In this episode, we talk to Dr. Phyllis West, Director of the Social Justice Initiative at Governors State University. Dr. West discusses the importance of listening for opportunities, being curious, and doing what may seem most challenging. She talks about staying connected with friends, family, and teachers from her youth and shares the lasting power of words, particularly from her 3rd and 4th grade teachers, that shaped who she would become. We also discuss the mission and vision for the Social Justice Initiative with its first tremendous step to coordinate a legal clinic.

Referenced in this podcast:

• Social Justice Initiative | Governors State University - The SJI’s mission is to transform vulnerable populations, racial and economic injustice, and structural and social barriers of underrepresented individuals, families, and communities in the Southland and in the State of Illinois. SJI’s goal is to address these social conditions through the utilization of research, policy, advocacy, restorative justice, and experiential learning.
• Legal Clinic | Governors State University - The GSU Self-Help Legal Assistance Clinic (GSU-LC) provides free self-help legal assistance and non-legal resources to low-income Illinois residents using the court system without legal representation, understand and navigate the legal system. At the clinic, a team of attorneys, social workers, and volunteers work together under the supervision of a licensed attorney and social worker to increase access to legal services in underrepresented communities.

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

legal clinic, community, people, educators, college, love, students, social justice, grew, governor, opportunity, servant leader, southland, part, grant, south, work, listening

SPEAKERS

Joi Patterson, Phyllis West, Amy Vujaklija

I believe that people are meant to be in our lives 3d In our face, to see their struggle to remind us to love and care for humanity.

This episode was originally released under the podcast titled teaching and learning theory versus practice. This rebooted episode has been migrated to teaching and leading with Dr. Amy and Dr. Joi. I am Dr. Amy Vujaklija, Director of educator preparation. And I

am Dr. Joi Patterson chief diversity officer. Our podcast addresses issues through the lens of diversity, equity and inclusion, along with solutions for us to grow as educators. So

join us on our journey to become better teachers and leaders. So let's get into it. Hello, Dr. Joi.

Good morning, Dr. Amy, how are you today?

I'm excited and energized. As when we talk about education, a lot of times we are talking about classroom teachers and other educators. But there's another element to university education that is almost like a soft skill or a hidden curriculum. And I think that's the education that you gain just by being present, aware, and with people who have a wide range of perspectives.

Yeah. So I think you're talking about our dispositions and our affinity to actually love people. And then I think that takes educators to a whole nother level, when we actually love people, and we become servant leaders in the field.

Oh, absolutely. And we can become servant leaders. Even as young as in our early educational times, we don't already have to be in a profession, to turn around and be of service to others. We have college students, high school students who can take on those community actions. And being aware, being open to opportunities can really bring you to great places.

I shared something with you yesterday, it was about a teacher candidate that was hurt, hurt by the words of another faculty member. And I looked at you and I saw the welds of your eyes just feel with tears. Tell me what that was.

That's hard to explain. I I don't want to see another human hurt. And it's painful to me. When words are said or spoken or feelings are hurt. I want to fix things. I want to make things better. And I know I've been on the giving end of harsh words and never intentionally. I've told you before that a lot of times it's because of passion. Like I get passionate about my subject and about the conversation. And so sometimes I'm on the giving end of harsh words. But part of that is just wanting to make things better, and wanting to have a strong community. And when we have that strong community I think we are giving to each other, especially in servant in service to our students. Yeah.

And I think all educators need to know that you have that opportunity to be a servant leader, and that we all have the ability to impact we are not powerless when it comes to loving and shaping their lives and how they feel and advocating for them. We are not powerless in that area. We have a lot of power as educators starting with the individual, and then the resources around us.

I want to talk about and introduce a person who is an absolute servant leader and can talk you know can guide us in this conversation. Dr. Phyllis West is the director of the Social Justice Initiative at Governor State University, and she earned a bachelor's degree in history from pain college and two master's degrees, one in public health and the other in Social Work from Tulane University before earning her PhD from the University of Chicago School of Social Service Administration. Dr. West is committed to self care, redefining social justice and reducing gun violence. Additionally, Dr. West research focuses on mothers in the criminal justice system, international service learning, community based social work. And I'm just really excited to have Dr. West with us today. Welcome to our podcast.

Thank you. Welcome. Dr. Last, Amy and I, we were having this conversation about really loving people, and how we are all we can all be servant leaders, and we can advocate for other people, and no one does that better than you. You are all that and a bag of chips. I am always so much and all of your inner and your outer beauty. You know, before we delve into some questions, I want to learn more about you, Phyllis, factor, Phyllis West, tell us about your journey to becoming a professional people helper. And all in your many roles, you know, the Peace Corps as a professional health administrator, social worker, now director of social justice, tell us who you are. And what drove you to be a servant leader. I know that's really, really big. But I want to, you know, take us back. Thank you. Thank you. It's great being here. And I'm honored and humble at the same time, because I don't give myself any of those titles. I do what I do, because it's just the thing to do is the it's the thing that's in you, it's when it's innate. You don't think about it, you just do it. And for me, I would say it started from my community growing up on the west side of Chicago, and my family, a community that and I think we talked about this before or with someone that in the 1970s Chicago Tribune, Dean, anyone who grew up in North Lawndale was like growing up in a black hole that you would never get out of, in terms of poverty, which clearly, I don't believe that I am, along with so many other friends that I grew up with are examples that you can grow up in poverty, and thrive. And I think a part of that thriving for my family, we grew up on the block, we'll start we started off in a block that was across the street from where Dr. Martin Luther King came to observe poverty, right. And that said, in 1968, when he died, our community, and the only grocery store burned. And it's still not there today. Although that feels very dark, and dim. It actually wasn't for us, I knew we struggled, I knew that our community was tough growing up. But I took it for granted. What attachment means when you think about developmental and YouTube are educational people and truly get attachment. I didn't fully get attachment. Until I took it for granted that I knew people from the time of conception until now, I took it for granted that I'm still in touch with my third grade friend and my fourth grade teacher. And I can say that is why I do what I do. Because that's what I witnessed all my life. We took care of each other. And we're still taking care of each other today. And I'm very proud to say that I grew up in Chicago, and it feels like I grew up in the south on the small block.

Only to continue this talk about your connections to the community of your youth. How is it that you are still connected to your third grade friend and young previous teachers? And why is that? Why do you think that is?

That's a good point. I think a part of it to be honest, my you know, my mom passed this year and she was sort of 90 years old. She died a few months short of 90 years old. And being a part being raised by parents who were a part of the Second Great Migration from the south. To the north. I believe we were raised by people who came from Alabama, Mississippi, Georgia, New Orleans, Texas, and just all these different Florida just named these places right in the south from Kentucky. And there was the connection was important. relationships were important. My father, when you say how I think it was just how we were raised my father was had a mental illness that occurred Clearly you didn't diagnosed back then my father wasn't again. My father was an alcoholic and died when I was a senior in high school. I say all that to say that my mother taught us and raised us to see the humanity. And even people who struggled, we didn't get to be embarrassed or shame about our Father, we get to recognize that he's still our father, even if he's struggling. And that inspiration, and growing up being raised by a mother who was clear that that is still your daddy no matter what, how hard it is. And that sense of pride. It taught it embedded instilled in me clearly, to have pride, and be proud of who you are, regardless of the struggle, and to carry that integrity and that dignity, and to have empathy. And so I say, Amy, for me, having witnessed that, in my own family, I have a special love. When I see people who struggle, I have special compassion, and connection. And I care. And I believe that through caring, we can change what we see in terms of Healthy People. And I believe that people are meant to be in our lives 3d In our face, to see their struggle to remind us to love and care for humanity. Like You I grew up poor in the Inglewood community outside of Chicago. And so often we try to run away from our past, but you found a way to embrace it, talk about how these early beginnings influence who you are as a person and the work that you currently tour. Those those early years, like I said, I took for granted that they were attachment. It was about attachment. And there was a community and there was a relationship. And it wasn't about your circumstances. But it was about in spite of those circumstances, there was a relationship and how that influenced my work. It just I went to college, I fell in love with community work. I always volunteered, pledged to sorority always participated right in the community aspect didn't care about any other aspect of the sorority. Although I didn't like dancing. I was impressed with these very bright, smart women who were studious. They knew how to study. I was impressed with community. But my part was, I wasn't the all a student, the overachiever. I was the person who worked part time, and did community work around voting, and all of that when I was in college, and joining Peace Corps came out of the vision for aka at that point, it was service with a global perspective. And at 2004. I applied I got in at 25 and then went to West Africa. And I fell in love with public health and social work in the villages, right, riding on the bike, doing mass vaccination campaigns 12 To 20 to 2124 miles a day on a bike from village to village making sure women were having healthy babies. I didn't know public health or social work existed. But I knew that in that moment, I wouldn't be doing this for the rest of my life. And that's how it started.

Phyllis, I have a follow up, because you didn't just show up as Dr. Phyllis West, as we see you now, as students see you now. And you also mentioned that you were not the smartest kid in your classroom. And today you are Dr. Phyllis West. Can you talk about your high school experience? And how did you go from high school of not being in a college preparatory school not being set up for college, in your path to college?

Sure. I am not going to stay on this first part I say long, but I will say that it was in fourth grade, where Miss Kent looked at me and saw me. It was prior to that. I remember and I'm saying this because you you're educators, I remember in third grade going into a classroom and I will never forget that teacher said to me, you don't belong in this classroom. And they had classes set up where they had three classes of one grade. And one particular class was like that top class, right academically top class. Well, I remember that lady said Miss Cooke said you don't belong in here. And I still felt right. I feel that today like if it was yesterday. However, I remember in fourth grade that same class, all of us That was in the class. I was back in that class, but it was a different teacher. And this kid looked at me, and she's been looking at me ever since. And she's in her late 70s Now, and she said, I could learn. And I was like, Oh, maybe I can learn because I didn't have books at home. I didn't, you know, we didn't have books at home. So when we went to high school, I majored in ROTC for a minute. And then I did I tried graphic arts that didn't work and drafting that didn't work. And then somehow some weird way. I fell in love with cosmetology a lamp that was a cosmetologist, I won first place. I love the science. I remember loving the anatomy of you had to learn anatomy and physiology in cosmetology, you know, you had to understand the skin and you had to understand, and I fell in love. And that became my side hustle. I did here. And in senior high school, someone said, hey, my friends were like, well, I'm going to this college, and I'm going to college, like, What are you talking about? Who's going to college? And I was like, Well, I want to go to college. So I knew I was going because my friends were going, but no one told me how to prepare. So I remember going to Loyola University saying I want to register for college. And they said, Well, did you take the AC T the LSAT? And I said, What's that? And they were like, Oh, why don't you go to a community college first. I said, well, where's that? I'm sorry. I'm literally 18 years old. I was like, Well, where is it? They said, Well, where do you live? And by that time I lived on the south side of Chicago. So Well, I live on 79th Street. And so why don't you go to all of Harvey. I said, Okay. And that's how it started. I went to all of our OB, I went over there, I registered, they, they did an exam, they did a test. I had to take these classes that I never took before and had to the you know, I just had to I had to take remedial class I had to start. And I just said, okay, and I just did it. I fell in love with it. And I was still getting in trouble. Very sneaky little teenager who get in trouble and getting caught up. And finally, my mother was like, What's wrong with you? You know, you seem sad. I was like, I need to go away. And she said, Well, I don't have any place for you to go, and I don't have any money. And I said, Well, I want last summer I wanted to visit Auntie Eloise, and I want to pay in college. I took one class gonna go back there. And she said, Yes. She said, but I don't have any money. As a mom, I don't need any money. I figured it out. And my mother gave me $100 And a bus ticket. And that began my college career. And that's how I graduated. There is

so much to unpack here. There's just so much as you mentioned, yes, we're educators, and I want educators to tune in if they have not part their ears. I want them to do it. Now rewind. And listen to this part where a third grade child is still within you. Still carrying that voice of that third grade teacher within you. That's fine. It reminds me of the short story 11. We carry all of those ages with us. We don't turn into a new age. But that fourth grade child, yes. had new inspiration. You listened and you held on to that because that was your new drive. Somebody believes in you. So of course you can believe in yourself.

Yes.

And I want to just explore this importance of listening for opportunities. You said, a friend caught you know, other peers said I'm going to college, you said what's that? Community College became an opportunity. Have you? Have you taken the this test? Or have you done this? What's that? This listening and pursuing? It seems like that is something we don't do enough of we don't listen for those opportunities, and then jump on them. What would you say to our college students, even high school students about that importance of listening for opportunities?

I would say when you hear something that you've never heard before, and you're like, Oh, it was like the home means yes, you should try it. And as soon as you say but I can't use it. Really try it because that means you can and it's just being curious. So enough, but it will take courage to be afraid. I mean, you got to be afraid. And you got to be courageous to push through your fear, right? of just saying, Okay, let me do it. And because the worst case scenario is what you're going to fail, and then you got to get back up, or we could stay safe. And if we stay say, we'll never know what we can do. Right? So I've always been, I don't know, I think that was born in me. Because as a first generation college student and the youngest of five, I didn't have a roadmap. But I knew I was curious, I've always been curious. And I, and along with being curious, I noticed people will take you and adopt you, and walk with you, there's always going to be someone there to walk with you. Even if you don't know, even if the designer there's gonna be someone here to walk with me, even if I don't see you. Even if I can't figure it out, and it's gonna feel uncomfortable. That is gonna be crazy, right? Whether you're 20 at 30, it doesn't matter. It is a recipe, once you look at it, and the recipe is fill it all. All the highs and all the lows, and try it anyway. And keep trying and keep asking.

Yeah, it is that adventurous spirit that got you to where you are. And so many, we see so many college students, I teach that freshman course that prepares them for college. And you know, I do a poll about why they are in college. And so many of them say because my parents said I had to, I didn't have a plan. They were tired of me being an owl. So I went to college, and had no idea of what their future would look like. You know, I actually a College Preparatory High School, and still didn't have a clue about what to do beyond that. I knew that I was supposed to go to college, but didn't know how. So like you I ended up in a line, I took my father's checkbook. And I found myself at Daley Community College. And I just went one step at a time, until I could start to see you know, bigger goals and bigger goals. But up until then I just one little step at a time trying to figure it out. I didn't counselor or, or anything. I just read the catalog and says, Oh, I want to be a nurse. These are the courses that I need to take, just register for the courses. But it's just that adventurous spirit. And regardless of what adversity that we have. These are just there's ways to overcome that. And you're a prime example of that. You know, I want to talk about this so much more. But I want to get to your current role as governor State University is the Director of Social Justice this year, the first director of the Social Justice Initiative. What does this position bring the governor State University and the surrounding areas?

Absolutely. Absolutely. I think this position brings an opportunity of a lifetime for Governor state university to be able to respond we have an infrastructure that most nonprofits don't have, that the surrounding area don't have the Southland Congress 2.5 million people. That's where students come from our students, the what we see whatever greatness we see in our students, whatever challenges we see in our students are all a reflection of our community, the surrounding area, and the Social Justice Initiative affords the opportunity to address some of the challenges first generation college students or college students who are experiencing other diverse challenges, right? It could be some kind of special need or special ability. Right? It could be it could very well be rural. What does it mean to be a student who lives in a rural area? And what are some of those challenges? The Social Justice Initiative is able to look at the environment of the Southland and beyond societal, right societal concerns and say let us address them. For example, we're in two weeks we'll have a visit a site visit. We applied for grant for our legal clinic. We have numerous people in this area who don't even know how to represent themselves in court but they can't afford a lawyer. Well, geez, you will have a legal clinic under this also Justice Initiative, and that legal clinic will be able to assist underserved populations communities, in which they will be able to say, hey, can we come and meet with an attorney? Can we find out more information about how to fill out these forms? Be it immigration expungement? Or is there two other categories that are missing right now? But we're starting there, because we know everyone can't afford an attorney. Right? This will be open to the governor, state university students, but also throughout the south communities in the Southland. It's important for us to know why is that important? There are 20 skin in the state of Illinois, there are 20 communities of 10,000 or more, who have citizens who live or citizens or residents who live below poverty, out of the 26 of those communities are in the South. Right. And that's just counting those that are over 10,000, a population of 10,000, that's not counting those that are under 10,000, like afford heights, or Pennbrook. Yet that is in our area, we are able to partner with libraries with Markham courthouse and to say how do we help address these needs? That also Joy creates an opportunity for us to have our researchers, our educators to say I want to work on these particular community challenges. And we want to do right research that says what are the best practices in addressing this issue, be it hunger, or immigration, I keep saying that expungement I keep saying those, because those are really big in our areas. But there are so many other topics as well. What we're going to do, and hopefully we'll get it done by the end of this year, is we're going to have an advisory council to say let's have a strategic plan in place, put a strategic plan in place, looking at these areas of concern, or we're connecting the social justice goals directly to the needs of this area. Right. And then we can also look at the broader issues that will never go away, right race policing, and those different areas as well. And gun violence is, of course really big, a big concern for our world at this point. All right, and particularly for the United States. I don't know if I answered you, but I can keep going.

Okay, there's so much that's happening so fast with the first announcement that there is a social justice initiative. In there are already some fast moving pieces, which is fantastic, and ways in which we can first see educators getting involved in that bridge to the community. Now, let's think further out. What do you envision for the Social Justice Initiative? Moving beyond this first year?

I wouldn't say moving beyond this first year. It's I mean, this first year has been although I know Governor state, I don't know the infrastructure of Governor state. Right. I was a senior lecturer. So I'm learning the nuances. And governor of state is not the governor state that was 13 years ago. Why I'm learning the nuances, the vision, I don't have a single vision. I think we need a collective vision. It is an oxymoron to say we're doing social justice. Right? And you say what is your vision, that is a very patriarchal model that will project on to something that should not be now as a person that is leading and bringing in the uniter in bringing visionaries together, we will bring a diverse group together that a blend of Governor's stake community combined with the external community and say, Okay, this is our vision and this is what we're recommending, for the next three to five years. This is the focus. We clearly want to institutionalize, and I mean, have a structure in place. We will in 2024 have a building. Right? There'll be an actual building where the legal clinic can operate out of the building where we can have the beloved community will continue. We didn't talk about the beloved community, but the beloved community that you and I are working on, that will continue and they will be able to work out that building We will, in the future have programming where we can have dialogue, deeper dialogue around major social justice issues. And invite external partners to say, what do we do? How do we plan this? And I would love Honestly, if I had a dream, it would be to team up with the Markham courthouse and to address some of the needs we have in the Southland that are a void. And to fill in that gap, where we're looking at different things. I mean, I can fantasize a lot that I can't do it by myself. So I can say I can I can say I'll put it out there to the universe. How about that? I'll put this out there into the universe, and then somebody will pick it up who's listening to this podcast? Yeah, great, right, as he said, Yes, yes.

And your hands are full. And I just learned that you wrote a grant proposal. Yes. And that grant was accepted. Tell me about that grant,

and what you're going to be able to do with those resources. The grant is from the Illinois equal justice Foundation. And what we wrote for is a full time attorney. And the model is it's a legal clinic that combines interdisciplinary model of bringing together legal, the legal clinic combined with social work and case management. We're concerned that often people come to and are in need of an attorney, but are also in need of other social services. We want to link people to those services, be able to walk with them, and say, Okay, we're going to connect you and we're going to make sure and we're going to follow up to make sure you get the support you need. We're the link, we're not going to be the service providers. But as a case manager, we will link people, our students to services. As you know, many of our students have had housing challenges they have had, even I mean, family, right? Family law is a part of what we do. And we will be able to listen, advise, help them fill out forms, and refer them if they need a therapist and get a therapist. If they need food, they'll get food, if they need housing, we can connect them to the South Suburban Housing Center. The grant will afford us to the model, I'll tell you the model, the model in which we wrote, I always say we because you never do anything alone, right. And the it will be a coal, a coal led model, Dr. Vince Jones, who's an attorney will be over the legal clinic part of it, he'll be over all the legal part, he will have pro bono lawyers as well as law interns, then I will be responsible for CO directing all social service needs, as well as all administrative needs of the entire legal clinic. We will have social work interns and case management interns and clearly, although obviously, in Social Work interns, we're definitely going to be open in opportunity, if counseling and other are able to do case management and prepare them. So it will be a training opportunity for students. And as you know, we also have this MOU with SIU and GSU. And we're hoping that we will be able to partner with them as well. Yeah. So we're looking at and we're excited about it. It's a model that is not in this region, you very seldom seek legal clinics that has a case management component, to see the whole person. Right. It's very much needed. And Governor state is really coming into his own of being that jewel of the South. And the President would say we are the jewel of just in case she's listening. She would say, We are the jewel of

us. Yes, we're just shining brighter.

I'm excited about the clinic. It's a big deal.

It is a big deal. I mean, it's this so very much needed. It is a big deal. When you look at being in that area, and students, how far do students have to go to go to the grocery store, the nearest grocery store, just the simple necessities and the many needs that are in the south man. You know, I applaud you on this.

Thank you. I would hope that there's a space for any justice issue that's out there for other for other faculty to get involved in. We just need to set the structure because it's very important to do social justice work with an agreement of how we see it because there Are many things right? It can mean many things to many people. But we must have a standard set, that we're not doing business as usual. But we've been very intentional and thoughtful. And those of us who come together agreeing that this is how we're going to collectively work together.

Thank you so much for talking with us today. It's been a fantastic opportunity for educators and for students, and for our community members to learn more about you about GSU. And about listening for opportunities, and minding the words we say to our young children, because they keep they shape who we become,

well possibly be a little rebellious and not believe it.

Apps. Absolutely. Right? Absolutely. Yes. It's been a pleasure. It's been a pleasure getting to know you better. And again, I think like Amy, I think the segment is so powerful, especially to that college student. That's just trying to figure it out. You didn't wake up one day, and I'm Dr. Phyllis West. You know, this was an entire journey. But it was adventurous. And it was a journey of love, and you know, wonderful friends and all of those things. Well, thank

you. And I think we have so many of these stories at GSU. And my desire is for us to get those stories out. I would love for some kind of way for us to highlight the journeys, because if our students understood, and saw our journeys, they will go Oh, wow. Right. I know. Thank you for joining us. But pleasure. Thank you. It was actually fun. I didn't know what to expect. Thank

you for listening to teaching and leading with Dr. Amy and Dr. Joi. Visit our website at govst.edu/teaching and leading podcast to see the show notes from this episode.

We appreciate Governor State University's work behind the scenes to make publishing possible. Stay tuned for more episodes with Dr. Amy and Dr. Joi.