Dating coach and podcast host Lakshmi Rengarajan joins Aransas Savas to challenge everything you think you know about finding love after 40. Discover why traditional dating advice fails midlife daters, how to build authentic connections through storytelling, and why your forties and fifties might actually be the perfect time for romance.

What You'll Learn:

-How to reframe dating without biological clock pressures

-The difference between connection and communication in early dating

-Why "wasting time" with the "wrong person" might actually be valuable

-How to create 15 magnetic stories that showcase your authentic self

-The concept of "romantic hope" and living romantically regardless of relationship status

-Why understanding dating culture is crucial before jumping in

-How to date as your full, evolved self rather than a younger version

Timestamps:

02:45 - Why standard dating advice fails people over 40

07:30 - The advantages of dating without deadlines

12:15 - Connection before communication: the real art of dating

18:30 - How to prepare for dating (hint: it's not just downloading apps)

22:00 - The story about yourself you need to master

28:45 - The "invisible at a certain age" myth, debunked

35:00 - Two-hour phone detox before dates

38:15 - Living a romantic life with or without a partner

Key Takeaways:

-Dating in your forties and fifties offers unique advantages when you're not rushing against biological clocks

-The best connections happen when you focus on getting to know the other person rather than evaluating them as a potential partner

-Learning to tell engaging stories about yourself is crucial for all relationships, not just romantic ones

-"Romantic hope" is about living with an open heart, not necessarily about finding a relationship

Resource Links:

The Later Date Today Podcast

Follow Lakshmi on social media for dating insights: @thelaterdatertoday @later_Lakshmi

Guest Bio: Lakshmi Rengarajan is a dating culture researcher and coach focused on midlife dating. Host of The Later Date Today podcast, she has worked to make dating culture better for more than 15 years, from designing one-of-a-kind singles events to actually working at Match.com, studying the art of the set-up, and learning about midlife dating today.

Host Bio: Aransas Savas is a leadership coach, researcher, and host of The Uplifters Podcast. Connect with her on Instagram, LinkedIn, TikTok, Facebook, and YouTube. Visit her website at theuplifterspodcast.com.

Keywords: dating after 40, midlife dating, dating coach, relationship advice, authentic connection, dating without pressure, romantic hope, dating culture, finding love later in life, second chance romance

TUP EP 128

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I'm Aza SSON today. I'm so excited for you to come hang out with me and my friend Lakshmi, [00:01:15] on the host of the later date today podcast, and a dating coach who specializes in helping people navigate romance and midlife. She brings. Such a refreshing perspective to dating after [00:01:30] 40 and really challenges some of the urgency and maybe kind of desperation stories you're gonna hear in this conversation.

Work in modern dating span several chapters. She began designing in-person events for singles way back in the 2010s. Went on to work@match.com and then was hired at WeWork for a first of its kind job as the company's [00:02:15] director of Workplace connection, A term that she actually invented, whether you're newly single, have never married or just.

Pre pandemic. Pre pandemic. Yes. Getting some certifications as professional coaches. Mm-hmm. And we got to coach each other and collaborate.

Aransas Savas: That

Lakshmi: was you.

Lakshmi: yeah, that can be a good thing.

Aransas Savas: It can be a great thing.

Lakshmi: That's, I mean, as someone who coaches people and dating, that's. Probably a good, a good skill to have.

Aransas Savas: Yeah. Yeah. And since you bring up dating your podcast the later date or today mm-hmm.

Lakshmi: mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas: Professionally, personally, and watching you obsess over those details has made me more thoughtful and intentional.

Lakshmi: Oh, I have thoughts,

Aransas Savas: and they will be meaningful for us. So why did you decide to focus your podcast on dating specifically?

And the standard data [00:05:15] is that person that's sort of like in their twenties or thirties and they are kind of thinking about marriage, long-term relationship, maybe building a family. And so because the information is organized around that outcome, [00:05:30] it has deadlines and it has a sense of urgency and it has this sense of like, you have to find out who the good people are and the bad people are, and you have to label things.

So my base thing was what if you centered the 40 and 50 something? What if you centered their experience? And then how would all of the, how would the discussion [00:06:15] fundamentally change when you didn't center marriage and the pursuit of family as a primary reason for dating?

Lakshmi: I mean, so many, so many things. One was just when I'm on the podcast or when I'm talking to people, the first thing is, is just, even just that realization because a lot of times people. Whether they have married or not, they're picking up [00:06:45] a version of themselves that's in some ways 20 or 20 or 30 years old, and sometimes everyone needs a hard factory reset.

So, I mean, the amount of things that I've learned is like just [00:07:15] unbelievable. And then the past, the last two years, I focused my research fundamental, like focused exclusively on interviewing and studying men, straight men, because I really felt like they were an understudied group and sometimes misunderstood.

And I think that that's a huge advantage that sometimes people don't see. And. You can really shape it for [00:08:00] what you want. Like, you know, a lot of times I have clients, they're like, oh, but you know, we have different custody schedules and you know, and I, I was like, sure, that's fine, but how many times do you really need to see each other and for what duration?

Aransas Savas: Yeah.

Aransas Savas: Yeah, I love that. And so if like in your twenties, subconsciously even the expectations are, I'm on this reproductive clock, correct?

An aunt or an uncle, whatever. Mm-hmm.

Lakshmi: Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas: Just sort of freeing yourself from those assumptions. Exactly. And then saying what's right for right now, which is maybe my favorite question in the whole

Lakshmi: Yes.

Aransas Savas: Like Lex Universe.

I think it's such a liberating space and I think it's such a creative space.

Aransas Savas: Yeah. Say more about why you use those two

Mm-hmm. So what is it that you actually want? Who do you wanna become in a relationship? [00:10:00] And what purpose does it serve? And also like how do you wanna be a part of someone else's story? Are you

Yeah, a friend and I actually were talking last week about how as humans, many of us, I won't say all of us, but many of us have this deep need for an exclusive pairing.

Lakshmi: Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. And yet for many people, really the answer is they just want an exclusive partner, like a real BFF, [00:10:45] or somebody with whom they can feel like I'm your person.

Lakshmi: Yeah. I think like most people just want a certain degree of clarity. And I think when you're younger, I think sometimes that clarity is a little bit more clear.

It's awesome. But then you also have to have the willingness to, to surf that with somebody else.

Lakshmi: Yeah. I think like one thing I might say is like before the [00:11:45] communication I think is connection.

Aransas Savas: Mm.

Lakshmi: I think sometimes people get too quickly get into the, this is what I want too quickly.

Aransas Savas: That's such a good point. Yeah.

Lakshmi: And I think this is where a lot of the dating advice, I think is misdirected, where it's like, well, I'm looking for this.

So much of what I have to do with people is to sort through all the, quite frankly, all the garbage [00:12:30] they've ingested about relationships and. Bad dating advice for 25 years and being like, okay, which of these really make sense for you? You know? And maybe coming out in the first 20 minutes and saying, well, I'm only looking for long-term [00:12:45] relationships, is actually the thing that will prevent you from getting into a long-term relationship.

Yeah.

Lakshmi: Yeah. And not everything needs to be stated.

Lakshmi: Right? Because really that is a, like a, an attempt to control the situation. Yes. Maybe instead of that, why not just focus on getting to know who this person is, Uhhuh, who's sitting across from you, Uhhuh. Right. [00:13:30] Which is the real art, the real skill.

Aransas Savas: Yeah. Yeah. What happens when you say to people, Hey, maybe the way you've been thinking about this is not serving you.

[00:14:00] Like people I just meet out in the world at dinner and they're like, oh, you know, you, you coach Midlifers. And then they're like, that's the person I have to like contend with. The people that end up coming to me are very bought in. But I would say at a high level, when I'm working with people, generally [00:14:15] I'm working with very successful, accomplished people.

And so that is not something that people. Think to consider because it's like, well, isn't dating just [00:14:45] like going to dinner and like talking to someone and seeing if you like them? And that's the furthest thing from the truth. Okay. What is it dating is this like, it's a very, very beautiful subtle art of connecting with someone and getting to know them and not just lobbing a [00:15:00] question back and forth, which is what most people do.

And then how do you inspire that from the other person? And going out on a date is actually a very, very artful [00:15:30] thing. And I think a lot of people are kind of like wing it, like, I'm just gonna go on, I'm just gonna see how I feel. I'm just gonna like go on like four coffee dates. And I think that's actually a huge waste of time.

Aransas Savas: think, for somebody who's been just sitting at home staring at the [00:16:00] walls hoping and wishing I do.

Aransas Savas: How does one prepare oneself to date?

What is the typical person that you're gonna [00:16:45] meet, what have they probably gone through? Mm-hmm. What have they seen? What is the actual, like, what are the actual dynamics of it all out there? And I think. That is so important. I think that the people who take the time to sort of understand that just fundamentally show up [00:17:00] differently.

About this thing. Mm-hmm. You can do that, but you're gonna have a fundamentally different experience. And so like that's one of my favorite things to do with people is just to watch their eyes light up when they just [00:17:30] realize, wow, there's this whole history, there's this whole culture behind dating, and it's not just swipe, swipe, you know, put your picture up.

There's actually like so much to dig into that can really empower somebody.

Lakshmi: I don't think you have to be a [00:18:00] historian, but it would be like, if anything, right, like if you went to a new city or you went to a new, tried a new cuisine, you might just wanna have a little bit of sense of like what to look for. Mm-hmm. You know, without, you know, you don't have to go deep sea diving, but you at least want someone to like [00:18:15] tell you what's in the pool and what to look out for.

That makes

Aransas Savas: sense. And then once somebody has their foundational understanding, what do they do?

Lakshmi: Well then I think they try and figure out like how to make it work for them.

Aransas Savas: Mm-hmm.

Not just dating. Mm-hmm. But how are they gonna build connection with their friends, with their neighbors, and then Yes. And then also dating and. I think a lot of times people [00:18:45] are just like, just tell me what app to go on, and I'm like, no, you know, like that's not it. Like that's not it. There are some differences between the apps and they all have like a slightly different tone and there's some that I would probably recommend to some other people, but it's like it's kind of doing this stuff.

So just a lot of things that I think are easy to overlook but can fundamentally change. Like how you, not only how you date, but how long you're able. To be out there [00:19:30] because I think a lot of people, like they get exhausted very quickly and so it is, it may take some time and so it has to be something that you enjoy and are not trying to just like get out of this as quickly as possible because that will have you making [00:19:45] less than, less than desirable decisions.

How do you help [00:20:15] people think about how to engage when they're meeting someone new for the first time?

Do they like to point at something in the ambient and kind of make that the starting point? You know, instead of just saying, you know, nice to meet you. Like, sometimes people need almost like a, like a third object [00:20:45] and that's how they lean in. So I don't think it's the same for everybody, but that's part of what I help people figure out is what are the things that are uniquely them that help them connect with other people.

So it's like a two part equation.

Lakshmi: No, because everyone's different. Yeah. And if I'm working with an engineer, sometimes their tendency is to think that their job is boring or [00:21:15] nobody wants to hear about it, uhhuh.

Mm. And who he is as a person and how he problem solves. And so a lot of times what I'm doing is helping people figure that out. Don't just say you're an engineer. Mm-hmm. Which is what a lot of people might think to do. Let's find the a way for you to say that you're an engineer. That's [00:22:00] actually interesting.

And is you, and opens it up for the other person. Mm-hmm. You know, to enter into the conversation.

Lakshmi: Right, but it's a thing that a lot of people sidestep working at Match.

Aransas Savas: Everything you're saying, I feel like could just be directly translated to the job hunting experience.

Lakshmi: Yes, it definitely can.

Aransas Savas: Hmm. Mm-hmm. I see what you mean there. Yeah. It's all skills though, that if we learn them, are valuable in [00:23:00] all aspects of our lives.

Yes,

Lakshmi: definitely.

Aransas Savas: It's too late worries and fears that you encounter most often.

And then also a, like a pretty even mix of people that are divorced and then people who did [00:23:30] not marry. And I think one of the biggest, I think misconceptions is that if someone is in their forties or fifties and they didn't get married, that they like don't want a relationship or that they're like meant to be single or that they're, and that's not necessarily true.

Mm-hmm. And there are people that are definitely, that is their best life. A single life is their best life. But I think there's a, a much bigger cohort of people. No, actually this is great for you. [00:24:15] This is your moment. This is when you might. Best to be suited for a relationship and to explore dating.

Aransas Savas: I love that.

Yes. In our thirties, forties, fifties. Seventies, totally. Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas: mm-hmm.

Lakshmi: About how the twenties is when we're supposed to find it. And so if we didn't, there's something wrong with us, or maybe I'm just. I'm just gonna be single forever and I just really believe that.

I literally built my. Around this woman I like worshiped her and it was like a dream to work with her when I was at Match. And she had such an [00:25:30] inclusive, broad based view of love. And this is the woman who is the expert in romantic love and she found love at the age of 72. Mm-hmm. And got married at 75 and then passed away at 78.

Aransas Savas: How beautiful. Mm-hmm.

And to be able to say that it is impossible to predict the future of our relationships based on the moment we're in now.

I guess this is, I guess it's me and my bridge club, you know, or mm-hmm. She plays bridge. That was, that's actually [00:26:30] accurate, but to always have that part of you not yearning and thinking that your life is incomplete, but also being open to, and I think that's a, a very, very like, beautiful dance that I also, mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas: Say more.

Lakshmi: So I think our culture loves labels.

Aransas Savas: Yep. And it's like, and binaries.

And I understand why it's hard, right? It feels like when you're, when you're looking for, you have to sort of actively announce like, I'm looking for a [00:27:15] relationship, I'm looking for a partner. But I've just, I've just noticed like, I mean that can work, but I think as you get older and you don't have a deadline and you are going to be.

Aransas Savas: I'm glad you brought up some supply and demand, because I think that that's one of the things that comes up a lot is mm-hmm. There's low supply available and so part of the reason. We think we've [00:28:00] run out of time is because we feel like we've run outta candidates. Mm-hmm. I'm making this sound like super clinical and professional now.

Lakshmi: Yeah. And it's just, it's just different. And I think again, like, like this idea of like yearning for how it used to be mm-hmm. Is just like not a helpful exercise. It's different. Because if you're just looking at volume, like it's never gonna be like that [00:28:30] again.

But if you're understanding that like it is a dynamically changing dating pool at all times, that's different.

Lakshmi: Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas: At a certain age they become invisible. Mm-hmm. Longer seen. A romantic partner or mm-hmm.

Lakshmi: Yeah. I understand it. And it's also not what I see. Yeah. Yeah. And [00:29:15] any really, really good dating coach, anyone who's like, studied dating intensively disagrees with that statement. Mm-hmm. And I understand why people say it.

I think sometimes though, it's being able to connect as peers. That is, is the art. Right. And knowing how to sort of still find space so it doesn't feel like you're at the [00:30:00] end of your story. You're still at the beginning of your story. So sometimes I think people confuse youth for someone that just feels like there's excitement about the future.

Mm-hmm. And that is one thing that I work with people on is like, there has to be genuine excitement about the future and not, like, all I wanna do now is play shuffleboard and like. You know,

Lakshmi: I think if you're, if you're talking, especially in forties, fifties, it's different when you get to your seventies. But if you're talking about your life like you're winding down, which a lot of people [00:31:00] do mm-hmm. Subconsciously. Yeah. Yeah. That is not exciting.

And all the women in my family that I grew up around lived until their mid nineties and doing big, brave things the entire time. And so I just assumed [00:31:30] point. And so this thought that like, people turn it off at 50, I'm like, huh, fascinating. Yes. Yeah. I was like, oh, no, no, no. We're just getting

Lakshmi: started. Girls.

Aransas Savas: Yeah. That's a really good point. And so if you were to give one piece of advice based on all of, not that anybody likes advice, but one insight maybe based on all of your [00:32:15] years of studying this. Mm-hmm. To the folks listening, what would you say? Learn how to talk about

Lakshmi: yourself and to get started with that.

Those may not be the great, the greatest questions, [00:32:45] but they are the most common questions. Mm-hmm. So we have to deal with that. We can't magically hope that that's not going to, that's going to stop. That is what you are fed. And instead of being like, oh, I wish people asked better questions, have better answers, have better [00:33:00] stories, have better ways to talk about yourself and listen to that.

Aransas Savas: Hmm.

Lakshmi: And they may or may not share all of them.

Lakshmi: they are ready to go.

Aransas Savas: It's almost as if they learn to date themselves first.

I'm like, wait, hold on. It's Thanksgiving, this fire, this what? It's connected to the HVAC system. And you like figure this all [00:34:00] out. And he is like, yeah. You know, like, and he's not an exception. Like people tell me their stories and like, you know, I'm dealing with people that are, that have jobs that, you know, on paper may or may [00:34:15] not be considered interesting.

Aransas Savas: Hmm. I love that. I love that. It's like if we can see how interesting and magical we are, we can offer that to other people as a gift and [00:34:45] hopefully see them.

There are interesting, magical uniqueness.

Lakshmi: Yeah. You're gonna inspire that in someone else. And I think sometimes people think that those stories are supposed to be told later. Uh, and I'm like, no, like out of the gate, let's go.

Yes.

Mm-hmm. And it's very, it's, it's really hard to say that, to really appreciate how that really impacts people. And so that's part of another reason why I [00:35:45] tell people to really understand dating culture like you are coming to someone. Not only have they been maybe on like six dates that week that didn't go so great, or they're like, you know, talking to other people, but like we don't know what they've been like snorting on their screens and how [00:36:00] that affects them.

Yeah. And so like that is like a tip that I give to a lot of people that they are like blown away at how it changes things. Just stay off your phone for two hours before a date.

Lakshmi: Yes. And I think people forget that it's just as important in dating.

Aransas Savas: Yeah. Yeah. Instead of bathed in everybody else's crap. So every guest on the Uplifters nominates another guest.

Lakshmi: I wanna, my best friend, Stephanie Kelly.

Aransas Savas: Tell me about Stephanie.

And I was like, what? I was like, if we had a book club with like John and Doug and Kurt, three guys we used to work with, and I was like, Uhhuh. So for her birthdate, I'm giving her a surprise book club. John, Doug, [00:37:15] and Kurt are gonna show up and we have picked a book that I know she's read. They're gonna read the book and then we're gonna have a book club.

Aransas Savas: Oh, that's really beautiful.

Lakshmi: I have like a bigger mission. I [00:38:00] always want and hope for people to sort of believe in romantic hope. This is this concept that is run through all of my work, and it's not about being in a relationship.

Aransas Savas: what does that look like for you?

And so whenever possible I try to go analog. Whether that's organizing a book club for my best friend and surprise and like even that, like [00:38:45] remembering that she said that. Mm-hmm. And then wanting to make it happen. And then it took courage for me to email these guys and be like, Hey, I have an idea. And they were instantly like, oh my God, I'm in, I'm in.

Aransas Savas: I love that. That does sound like a romantic life. And I definitely feel better when the majority of my hours each day are not spent staring at a screen, even though I'm staring at a screen doing super meaningful stuff with [00:39:30] other humans super intimately.

I also need lots of toes in the time.

Mm-hmm. And like little things like I'm just moved back to my hometown in October and you know, I made a list of like all the people [00:40:00] that I, I definitely want to build a relationship with. Now that I'm here, like I'm, I'm trying not to just wait for it to happen. But actually saying, no, you are meaningful to me and I want to connect with you, and not just assuming it's going to happen, but really [00:40:15] carving out time for those people.

Aransas Savas: Just asking ourselves what we want and who we wanna be is a really powerful step. Absolutely. Both in dating and in cultivating other relationships and aspects of our lives.

I was like, I wanna live where my friend lives. [00:40:45] So those choices I think are part of like living a romantic life.

Head over to Spotify, apple Podcast or [00:41:15] wherever you get your podcast and like follow and rate our show. It'll really help us connect with more uplifters and it'll ensure you never miss one of these beautiful stories. Mm,

Toss a star in half for beer around. Best love [00:41:45] for relish in a new prime land, a tree in springtime dance. With that, all hindsight, bring the sun to twilight. Lift you

Lift you up.

Lift you up. Whoa. Lift you up.

Lift you

Um, beautiful. I cried. It's that little thing you did with your voice, right? In the pre-course, right? Uh, Uhhuh. I was like, [00:42:45] mommy, stop crying. Mommy. Stop crying. You're disturbing the peace.