When I sat down with Tania Kinsella, the first woman of color to serve as Deputy Chief of the NYPD, I expected the usual leadership conversation – strategies, milestones, carefully crafted responses. Instead, I found myself swept up in a current of pure, unbridled love.
Yes, love. In the world of law enforcement. (Stay with me here.)
There's something almost rebellious about the way Tania infuses this four-letter word into every aspect of her leadership. Her voice fills with warmth as she describes her officers, her eyes light up talking about New York's diverse communities, and she beams with a mother’s pride when speaking of her officers.
"If you love and respect your cops, your cops will run through a burning building for you. They will love to come to work. They will love to serve the communities. They will love doing what they're doing if they know that they're valued."
But here's what really got me: underneath the groundbreaking achievements and badassery, Tania is refreshingly, beautifully human. She admits to being scared of the unknown (aren't we all?). She talks about the messy juggle of motherhood and career (those 7-day workweeks with a 13 and 9-year-old at home). And she's not afraid to say she's still figuring it out, still growing, still learning from every misstep.
Her Courage Practice: Dawn Patrol Leadership
In the quiet hours after dropping her kids at school, Tania laces up her running shoes. The rhythmic pounding of feet on pavement becomes her meditation, her reset button. But true to her nature, she's turned this personal ritual into something bigger – creating a city-wide program where NYPD officers run alongside middle school students. (And maybe, just maybe, shapes future Olympians – because that's the kind of big dreamer Tania is.)
5 Ways she Shows us how to Build our Courage Capital:
1. Speak Your Dreams Out Loud: Tania didn't wait for permission to voice her ambitions. She claimed them, then built the foundation to support them.
2. Let Love Be Your Leadership Language: In a world that often equates toughness with strength, dare to lead with open-hearted care and genuine connection.
3. Turn Your Self-Care into Community Care: Your personal practices can ripple out to create unexpected waves of positive change.
4. Embrace the Beautiful Chaos: Those dropped plates and imperfect moments? They're not failures – they're your best teachers in disguise.
5. Root Deep in Your Now: Stop stressing about tomorrow. Focus your energy on making magic where you're planted today.
The Uplifters’ Web
Today’s opening is by Meg Wolfe.
Let’s keep rising higher together.
💓 Aransas
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Transcripts
TUP EP 091
Nomination: [:
Aransas: Uplifters. [00:00:30] Hi, this is Aranzas. I'm so excited for this episode. Today, you're going to meet Tanya Kinsella. She's the first woman of color to be the deputy chief of the NYPD. the largest police force in America and [00:00:45] possibly the world. But this episode isn't about that. It's about her style as a leader. A style that she carries over into everything she does.
u do one thing is how you do [:
I can't wait for you to hear this. Tanya, thank you so much for being here. Nice to meet you. Likewise. You're a badass. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's good to know when you're a badass. You've [00:01:30] made history as the first female deputy chief of the NYPD. I was in my last
Tania: year of John Jay, my four year degree. I wanted to be a lawyer.
then I took the test for the [:
And it has been by [00:02:15] far the best decision I've ever made in my life. My children are products of the NYPD. That's the greatest joy in itself. But for two decades, I was part of the change in New York City. Good or bad, but I was partly [00:02:30] responsible for the safety for New York City, and that's a
Aransas: great feeling.
to stand back and just, yes. [:
Tania: Around this one decision. Did it feel scary to you? [00:03:00] Yeah, it was very scary because I don't come from the police culture, right? My mom is an immigrant Guyanese woman and she's a nurse. Law enforcement was never even thought of in my family. My aunts and uncles are all like [00:03:15] nurses or doctors, but no law enforcement.
ouble. I wasn't that type of [:
What was it about being a lawyer that attracted you? Well, I could argue my point until we, until I turn blue. I [00:03:45] love law. I love criminal justice. And instead of being law enforcement, I wanted to be like a prosecutor. And that was my dream growing up. If you asked me what I wanted to do since I was a child.
And so I'm
Aransas: [:
Tania: I just loved the structure. I loved criminal justice, and I wanted to be part of the process of putting bad people away.
: What do you believe helped [:
Tania: So, I'm not the first woman. There was a woman many, many years ago, I think she served for like a month or two, but I'm the first woman of color. to [00:04:30] hold the first deputy commissioner position. I'll be honest with you. I don't fixate on that concept that I'm the first woman of color is great, right? It's nice, but I went through the ranks and I worked very hard.
I was every rank besides the [:
Aransas: Yeah, I think that it's such an important [00:05:15] message and I think it's something we hear quite often when I get the opportunity to talk to trailblazers. And there is such a ripple effect from FIRST. Right? Because it creates a role model and a sense of [00:05:30] opportunity for other girls who might not have seen themselves in those positions to say, yeah, this is what it looks like to be a leader.
leadership. So can we talk a [:
Tania: For me, leadership is everything because I've been a leader since I have five years in this agency. Leadership is all I know. A leader is not afraid to [00:06:00] leave from the front.
to do what's better for the [:
Leadership is more than just the word leadership. And [00:06:30] leadership is really learning when to have humanity. And I'm a very humble person. I like to surround myself with people that are smarter than me, because if you're the smartest person in the room, then you're not the greatest leader.
Aransas: How do you keep the [:
Cause I think that's really hard for a lot of people to do.
York city took a bet on me. [:
Aransas: What I'm hearing is that it's about a mindset of gratitude.
Tania: Yes. Full of gratitude.
Aransas: So [:
Tania: Yeah, most definitely. And that's what I'm about. I love policing. I love making a difference. I love the communities that we serve in New York City. Every [00:07:45] community has its own unique value to, to the city. And I love it. I wouldn't trade any other day, any other field. I am right where I belong.
Aransas: You use the word love a lot.
d you talk about loving your [:
Tania: love what you do. And you love the people that work with you and you'll have love for the communities that we serve. Everything else falls into place. If you love and respect your cops, your cops will [00:08:15] run through a burning building for you.
They will love to come to work. They will love to serve the communities. They will love doing what they're doing if they know that they're valued. And I'm big on that.
ou show them that you value, [:
Tania: This morning, I had a speech at the training facility at the police academy.
ise decisions and just by my [:
Aransas: When you were in the police academy [00:09:00] and they said, what do you want to do?
a culture where at least so [:
Tania: And I only dream big.
p I wanted to go through the [:
Aransas: So what did that look like, the work to get there?
Tania: It was a lot of long days, still a lot of long days.
It wasn't just [:
Aransas: How do you take care of yourself while working seven days a week and having millions of people in New York City who are influenced by your work and decisions and [00:10:15] tens of thousands of people on the force?
he forefront and put our own [:
I'm a runner. That's still a work in progress.
Aransas: What's the most [:
Tania: It's just time management, right? Time management because if I'm not working, I have to be a mom. I have a 13 year old and a 9 year old. So you gotta stay on top of that [00:11:00] to make sure that I'm present for them but not sacrificing my career either.
nd I teach part time at John [:
Aransas: And then you run a community running group.
mentorship and keeping kids [:
It's funded by the Police Foundation. Middle school kids get running sneakers, uniforms, and they have the cops who are NYPD club runners. They are the mentors, [00:11:45] coaches. They are going to help the kids. and make sure that they're gaining, you know, a love for running or because a lot of times running is not really part of a middle school curriculum or sports.
[:
Aransas: to the city. Oh, how beautiful.
Tania: My hope is that one day that every school can adopt it and we'll have a future Olympians.
d to me, this is the essence [:
I agree. That's a big deal. I [00:12:30] don't know if you, you never lived in any other brands. I get to talk to women all day, so I get to see how rare this is, but it's a big
ever. So making sure that my [:
It's really making that difference. So what would your dream for that be? My dream would to never leave this, but. That will be [00:13:00] my dream, but my dream is to carry on what we started.
Aransas: Do you still want to be commissioner?
Tania: I think that now that I'm more matured in life has a way of evolving. I feel like what's meant for you always find you.
f I'm meant to be the police [:
Aransas: Happy birthday.
Tania: Thank you. And it took a lot of self reflection.
kes and punishing myself. It [:
The core of leadership
Aransas: is the bravery to make choices.
Tania: Yeah and sometimes our choices are not the right choices and that's fine.
: You are a remarkably brave [:
Tania: The future scares me, right? And you know, the unknown scares [00:14:30] me and like, you know, the ever changing times scare me, but I feel like I'm starting because I'm not perfect at it. I'm not going to sit here and preach it, but I feel like if it's outside of your control, you can't [00:14:45] really, you know, you try to calm those fears.
till a work in progress like [:
Aransas: all are. I talk about women as wearing 20 hats while carrying 50 plates and trying not to let anything drop and then feeling really bad about ourselves the second one thing drops or we wear the wrong hat at the wrong moment.
[:
Exactly. So as we wrap up, what do you most hope people will learn from your story?
Tania: [:
And it's also okay to be human and be humble. And it's also okay to uplift other women. That is a okay.
ance to meet you and to know [:
Tania: Yep. Thank you so much for having me.
. Thank you for listening to [:
It'll really help us connect with more uplifters and it'll ensure you never miss one of these beautiful [00:17:00] stories. Mm,
ing. Toss a star in half for [:
With that, all hindsight, bring the sun to twilight. Lift you up, whoa, [00:17:30] Lift you up, whoa, Lift you up, whoa, Lift you up.[00:17:45]
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1.The Uplifters Podcast: How to Live Your Dreams and Unlock Your Potential
