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When Your Mind Is on Fire, What Remains Untouched?
18th September 2026 • This Is Your Season • SageWork with Doc Hershey & Sarah Jane Forman
00:00:00 00:27:38

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Some mornings the mind is quiet. Some mornings it is a forest on fire.

This teaching is about what does not burn.

Most of our attention runs outward — reporting on what is coming, what is going, what just happened, what might happen next. The habit is so old it feels like us. And it costs us. We hemorrhage energy into what is momentary, then wonder why we are tired in a way that sleep does not reach.

But something here has never moved. Something watches the arrival and the departure of every thought, every sensation, every storm, and is not carried off by any of them. This morning we turn the attention around and look for it.

Not as a belief. Not as an idea to agree with. As something you can check for yourself: if I were only the thing that came and went, I would have gone with it. But I am still here, watching it appear and disappear. So what am I?

In the Vietnamese Zen tradition this is called touching the nature of no birth and no death. Not a doctrine — a recognition. And it is available in an ordinary kitchen on an ordinary morning.

You will meet resistance. The mind has endless energy for foolish things and none at all for this one. That resistance is also perceived. Notice it, and keep looking.

What is found is not a technique for managing your life. It is a steadiness that was already there, and a quiet confidence that comes with it. And it does not remove you from the world. Inner freedom is what makes compassion possible — when you are not imprisoned by every movement of your own mind, there is finally room to truly see another human being. Room to listen. Room to respond with loving kindness instead of reaction.

Sit with it. Walk with it. Lie down with it. Stand with it. Whatever posture supports the practice.

May we be peaceful. May we be compassionate. May we be free of suffering and the causes of suffering. May the peace we touch within ourselves become peace for all beings.

Namaste.

Walk it with us. The daily practice and the seasonal gatherings live inside The Circle, our community of practice. Your first seven days are free, no card: sagework.life

Transcripts

Doc:

Keep confirming Sit with it, walk with it, lie down with it, stand with it

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in whatever posture supports the practice.

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Namaste

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Good morning.

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Sit with me.

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Take a breath

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and just arrive here

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This morning, let us keep

confirming even the small things,

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whatever's coming and going

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The habit is that the

attention runs out to it.

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It runs this way, it runs that way.

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It's all over the place, reporting

on what is going on But from the

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real place, nothing is going on.

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Confirming this over and over

corrects the habit of feeling

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that we are the ones

who go with every moment

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If we stay with it, if it resonates,

and we keep looking and confirming, then

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gradually we stop hemorrhaging energy

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to what is momentary

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to what is coming and going.

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And everything stays right here.

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Our energy is not broken.

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We are simply here

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So.

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, on the day the forest of your mind bursts

into flames, something remains untouched.

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And this, we may say, is our training.

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It's the practice

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And it is the training

that becomes more enjoyable

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It is enjoyable to feel our expansiveness.

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It is enjoyable to feel that something

is growing into truthfulness.

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It is enjoyable to come to the point

where it becomes a natural conviction

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within us that what we are is not

limited to what comes and goes

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In Vietnamese Zen, we might say

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that we begin touching nature of no

birth and no death, not as a belief,

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not as an idea, but as something

we begin to recognize directly

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If someone merely touches us with this,

perhaps we will not be able to grasp it.

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But if we pay attention to that which

is unmoving rather to the things

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which are always moving, we will

come to that natural conviction.

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we may even go beyond

conviction or the concept of

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belief itself.

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It is not simply saying,

I'm not what I see.

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I'm not what I see.

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Over and over again, there is no

need to turn it into a mantra.

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It is actually understanding and

confirming that I cannot be only that.

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It is coming and going

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If it were that , when it went , I would

also be gone . But I am here to watch

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its appearance and its disappearance.

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So who or what can I be?

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Not merely ideas

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Now experience it and prove it

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It is very easy to feel some

resistance here, some laziness

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It is part of the mind's condition.

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We have plenty of energy

for foolish things

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But for that one thing that

can reveal our true nature.

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The mind says, "I don't like this.

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"I don't have time for

this That too is perceived

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Does it matter?

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Does it have the power we give it?

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All things are perceived.

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That which sees everything,

that which perceives everything.

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All our lives we've been

perceiving and making some records

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Save.

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Save.

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Delete.

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Delete.

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Save.

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Replay.

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Replay

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We've been doing this our whole life

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No one else is really contributing to

our movie in the way that we imagine.

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That which is perceiving everything,

every sensation, even sensations so

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subtle that there's no name for them.

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Still, they are perceived in consciousness

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So that which is perceiving

everything, which sees everything

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Can that itself be perceived?

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That which sees everything.

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And by seeing, I don't mean only

visual seeing, perceiving as in

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feeling, sensing, knowing, being

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That which is behind it, can that

itself be perceived directly?

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And take a look

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Try.

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And if it can be perceived,

by what can it be perceived?

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By another?

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Does it have a story?

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Does it have a parent?

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Does it have a CN diploma?

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So what is it?

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If we say that which is

perceiving everything

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Where is it?

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Where is the location of that

which perceives inside and

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outside at the same time?

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Where is it located?

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And where are we in all of this?

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Are we the object of perception?

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Are we the subject of perception?

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It is mostly through habit that we

place ourselves in the position of an

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object of perception, and that's fine

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This is the capacity of our

knowing, but it is not fine if we've

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forgotten the subject of perception

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If we're only a leaf blown by

the wind, what knows this leaf

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is being blown by the wind?

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Another leaf

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Somehow within the blown leaf, there

must be something which is not blowable,

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not movable, not moving, not subject

to all the movements of the wind.

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And then what happens during a tsunami?

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A tsunami is a crisis moment.

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This crisis moment, this

intense experiencing.

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In those moments, we tend to panic,

and panic is also perceivable

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Maybe in that intensity on this

emotional rollercoaster, our

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ability to perceive feels diminished

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But is it necessarily diminished?

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And why is that?

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That we feel Not now.

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Not now.

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I'm all caught up with

the noise in my mind

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The strength of our identification

with the body-mind and the strength

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of our ability to witness what

is happening are directly related

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If we strongly identify with the

body-mind functioning and personal

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identity, we will feel unable to witness

it, unable to stay out of that noise.

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Many beings through their practice,

but largely through understanding,

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come to recognize their correct

position in this, and they honor it

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they begin to honor it

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And what does honoring it mean?

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They pay attention to it

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that which is.

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They become very keen to

observe this moment and to

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see, " Wow , I am watching this

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And maybe after a while of watching

it and not identifying with it,

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we lose interest in it also.

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And if we lose interest in a

thing , it is no longer registered

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in the consciousness in the same way.

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Experientially, its

grip begins to disappear

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Now we can say we are editing

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Maybe the things we don't like

we try to get rid of, and the

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things we do like we try to keep.

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But even if that were true, the

one who wishes to keep or get rid

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of anything is also perceivable

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So we can begin giving

some attention to this

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Because if indeed we do this, the fruit

of our looking will not disappoint us

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We can simply say, "Okay, from now on,

I wanna give some attention to this.

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This is really interesting

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I wanna know more.

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I wanna understand

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I would like to sit with it just

a little more and really try to

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understand what is happening here

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And some come into the practice and say

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I'm very easily distracted

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Somebody says something and we're--

right in the middle of that story

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Or we are really here and

then something goes Click

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and something is gone

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Click It's like a light switch.

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It's a little flicker.

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And we can watch that sense of going and

see that which observe the sense of going.

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Did that also go to the witness

of the thing being watched?

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And you can find out what

happened, and it's such a joy.

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It's such a silence and stillness and such

a steadiness is discovered within you.

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It's already there.

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And tremendous confidence, absolute

confidence comes too And we can keep

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doing this and transcend the noise

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We entertain with our attention the

noise that pulls us away from presence

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The noise that comes and

pulls us away from compassion

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The noise that causes us to forget

ourselves and forget one another

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And how to be compassion

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Center people

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Express matter

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Every moment in loving kindness

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Toward another person and being

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and connectedness with others

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We entertain so much of it

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and we can become very

complacent with many bad habits

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They can be overcome more

quickly than we sometime imagine.

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So many wonderful things await us

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Meaning that we are not accessing

a great part of our potential

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We don't know anything about it.

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But we're starting here.

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We're paying attention.

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We're learning to observe.

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Something begins to open.

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There are people who have practiced these

things even in prison around the world

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And many of them have come to recognize,

"Wow, I thought I had no control over that

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But just the ability to observe and

not be pulled into the reaction.

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To see that actions, reactions,

interactions are observable,

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and to find in the midst of

all this that I'm still here

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Think about what that means

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A person whose body is physically confined

may discover tremendous inner freedom

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Sometimes bodily restrictions can

amplify the discovery of inner freedom

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So simply just keep checking

in and apply this and look.

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Is that true?

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Is this simply something coming and going?

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distractions and thoughts of the mind

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We don't even have to spend

so much time trying to prove

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whether or not it's true or not

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If it comes and goes, that

itself tells us something.

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Stay put

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Get used to your own stillness

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And get familiar with that

natural state of emptiness

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Meaning empty of the noise of life.

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Not empty of love, not empty of

compassion, not empty of relationship.

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Empty of the unnecessary noise that

keeps us from touching life deeply

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Empty of concept

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Identification of self

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And who we believe ourself to be

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Beware of yourself in this way

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And from just being silent without

trying to be silent, we discover silence.

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Many wonderful things are

waiting to be revealed to us

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And, Many wonderful things are

waiting to reveal themselves to us

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Many wonderful things are waiting

to reveal themselves in us

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And it keeps expanding.

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And yet this expanding is taking

place against the background

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of unchanging awareness

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At the same time

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A paradox we can only experience.

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The truth of it must be experienced

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If we only think about it

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"Ah, this doesn't make sense."

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That is what the thinking mind does.

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But look, look for yourself

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Because when we begin choosing this,

of course, our habits and the mind may

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rebel against what we are discovering

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It is as though some power within

us does not want to go in the

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direction of deepening awareness

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Deepening understanding,

deepening compassion

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But rather wants us only

at a level of personhood.

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And six years can pass,

and we may have a beard

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We may not walk as straight as we used to.

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We may be a little bit older

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more wrinkles.

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But we have not really grown internally.

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Maybe much of our growth

has been external.

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But here, our real growth is internal,

meaning we are discovering our inner life.

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Inner life does not mean that we

have to give up our outer life.

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Outer life can go on, and we can still

have our job, and we can follow our

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religion, and we can follow our practice.

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We can raise our families

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See our children grow up, grandchildren

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We can work

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We can love

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We can laugh

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And we can walk through the world fully.

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Vietnamese Zen teaches us

not to run away from life.

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The practice is to touch life deeply,

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to recognize

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That nothing exists by itself alone.

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So inner freedom does not

remove us from one another.

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It makes compassion possible

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because when we are not imprisoned by

every movement of our mind, there is more

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space to truly see another human being.

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More space to listen.

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More space to understand suffering.

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More space to respond with loving

kindness instead of reaction

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And internally, somehow, something

is deepening in a way that

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nothing external can give us.

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This joy, this peace, and it is not peace

that we will have or collect or keep.

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It is not something to possess

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It is synonymous with our own being

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So this morning, just stay

here for another breath

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Nothing to chase, nothing to push away

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Coming, going

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Coming, going, again and again

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will always lead you back here

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Welcome home to yourself

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and state of peace and bliss and love

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Compassion for yourself

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in other beings

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So as we close out this

teaching meditation

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I'd like to devote the merit

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Of our time together

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to your practice

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And time and attention and focus

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that you give to discovering

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Who you are

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and the boundless potential of your being

that's already waiting to be discovered

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May we be peaceful

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May we be compassionate

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May we be free of suffering

and the causes of suffering

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May the peace we touch within

ourselves become peace for all beings

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Om Namaste Om

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