In this episode, expert Tatiana Teppoeva shares insights on nonverbal communication, its impact on personal branding, and how to use it to connect more effectively with clients and audiences. Discover practical tips to enhance your presence and influence in a digital world.

GUEST BIO

Tatiana Teppoeva is a nonverbal communication expert with a unique blend of academic, corporate, and entrepreneurial experience. Originally from Russia, she earned a PhD and began her career in academia before transitioning into the tech industry, where she spent over 17 years, including 14 years at Microsoft working in AI research. She later earned a second master’s degree from Harvard in data science and artificial intelligence. Today, Tatiana helps coaches, speakers, and professionals enhance their presence, improve communication, and build deeper human connection—especially in an increasingly AI-driven world.

CHAPTERS:

00:00 Introduction to Big Impact Experts

02:58 Tatiana's Journey to Nonverbal Communication

05:25 The Role of AI in Communication

08:11 Understanding Nonverbal Signals

10:52 Improving Communication Skills

14:02 Practical Tips for Effective Presentations

16:24 The Importance of Nonverbal Cues

19:33 Final Thoughts and Resources

LINKS:

5 High-Stakes Signals to Master for Real Presence, Authority and Trust

https://one.tatianateppoeva.com/guide-master-five-authority-signals

Was this episode helpful?

Please leave us a review and subscribe to the show to be notified of future episodes.

Until next time, keep moving forward!

Chuck Anderson,

Affiliate Management Expert + Investor + Mentor

https://AffiliateManagementExpert.com/

Hello everybody and welcome back to the show.

2

This is the collaborators unite podcast, Chuck Anderson here, your host.

3

And this is the show for what we call big impact experts.

4

And that's you, if you are on a mission, not only to make money in your business, but you

want to make a big positive impact in the lives of your clients, your community, or

5

possibly even the world.

6

And we hear all sorts of missions and all sorts of uh goals when it comes to

7

what that impact is.

8

But what we know about you is that you prioritize impact over profits, but we believe that

you need to do both.

9

And from time to time on that journey, you're gonna feel like you are attracting the right

people.

10

uh Sometimes it feels like maybe we're repelling the uh right people, or we're having

difficulty selling, or we're having difficulty communicating.

11

And there can be a lot of challenges along the way.

12

uh especially non-verbally.

13

And so today I have an expert in not only non-verbal communication, but how do you use

this knowledge to be able to communicate more effectively, drawing people in, into the

14

conversation and enrolling more into your program.

15

So uh I have Tatiana Tavova with me today.

16

uh Welcome, Tatiana.

17

I'm so glad that you're here.

18

Thank you, Chuck.

19

It's great to be here.

20

Hello, everyone.

21

I am, we've had a few conversations about this and I've been excited to share this with

our audience.

22

And I think a great place to start is tell everybody a little bit about you, like your

background and how did it come to be that you're this specialist in nonverbal

23

communication?

24

Thank you, Chuck.

25

It could be a very long story, but I will try to make it short.

26

Originally from Russia, I was on the way to become a professor, but I always was curious

about em philosophers, psychology, why human behave particular way in a particular way in

27

a particular situation.

28

Why in the same situation, one person behaves this way and another person behaves another

way.

29

It was so interesting to me.

30

And my manual when I was 16 was Dale Carnegie book, How to Make Friends.

31

So it started back then, my interest, but I went into economics, statistics and things

like that because I'm also a materialistic person.

32

And those were better paid jobs at that time.

33

And then in 2006, I immigrated to the United States and I decided to make a pivot.

34

And instead of becoming a professor, I already had PhD by that time and taught in

different universities.

35

I decided to go and work for businesses to apply my knowledge in real business.

36

And it led to 17 years career in tech.

37

And I spent 14 years at Microsoft.

38

This was my last employment.

39

where I also took care of AI uh research and even managed to get AI patent.

40

And then I decided to make another pivot, actually last year when I was working too much

on the data and got my second master degree from Harvard in data science and AI.

41

And I was too involved in data and I was missing this human element.

42

ah And I think it's just I learned so much that I was ready for something new, for a new

challenge.

43

So I decided to start my own business and help people to answer questions that I still had

from that time.

44

I was quite successful at getting interviews, presenting in front of people, sometimes

over 300 people.

45

And as I mentioned, I taught at universities before.

46

So I had this experience, but I didn't know exactly what worked.

47

And I also felt that something was missing that I could improve and I still have do.

48

There was a few areas, but now I'm more knowledgeable and I know what those things are and

I can help other people.

49

So this really interesting time when we are getting so much into AI automation and even

email can be scripted automatically sent on behalf of us, received and replied.

50

So much is going on.

51

how we keep this human touch, how we present ourselves the way we would like to be

perceived.

52

Not only that we believe that we are smart and look like an expert, but also our clients,

our audience thinks the same way.

53

This is something that I help people to answer.

54

Amazing.

55

And we're in exciting times right now because there's so many advancements in technology

and AI is accelerating it at a pace that we've never seen before.

56

And I really like what you said about maintaining that human connection.

57

And we can use the I always think about using AI to augment what I really do very, very

well, not necessarily to replace.

58

you know, some of the conversations and some of the communication that I have to do

personally.

59

But, you know, how do we use it em to do better?

60

And so.

61

That's OK, I'll just pause for a second while you do that.

62

And it's there we go.

63

I think that's perfect right there.

64

Yeah.

65

Yeah, technology, I tell you.

66

Yeah, you'll be fine.

67

So I'll just edit that part.

68

So um I wanted to ask you.

69

you know, uh what are you noticing when you think about, you know, some of the people who

want to make a big impact, such as coaches and uh book authors and speakers who, know,

70

messaging and communication is such a huge part of their business.

71

And I do know many of them are using AI, so we definitely want to touch on the human

connection part.

72

But I want to ask you first, what are you noticing?

73

What are some of the struggles that people are having that

74

you know, may even be caused by mistakes that they're making or mistaken assumptions.

75

What are you noticing?

76

Where's the struggle?

77

So one big trend that may be not so much applicable to coaches themselves, but to their

clients.

78

That over 50 % of the companies right now using AI in their job interviews.

79

So if their clients are looking for a job or thinking to upgrade or whatever, they may

face this issue.

80

And it's not only about resume scanning, like machine reading text.

81

It's actually screening.

82

the presentation.

83

How a person is talking, how they show up on camera, their gestures and things like that.

84

So it's nonverbal piece that we are talking about.

85

So over 50 % of the companies do it.

86

And the problem is that AI is not that great at it.

87

So if I was a performer and I could present myself confidently and have less knowledge, I

would pass potentially AI screen.

88

But if I was someone very knowledgeable, but a little bit shy or stressed in particular

situations like interview, I wouldn't pass it well.

89

It would treat me like someone who is not confident, who will not be able to do

leadership, even if it's not true.

90

So this is a huge issue.

91

And right now, companies struggle because they cannot hire, they filter out many people

first on uh resume screen and then on AI screen.

92

But also candidates are struggling.

93

because they're being filtered out, even though they have great skills that would be a fit

to a particular company.

94

So this is one trend, and it's not solved.

95

And we can talk why this happening, um but another portion uh of the uh most common

problems that I'm seeing that we would like, and inside we may even feel like we have so

96

much knowledge, we are happy to share, but our clients don't feel it.

97

and they don't feel it, uh some of them may not feel it.

98

We can talk about personality profiles, for example, personality types, or they may

partially feel it.

99

And it's because we are translating some signals that resemble lack of confidence, lack of

expertise, something may be irritating some people.

100

So it's some unknown nonverbal signals that we are translating.

101

And oftentimes people are not aware of them.

102

Yeah, let's dive deeper into that because that is something that I have observed.

103

It's something that I have experienced.

104

It's also something that I know uh others struggle with, where it's like, you know, I feel

like I've got so much to give.

105

Why are not more people saying yes to me?

106

And perhaps that's even eating at their confidence.

107

uh somewhat, which then as you're saying could be non-verbally communicated.

108

you know, let's talk a little bit about, you know, what in terms of our messaging and the

way that we're talking and how we, you know, I love what you say, like, what are the

109

people that are listening feeling?

110

And I've often said this to the clients that we work with in webinars.

111

They're so focused on the content.

112

They're so focused on the data.

113

or they're so focused on step one, I do this and step two, I do this and step three, I do

this.

114

And there's no feeling there.

115

And um I read a statistic once that said, you know, 90 % of the people that you're

teaching are gonna forget all of that content within 24 hours.

116

They're gonna forget most of it, but they're gonna remember how you made them feel.

117

And so talk a little bit about that, how, like, cause I heard you say the word feeling and

it just reminded me of that and.

118

you know, in terms of how that maybe draws people in and or potentially repels them based

on how we're feeling or how we're communicating.

119

So again, and I totally agree.

120

We definitely remember how it made us feel and we oftentimes feel like, I really like this

person.

121

I don't know why they didn't do anything special.

122

They didn't say anything special, but I feel so connected.

123

I want to be their coach here, right?

124

Or their client or whatever relationship they may have.

125

And can be the opposite.

126

The coach is great, great credentials, great track record.

127

right?

128

But thank you, but no, right?

129

uh Or I will think about it and they never show up.

130

Or I don't have money or I need to ask my spouse.

131

So there are bunch of reasons show up and they don't want to engage.

132

So again, it's two sides.

133

First, how we portray.

134

uh It can be voice, it can be visual.

135

For example, I say, I'm so good at nonverbal.

136

And I raised my intonation, I even did it physically because I needed to force myself

right now to uh show it.

137

But oftentimes we can do it naturally.

138

We raise intonation at the end and instead of statement, we ask a question and it

immediately lowers our confidence, immediately downgrades our authority in the eyes of our

139

audience.

140

Another one is uh how we show up.

141

If I show up like that, right, or like that, it's very different from if I show up like

that, right?

142

And it's just a small change, the same person, same content.

143

I even can do worse ah and can show you many small gestures that will change a lot how we

are perceived.

144

So this is one thing, so what we are translating specifically.

145

The second piece, how we read the person.

146

So if we have a cookie cutter script that we are going through with everyone and we don't

pay attention to what personality types they are, what their non-verbal, their non-verbal

147

signals are saying, we are missing out a huge portion.

148

And I believe non-verbal communication, approximately 50 % of what we are communicating,

50 verbal, 50 non-verbal.

149

Depending on the context and situation,

150

et cetera, but it's easier half and a half to think about it.

151

So if we are not reading, if we have an analyst client who wants numbers, who wants

specific questions to be answered, but we talk about some abstract ideas, things like

152

that, they are lost.

153

They are lost.

154

They are being respectful.

155

They may not interrupt us, but they are not with us already.

156

And the opposite can be true.

157

So paying attention, seeing those signals that it's time to move on, it's time to give

them uh option to ask a question maybe at this moment, maybe to clarify something, paying

158

attention to all those clues and adjusting, still having the skeleton of your script,

right?

159

The way you usually like to do it, but adjusting elements to each particular personality

type or each particular individual will give much better

160

uh outcome at the end because we want them to be heard, we want them to be felt, so we

feel their pain, right?

161

So we can relate so they can understand, okay, we are on the same page, she listened to

me, uh he heard me.

162

And this is when I talk about feeling.

163

So uh this feeling when we feel the client is super important and it's both ways.

164

When we translate something and when we can read them,

165

and respond accordingly.

166

I love that.

167

is such great insight and I can really relate to, you know, some of the gestures that

you're talking about.

168

Like I see this one a lot on on Zoom meetings and, know, where they're they're listening

and they, know, they're or, you know, there's different ways that people sort of show up.

169

But I agree, like, especially when I'm presenting, I usually like to stand.

170

I have a standing desk, so I'll raise up so that I'm standing when I'm presenting, because

it's more likely to, you know, than to.

171

slouch into the chair and uh things like that.

172

And, uh you know, I find that to be really helpful.

173

uh I think it's really important for people to hear what you're saying in terms of, you

know, how you are showing up is how you're being perceived uh on the other side.

174

So uh we explored some of the mistakes we saw, some of the struggles, some of the

challenges.

175

uh What is your oh

176

Uh, you know, what are the things or the steps or the, um, you know, top things that you

want people to think about that can help them to improve, uh, the way they are showing up

177

when they're communicating so that they are being perceived the way they want to be

perceived, especially for those of you who are trying to sell your coaching services, you

178

know, are you, um, communicating confidence?

179

you communicating clarity?

180

Um,

181

And so that your that is what's being received on the other side.

182

So Tatiana, what do you what are your top suggestions there?

183

Like what should people be doing, you know, to make sure that they're showing up in the

right way?

184

Great question.

185

And I will address one tip uh also that could be uh as a minus or a plus for us.

186

And I actually um listened to multiple coaches presentations last week because we had a

summit and I observed this to be very common.

187

So I will mention that one.

188

But first, let's thinking about what audience and what format we are presenting it.

189

Because if you talk about this video format online, you can only see what, one third of

me.

190

Maybe if I stand away little bit, maybe half of me.

191

uh If I'm presenting in front of 300 people, they can see me all, but they also can see me

from different angles, and we need to account for that as well, right?

192

So if audience...

193

uh is not all upfront, but from sides, we need to consider this as well.

194

So first to be aware how you're presenting.

195

And I will tell you one story.

196

When I presented in front of 300 plus students and uh educators at the conference and the

room they gave me, the podium oh was covering my body.

197

The mic was completely attached to the podium.

198

Who could think that nowadays you can have a touch mic that wouldn't move with you?

199

And the rest of the stage was covered by the tables.

200

So I couldn't even do my job well.

201

So I needed to find a way to show gestures because it was about presenting yourself, how

to show up, bad and great things that we could do potentially.

202

uh So I needed to step away, but then they couldn't hear me.

203

If I stood next to microphone, they couldn't see me.

204

So be aware of that.

205

It was a great lesson for me.

206

So going forward, I'm not only asking if there is a microphone and stage, but I'm also

asking how covered it is that I need to be able to show what I'm preaching.

207

So be aware.

208

ah Then if it's online format, they are paying attention to this portion.

209

And we can potentially even hide some of those gestures like adapters some people use.

210

Many of them I had professional who used 397 times of those adapters during 45 minutes of

her presentation.

211

So did you already get tired of these gestures that I'm doing?

212

So I exaggerated it, but imagine 397 times during 45 minutes.

213

Do you think she realized she was doing it?

214

No.

215

Oftentimes our brain protects us from this information and we cannot even see it

sometimes.

216

So being aware of those gestures is very important.

217

So how can we start without uh help from someone like me?

218

uh We can do first is record ourself, whether we present it or record intentionally, you

can decide, you can do both.

219

And first I recommend uh watch without sound.

220

Just seeing on verbal, if it was not you, what impression would this person make on you?

221

What is great about that and what would you change?

222

Then when you made your notes, listen to the presentation without any video and listen to

intonation.

223

Maybe there is a question at the end of the statement where it shouldn't be.

224

Maybe there are some, so, you know, kind of, maybe there are some other words that you are

using.

225

excessively or maybe they don't belong there.

226

Make notes as well.

227

And then third time, watch together audio and video and see.

228

And most likely in each of those passes, will make uh note that the things that you

noticed and mentioned, noted are different.

229

Because we change our perception based on what we hear, what we see, or if we see them

together.

230

And it's uh another point that each element of nonverbal is very important.

231

So then when you have a list of those, you can already start addressing them, especially

the ones that you didn't like.

232

And next step would be to ask someone you know and trust.

233

Just be careful who you choose for this role to ask them to watch this video and provide

you with feedback.

234

And then you have an option to implement it or not.

235

And finally, uh

236

find someone like me and ask for a true assessment.

237

I highlight what person is already doing great because oftentimes we forget about it.

238

Each of us has something great that we already have and we could leverage more.

239

And then I would point out some of the things that could be improved and highlight the top

20 % that would provide most impact if person addresses them.

240

So those would be my suggestions.

241

uh going back to the tips that I promised.

242

So what I noticed from the video recordings, it was online presentations, what I noticed a

lot, people wear glasses.

243

First, uh many of the lenses are reflective.

244

So when we, let me see if I have any.

245

Mine are anti-reflective, I think.

246

I don't wear them often, but you don't see, so you see reflection now, So many people have

reflection and oftentimes it's big, so you can't even see their eyes.

247

So if you were my client and if I was talking with you with the reflection on my glasses

all the time, does it make you comfortable?

248

Like, is it really enjoyable to look into my eyes?

249

to have eye contact?

250

Probably not, right?

251

Then some people do, they look like that.

252

Is it comfortable?

253

Some do like that.

254

Some constantly change.

255

So if you wear glasses, start with glasses because it's such a big destructor if it's not

done right.

256

So ideally, we don't want any reflection.

257

We don't want to touch them many times unless it's necessary.

258

It's also an adapter.

259

like I showed you this one, touching glasses, correcting them, just because uh it's also

uh becoming annoying eventually to our audience.

260

So adjusting this.

261

If you can do sessions without glasses, if you don't need to read, it would be the best.

262

uh this is uh glasses can make us look smarter, some of the frames.

263

So and feed our fashion style if you would like to.

264

So there could be a big plus of that.

265

And of course they help us see better, but they can also be a huge destructor for our

audience and take our attention away.

266

ah And even this thing alone can already say like, oh, I'm so irritated.

267

I don't know why, but it's irritating.

268

And probably it's not going to work for me.

269

And people often...

270

don't even realize what exactly caused this sensation.

271

They just feel it subconsciously.

272

Oh, I love that suggestion.

273

And I see that all the time.

274

And it does take some practice to get the lighting just right so that it is not reflecting

in your glasses.

275

And I agree.

276

It does take away from the message.

277

If your audience finds themselves needing to turn away because they can't look.

278

um that's gonna take away from how they receive the message.

279

And to add one more, and maybe you can um jump in on this as well, I see this too, where

the webcam is in the wrong position.

280

So either they're looking up here like this, or they are looking down here like this, or

even worse, they have two screens, they're over here looking like this, and they're

281

talking, but our audience is right there.

282

and I'm looking at my screen, I'm looking at my wall, I'm looking down here, uh but your

audience, especially online, is right there.

283

It's right in the camera.

284

What are you noticing there, and what do you recommend?

285

uh Definitely.

286

I think, Chris, it was your suggestion to have something in the middle of the screen where

you can position the camera.

287

ah I actually even got this thing to try.

288

I haven't tried it because ah it's challenge for me.

289

I prefer to speak in person, honestly.

290

And right now, I'm also moving between looking at you and looking at the camera.

291

ah So this is challenge for many people.

292

Some adjust it better than others.

293

but it's definitely going to the camera so it looks like real eye contact, not just

looking at the person.

294

Sometimes it's not a big deal because it's relatively close and eye contact, we don't try

to make 100 % of that, it's not natural.

295

70, 80 % of eye contact is great.

296

So if we can stay about this number, it's already awesome.

297

But if it's...

298

with people like me who have a challenge, then maybe trying to move this camera on some

kind of hook or adjustment and put it at eye level.

299

Completely agree with you because if you look from the top down, it's maybe considered as

arrogant, right?

300

We are looking at them like, oh, you are a small one.

301

I'm the smart one here in the room.

302

If you look the opposite way, first we show our nose and it's more...

303

our personal zone that usually people don't expose.

304

We look at each other this way, not that way.

305

And secondly, if you look at them, then we change position.

306

Now they are the boss and we are the client.

307

And this is not the situation we uh are in with them, right?

308

So we would like something on the same level.

309

So we are the same or a little bit, slightly a little bit higher.

310

So we show up as authority, but a little bit, not too much.

311

I love that.

312

And yeah, I wish I could take a picture of it.

313

Maybe we I'll do that and put it in the show notes here.

314

But, you know, to your point, my camera is on a tripod.

315

It is positioned so it's in the middle of my screen.

316

And then I've positioned the window where your

317

face is right above the lens.

318

So I'm looking at you right now, but it also looks like I'm looking at the camera.

319

And a great way to know if you want to practice by yourself is position that look where

you, uh you know, record yourself looking and just notice, like, notice where do your eyes

320

go?

321

Maybe even take a screenshot of it so you can kind of see like, where is it that you're

looking at?

322

Where does it look like I'm looking right at you?

323

And where does it look like I'm looking?

324

at somebody else.

325

I love that.

326

And that uh has nonverbal

327

Yes, and if I can add, uh having relaxed face helps.

328

So sometimes we are so tense because we are desperate or because we want to help this

particular client so much or because we had something happen before this meeting or

329

whatever it might be.

330

But trying to relax muscles so you can play, do some gymnastics, whatever it is, and just

looking at yourself, smiling at yourself, I will do great.

331

Yes, everything is there, what I thought about.

332

I will think about that after meeting is over and trying to relax face and smile, not

overdoing it, but genuinely smiling, inviting person, and it changes uh perception a lot.

333

It makes us more likable right away.

334

I love that.

335

Tatiana, you have such great advice and I want to, uh before we run out of time, give

people a way to connect with you and to learn more from you.

336

And I know that you have a gift that everybody can, it's a free gift that everyone can go

and uh get and they're going to learn more of your advice, more of your tips and a way to

337

connect with you as well.

338

You want to tell everybody what that is?

339

And I will make sure I put all the links beneath this video and in the podcast show notes.

340

Sure, Chuck, thank you.

341

I'm sure that your audience will find it helpful.

342

It's a free guide on five nonverbal signals that shape how prospects and clients actually

perceive us.

343

So those are five main ones that they can start exploring and practicing right away.

344

Yeah, and I highly recommend that you do uh practice it right away.

345

if you're listening to my voice right now, there's no better time to go and grab that than

right now.

346

If you're watching this on video, just look beneath this video.

347

Tachyana's link is right there.

348

And if you're on a podcast, if you're listening on your phone, just open up their phone

and the link is there as well.

349

And there's no better time to do that than right now.

350

Tatiana, thank you so much.

351

You are amazing.

352

I love everything that you shared.

353

This is not a topic that we've covered uh on this show before.

354

I look forward to uh more opportunities to hear from you, to learn from you.

355

ah And before we sign off, I'm wondering if you have any just final piece of advice or

words of wisdom that you can leave our audience here with today.

356

Thank you, Chuck.

357

It was a pleasure to share insights with you and your audience.

358

I would recommend to try uh watching recordings, and uh video and audio together, as I

mentioned before, and also start observing people.

359

When you start observing, attention to what nonverbal signals they're sending, including

us with you right now, and at least start guessing, what did this

360

cue mean.

361

What did that cue mean?

362

Then awareness comes to you and you start noticing what signals you are sending.

363

I just did that.

364

I just did that.

365

Or intonation went up and awareness already helps to move forward in this journey.

366

I love that great tip to end this episode by Tatiana.

367

Thank you so much.

368

I really love everything that you shared here today and to our audience.

369

Thank you for being here as well.

370

And if you're still listening to me right now, it means that this episode resonated with

you.

371

So the first thing I want to invite you to do is go and look beneath this video and get

Tatiana's gift.

372

Go and do that right away and start taking the next steps.

373

And also I wanna tell you that on your journey to make a big positive impact, you are

gonna encounter challenges, you are gonna encounter setbacks, but you might be just one

374

collaboration away from a big breakthrough that allows you to make that bigger impact and

perhaps Tatiana is that person to collaborate with or to learn from.

375

And so go and take that next step today.

376

So remember, as you are on your journey to make a big impact,

377

uh Really, the only way to fail is to quit.

378

So keep moving forward and we will see you on the next one.

379

Thank you.