Support and survival tools for one of the hardest days of divorce.

“When the house is quiet, the feelings are loud.” If you’re facing Christmas (or any holiday) without your kids, this episode is your survival guide.

Andrea Rappaport and Morgan Stogsdill talk about one of the most painful parts of divorce: the first (or early) holidays when your children are with the other parent. The anxiety can start days in advance, and the empty-house silence can feel unbearable — but Morgan reminds listeners that this is usually a moment in time, not a sign that you made the wrong decision about divorce.

You’ll hear real, practical tools for getting through the day hour-by-hour (doggy paddling counts), what not to do when you’re spiraling, and why “effective support” matters. You’ll also get tips for keeping conversations with your kids positive, avoiding emotional landmines, and making a plan that helps you survive the holiday — without shame, stalking your ex, or numbing yourself into oblivion.

In This Episode, We Cover

1. Why holidays without your kids after divorce can feel like a crisis moment
2. How to tell the difference between grief and a “divorce decision”
3. Why “two truths can coexist” (you can be doing the right thing and it can hurt)
4. The best coping strategies for surviving Christmas without your children
5. What not to do: social media spirals, isolating, stalking your ex, emotional decisions
6. Why moving your body helps your mind calm down (“an exhausted body is a calm mind”)
7. How to use community support (even anonymously) when you feel alone
8. How to talk to your kids without making them feel responsible for your emotions
9. Co-parenting communication tools (and why OurFamilyWizard helps when rules aren’t followed)
10. Morgan’s “Chad” story: how making a plan helped a parent survive the first Christmas alone
11. Why leaving the house is the #1 non-negotiable tool (even a drive-through counts)

Key Takeaways

1) This is normal — it doesn’t mean you’re weak

Andrea says it best: no amount of self-care candles fixes the fact that your kids aren’t here. Missing your children doesn’t mean you’re failing. It means you’re hurting.

2) Don’t make big decisions in a holiday spiral

Morgan sees clients question everything during the holidays — but she rarely sees people truly halt divorce because of it. These feelings are real, but they’re usually temporary.

3) Doggy paddling is still progress

You don’t have to “thrive” today. You just have to get through it. Hour-by-hour is allowed.

Holiday Survival Plan (From the Episode)

Here’s your breakdown, straight from Morgan + Andrea:

✅ 1. Move your body (or at least get moving)

1. Walk outside if you can
2. If it’s cold: use a short YouTube workout video
3. If you hate workouts: get in your car and go somewhere (Target counts)

✅ 2. Get support — and help someone else

1. Join the private community (anonymous if needed)
2. Post what you’re doing to lift your spirits
3. Ask for support or distractions if you’re struggling
4. Compliment a stranger — small moments matter

✅ 3. Do something with your hands

Clean. Organize. Junk drawer. Closet. Anything that creates:

1. distraction
2. accomplishment
3. a tiny sense of control in a messy season

✅ 4. Have a plan for the day (chunk it- hee hee "chunk" is such a funny word)

Morning / midday / evening. Decide:

1. where you’ll go
2. what you’ll eat
3. what you’ll watch
4. what you’ll do when the feelings hit

✅ 5. Keep kid conversations brief + positive

Don’t guilt your kids or make them feel responsible for your sadness. Have a “safe” positive story ready before you call.

✅ Bonus idea: go to a movie

It’s a built-in time block, gets you out of the house, and gives your brain a break.

What NOT To Do (Important)

1. Don’t numb yourself into oblivion (alcohol, doom scrolling, dissociating)
2. Don’t isolate all day
3. Don’t stalk your ex or interrogate your kids
4. Don’t make big legal/emotional decisions today
5. Don’t shame yourself for feeling sad or relieved
6. If you’re spiraling: stay off social media

Here are some podcasts we love:

Morgan's picks:

NPR News Now (omg boring)

Big Deal

Andrea's picks:

Crime Junkie

Andrea's favorite YouTube workout channel-

https://www.youtube.com/@MadFit

Join our private community here: https://www.facebook.com/share/g/17bUX16Wvz/

Our Divorce Crash Course was designed to hold your hand through the process and help you avoid major and expensive mistakes. Learn more here: https://www.hownottosuckatdivorce.com/divorce-crash-course

Our Family Wizard is another fantasitc resource for those who need help navigating the "fun" world of coparenting. Head to this landing page to see how we work closely with them to support our listeners! http://www.ourfamilywizard.com/notsuck

Friends, slide into our dms, we love love love hearing from you. We are always here to listen and help in any way we can. You've got this and we've got you.

Instagram: @hownotosuckatdivorce

Follow Andrea: @theandrearappaport

Follow Morgan: @divorceattorneychicago

When the house is quiet, the feelings are loud. So here's your special episode for surviving Christmas without the kids.

If you're going through a divorce or thinking about getting a divorce, this is the podcast for you. Hosted by Morgan Stogsdill, the head of family law at the largest family law firm in the country and comedian Andrea Rappaport, you're gonna laugh, you're gonna learn, you're gonna avoid major divorce mistakes. This is How Not to Suck at Divorce.

no amount of self-care candle fixes the fact that your kids are not here. And this is easily one of the hardest parts of being divorced. or going through a divorce. It does not mean that you're weak. It does not mean that you're failing. It doesn't mean that you're not

grateful enough that you have beautiful and healthy children. It just means that you're hurting. And the other thing that I want you to know as we go through all of this is that two truths can coexist. So you can be doing the right thing in your life and you could be doing the right thing for your kids and it can also feel really painful.

Mm-hmm. And I love that you said that because it's true. These two truths can coexist. And the reality is in your legal case, it can derail you in your matter. I've seen it happen when a client experiences a really hard moment.

away from their kids, especially over the holidays. Maybe it's the first time and they think, my God, I don't think I can go through with this divorce. Is this the right decision?

And I'm curious to know, Morgan, how often are they right? Like how often is it really somebody who can't go through this divorce and they have to pause things? Or how often is it just a hurdle in their divorce process where they need more effective support?

It's usually just a feeling or feelings during this time of year. Rarely do I see clients truly halting their divorce process or withdrawing their divorce process completely. It's just really negative energy, bad feelings. It's all the feelings during the holiday season that make you question. But in reality, I don't see a lot of couples actually taking that step saying, I made the wrong decision. It's just a moment in time. And that's what I want you to remember. It's OK during the holiday season.

to kind of back off the divorce process if you need that. And it's okay to feel these really big emotions. It doesn't mean in general when you're feeling these big emotions that you made the wrong choice moving forward on a divorce.

Okay, so did everybody just hear this? You're not doing anything wrong. This is normal. This doesn't mean that this pain that you are feeling right now, or even the anticipatory pain, because if you're listening to this episode right when it came out, you're probably gearing up for not having your kids tomorrow, the next day, you know, whenever.

and it feels awful and it feels scary and it feels nauseating. This doesn't mean that you can't do this. All it means is that you need, and I used the word effective a moment ago, because there's a difference between support that really doesn't do anything and then effective support. Support that's really going to help you doggy paddle through this day, because that's all we need you to do.

Doggy paddling exists for a reason. So here it

I'm gonna start here. You gotta let yourself feel it. As humans, we hate feeling uncomfortable feelings and we do everything to avoid pain.

But if you don't let yourself feel the pain and acknowledge that you're sad, then you have a greater chance of that feeling hanging around. If you let yourself feel and then apply all these tools that we're about to give you, it's going to leave faster. Trust me on that. Now.

When we're talking about feeling, this does not mean that we want you to sit in your bed all day with unbrushed hair and unbrushed teeth and cry.

because that's gross. Don't do that. Actually, I want to fill you in on one of the things that you might not know about me, Andrea, Do you know that my sense of smell is like amazing? Did you know that about me?

No.

Okay, let me tell you, I'm gonna land this plane. I know when people don't wash their hair, and it's not men, because males usually take a shower every day, but females, I get it, because usually it's a few days or two days, and that's normal to wash your hair, but you know when the female is really pushing the limits of hair washing? I smell it. And I have to tell you, I think it's one of the grossest smells out there when you don't wash your hair consistently. It's like that nasty,

oily smell. So that's what I'm talking about and that's what Andrea is talking about. We want you to get out of bed immediately when you wake up and you're in all your feelings because nobody wants to smell that smell. We want you to get up, take a shower, go move your body.

but like maybe we want them to move their body and then take a shower because I don't want to bury our, we read the biggest thing here. And God bless you Morgan for your canine level smelling abilities because now I just imagine Morgan walking around people being like, you haven't showered, have you? What are you going through a divorce or something? Get it together. Let's go back to moving your body. Yes.

Fine.

I also want you out of bed immediately, but before you go and herbal essence yourself, which if you're still using herbal essence, girl, maybe maybe we start there upgrade. OK, we're going to talk about moving your body because you've got to do it. You have to get up and do it. And if you're not a regular worker outter, then we're going to give you some things that you can do. If you are a regular exercising person, go do your regular

routine. That's going to be really important. Get on your Peloton, go to your SoulCycle class,

whatever it is, do your things. But if you don't normally work out, here's what's really, really important for you to do. There's a very famous saying that says, an exhausted body is a calm mind. So we got to move.

If you live in a warm climate, go walk. Walks are so amazing for your minds. And while you walk, you can listen to another episode of this podcast or you can listen to any podcast. There are so many good shows out there. We'll give you a list. We'll give you some links to some of our favorite shows. Morgan listens to a lot of like smart people podcasts. I listen to a lot of true crime stuff. Do it. ⁓

If you live in a colder climate and you can't walk, put on a YouTube workout video. They have the shortest videos that are not at all intimidating, whether you are a dancer or a stretcher or a weightlifter, anything. And I'm going to link this one channel in the show notes that I love and

I can tell you, I can speak from personal experience here, that Something about doing this as soon as I wake up, when I'm really struggling, helps me so much.

Okay, agreed, but maybe our listeners are like, hell no, I'm not working out. And if that's you, that's okay, I've got another option for you. So, you know, where we live in Chicago, it can get pretty gross during the winter. So we feel like cooped up at times. And sometimes that makes us feel like we're going crazy. And you're already feeling like you're going crazy because you're in the middle of a divorce. Just get in your car and go somewhere.

Go to the mall. I know malls aren't really a thing anymore, but go somewhere. Go to Target, go to Walmart. I don't even care. Go to Starbucks. Just get out of your house. That in and of itself is moving around and actually doing something that's going to make you feel better. All right. After you've boosted your serotonin levels, you're moving your body, you're getting out of your house. The second thing we want you to do is we want you to go help somebody else. And yes, this sounds like woo woo what, but it's not as difficult as it may sound.

Here's exactly what I want you to do. I want you to head to our private community. Our link is in the show notes if you're not already a part of it. And if you do want to become a part of it, it can be completely anonymous. starting on Christmas Eve, we're going to have posts in there where everyone can comment on what they're doing to lift their spirits today. You can comment, just worked out. You can comment, I just paid for someone else's Starbucks or gave them a compliment, anything.

Your comment, as simple as it may seem, can lift somebody else in our community who's struggling as much or even more than you are.

And that feeling of helping somebody else really does help you. I think it sends a message to our brain that like, okay, I'm not as bad as I think I am right now because I was actually able to help somebody else. The other thing that I want to let you know is in addition to the positivity posts in our community, we're also going to have posts where people can ask for support. So if you are really struggling.

over the holidays, you'll be able to post in the group, hey, if there's anyone available who can chat right now, who can send messages back and forth, I need a distraction, I need someone to talk to, or send me a list of binge-worthy shows, right? Whatever it is, we're gonna have that there.

We work really hard on this community. We're so proud of it. This community is amazing. And we encourage you to take full advantage of the How Not to Suck a Divorce community over on Facebook. So again, it's going to be linked. But that is the second thing we want you to do. We want you to move your body. And then we want you to go jump in the community or either and either help somebody else or ask for help.

it can be as simple as just giving somebody a compliment that you don't know. Make somebody smile. I know it's hard for you to do it, but you can do that for somebody else. Because here's what we don't want you to do. We don't want you to numb yourself into oblivion, whether that be with us, an enormous amount of alcohol, or just not feeling the feelings. We want you to feel the feelings because when you push them down, it only creates more problems. We don't want you to isolate.

because isolation is the easiest thing to do, but probably the worst thing for you. We certainly don't want you to stalk your ex on their holiday

We don't want you to ask your kids enormous amounts of questions about what your ex is doing, whether he or she served turkey on Christmas or the brownies that you always made. We don't want any of that. That just is nonsense we want out of your mind. We don't want you to make big legal

or emotional decisions in this moment. And we certainly don't want you to shame yourself for feeling sad or maybe even relieved.

The other thing that I don't want you to do is don't go on social media in general if you're really struggling because looking at everybody else's perfect holiday ain't gonna make you feel better. So just a little word to the wise. Okay. Here comes a really funky suggestion, but I stand by it.

I want you to have a task that you can do to help pass the day. I want you to clean something. I want you to organize your junk drawer. I want you to clean out a closet. And I know that it doesn't sound sexy, but sometimes the only thing that really helps us take our mind off of what's absorbing our bodies is some kind of work. And

I say this with, again, experience. This is tough because I used to talk about this all the time when I was going through it, but when you are trying to not...

feel the pain of not having your kids and you're in your home and you're just not doing anything. You're surrounded by emotional landmines. They're everywhere. The kids' clothes, their toys, pictures. Everything's there but them. And the house is quiet. And it's not the kind of quiet you crave when they're with you. It's a kind of quiet that eats at you. It hurts.

And again, I want you to acknowledge that hurt. want you, can even say out loud, fuck, I hate this. Okay? I hate this.

don't just go through the motions of, okay, I'm gonna get up, I'm gonna work out, I'm gonna go be nice to people, I'm gonna do all these things, and I'm not gonna acknowledge the pain. That's not gonna help you. You have to have that moment and you're like, okay, ouch. I don't like this, I don't like this feeling, I'm feeling sad, I'm missing these kids. Okay, good, you said it. But then what are you gonna go do? I want you to go and do something.

Yeah, and if you don't want to clean, I don't really blame you, but just make sure your house doesn't smell.

I don't want your house smelling. I don't want your hair smelling.

That's right. But maybe you're one of those people that are like, you know, during my marriage, I never got to live in a messy house. So I'm not picking up shit. And if that's you, that's OK, too. Anything works. But my point to you is it's best to have a plan. Have a plan for what you're going to be doing on the holiday when you don't have your children. Some ideas for you. If you don't want to clean your house, maybe you treat yourself to something. Maybe it's something you're going to buy or something that you're going to eat special.

But if you're alone on Christmas, think of, okay, here's what I'm going to do in the morning. Break it up into chunks. I'm going to do this in the morning. I'm going to get out and take a walk. I'm going to go to Starbucks. In the middle of the day, I'm going to have this for lunch, then maybe have a plan for the evening. I'm going to watch this show. I'm going to watch this movie. And here's what I'm going to do until the children are back.

if you haven't seen it, you can watch the Diddy documentary. it's severely eye-opening, but definitely not kid-friendly. So it might be perfect timing to watch it when you don't have your children.

Nothing will make you feel better than watching the Diddy documentary because at least you aren't him. Merry Christmas like Diddy. You could wake up in the morning and feel like P. Diddy,

Merry Christmas like Diddy, right?

but don't be P. Diddy.

I just finished watching The Beast in Me. That was pretty good. That was a good binge. I also just finished last night another really interesting show on Netflix that I think originally came from HBO Max. It's called Love and Death. based off of a true story of

this affair that happens in a small town in Texas and then there's a murder and it's just really, it's interesting. I liked it. It was really good. Definitely not kid friendly. So another thing that you can binge, if for you, binging the happy silly stuff doesn't work. Some people want to binge something happy and silly and go for it. Like if you can watch all of the Hallmark Christmas movies and

not want to scream and cry, then do that. There are so many of those. But if you need something darker to kind of meet you where you're at right now, I concur with Morgan that you can feel like P. Diddy and lean into that dark shit.

Also, I wanna talk to you about something that's important. So if you're struggling and you don't have your children on Christmas and you talk to your children on Christmas, I want you to find something that you can tell them that's positive. We don't want you making your kids feel bad for you or sad for you. Like what we don't want you to do is, ⁓ I'm just gonna say mom. Mom's been sitting at home all day.

Mom doesn't have anywhere to go today. Like that's inappropriate for children. Think of something before you even get on the phone with them about a funny story of the day, even make up the fact that you've been very busy or that you're watching a new show that's really fun. We want you to put your brave face on and keep the conversation brief if you feel like you're going to go to that emotional place.

And speaking of kids, if you are really hurting this holiday season because you don't know whether you're going to be able to speak to your kids, let's say your ex is not really playing by the rules and they are withholding communication, which we all know is a big no-no, but it still happens all the time, then you need some extra support. And you, my friend, desperately need to partner up with our family wizard and

Yes, we talk about our family wizard all the time, but there's a reason why we talk about them all the time because they are incredibly helpful. They, like it's a group of people. I mean, it is, but it's an app. It's an incredibly helpful app that helps track communication on all levels.

But in particular, if you are feeling like, I don't know if I'm gonna get to talk to my kids. She said that they're gonna call, they haven't called, I'm feeling nervous, she always does this, she blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, or he always does this, you need to message your attorney after the holidays and request that both parties use our Family Wizard. It'll track the conversations. It's the only app that is incredibly safe and court respected.

So that should you need to bring something up in front of a judge at some point that certain things have been withheld, then that's what you need on your side. So yes, I totally agree with everything that Morgan said don't tell the kids that you're miserable. But let's face it, a lot of us are feeling an extra layer of anxiety because we don't know whether or not we're gonna speak to the kids.

I hear that. And that's normal for where people are during the holidays. What I want to remind you is that most parenting agreements, whether it's temporary or permanent, they flip-flop the days. So for instance, if you have Christmas Eve one year, you're going to have Christmas Day the other year. So you have to think about both sides, meaning doing what you want to have happening to you the next year.

And if it's not working, if you may get through the holidays without your children, whatever day it is, or maybe it's days, you can figure out what worked and what didn't work and talk to your lawyer potentially about modifying it for the next year.

You mentioned something about surviving. You're gonna survive this. Morgan, I am sure that you have seen people survive the holidays, people who did not think that they can do it. Can you give us something to hold onto? Can you give us a story of somebody who has been like, okay, I thought I was gonna be in a puddle.

you know, at a dive bar sobbing, but instead I, whatever.

Yes, so I had a client it was we'll call him Chad and Chad was

what a lovely name.

What a lovely name. If you don't know, we always talk about Chad and Brenda on this podcast. They are make-believe resident divorce couples. So anyway, Chad called me and he was really worried because basically during his marriage, it was all about the family. He didn't really have a ton of friends. He didn't have family in town. And this was going to be the first year on Christmas day that he didn't have the kids around or a spouse. He didn't have Brenda around.

And he was worried. He was like, what am I going to do? And, you know, I think that we always, because we're two women on this show, we talk a lot about how women feel. But the fact is that men feel the same thing. They just maybe aren't as vocal about it. But this Chad was vocal about it. And he called me and he said, these are the feelings that I'm feeling. I don't know what to do. I don't really have any friends to go to their house on Christmas Day. And I certainly don't have any family here. At that point,

I really appreciated that he was honest with me. And actually we worked through it. we actually made a plan, lawyer and client, of what he was going to do. It was not perfect, certainly. And I want to be honest about that. It's not like rainbows and sunshine. But the fact of the matter is he followed the plan. He was busy. He got out of bed. He did the things. And then the next day the kids were back with him and it worked okay.

And I think what I want you to know is that especially the first year when it's weird, you've never had it, you've just got to get through it and it will get a little bit easier. But that first year or the first few years are the most difficult.

Did part of Chad's plan involve getting out of the house?

Absolutely,

that was one of the first things I said that we're going to do in the morning and he did it.

Where did he go?

He went to open restaurant to get some breakfast. And that was our plan. That was our first plan. I said, get out, walk. If you can walk to the restaurant, do it. If you can't drive, they're fine. It's just all about getting out and actually seeing other people, getting some socialization. Remember, isolation is the worst enemy during this day.

So get out of the house, go anywhere. Yes, Starbucks counts. Drive-throughs count. Go somewhere. If you can go in, hey, bonus points. But even just getting that air on your face and driving through somewhere, don't force yourself, however, to go to somebody else's holiday event if you don't feel up for it. If you feel like that is really going to be torture, then you get a hall pass from me and you don't have to go. However,

Sometimes it does help to show up for a bit. You don't have to stay for the whole thing. But there is nothing wrong with popping in and saying, Happy New Year, Merry Christmas, go fuck yourself, whatever it is that you feel like sharing. You stay for a bit and then you leave. You do what you need to do.

So here's your breakdown from this episode of what you're going to do to get through the holidays without your children. Number one, you're going to move your body. And if you want information, check our show notes for recommendations on shows to walk to or working out, if that's your thing. If you're not, you're just gonna get out of your house. You're gonna go somewhere. Number two, we want you to pop into our private community and share something that you're doing.

Words of encouragement or experiences will help someone else. And even if you don't want to do that, go out of your house and give somebody a compliment. Number three, do something in your house. Maybe clean something, reorganize something, watch a marathon of something. We don't care. Number four, have a brief positive conversation with your children. And the biggest thing, the biggest takeaway out of all of this is leave the house.

Even if, and I've heard this and I'm going to leave you with this tidbit, I have not had a client do this, but I actually heard it from somebody who didn't have family in town. They actually go to movies on Christmas day because it's a big chunk of time. It's something to do. It takes your mind off of things. it's what, two hours, two plus hours where you're not actually thinking about your life and what's going on. And you have to show up at a certain time. You have to get out of the house. So that's an idea if you haven't thought about that.

Yeah, I think a movie, if you like movies, I don't really like movies, but I think it's a great idea. Go and do something for a period of time. But I gotta say, don't knock cleaning out the junk drawer, friends. You know why? I think it's like a feeling of accomplishment. I think it's a feeling of like, look what I did. And I also think that when our life is a mess, it's really nice to organize something, to see something improve, to clean out something.

to, and maybe that's just the way I'm wired. Maybe I'm a crazy person, but I really find value in it. So try it. You don't have to do all these things, but do one of them. Do some of them. Again, we're trying to give you effective support. Things that are actually going to help you feel better because this might not be easy, but it's doable.

I you that.

do us a favor, leave us a review. Tell us that you took one thing away and it made things a little bit easier because those matter to us. And remember that divorce is a marathon, especially in the holidays. my gosh, it's a marathon. It is not a sprint. The holidays specifically, it could be day by day that you're hanging on and sometimes it's hour by hour.

but that is okay. We want you to know that you're doing it. You are doing it already.

We have so many tools available to help you. It's exactly why we do this show. Go to the website if you haven't already visited the website. Make sure you're in that private community. If you need the Divorce Crush Course, if you need any of our guides, we have things here to help you because divorce sucks. We know this. Life after divorce does not suck. Having the kids is amazing and sometimes even having the kids feels overwhelming.

Not having the kids definitely sucks, but it's not gonna kill you. You're going to get through this. We mentioned at the beginning of the show that doggy paddling exists for a reason. You doggy paddle if you can't swim to get yourself to the shore. Okay, so right now maybe you're doggy paddling, but it's okay. Maybe all these tools that we gave you are just a bandaid, but band-aids exist for a reason.

because they help us while we're healing. Use the Band-Aids. Use these tools. I promise you, you are going to be okay. On the days when you think you can't do it like today, I want you to remind yourself that you are doing it. Say it out loud, shit, this hurts, fuck, this sucks, but I'm doing it. Or you can use my other favorite phrase, bitches ain't shit. Morgan used it herself the other day and it worked for her.

Bitches ain't shit. You can do this. You have got this.

we my friends have got you.

Thank

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