Today’s podcast dives into the fascinating world of in-car technology and its implications for driving instructors and learners alike.

Vicky Folland joins Terry Cook to discuss the importance of embracing technology to enhance driving skills rather than replace them. They explore various tech features, such as cruise control, lane assist, and autonomous emergency braking, examining how these can make driving safer and more efficient.

The conversation also highlights the need for instructors to teach the fundamentals of driving while integrating modern technology into lessons, ensuring learners are well-prepared for the vehicles they'll encounter post-test. With a playful tone and plenty of insights, this episode encourages a positive approach to technology in driving education, emphasizing that it should serve as a valuable aid rather than a crutch.

Season 9 of The Instructor Podcast is sponsored by MyDriveTime, the industry's premium, award-winning business management app.

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Terry Cook welcomes driving instructor Vicky Folland to discuss the integration of technology in driving lessons. The conversation dives into the importance of embracing modern car technologies such as adaptive cruise control, lane assist, and in-car entertainment systems. Vicky shares her experiences with students who have varying levels of comfort with tech, highlighting the need for instructors to teach the fundamentals of driving while also introducing these technological aids. They emphasize that technology should enhance driving skills rather than replace them, noting the anxiety some learners feel towards new systems. Vicky illustrates how introducing gadgets like smartphone connectivity for music can make lessons more enjoyable and reduce stress for learners, as well as the importance of teaching students how to use these features effectively before they take their tests. The episode also addresses the scepticism surrounding the use of technology in driving, exploring the fears related to losing control and the need for instructors to remain positive and proactive in promoting tech-savvy driving skills.

Takeaways:

• Embracing in-car technology not only enhances driving skills but also builds learner confidence.
• It's essential for driving instructors to teach the fundamentals before introducing technology.
• Autonomous vehicles will reduce accidents, but human supervision remains crucial for safety.
• Learners need to understand the technology in their vehicles for safe driving practices.
• Effective vehicle checks should be part of every driving lesson to prevent accidents.
• A positive attitude towards technology can significantly influence learner acceptance and understanding.

The Instructor Podcast with Terry Cook talking with leaders, innovators, experts and game changers about what drives them.

Welcome to the Instructor Podcast.

This is a show that helps you become an even more awesome driving instructor.

And as always, I am your bang average horse, Terry Cook.

And I'm delighted to be even more delighted that you have chosen to listen because we are continuing our season nine which is based all around technology.

And who better to have sponsor season nine than My Drive Time, the industry's premium award winning business management app.

Find out more@mydrivetime.co.uk but on today's show I am joined by Vicky Folland as we take a look at how we can introduce the different types of in car technology that we have into lessons and with our learners.

Really enjoyed speaking to Vicki today and yeah, you'll hear on the episode itself how she taught me some stuff.

So really interesting episode today.

But just before we get stuck into the episode, I want to point you in the direction of the instructor podcast website.

That's www.theinstructorpodcast.com.

over there you can find everything that we have to offer, including all the entire back catalog of episodes, the free resource we've got and more details on our paid membership for which there is currently a free weeks trial.

Find out more@theinstructorpodcast.com but for now let's get stuck into the show.

So today on the instructor podcast I am joined by the wonderful Vicky Fox Holland.

How are we doing Vicky?

Yeah, I'm very well, thank you.

How are you all?

Better for seeing your smiley face obviously.

And the reason I got you on stage because I wanted to talk about the sort of in car tech and how we can use that with our students and I was trying to think who we could get on and I thought who better than yourself because you are you very much on the green train, you're on the eco train, you're on the tech train, you are working in fleet, you work with learners, you're a globe trot, are going all over the world to learn, to teach, to develop all this kind of stuff.

So I thought who better to get on than yourself?

And I think I want to start off by asking you because I was giving you all those different hats to wear.

How would you describe yourself and what you do?

That's a big intro to follow that.

That made me sound really important.

I'm a driving instructor and I'm a mom.

That'll do for me.

That'll do for me.

Let's, let's get Stuck straight in, then.

Because we were talking about the.

In car tech today, and I'm intrigued on your thoughts generally, because I still see a lot of negativity.

So just by drivers.

Never mind instructors, just drivers that complain.

I mean, look, I have a conversation with my dad every time I see him about cruise control because he despises the thing.

And not just that, any technology.

If it were down to him, I think I'd still be like Fred Flintstone running a car.

But I'm wondering what your thought is on tech overall.

Should we be embracing it or should we be a bit, you know, approaching with caution or what?

I like a gadget and I like driving tech.

Really, though I'm a bit of a technophobe when it comes to computers and other things like that.

I have a bit of a.

I don't almost have a bit of an energy around me.

And sometimes automatic doors don't open, computers never work, printers do random things.

Card machines go off every time I go near them.

But driving tech seems to be fine.

I'm all right with that bit.

You say card machines go off whenever I go near them.

Okay, interesting.

Well, that'll be why my zoom's playing up today.

That'll be what that is then.

I'm a bit cursed with technology, I really am.

But driving tech seems to be my thing.

But every other tech.

Absolutely not.

Can't do it at all.

Why do you think so many people are negative towards it?

I think people don't like change.

People don't like to feel like they're losing control.

Yeah, some people don't understand it.

So it's that fear of the unknown, I think, isn't it?

And I don't want to learn how to do that.

I've done it my way for all these years and being absolutely fine.

It's totally unnecessary.

I.

I also wonder if it's an element of.

How can I put this?

It's that fear of someone's telling me I'm not good enough.

Now if I need this assistance in my car, I'm not good enough.

Do you reckon that comes into play as well?

Yeah, definitely.

Very.

Everyone's very, very defensive about their own driving.

I do a lot of defensive driving courses and nobody likes their driving critiqued.

Everyone likes to think they're really good at it and nobody likes to be told, actually, maybe you could do this better, maybe that could be better.

But the reality is people crash every single day, and they don't crash because they weren't good enough to pass a driving test.

We get distracted, we get complacent.

So if we can put some technology in place, it's going to take that little bit away and make us a little bit safer.

Why wouldn't you be all for it?

I agree wholeheartedly.

And moving this into kind of the instructor part, if you like.

I still see some resistance there from instructors and I think there's some of it which is the same thing against kind of technology, but I think I see some around.

It's like we shouldn't necessarily be teaching our learners because when they get the first character, not mine have the second stuff.

So do you agree, do you think that we should be teaching our learners as much as we can or should we be taking that approach of hold off because they might not have been a new car or whatever?

I think it's important that we still teach the fundamentals and we get that right first.

We don't want anybody to become reliant on technology.

It doesn't matter whether you're learning or you've been passed.

The technology is there to enhance your skills, not to replace them.

So we have to teach the fundamentals and the basics before we can then start looking at that.

But you know, when power assisted steering came in, do you think instructors went, actually we're not going to use that.

You've still got to fight that wheel round.

When people got windows that opened with the touch of a button, nobody said, actually, I'd rather keep my winder.

Things progress and things move on down there.

I bet there was someone that said it.

You know, I miss my older handle still window done.

But no, I think you're right.

I do.

I do think we need to teach those basics.

Do you know what?

I love that phrase you is that technology is there to enhance our driving.

I like that phrase.

But I think the other thing I'm interested in your thoughts on this is I mentioned about the car learners get after a test.

Do you think this is part of our role as well now?

Because it's something that I've shifted a lot this year in that I used to say to students, you should buy the cheapest car you can get your insurance on that.

And now I'm very much buy the most expensive car you can buy the car with the most tech, the most safety features to keep you safe on the road.

Are you in that camp and do you think we should be doing more of that?

Definitely about the safety rating.

You know, some tech's not, you know, some tech's pretty and it's brilliant.

But is it going to keep you safe and your car might have a five star safety rating but if you are going to get in and then turn off lane assist, turn off emergency braking and not use the features that are there, we now don't have a five star safety rated vehicle.

Yeah, no, I get that, I get that.

I just, I think that we need to take.

We're in a position where we're teaching people to drive and then when they pass they're going and buying a car.

So we were in a position where we can give them that advice, aren't we?

To go and buy the safest, the best, whatever you want to phrase it, vehicle for them.

But let's move on to some specific technology then because the first one I want to talk to is probably the least important but the one that intrigues me the most, which is I've got a few students, when they come in my car, they just connect their phone to my car straight away.

They'll have a playlist for that they want while they're driving so they connect it or they've got the Spotify playlist and whack it on.

And I think that's great.

And the annoying thing is they can use that radio better than I can like straight away and it just takes me 20 minutes to work out.

I do it.

Is that something you would encourage?

Is that something you do?

We all learners?

Absolutely.

You know, if somebody wants to listen to their own music rather than mine, that's absolutely fine.

I had somebody pass their test recently and she connected our phone up and we listened to 100 Grizzly song.

She had a little sing along.

The examiner didn't join in.

I was a bit disappointed.

But yeah, why not?

You know, it's their time, isn't it?

And while I drive in it fundamentally their vehicle.

No.

So if that helps you absolutely connect up.

Absolutely, yeah.

I also think that's a, almost a good way to introduce that technology and let them know you can press these buttons, you can do this stuff.

And, and you know what, you mentioned it then and I think it's worth mentioning because there's still people that don't know it's completely fine to have music on your lessons and they'll let you have it on a test.

And yes, I'm disappointed that examiner yours didn't have a sing song as well, I think.

Do you, do you, do you have an opinion on this?

Because I genuinely advise him.

Again, stuff like hardcore hip hop generally try and go for something more mellow.

Do you suggest that or is it just do what you want, I think.

You know, as long as it's not offensive, I think just crack on, you know, it doesn't need to be loud, does it?

You don't want it blaring anywhere.

You're not going to be on.

Especially when you're driving test cruising up to the traffic lights, window down with your boombox absolutely blasting in the base, like making the car next door you move.

So, you know, I think as long as, you know, it's not offensive, just crack on, that's fine.

Yeah, I mean, yeah, I think you're right.

And do you know what?

It's also a good way to build up a bit of rapport and put students at ease.

But let's move on then, because I do want to ask you specifically about some of the tech you use and how you work for it, but I want to start with cruise control because I think, and I mentioned this before in my dad actually, but I think that this is the one that seemed to evoke the biggest reaction from people, cruise control.

So just to start with, is it something you use when you're driving, is it something you get your learners using?

I love it.

I absolutely love it.

And maybe this is the eco side of it coming out because we're more efficient and we're turning that, that steady speed.

So I use it a lot when I'm driving.

I encourage my learner drivers to use it when we're doing dual carriageway lessons.

Absolutely.

I don't know why you wouldn't use it, especially the one who I've got in my car.

It's adaptive.

So it reads the road signs, it watches the traffic conditions, it keeps the distance safe between us and the car in front.

Why wouldn't, why wouldn't you use that makes life loads easier.

See, I don't have adaptive cruise control.

I'm.

I'm old fashioned, you know, I've got the.

Yeah, I'm old fashioned.

I don't have adaptive cruise control keepers.

But what I do, I love it as well.

And one of the things I like about mine, and obviously this isn't the adaptive aspect, but you can just change your speed on it just with a flick of a button.

And I really like that, that it, it keeps me planning.

And I think this works quite well with students as well because one of the things that.

My dad's a perfect example for this because I can hear him back in my head now mourning about it, he'll say that if he sees something changing up ahead, the car won't See it, and yours might, but mine wouldn't.

So how are people going to adapt to that?

And.

And it is right to a degree, because if you were driving, you'd just ease off the gas a little bit.

But if your cruise control's on and it's not adapted, you would consciously have to press the brake or whatever.

And I think that works really well on lessons because it makes students look ahead because they know they're going to have to make a change.

And like I say with mine, when you just tweak the button, it's like, I see someone up ahead, I'll just drop it down from 30 to 27 and it's beautiful.

But how do you introduce that to lessons then?

Before we do any dual carriageway lesson, we always have a chat about slip roads and speed, especially if we do a national speed limit and we can get up to 70, say.

I think that one of the hardest things to teach is that constant speed, because they're that busy worrying about overtaking what's on what side, looking in the mirrors, and at high speed, the tiniest little change on that accelerator pedal can make speed drop from 70, 60, 65.

So if we've just overtaken something, I find that my pupils have a tendency to then try and slow down as we're trying to move back across into the left hand lane, which is not a great idea because whatever we've just overtaken is going to catch us up.

So we have that chat before we go about maintaining that constant speed and the importance of maintaining the speed, not only just for, obviously my eco stuff, but, you know, for safety and what's happening around us, because other people need to plan around us.

If we're constantly changing, so is everybody else.

And then when we're going along, I'll just say, how are you finding your speed?

Are you managing okay?

Actually, I might be struggling a little bit.

So can we get it more constant?

Can we stop the fluctuating right now?

We've done that.

Press that button.

That's the cruise control.

Look what happens now.

That's what maintaining that speed looks like.

Okay, that's not quite what I was doing.

I was still fluctuating.

And then turn it off.

I'll give it another go.

Turn it back on.

I think actually it helps.

It's like as an aid, it's not a replacement, it's an aid.

I love that.

I've.

I've never done that before.

I use the cruise control, but I've never thought of using it as a demonstration that I'M going to bring that into my lesson now.

I'm glad we've had this chat.

I think that's a really good way to do it, to practice with them on that long stretch and then get them to add the cruise control to see what it feels like.

I think that's a great idea.

Well, you throw me there with a really good idea.

Not that I wasn't expecting you to have great ideas, obviously.

To be honest.

That one works a treat.

But I mean, just thinking of using that example along stretch of dual carriageways and along on what you could do on motorways as well.

Do you ever set them that challenge of getting to 70, for example, getting your cruise control on and then maintaining it at 70 for as long as possible.

So therefore you're having a plan further ahead just to keep that speed.

Absolutely, yeah, absolutely.

You know, especially if you've got a car with a smaller engine, it's hard work get into that speed in the first place, so it's much easier to maintain it.

But it does require planning.

We've got to be looking further ahead down the road.

We've got to anticipate, we've got to be watching for people merging on slip roads and coming out of service station.

We've got to make sure that we've planned that in which that's going to make them safer drivers.

That's not going to help you push your driving test necessarily, but it's going to keep you safe once you've passed.

Yeah, I completely agreed.

And do you find that's where you use it most, dual carriageways, motorways, or do you.

Do you use it elsewhere as well?

I don't use it through our town because we've got that many changes in speed limit.

We go 20, 30, 40, we even have some 50 roads and then we're back to 20s again.

So the adaptive cruise control would work, but how many of them would have that?

So it's not.

So unless they specifically asked to do it, it's not something that I would say, let's turn it on, because by the time we've got it on, it's off.

Yeah.

So, sorry, Terry, would depend on your location, wouldn't it, and what your area was like?

I completely agree because I was going to give my sort of personal example for me.

I'm.

I'm at the top of the hill, a place called Saltair, and there's a really steep bend.

You're going up here that you do about 20 miles an hour up, and I'm a lazy sod.

I just bob the cruise control there, set it to 20 and take my feet off at pedals and I can just steer and it makes my life so much easier.

And that's probably not somewhere where you'd necessarily think to use the cruise control, but in that situation it works perfectly.

So, yeah, I think you're right.

It depends on the.

On the situation completely.

Well, let's move on then.

I want to ask you about the technology you use.

So have you got some examples of tech that you use and how you use it with your students?

Yes.

So my learner assists automatically on in my car.

So the first few times my pupils will feel that is when they're not in their lane or when the road markings about and my car's trying to force them one way or the other.

So some of them would prefer just to switch it off, which is fine.

Some of them will say, can you show me how to do that?

That's not a problem at all.

So lane assist always on, because that's where it just comes straight on.

So you have to actually turn that off.

Lane assist is brilliant.

Like motorways, dual carriage wears.

It stops that wandering and we all see it happening when we're on long journeys, you see other people doing it, wondering about all over.

So I think it's brilliant for that.

But we've got a problem, as in our roll back into our rubbish.

We can't see them and our cars can't see them either.

So technology is brilliant.

Infrastructure not so great.

Yeah, no, that makes sense.

I like the LAN assist and I think one of the good things I found it useful for is I think it weirdly helps students signaling for that lane change.

Because when you signal in, the learner assist won't kick in, you don't feel it and there's the odd time and I'll allow it to happen, if it's safe.

Where they'll go to change lanes, you know, no one's there, they've got to change lanes and the car will vibrate and it'll flash up saying, stay in your own lane and oh, I didn't signal.

They bob the signal back on and it's.

I'm not saying they necessarily should have that, but it's almost itself.

It's a nice little learned.

Have you come across that as well?

Yeah, absolutely.

I think the problem with that lane assist and that signaling is it promotes an automatic response.

So what we're really then teaching them is you just need to signal the change lens.

But hang on one minute.

What?

Where's Our judgment gone because you don't always need to signal on.

So we shouldn't just be teaching, we always have to signal.

I think it's really important that that judgment call's still there.

What's happening around us, who's benefiting from this signal?

And I think with Learn Assist that is a huge downfall because it sort of takes that decision making away, where it's just we have to put one on, we have to put one on and it becomes so automatic.

Unless you've got blind spot monitoring that's going to stop you from making that lane change.

You're going to be across and you haven't checked.

I'm really glad you made that point because it's not one I would have thought to make.

And I remember a student recently saying so much along the lines of, I hate changing lanes this car because I've got to faucet.

And it will because she wasn't signaling.

So she felt the car pull it and she had to push against it.

So, yeah, it's a really good point because the great thing about this technology is that it does help keep us safe.

It does add in these extra barriers.

But like the point you just made, we still have to be vigilant as drivers and as instructors and making sure our learners are vigilant as well.

And you know, obviously you're a top class instructor, but have you found that a hindrance at times to teaching learners?

Have you found that you've had to almost overcome some of these technological issues?

And I fully embrace the tech and as soon as I get a new car, I know what all the gadgets are.

I am that person.

Don't press that button.

What?

That button.

I will press it straight away.

So I need to find out what it all done.

So for me personally, I enjoyed that.

For some pupils, they don't want to know and they don't want to embrace that.

Especially some pupils who are maybe got anxiety or neurodiversity and they're already dealing with a lot with driving.

And then hang on, there's a button here for this and there's a button there for that.

And a learner says, going to move the car.

But I'm on a minute, I want to move the car.

And so I think for some people it can be a huge disadvantage.

Again, it's been able to tailor it to them, isn't it?

And help them overcome that in a way that they can see that as a positive rather than something I don't want because eventually all cars are going to have this tech in, not new cars.

Have it in.

We can turn it off at the moment, some of it, but it's going to get to the point where we're not going to have choice.

It is there and we're going to have to embrace it.

Do you know what?

I think that's perfect because you mentioned before as well about this tech is there to enhance our driving.

And I think that's what we need to have our learners in there.

It's.

We need to get them using the tech in the way that works for them to help them with their driving.

So if that's use the example before the road by me, that's all bending me, just being lazy and making that drive a bit more comfortable for me and do it in a way that helps me.

I think that's what we need to get along.

And have you come across much resistance with your learners with this?

Because the reason I asked that question, I'll put some context on it because I very, very rarely do.

I've got one bit of tech in my car that I'll touch in a bit that I occasionally get a bit of rebuttal with.

But generally my learners just love it.

But I seem to see a lot of other people complaining.

So I'm wondering if you come across any negativity from your learners or any of the fleet guys that you work with.

Some of the fleet, some of the wagon drivers and some of the tech that they've got, they are not a fan of the wagons and things will break sometimes, though, they'll misread road signs and they'll whack the brakes on on that wagon to bring the speed limit down.

And that's not correct.

And then they're potentially in a more dangerous position.

So certainly doing fleet, I think there's more resistance, but it depends on the technology.

And I feel that for some fleet, especially for the sort of the wagon drivers, they feel like it's big brothers watching me.

Everything's monitored.

There's cameras inside the cab, their steering's been monitored, their brakes with their accelerator.

Everything's been monitored to like an nth of a degree.

And there's a lot more advances in technology in these bigger vehicles and there seems to be in our little cars at the moment.

So I think certainly on the fleet side, yes, probably a little bit more resistance.

But for my learner drivers, I think because I approach it with a positive attitude, I think, you know, you get back what you put out a lot of the time.

So I hate the sat nav I hate it.

That's one bit of check I just cannot get with.

I can't really use it.

It confuses me.

The voice makes me really, really angry.

I would happily let my pupils reverse over it all day long.

And I hate that.

I tell my pupils I hate that.

But even though I'm saying I hate it, most of them are absolutely fine with it because I think they're just used to it.

It wasn't a satnav when I started learning to drive.

I didn't own one until I was an instructor.

It's not something I wanted to use where a lot of them, they'll use it, just Google Maps, just walking about.

So they're so used to that technology that they don't even think of it as tech.

It's just to what we have to what we use.

A couple of things I want to back on then, because again, you said something really key is that having that positive attitude.

And I think that's so lacking it in some stuff where, you know, if we come in and we're enthusiastic and talking about the positives and the negatives, you know, the stuff that doesn't always be great.

So we're not just saying it's all sunshine and roses, but we come in with that positive attitude.

That's how we get people on board when we come in.

You know, I always think back to when they brought the pull up on the right maneuver onto the test.

I couldn't get my head around that.

And I used to just complain about it to all my students.

I don't know why we're doing this.

It's not appropriate.

High record, ra ra ra ra.

None of them liked it.

And then I shifted my attitude and I started being positive about it.

All of a sudden they started getting on board and it's, it's not going to work every single time, but it's definitely going to have a bigger impact if we're positive, isn't it?

Absolutely.

Yes, absolutely.

Why would you want to bring your negative attitude to work anywhere?

Like, I know I've just said I hate the satnav and I'll openly say that, but we just make a bit of a joke about it.

And when they can follow it better than me, I always ask them to give me a lesson.

But, you know, I, I want to come to work and have a great time.

I don't want to come and sit there and be miserable and whinge all day.

Like, that must be so tiring and draining and you must come home feeling absolutely awful.

But There's a big difference for me in the way that you just described.

You don't like satnav and.

And the way other people do.

Because that to me didn't sound negative.

That sounded playful.

I don't like sunlight.

It's not for me.

You know, it sounded jovial, even though you don't like it.

So if I was your learner there, well, maybe I'm misreading that.

But just a happy person to me.

There you go.

But I love the sat nav.

Honestly, it's my favorite thing.

And I think it's because I'm genuinely.

Don't give a toss if I go the wrong way.

I'm not like.

It's not one of the things I just say to put students ease.

It's like, I just.

It's like a view as having someone just giving me general guidance.

And because I've got that mindset, I love it.

It's just like, okay, I'm going over there, right?

Sat nav's in.

And I'm aware.

And I just find it.

The only thing I don't like about something is when it interrupts my music.

That's the only thing I dislike about it.

But, you know, I just.

I think she's so rude.

She's so rude and she's so impatient.

She's like, turn left, turn left, turn left.

I'm like, I am.

When I get there in a minute, check my mirrors.

I've signaled.

I'm aware of the traffic.

I'm getting on with it.

Leave me alone.

If I said to my pupil, turn left.

And then in another 100 yards, said, turn left, then got right on top of the junction and said, turn left, they'd say, just be quiet.

Do you think satnav should say turn left when it's safe?

Yeah.

And a couple of my pupils have said, would I be a voice on sat nav?

So just to give some little road safety tips as we went as well.

So I like approaching a roundabout, third exit.

Think about repositioning.

Stay in your lane 100.

Do that.

Out of curiosity, what accent have you got on your sat nav?

Is it Serena?

Is that the standard?

I don't know.

I've got mine.

Well, that shows how much you like it.

I think maybe I've got mine specifically set to Australian.

I'll switch between Australian, Irish.

So there you go.

Yes.

Invite the examiner shoes.

But if I'm.

If I use it myself, I have to turn the voice off.

That is my personal trigger.

Like, makes me really stressed.

I can't be listening to her.

I have to quit.

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And they are John Sewell, Ian Kilby and Alistair.

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Now, with that membership, they get immediate access to hundreds of hours of video, audio and written training to help them become even more awesome driving instructors.

So whether you're looking to grow your business, become a better instructor, or get some help looking after your mental health and mindset, sign up to the Instructor Podcast Premium.

There's currently a three weeks trial or you can get a 16 discount with an annual membership.

To find out more, use the link in the show notes or head to the website theinstructor podcast.com but I also want to take a moment to thank my drive time for being sponsors of Season nine and take the opportunity to shout out about one of my favorite my drive time features.

And that's the ability to create multiple progress trackers for different types of students so we can add unique things such as parking on driveways or with one of my students specifically, a very specific type of roundabout.

Loads of you that are in Leeds will know as lawnswood roundabout.

She has a phobia about this roundabout.

So on her progress tracker we have roundabouts and within that roundabout section we have lawnswood roundabout specifically for her.

I love that I can do this and so does she.

It's the last thing she wants to do.

It's the last thing on her lesson she wants to do.

But either way, enough about that.

To find out more about my drive time, head to mydrivetime.co.uk but for now let's get back into the show and you know, let's tie the sat nav in.

We're learning a bit then.

So how do you bring in the sat nav into lessons?

We, we sort of learners specifically.

So after we've mastered the basics then we'll say, right, let's look at the independent driving.

So we'll do a lesson where we do sat nav and road signs.

Because I normally say you, you know, you normally prefer one or the other.

You're normally better at one than the other.

I love, I love a road sign.

So we'll, we'll go and we'll just follow up out of a test route round and to be honest, they all find it absolutely fine and most of them prefer that and they really get really excited about putting the sat nav on.

Or we can.

We.

We use the sat nav if they want to.

We can use Google Maps on the phone.

We can use the inbuilt car one.

That's fine.

Always.

Just take the TomTom, because this is the one that you're going to see on your test.

But I don't even mind which one we use.

I don't like any of them, so I don't mind which one we use.

Yeah.

Do you ever find that it seems to be on their mind?

It's quite a big thing.

But then when you do it once, they're almost like done with it.

Oh, that was easy.

Right.

I'm done that.

Because I seem to get that a lot, that it's a big.

It feels like a big thing from.

And then they see how simple it is and it's like, oh, no, that was all that was, you know, whatever.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

I think a lot of them prefer the satnav because it tells you and you can see and it'll tell you and tell you and tell you where were the road signs.

If you missed it, you missed it.

Yeah.

The one of the things I do, and I don't know if this is something you do, I'll be interested in your thoughts, is like you said about the inbuilt sat nav from lesson one.

I make sure that that's got the map screen on the sat nav screen.

Even if you're not using it, that'll be on there.

So it's not like a new thing when all of a sudden they've got this map there.

Is that something you do?

Is it something you'd encourage?

In my Mini, we've got no maps at all.

So more basic in the electric car, the maps are there.

I think, again, it comes down to personal preference and the type of person that you're teaching that can be quite a distraction and people start looking at it rather than the road.

One of my friends uses the sat nav and drives it like a computer game and stops looking at the road.

So they plan their bends and turns and everything off the map, which I think is absolutely crazy.

Again, it's just personal preference, I think, isn't it?

And knowing your pupils and making sure it's right for them.

You're making me nervous thinking of driving like that.

Now, I want to ask you about Hill Hold Assist.

Do you have or have you had experience with Hill Hold Assist?

Yeah.

So my Mini's got a little bit of it.

You mean, don't get me wrong, you can still roll backwards.

But it's not like when I learn to drive where, you know, the minute that you moved your feet, you were going to have a roll.

And that caused me quite a lot of anxiety when I was learning.

And even when I passed, I remember, like smelling that horrible Bernie clutch smell.

So I was that worried about stalling or rolling on the hills of way too much gas on and holding the clutch because I didn't dare put my handbrake on in case I couldn't find my feet again and ended up rolling backwards.

So I think that's our technology.

That's.

That's great, isn't it?

And lots of learners probably don't even know it's that.

This is the one for me that causes the most debate, shall we say, on lessons, because for the listeners that don't know, the hill hold assist is where you've got your foot brake on, on a hill.

And when you come off, the car will lock for about two to three seconds, I think, depending on the car.

And even if you find your biting point, it will still stay locked.

The only way to unlock it is to hold that two or three seconds, or as soon as you press a gas pedal will override it.

So for anyone listening, that's what that is.

That doesn't kick in with a handbrake.

So you've got the handbrake on, it won't kick in.

And this causes real debate with my learners because some of them love it.

They think it's great because it's like that safety net.

So if they've just stopped on a hill and for whatever reason they're not using the handbrake, they know they've got three seconds to do whatever they're doing before they sit off.

And it's like this massive safety net.

But then I've got other students that come to it, and this is where the preference comes in.

Like you spoke about before, they hate it with all of their being.

They despise it because they find the biting point, they come off their foot break and then the car's not moving.

And then it's like that little delay before they find the gas and all they can hear is the noise because they're at biting point but the wheels are locked and it's just horrible.

And I have so much fun with that on lessons because I'm quite mean.

And I will make the ones that don't like it do it more just because it amuses me.

Have you.

I know you Said you're not.

You've got a bit of it in your car.

Have you had any students sort of react positively or adversely towards that?

No, mine's not as bad as that.

So.

Because my money's getting on a little bit now, Big bang.

The love of my life is.

Yeah.

Knocking on some years now.

So it's sort of like a very early version of that, I suppose.

Or.

No, you're not gonna roll as much.

I wouldn't even say it was a thing.

In my car, we just get on with it, you know, find your bike, let your gas, off we go.

But then I've got an automatic car that even when you have retested automatic car, the examiner says, pull up on the left to do a hill start.

Well, where are you going?

You're only going to go forward.

You're not going to go backwards there.

I mean, I've got auto hold in my electric car.

So, you know, when we talked about tests and it being fair and the same.

Well, it isn't, is it?

Like if you've got all this technology or how that hasn't, or if you get a parallel park or a park on the right or some.

Not the same test, is it?

It's not.

But, you know, it's interesting, when I was at the convention in April or earlier on this year, the dvs, they were speaking there, weren't they?

And they were saying that they can't mandate this technology because that's discriminant against people that don't have it, but they do encourage you to use it.

And, you know, I encourage my youth learners to use it as well.

But just going back to that hill hold, I always forget the hold bit.

The hill hold assist.

I just.

I just think it's one of the things that I love it personally, and I'm slightly apprehensive about when I change cars because I lease my car.

So I'll get a new one next year, I think.

And I'm slightly nervous that my next car will have it because I've got.

I just love this.

I find it's just.

I can just, you know, come off my brake.

I don't even have to find my banking point.

And I think it's just such a wonderful little thing.

But I think the thing I want to get across here, and I'm sure you'll agree, so please share your thoughts, is that even with this, I will teach my students to set off without it so they're not using it.

Because as much as we want them to get the safe, the more techno technological car, if you like.

Processors still might not, so we still need to teach them kind of every aspect.

Your handbrake set off your hills is set off your non hill set off.

So I'm presuming you'd agree with that.

Absolutely.

We've got to be able to get the fundamentals and the basics right and driving is just starting and stopping, isn't it?

You know, whether it be on a hill, junctions, traffic lights and the world's not flat.

So when we talk about hill staff, we think of a hill and quite a steep gradient where actually on the approach to the roundabout you're probably going up slightly up a slight gradient.

When you park up on the left, the road's probably not flat, it doesn't have to be a steep hill.

So we're stopping and starting all the time.

So I don't specifically teach hill starts as a lesson, unless someone who's got severe anxiety rap, because how many times actually are we stopping and starting just on the flat?

I think when you put the word hill start in, it sort of like gets that panic going or actually quite often I'll say, oh, that was a great hill start.

And they're like, oh, did I do a hell start?

And I'm like, yeah, we're on a hill because we haven't dressed it up as that and called it that and parked them on the side of a mountain.

Then they haven't realized it's even happened.

It's interesting you say that because that's kind of what I used to, especially on the first lesson, I'd always try and get my first ever set off on a hill and they wouldn't notice.

Nine times out of 10 and IQ, the only time I would bring it in specifically is if they were saying they were concerned about hill starts.

But I found that with this car I kind of have to because it's got this technology.

So it goes back to what I was saying before.

There's definitely positives there because it reduces the risk of rolling back.

But the negative is now I have to do this hill start aspect of it.

So yeah, it's interesting, but is there any other technology that you can think of that you sort of specifically either teach your learners or talk about with your learners?

I think revising cameras comes up a lot still, doesn't it, in the technology and can you use it?

Is it allowed?

And like I've said with the other technology it's a, an aid rather than a replacement.

That doesn't stop you checking it Gives you extra information.

So we can't just look at the camera and watch it like the telly.

We still have to be fully aware, but it's given us extra information.

I think people got worried about being able to use the sensors on the cameras in the car as well.

That's fine as long as it's not replacing the checks that you need to be making too.

I think that's quite a common one that lots of people have in their car now, isn't it?

Some sort of at least a sensor?

Yeah.

I don't just.

There's no parking sensor in there, there's no cameras and I've never actually driven a car.

I've driven a car with parking sensors, but never on my cameras.

But I've.

I've been in one with a camera once.

It was the weirdest thing because it was a bird's eye view, so the camera was looking down upon the camera.

How does this work?

This.

There isn't a camera above the car.

How are we looking down?

There's obviously ways to cameras around the car, but it just.

That completely baffled me and I think genuinely that I will find that more distracting if I've got a camera and I've got sympathy for learners.

I've got that because I can see why someone would find it more distracting.

So, yeah, I think that.

But no, you're right again, it goes back to.

We use it as an aid, but we've got to make sure we get those observations in as well.

So I'm going to chuck another couple in here because there's one for my car that I can't teach, but I can talk about and I struggle with this word, so bear with me.

Autonomous.

Oh, got it.

Right.

So if we can do it twice.

Autonomous emergency braking.

So again, for those that don't know, there's a sensor at the front of the car and if something was to, for example, pull out in front of the car, that will kick in.

If we're not breaking.

It will basically kick in with the brakes and the car will stop and a big flashing sign comes on the dashboard saying, you know, warning.

And the reason I know that is because it's happened and it happened once when inadvertently and this car came flying out from the left and stopped at the junction.

But my car sensed it was coming and the learning was driving.

It just kicked in and the learner thought the car had broken because it had just come up, it had just stopped and the.

The red light come on and then it will.

I suddenly realized I've Never discussed this with my students.

So.

No, because it had never happened, Terry.

It's not something that I've ever discussed with my students.

Yeah.

But now I do, you know, now.

And it said discussion.

It's not like a massive long two hours pulled up at side of road, but it'll be somewhat where we talking about something else technology wise.

And I'll say, oh, while we're talking about this, let me mention this.

Have you heard of.

You know.

And sometimes I'll say the word correctly, sometimes I will.

Autonomous emergency braking.

And sometimes I've got loads of questions.

Sometimes you just want to explain in.

So I think that's one.

And the other one that ties in with that a little bit is ecol, which my understanding.

I don't think I'm wrong.

My understanding is that every new car will now have the E Call feature.

So does any.

Do either of your cars have E Call?

Yes.

Right.

Not in my Mini, because like I said, we're knocking on a little bit, but in my electric car.

Yeah.

Do you talk about that with your students?

Only if they go, what's that?

And look up and like, don't touch the buttons up there.

So only if it came up.

Some of them are interested.

But no, I'm not.

It's not something that I've probably even thought to say.

See, I'll be honest, that's something that I've now started tying in with the aeb.

That should be.

If I'm not storing the word again, the aeb.

Because just while we're saying that, I'll also go.

And you know what?

That does.

Because again, what I want is for them to get as much knowledge as possible.

I love the way that we both keep.

Pointless ceiling.

Yeah.

Just in case people don't know where up is, you know, or the roof.

But yeah, it's.

I think it's.

It's useful just spending that one minute and just saying, look, asking them, do you know when you'd use it?

You know how it works and just explain how it connects to the operator who will then connect you to the emergency service.

And then they've got all your data from the car then as well, which.

And I'm sure I read somewhere that the average response time is like 50% quicker if he was E call us.

Yeah, yeah.

Because it's specifically to your location, isn't it?

And I've done a social media post on it, but it's not something that I've thought to put in my lessons, but I will be from now on.

Terry.

Well, we're learning from each other today.

This is a good episode.

I like this, but I just think that one minute conversation that could make a difference for someone post test.

And I think the other thing I think I do just want to touch on here a little bit is the show me questions.

Because when we, I think this is a really good place for me to shoehorn this in.

Because when we think of the show me questions, what have you got?

You got opening windows, turning lights on, cleaning your windows, demissing your windows, that kind of stuff.

So whilst it's not necessarily modern technology, it's still a form of technology.

So perfect opportunity for me shoe this harness in and ask how you cover the show me questions.

So we normally do it a little bit later on, but what I'm going to start doing actually going forward, I think I heard this on one of your episodes that you were doing before is getting the pupils to do them sort of right from the off because they're driving.

We ask them to take part responsibility.

So, you know, we should be more aware of them.

So, you know, that's on me and I need to start doing that a bit earlier because it's normally right.

You've got your test book, let's start looking at these questions.

I always explain to them the importance like this is not just to pass your test.

When you're, you're passed and you've got your car, even if it's not your own car but you're driving somebody else's, it's your responsibility to check that things are okay.

We don't want any breakdowns, we don't want any crashes.

And you could prevent some of these things from happening by just having a quick check around.

To be fair, they all seem to quite enjoy it.

I've had a puncture mid lesson and we've had to actually go to the, to the garage and get the tire off.

And then while they're off, I'm like, right, this is where your brakes are and this is what this looks like inside and just use it as a learning opportunity.

The day my car was on fire and we needed to be recovered with a fire extinguisher.

Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on.

The day my car was on fire.

Honestly, there's a whole episode on this, on our podcast, like, it's my worst day I've ever had at work.

I honestly the love of my life on fire mid driving lesson because the people say, oh, I just rely on my sensors.

Well, I'll tell you that day, my Car was on fire.

There was not one light on that dashboard.

There was anything wrong with my car.

Just flames coming out of the bonnet.

It's.

Yeah, I'm lo.

Black smoke bellowing through the vent.

Okay, right, sorry.

You just massively threw me there with that.

Starting off, casually dropping in.

The day my car was on fire and I interrupted your story.

Please carry on.

I think you were talking about how you learn and learn from that.

So you know the importance of what to do because actually how often have you been in a car that's been on fire?

Well, that was my first time too.

So the importance of the electrics and getting the engine off and who to fall and what to do and you know, if it goes up.

Is there anything you can do?

Well, not really.

You've got to step away.

So we used it as a learning opportunity.

But I always use this story because again, with technology, we've all got lazy with these vehicle checks.

And we rely on a sensor to tell us when our tire pressure is low, a sensor to tell us when our oil needs topping up, our screen wash needs putting in, where actually if the sensors come on, it's probably late anyway.

If you're driving down the motorway and it's come on to tell you that your tire pressure is not right, well, that would have been better to know before we set off.

But the day that my car really was not okay, there was not one light that not even an engine management light came on to say there was something wrong.

So we need to stop relying on it and check ourselves.

It's really, really important.

It literally could save your life.

Just doing these show and tell questions that we, we ask people to do very much.

And you mentioned kind of hearing me talk about it before.

So just to clarify what I do, I don't necessarily cover the whole thing on that first lesson, but from the day they drive us out from their house, because often, you know, the first lesson or two, I'll drive them out somewhere.

So the, the day that the first time they drive us out, I'll get them to do a walk around, check around the car, and that's often a 32nd thing.

It's not like inspecting everything.

I mean, the first time we do it, it's longer because we talk about it a bit, but then it's just them checking the car.

And one of the examples I always use that I think works quite well because I've had students in the past say to me, well, they trust that I'm going to bring them a good car and I'LL say, but what if the student before you was taking a trunk out of the tire and then during today's lesson you bump the curb and I look and I say it's you and I'm now going to make you buy me a new tire.

Which I probably wouldn't do, but they don't know that and you can see it just clicks.

Have got a shopping list and a price list on their dashboard.

I mean, have you heard about that before?

Yes.

So much for a wheel and so much for a mirror.

I try not to give instructors ideas with our stuff, but no, but that's kind of how I kick it off and I'm always happy to go into as much detail as I want and I try and bring this stuff in earlier and I had Fairly recently a 25 minute conversation about tires with a student and I accidentally timed it, you know, just because I know at the time.

And it was all her asking me questions and there was some stuff I didn't know.

So we looked up and there were a center of the way of Sophie Lydon, the Thai lady.

And it was just she's awesome and she.

But it was just such a great conversation.

And from this conversation that's helped me with other students because it's maybe made me thinking, oh, what about this and what about this?

But I mean it got me thinking what I do now just turn the tires for what can we get out and look at the tread on the tire and do that every lesson now and again.

It's generally it's a two minute thing.

So for any, anyone listening, this isn't me making my student pull up outside of 25 minutes, look at a tire with every single student.

Generally it's a two minute thing where they learn some.

But sometimes students.

Last question.

Sometimes we'll dig into it a bit more.

Sometimes it'll turn into a 25 minute conversation about tires which I still can't get my head around.

But yeah, I just think that the earlier we bring it in, the better.

And do you think that maybe this is coming off topic?

Slightly, but I'm interested in your thoughts.

Do you think that the people that just send that DVSA video out for, you know, the seven show me questions on that the day before a test or whatever and sit here, memorize this for tomorrow.

Do you think that's part of the problem in our industry?

Hugely.

I think we still have people with the attitude of I'll teach to pass your test, where we've got a responsibility not just to that person but that person's out on the road now with everybody else.

You know, can you go home and look at yourself in the mirror knowing that you've only done half a job?

Like, what if that person has a horrendous crash and it's, you know, there's fatalities and it was because you missed something.

You didn't explain something properly, you didn't stress the importance of these vehicle checks.

Because it's not just a two minute.

Watch a video.

Like, you know, it's a legal responsibility that you've got.

You can get a fine, you can get points, you know, you might end up in prison if something goes wrong.

It's not just watch this video.

I think you need to fully understand the importance.

I think not just as driving instructors, I think, you know, I'm a parent, I get my kids to help me do vehicle checks.

Especially if we're going like long trips, we make it part of the thing.

Before we go, let's get the bonnet open, let's get the 20 pence piece out like Sophie does, let's check the tread.

Because when they do a journey when I'm not here and they've passed, I want them to do that.

I want that as part of their routine.

I need to know that when they leave my house, they're going to make it safely to where they need to be.

And I think that kind of ties into what we're talking about today as well.

It's a nice full circle, if you like, in the idea that most of this tech we've spoken about today and loads that we haven't, because there's loads more we've not touched on, but most of this tech doesn't, isn't needed on the driving test.

You know, you don't have to use cruise control, you don't have to set a speed limit, but if you have a speed limit or cruise control, you're not going to break the speed limit.

So it will actually help you on your test.

But also it's giving you, the students those additional knowledge, not additional skill after test to make them safer.

And I recently put a post on.

LinkedIn, sorry, there is studies to back up what you're saying, that all these aids and enhancements that we're putting in vehicles do make us safer.

Yeah, they do.

The research is there?

Yeah, 100%.

And this is the problem, isn't it?

What we do is we work off anecdotal personal evidence where this thing happened once, rather than looking at the big picture, which massively contradicts that one piece of anecdotal evidence that we've got that's been spread around like wildfire and now sounds like a much bigger thing than it actually is.

But is there anything else technology wise, that you want to touch on today or anything that you've come across for your learners that particular like or dislike or.

Not so much my learners, but just personally, I'm quite intrigued in what you think about fully autonomous vehicle.

Oh, do you know what?

I hate you for asking me this question because I.

There are two parts of me right now.

One part is the old grumpy old man Terry going, yes, but, you know, we, we should be driving and you know, the fled Fred Flintstone Terry, because I am still human and I have those, those thoughts.

But when I step back and look at it rationally in principle, I think that they will reduce massively significant if we could bring in autonomous vehicle, I'll say that again, vehicles that work correctly, not necessarily perfectly, but correctly, the death on our road would plummet.

There will be very, very little.

The problem is that even autonomous vehicles still requires an element of human supervision.

And I think that's going to be the problem.

And these are the, maybe the exceptions to the rule, but the people that decide, right, screw it, I'm going to take a nap.

I'm going to climb into the backseat and take a nap.

There was a guy fairly recently in America that did something like that one there, and it resulted in a collision.

So I think my bigger concern isn't the actual vehicle itself, it's how the humans handle it.

But I still have this nagging thing that I have to fight off, you know, grumpy old man syndrome.

What, what are your thoughts on them?

When I was out in Saudi doing some driver training earlier on the year, I got to go on an autonomous bus.

And honestly, like, it was quicker to walk, it was quicker to get the golf ball.

But I made Chris, the other trainer that I was out with, wait for the autonomous bus to come.

And we were the only two people that had got on it all morning.

And I was so excited, I couldn't wait to try it.

But it still had an operator and there's cameras and stuff.

So if anything went wrong, he's there to press the emergency stop button.

But honestly, I just, I couldn't wait.

Like, I'm fully, fully up for this technology.

I don't think it should replace us.

I think we still need to be able to take control because things do go wrong.

But yeah, it was, it was really exciting.

Would you not have got on the bus with me, Terry.

Oh, 100.

I've been on that bus.

I would have been.

I would have been annoyed that he probably drove better than me.

Um, but also keen to see what.

What it was like and how smooth was it.

Smooth.

I know you said it was slow, but was it smooth?

It was very, very smooth.

It's very, very cautious, though.

And people take bigger risks around slower moving vehicles.

So it kept having to stop all the time because people just walk out in front of it because they know it's going slow and they know it's going to stop.

So I think that's another thing that we probably need to look at.

I think when we get these in advances in technology, we need much better education around.

Around it.

Because you might go and get a new car.

The guy from the sales person, you know, the person who does the exchange with you when you go and pick a new car, does the demonstration, you're only getting the information that they know.

You're only going to remember a bit of that.

Then as instructors, you're going to go and pass on that information.

And again, you might only remember a bit of it now that that person that you've then passed it on to has now only got a tiny bit of that information.

What if you bought a secondhand car and nobody explained it to you?

Now, what if, when we get these autonomous vehicles on the road, do we need to start incorporating it into road safety education in schools so that they're more aware of the risks and what can happen?

Because I think as kids especially, you think that was really fun.

Wouldn't you, to step out in front of a bus that you knew was going to stop, especially teenagers, and that would be great fun on the way home from scale.

But actually, where's the element that tells us what.

What if it goes wrong?

That can still happen.

Yeah, I fully agree.

I think it needs better education now because I think that's where a lot of this negativity comes from, is a lack of understanding, you know, And I'm hoping that a couple of the episodes I do on this season, how I'm hoping today helps with life, I'm being honest, but I think the closest thing we've got to that now.

Have you seen the little robots that deliver parcels?

Yeah.

Oh, I'm so excited.

You know Jason Sykes, one of the examiners?

Yes.

He has the.

Where he lives.

And it was the first time I'd seen them and I was like, what are these little things with the flags on?

Yeah.

If there Was one of them near me that would be bringing me all of my parcels and shopping?

Well, we've got them in a very, very local to one of our test centers and the students love them.

I think they're.

I love them.

I think they're like the cutest thing at all because they drive down and they, they stop when there's a big leaf, you know, and then they reverse back and drive around it and they stop outside it road and they won't come out in front of you, they'll stay there until you go, you know.

And I just think that.

I appreciate that's a different thing because that's something probably moving like one mile an hour.

But when you look at the way that works, if that can be applied to two vehicles and then, yeah, there's got to be somewhere in there.

But we'll see, we'll see, we'll see what the future holds.

In fact, I'll ask you, let's.

Let's make a prediction now.

What year will autonomous vehicles first come on to fully autonomous vehicles first come on to UK roads?

I think the technology will be there way before our infrastructure.

I think we always spoke about it earlier with the lane assist.

If our infrastructure is not correct, the technology can be as brilliant as you want, but unless it can, all the road signs are correct and unless the lane markings are correct and unless councils update maps and things when there's been speed limit changes and model out changes in things.

It can drive as much as it wants on its own, but it's going to stop the minute it doesn't understand and at the minute it wouldn't understand because the infrastructure is too poor.

Yeah, I, I agree.

So on that note, on a nice agreement, I'll take some people where they can find you and what you might have to offer.

Yes.

So I am on Tick Tock, Facebook and Instagram.

If you just search for Vicky's driving tuition, I am on there.

I'm also on LinkedIn and just as myself, Vicki Folland, if anybody wants to, you can see the pictures of the autonomous bus on there.

I'll put it straight on my LinkedIn.

I was way over excited.

And if anybody wants to check out our podcast, you can just search for Car School Confessions.

We're definitely not serious educational side like you are, Terry, or rather the lighter side and the funnier side of being a driving instructor.

Fair enough.

On that note, I just want to take a moment to thank you for joining me today.

It's been a pleasure.

Oh, thank you so much for having me, it's been great.

Thank you very, very much.

I really appreciate you asking me on.

Thank you.

So a big thank you to Vicki Fallen for joining me today.

Really interesting conversation.

Vicky making a debut on the show.

And when I was thinking of talking through this tech stuff, Vicky was someone that sprung to mind.

Like I said at the start of the show, the stuff that she gets up to is phenomenal.

You, you really do want to go follow on LinkedIn because she pops up everywhere doing all kinds of stuff.

And some of the stuff you've said today I will be adding into my lessons.

So, yeah, definitely so.

And as always with this episode, once you've listened, go back and listen again with a notepad and pen, make some notes and apply the stuff you've heard today.

I've said this before and I will continue saying it.

The Instructor Podcast and the Instructor Podcast Premium is not giving you quick fixes.

This is stuff that we want you to take away and apply.

So Whether you've got one key takeaway from today or 20, it doesn't matter.

Go and find one of those things to work on.

Don't just listen to it as background noise.

Now, admittedly some episodes will be background noise to you.

This one for example.

Maybe you're already doing everything we've spoke about today, in which case, fantastic.

Hopefully we've entertained you a little bit today, but go and find another episode where you can take something from.

And that same ethos applies to the membership that I run, Instructor Podcast Premium.

Do not sign up for the Instructor Podcast Premium if you're not a dedicated driver that wants to improve, because that's what we're all about over there.

If you're after quick fixes and a quick oh, do this thing and do this thing and the world will be magic and sunshine and rainbows.

Not really the right place.

The Instructor Podcast Premium is somewhere you want to go when you want to develop and evolve as a driving instructor.

And I suppose excuse the cheesiness of me saying this, but and as a human as well, got stuff around the three key pillars of the Premium, which is the mental health and mindset, the business and the in car stuff.

So to find out more, head over to www.theinstructorpodcast.com or use the link in the show notes.

There's a free trial that runs over there for a week, so you can get access to everything there.

Or you can upgrade your CPD with a membership to the top tier, which is interactive tier, where you get to come and join loads of stuff live and get access to the expert sessions over this well delivered by people such as Tom Stenson, Kevin Tracy Field and Chris Benstead.

Chris is always on there somewhere.

But you can also bring the Instructor Podcast Premium into your driving school because we now run the option of you being able to give the Instructor Podcast Premium to your ADIS and PDIS as part of your driving school franchise.

To find out more, feel free to reach out to me or go and have a look on the membership.

Lastly, just want to give a big thank you to my Drive Time.

I mentioned the feature that I've really kind of keen on at the minute, which is that multiple progress trackers.

I love being able to create unique ones, different students.

Now admittedly most of them don't need a different one.

You can just do one and tweak it a bit here and there.

But I don't know.

It's a feature that I like a lot, but I'm not if I'm being completely honest, I'm not waving for the features and with them for the reliability.

I'm with them for the security.

I'm with them for the customer service.

That's what I like from them.

They they deliver the bread and butter and they are adding ego.

I hope Dan's listening to this.

They deliver the bread and butter and they're continually adding fillings to that bread and butter to make it an even better sandwich.

I'm gonna have to use that analogy somewhere at the start of the show because not everyone listens to the end.

So if you like that one, keep listening to the end of the show.

But yes, go and check out my drive time.

I appreciate them sponsoring the show.

Anytime someone sponsors this show, it helps me massively with the running of this podcast because this takes 10 hours a week to produce.

So when someone comes in with a sponsorship offer, it takes so much weight off my shoulders and I put off doing it for years.

Finally caved and it's definitely helpful.

So big thank you to my Drive time.

Find out more@mydrivetime.com Cook UK but for now, let's just keep raising standards.

The Instructor Podcast with Terry Cook talking with leaders, innovators, experts and game changers about what drives them.