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Hello, everyone.
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I'm John Montoya, and I'm John Perrings.
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We're authorized Infinite Banking Practitioners and hosts of the
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Strategic Whole Life Podcast.
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Episode number 102.
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Welcome to Strategic Whole Life.
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Today, we have a special guest, one of, one of our clients, Ian King,
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who is a young go getter out there in Minneapolis, Minnesota area.
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Where he is a tech employee, a real estate investor and business
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owner and avid IBC practitioner.
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And so we wanted to have him on today, to talk about his experiences and what
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he's seeing out there in the marketplace from a real estate and business aspect.
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And talk about how he's using.
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The Infinite Banking Concept in his life.
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Ian King, welcome to the show.
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Really glad to have you on.
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Could you, we can just kick things off and maybe you could tell us a little
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bit about yourself, your background, how you got into IBC, all those good things.
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Yeah, absolutely.
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So first of all, I, I appreciate you guys having me on.
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I've been a long time listener, so it's, it's very cool to actually be here,
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talking with you both on the podcast.
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So as you mentioned, I live in the Twin Cities area of Minnesota.
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So I'm just, a suburb here outside of Minneapolis, and
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from a little bit of background.
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So I've worked in the tech sector pretty much my entire professional life.
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so I kind of work in enterprise tech for those listening
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that are familiar with that.
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but in addition to that, I've always had really an entrepreneurial side.
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So I've always been really interested in investing, personal finance,
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business, things like that.
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And, really since, you It's the entire time that I've been
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working professionally, I've always done things on the side.
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one of those things is the real estate space, so I've been buying rentals.
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pretty much since I graduated, I think I bought my first rental maybe four or
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five months out of college and have been steadily buying since, I've sold a few,
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which I'm sure we'll get into later, but, I think at the peak I had somewhere around
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30 rentals or so that, both in Minnesota and then Michigan as well, that, were just
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full rentals, single family things all the way up to some small multifamily stuff.
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nothing huge compared to some folks out there, but, it was definitely a lot for
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me while still working a full time job.
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And then, over the past few years, I've actually started and purchased a
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couple of businesses as well, so I've got a commercial cleaning company that
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really focuses in cleaning, medical, school, manufacturing, office, pretty
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much anything you can think of on the commercial side, we do from a
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commercial cleaning perspective.
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And then I also own a transportation business that I've purchased within
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the last six months or so as well.
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so both of those businesses, I've got partners in and the, the
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partners in those businesses are the full time operators and CEOs.
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but it's been really cool for me to get into business ownership from that
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side as well, both starting and then, learning all there is to learn about
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acquiring businesses and all the stuff that comes along navigating that as well.
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So that's been a bit of my journey and focus, on the professional side here.
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Maybe we could just start a little bit with the IBC journey side of things.
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how did you hear about IBC?
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How'd you get involved in, what was it about IBC that piqued your interest
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enough to, really start looking into things and doing your research?
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Yeah.
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So I think the first time I ever heard about anything around insurance
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was not even the words IBC, just around whole life insurance.
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I met with a financial advisor probably back right when I
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was right out of college.
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And one of the things that they really pushed on me was, Hey, you should be
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putting money into this insurance thing.
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At the time I had no idea what it was.
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I just knew that, at the time I was maybe making 3, 000 a month after taxes
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and they wanted me to put 2000 in.
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And I thought, there's no way I can do this.
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And.
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I forgot about it and I, yeah, I really pushed that thinking aside.
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And I, to be frank, I didn't think about it again for probably
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another five years from there.
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and I, was, to be honest, I just had a gross feeling.
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It was a slimy push.
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It was, something that.
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We spent the entire, meeting that I was in there talking about and, it was, I
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just didn't walk away with a good feeling.
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So I really pushed it out of sight, out of mind for a few years.
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and then, one thing about me is I'm a, big learner.
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I'm a nerd for podcasts and books and things like that.
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And I'm always listening to something around personal finance
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or investing in businesses.
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And, as I was listening to, one of the real estate podcasts out there
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and even some of the business buying podcasts out there, I heard some folks
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that I really admired in this space.
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Talking about IBC and leveraging cash value and kind of doing that to buy,
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whether it be rental properties or even buy businesses and things like that.
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And so from there, I really went on a kind of an education binge
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and I found every book and podcast and, everything that I could find.
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And, that's when I happened to find you guys and I think I listened to every
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single episode that you had at the time.
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In a, maybe a three or four day period, so I was just listening nonstop, trying
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to get all the information I could, and from there, I, I bought Nelson's
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book, so I bought Becoming Your Own Banker, and then I bought, Building Your
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Warehouse of Wealth, read both of those.
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to be honest, they were way over my head.
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I think the first time I read Becoming Your Own Banker, I Got way too lost
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in the illustrations and I was trying to pencil out the math and try to
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learn everything that, that I could.
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And, I'm somebody who really likes to act.
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So I think after reading through the book and listening to the podcast, I
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reached out to you guys website, got in touch with John Perrings and, we were
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on a call and I think within maybe two weeks I had my first policy in place and,
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have been running with IBC from there.
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I think to maybe go back to your question around what really intrigued me, I'll
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say that it was, A, having, control and access to my own capital, but, the other
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thing was just to have some reliability.
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A lot of things I touched on in the beginning.
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Our spaces that have some volatility, they, they're not
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super reliable areas at all times.
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I certainly have months in my businesses where I'm way up and then we're way down.
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I have real estate deals that have gone really well, and I've had
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real estate deals where, I've lost a Tens of thousands of dollars.
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And so I really liked being able to have something that had, a guaranteed
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side to it where I knew if I were to look out five, 10, 15 years later,
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and I was diligent about paying a premium and, making sure that as I take
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loans, I'm paying them back and I'm being an honest banker that, I would
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be in a strong financial position.
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and it was really a mindset shift for me to build my foundation first.
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I think I've always jumped into a lot of things without, maybe earlier
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than I should have, or without maybe being properly capitalized, and I've
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gotten burned by that a few times.
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And so I think I really saw the power in IBC and just, to be honest, really
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being able to build out my foundation.
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It was something that was really important to me.
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I think it's interesting that, you had a whole life policy that you started and,
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for your own reasons, you said, you didn't really pay attention to it or look at
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it for maybe another four or five years.
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In a way, you really had the, have had the benefit of hindsight, even though
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you may not have looked upon it that way.
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I'm curious, once, once you did read, Nelson's book and you listened to
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the podcast, what were your feelings going back to this whole life policy
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that you had started five years ago?
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How did your, impression of what you did change with what you learned?
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Sure.
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And I may make one correction there, John.
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So I actually did not start it when,
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Oh, you did not start.
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Okay.
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No.
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So I walked out of that meeting and thought, ah, this is not for me.
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And unfortunately, it ruined, I think, the notion of insurance
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for me for a few years from there.
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And I really pushed it out of my head.
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But I will say when I read the book, I thought, man, I wish I would
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have done this five years earlier.
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Even if I had done whatever the policy was that they had put in front of
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me at that time, I think it still would have had benefits that at the
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time I just couldn't understand.
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And so I think reading the book.
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Really just clicked for me in terms of, Oh, I think this is
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what the guy was trying to say.
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Now they weren't affiliated with the Nelson Nash Institute in any way.
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they were a big, financial planning and insurance house that was just
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trying to push insurance products.
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But I think really being able to tie it back and the book really just opened
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up my eyes to see wow, I really wish I would have understood this earlier
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and I wish I would have acted on it.
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But, but I didn't have that initial policy.
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the first one I did was through you guys a few years ago.
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Okay.
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Okay.
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Got it.
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interesting, that, your regret is you wish you would have started five years
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ago because the most common, regret we hear from people is, they, say, we wish
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we would have started 20 years ago.
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you're definitely, in better position.
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and the fact that you have gotten started and you have gone down the rabbit hole,
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it's tremendous and it, only gets better.
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As we age, right?
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Because whole life policies, they lock in your age and, you start to capitalize and
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with your entrepreneurial, mindset, you need to have capital allocated someplace.
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maybe, it would be helpful to listeners to, hear from you how the
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capitalization of your whole life policy has helped you, in your businesses
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and, in real estate investing.
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Yeah.
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and I'll be transparent.
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So I'm, I just entered my third year of the first policy that, that
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you guys helped me put in place.
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And to date, I actually have not taken any policy loans.
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So I have been really focused on the capitalization phase.
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I think, you guys talk a lot about that in your podcast and something
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I really took to heart, which was not rushing in to leverage the money
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just because it's sitting there and really being patient to build up.
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My foundation, really build my system and put it in place and I'll say I took your
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advice and I did do a little 200 policy loan just to get through the scaries of
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making sure that I could take the loan and it's real and I knew how to use it.
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and but I've really been focusing on that capitalization phase and so much so in
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fact that I've actually started selling off a number of my rental properties.
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And as I really got into this, one of the things that I was really evaluating
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was, and it's something I know is talked about, but I don't know, at
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least in the real estate circles, I hang out and not something that's a
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huge metric, which is return on equity.
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I was looking at some of these houses that I had bought and I had, 50, 60,
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100, 000 worth of equity on, and yet I'm making 20 in cash flow on them
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because of, whether the financing or just, hey, stuff breaks and stuff comes
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up and, the cash flow wasn't crazy.
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And so I've been looking at, I've been selling those.
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I'm in the process of doing so right now.
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I've sold a few and I've got, a few more on the market and I'm going
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to continue to do this exercise.
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And what I'm doing with that money is I'm taking it, I'm buying additional
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policies, and I'm using it to buy PUA as well and really building
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out and capitalizing that system.
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To answer the first part of your question, I can go back and as I start to look
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at other opportunities, whether it be private lending, whether it be investing
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in syndications, buying or flipping homes of my own, buying more businesses,
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I'm doing that with a well structured foundation that I know that, can help
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propel me and again, be there to build on and make smart investments going forward.
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So maybe not as, as sexy of an answer, but again, I've really just
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been focusing on the capitalization and really trying to not.
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Rush into investments and really build that foundation first, and then, go back
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and really make investments from there.
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Yeah, I think you're doing it right.
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And, in this case, I want to say boring is, is doing it right because, you'll
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never be in a worse position by having access to cash and having access to the
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cash value in your policies that just puts you in a better position longterm.
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and, a takeaway for me in how I'm hearing you, redirecting money.
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You, you're choosing to redirect money from one asset class property,
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real estate property, and you're redirecting that money into another
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asset class, which is also property.
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And I think what people sometimes, don't understand is that when you have a
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guaranteed cash value contract, that is.
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property, much like real estate property.
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It's a different asset class.
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but this is an asset class that comes with a contractual guarantee that
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it's going to increase in value every single year for the rest of your life.
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and it's great to own real estate, but I think it's, even greater to have Whole
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life contracts, because that's another form of property that comes with a ton
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of benefits that, maybe for, speaking to, real estate investors out there
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who quite aren't up to par with, their life insurance knowledge to where you
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are at today, this is really important for those people to better understand
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life insurance as an asset, as property.
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So I think what you're doing, I think it's tremendous and I think
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you're doing it the right way.
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and you bring up a couple of interesting points there too, John.
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And I think one of the big things for me, to be honest, as I was really looking at
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this is, I had to overcome a little bit of an ego thing when it came to this.
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I always loved, and I even said it at the beginning of this podcast, I hate
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when I say it, oh, I own whatever, 20 doors, 30 doors, 100 doors, whatever it
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is that somebody may out there may own.
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And so I think as I was really starting and debating on going down this route,
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part of it was me overcoming that to say, I always said there's this ego thing about
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owning so many doors, but really what I'm focused on is, Building my foundation,
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building my wealth, having access to cash, and being able to have cash flow.
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And it's cool to say you own 30 real estate doors, but if those 30 doors
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are producing less cash, or aren't giving you access to capital when
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you need them, where's the benefit?
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and I figured, hey, I can have more benefit.
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I can have the same equity that I have putting 'em into a life insurance
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contract, which is growing for me, as you mentioned, which is, In most years
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paying a dividend and is continuing and then that I can borrow and use to put into
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other assets that are paying me cash while that cash is still growing, uninterrupted
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in my life insurance contract.
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And so I think once I was able to make that mental switch and get over some of
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the vanity or the ego piece that comes, I think that was the biggest thing I had to
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overcome when I was really debating this.
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Because as I run the math and I look at the numbers.
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It's a no brainer to do it the way that I'm doing it now.
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It just took a little bit of, really being able to get out of my own way to do it.
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Yeah, said.
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I would like to dig into that a little bit more.
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so we've mentioned building the foundation a couple of times now.
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And one of my favorite quotes from Montoya is you can't build a
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house by starting with the roof.
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So you gotta start with the foundation.
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And you've mentioned that a couple of times, Ian, and you also, you
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said a couple of things that, One, you got burned a couple times by
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not having the foundation set up.
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Would you mind expanding on anything?
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Yeah, I can give you a couple examples.
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as I was building my portfolio in real estate, I did it without
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always a lot of access to cash.
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And so I've borrowed private money.
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I've borrowed, from hard money.
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I've borrowed friends and family money.
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I've used lines of credit off houses.
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I've used lines of credit off stock investments.
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And so just off those examples alone, I had one time where I was borrowing.
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Money from a stock portfolio and I was borrowing maybe 60% of the value of that
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portfolio and the market tanked and I got a margin call, and all of a sudden
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I owed $10,000 into the account and I had maybe $8,000 in cash at the time.
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And so I was scrambling trying to figure out how I would pay this.
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saying, Oh, shoot, I'm now I got to pay this.
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I got to figure out then how I'm going to be able to keep this alive.
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And if the market continues to go down, the broker's you're going to
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get another call tomorrow and the next week and whatever, until the market
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rebounds and you get to a place where, it meets your lending threshold.
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And that's happened to me a number of different times in situations like
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this, I did a similar thing where, we borrowed hard money and at least all my
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projects do, I'm sure there are better real estate investors and flippers
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out there than I, but whenever I do a project, I think we're going to be done
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in six months and it takes 10 months.
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and, after that six month, My interest rate shot up from, I was
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paying 10 percent on hard money.
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I went up to 14%.
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I had to pay all these fees to keep the money going.
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And, the hard money lender was, knocking on our door every day, making sure that,
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everything was in line, getting updates and everything like that, as he should be.
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00:16:38
But just, it was another, hoop I had to jump through and
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00:16:40
just, again, something that.
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00:16:42
was a really difficult place to be in because we didn't
Speaker:
00:16:45
have access to that capital.
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00:16:46
And I was leveraging the ways of financing in front of me, which are great ways
Speaker:
00:16:50
when you don't have anything else, but they're not always super reliable ways.
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00:16:54
And they're, ways that, where you're really in second or third
Speaker:
00:16:58
position sometimes, and those things can change should the market
Speaker:
00:17:01
shift or the environment shift.
Speaker:
00:17:03
maybe one more example I'll give you just a quick one, and then we can move on if
Speaker:
00:17:06
you want is, I have a commercial loan.
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00:17:09
So I've got a small apartment building right now that I'm in the process of
Speaker:
00:17:12
selling and we were on a commercial loan.
Speaker:
00:17:15
It was a 15 year fixed rate, which in my book, I thought that
Speaker:
00:17:18
meant it was fixed for 15 years.
Speaker:
00:17:21
about a year and a half ago, as rates really spiked up, the bank came back
Speaker:
00:17:25
and had all these loopholes in their contract and basically said, Hey, you
Speaker:
00:17:29
set up this operating account, you're not using it like we thought you would,
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00:17:33
so we're going to increase your rate.
Speaker:
00:17:35
And I went back, and we went back and forth, and I said, Hey, I'm using it.
Speaker:
00:17:38
I just didn't know that you had to be putting a certain amount
Speaker:
00:17:40
of money through it each month.
Speaker:
00:17:41
And they said, yeah, we decided that, you need to have certain
Speaker:
00:17:44
thresholds in order to meet.
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00:17:44
And so just like that, they increased my rate.
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00:17:46
My payment went up a thousand bucks a month.
Speaker:
00:17:48
And this was a property where, you know, that pretty much
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00:17:50
ate into my entire profit.
Speaker:
00:17:52
And again, it was just another example for me of, I'm really not in control.
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00:17:57
I'm at the mercy of a lot of these factors that I have no personal,
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00:18:00
influence on, and, unfortunately, in those situations, I just had to roll
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00:18:04
with the punches and, take whatever it was in terms of those outcomes.
Speaker:
00:18:07
I definitely have seen a lot of examples of it, and I know those are maybe just
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00:18:10
a couple that come to mind right away.
Speaker:
00:18:14
I think this is huge and I really, we talk to a lot of real estate investors
Speaker:
00:18:19
and a lot of times, people, especially real estate investors, they have a hard
Speaker:
00:18:24
time getting their head around, you Why they would want to put money into a whole
Speaker:
00:18:30
life insurance policy when they could be putting that money, towards their next,
Speaker:
00:18:35
acquisition, real estate acquisition.
Speaker:
00:18:38
And so a few things I'm hearing from you from the real world, are access
Speaker:
00:18:44
to capital And the fact that the way you finance a, the way you finance a
Speaker:
00:18:54
real estate deal in the conventional way, you give up a lot of control.
Speaker:
00:19:00
Number one, I hear stories all the time where there are always surprises
Speaker:
00:19:07
somewhere in the lending agreement.
Speaker:
00:19:10
like things that they weren't expecting, powers that can be, Implemented, to,
Speaker:
00:19:18
call a loan or increase the rate or, stop the loan or stop the line of
Speaker:
00:19:25
credit based on different stages.
Speaker:
00:19:28
we've talked about a lot of those stories, but they're always third
Speaker:
00:19:31
hand coming from our mouths.
Speaker:
00:19:32
So it's interesting to hear, your, direct experience, with some of
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00:19:38
these things and how do you feel You know, as you mentioned, you've been
Speaker:
00:19:44
focused on the capitalization phase.
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00:19:47
how do you think IBC will help with some of this?
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00:19:50
Do you think you'll completely stop using third party finance or bank
Speaker:
00:19:55
finance or, hard money finance?
Speaker:
00:19:59
or do you think, what is it about IBC that you think is
Speaker:
00:20:03
going to help with some of these?
Speaker:
00:20:05
situations.
Speaker:
00:20:06
Yeah.
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00:20:07
I certainly would love to get to a place where The need to use a third party
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00:20:11
finance company is no longer there.
Speaker:
00:20:14
I know that, obviously, especially if I look at kind of the scale
Speaker:
00:20:17
that I had been buying, it would be, take quite a while to do that.
Speaker:
00:20:20
But I really see myself, to be honest, starting to play a
Speaker:
00:20:22
little bit of a different role.
Speaker:
00:20:23
I think one thing that IBC has changed my mindset on a bit is the
Speaker:
00:20:27
power of cash flow versus net worth.
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00:20:30
And I think, honestly, with IBC, you get both.
Speaker:
00:20:32
A lot of the net worth, in my mind, I'm not using up until my goal is to have it
Speaker:
00:20:36
there for my wife and my future family.
Speaker:
00:20:39
and I get that with IBC.
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00:20:41
I also get the access to cash, and I can leverage that to use, to buy more
Speaker:
00:20:46
things and invest in more things.
Speaker:
00:20:47
It gives me cash flow.
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00:20:48
But I can also, use IBC as a retirement plan down the road,
Speaker:
00:20:52
where I can take, multiple different ways to really take cash flow and
Speaker:
00:20:56
take income from IBC down the road, which I know will be there for me.
Speaker:
00:21:01
but in terms of real estate specifically, John, I think I'm shifting my mindset
Speaker:
00:21:04
a bit to really look at to say, hey, instead of maybe buying a house and
Speaker:
00:21:08
leveraging IBC, I'm really almost looking at it from like a private
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00:21:11
lending and a syndication perspective where I make these investments,
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00:21:14
whether they be whatever the number may be and I get a consistent return.
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00:21:19
So if I look at private lenders, when I borrow private money, I see the
Speaker:
00:21:23
statement at the end of the deal.
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00:21:24
50 percent of the time, the private lender makes more money than I did.
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00:21:27
So that had me thinking, maybe I'm doing something wrong.
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00:21:30
I'm taking all the risk.
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00:21:30
I'm the one signing the guarantees.
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00:21:32
We're doing all the work.
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00:21:33
At the end of the day, we're making the same amount of money.
Speaker:
00:21:35
and then on the syndication side, really looking at it at a way to say, Hey,
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00:21:39
I still have my, I'm leveraging, IBC.
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00:21:42
I'm making an investment in a syndicator.
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00:21:44
I'm getting cashflow from that syndication.
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00:21:46
And at the end, I'm getting a payoff for my initial investment.
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00:21:49
And then some, obviously if the syndication goes well, all the while
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00:21:52
I'm continuing to service that loan.
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00:21:55
my, my IBC policy is compounding and continuing to grow and pay
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00:21:59
dividends in the background.
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00:22:00
and so again, I think IBC, more than anything, has really just
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00:22:03
changed my mindset around things.
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00:22:05
And again, it's really had me have more of a focus around cash flow, access to cash,
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00:22:09
less on net worth and that phantom number that I was so focused on, throughout my
Speaker:
00:22:14
20s and even up until a few years ago.
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00:22:19
And so just speaking of syndications real quick, are, what are, do you
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00:22:23
see any risks with syndications?
Speaker:
00:22:26
so you, it sounds like you're seeing an improvement in the process there
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00:22:30
where it's more focused on cashflow.
Speaker:
00:22:32
You don't have to, sign away all these guarantees, but what
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00:22:35
are the, risks, if any, that you see with syndication type deals?
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00:22:40
Yeah, so obviously, I think from my perspective, and I'll, again, be
Speaker:
00:22:42
transparent, I have not invested in a syndication before, but I certainly
Speaker:
00:22:45
have done my homework on them and met with a number of syndicators,
Speaker:
00:22:48
so when I'm ready, I, know what I'm getting into, but I think, obviously,
Speaker:
00:22:52
the operator is really the big thing.
Speaker:
00:22:53
when you're looking at a syndication, you're really vetting the operator.
Speaker:
00:22:56
You want to make sure that operator has a track record, that operator
Speaker:
00:23:00
is reliable, that operator can, knows how to buy, reposition and
Speaker:
00:23:03
manage assets, in that particular area that you're looking to buy.
Speaker:
00:23:07
And so I think obviously the big risk is the operator and, the big
Speaker:
00:23:11
risk is, hey, the money that you put aside, if you invest 50, 000 into
Speaker:
00:23:15
a syndication deal, that money is not guaranteed to come back to you.
Speaker:
00:23:19
But to take it back to IBC, one thing I, that gives me a little bit more peace with
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00:23:23
that is I know that, hey, that 50, 000.
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00:23:25
In theory is still growing and compounding inside of my life insurance contract.
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00:23:29
And so if I lose the 50, 000, yes, I'm going to be an honest banker and I'm
Speaker:
00:23:33
going to pay back that 50, 000, but I know that I'm not losing the velocity on that
Speaker:
00:23:36
money, even with an investment like that.
Speaker:
00:23:38
And so I think, again, John, that the big risk would really be around the operator
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00:23:42
itself, and again, making sure that you vet the operator and that you know who
Speaker:
00:23:47
you're investing with is somebody that you can trust and that, again, is going to be
Speaker:
00:23:50
there and be a reliable, solid operator for the asset that they're purchasing.
Speaker:
00:23:56
And then.
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00:23:57
Out of this, you said one other thing that, that, hit me and I
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00:24:02
never thought of it this way.
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00:24:03
So this is pretty awesome.
Speaker:
00:24:04
you mentioned you're selling some of your real estate assets and you're.
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00:24:11
You said something to the effect of your, you have the same equity moving
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00:24:15
from real estate to whole life.
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00:24:18
Can you talk a little bit more about that?
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00:24:19
Because I liked how you said that.
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00:24:22
Yeah.
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00:24:23
So I think, when I look at a piece of property and I use simple numbers here,
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00:24:27
if I have a hundred thousand dollar property that I have 50, 000 worth of
Speaker:
00:24:30
equity in, Essentially, my net worth goes up 50 percent or sorry, it's 50, 000.
Speaker:
00:24:36
And so what I'm looking at doing is saying, Hey, instead of hanging onto
Speaker:
00:24:40
it in that asset where it's a very hard to access, if I actually needed
Speaker:
00:24:44
it, I would either have to refinance, take a line of credit or move to sell
Speaker:
00:24:48
it, which as I'm going through the sales process, I can tell you it's
Speaker:
00:24:51
taken longer than I thought it would.
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00:24:52
And had I needed that money and been in a position where I was in a crunch to
Speaker:
00:24:55
get access to that cash, I would have been in, I would have been out of luck.
Speaker:
00:24:59
And so I'm really looking at that to say, hey, as I move this money, what I want to
Speaker:
00:25:03
do is I want to take it and put it into a vehicle where A, I have access to it and
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00:25:07
B, where I know it's growing and I know
Speaker:
00:25:14
I'm also able to take that money and leverage it into things that to
Speaker:
00:25:17
be honest will pay me a better cash flow than I'm getting in those deals.
Speaker:
00:25:21
Now that's not every real estate deal.
Speaker:
00:25:23
I will say there are deals I have where the cash flow is such in
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00:25:26
the equity position is such that I'm still hanging on to those and
Speaker:
00:25:28
I see them as a good investment.
Speaker:
00:25:30
as a good asset to still hang on to, but a lot of those things where my return
Speaker:
00:25:34
on equity, as I mentioned, is really low, that's where I'm looking at getting
Speaker:
00:25:37
that equity out and I'm moving it into, a life insurance contract or buying
Speaker:
00:25:42
PUA, et cetera, to really have better access and better use of that money.
Speaker:
00:25:46
And I know an objection I hear when I tell my friends, this is, wow, I can't
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00:25:50
believe you're going to pay those taxes.
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00:25:51
And I have maybe an unpopular opinion here, which is if I'm making money and I'm
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00:25:55
getting a gain, I'm okay to pay the taxes.
Speaker:
00:25:57
It's money that I didn't have.
Speaker:
00:25:58
And so I'm okay to pay the taxes, and when I run the math and I look at the
Speaker:
00:26:02
long term use of putting that money inside of a whole life insurance contract
Speaker:
00:26:06
versus leaving it in, in a B class home, which a lot of these are, that's
Speaker:
00:26:10
going up maybe 2 percent a year and I'm making minimal cash flow on, it's a no
Speaker:
00:26:14
brainer for me that the money is better used and I have better uses for it
Speaker:
00:26:18
down the road in my insurance contract.
Speaker:
00:26:23
that's a great explanation.
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00:26:25
And, we talk a lot about in the, in this industry, different asset classes
Speaker:
00:26:33
and the control you have over those different asset classes and, real
Speaker:
00:26:37
estate is very popular right now.
Speaker:
00:26:40
And one of the things that I think people miss is when you put money into a real
Speaker:
00:26:47
estate The money, we, call it having the money locked up in the walls of the house.
Speaker:
00:26:53
And you just hit the nail on the head there where you said, if you had needed
Speaker:
00:26:57
access to that capital, it took you longer to get to it than what you anticipated.
Speaker:
00:27:03
And I think a big problem out there is, people look at, real estate equity.
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00:27:10
They look at, home equity lines of credit, different ways to source capital.
Speaker:
00:27:17
And They really are not putting enough emphasis on the fact that
Speaker:
00:27:24
they're not in control of whether or not they can actually get to
Speaker:
00:27:27
that capital when they need it.
Speaker:
00:27:30
lines of credit can be called, lines of credit can be canceled.
Speaker:
00:27:35
it takes longer to sell a property than what you think it might.
Speaker:
00:27:42
you're, really speaking the language of, what we talk about all the time.
Speaker:
00:27:46
no, no big surprise there, but it's, just the control that you have, comparing
Speaker:
00:27:53
different sources of capital, there really aren't, there really aren't too many that,
Speaker:
00:27:59
that stack up to whole life insurance from a liquidity and control, aspect.
Speaker:
00:28:06
And John, I think I'm still very much a proponent as I know you
Speaker:
00:28:10
guys both are that real estate is a great place to put your money and
Speaker:
00:28:13
is a great place to build wealth.
Speaker:
00:28:15
I just really looked at the mechanics of the order of operations.
Speaker:
00:28:18
When should I put that money in and where should that money go first
Speaker:
00:28:21
before it goes into real estate?
Speaker:
00:28:22
and you've got a great illustration that really sold me on it in terms
Speaker:
00:28:25
of really seeing and running the math on how that would actually work.
Speaker:
00:28:29
And I think it's really that mindset shift for folks that, we're not
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00:28:33
saying that real estate is not a great place to put your money.
Speaker:
00:28:35
I am.
Speaker:
00:28:35
I agree.
Speaker:
00:28:37
made and lost money in real estate, and real estate has been a huge foundation
Speaker:
00:28:40
for the wealth that I've built to this point, but I think, wow, had I been
Speaker:
00:28:44
able to put it in my insurance contracts first and then leverage it from there,
Speaker:
00:28:49
I can only think of how much farther along I would be, and so I think it's
Speaker:
00:28:51
really just that order of operations and getting people to understand that.
Speaker:
00:28:56
versus saying, hey, I want to buy that property right now, have one
Speaker:
00:28:59
use for that money, and then have to start over again, save my way up to
Speaker:
00:29:02
my next down payment, buy the next property, and start all over again.
Speaker:
00:29:05
It's just a perpetual cycle where you're saving down to zero, saving down to zero,
Speaker:
00:29:09
versus taking a step and saying, hey, I'm just putting one step in between
Speaker:
00:29:11
those actions, and that one step can make a huge difference, especially when you
Speaker:
00:29:16
look out over the longevity of, 5, years.
Speaker:
00:29:21
And, you mentioned liquidity.
Speaker:
00:29:23
So another thing to think about is a lot of times real estate investors, in
Speaker:
00:29:28
their mind, they're always thinking of, okay, I've got to put money in whole
Speaker:
00:29:33
life insurance or I could buy this asset.
Speaker:
00:29:36
And they're looking at it as either or.
Speaker:
00:29:38
So number one, life insurance is the and asset.
Speaker:
00:29:42
So you can put it in life insurance first and then use it to buy real estate.
Speaker:
00:29:46
So that's the first thing, which you just, have been alluding to.
Speaker:
00:29:50
But the other thing is, would you agree that, real estate investors need to,
Speaker:
00:29:56
really just be sitting on a significant amount of cash in order to just run
Speaker:
00:30:01
their real estate investment businesses?
Speaker:
00:30:04
Yeah, I think access to cash in real estate is huge and people that don't
Speaker:
00:30:09
think other people that don't think so, in my opinion, haven't been around
Speaker:
00:30:12
real estate long enough to know because it's not a matter of if it's when
Speaker:
00:30:17
you're going to have to replace a roof, you're going to have a furnace
Speaker:
00:30:19
go out, you're going to have a tenant destroy your home, or all the above.
Speaker:
00:30:23
And so having access to cash is always there.
Speaker:
00:30:26
And I think regardless of what endeavor you do, I can speak
Speaker:
00:30:28
for my businesses as well.
Speaker:
00:30:29
TheFifthEdition.
Speaker:
00:30:29
com We always have an unplanned expense, people think those unplanned
Speaker:
00:30:33
expenses come around once in a while.
Speaker:
00:30:34
But I think the more stuff you do and the farther you've been in those games and
Speaker:
00:30:38
investing, those things happen constantly.
Speaker:
00:30:41
And so being prepared and being able to weather those storms is oftentimes
Speaker:
00:30:44
the difference of what people, what keeps people in business and
Speaker:
00:30:46
what puts people out of business.
Speaker:
00:30:48
That's amazing.
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00:30:49
And, we had an episode 100, we had a couple of business owners on,
Speaker:
00:30:53
to, celebrate our 100th episode.
Speaker:
00:30:56
I was saving you, Ian, for this one, so that's why you
Speaker:
00:30:58
didn't get invited to that one.
Speaker:
00:31:00
The, but they both mentioned several, instances where, their whole
Speaker:
00:31:05
life insurance saved their bacon.
Speaker:
00:31:07
And, what's the rate of return on, keeping your business alive.
Speaker:
00:31:12
the, and, Just going back to the sitting on cash, I just wanted to point out to
Speaker:
00:31:17
the listeners, especially the real estate investor listeners who are exploring this
Speaker:
00:31:23
and they're having trouble, justifying paying a life insurance premium when
Speaker:
00:31:27
they could be, putting their money into the next real estate investment.
Speaker:
00:31:31
It doesn't have to be that.
Speaker:
00:31:33
What about just the cash that you absolutely need to have on hand?
Speaker:
00:31:36
What if you just made that your whole life insurance policy?
Speaker:
00:31:39
And then you kept all your cashflow, for all your real estate,
Speaker:
00:31:43
you don't have to interrupt the real estate investment process.
Speaker:
00:31:47
Although, Ian alluded to a talk that I have, I can show you the math that if
Speaker:
00:31:52
you do interrupt the process, you'll long term, you'll come out way ahead.
Speaker:
00:31:56
But if you don't want to do it, you don't have to, but what if you just kept.
Speaker:
00:32:00
The cash that you need instead of spending that cash, you never interrupt the
Speaker:
00:32:04
compounding process on just that cash that you need to have on hand to run
Speaker:
00:32:08
your, real estate investment operation.
Speaker:
00:32:11
Yeah, pretty powerful.
Speaker:
00:32:12
And I, think the main thing I'm hearing you say, Ian, is that, you really need
Speaker:
00:32:18
to prioritize savings, before investing.
Speaker:
00:32:23
and too many people, they get out over their skis and, they Just
Speaker:
00:32:27
jump right to investing right away.
Speaker:
00:32:30
And to get back to, building the foundation before the roof.
Speaker:
00:32:34
that's exactly it right there.
Speaker:
00:32:36
And like we've said on the podcast over and over again, you'll never
Speaker:
00:32:39
be in a worse position by having access to cash and, you're, you're.
Speaker:
00:32:45
Given examples that hopefully listeners can relate to.
Speaker:
00:32:50
I think they can.
Speaker:
00:32:50
I think we all can, to be honest, because life is challenging.
Speaker:
00:32:55
And how many times, have we all wished, if we didn't have access to
Speaker:
00:33:01
cash that we did have access to cash and under our own terms where we can
Speaker:
00:33:06
control it and control our own destiny.
Speaker:
00:33:08
And the.
Speaker:
00:33:10
just getting back to fundamentals, you start with savings and, you'll
Speaker:
00:33:16
never be in a worse position by having access to cash in a whole life policy.
Speaker:
00:33:20
it's, kind of one on one stuff.
Speaker:
00:33:24
And, I think that's a great point.
Speaker:
00:33:25
And I think one thing too, for people to think about that are listening is,
Speaker:
00:33:30
Putting your money in a whole life insurance contract is doing something.
Speaker:
00:33:32
I think, when I was younger, and I have this problem today,
Speaker:
00:33:36
I still am the same way today.
Speaker:
00:33:37
I always feel like I need to be doing something, whether it's buying the next
Speaker:
00:33:40
house or the next business or buying the next stock or whatever the case may be.
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00:33:43
And, I have a lot of shiny object syndrome as I know a lot of folks out there do.
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00:33:48
but I think one thing that I've really has helped me with that is, You know, putting
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00:33:52
money into a whole life insurance policy is doing something, you are bettering
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00:33:55
yourself, you're putting that money into a place where you know you're going to
Speaker:
00:33:57
get guaranteed growth, where you can access it, and if you can set aside and
Speaker:
00:34:03
know that, hey, you're not missing out, this is still doing something, you're
Speaker:
00:34:06
very much putting yourself in a better position, and I think when I look out 10
Speaker:
00:34:11
15 years from now, I'm going to really thank myself that I spent the time to
Speaker:
00:34:14
do this and that I put my money into it.
Speaker:
00:34:16
Inside of my whole life insurance contracts first, and again, and that
Speaker:
00:34:20
I didn't get over, over eager or get rush things and not have the patience
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00:34:24
to, to really be methodical about how I'm going to go about this approach.
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00:34:28
And again, I would just say that to anybody listening that putting
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00:34:32
your money in a whole life insurance contract is doing something.
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00:34:35
and again, I think that has been something that's really helped me get
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00:34:39
over some of that shiny object syndrome.
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00:34:40
And I'll tell you now that I have.
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00:34:42
Money in my insurance contracts and I've got a foundation that's
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00:34:46
really starting to be built.
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00:34:47
I'm thinking twice about investment opportunities.
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00:34:49
I had a house that was brought to me the other day and I passed on it.
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00:34:52
Five years ago, I would have invested in that house all day long.
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00:34:55
But now I think twice about, the uses of my capital and
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00:34:58
really where I want to put it.
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00:34:59
And that extra step is something that I never had that, I never
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00:35:03
really had that visual before.
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00:35:05
I never had that, eye on things.
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00:35:08
And I'm so eager to jump into things.
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00:35:09
And this has really given me a second place to say, okay, actually, let me
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00:35:12
look, let me make sure that this is really the best use of my capital.
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00:35:14
And this is an investment I want to make.
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00:35:17
I love that.
Speaker:
00:35:18
I was actually going to ask you, has owning a whole life policy
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00:35:21
made you more discernible in how you choose your investments?
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00:35:24
And yeah, you beat me to the punch.
Speaker:
00:35:26
That was perfect.
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00:35:27
Yeah, that's great.
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00:35:29
And that's actually what you just said is so much more important just from a general
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00:35:37
principle and personal finance Having a little bit of an, you called it an extra
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00:35:43
step or a beat in time to think about, what we're actually spending our money on.
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00:35:49
And so much of what we do in these, in this day and age is unconscious.
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00:35:54
And unfortunately the spending is what Typically becomes an unconscious,
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00:35:59
decision rather than saving.
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00:36:02
And so I think, what we try to talk about here is let's figure out a, a system or a
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00:36:07
process to make the savings unconscious.
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00:36:11
and you also mentioned that as well, where once you have your whole life
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00:36:13
insurance policy in place, like it, it helps with our FOMO or the shiny object
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00:36:19
syndrome where, we make this commitment.
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00:36:23
You got to take a little bit.
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00:36:24
There, there's a little bit of a leap of faith, but not even much
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00:36:27
because it's all just guarantees.
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00:36:28
So it's okay, I guess I, I guess I'll, I guess I'll go ahead and take this leap
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00:36:33
of faith into 100 percent guarantee.
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00:36:36
but you have to do it because of the shiny object syndrome and FOMO.
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00:36:41
It feels like a leap of faith, but once you have it in place.
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00:36:45
Every single one of my, I shouldn't say every single one of my
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00:36:48
clients, because I have had some clients that get over their skis.
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00:36:52
They don't listen to what I'm saying.
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00:36:53
They borrow all their money and then something happens and they can't,
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00:36:57
they can't keep, paying a premium.
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00:36:59
That's an unfortunate thing, but the ones that, I had to really talk to
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00:37:05
about the strategy that we're doing.
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00:37:08
I have one, who's one of my best friends from that we grew up together
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00:37:12
and he was just super into Bitcoin.
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00:37:14
He was super into putting his money in his brokerage account, cause everything
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00:37:18
was going up and up at that point.
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00:37:21
And I really had to.
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00:37:22
Talking, almost convince him to say, Hey, why don't you just put some of
Speaker:
00:37:26
that over here into life insurance?
Speaker:
00:37:27
And so he bought a whole life insurance policy with me and he
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00:37:31
called me, I don't know the other day.
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00:37:33
He's Hey, I just really want to thank you.
Speaker:
00:37:37
I feel like a responsible adult when I, just knowing that I have
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00:37:40
this in place and knowing that on autopilot, I'm putting it somewhere.
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00:37:45
That's not part of the shiny object thing.
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00:37:47
It's it's forcing me to just have one little area of my life.
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00:37:51
That's like responsible, going into safety as opposed to just putting money out there
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00:37:57
into the unknown and hoping for the best.
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00:38:01
Man, that, that really, that hit the nail on the head, Ian.
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00:38:07
What's, as far as people looking at infinite banking right now,
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00:38:13
maybe let's talk about it from two ways because you do both.
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00:38:18
You're an investor and business owner, but you're also a W2 employee.
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00:38:22
So we talked a lot about the real estate.
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00:38:23
Why don't we wrap that up?
Speaker:
00:38:25
Component up and just say what, and we're wrapping up the episode as well.
Speaker:
00:38:30
what would you say to someone evaluating infinite banking?
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00:38:35
maybe they're a real estate investor and they're just really, they're
Speaker:
00:38:38
like, man, I don't know, should I, is this something that makes sense?
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00:38:42
what would you say to that type of person right now?
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00:38:45
Yeah.
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00:38:45
So I think the first thing is, You got to dive in and learn.
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00:38:49
I think that was the biggest thing for me, and I'm a firm believer that the
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00:38:53
learning has to come from the individual, as great as is listening to the two of
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00:38:57
you and consuming content from other peers in your guys world, you have to be
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00:39:01
dedicated to learning and understanding it, and really, it's on you to learn
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00:39:07
that, and then I think from there, it's listening to the right sources.
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00:39:11
I'll tell you one thing that I do for every piece of content that I consume is
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00:39:15
I, whoever the author is or the published poster of the LinkedIn post or the YouTube
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00:39:20
video or whatever, I go to the Nelson National Institute website, I look at the
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00:39:23
practitioner finder, and I make sure that who I'm listening to is somebody that's
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00:39:26
been through and is a part of the NNI.
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00:39:29
I think there's so much information and IBC seems to be a huge buzzword
Speaker:
00:39:32
that John, I know you and I have talked about it before that, just in terms
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00:39:35
of there's so much noise out there for it, good, bad, everything in between.
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00:39:39
But I think, really.
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00:39:42
vetting and making sure that you're listening to the right sources.
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00:39:44
But then for me, the big thing was acting.
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00:39:48
I didn't know everything.
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00:39:49
I still, no means do I know a lot.
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00:39:51
I'm learning every single day.
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00:39:52
There's, and I don't know that I'll ever be done learning.
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00:39:55
But I think when I felt like I had a good enough grasp to feel confident
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00:39:58
about what I was doing, I went all in and I said, okay, I'm going to do this.
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00:40:02
when I worked, John with you and you helped me set up a policy that was, a
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00:40:06
good policy for me at that time in my life and was, something that, definitely was.
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00:40:11
Saving a good chunk of money and, but it wasn't something that made me
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00:40:14
uncomfortable or that I was scared about, if I regret this, I'm really
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00:40:17
going to be in a bad position.
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00:40:18
And so I think that, between doing the research and then.
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00:40:22
Acting.
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00:40:23
I think those are really two big things that, I'm happy that I
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00:40:26
was able to do pretty quickly.
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00:40:27
And I think for anybody getting into this, that being undecided is something
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00:40:34
I think that is really challenging and there's always going to be
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00:40:36
questions that you're going to have.
Speaker:
00:40:37
But I think as you get into it and you really start to learn,
Speaker:
00:40:39
there's always going to be things you're going to pick up.
Speaker:
00:40:41
You're going to learn more.
Speaker:
00:40:42
You're going to feel more confident about your knowledge.
Speaker:
00:40:44
and every podcast I've ever listened to around IBC says they wish they would have
Speaker:
00:40:48
started earlier and I have to echo those sentiments in terms of, getting started.
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00:40:55
Do you have, friends your age, maybe that you're invested with or just
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00:40:59
people that, you know, your age that have asked you about whole life and
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00:41:03
what you're doing, and, if so, what are some hangups that they have that
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00:41:09
maybe you have to try to dispel?
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00:41:12
Yeah.
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00:41:12
So I certainly, I talk about it a lot.
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00:41:14
I think my friends and my wife probably hate how much I talk about
Speaker:
00:41:18
it, but I do really bring it up a lot.
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00:41:20
I think,
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00:41:21
You'll be in the business soon enough.
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00:41:23
That's how it starts.
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00:41:26
know who I'm coming to for a job, But, it's, John, to answer your question, it
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00:41:31
certainly is something that I talk a lot about in the circles that I'm in, and
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00:41:35
I've, really tried to, push gently on friends and business partners and others.
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00:41:39
And I think, I hear a couple of hangups all the time.
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00:41:42
One is, I can only put in a few, maybe 500 a month, and I don't know
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00:41:47
if it makes sense to start with that.
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00:41:48
And, I can tell you that it does.
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00:41:51
getting started is the, important thing, and I think whether your first policy
Speaker:
00:41:55
is 500 a month or 50, 000 a month or anything in between, I don't think
Speaker:
00:42:00
there's such a thing as too small.
Speaker:
00:42:01
I think getting started and being familiar with the mechanics
Speaker:
00:42:04
is really the key thing.
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00:42:05
So I think that, that is one hang up I always hear.
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00:42:09
and the other one that I hear, and I have a challenge Explaining this,
Speaker:
00:42:12
I'm not as technically sound as you two, but is why would I ever pay
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00:42:16
interest to borrow my own money?
Speaker:
00:42:18
And I've tried to explain that and really, offer some insight on
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00:42:22
really what you're doing there.
Speaker:
00:42:23
But I think that is something that I've found that people really have a
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00:42:26
hard time getting over, which is they can't fathom paying money, paying
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00:42:29
interest to borrow their own money.
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00:42:31
even though I know that's not technically what's happening in their
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00:42:34
mind, that's capital they've set aside that they have and paying interest
Speaker:
00:42:38
on it is something that doesn't make sense when they're like, I can just
Speaker:
00:42:40
borrow from my Chase bank account.
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00:42:42
And not have to pay any interest, although losing the compounding on all
Speaker:
00:42:46
that, and again, everything in that goes along with that, goes out the window,
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00:42:50
but I would say those are really two of the big objections that they've had.
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00:42:53
I think one of them I've been able to talk through and help people
Speaker:
00:42:56
understand, but the other one I think is a challenge, and even with
Speaker:
00:42:59
explanations I've given, that seems to be a tough pill for people to swallow,
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00:43:04
paying interest to borrow that money.
Speaker:
00:43:07
That's pretty good.
Speaker:
00:43:07
I haven't actually heard that one in a while.
Speaker:
00:43:10
Should we just tackle it real quick?
Speaker:
00:43:12
Yeah, I think we should.
Speaker:
00:43:13
Why
Speaker:
00:43:13
the, the, short answer is you're not borrowing your own money.
Speaker:
00:43:18
what you're doing is you're, creating a present value and a life insurance
Speaker:
00:43:23
policy that's known as the cash value.
Speaker:
00:43:26
And what you have is a guaranteed loan provision Collateralized
Speaker:
00:43:31
by that cash value to borrow the insurance company's money.
Speaker:
00:43:35
So it is 100 percent not your own money that you're borrowing the money and the
Speaker:
00:43:42
cash value that's created in the life insurance policy just acts as collateral.
Speaker:
00:43:46
And it's really the death benefit at the end of the day, especially with whole life
Speaker:
00:43:49
that ends up being the collateral, that.
Speaker:
00:43:54
allows you a guaranteed source of capital that the insurance company lends you.
Speaker:
00:44:00
And it comes from the insurance company's general fund.
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00:44:03
It does not come from your policy.
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00:44:07
so that's probably the, unless Montoya has, anything to add to that.
Speaker:
00:44:11
I think that's probably the shortest way to answer that is that you're not.
Speaker:
00:44:15
So that's, that's what's going on there.
Speaker:
00:44:19
two ways, that I just thought of how I would answer that, for the real estate
Speaker:
00:44:24
investors out there, when you go to refinance or take a loan from a property,
Speaker:
00:44:32
what is the collateral for that loan?
Speaker:
00:44:34
it's the property, right?
Speaker:
00:44:36
And who determines the value?
Speaker:
00:44:39
an appraiser generally does.
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00:44:40
If you're selling it to the market value of whatever someone, the
Speaker:
00:44:44
next person's willing to buy it.
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00:44:45
But, you have property values that are the underlying collateral for that loan,
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00:44:53
and there's a cost for that capital that you're going to pay to a bank.
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00:44:56
but that value is, it's going to fluctuate.
Speaker:
00:45:00
And when you borrow from a policy.
Speaker:
00:45:03
What is the collateral to your cash value?
Speaker:
00:45:05
And that's the present value that Perrings was talking about.
Speaker:
00:45:10
but it's also tied to a future death benefit that's guaranteed.
Speaker:
00:45:14
you're good for that loan no matter what.
Speaker:
00:45:18
There's, understanding that, what is the collateral, and knowing the
Speaker:
00:45:26
difference between, asset classes that you may be utilizing, but for the,
Speaker:
00:45:31
people who just have, any, objection to paying interest, I would point this
Speaker:
00:45:40
out that when, when you pay cash for something, you're giving up the ability
Speaker:
00:45:47
To earn interest on that money forever.
Speaker:
00:45:49
It's gone, that you're constantly having to start over from zero.
Speaker:
00:45:55
Let's say you save 20, 000 or 50, 000, whatever that number is.
Speaker:
00:45:58
And then you use that money someplace else that money is,
Speaker:
00:46:03
it's one use and then that's it.
Speaker:
00:46:05
And then you're having to rebuild that savings account all over again.
Speaker:
00:46:10
And the thing that people miss when they do this is that
Speaker:
00:46:14
not only the, uninterrupted.
Speaker:
00:46:17
Compounding of that money, had you had it in a whole life policy, but you also
Speaker:
00:46:22
not only have to replace that principle, but people forget that they also need
Speaker:
00:46:27
to, replace the interest that they otherwise would have earned on that money.
Speaker:
00:46:32
And then the compounding interest on top of that, and people
Speaker:
00:46:36
never make that connection.
Speaker:
00:46:38
And I, think this.
Speaker:
00:46:39
The second way of explaining it is probably more powerful because
Speaker:
00:46:43
people completely don't think about the second order effects
Speaker:
00:46:48
of paying cash for something.
Speaker:
00:46:49
And then the third or third order effect, which is the compounding
Speaker:
00:46:52
interest that you're also going to lose by never, having access to that money
Speaker:
00:46:57
again, and the interest on interest.
Speaker:
00:46:59
And here all along, you've had, you have this whole life policy
Speaker:
00:47:03
giving you complete, access.
Speaker:
00:47:05
To, to the cash values, and always growing uninterrupted, even while that
Speaker:
00:47:11
money is being used someplace else.
Speaker:
00:47:13
it's why I call it a financial unicorn.
Speaker:
00:47:15
it just gives you so much, clarity and, if your vision is clear about
Speaker:
00:47:22
how you're managing your money, the decisions are quite easy.
Speaker:
00:47:26
and.
Speaker:
00:47:27
that, that's, something that I think, for most people, just think about
Speaker:
00:47:33
it, spend a little bit more time thinking about how, money compounds
Speaker:
00:47:38
over the long run and does it behoove you to, manage your money better?
Speaker:
00:47:44
And if so, what is a better way?
Speaker:
00:47:46
if you're listening to the show, I think you're, taking strides to
Speaker:
00:47:51
coming to the same conclusion that I think the three of us already have.
Speaker:
00:47:57
Nice.
Speaker:
00:47:57
Yeah.
Speaker:
00:47:57
Nelson, just to sum it up with, from the book, you finance everything
Speaker:
00:48:01
you buy, you either pay interest to someone else when you use their money,
Speaker:
00:48:05
or you give up interest you could have earned when you use your own.
Speaker:
00:48:09
And, that's, that's, that's a core, principle of The Infinite Banking Concept.
Speaker:
00:48:17
And it's really, it's not, The it's not specific to The Infinite Banking Concept.
Speaker:
00:48:24
the concept of economic value added, it comes from that.
Speaker:
00:48:28
So this is like basic corporate finance, economic value added.
Speaker:
00:48:32
So it's not a, it's not an unknown thing or a new thing that, only we know about,
Speaker:
00:48:39
but it is a fairly unknown concept in the world of personal finance because
Speaker:
00:48:44
there's so much information out there.
Speaker:
00:48:46
Misinformation out there about staying out of debt and, never paying
Speaker:
00:48:50
interest or minimizing the interest.
Speaker:
00:48:52
And it's the wealthiest people in the world, they absolutely use debt as a tool.
Speaker:
00:49:00
So you've just got to look at the right way to, to use debt.
Speaker:
00:49:06
and if you're.
Speaker:
00:49:07
If you're looking at it that way, The Infinite Banking Concept and
Speaker:
00:49:11
having this guaranteed loan provision that, Montoya said, the underlying
Speaker:
00:49:15
collateral is guaranteed, it doesn't get much safer than that in terms
Speaker:
00:49:21
of using debt in a, correct way.
Speaker:
00:49:27
this has been a great talk guys.
Speaker:
00:49:29
we'll, we'll wrap up the episode here and Ian, just want to thank you very much
Speaker:
00:49:33
for coming on and sharing some of your insights and how you've been using IBC in
Speaker:
00:49:39
the real world and some of the real world things that you're coming up against.
Speaker:
00:49:43
Because as we know, money is not necessarily just the
Speaker:
00:49:47
math that goes along with it.
Speaker:
00:49:50
There's, things that happen in real life that change the way that the math works.
Speaker:
00:49:55
this has been, I think, hopefully super eye opening to, some
Speaker:
00:49:59
of the listeners out there.
Speaker:
00:50:01
If any of this is resonating with you guys out there, head
Speaker:
00:50:04
over to strategicwholelife.
Speaker:
00:50:06
com and you can schedule a free 30 minute consultation with Montoya and myself.
Speaker:
00:50:11
And if you're one of the type of.
Speaker:
00:50:13
People like I was that just likes to keep learning as much as you can
Speaker:
00:50:16
before you actually, talk to someone.
Speaker:
00:50:19
We have an online course, IBC Mastery, just for you.
Speaker:
00:50:22
And you can get that right at the top of the homepage of strategicwholelife.
Speaker:
00:50:26
com.
Speaker:
00:50:28
All right, guys.
Speaker:
00:50:29
Thanks again.
Speaker:
00:50:30
Thank you.
Speaker:
00:50:31
Thank you, John.
Speaker:
00:50:34
See you next time.