look

good in orange, but I would

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happily bring you a pie.

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John: it would be, it would be a very

bad return on investment, I fear.

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So I think there are better ways

to bring people into your world.

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And that's what we're going

to discuss on our show today.

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So let's get into that, Angie, in

terms of your coaching business, how

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do you bring people into your world?

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Angie: I'm going to say this because

I know that, people listen to

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things like this and they're looking

for that one specific, like this

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is the magic pill or something.

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And that's not how I do it.

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There's multitudes of ways that I do it.

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So it's people I know, anybody who

knows my name and then there's the

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people that don't know my name yet.

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So I automatically start right there.

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I differentiate between the two

because when you say my world

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my professional world yeah.

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So there's two different

paths that I focus on.

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Initially.

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John: So is that like the

difference between cold and

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warm leads or prospects for you?

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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I

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Angie: It is.

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Absolutely.

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It is.

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I think that, there's such a focus now.

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Things have changed so much since, the

beginning of time when I got into coaching

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and training and all the things cause

it was so long ago and it was very much

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like almost knocking on doors, showing up

and keep showing up and maybe an email.

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But now, gosh, it's just so much easier.

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But we don't want to take advantage and we

don't want to be super spammy and all the

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things So you have to really be careful.

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So the warm leads Anybody who knows

my name, and there's degrees of that.

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And then there's the cold, which is,

hey, you don't even know who I am

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yet, but allow me to introduce myself.

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John: feel that these days, especially,

it's far more important than ever to

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create that relationship with people if

you don't, if you don't already have it.

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And if you do have it to maintain that as

well so often we'll hear people talking

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about relationship marketing and as

a coach and as a speaker, I feel that

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those are some of the best ways for.

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Me to be bringing people into my world and

to what I talk about certainly creating

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valuable content for people is good,

but if we lean too much into that, we're

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always having to come up with something.

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We end up on this content treadmill.

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And I don't think it's really

the only way to be doing it.

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We do actually want to

build relationships.

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So it's not always like

everything has to be high value.

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Everything has to be teaching something.

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Sometimes we just need to be sharing us,

maybe even just a little vulnerability

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that I've never liked the idea of the

sort of unassailable gurus at the top of

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the ladder who have it all figured out

and have all the answers, and there's

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still some of that around in the personal

and professional development world.

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Angie: there?

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John: buy it.

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There may, maybe was a time very early

on when I was very naive that I did, but

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now I don't, now I really feel the need

to, that for there to be some kind of

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relationship there I would never have

gotten into working with someone like

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Chris Ducker, who's been a great business

mentor for me had Chris not worked to

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establish relationships with people and do

what he calls person to person marketing.

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It was in conversation with him

that I started to come into his

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world and recognize that he has

something valuable to offer.

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And it was that it was a weird

thing that I thought I was

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chatting to a bot for a while.

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And then, and then we actually,

then we actually jumped on a

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call together and I was like, all

right, I wasn't chatting to a bot.

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I was chatting with him because I thought

I'm going to get onto a call and it's

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going to be someone who works for him.

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And it wasn't, it was the man himself.

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I like that approach to

my marketing as well.

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If I'm bringing people into my world

who aren't already aware of me or

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connected in some way, I want to very

much create a relationship with them.

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Angie: Yeah.

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I think that's the key.

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What I mentioned is my baseline, right?

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I have two different arenas, two

different paths that I follow, right?

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Systems in place for each of those.

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But my systems have changed because even

though we're part of this digital age

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where we have so much access to people

you and a billion other people so it is

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so hear me now anybody listening hear me

now the most important thing you can do is

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to focus on building the relationship and

not say okay good I sent out 20 emails.

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And, it's just enough so that I

don't get stuck in spam and it's,

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I'm hoping they're going to hear

and people can smell it a mile away.

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So I know that there are people

who will say to me, well, isn't

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that the whole point of being

able to cast that wider net?

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And to some degree, yes, it is easier

because we do have more access to people.

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But, like it or not, and I don't care

what generation they're from, people want

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to build a relationship of trust, right?

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So you may have a great product,

never, we're not even questioning that.

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Let's assume everybody listening

today has the best product.

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Let's just say that.

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You still have to build a

relationship with somebody.

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Because they're really buying you before

they do anything with that product.

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Yeah.

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You want to make sure you deliver

because if they find out that you stink

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at what you do, then you don't get

to keep them anyway, but it's really

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that building of the relationship.

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And what does that mean?

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It's starting with an understanding

of their needs, not your product.

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So before I get into a deeper level

here, I don't want to go there,

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but that's really my approach.

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I will look at individuals who are

cold and then the warm and say to

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myself, how do I want to interact

and communicate with this person

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to start building the relationship?

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We're not like how many of us

get married on the first date?

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Okay, for those of you that might do it.

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I know that there are the exceptions

But you are not the rule just saying so

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that's the mindset you're giggling Why

did you get married after the first date?

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What?

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John: No, no, no, no.

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I was just thinking my, my

experience of life has been any

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whirlwind romance relationships

have usually whirlwinded out.

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: probably not the

right way to say it.

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They fizzle.

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They fizzle just usually

just as quick as they start.

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But I think these Marketing

relationships can be like that as well.

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I was saying to you the other day whilst

we were chatting privately about stuff as

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we tend to do how important a breakthrough

it was to me to understand the idea of

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the concept of what I had to offer, what

I wanted to take out into the marketplace

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wasn't necessarily what people wanted.

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It was what I wanted to take out there.

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So it was big breakthrough moment

for me to understand that I needed

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to either adapt what I wanted into

what they wanted or really just figure

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out who I want to serve and find out

what they want so I can give them that.

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Because it's not always going to be the

case that what you want to take out into

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the world is going to have a market or

it's going to be right for the people

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that you want to take it out there too.

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And one of the things I'd often say

this, I will often say with people

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I work with is you need to sell

the destination and not the flight.

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Angie: Gosh, yes, there's

got to be a vision, right?

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You need to take people past the

hard parts for a minute, right?

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Connect them to the necessity and

the why of what it is that they

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want to do, what they need from you.

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Absolutely.

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Because that's what we all,

every piece of marketing that's

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out there is end result driven.

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It definitely is.

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It's if you follow this diet

plan, you'll look like this.

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If you do this exercise,

you'll look like this.

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Coaching and all those things that, that,

that accompany it are no different, right?

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If you want people to,

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John: sell the outcome.

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We have to sell them what they want,

because imagine, because if you, let's

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say you do buy like a health and fitness

program or a personal trainer, you'll

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get, you're buying the outcome, right?

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You're not buying, all

right, I'm going to get up.

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I'm going to have to get up early

three days a week and go out and

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back out with my personal trainer.

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And it's going to absolutely

beast me in the gym.

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Nobody's going to buy that.

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But that is what you buy.

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I mean, that is the how

of how you get there.

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But what you're buying is the

concept, the idea, the destination.

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So they're in that sense, they're

selling you what you want, but they will

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give you what you need to get there.

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And we need to do the

same as coaches as well.

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We need to sell them what they

want, not to do a bait and switch,

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but to give them what they need.

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Like they're still going to give them

what they want, but we're the, how we

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get them there is usually less important.

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We

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Angie: I think I would agree with that.

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I've read something today that's so funny

because as I was doing some personal work

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this morning, I actually utilized this.

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I didn't come up with it and I've

heard it before, but I heard it years

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and years and years ago, and I think

I just needed to hear it again today.

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So being where you are is hard.

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And doing the work for change is hard,

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but which one will bring you the greater

outcome because it's hard, right?

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So I feel like being able to display that

for people, becomes like the no brainer.

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And I don't need the surgeon

to tell me like, I'm going

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to do this in your surgery.

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I'm asleep, dude.

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Just do it right.

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So I wake up.

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I, I need to know that when I wake up,

this is going to be the outcome for me.

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So it's really just, I mean, you're

poking fun, you know, me and my visuals,

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like they're always here right there

at the top of my mind, top of my mind.

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But that's the key because we wouldn't be

able to sell, nobody would be able to sell

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anything if there wasn't an end result.

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So for sure.

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Um,

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John: want to get.

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People clear on what the

outcomes are for them.

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What is the desirable outcome for them?

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What's the solution to their pain that's

going to be very attractive for them?

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I was having a chat with a good coaching

friend of mine just this morning about

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that we've both been part of these sort

of big coaching speaking communities, like

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in personal development, working, we both

worked for, like you have yourself for big

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names in personal development, who sell

courses and programs and stuff like that.

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And we were wondering about how

many people from those programs are

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actually really truly successful.

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So and get the results that

those programs offer them.

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It's probably a very small percentage

of people, but many of them will buy

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the $10, 000 plus programs because of

what they think it can do for them.

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But as you say, very often they don't

actually want to do the work to get

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them there, or maybe they're buying

into a dream more than a reality that

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not, I do think some of the programs

that I've taken in the past wouldn't

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create that for you, looking back,

like at the time I didn't know better,

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but now I know that they probably

wouldn't have created those outcomes.

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And maybe would have

changed my ideas about that.

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We do have to have some level of

skepticism, healthy skepticism, when we

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are looking at other people's offers as

well, mine, yours, whoever's, we need

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to look at, can they, with offering

a result, but can they get us there,

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what's, what's the credibility to get

us there and is that result realistic?

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Angie: Well, I think that when we're

endorsing a vision and an outcome, we do

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need to make sure that as you mentioned,

and I'm going to just springboard off of

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this, we need to make sure that people

also realize that this isn't the magical

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bean and if you just take the magic pill

or whatever that you're going to wake up

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tomorrow and be an overnight success, like

there has to be an intentionality around.

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The steps needed to get there.

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It's like any other program You

cannot start at the end, but you need

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to know what the end is begin with

the end in mind What is the vision?

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What is the goal?

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Whatever you want to call it.

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And then make the commitment to you

know Are you willing to do what it's

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going to take to get to that point?

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And I think a lot of people do peter

off because, it's maybe not what

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they expected, it's harder than they

expected and they forget the why.

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They just forget hey but, what,

now you're laughing, what now,

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John: I know I'm laughing because I'm

afraid I've taken this down a bit of a

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rabbit hole and I think we're getting away

from what we want to talk about today.

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Which is like bringing people

into our world as coaches.

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And I do feel, for myself, I know that

Podcasting has been a big part of that.

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I know that people, even just last

week, someone goes out, I've been

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listening to you on the podcast.

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Can you help me with this?

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Great.

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That sort of stuff can

generate leads for you.

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And very often it's going on other

people's podcasts that does a

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lot more of that for me as well.

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But, even so that I'm very I'm sure

I said this before on the show, but

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I'm very, Choosy about the shows

that I go on and that partly because

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I really prepare for going on them.

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I listen to some of their shows.

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I make sure I have value to deliver.

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I want some of the stuff that I say

to be really memorable for people.

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I want to be such a good guest that

people who listen to that episode are

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going to remember me and that the host

is going to want me to probably come

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back again sometime in the future.

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That's my goal with it.

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So rather than just spray painting

the whole podcast landscape with

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with interviews, all about my life

story and how wonderful I am is like,

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nobody really wants to hear that.

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Most people don't know

who I am and don't care.

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So you give them a reason to I want

to go out there and be an interesting

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and exciting guest for people.

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That gives getting in front of other

people's audiences always is going to

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give you a great bump in credibility

and a great way to connect with new

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people who aren't in your world as

much as speaking to large audiences

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where people you haven't connected

with before can do that for you too.

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Angie: Absolutely.

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And yeah, we did make a left turn earlier,

but it's easy to do that sometimes

281

because there's so many nuances to how we

connect with a potential audience, right?

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Or a potential client.

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And there are all the ways, all the

things, and the, I think that the rule of

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thumb is come out from behind the curtain,

come out from hiding and be prepared,

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whether it's going on a podcast or.

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Creating the videos and all the

things that are going to exemplify

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and show who you actually are in

terms of the offering, in terms of

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what it is that you actually do.

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I think it's really important.

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I don't know.

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How many emails do you think you get a

day from people who want to, help you

292

with your coaching and speaking business?

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John: Or, uh, More than I care for.

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Angie: Yeah.

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John: that I can say that they're

either coming in my email.

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They're coming into my LinkedIn

Often into my inbox there And

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other places as well uninvited.

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And yeah I do not appreciate

people spamming me.

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I have again, I may have mentioned

this before on the show, but I even got

300

taught in one program to go out and do

that strategy of going to these Facebook

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groups and connecting with people

who are your audience or your ideal

302

client and message them, direct message

them, friend them, and message them.

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And, and all that ever brought

me was aggro from people who

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knew exactly what I was doing.

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And it's like basically told me not to

be spamming them and stuff like that.

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And what one guy should go and

say, you seem like a nice guy.

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Why are you doing this?

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It's you know what, for

me, it felt really sleazy.

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And once I know it has worked for

some people, I think the reason

310

it didn't work for me is because

it felt so out of integrity for

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Angie: right.

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Yeah.

313

No.

314

And I think that's the thing.

315

I think that there's a lot of people that,

I think in the sales industry in and of

316

itself, right there, you're taught, I

don't care if it's car sales, I don't care

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if it's insurance, real estate or anything

that's like kind of commission based.

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The first thing that a mentor will tell

you to do or has told you to do over

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the years is, Go after everyone you

know and don't take no for an answer.

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Go tell them about our products,

go tell them about what you do.

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And I'm not, okay, let me be clear here.

322

I'm not saying everybody that you

know shouldn't know what you do.

323

How you do it, though, is the

differentiator between you And the

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people that are like, block, block,

blocking you because they just

325

don't want to hear it or see it.

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And I think that that's really a

great other episode that we can

327

do is actually how to communicate,

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John: And that,

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Angie: start building a real relationship

330

John: that would be valuable.

331

Angie: yeah, I think where people

are coming to you and saying,

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You know what, Angie, or you know

what, John, because that has been,

333

and it took me a minute, right?

334

I was taught, my background is a million

years ago in sales, and it was bang on the

335

door, go in the front door, the back door.

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Yeah, sometimes you just have to

listen and shift and say, okay, wait,

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John: Yeah.

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Angie: looking to sell them

something, I'm banging on the doors.

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But if I'm looking to build

a relationship, there is

340

a better way to do that.

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I just need to be patient

for those outcomes.

342

And that's the difference in the mindset

of, go get the sale, go get the sale.

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Ah, get away from me.

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Stop spraying me with perfume.

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John: ask anyone who's ever joined a

multi level marketing business, right?

346

I

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Angie: Oh, geez.

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Yes.

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John: how to lose friends and alienate

people and family as well for that

350

matter, because they do tell you

to pretty much go after everybody.

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So you're stuck to everybody you know?

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Yeah,

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Angie: it becomes that really like

you people like will literally.

354

Run the other way or pick up their

phone and be like, Oh, I want to call.

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Sorry.

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Like, come on.

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Don't be that right.

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Be a professional.

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I mean, there are times to

I'm going to be really honest.

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There's some big names.

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I follow and I'm getting four or five six

videos a week and I'm like, okay, come on.

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I get it.

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I get it.

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But I've also stopped listening a

little bit because it's so much.

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It's that it's too much.

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I'm busy.

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I need to make sure.

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I think that they could be a

little bit more strategic, but

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maybe because they have the names.

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You know what?

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Who cares?

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They don't really care

what Angie thinks anymore.

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You know?

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John: be honest that there there

are some people who I do probably

375

get daily emails from who I don't

mind getting daily emails from.

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I don't necessarily read them every day,

but I don't mind them being in my inbox.

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I've want them there, like one

of them typically is Kennedy from

378

the email marketing show gives

him a plug, but learning, I'm

379

learning email marketing from him.

380

And also one of my favorite coaches

is now his cohost on the podcast.

381

So, it is really great to be learning from

them and I want to see them in my inbox.

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I want to be good at doing what they do.

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And I don't mind getting the data emails

from, 'cause it's not the same crap that

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Angie: so what's the difference?

385

And that's my question.

386

What's the difference between that

and what we're talking about, like in,

387

what we were talking about earlier on?

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John: It's not spammy.

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They have a lot of story staff.

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And I know that when there's

an offer from them, it's gonna

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be a high value offer for their

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Angie: There it is.

393

That's the word, the value.

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John: serving, they're serving

their community and and

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sharing themselves as well.

396

And this is, I wanted to say earlier

that I do have a perception of that I

397

think there's been a lot of BS around

authenticity, especially in the coaching

398

world, that it's almost become meaningless

when somebody says you're being authentic.

399

And it shouldn't be because it's a really

powerful thing to be truly authentic.

400

It's about being true to

yourself, to who you really are.

401

Personal development is about discovering

the authenticity of yourself and who you

402

really are, who you really want to be.

403

It's a shame that it's been so

overused, abused, whatever else to

404

become almost meaningless in the world.

405

Because when we talk about authenticity,

people think you have to be showing

406

the world everything of who you are,

you have to air out your personality.

407

Around your closets and stuff to the

whole world and shake out your skeletons.

408

And it's really not that

I do feel we always have

409

Angie: You don't want to say my skeletons.

410

We can launch an entire house.

411

We don't want to do that.

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And

413

John: we always have to be

curating the image that we want

414

to be putting out into the world.

415

And some people will say that that

doesn't seem very authentic, but it

416

still has to be authentic to you.

417

You just want to be very particular

about what aspects of yourself

418

you are showing to the world.

419

And, and people say, no, that doesn't seem

very, it doesn't sound very authentic as

420

we're talking about, but, I think about in

terms of, would you go to a job interview

421

dressed and acting like you would have for

a night out on the town with your friends,

422

Angie: Right.

423

John: show a different, you show a

different version of yourself in that it's

424

a curated version of yourself, the version

of yourself, you know, you probably should

425

be showing up as in that environment,

we all have these versions of ourselves.

426

And they are all to some degree authentic,

even though they can all be different.

427

We adapt ourselves to different

people in our life, to different

428

circumstances and situations.

429

And this is no different.

430

This is no different.

431

So we want to have a curated professional

image that we are intentionally projecting

432

out into the world, but it still

needs to be true to who we are inside.

433

We're just not necessarily

going to be opening up our

434

whole world to, to everybody.

435

We're going to be opening

up elements of our world.

436

Hopefully some of that is going to

include levels of vulnerability that

437

lets people in To see our heart, to

see what we, that we really care and

438

that we are genuine people, but they

don't need to know everything about us.

439

They don't.

440

need to know our horrible histories or

whatever else, which we know we all have.

441

But that, that's just it.

442

And not everyone is necessarily gonna

agree with that, but this is very much

443

what I think in terms of we, we talk

about bringing people into our world.

444

We have to have that kind of, we have to

know who we are professionally that we are

445

putting out in, into the world as well.

446

As a brand, as a person,

447

Angie: Yeah.

448

And I think I, so I do agree

with you that there has to be

449

a level of true authenticity.

450

Nobody wants the actor or actress, but

it is, and it's, so it's, so what you're

451

saying is essentially, it's really, I'm

not the Angie that's going out on a

452

Friday or the Angie that's entertaining

with friends and family on a weekend.

453

It's, there's this other

piece of me and that's great.

454

I think that where I take that to the next

level is, and this is the feedback that

455

I've gotten forever, is my relatability.

456

When I am doing like a video or

I'm even in a coaching session,

457

I'm being in that moment.

458

I am creating a rapport intentionally.

459

I'm speaking to that audience, that

person, that group, whatever and

460

they know that I'm not full of crap.

461

They just know.

462

Because of the way that I'm connecting

with them and again, the way I am

463

in an email is how I am, even on a

stage, I am still the same person and

464

there is a continuity there that make

people go, that's just who she is.

465

I love she's just, I've heard people

say, Oh my God, I love Brene Brown, or I

466

love Tony Robbins, or I love X, Y, and Z.

467

And I say, well, what

do you love about them?

468

Tell me what that is, because

you don't even really know them.

469

They're showing the best professional side

of themselves, and then they get into what

470

really is making that connection for them.

471

And it's, oh, it's the raw, their

ability to, to speak in a way that

472

is just real and it's not full

of frou frou and whatever it is.

473

I've heard so many different

variations of things.

474

But what it really has boiled

down to is that they really

475

feel like they know the person.

476

They do.

477

They believe that they're so connected

that they actually believe they

478

know the person to some degree.

479

And again, is that really true?

480

Well, I guess to some degree they

know them as this person, but not

481

John: you know, a version of

482

Angie: person.

483

John: where, yeah, we, we know from

our speaking experience and whatever

484

else that there is a performance

element that comes into this.

485

And that's partly what

I'm talking about as well.

486

There is a level of performance, a

level of acting, but you know, even

487

that can throw people off here.

488

It's like, if we're acting,

are we just pretending?

489

And it's no, it's not really like that

because if you look at all the best

490

actors They generally make characters

and parts their own, they bring their

491

own authenticity into the roles that

they play and that usually is what

492

makes them so amazing and they're not

throwing aside who they are as a person

493

to take on a role they're not doing an

impression, they're bringing themselves

494

fully into that role and experience,

so that's what I'm talking about.

495

That's why I say that it's dangerous

to talk a little bit about this or

496

curated image that we put out there

because I'm not suggesting for a moment.

497

That we want to try and come across as

perfect or elevated, or, we actually want

498

to help ourselves get onto the same level

as our avatar, as our audience that we

499

want to be reaching out to, we want to be

able to connect with them on their level.

500

So, if we are elevating ourselves to above

them, it's going to be harder to do that

501

and harder to create that relationship.

502

We maybe want to make clear that

we might have more experience or

503

knowledge that they don't have that

it's going to be very helpful for them.

504

But one of the biggest things that

connected an audience to me and one of

505

my speaking gigs in the past was, Talking

about my experience of really screwing

506

up my business first time out the gate

and all the mess ups I made and and

507

people really identified with that story.

508

And sometimes we do need to share our

mistakes, our mess ups, not really

509

whilst we're in them, hopefully, but

you know, when we've got some distance

510

between them, it's good to share

those and to show I'm not perfect.

511

I didn't have all the answers.

512

I didn't have a clue what I

was doing when I started out in

513

business and it's taken a long time.

514

But but people need to hear that.

515

Angie: Yes, and I agree.

516

I think that creating that

reliability piece is the key, right?

517

Showing that there's an outcome

and how we communicate that,

518

and I do it to your point.

519

I just want to say this, right?

520

We really need to be on the

other side of that growth spurt.

521

that we had or that challenge

in order to be viable.

522

Nobody really, wants to be like in

the misery loves company space, right?

523

Because you are essentially offering hope.

524

Like, Hey, I was here.

525

I did this.

526

I get it.

527

That's how we get people.

528

We go, yes, I get it.

529

I understand.

530

And this is how it can

change or, whatever that is.

531

But.

532

But I think it's just no matter

how you're communicating with them.

533

It's the way in which you're communicating

with them is the real way to start getting

534

people to seek you out and shift that.

535

I honestly, anybody who works for

themselves, anybody, especially

536

in the coaching, consulting,

speaking in that industry

537

John: It's a

538

Angie: you need to keep that.

539

John: you alluded to this earlier that

we are often inundated with people trying

540

to spammy sellers, all sorts of things.

541

And some of them may be good.

542

Some of them may be not, but who knows?

543

We don't have any relationship with these

people who are just invading our inboxes.

544

And that's why I will always delete

them and never respond to them.

545

Like, please respond, please

respond and subscribe if you

546

don't want to hear from us.

547

No, you're just going into the spam

because that's what you're doing.

548

It's but because we, I think a lot in

sales and marketing or what we encounter

549

or what we remember is the negative stuff.

550

I think very often when we start doing

it for ourselves, we think that's how

551

it's supposed to be done because that's

what we encounter far more or we pay

552

attention to far more than the people

who are doing a really good job of that.

553

And I think that's a big danger zone.

554

But here's where I want to lead

that to for you, Angie, how many

555

of your coaching clients come to

you by referral or recommendation?

556

Angie: Oh, I would say by

now it's more than 50%.

557

Maybe 60 or more.

558

Is by referral, but with that being said I

still haven't stopped the outreach, right?

559

I still look to keep the pipeline full.

560

And that 40 percent number is still

a good number and, I do the rule of

561

twos, which I learned back in like the

okay, I learned it in the seventies,

562

but I didn't know I was learning

anything cause I was like a kid.

563

I was a young kid, but . It's taking

one and getting two more, right?

564

If I get a coaching

client, I get two more.

565

If I get a workshop, I ask for two more.

566

So that's why it's how I've, how I'm

even asking for the referral, right?

567

So I don't come off as, that's the

only reason she wanted to talk to us

568

is because she wanted more from us.

569

No, again, remember what I

said at the very beginning.

570

It's how.

571

You're asking for the business you

are, and you're asking and how you're

572

essentially selling it because you

are, but doing it in such a way where

573

people are like falling over themselves

to give you more work or refer you

574

to other people because yeah, I think

that it's a pretty big number by now,

575

and it's because of the way that I do

business and it is the way I communicate.

576

It's not just.

577

Oh, I'm a great coach.

578

I'm a great speaker.

579

It's how I'm communicating with

people and how I've trained myself

580

to ask for more business, how

I've trained people to refer me.

581

John: Uh, and I do think.

582

We certainly need to have the outreach,

especially when, if you're in a position

583

of just getting started, it's essential

that you have that and you have a plan.

584

Ads will probably help

you social media presence.

585

I think it's harder to compete in that

world, but it probably will help you.

586

I think you need to find the

things that feel most effective

587

and authentic for you as well.

588

In person networking can

probably really, really help you.

589

As a coach, how many clients do

you really need to fill your books?

590

You should probably have that figured out.

591

And we probably mentioned it before in

an episode, but you should know how many

592

clients you really need and what you

need to be charging them in order to

593

put food on the table and keep the roof

over your head, so then if that can be

594

achieved with in person networking and

things like that, then, and that's your

595

preferred way of doing it, then that

probably is a far better way for you

596

to be spending your time and resources.

597

To bring in clients and then once people

are in your world, you moving into

598

being able to set up referral systems

now, no, we should think to, to some

599

degree, being good at what you do is

a great way to be a referable yes.

600

And as you say, asking for the

referrals the right way is also a

601

great way because In my experience,

you generally do have to ask for them.

602

There are some people but I think there

are few and far between who will say, Oh,

603

I know these people that they've prepared

for you, they will do the referrals.

604

They're natural referrers.

605

They're the people who

are natural promoters.

606

They want to have, they want

to share you with other people,

607

Angie: Right.

608

They're natural networkers.

609

John: Yeah, but those are not going to be

every client or customer that you have.

610

So you do need to go about asking in

the right way for those referrals and

611

recommendations for people and approaching

those in the right way as well.

612

It's not just to sell.

613

It's like, you want to be specific about

614

Angie: Mm hmm.

615

John: going to be offering and how you can

potentially be helping them make sure you

616

have your testimonials, your credibility,

but I would say more than anything else,

617

make sure you believe in this yourself.

618

Because if you don't, you're always,

you're just going to feel like

619

a fake out there in the world.

620

Hoping that something's going to stick

or that people aren't going to, aren't

621

going to uncover your secret and the old

imposter syndrome that's going to kick in.

622

It's like your beliefs about what

you can do and offer to people

623

are really, really important.

624

Like if you know you're the shit and

you can really help people and make a

625

difference for them, that's really going

to help you to stay motivated or in

626

getting out there and talking to people.

627

An offering to help them and serve them.

628

Do you,

629

Angie: Yeah.

630

Sometimes less is more in terms of, How

to communicate certain things, I think,

631

but again, I think we have the makings

of a really another great episode that

632

we can create that gets into some of the

how to's and the best practices of that,

633

because that's a space where, I see people

spending tons of resources, time, energy,

634

financial, and getting such little return

on investment because, They're doing what

635

they think they're supposed to be doing,

and they're not considering their own

636

specific product, audience, services,

whatever in the communication process.

637

John: Okay.

638

Let's wrap up but I think we've covered

some valuable and important stuff.

639

We maybe had a bit of a

deep dive here as well.

640

And We'd love to know your thoughts.

641

Do you have thoughts?

642

Do you have questions?

643

Do you have things you want to know

or challenges that you're facing in

644

your coaching business or growing

your coaching business or getting

645

clients for yourself that you

want to ask questions to us about?

646

Well, you can leave us

a voicemail for free.

647

Go to speakpipe.

648

com forward slash at the coaching clinic

podcast, that's speakpipe dot com forward

649

slash the coaching clinic podcast.

650

You can leave us your voicemail there.

651

And if we like it we might just

feature you on the show, but I

652

think we're going to wrap things

up there for this week, Angie, Been

653

a wonderful conversation as ever,

654

Angie: it has.

655

John: back next time

656

Angie: hey, can I give

them a little spoiler that

657

John: Go on.

658

Angie: and I have something in

the, we have something in the works

659

John: We do

660

Angie: we are, we're

gonna have a big surprise.

661

So just stay tuned.

662

We're not.

663

Nothing's coming up next time, but

do, we are working on something

664

really amazing and just wanted

to put that out there for you.

665

Bye

666

John: planting the seeds.

667

Yes, it is going to be exciting.

668

We will be doing prior to announcements.

669

So do stay tuned to the show for those

as this comes closer to bearing fruit

670

into reality, we will keep you posted,

but you will hear it first on this show.

671

So do make sure you are tuning in every

Wednesday for your latest episodes.

672

That's it from me and Angie.

673

We'll wish you a fantastic week

and lots of coaching successes.

674

And we'll see you again next time.

675

Angie: bye.