In this episode, Adrian McIntyre and Abbie Fink reflect on leadership, recognition, and the responsibilities that come with both. Prompted by Abbie’s recent induction into the Scottsdale Hall of Fame, the conversation moves beyond awards themselves to focus on what meaningful leadership actually requires: shared purpose, trust, connection, and the ability to bring others along.

Abbie argues that the best leaders are connectors. They create enthusiasm around a mission, help people see themselves in it, and measure success not only by their own accomplishments but by the growth and achievements of the people around them. Together, she and Adrian explore the role of relationships in business and leadership, the importance of listening and curiosity, and why no meaningful success is ever truly achieved alone.

The episode closes with a broader reflection on responsibility and community impact. Drawing on ideas from Arizona State University’s charter and Abbie’s own work in business and civic leadership, they frame leadership as something bigger than visibility or recognition. It is about inclusion, stewardship, consistency, and helping others find purpose and succeed.

Read the transcript and notes for this episode on our website.

Key Takeaways

• Great leadership is rooted in connection and shared purpose.
• Recognition matters most when it becomes a platform to elevate others and advance meaningful work.
• Relationships, not transactions, are the foundation of lasting success in business and leadership.
• Curiosity and listening are essential leadership skills because they build trust and improve judgment.
• Leadership carries a responsibility to strengthen teams, organizations, and communities.

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Credits

Copper State of Mind, hosted by Abbie Fink and Dr. Adrian McIntyre, is brought to you by HMA Public Relations, a full-service public relations firm in Phoenix, AZ.

The show is recorded and produced by the team at Speed of Story, a strategic communications consultancy for PR agencies and marketing firms, and distributed by PHX.fm, the leading independent B2B podcast network in Arizona.

If you like this podcast, you might also enjoy PRGN Presents: PR News & Views from the Public Relations Global Network, featuring conversations about strategic communications, marketing, and PR from PRGN, "the world’s local public relations agency.”

Leadership and recognition. Sometimes they go hand in hand. Sometimes the best leaders are the quiet leaders whose accomplishments and leadership are not recognized. Sometimes there are awards and the leadership and accomplishments of leaders are celebrated. Abbie, this is a bit of a different twist on our conversation because we’re talking about you and celebrating some of your accomplishments, and I know that you’re a very humble person. This isn’t only about you. You’ve got a lot to say about that. But having recently been inducted into the Scottsdale Hall of Fame, just the latest in a series of awards for both yourself personally and for your agency, let’s talk about it. Let’s talk about leadership and what it takes and what all is involved. And of course, these awards are not the point. The work and the contribution is the point. What’s on your mind?

Yeah, well, thank you for that. And yes, this is a little bit different for me, but I thought it was an important topic because although I have recognized the good fortune that I’ve had and our agency has had over the last handful of months to be recognized in our industry and for our leadership, personally and professionally, but it’s really about for me what it means to be a leader and what responsibility we have to surround ourselves with the right people, with solid people that want to carry out the vision and the mission that a leader has put forth and doing what you can to bring people along with you.

You can only be a leader and a successful leader when you have people around you that buy into your vision and your mission and see it personally as theirs as well. And although I have the pleasure of standing up in front and accepting the award, it truly is about the people that I get to work with every day. My team at HMA Public Relations, the clients that we get to support. And given what these opportunities have been over the last few months, it’s really been for me about the responsibility of what leadership is in terms of connecting, using that recognition to put forth things that are meaningful to you, using opportunity like this to share that information. And if you are lucky enough to be recognized for that work, then, you know, to me, it’s use that platform then for something that moves it forward. And so I thought, well, I have this platform, so let’s get a bit personal and talk more about my view on the responsibility of being a leader and what you need to do when you get that kind of recognition.

You know, it’s a great point you make, because leaders aren’t leaders just because they say so. Leaders need followers. Leaders need a team. Moses, or Musa, depending on the language you read the old texts in, would have just been a guy wandering in the desert going to die of dehydration.

If he didn’t have people following him.

If he didn’t have people following him. So there’s something inherent in leadership that is a relationship between leaders and followers, leaders and the mission, you know, leaders and the bigger context in which we recognize them as leaders. Let’s break this down a little bit and make this something of a reflection on qualities maybe others can relate to or aspire to. You mentioned connection. What is the role of connection in good leadership?

One of the questions that have been asked in, in these recent award applications when they’re doing your profile is, you know, what would say about you? What do you think is, you know, a characteristic of a leader? And I’ve always answered that question, that the best leaders are connectors. If we are a good leader and recognized as such, it’s because we bring together people around a shared purpose, around a common cause. And our enthusiasm and our commitment to that then is infectious, right? It encourages others to come along. And whether they come along directly in what I’m standing for or what I want to do, or they’re finding their own purpose as a result of something that we’ve done together or acknowledged together, we can achieve success individually. But in the truth to me is it’s really a collective of all these activities that we’ve done together.

And my biggest joy and the biggest things for me when I consider success is when I see others achieving what they set out to do. If it’s a result of something that I was able to teach them or guide them or lead them, then that’s where I get my excitement. And where I feel the most success is when I watch people around me do the things that they set out to do. And if helping them connect, helping them bring others together, makes that happen, then that’s to me, a quality and a designation of what a good leader is. And something that I think we should all aspire to do is connect the people around us with causes and things that are important to them so they can push forward and make, you know, not to get too woo woo about it, but make it a better place by guiding and leading people around shared and common purposes.

There’s a word missing in the English language, or at least I can’t think of it, so it might as well be missing. Says the word nerd who used to read the dictionary as a kid. The word is for what we would call somebody who is acting like a leader, but making it all about themselves. And we all can think of examples like this from our own personal lives, from public life, from history. There are people who are at the forefront of something in the spotlight, but it is very clearly something about them. And I don’t think we have the right word for that. It’s not leadership. It may be something else.

It’s easy to dismiss it and say, you know, narcissism or something, but I think there should probably be a value neutral term. I just can’t think of what it is because true leadership is exactly what you’re talking about. It’s celebrating the achievements of others. It is acknowledging the team, acknowledging the movement, giving back that credit or passing on that credit rather than pretending they did it themselves. Nobody does anything themselves.

People achieve extraordinary things. But every amazing athlete has had a coach. Every amazing musician has had teachers. And when people stand up to accept the Academy Award, you know, after thanking the academy, their family, the higher power, and whatever else they name the people around them who helped make it possible, maybe it’s people from their past who had an impact on their life. Maybe it’s people they worked with on the project, the film, the election, whatever. But it’s, it, it’s about everyone. And that’s a really interesting phenomenon because leadership and being a leader is, of course, it requires a leader. Like, that spot can’t be empty. But it’s not about the leader, it’s about the, the bigger team. And that means that relationships are foundational. So not just connection, but really understanding that it’s the relationships and the collaboration that drive the results. Talk about that.

Well, right. And as you said, we cannot achieve success entirely by ourselves. I mean, even if we don’t necessarily outwardly recognize that there were people along the way that helped us get where we are. There were people along the way that helped us get where we are. I mean, you cannot do all this by yourself. And we refer to this quite a lot in business. And it comes in part because of. One of my first bosses used to say that what we were actually doing with public relationships, not public relations, that all of what we do and all the success that we are able to achieve on behalf of our clients is built on long term relationships. These are not one off transactional activities. These are things that we have worked very hard for, that we’ve placed a lot of value on, that we’ve nurtured, and that we have made sure that we honor and recognize what that relationship is. And so even if we push forward, you know, what does it mean for business?

Well, it means everything for business. And even the most well recognized, high powered CEO has to acknowledge, maybe not publicly, but has to acknowledge that there have been relationships along the way that have impacted them and caused them to continue to move forward and to be successful. I think the most important element of recognition in leadership is acknowledging the relationships that helped get you there.

You mentioned the Scottsdale Hall of Fame, which is an incredible and humbling experience to be recognized in that way. And this year in particular, at least for my purpose, is every one of the other honorees this year in some way has been an active part of my journey in what I’ve done. They are former clients, they are former coworkers. I worked side by side with one, I hired another one is a former journalist. And, you know, so in all of this coming together, in this recognition, every one of these individuals are being honored for their impact on the community, but can point to the others in the room and say, it is because I worked alongside you, we did this together, we projected this thing out. And I, I just think that in itself is such an amazing thing and in this particular case gave me a real opportunity to sort of reflect on what it means and what I’ve been able to create and provide opportunities for and give space for others to be successful in the same way that I believe these other individuals have done the same, to allow those to shine. And so it’s a pretty wonderful acknowledgment, but it is also this powerful statement about all the people that come along with you on your journey and how important it is for us as leaders to bring others along on their journey as well.

I mean, the bigger the vision, the bigger the mission, the more it’s going to take others to pull it off. I mean, you think of any of the major accomplishments that we’ve celebrated throughout human history, and look, let’s be honest, some of this is the dark stuff, the horrific stuff even to pull off, you know, things that are truly appalling that we hold up as examples of the worst of human behavior or of evil or of whatever that takes a lot of, takes a lot of people. But back to the bright side, that’s where we want to live.

Anything, anything that’s been built, anything that’s been achieved has required the inputs, you know, and I’m just thinking historically is what I do. But you know, you think of the pyramids at Giza or the Mayan pyramids in Central and South America, you Think of the moon landing. You think of anything. You know, even the interstate highway system. Like, no one person does any of these things. No one person can.

And so to pretend I did it all myself is just. Is just not even true. Even the people that we celebrate in entrepreneurship, you know, Jeff Bezos built Amazon, but the Internet was there. Someone built the Internet for someone built the roads. You know, I’m expecting a delivery later, and it’s going to pull up on a highway that’s maintained with tax dollars by people who do the work. It. We’re all in this together, and the illusion that we can do anything without others is truly, I think, something that holds us back. And the best leaders do not suffer from that illusion. The best leaders understand that others are the path to success. I really like what you said about public relationships rather than public relations, because it just puts at the forefront.

What we’re trying to do is create. You know, circling back to another theme you talked about, create connections, create, understand and create relationships. Those could be consumer relationships between a brand and their customers. They could be service relationships between a medical system and the people who benefit from that, who live in that area. We’re in the business of relationships. We specifically, as communicators, are using communication to form relationships. But so is every person.

Every human being is using their words and their listening. And that’s what I want to talk about next, to create and deepen those connections. So qualities that make a great leader. We have talked in the past about listening. Let’s revisit that. You’ve also flagged curiosity as something that really helps drive leadership. So let’s talk about those two things. Just riff a little bit on listening and curiosity.

Well, you know, when I talk with up-and-coming PR professionals, you know, the students or, or those that are thinking about re careering one of the, you know what, what skills should I have, et cetera, et cetera. And I talk about, you have to be a good writer, this, that, and the other thing. But one of the things I also say is you have to be curious. Well, what do you mean by that? And I said, you have to be interested in learning new things. You have to be okay with asking a lot of questions, you know, when we were little kids, but why, but why, but why? That’s a skill now. You know, that thing that you did with your parents and continually asking them, but why, but why, but why is really a skill you need in public relations, and I think is a skill that leaders need to embrace as well. If we Are continuing to learn and we are listening to others and we are taking in all this information, considering different perspectives, thinking about the impact of doing A versus B.

All of that leads us to be a better, stronger leader. It’s puts us back in touch with the human connection with what we’re doing. It helps us create trust. You can only be a good leader when those around you trust you to take them in the right direction. And that comes from asking a lot of questions, continuing to be curious, taking in the information that you’re getting from others and formulating this idea, this concept, this vision, this mission, and then building on it and putting that into action means it doesn’t just stop at the point where you’ve taken it all in. What are you going to do with it? You know, what are you going to do with all this information?

And for me, I love my work that I get to do every day for the clients that we get to do it for. I love the people that I get to do it with. But I also love that I get to take this and bring it to organizations that mean something to me and that I can lead in a different way with some of my passion projects. The things that I get excited about that are outside of my workday, the work I do with Valley Youth Theater as their board chair, the work that I’ve done over the years with other youth serving organizations, right? These are things that if I have leadership skills, that I can use them in addition to what I do professionally.

But I can bring that understanding and responsibility to the organizations that mean something to us. It means something to me personally. And when I can combine my leadership skills, my professional ethics and the work that I do and make an impact on a community, make an impact on an organization, make an impact on the work that our clients are doing, there’s no better definition of success than to me, that’s it, right? When you can bring all that together and make that kind of impact, you are a leader and you are successful. And even if you are not standing up and collecting a trophy, you are a leader and you are successful. And I think that’s a pretty amazing opportunity when that happens.

Let’s end with this thought about community impact, about thinking beyond the business or the nonprofit or the particular client relationship, whatever it may be. We live in a pretty dynamic environment here in Arizona. I had the privilege a few weeks ago of attending a special event down at ASU put on by the Shea Group. And there were leaders from ASU talking about different initiatives of the university.

And one of the things that really struck me was how proud they were of the ASU Charter and how they tied everything back to the Charter. And I had read the thing before, but it was just words on paper to me. But when I saw leaders from the university tying their projects to the charter and the charter itself, which is short, I just want to share because it really names this so well.

It’s about who we include.

That’s right. You’re an alum, both undergraduate and and graduate degrees from here…

A double devil, as they say.

A double devil! So we could celebrate them, too. “ASU is a comprehensive public research university measured not by whom it excludes, but by whom it includes and how they succeed.” Measured by how they succeed. That’s interesting. “Advancing research and discovery of public value and assuming fundamental responsibility for the economic, social, cultural and overall health of the communities it serves.” Leadership is about taking responsibility for others, not just about leading your thing. Why don’t you reflect on that as we close?

Well, I’m glad you brought that up. You know, I’m just finishing my participation in the ASU Leadership Institute. And for the ninth months we’ve spent learning about asu. And without fail, absolutely, every person that has come in to speak to us has brought the charter up in their conversation. And look, we have all been worked for organizations that have the vision statement up on the wall and it looks really nice and you look at it once and you memorize it for your job interview and then you never look at it again.

That principle that ASU has incorporated into everything that they do, you can’t walk a step on that campus without seeing it. All of the individuals live by that mission. And I think the two parts in there that resonate for me is the inclusive statement that their measure of success is about who participates and not who doesn’t. And that there is an inherent responsibility. If you are going to take on a role as being a leader, you are responsible for the community that you are leading.

And look, that’s a lot. That’s a heavy lift to take on that responsibility. Some people are successful in being a leader because they can take on that type of responsibility. That’s not to say that you aren’t if you don’t assume all of this. But recognition is the public part of the hard work that we all have to do. And it’s consistently showing up. It is living with purpose, being proud of your accomplishments, but equally and maybe more so of the accomplishments of those that are around you.

And when and if we can impact others and understand what that role is. To me, that’s the most fulfilling part of being a leader. And what is really the more significant recognition of our success is when you can step back and you can say that organization is in a better place because of something I was able to help them with. My team is successful because I was able to guide them in a way that brought them to find their sense of purpose and what they wanted to do.

And that recognition and that, you know, byproduct of all of that work is the consistency that makes that matter. And to me is the most fulfilling part and the part that if, again, if I’m fortunate enough to be accepting the award on stage, it’s not because I did it by myself. It’s because all of these other people along the way, those that I know and those that were quietly behind the scenes, helped get there. And it is my responsibility then to pay that forward and help others achieve their successes as well.

Thanks for listening to this episode of Copper State of Mind. If you enjoyed the conversation, please share it with a colleague who might also find this podcast valuable. It’s easy to do, just click the “Share” button in the app you’re listening to now to pass it along. You can also follow Copper State of Mind in Apple Podcasts, Spotify or any other podcast Apple we publish new episodes every other Friday.

Copper State of Mind is brought to you by HMA Public Relations, the oldest continuously operating PR firm in Arizona. The show is recorded and produced by the team at Speed of Story, a B2B communications firm in Phoenix, and distributed by PHX.FM, the leading independent B2B podcast network in Arizona. For all of us here at Speed of story and PHX.FM, I’m Adrian McIntyre. Thanks for listening and for sharing the show with others if you choose to do so. We hope you’ll join us again for another episode of Copper State of Mind.