Shownotes
In this episode
Jackson Cole, a standout goaltender at St. Michael's College, shares his compelling narrative of resilience and achievement in the realm of collegiate hockey. Having recently secured the NCAA Division 2 National Championship, Jackson reflects on the formative experiences that shaped his approach to the game.
Bio
Jackson Cole
Jackson Cole currently plays goalie for Saint Michael's College in Burlington, Vermont. Last season, he won the NCAA Division II National Championship with the Purple Knights.
Prior to attending Saint Michael's, Jackson was a four-year starter and captain for the Hun School of Princeton in New Jersey. There, he finished first team all prep and the prep's saves leader. Cole also played two years of varsity lacrosse at the Hun School.
His hockey resume includes attending the USA district program and being a national camp reserve player, two years of Junior hockey experience in the United States Premier Hockey League (USPHL) and the Canadian-American Junior Hockey League (CAJHL).
Not only does Jackson excel on the ice, but off as well. In high school, he was a member of the National Honor Society and was Student Council Vice President. He is a Dean's List student at Saint Michael's and was inducted into the National College Athlete Honor Society as a business administration and accounting minor.
https://www.eliteprospects.com/player/543833/jackson-cole
https://smcathletics.com/sports/mens-ice-hockey/roster/jackson-cole/10960
Takeaways:
- The importance of maturity in a hockey player's development cannot be understated, as it encompasses both physical and mental growth.
- Cultivating a supportive environment for young athletes is essential for their emotional well-being and overall development.
- Positioning has become increasingly critical for goaltenders, as modern play emphasizes fewer athletic saves and more strategic placement.
- A strong team culture, fostered by mutual support and camaraderie, significantly contributes to a successful hockey season.
- Young athletes should focus on enjoying their sport to maintain passion and prevent burnout, rather than solely concentrating on performance metrics.
- Engaging in meaningful conversations with young players about their feelings helps mitigate pressure and fosters healthy emotional growth.
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Transcripts
This is Sharpening youg Edge with Chuck and Eric.
Speaker A:Today's guest is Jackson Cole.
Speaker A:Jackson currently plays goalie at St. Michael's College in Burlington, Vermont.
Speaker A:Last season, he won the NCAA Division 2 National Championships with the Purple Knight.
Speaker B:Welcome to episode three of Sharpening youg Edge, presented by CB3 Hockey Development.
Speaker B:I'm Chuck Vertolino along with my co host, Eric Melanson.
Speaker B:And today we have Division 2 goaltender from St. Michael's College, Jackson Cole Jackson.
Speaker B:Thanks for joining us on Sharpening youg Edge.
Speaker A:Thanks for having me, guys.
Speaker C:Hey, Jackson.
Speaker C:Welcome to the show.
Speaker C:Really appreciate it.
Speaker C:And congratulations on the national championship you most recently won.
Speaker C:That's amazing.
Speaker C:Yeah, it's awesome.
Speaker A:Yeah, that was an awesome time.
Speaker A:Yeah, I bet.
Speaker C:I bet.
Speaker C:I hope you guys are still relishing it.
Speaker C:So.
Speaker C:So you've been a goalie your whole life, right?
Speaker C:I know that both of my kids wanted to try goalie at Meitz, and I told them the same thing that my dad told me was, no.
Speaker C:That's a lot of money.
Speaker A:Common answer.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:Yep.
Speaker C:What drew you to that position?
Speaker C:And kind of what made you fall in love with it?
Speaker A:You know, ironically, what drew me to the position was the gear.
Speaker A:At first, I remember at the University of Delaware, skating really young and seeing how they had rental goaltending equipment kind of just sitting in a box, and I just thought it was so cool.
Speaker A:Like, it looked so cool in the player, and I thought that I wanted to try it.
Speaker A:And then the other realization that I had at a young age was that there's only one on the ice per team.
Speaker A:And selfishly, I was like, I want to be at the center of attention.
Speaker A:I want to put on that cool gear.
Speaker A:So that was the first thing about it.
Speaker A:And then what kept me in the position was making big saves and sort of getting the hoots and hollers for my teammates and the parents.
Speaker A:And I thought it was really exciting that you could make some plays out there that really stood out.
Speaker C:That's awesome.
Speaker C:Yeah, I can definitely see that as appealing, especially the gear, but it's pretty cool, especially now.
Speaker C:Pretty slick designs out there.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:I think that's a good way to look at it.
Speaker C:And definitely an easy sell on the parents.
Speaker C:Probably once you start making those big saves, it kind of makes it all worth it.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's tough to keep asking for money for pads if the pucks keep going past you.
Speaker C:Yeah, I bet.
Speaker B:So, like Eric, I told both my boys no when they asked to play goalie, but I have a daughter as well.
Speaker B:And when she asked, I said, we'll give it a try.
Speaker B:And here we are years later, and she's.
Speaker B:She's fallen in love with it.
Speaker B:So thinking back to your youth hockey days, what were some key lessons or habits that really shaped your development early on after you finally fell in love with the position?
Speaker A:So I would.
Speaker A:Just to back up, I would consider myself sort of a late bloomer.
Speaker A:I wasn't the tallest kid growing up, even throughout early high school.
Speaker A:So the key thing that I focused on at a young age was speed.
Speaker A:My parents and coaches would always say is that you're a better skater, you were faster.
Speaker A:And just in general athleticism.
Speaker A:I thought that that was what I sort of focused on and keyed in on most at a young age.
Speaker A:And I wasn't even really worried about the more technical side of the game, like pushing rebounds into the corners or freezing pucks.
Speaker A:I mean, I was all over the place, just trying to be as fast as possible, making athletic saves, and.
Speaker A:And I seemed to do pretty well at a young age.
Speaker A:I got away with it then.
Speaker A:But of course, it changes as you grow up and start playing at higher levels.
Speaker B:They often say, too, that the goalie's got to be the best skater on the ice, so it is important.
Speaker A:Yeah, that was.
Speaker A:That was absolutely my.
Speaker A:My habit would always be to.
Speaker A:When I wasn't in the net for.
Speaker A:For drills in practice or what have you at camps, my first goalie, coach, P.J.
Speaker A:diana, would teach me to do these things called side drills.
Speaker A:Where would just be small ways to work on your skating and your athleticism or your speed, what have you.
Speaker A:And that's.
Speaker A:That's what really kind of drove my development at a young age, was just being on my feet and skating and just being as fast as possible.
Speaker C:That's awesome.
Speaker C:I think so.
Speaker C:I want to go on record and say Chuck's being extremely modest when he talks about his daughter, because I have the great fortune of coaching her for the last couple years.
Speaker C: 's hands down one of the best: Speaker A:Absolutely.
Speaker A:I've been saying that too, bar none.
Speaker C:And just her mindset, the way she approaches the game, incredible.
Speaker C:I just wanted to get that out there.
Speaker B:But you've.
Speaker C:You've had the fortune of growing up in an era of hockey that's had some pretty electric goaltenders.
Speaker C:Right?
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker C:Is there one, you know, collegiately, professionally, or even, you know, a kid that you looked up to as you progressed through the ranks that maybe was a Little bit older than you.
Speaker C:That kind of inspired you to.
Speaker C:To start really wanting to approach goaltending at an elite level.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So, great question.
Speaker A:Interesting thing about me is I feel like when you ask this question to hockey players my age, there was always kind of someone, maybe an older brother or someone that was the senior when they were a freshman in high school that they really looked up to.
Speaker A:I was so competitive that I didn't idolize anyone that was outside of the NHL.
Speaker A:I wanted to be better than absolutely everyone.
Speaker A:And a lesson that stuck with me is, you can't beat what you copy.
Speaker A:So I kind of took that to heart at a young age.
Speaker A:And so the people I really looked up to would be Bobrovsky.
Speaker A:When he was first in the Flyers, I thought that his game was similar to mine.
Speaker A:I mean, of course, I'm 10, 12 years old.
Speaker A:I'm not playing like Sergey Bobrovsky, but he was a fast, athletic goalie.
Speaker A:And similarly, Jonathan Quick, when he was on his reign with the Kings, that shoot out against Russia and Sochi, I mean, that's stuff of legends.
Speaker A:And those guys really inspired me.
Speaker A:And seeing them play at such a high level and on that stage and being on tv, going to Flyers games, seeing people go crazy for them, that's what was really inspiring to me.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And I would just envision myself out there and think, you know, what.
Speaker A:What if.
Speaker A:What if I could do that?
Speaker A:What if I could be that goalie and really kind of command a game for a team at such a high level?
Speaker A:So, yeah, that was.
Speaker A:That was really inspiring stuff for me especially even when Bobrovsky went to the Blue Jackets, half my family a season tickets to the Blue Jackets.
Speaker A:So whenever I was up there for Thanksgiving, Christmas, we would always go to the games, and he would be starting, and it would just be the coolest experience, just seeing him play in person.
Speaker C:Those are two amazing examples.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:And they're both hall of Fame careers.
Speaker C:I think it's remarkable.
Speaker C:I think you spoke to their athleticism.
Speaker C:It's still on display, you know, for Bobrovsky.
Speaker C:Espresso.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:Given the cups he's won.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:So you mentioned that, you know, those were the ones you looked up to.
Speaker C:Everybody else was kind of in a competitor.
Speaker C:Were there any moments, like lessons or other outside the game, role models or just words of advice?
Speaker C:I mean, you spoke to some earlier that really kind of dialed you in, and you were like, all right, now it's time to get serious.
Speaker C:And that led you to where you're at now.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So I remember One moment in specific.
Speaker A:When I was playing in prep school, we would have a student take the shots and the stats down.
Speaker A:And of course, as a goalie, right, you.
Speaker A:You want to make the most saves with the least amount of goals and have the highest save percentage.
Speaker A:So I remember one game, I can't remember who was against.
Speaker A:I literally took the score sheet from the student that was taking down the stats, and I realized that she flipped the shots, which decreased my save percentage substantially.
Speaker A:And I cross it out, and then I wrote in the real shots.
Speaker A:I didn't try to add shots or anything.
Speaker A:I just tried to give myself credit for the real thing.
Speaker A:And My coach, Ian McNally, saw me doing this, and he was livid.
Speaker A:He was, what are you doing?
Speaker A:And it wasn't because of the score sheet or anything.
Speaker A:It was just because of what I was trying to do.
Speaker A:And my response when he asked me what I was trying to do, my response was, I'm trying to play D1.
Speaker A:I'm trying to play pro.
Speaker A:Like, I.
Speaker A:This.
Speaker A:I need the stuff.
Speaker A:This is why it's important.
Speaker A:I need a good save percentage.
Speaker A:And he said, that's exactly why I'm worried.
Speaker A:And why that stuck with me is because I realized that he was saying, it's not about the stats.
Speaker A:It's about not freaking out about the stats.
Speaker A:It's about enjoying the game.
Speaker A:And there was a million other ways that I could have dealt with that situation better.
Speaker A:But that moment for me, when he said, basically, what are you doing?
Speaker A:It's not a big deal, where I was like, I really need to mature.
Speaker A:This is a long haul.
Speaker A:This is going to be a long journey.
Speaker A:This game means nothing.
Speaker A:My stats, my freshman year of high school mean nothing.
Speaker A:I need to dial it in mentally and start to mature now if I want to play Division 1, if I want to play pro.
Speaker A:And that moment really hit me, and it was a humbling moment because it sort of took a level of selfishness out of me.
Speaker A:And I started to think, okay, we won the game, and I did.
Speaker A:Well, it's just numbers, and I can't overemphasize these little percentages if I'm going to play this game for a long time.
Speaker A:So, yeah, that really kind of flipped the script for me mentally.
Speaker C:That's awesome.
Speaker C:I mean, talk about focusing on the priorities, right, and helping us set you up for success.
Speaker C:I think that unfortunately, that's probably something that's lost in the youth hockey world today.
Speaker C:Whether it's be kids focused on the wrong thing, or probably to a greater extent, Some of the parents of those kids focused on the wrong thing.
Speaker C:Right, right.
Speaker C:That's why you're seeing some burnout in a lot of these kids.
Speaker C:Absolutely.
Speaker C:From what I'm thinking, yeah, that's a fantastic way to approach it and I hope that some of our listeners take that on board and really try to implement that either in their kids game or their own game.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:So Jackson, you spoke about going to the Hudden School at Princeton.
Speaker B:You were a four year starter there, captain, which you rarely see for a goaltender.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:So that's pretty cool.
Speaker B:First team, all prep and prep saves leaders.
Speaker B:You spoke about a little bit of an experience with your coach there.
Speaker B:But how did playing at that prep level environment help shape your development both on and off the ice?
Speaker A:Well, it makes you realize, right, that.
Speaker A:So when you're coming from Delaware where hockey is not exactly huge, it's getting better and you're put in an environment where pretty much everyone's really good and as good as you, if not better, and you're playing against teams with kids committed Division 1 schools at 15 years old, kids that are older than you and bigger than you.
Speaker A:And what prep school changed about me is playing at that level is I started to realize that I first off, I need to start thinking team instead of me.
Speaker A:And also I need to kick it into a different gear.
Speaker A:It was kind of like cold water, like ice to the face, like wow.
Speaker A:Like hockey.
Speaker A:The hockey world is huge.
Speaker A:These kids are big, these kids are good.
Speaker A:And if you're going to succeed, you need to differentiate yourself in one way or another.
Speaker A:And that was sort of, you know, a kick in the head where I was like, wow.
Speaker A:I mean, I'm not even playing at a prep school that's nationally ranked or anything.
Speaker A:And, and we only had a couple Division 1 commits.
Speaker A:But it was really a sort of a shock to the system and it made me mature very quickly, especially living on my own.
Speaker A:And it made me take my nutrition, mental habits and my training just to the next level.
Speaker A:And it's not even necessarily by choice.
Speaker A:You're sort of forced into it if you want to survive at that level.
Speaker C:At least it's huge.
Speaker C:You mentioned the nutrition, the mental performance, the, the physical prep and stuff.
Speaker C:How big of a factor do you think that made in your game?
Speaker C:Do you think if you had, you know, maybe incorporated it earlier, it would have set you on a different path?
Speaker C:Do you think that, you know, there's, obviously you do, there's, there's some significant benefits to the, paying attention to those things.
Speaker A:You Know, I obviously, I mean I took it seriously at that age, but kind of ironically I might have taken it too seriously and that's almost a regret of mine.
Speaker A:I took my training and my nutrition to a level that isn't really healthy for a high school aged kid.
Speaker A:And it really started to eat away at me mentally when I'm in the dining hall after a practice and I'm in a bad mood because the food doesn't seem healthy, or I'm in a bad mood because I have to do homework instead of stretching or going to the gym and we're talking my schedule would be go to practice after school.
Speaker A:I would go to school from eight to three or whatever and then I would go to practice right after school, then I would come back.
Speaker A:Sometimes I would even skip dinner or just make a protein shake, go to the gym and then go to another practice.
Speaker A:And I thought that was healthy and that's what the pros did, but that's so far from the truth.
Speaker A:The pros have such like an emphasis on rest and recovery and that wasn't a factor at all in my, in my early years in prep school there.
Speaker A:So I think it helps, it absolutely helps.
Speaker A:Especially if you want to reach the next level.
Speaker A:I mean, you got to be mobile, you got to be eating right.
Speaker A:But I think that the hardest thing about that is striking the balance between what's, what's good for you and, and what begins to be adversary to you and what's working against you.
Speaker A:And I started to absolutely lean towards sort of working against me kind of just not eating, not eating the right foods, sort of empty foods like rice and just grilled chicken, stuff like that.
Speaker A:And I wasn't enjoying things that I should have been as a high school aged kid.
Speaker C:Now when you made that transition from the prep school to the college level, did that shift, did you know, kind of, did that challenge you or did you have some better resources at your disposal that we're able to kind of dial you in and say, hey, maybe you're hitting that over training threshold.
Speaker C:Let's back you off and put you on a better way, on a better path?
Speaker A:Yeah, I, I think that my, my nutrition and training, well, my training is, is obviously at a next level at college because that's what it demands.
Speaker A:But the nutrition stuff, I eased back on that.
Speaker A:I started to enjoy myself a little bit more because I saw guys on my team, guys my age, and they, if I did the same stuff I did in prep school as I did in college, they'd be like, whoa, dude, you really gotta freak.
Speaker A:You gotta, you know, chill out a little bit.
Speaker A:You're sort of freaking me out.
Speaker A:So I would say that my sort of health regimen now is absolutely more relaxed and refined, and that's helped me so much mentally.
Speaker A:Not feeling bad almost to the point of tears.
Speaker A:In high school when I eat ice cream.
Speaker A:I mean, that's absurd.
Speaker A:And now it's, of course, of course I can have ice cream.
Speaker A:It's not a big deal at all.
Speaker A:Like, of course I can have a cheat meal.
Speaker A:And I think that's honestly what's taken my game to the next level.
Speaker A:I mean, you see kids at such a young age getting exposed to professional athletes and they think that they can't have sugar.
Speaker A:Or some people believe that you shouldn't eat carbs or anything when you're a young athlete.
Speaker A:I mean, it gets so out of hand.
Speaker A:And people do that because they think it makes them a better athlete.
Speaker A:But it really is kind of just.
Speaker A:It's just psyching you out and it's adding all this static into your head when you really should just be enjoying the game and worried about your on ice performance, not this other, you know, marginal gains stuff.
Speaker A:It's really not good for anyone at a young age like that.
Speaker C:Believe me.
Speaker C:I could talk at length.
Speaker C:We could have a whole discussion on the human performance factors and stuff like that.
Speaker C:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:So Eric mentioned your shift from prep school to college.
Speaker B:And we all dream it, we all do when we're kids, you know, playing in the driveway and thinking we're scoring the winning goal to win Game 7 of the Stanley Cup Final or making that big save.
Speaker B:Now, it may not be the Stanley Cup Final, but we did mention that last year he won the Division 2 National Championship with St. Michael's College.
Speaker B:Had to be a unique experience for, for you, an exciting experience.
Speaker B:So, so just walk us through that.
Speaker B:What was it like competing and ultimately winning that national championship?
Speaker A:Yeah, so I'll try not to give a stock hockey guy answer to this.
Speaker A:Like, oh, we, we all bought in and we got puck steep.
Speaker A:I mean, that, that experience was, was so unique.
Speaker A:And it all started with early on into the year.
Speaker A:First off, we had a great group of guys.
Speaker A:Our leadership group was phenomenal.
Speaker A:The seniors and captains, it was phenomenal.
Speaker A:And there was such a level of maturity and such a high level of buy in just from the get go.
Speaker A:And we all knew what we were capable of from the get go.
Speaker A:And it kind of took off from there.
Speaker A:And what really started this championship run was when we first got to campus, we would have a day or two every week where we would go on walks with each other.
Speaker A:And it could be on the beachfront Lake Champlain, could be in the woods, just be around campus.
Speaker A:And we all started to get to know each other on such an intimate level.
Speaker A:And we would talk about our insecurities, what makes us anxious, what we're scared of, and we would try to mix it up, maybe getting guys that you don't talk to that often you don't have to get any classes with.
Speaker A:And we made sure that everyone knew each other like the back of their hands.
Speaker A:And then that was the foundation.
Speaker A:And then the second brick of that was this term, our coach brought it to us.
Speaker A:I think it's from Alabama basketball.
Speaker A:It's called mudita, and I'm not sure which language that's from, but essentially mudita means celebrating others achievements and being genuinely happy for others.
Speaker A:And how that helped us was say you weren't starting and net a game, being genuinely excited for that goalie to do well, not wishing, oh, like, I hope we win, but I hope that he gives up a couple ones, or even if you were a forward or a D man, not being like, I hope this guy screws up on this play.
Speaker A:Then I go out there and then now I'm on Power Play 1.
Speaker A:We all started to really be happy for each other, and we knew each other first off, but now we're genuinely happy for each other.
Speaker A:And that led to no tension between anyone and really started that cohesive group feeling.
Speaker A:And then we hit our schedule and we were just rolling games.
Speaker A:There's not enough time to really do those meetings or any, or, you know, culture meetings, what we call them.
Speaker A:There's no.
Speaker A:Not much time to do that anymore.
Speaker A:So now we're game, game, game, practice, practice, practice.
Speaker A:And we just started to get into those early habits.
Speaker A:Just consistency, pretty basic stuff.
Speaker A:Nothing, nothing really out of the ordinary that we did.
Speaker A:We just made sure that every time we hit that ice, we had a goal and we were going to meet it.
Speaker A:And when someone messed up, there was someone right there ready to pick up the slack.
Speaker A:And we really started to know or to think that it was going to happen going in the playoffs.
Speaker A:We caught so much steam going into that last month, month and a half of the season.
Speaker A:And it was emotional because our seniors that were leaving were guys that were fundamental to this program.
Speaker A:And not just points leaders and guys that play the most games, have the most minutes.
Speaker A:I mean, guys that would really, really do anything that they could for you.
Speaker A:And that went for everyone, not just their leadership group and the seniors.
Speaker A:It went for the freshmen and our equipment managers, our coaches, our trainers.
Speaker A:They really were just such sweet, caring people.
Speaker A:And we just had such a warm energy about our team and we all loved it so much.
Speaker A:We had students working the cameras that were in our locker room as if they were part of our team.
Speaker A:And it was, it was one big family.
Speaker A:And we all sort of looked at each other and we're like, you know what?
Speaker A:Like, there's no reason why we can't do this.
Speaker A:And that just carried right over onto the ice and.
Speaker A:And we got it done and that we, we were playing St Anselm and we had lost to them in the national championship my freshman year.
Speaker A:And we were going into their barn, that championship game, and we knew that it was going to be different this time.
Speaker A:We were a different team and we pounced on them.
Speaker A:I mean, we left no room for error.
Speaker A:There was not going to be any gray area or second guessing if we were going to win that game.
Speaker A:There was such a high level of aggression and everyone was in it with each other.
Speaker A:And I have never seen such a cohesive group of people, not just talking about the players, I'm talking about everyone that's on the bench.
Speaker A:Our administrators at school, our fans, our trainers, parents.
Speaker A:And it was, it was such a unique experience in that aspect where it really did feel like a family win and not just we were the better team.
Speaker A:It seemed like we genuinely had the culture that deserved to win that title.
Speaker A:And we got it done.
Speaker B:And now let's take a quick break to hear from our partners.
Speaker B:This episode is proudly sponsored by High Stick Hockey, your go to source for premium hockey apparel.
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Speaker B:It's nice to hear you say that because I don't know if it's the exact quote, but Kurt Russell said in the movie Miracle when people were questioning his picks, he said, I don't want the best guys, I want the right guys.
Speaker B:And it's good to hear you say that because a lot of youth coaches, or maybe even at the higher levels, these coaches look for the best guys.
Speaker B:But it's a complete team effort.
Speaker B:You need your role players and you need everyone to buy into the team mentality.
Speaker B:And it's good to hear you say that.
Speaker B:And we're seeing a lot of successful teams, even like the Panthers.
Speaker B:Do they have all the best guys in the world?
Speaker B:No, but they have the right guys that fit their roles and, and they click well and they buy into that team mentality and they've won two Stanley Cups in a row.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker A:Yeah, and that's, that's a great way to compare it to our team too.
Speaker A:You wouldn't say we had the best points leaders in the league or nationally and we don't have the most guys that had the best junior careers or, or what have you.
Speaker A:But it was the right group of guys.
Speaker A:And I give so much credit to my former coach Damian De Julian for somehow finding all these pieces that just seemed like they magically fit together.
Speaker A:And we all loved each other so much and it really did carry over onto the ice.
Speaker C:That's awesome.
Speaker C:I think you've used the word culture, you know, a whole bunch and that's, you know, I'm huge on culture.
Speaker C:I think it, it is a great attributing factor to successful teams.
Speaker C:I think if you have a poor or broken culture, it's, it's not going to allow you guys to reach your full potential.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Do you think that the coach was really initially a big driving factor in that?
Speaker C:Not.
Speaker C:And not so much that he scripted what the culture would be.
Speaker D:Right.
Speaker C:Did he just allow for an environment for that?
Speaker C:To Foster.
Speaker C:And he kind of led by example from the top down.
Speaker A:Yeah, I would agree.
Speaker A:I think it's the latter of what you just mentioned.
Speaker A:He wasn't an overbearing coach or do this, do that guy at all.
Speaker A:But he really sort of.
Speaker A:He would call it, give us the keys to Lamborghini, and really opened up that room and said, this is your team.
Speaker A:This is not.
Speaker A:This is not my team only.
Speaker A:This is your team, and this is for you guys to figure it out.
Speaker A:And I think that was.
Speaker A:That was perfect for that team.
Speaker A:And we had the right.
Speaker A:Right group of guys and we had been building on this culture that was so, so incredible from the prior two years.
Speaker A:And I don't want to say it peaked, but I mean, it seemed like that was the top and we're only going forward from there, hopefully.
Speaker A:But I think that Coach De Julian was pivotal in allowing us to have the keys to Lamborghini and drive our own car.
Speaker C:We've talked a lot up to this point about the successes that you've had on the ice and the successes that you're still having on the ice.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:That culminated in that national championship last year.
Speaker C:Hopefully back to back this year for you.
Speaker C:But I'd be remiss if we didn't talk about the success you've had as an academic as well.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:So honor society in high school, National Collegiate Athletic Honor Society, now, Dean's list.
Speaker C:You know, looking back on your career, maybe it started before the Hun school or even when you were playing the game or Mary, your parents were instrumental in it.
Speaker C:Was it that drive in athletics that kind of shaped your focus in the classroom?
Speaker C:Was it how much you liked school?
Speaker C:Or maybe you didn't like school, you were just good at it.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Was it.
Speaker C:Was it that that shaped your athletics?
Speaker C:Was it a healthy mix of both?
Speaker A:Yeah, I think.
Speaker A:I think it really stems from just who I am as a person.
Speaker A:I'm a competitor, just in general.
Speaker A:And same thing with hockey.
Speaker A:I want to have the best grade, So I want 100.
Speaker A:I want 100.
Speaker A:I want 100.
Speaker A:I want a higher score than my roommate on this.
Speaker A:On this exam.
Speaker A:It's a lot of similar attributes.
Speaker A:And also just plainly I knew that school was important and that had been harped on me from a young age, especially my parents.
Speaker A:And I think the second driver of that academic success was just surrounding myself with intelligent people.
Speaker A:You wouldn't want to be the odd man out and be like, oh, I don't really understand this.
Speaker A:I had the great fortune of going to The Hutton School.
Speaker A:And of course, I was surrounded by many intelligent people.
Speaker A:You got, you were sending a handful of kids to Ivy League schools every year.
Speaker A:Other great schools, Boston College, Northwestern.
Speaker A:And I think when you're in the right environment, it's sort of, sort of enriches your just curiosity in general, and you want to know more than you don't.
Speaker A:And the knowing part feels good.
Speaker A:The knowing what's on the exam or understanding your homework, that's the same feeling for me at least, as getting on the ice and knowing exactly what you're doing and feeling like you're a part of it.
Speaker A:So I think one, it was being a competitor, and I think two, it was wanting to be sort of in the mixture and not wanting to be the one falling behind and not struggling.
Speaker C:Yeah, I mean, you've mentioned, you know, again, you use that word compete, competitor, and that's, you know, that's the word they call it.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:They don't call it winning, they don't call it lose it.
Speaker C:They call it competing.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:So having those high expectations for yourself all the time, how did you deal with failure?
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:How did you deal with when things did not go your way, whether that be on the ice or in the classroom?
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Like, was there a point where you completely used to shut down and then there was something that you learned?
Speaker C:Maybe it was that, that quote about the stuff, stats.
Speaker A:Right, Right.
Speaker C:To deal with that mental pressure.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Because it's, you know, like you said, you're at the Hunt School, so challenging academic environment, challenging hockey environment right now.
Speaker C:So you're getting it from both sides.
Speaker C:How did you, how did you deal with that?
Speaker A:Not well, to be completely transparent, not well at all.
Speaker A:And I, I wish I had some amazing story of growth where I was like, it's okay.
Speaker A:I'm going to fight through this adversity.
Speaker A:I would take it badly after a loss, after a bad exam grade, and it would just be.
Speaker A:It would just start with anger, just be like, oh, how did I not know that?
Speaker A:Or how did I not see that?
Speaker A:I started to mature just in general through life and started to understand that failures are good for you.
Speaker A:And that was a hard concept for me to grasp initially.
Speaker A:And it wasn't really until junior hockey after prep school, where failure was often.
Speaker A:Failure was very often.
Speaker A:And that's sort of where I came to terms with it.
Speaker A:And I started to use failure as a tool and sort of as a healing and coping mechanism because I knew that if it's going to keep happening, it's a.
Speaker A:It's a part of life.
Speaker A:And I looked at it sort of objectively and thought, what am I going to do about this?
Speaker A:Am I going to sit here and pout?
Speaker A:Am I going to self destruct like I did in prep school and not talk to anyone for a day?
Speaker A:Or am I going to learn from this?
Speaker A:And that's sort of a stock answer just on facing adversity in general.
Speaker A:But I also think that there's so much virtue in using failure to your advantage because that's what the greatest have done in the greatest intellects, the greatest athletes.
Speaker A:Because that's like failure is your friend.
Speaker A:I would say, yeah, that's a, that's.
Speaker B:A very hard concept for especially youth players to, to get.
Speaker B:I try to instill in my players that, you know, it's okay to fall down, right?
Speaker B:It's, it's how you learn, right?
Speaker B:Just get back up.
Speaker B:What separates the NHLers and the high level hockey players from the other guys?
Speaker B:It's, it's the guys that were willing to get up and learn from their mistakes.
Speaker B:And, and I like that, that you express that, that failure is a learning tool.
Speaker B:What other advice would you give to younger players?
Speaker B:Because you're in it now when they're trying to balance the hockey, the school and, and life overall, especially when it comes to, when they get to, when, when it starts getting real in middle and high school.
Speaker A:I would say first off, stop comparing yourself to others.
Speaker A:Everyone's on a different path.
Speaker A:And, and some people, you know, reach certain levels at a younger age than others.
Speaker A:And that doesn't necessarily mean they'll have a better career or get a better job someday.
Speaker A:You have to stay true to your own path.
Speaker A:And also I would say that if you don't have passion for what you're doing, that's when you're really in trouble.
Speaker A:It's not about failure or anything if you love what you do.
Speaker A:Of course we all love hockey.
Speaker A:You don't love losing games, but you have to love hockey even as you're losing games.
Speaker A:And I think that passion and that love for it will take you so far as compared to someone who doesn't love hockey.
Speaker A:Maybe they're just really good at it because that can fizzle out very fast.
Speaker A:And I've seen that countless times just growing up.
Speaker C:One of the biggest investments that I've made for my kids thus far, and they're only 11 and 9 for me at least, isn't, hasn't.
Speaker C:Hasn't been the, the extra skating, the, the, you know, this clinic, that camp, this Workout program or this, whatever.
Speaker C:It's been in a mental performance coach.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:And it's one that specifically is, you know, her goal was to focus on youth athletes because it gets them talking, it gets them understanding their feelings, knowing that it's okay to feel certain ways and then how to deal with that pressure.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Because that's going to help them in life as they get older.
Speaker C:So that being said, and you know, you, you mentioned that you also spent a lot of time out of the networking on your skating.
Speaker C:Right?
Speaker C:So in today's like Instagram, social media society where everybody's got a platform now, so you're getting hit with all these things from every different angle from human performance to on ice skills to off ice skills.
Speaker C:You know, what are things from your point of view that, you know, kids should be focusing on now?
Speaker C:You know, what should they be prioritizing?
Speaker C:Is it some of the on ice stuff or maybe it's a mix of both?
Speaker C:Right, so just what do you think?
Speaker A:I think that the on ice stuff is absolutely the most important because that's what it is.
Speaker A:Your craft is on the ice.
Speaker A:The off ice stuff is obviously important.
Speaker A:I don't think it's as important as being on the ice.
Speaker A:I think that if you went to an hour long stick and talk and you sat there and you had fun with your friends and you got scored on or you just, you're just passing around, maybe you want to work on something specific.
Speaker A:I think that's so much more beneficial than going to a gym and running on a treadmill just to the point of driving yourself insane or going on Instagram and being like, oh, okay, here's how I get a six pack in 10 minutes.
Speaker A:I think that is what stems into the unhealthy habits.
Speaker A:And again, going back to that passion thing, if you keep feeding that passion and feeding that fire and having fun on the ice and playing shinny with your friends, playing stick hockey, I think that's genuinely what makes you one of the better hockey players, is just staying within the game, but understanding that that game is not always, I'm in the game right now and I need to perform.
Speaker A:It's also fun.
Speaker A:And I think that one of the, maybe not the worst, but not, maybe not the worst way, but a bad way to approach it would be being 100% off the ice on your gym and maybe watching YouTube, trying to understand how to do certain things on the ice and then going onto the I and trying to be perfect.
Speaker A:I think that's what drives kids to an unhealthy mental point.
Speaker A:I think that there needs to be a balance between taking hockey seriously and just going out there and just falling all over the place.
Speaker B:And now let's take a quick break to hear from our partners.
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Speaker C:The fun word, right?
Speaker C:That's the most important that I think gets lost now or it becomes, you know where it starts becoming a career and probably not a fun one and stops becoming playing for the love of the Game.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker C:I mean, maybe some people that listen will think I'm lying, but the first thing I ask my kids when they are done with the game or practice is did you have fun?
Speaker C:Because that's going to set up my next question because if it's no, I didn't have fun, then the conversation is going to be completely different.
Speaker C:So yeah, I think the fun thing is huge.
Speaker C:That's a great answer.
Speaker C:Thank you.
Speaker B:So Eric, you mentioned my daughter earlier.
Speaker B:Jackson, you know her well, for those obviously that don't know her, she's 10 years old, she's a girl, she plays high level hockey with the boys.
Speaker B:So I would imagine.
Speaker B:And they don't Express it at 10 years old, but I would imagine it's extremely stressful when she's in there.
Speaker B:And I gotta give a shout out to Eric for always being her crotch in between periods.
Speaker B:Whether she has a great period or she let up a softie.
Speaker B:He's always on the bench giving her advice, talking to her, keeping her head in the game.
Speaker B:Jackson knows her well too, by working with her at some of my clinics and camps.
Speaker B:So what advice, Jackson, would you have to some parents and even coaches?
Speaker B:We see it all the time during practices.
Speaker B:How could parents and coaches best support their young goalies with their confidence and development?
Speaker A:I would say first and foremost, just be their outlet.
Speaker A:Be a safe, safe space for them to express how they're feeling and what they're worried about.
Speaker A:And that doesn't mean crying or being invasive if they don't want to talk about it or anything.
Speaker A:But having that outlet, like having my, my mom and my dad on car rides home from, from hard games and that doesn't mean necessarily lying to them to be like, oh, like you're the best player, like screw your coach, like that's why we're not playing.
Speaker A:But just, but listening is so important for parents and really trying to understand why they're feeling so certain ways.
Speaker A:And I, I believe that if, if you are their outlet and their sort of comfort system to really talk through the highs and the lows, I, I think that that makes them take sort of the pressure off of themselves.
Speaker A:And if you're a parent that gets, you know, all mad that your kid didn't have a great game or maybe was up all night playing video games and didn't play well and you know, you feel like you wasted your money at a tournament or something like that, and then maybe you go quiet in the car because you're so frustrated, I can understand that too, but I think that that leads to children and younger kids just being.
Speaker A:Just reach, then internalizing their feelings.
Speaker A:And then most of the time for young kids, they can't work through that in a mature way, and those just turn into negative feelings.
Speaker A:And then it starts to fester inside and build up and it doesn't really end up well until they can sort of get it all out.
Speaker A:And maybe when they get it all out, maybe that's a big crash out on the ice.
Speaker A:So I think taking those mitigating steps and checking in on them and just being a listener in general is, Is the greatest advice I could give along.
Speaker C:That same, like, advice line.
Speaker C:The best piece, you know, that, that advice that I've heard is, is exactly the same.
Speaker C:It's, you know, for parents to say, you know, hey, first and foremost, like, hey, Jeff, fun.
Speaker C:But then usually my next question is, you want to talk about your game?
Speaker C:And if it's yes or no, right.
Speaker C:Then it will go from there.
Speaker C:But if it's no, then it's all right.
Speaker C:Hey, just let me know when you want to talk because maybe they need a minute to work through it or to try to work through it and just to let them know that, hey, you're here.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker C:And you've dropped a lot of nugget bombs on us over the course of this podcast so far.
Speaker C:But if you had one that is like your Ted Lasso, I believe, sticker at the door, what is one piece of advice for a 10 to 12 year old or.
Speaker C:Or somewhere in that age range, goalie chasing, you know, to be the next Jackson or beyond.
Speaker C:Right, the next Bob or somebody in the NHL.
Speaker C:What's that going to be?
Speaker A:You know, it's funny you mentioned Ted Lasso, because I was actually going to say be a goldfish.
Speaker A:That.
Speaker A:That short memory is so important, and that was sort of our mantra.
Speaker A:Our coach actually made us watch Ted Lasso over the summer because he thought that that was so important.
Speaker A:And I think if I could have embodied be a goldfish and having that short memory at a young age, I would have been a better player and a happier player because I was replaying goals that happened to me two weeks before and being like, how do you think my coach is holding that against me?
Speaker A:Do you think, you know, that girl in the stand saw that and doesn't like me anymore.
Speaker A:You just got to.
Speaker A:You just got to forget and forgive yourself and just keep going.
Speaker C:Yeah, I mean, shout out to Ted Lasso, right?
Speaker C:Great show.
Speaker C:Huge fan.
Speaker C:They're bringing it back, right?
Speaker A:A lot of.
Speaker A:A lot of Good knowledge in that show.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:I mean, I think it should be mandatory viewing for all coaches, regardless of sport, because I, you know, the way he approaches it was pretty awesome.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:Love that you brought up Ted Lasso.
Speaker B:So you talked about at the beginning of the podcast.
Speaker B:We're going to go back to the beginning, circle back.
Speaker B:You talked about the fundamentals of skating for a goaltender, things you like to do early on.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:So what are some other fundamentals that young goalies should, should focus on at the younger levels and how does that progress as they.
Speaker B:They move up to middle school and high school and college?
Speaker A: g the best athlete even up to: Speaker A:It used to be Martin Brodeur doing backflips out there and making ridiculous saves.
Speaker A:That is completely ridiculous in today's game.
Speaker A:So I think that goaltenders now from a young age should be more concerned about their positioning and moving the least amount possible now because you want to be set, you want to be in the right position from the get go, and you don't want to have to make those ridiculous athletic saves.
Speaker A:Sometimes they're appropriate and they're exciting to watch.
Speaker A:It's just the nature of the sport.
Speaker A:But I think positioning is the most important, growing aspect of the game.
Speaker A:Obviously skating comes with that.
Speaker A:Skating is just a must have, but positioning is what's changing the most to me, because you see the best goalies and they don't look like they're doing anything at all.
Speaker A:I remember watching Carey Price and thinking, this guy is just not even trying, which isn't true.
Speaker A:He's just so good at what he does and he's always in the right spot.
Speaker C:I noticed that, at least on the, on the player side.
Speaker C: , it seems like over the last: Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:So like what the, you know, average height, maybe back in the 90s, used to be around 6 foot.
Speaker C:Now you're getting more into like the 6, 3, 6, 4 with a lot of goalies.
Speaker C:I'm saying they're gonna be huge as well.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:So maybe that is.
Speaker C:Is to your point that like we're.
Speaker C:Or there's an emphasis on bigger, bigger players, so you want to be able to move less and take up more of a net.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:Well, the other thing is that the pro goalies are sort of shrinking.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Maybe, maybe not as a general trend, but some of the better ones are smaller but they're still doing the same thing.
Speaker A:And you're realizing that you don't have to be the best athlete to get away with it.
Speaker A:You can be smaller and smaller than NHLs like 6 foot, 6 foot one.
Speaker A:So they're still big guys but they are embodying the same aspects of, of positional awareness and just being always in the right spot before anything even happens.
Speaker A:So it looks easy to them.
Speaker C:It's that hockey iq but for a goaltender, right.
Speaker C:So like figuring out where the play is going to go.
Speaker A:I think that's exactly.
Speaker C:Don't talk about.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker B:So we talked about a lot during this podcast.
Speaker B:Is there anything that we didn't ask you that you've been thinking about that you wanted to maybe any pieces of advice for players, parents, coaches that, that we didn't get to address today?
Speaker A:Stay off social media and not all social media.
Speaker A:There is great social media.
Speaker A:The social media that I am referring to is the toxic, what the kids call brain rot and you're doing what they call doom scrolling and you're just, it's just constant dopamine hits and you're just going through it for hours.
Speaker A:That is literally shrinking kids brains.
Speaker A:And the social media that you should be watching and the people that you should be following are people like Chuck and the hockey development and the NHL and your favorite team and maybe you friends and stuff, that's all good.
Speaker A:But I think when you get into the side of social media where it's, it's sort of toxic and dangerous and kids get exposed to things that they shouldn't be and start to say things to their parents and friends that they shouldn't know.
Speaker A:I think that's dangerous.
Speaker A:Not even just from a hockey or growing up perspective, but in a professional sense too.
Speaker A:You start to see that digital footprint sort of come back to bite people.
Speaker A:So I think you should use social media as a tool, as an educational tool and not as necessarily entertainment per se all the time.
Speaker C:That's awesome.
Speaker C:I love it.
Speaker C:I want to make sure my kids hear that because they're begging me for cell phones left and right.
Speaker C:Oh, that's.
Speaker C:That's awesome.
Speaker C:That's perfect.
Speaker C:Right?
Speaker C:And you know, I've got, got a great friend who trains both my boys in skills and we're going to be fortunate enough to have him on the podcast too here in a couple weeks.
Speaker C:Chase Fuchs, and he's a current scout for Red Deer in the whl.
Speaker C:And I've Asked him, you know, jokingly, how many.
Speaker C:How many kids have you ever recruited on social media?
Speaker C:And he said, zero.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker A:So it's.
Speaker C:He's like, none.
Speaker C:That's probably the last place I'd go to look, you know, so, yeah, I think it just echoes what you said.
Speaker C:I know that I'm gonna give you a follow on social media, Right.
Speaker C:Because you've definitely dropped a lot of knowledge here.
Speaker C:And.
Speaker C:And I love to try to just surround myself with great people.
Speaker C:Thank you.
Speaker C:Like yourself.
Speaker C:So if there's folks out there listening, is, you know, is there a way they can get in touch with you, follow you on social media, follow your journey, hopefully back to another national championship.
Speaker A:I am on Instagram and LinkedIn, but this isn't a business call, so my Instagram is underscore.
Speaker A:Underscore Jackson Cole and fair warning.
Speaker A:I don't post very often, but I will be reposting our hockey results and hopefully some good news will come across your feed.
Speaker C:Awesome.
Speaker C:You know, I think that's great.
Speaker C:I certainly hope you guys repeat.
Speaker C:You know, I went to college up in Vermont as well, so I know how the winters can get up there.
Speaker C:So hockey is definitely the thing that.
Speaker C:I'm sure it'll get you through that.
Speaker C:Yeah, I guess.
Speaker C:One final question for you.
Speaker C:Hit you with the hard one.
Speaker C:This is a Development Focus podcast, right?
Speaker C:What is.
Speaker C:What is Jackson Cole's definition of development?
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:And that can be mental, physical, spiritual, whatever aspect you want to take on it.
Speaker C:What's your definition of development?
Speaker A:I would say my definition of development would be maturity.
Speaker A:I think maturity embodies all the senses of what it means to develop.
Speaker A:When you're maturing mentally, you're growing, you're maturing physically.
Speaker A:And with that maturity comes new responsibilities, a sense of self awareness and humbleness.
Speaker A:And you start to realize that, you know, I'm the only person that can dictate my success.
Speaker A:And that comes from, for me, that comes from a perspective of maturity.
Speaker A:And I think that if you see a hockey player play and then you don't see him play for five years, and then you're like, wow, he's really mature now.
Speaker A:He's really taking care of himself and he's like, so nice to talk to, and he looks great on the ice, I think that is.
Speaker A:Is a successful development in my eyes.
Speaker A:It's just not saying grow up, but just start to mature, understand yourself, understand your body, and understand the process, and it's going to be a long one.
Speaker C:That's great.
Speaker C:I mean, you can't do anything really well in those arenas until you're, until you're mature.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Because you're not going to take anything seriously.
Speaker C:So.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Awesome.
Speaker C:Awesome answer.
Speaker C:You know, I think for any, for any coach listening out there, I know you said this wasn't a business call, but any coach that's it's going to need a goaltending coach in the future.
Speaker C:I think you get a.
Speaker C:You got one here in Jackson, that's for sure.
Speaker A:Thank you.
Speaker B:So we know you got to get off to practice in a couple of minutes, so we're going to wrap it up.
Speaker B:So very informative show for players, coaches, parents, everybody.
Speaker B:So thanks a lot for joining us, Jackson.
Speaker A:Thank you so much for having me, Jackson.
Speaker C:This is great.
Speaker C:We look forward to seeing you guys march back to a national championship this year.
Speaker A:Thank you so much.
Speaker A:I appreciate it, guys.
Speaker B:All right, so share with a friend, coach, parent or player if you think they may be interested and benefit from this podcast.
Speaker B:If you'd enjoyed this episode, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.
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Speaker C:Keep up to date on our growing list of guests and topics, as well as our growing list of Courtney partners.
Speaker C:So thanks for listening to episode three of Sharpening youg Edge, and we'll see you next time.