In an engaging and deeply insightful discussion, Kristin Fitch and Dr. Gary Lawrence tackle the intricate issues surrounding rejection and emotional trauma. Dr. Lawrence, a renowned counselor and author, shares his personal journey, including the challenges he faced after suffering a stroke, which led him to reassess his purpose and the importance of helping others heal from their past. The episode delves into the psychological implications of childhood experiences, highlighting that by age eight, most emotional patterns are established, laying the groundwork for future relational dynamics. This understanding is crucial as it frames the conversation around how unresolved trauma can hinder emotional growth and fulfillment throughout life.

As the dialogue progresses, Dr. Lawrence introduces the term 'rejection junkies', referring to individuals who find themselves trapped in cycles of self-doubt and fear of rejection. He vividly illustrates this concept with real-life examples from his counseling practice, emphasizing how many struggle to recognize the roots of their bitterness and emotional pain. The discussion also touches on the significance of cultivating self-compassion and the essential role of forgiveness in breaking these cycles. Dr. Lawrence passionately argues that forgiving others—and oneself—is a powerful step towards emotional freedom and healing.

The episode concludes with Dr. Lawrence offering listeners guidance on how to navigate their healing journeys. He stresses the importance of seeking help and the transformative power of community and faith in God. Dr. Lawrence’s insights serve as a beacon of hope, encouraging individuals to confront their pasts, embrace their worth, and ultimately step into the fulfilling lives God intends for them. This heartfelt conversation is not only a source of wisdom but also an invitation for listeners to embark on their journeys of emotional healing and spiritual growth.

Takeaways:

• By age 8, 80% of our emotional patterns are formed, impacting our later relationships.
• Recognizing and addressing the roots of bitterness can lead to emotional healing and growth.
• Forgiveness involves prioritizing the needs of the offender over our own hurt.
• Self-sabotage often stems from a fear of rejection rooted in past trauma.
• The journey to emotional freedom requires commitment to oneself and seeking help.
• Building healthy relationships involves understanding and breaking free from past emotional patterns.

Connect with Dr. Gary at RejectionJunkies.com or purchase his book here.

Download My Free Joyful Living Devotional: https://kristinfitch.com/devotional

Ready to take your first step towards a more joyful, faith-filled life? Download our Reignite Your Passion Workbook and start living with purpose today!

Ready to work with Kristin to make a shift in your life? Click here to get started.

Ready to Reclaim Your Life? Purchase the Reclaim Your Life Masterclass: Protect Your Spirit, Space and Pace for only $47 Learn more here.  

faith, rejection, emotional healing, trauma recovery, Christian counseling, self-worth, personal growth, forgiveness, bitterness, emotional patterns, mental health, Dr. Gary Lawrence, rejection junkies, overcoming rejection, spiritual growth, relationships, healing from trauma, faith-based support, emotional maturity, coping with rejection

Hey.

Hey, beautiful friends.

Welcome back to Faithfield woman.

This is your host, Kristin.

Today I have a great guest interview for you.

We're going to talk about rejection and.

We'Re going to talk about how past.

Hurt or trauma, holding on to resentment, fear, anger, fault, feeling of unworthiness, how.

It'S holding us back, how it's keeping.

Us from maturing emotionally.

And we're going to talk about how.

We shift the script and how we can actually step into a life that is fulfilling and we can thrive in and so you're going to love this conversation.

It's raw, it's honest, and there's so many takeaways that you can apply to your own life.

Welcome to Faith Fueled Woman, a podcast designed for Christian women eager to deepen their faith and shine God's light in every aspect of their lives.

Each week we'll delve into practical strategies, inspiring stories and biblical wisdom to equip you with the tools you need to navigate life's challenges and grow deeper in your faith.

From finding calm in the chaos, forming deep Christian friendships, to everyday ways to connect with God, we'll cover it all.

Hi, I'm your host, Kristen.

I'm an encourager, a faith led entrepreneur, a mom and a wife.

Let's be encouraged in our everyday lives as we let our faith guide us, fuel us and fill us with God's incredible peace, wisdom and joy in our lives.

Hi.

Today on the podcast, I would like to welcome our guest, Dr.

Gary Lawrence.

He's the founder and director of the new of New Life Dynamics Christian Counseling Ministries and the author of the bestselling book rejection junkies.

After 20 years as the host of his own radio show, Life mastery counseling with Dr.

G.

Dr.

G has personally met with and coached more than 6,000 clients and he's inspired thousands more on his radio, television and on the stage appearances.

Dr.

G specializes on breaking down the damaging effects of rejection and the way in which trauma manifests through all phases of life.

His book Rejection Junkies helps readers to recognize the circumstances, hold them hostage, keep them stuck and make and are making them bitter.

And I'm excited for our conversation today because so many of us get stuck in our old patterns, our stories, something that's just holding us back like it said.

And I can't wait for him to help us unleash some of this in our own lives and just live our best lives in the life that God wants us to.

So I'm so happy he's joining us today.

So welcome Dr.

G to the show.

Oh Christian It's a joy to be here and an honor.

So good to meet you.

You, too.

So I know you're going to just give so much to the audience, you know, with all of your wisdom and your years of counseling people.

So can you start off with just telling us a little bit about what have the last many decades looked like in ministry and doing your radio show, and then what does life look like today in your new book?

What's that about?

Well, actually, Rejection Junkies is not a new book.

And then I went into real estate investing.

And so I was very frustrated.

I said, God, are you done with me?

Is this it?

And I'll never forget, Christian, in my rehab hospital, outside the double windows, there was a brick wall.

Nothing else.

Not a patio or anything, just brick wall.

And I laid in my bed, and I'm looking at that.

I said, okay, Lord, here's another brick wall.

You've got to help me get over this one, you know, And I'm going to get over it.

I'm going to get under it.

I'm going to get around it some way, you know, when it comes to fulfilling your ministry, whatever it is that God's put you in or has placed you wherever he has, it's a matter of having a genuine purpose and understanding what your purpose and your plan is in life.

And So I was 76 at the time.

And so I thought, well, I don't know what I'm going to do.

So my wife and my.

One of my sons, Kevin, they said, dad, you need to update your book.

And Sylvia said this to me I'll never forget.

She said, honey, whatever you do, don't let your knowledge die.

And that really spoke volumes to me.

And I'll tell you, when Sylvia speaks to me, Christian, it's like the Holy Spirit is speaking to me.

I mean, God uses my wife to really reach my conscience.

And so that's what I did.

I updated my book, Rejection Junkies, and, well, thank the Lord it became a bestseller on Amazon.

And I'm grateful.

Absolutely.

Well, thank you for sharing that with us.

And like you said, what you.

You just walked through or recently, in the last couple of years, the stroke and.

Or did you say heart attack?

I missed?

No, it was a stroke.

Yeah.

Like you said.

Next.

I hope you're doing better now.

Yeah.

I think, though, is if we're still here and we're breathing in breath.

We still have use, right?

We still have purpose if we're willing to step into that.

And so I guess the first thing I'd ask you is, in all the years of counseling you've done and just helping people, guiding people on your shows, what would you say, why are we struggling with rejection?

And what is a rejection junkie?

Well, I'm so glad you asked.

That's a great question.

Here's a fact, okay?

By age 8, 80% of our emotional patterns are formed.

By age 18, 100% of our self image is formed.

And so when we turn 18, you have to understand that child within us is still very strong and much alive.

Okay, well, we go into college, we go into a career, we get some education, we learn how to make more money, Then we go into our 30s, we get older, and then we go into our 40s, we get gray hair, then we go into our 50s.

And so the older we get, the less opportunity we have to mature emotionally.

Let me tell you this cute little story.

I had a couple come to me years ago.

They had been married 56 years and he was an 80 year old retired medical practitioner.

And when he heard me say, by age 8, 80% of her emotional patterns are formed, his wife, he said to me, well, Dr.

G, what you're telling me is I'm just an 80 year old, 8 year old.

Yeah, you got that right.

And his wife leaned over and patted him on the leg and said, see, sweetheart, I told you, you act like a little boy, okay?

And that's true of all of us.

So I want to say this again for your audience.

By age 8, 80% of our emotional patterns are formed.

It's those early years in life, you learn how to live in fear, or you learned how to have an anger issue, or you learned how not to express yourself.

So Sylvia and I, we've been married 57 years, going on 58 now.

But anyway, I'll never forget I went back for my second year of college and I was asking God, Lord, let me meet my wife this year.

Let me find the woman you have for me.

So I was on the prowl, okay?

I was on the hunt.

And so I saw this beautiful brown eyed, olive skin, brunette, beautiful lady.

And I said, my roommate, I said, bob, you see that beautiful brunette over there?

And he said, yeah, what about her?

And I said, well, I'm going to ask her out for a date.

I Said, as a matter of fact, I'll probably end up marrying her.

And he just kind of laughed.

We kind of chuckled about it.

But you know what?

Four months after I met her, we got married.

Love it.

But here's what happened.

When we got married, it was just within a couple of days I thought, who did I marry?

This woman hardly ever expressed her emotions.

She was as quiet as a person can be.

She had a hard time conversing with me.

And then we had been married three months.

We were back on the college campus.

And I'll never forget this, and a lot of your audiences will identify this because probably 60 to 65% of all the ladies I've counseled throughout the years have had some level of sexual abuse, whether it's physical or verbal or emotional.

But anyway, I had come home from a long trip and, you know, I was 22 years old then.

I wanted to get home to my new wife.

And so I took a shower and I fixed myself something to eat, and I got in bed and snuggled her.

And she literally jumped out of bed so fast she slammed her head against the wall.

For the next four hours, she sat there with her knees up to her chest saying, don't touch me like that.

My daddy told me never to let another man touch me the way he has now.

We would call that PTSD today.

We didn't have a name for it then.

I was in Bible college, for crying out loud, serving the Lord.

My brand new wife of three months was having a nervous breakdown.

So that was my introduction to her sexual abuse.

And boy, I'll tell you why you talk about putting a stress and a strain or a marriage relationship.

And of course, now in my background, I was the fourth of four children and my father believed my mother got pregnant by another man.

They both had had extramarital affairs.

They were not Christian people.

Both of my parents were alcoholics.

So there was a lot of physical and verbal abuse.

Well, I handled my rejection by becoming a survivor.

I will fight back.

Sylvia handled her rejection by withdrawing.

She became an escaper.

So when it turned out married, we didn't know the dynamics then, but she was the escaper and I was a survivor, okay?

And she needed someone to dominate her, and I need someone to dominate, okay?

Because her mother was a very hostile, physically abusive, verbally abusive, narcissistic personality.

And so with Sylvia, Mary be unknowns to her.

She married her mother's personality.

So let me simplify this for our audience.

In every marriage, there's a parent and there's a child in Every marriage, there's a dominant personality and a more passive personality, and the dominant personality becomes the parent in that marriage.

And that's why the divorce rate in the Christian community is actually higher than in the secular community.

Does that make sense?

It does, yeah.

Yeah.

I thought they were similar.

I didn't realize it was a higher percentage.

Yeah, well, that's because there's so much performance in Christian lives.

When I became a Christian, I was 20 and a half years old, and it was the first time that I ever heard the gospel preached and I accepted Jesus Christ as my savior.

And then I began here, and I was in a legalistic church.

I didn't understand what that term meant at that time, but I heard, now that you're saved, you need to stop your smoking.

Well, okay.

Now that you're saved, you need to stop your drinking.

Well, okay.

Now that you're saved, you need to give up sex.

I thought, oh, wait a minute here, you're getting too personal.

So all I heard after I became a child of God was, stop this, stop that, stop this, stop that.

And so many young Christian men and women that they're new in the Lord, they hear the negative, stop this and stop that.

And they're so busy trying to perform to gain acceptance, they don't even know who they are in Christ.

And so, so many people are in the prison of the past.

Now, let me say this.

Unless you learn how to get mentally and emotionally free from your past, you will never be able to enjoy the present, and you definitely will not be able to design and create your future.

Yeah.

And that's what I'm all about.

I have a process where I help my clients learn how to break free, to unplug from those emotional energy fees from the past so they can build a healthy relationship in their present lives, whether it's a marriage relationship, a parental relationship, a relationship with the Lord, or just a relationship with themselves.

It's amazing to me.

Well, I shouldn't say it's amazing to me.

It's just a fact.

A large percent of Christian women and Christian men do not accept themselves unconditionally as God does.

Yeah, they're always striving to be better.

They're always striving to do more.

They're always striving to be worth more when they're already unconditionally forgiven and accepted because of the blood of Christ.

Yeah.

So let me ask.

Oh, sorry, go ahead.

Where are you gonna still say?

You go right ahead.

Okay, so what would you.

I mean, obviously, so many of us Deal with some level of holding on to rejection, like you said, either about ourselves or, you know, our past, how we grew up.

But we're holding on to stuff, right?

And so what would you tell us about what we're holding on to?

Maybe the roots of bitterness and all that.

And then also, how do we identify if we're someone that's holding on to something that we need to?

Then later we'll talk about kind of letting go and sort of emotional surgery, probably.

But so what would you tell us about that so that we can identifying in ourselves if maybe we have some of these things going on that we need to?

Well, sure, absolutely.

That's a great question.

Let me back up with some of your verbiage here.

Things that we're holding on to.

The truth is we're not holding on to that, they're holding on to us.

Okay, now stop and think about this.

In today's society, there are so many newborn babies that are born to mothers who are hooked on some kind of drugs.

And so because of that, the baby is addicted to that drug.

Okay?

I mean, just about every hospital in America has a special unit for newborns that are drug addicted, okay?

And they have a special system they bring them through in the early months of their life.

Well, that's the way it is with rejection junkies.

They are unconsciously hooked on the negative rejection patterns of their past.

Okay?

For an example, I had a hostility problem.

I would get angry, I would raise my voice, and I would use certain words that I shouldn't be using.

Okay?

That's because when I was a child, my mother and father, they fought like Imanzi Indians.

I mean, they were always mad.

They were always swearing each other.

There was no peace in my home.

So guess what?

I adapted that emotional response pattern.

If I didn't like something, I got angry.

Well, in the early months of our marriage, when I would get angry, Sylvia would withdraw.

She would be quiet, okay?

Because she lived in that kind of fear when she was a child.

So here's what we had.

Get this picture.

Sylvia and I, unconsciously, we're playing that game, I reject you before you reject me.

She would withdraw.

I'd get angry.

I'd get angry.

She would withdraw.

She would be quiet.

She would literally go in the master bathroom, lock herself in just so she could get away from the anger.

Well, unconsciously, whose anger was she really trying to escape?

Her mother's.

Right?

Okay.

When it came to our sexual relationship, she had nothing but guilt when it came to having a healthy sexual relationship.

So There she was, reliving that emotional response pattern of guilt.

Should I be doing this?

Should I like this?

Should I not like this?

And so we were just playing that game.

I'll reject you before you reject me.

Okay?

Now, I had a couple come to me one time.

Both of them were very passive.

And so he said, well, I want to ask you this, Dr.

Gene.

If you've got two passive, quiet people in a marriage, what's going to happen?

I said, nothing.

So as I took their life history, they'd been married 25 years.

They never went on a vacation.

They never got involved in any kind of sports activities with their children.

They never really enjoyed being parents.

Okay?

He went to work.

She went to work.

They came home, fed the kids, went to bed, and got up, did the same thing the next day, okay?

And so here they were, trapped in this dead, dull, boring marriage.

And finally she said, you know, I can't take this anymore.

We've got to get help.

And you know what his response was?

He said, well, good for you.

Go find out what you can change.

Yeah, See?

And so passive people are not motivated to make changes.

But it's not a matter of making change.

It's a matter of breaking the chains that have kept you in prison in the past.

Great.

So does that question there, Kristen?

It does, absolutely.

And I think.

I mean, what would you say, though, for so many people, do you feel like they're just going through life and they.

They don't for a long time even realize that they're stuck in a rejection cycle?

They're holding onto something.

Because I feel like the more that I've studied, the more that I've done podcasts, the more books I read, I feel more aware of a lot of ideas.

But I'd say 10 or 20 years ago, I probably wasn't.

I didn't know so many things I know now, but I feel like I know a lot of people that they're still not.

Not to say that we don't have our.

All of our own things.

Right?

It's a product.

It's a process.

I feel like a lot of people are stuck not even aware that there's a pattern, that they.

It's holding them hostage.

Right?

Yeah.

No, I agree with you 100%.

They're not aware of it.

That's well said.

Yeah.

What do we do?

So how do we assess ourselves or patterns to try to break the chains?

Okay, let me tell my story here.

Sylvia and I, we were missionaries to Canada when I got out of Bible college.

We ended up in Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada.

And I didn't know a person in that city.

And so I just went out and started knocking doors.

Now I rented an empty Lutheran church building and we went from day one to six months later we had 170 in our congregation.

In three years we bought five acres of land and we built a 450 seat auditorium.

And then I started a Christian school.

So I didn't see in Canada the educational system, well, the government sells.

Very socialistic.

I didn't want to put my son Dwayne in that public school.

So, so we started the Christian school.

We built an educational facility for 125 students.

So my ministry was being greatly blessed.

Many people were coming to know the Lord and families were being totally turned around.

But anyway, I had a hard time understanding why my wife was not happy.

Sylvia, you hardly ever smile.

Well, guess what?

She hardly ever smiled when she was a little girl.

She didn't have the chance to, but anyway, I found this verse of scripture in Hebrews, chapter 12, verse 15.

It says, look diligently lest you miss out on the grace of God.

Lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you and thereby many be defiled.

Now bitterness is not a user friendly word.

If I said to person, oh, you're bitter.

You see, I'm not bitter.

Well, bitter, bitter, that word bitterness, it sounds bitter, doesn't it?

Just the sound of that word irritates your ears.

I'm not bitter.

Well, Sylvia and I, we were traveling from El Paso back to Albuquerque, New Mexico.

One day we were away for a weekend and I had decided, now I'm going to divorce her.

And so I told her, I said, sylvia, I'm not angry, I'm not upset.

But I decided I'm going to file for a divorce.

Now this was in the early months of my counseling practice.

And she said, what do you mean?

I said, well, Sylvia, you're not happy.

I can't make you happy.

All we do is reject each other and I can't live.

Now this is funny.

I said, I cannot live with an emotionally damaged human being the rest of my life.

I will not do that to myself.

I wasn't paying attention to how emotionally damaged I was.

I was focusing on her weaknesses, okay?

And I tell every, every married person, every man that comes in, you've got to stop resenting your wife's weaknesses and start responding to her strengths.

See, all I did is I was focusing on her weaknesses.

You know, and I'd already planned, hey, I'll just move to Las Vegas, Nevada, and start a counseling practice there, because a lot of people in Vegas are divorced, right?

So I fit right in with the neighborhood.

So, yeah.

She said, well, I'm not like you.

And I said, what do you mean you're not like me?

Well, you're mad all the time.

You're yelling, and you.

You get upset, and you're a very, very abusive verbally.

And I said, sylvia, you're right.

You're not like me, and I'm not like you.

But when your father sexually abused you, he wounded your spirit.

And that's when I caught on to him.

We can redefine that word, bitterness.

So I want to say to your audience, and I'm going to list these out, okay?

If you can think of someone you have an inward resentment towards, you have a root of bitterness.

If you can think of someone that's wounded your spirit, you have a root of bitterness.

If you can find someone who creates a sense of anxiety when you're around them, you have a root of bitterness.

If someone produces a sense of fear or a feeling of guilt, you have a root of bitterness.

Okay?

Someone that has created a sense of loss or a sense of abandonment.

That's a root of bitterness.

So bitterness can be broken down in many different ways.

And some of the nicest people I've counseled were some of the most bitter people.

Does that make sense?

Yeah, because it's.

It's something that's.

Like you said, it's.

It's holding on to us because of some past trauma or perception we have about, you know, something that's happened to us.

And so it makes perfect sense to me, I'd say.

I would actually challenge to say most people are holding on to some percentage of bitterness, one of those things.

Oh, absolutely, yeah.

Big time.

Big time.

And, you know, and I tell folks, you know, some people are so addicted to their misery, they don't think they can ever find a way to change.

And so I've developed this coaching program, this counseling practice, and I began to apply to Sylvia and I, and everything we teach our clients is something that Sylvia and I experienced in real life.

I put it down in an organized format.

And we had a pastor and his wife come to us from Phoenix, Arizona.

And he said, Dr.

G, we need this counseling in Phoenix.

So we opened up a second office in Phoenix, and I kept both offices open for several years.

But we have been on five different Christian stations for over 20 years here in Phoenix.

Our staff grew, trained a lot of people.

And so we saw, besides the 6,000 I actually counseled, we saw another 10,000 people go through our process.

And boy, my goodness, I had a 90 year old lady come to me one time for counseling.

She was a very, just a well dressed, well manicured lady.

And she had never been married.

Well, as I took her life history, the reason she had never been married is because she was sexually abused.

Okay.

And she just didn't think that she was ever worthy to be married.

Isn't that sad because of what someone else has done?

And so I asked her, I said, well, why did I say on the radio that motivated you to call me for counseling?

She said, oh, everything you say has motivated me.

And he said, but the bottom line is I thought, you know, I'm 90 years old and it's time I get my poop in a scoop.

I'll never forget that she was a great person.

So let me ask you this.

So.

So the roots of bitterness.

And you, you referenced in your book Ephesians 4, 4, 31, but you, you mentioned some of them.

But it can be, you know, resentment, anger, I think fear, guilt, a wounded spirit like you talked about.

It can also be a sense of loss or betrayal or abandonment.

And so would you say that at the crux of all of that is really there's a lack of trust in other people or ourselves or in God.

In other words, there are all those things that we're hesitating to trust our spouse or trust ourselves.

Like you said, like we, we are afraid to trust people or we're internally right, we're, we're scared to be ourselves fully right.

Because of this, this wound, if you will.

Well, you said that very well.

Let's take all three of them.

Because of the negative rejection patterns in your past, you will be unable to have a trust in yourself, a trust in others, and a trust in God.

It's an absolute impossibility.

You see, I never had a relationship with my earthly father.

I never heard the words I love you.

I never heard the words I'm proud of you.

So when I became a child of God, how in the world could I identify with my heavenly father?

Great.

Because immediately I was put on this performance, this guilt trip.

Let me share two definitions of guilt with our audience.

Could I do that?

Absolutely.

There's false guilt and there's genuine guilt.

False guilt is anxiety created from a fear of being rejected for a lack of performance.

Now let me say that again.

False guilt, anxiety created from a fear of Being rejected for lack of performance.

Now, genuine guilt, a grieving created by the Holy Spirit over a situation.

So when I ask the average person, which level of guilt have you functioned on most of your life?

They're almost always say, false guilt.

Anxiety created from a fear of being rejected for a lack of performance.

That makes so much sense to me.

Yeah.

So let me ask you this.

What.

What I see a lot around me, you know, so whether that's people I've talked to, whether it's friends, family, especially with the young adults today, but what every age there is, there seems to be this.

This feeling of not being worthy or this feeling of holding on to.

Right.

Shame, or I'm not enough.

And so while that's similar to what we've already sort of talked about in some of those areas, what would you just say to that?

Or people that might be feeling that way.

Right.

Like you said, they.

They're never measuring up.

You know, they can't measure up to.

So I just see that a lot, and I see the struggle some of these people are having, but I feel like they don't know how to get out.

Get out from underneath that weight, if you will.

Well, because this is your audience, I hesitate to do this, but I'm going to be bold and go ahead and do it.

If you can identify with what Christian just said, and you are that individual that cannot accept yourself, you feel like you're not good enough, you feel like you haven't arrived at the level of life you want to arrive at, then contact me.

I'm still here to help people.

You know, I was very encouraged.

President Jimmy Carter, you know, he spent the last 30 years of his life involved with Habitat for Humanity, and he was a wonderful Christian man.

I don't know what kind of president he was, but.

Yeah.

But anyway, someone asked him, Mr.

President, why have you spent the last three decades of your life with Habitat for Humanity building homes for those who couldn't afford homes?

And here's what he said.

He said, my faith demands that I do everything I can, everywhere I can, for as long as I can, any way I can, for as long as I can.

And I thought, wow, I like that.

Here he is.

He's still alive, 100 years old.

Right.

So that's where I'm at at this season of my life.

Yeah.

I'm very, very selective with the clients that I take.

I want to know what level of commitment they're willing to make themselves.

Because if you're not willing to make a commitment to yourself, nobody.

And I Mean, nobody can help you get past yourself.

Okay.

Yeah.

And so, yeah, the bottom line is, no matter how old you are physically, that little child within you still controls you.

And I teach you how you can unplug from the past, put that little child to rest and actually become the mentally, emotionally and spiritually free human being that God wants you to be.

Absolutely.

So what would you say to us about.

I know in your book you talk about, I know there are two different concepts, but failure syndrome and poverty syndrome.

But I think so many of us can probably take a lot away from these concepts.

So what would you want to share with us about those two ideas?

Well, I didn't have that in my mind.

The bottom line is people who are repeatedly experiencing failure in their life, it's become a syndrome.

It's an addictive emotional and mental habit where they will unconsciously self sabotage themselves, whether it's in their career, in their marriage, in their family relationship.

Because of the negative patterns from the past, they will continue to implode emotionally and never be able to build healthy, I'm going to say, sustainable relationships, whether in the workforce, whether it be in the family relationship or whatever.

I mean, stop and look at the society we live in today.

Do we have a few problems with our political system?

Yeah, absolutely.

Is there just a little bit of bitterness and resentment out there in the public eye?

Too much.

Now look at the President Elect.

Does he have a few emotional issues in his past?

Big doc.

Well, welcome to the human race.

We all do, right?

I could help President Trump.

Okay, now don't say that braggadociously.

I say that because Chris and I have been privileged to counsel some of the wealthiest people in America, counsel some of the poorest.

I've counseled athletes, I've counseled personalities from Hollywood and boy, I'll tell you, it's Hollywood and experience.

But guess what?

They all have the same issues.

They just go by a different name, that's all.

Okay.

They have different levels of income.

Right.

Okay.

So does that your question?

Yeah, I think so.

I mean, I think it's the, you know, this might be the wrong language for it, but what was coming to me is that it's much like a self fulfilling prophecy or before we finally get to a place where things are going better for us, we basically self sabotage ourselves.

Right.

Like in other words, as soon as we're like, things are going pretty good, we do something because we're not comfortable going to that next level.

Is that right?

Absolutely.

You're, you're spot on, man.

You need to be a counselor girl.

Pretty sure I missed my calling in that, by the way.

Yeah, well, no, that's true.

Let me give your audience a definition.

I heard this.

Oh, I think I was about 30 years old.

The true definition of success.

If you want to succeed in life, all you have to do is fail and then fail again, and then fail again, and then fail again, and then fail some more and keep on failing until success breaks through.

Now, here's why you're not a failure, because you have failed.

You can only become a failure if you let failing become the last chapter of the book you're writing.

Well, you absolutely fine and believe that as well.

You know, it makes perfect sense to me because, you know, we only learn from the things we truly, you know.

So we have to keep getting out there and trying.

Well, everybody fails in their life on some level, right?

Everybody.

And many, many times I ask my clients, when in the world are you going to stop beating yourself?

When are you going to stop punishing yourself?

You're the biggest detriment you have in your life.

You're the biggest blockade to enjoy in your life.

So I'm saying this.

Let someone break through that wall of self defense and take some time out of your life to make a life.

Take some time to come to the place where you make yourself a priority.

You know, when it comes to a marriage relationship, I know there's a lot of ladies listening to this podcast.

They're very frustrated because their husbands don't understand them.

Their husbands don't see their hurting emotionally.

And I want you to know the reason your husband does not understand you.

It's real simple.

Are you ready for this?

They don't understand themselves.

So listen carefully.

A man's ability to love his wife is no more than the overflow of his own self esteem.

Now let me say that again.

A man's ability to love his wife is the overflow of his own self esteem.

If he doesn't have a healthy level of self love and self acceptance, he has no, no love to give you.

He's bankrupt emotionally.

He's empty inside.

And that's why you're frustrated and unhappy in your marriage.

And then unfortunately, you're bringing your own rejection baggage into this relationship.

Right?

And aren't we having fun?

Right.

Well, what do you do though, if you find that being the case, and I'd say that Mormon, I'm sorry, more women than men, it seems, are more willing to go have a conversation, right?

Because we're more relational, we're to get help, whereas Sometimes men, right.

They struggle to go and want to talk about their struggles with.

With someone else.

So what do you do if you find yourself in the situation you just kind of described for us?

Well, first of all, you have to understand I don't think it's a male, female issue.

Yeah.

I think it's a rejection issue.

Right.

Okay.

Unfortunately, I don't.

I don't know if it's a larger percentage of men that don't express their emotions or a smaller percentage of women that don't express their emotions.

Okay.

The bottom line is they're in a marriage relationship to a person that does not think that their opinion or their input has any value.

So therefore they don't give it or they don't want to give it.

Because when they were a child, excuse me, because of the stroke, sometimes I have a issue talking.

But because of their childhood and the rejection of their childhood, there's two things that they've lost.

Number one, they've lost their voice.

And number two, they've lost their choice.

So a man that gets in their marriage relationship and they don't have any positive self image of themselves, they will feel that their voice is not valuable, that they have nothing to bring to the marriage relationship.

So here's what I advise every woman to do.

Make yourself a priority.

Get help for yourself.

No matter where the marriage stands, you've got to become your own priority.

And I promise you this.

If I happen to be the person you contact, I'm going to give you truths and principles that you can employ that will capture your husband's attention and help him begin to respond to your needs emotionally.

That's a guarantee.

That sounds great.

So what would you say is one or two things that you'd most want to convey or share with the audience that you think would be most helpful?

Oh, my.

There's so many things, you know.

Well, first of all, welcome to the human race.

Everybody's got rejection patterns.

So I think the number one thing I want to share is only you can decide.

How long do you want to go on suffering?

How long do you want to go on being sad, depressed and unhappy?

How long do you want to go on living an unfulfilled life?

Now listen carefully.

I'm not in favor of divorce, but you've got to come to the realization that maybe the person you married isn't the person God wants you to marry.

Okay?

Maybe you made a decision on your own without any input from the Holy Spirit.

Okay?

Now I'm not trying to put anybody on guilt trip I'm just asking you, are you willing to make yourself number one priority because Christ did?

Yeah.

See, Christian, how many times have you heard, well, forgive and forget?

How many times?

Yeah.

Did you know that's a lie?

I did, because I saw we.

You talk about it, right?

But yeah, so share it with us.

Share, though, with the audience about this.

Right.

You may never be able to forget, but see, forgiveness.

Forgiveness is one of the most misunderstood words in the Christian language.

Okay, forgiveness, here's my definition.

Forgiveness is becoming more concerned for the needs of the offender than what they've done to offend me.

So let me say that again.

Forgiveness is becoming more concerned for the needs of the offender and what they've done to offend me.

Now stop thinking about, why did Jesus go to the cross?

Because he was more concerned for our needs and what we did to offend him.

Now, for example, I hated my father in law.

I mean, I had a true, solid hatred for that man because emotionally damaged my wife.

And I learned from that, that no matter who she would have married, he, her husband would have become the victim of the second order.

So I became a victim of the second order.

And I'll never forget when I learned how to get free from my bitterness, literally, I experienced genuine forgiveness.

I began to become more concerned for his needs than what he did to offend me.

And about a week after that happened, I thought, you know, I need to call him and express my love to him.

Now, here's a man who sexually abused my wife.

Here's a man who literally had lived in my home for the first 12 years of our marriage.

Here's the man that divided me from my wife.

And of course, because of the bitterness towards my past, everything was compounded.

So I called him.

And I would just call him George.

I said, hey, George, how you doing?

He said, I'm doing all right.

What's going on?

I meant a few words, right?

I said, well, George, I just wanted to let you know that I'm so grateful that God has let you be my father in law.

And I'm so grateful to God for everything you've done for my wife.

See, I didn't focus on his behavior.

I didn't focus on his sins.

I didn't tell him he needs to get rid of God.

I thanked him for being the father to my wife.

Okay?

And then I said, now I want you to understand that I know you've never heard this before because he never has heard it.

Okay?

I want you to know I love you and I'm so Grateful for.

You see, that's genuine forgiveness.

The man I hated.

Now all of a sudden I'm saying I love you.

You know how much peace and joy that brought to my marriage?

Yeah.

It's all about getting you free from the past.

Yeah.

I mean it's much like you hear people that have unfortunately lost a loved one, especially a child, at the hand of someone, you know that took their life.

And you see this supernatural forgiveness, I'd say come across that they're hurting for their child's loss or their family member's loss.

Right.

They have within themselves allowed themselves to truly forgive that person.

Right.

And this is what we're talking about.

I think.

Right.

Is because we can't do that on our own.

I don't think, you know, not, not at all.

Not at all.

Christian.

Let me take it just a few more minutes if you don't mind.

Absolutely.

My, my one goal for every Christian, man or woman is I want to encourage them to stop living for the Lord.

Now that sounds anti biblical.

Doesn't it at first sound right.

Right, exactly.

Well, I don't know if you're old enough to remember Paul Harvey or not.

Paul Harvey was a famous radio commentary and he would make a statement like that and he'd say, now stay tuned for the rest of the story.

Okay.

And so I say like this, every Christian should stop living for the Lord.

Because frustrated Christians live for the Lord.

Spirit controlled Christians, let the Lord live through them.

See the fruits of the spirit.

Love, joy, peace, long suffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness.

Against us there is no law.

So many Christians are so busy performing living for the Lord that they're peace in their own life, in their own heart.

And that's sad.

Now here's the problem.

See, we are created in God's image.

God the Father, God's son, God the Holy Spirit.

Well, we are a triunity.

We are a body of soul and a spirit.

The Bible says that the word of God is quick and powerful and sharper than any two edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and morrow.

Okay, so where is the problem?

Well, if you're a child of God, if you're a born again child of God, you are spiritually complete.

You don't have spiritual problems.

Now why is that?

So let me ask you Christian, have you accepted Christ as your Savior?

Yes, I have.

So you receive the Holy Spirit of God, right?

Yes.

So is the Holy Spirit perfect?

Yes.

So then spiritually you are what?

Perfect?

Exactly.

Now do you act like you're perfect?

Absolutely not.

Do you feel like you're perfect?

No.

No.

So.

So.

So where's the problem?

And you know, I didn't even learn this in Bible college.

I went for a special training session up in Denver, Colorado, with a gentleman by the name of Charles Solomon.

And he wrote a book, Handbook to Happiness.

But this is where I learned about the triunity of man.

I had been a Christian for five or six years before I learned this.

Okay, so the man's a triunity.

We're a body, a soul, and a spirit.

The spirit is perfect, but in the soul, it's the residents of three elements.

The soul is the resonance of your mind.

That's what you know to be true.

It's the resonance of your emotions.

That's what you feel to be true.

And then the soul is the residence of your will.

That's your ability to respond to life's circumstances.

Now follow me.

When while you know and how you feel are in conflict, your will, your ability to respond to life is damaged.

For example, I know God.

Lesbian.

I don't feel like God loves me.

I know I'm accepted.

I don't feel like I'm accepted.

I know I'm a good wife.

I don't feel like I'm a good wife.

I know I'm a good husband.

I don't feel like I'm a good husband.

I know I'm successful.

I don't feel like I'm successful.

So when you have that constant conflict, instead of love, joy and peace, the fruits of the spirit, you have anxiety, feelings of inadequacy, feelings of insecurity, and so on and so on and so on.

So when people come to me, I focus on the soul with spiritual truth.

Yeah.

Now here's what happens.

Because of all the conflict in the soul, the body becomes a buffer of that pressure.

And all kinds of diseases, all kinds of physical maladies come as a result of that.

When you're under stress, you have headaches.

Excuse me, migraines, nervous stomachs, hives, rashes, allergies, ulcers, arthritis, colonitis, fasted colon, palpitations, the heart, angina pectoris.

That's false.

Heart attacks, and so on and so on and so on.

And unfortunately, many, many people make themselves sick.

Well, sick physically because of all that mental, emotional turmoil.

So I love how you put that.

So what would you say is the power of prayer in all of this?

Well, I think.

Well, that's good.

As you pray, be sensitive to the fact that you are speaking To God Almighty and you are speaking to the Holy Spirit.

And if you're really sincere, now that's almost false guilt, isn't it?

But if you're really sincere, God will bring the answer to you.

Okay, I don't think it's an accident that you and I are talking today.

I just, just recently on a podcast interview I did.

Oh, I want to tell your audience, if they go to my website, on the home page, there's a quiz.

Are you a rejection junkie?

And if they answer that quiz, it comes to my inbox and I will get back to them and arrange an absolute free, no cost involved, 30 minute evaluation.

Are you a rejection judge?

I will help you identify to what level you have become addicted to rejection.

Okay.

So I called this one lady, she responded to that quiz and she answered the phone and I said, this is Dr.

Gary Lawrence.

She said, what?

I said, this is Dr.

Gary Lawrence.

You took a quiz at my website?

She said, I can't believe it.

She was literally in her living room in tears, praying and asking God, lord, give me some answers.

I need some help.

And everything has just totally turned around for her now.

Isn't that something?

I love it.

A friend of mine that also wrote a book, you know, she had some things happen in her life with one of her children and not to her doing.

Right.

It's just fortunate, but.

So she finally wrote a book about it.

But she also talked about her mental health struggle and it was much the same where she tried praying, she tried all these things.

And while she had some, some help there, she finally had to work with a, you know, a counselor.

But the point is, is often the solution is not just only in prayer.

I mean, it depends what it is, but it's going to come to us through people or resources.

Right?

In other words, think sometimes we also get.

It's not maybe the legalistic side, but it's the side of thinking like, well, I'm asking God.

But sometimes God is putting people or resources in our path that are going to help us uncover or get what we need.

Right?

And I think sometimes we forget it's not just about only prayer.

It's what is he doing around us when we absolutely.

You said that very well, Christian.

The fact is you could probably help me in my life.

There's experiences you've been through that I haven't been through and I don't have all the answers.

And so none of us do.

And if you're not willing to seek help outside of yourself, well, unfortunately, you probably never solve your Problems.

That's why the Bible said that there's safety in a multitude of counselors.

Okay.

So seek some, insert some input from someone else.

I love it.

So before, before you share with us, you know, where people can.

You've already shared it, but where people can find out more about your book and just how you are helping people in your quiz.

I have one last question.

Well, two last things for you.

The first is, is there anything else or any just word of encouragement you want to share as we wrap up this episode?

Well, I think that the word of encouragement is, is there are answers in the word of God.

Sylvia was about to leave me.

She had decided she was going to leave my two sons with me because at least I could take care of them financially.

And I asked her.

I see.

My response was, oh, what will people in the church think about me?

I was more concerned about my precious reputation than I was what her emotional needs were.

And so I told her, I said, sylvia, if we believe the word of God has the answers, I promise you I will get into the Word of God and find the answers.

Why are we rejecting each other?

And when I came across Hebrews, chapter 12, verse 15, look diligently lest any person misses out on the grace of God, lest any root of bitterness trouble you and thereby many be defiled.

I thought, wow, there it is.

There's the culprit, the root of bitterness.

I have been defiled.

My wife has been defiled.

Now stop thinking about that.

That word, defiled is a nasty word.

It means tainted.

It means polluted.

But here we were, just young 20 year olds, just gotten married, and already our lives were crippled because of the past.

Would you say our lives were polluted?

Yeah, I would, Yeah.

I love, I think it's in one of Mark Patterson's books.

And I don't remember if he said it first or he was quoting someone, but he says that most of us, our problem is, is that we think our problems are bigger than God and not thinking God is bigger than our problems.

Right.

To move in our lives.

And I think that's much, you know, what you're getting at, which is if we go to God's word, right, if we go to the resources and the people he puts in our lives, but we're seeking that and knowing that the he is more powerful than any of your circumstances.

Right then.

Right.

But we have to have that understanding, I think, in order to know that our marriage, our relationship with our child, whatever it is, right.

Can be changed, it can be transformed, you know, over time, obviously, we don't know how long things will take sometimes, but.

Yeah, yeah, right.

Well.

And unfortunately, the.

The Bible, the word of God, is 66 books in one book.

And the average person looks at that big old book, that big old Bible, and says, where do I start?

Go to a counselor, for crying out loud.

Call someone that's qualified to help you and be willing to be honest with yourself and be willing to be vulnerable.

Okay, so you said that very well, Christian.

Thank you.

So, last question.

What would you say is fueling your faith and just your life right now in this season?

What is fueling my faith in your life?

In my life?

Oh, my goodness.

The word of God, the ministry of the Holy Spirit, the fact that.

Well, there's three things I think that we need to incorporate in our relationship with our Heavenly Father and in our ministry in our life.

By the way, everybody listening to us, you have a ministry, whether it's your husband, your wife, your children, somebody in the church, you have a ministry.

Okay?

And the bottom line is you got to employ three character attributes to enjoy life.

Number one, you have to have commitment.

Number two, you have to be consistent.

And number three, you have to be creative.

And being creative means step outside of yourself and get some answers.

Keep looking for those answers that you need so desperately in your life, because there are answers that work.

And now to me, it's found in the word of God.

And so that, to the Lord in my faith, is what makes everything real to me today.

Love it.

All right, so, Dr.

G, can you share people again your website address where people can find out more about your book and your quiz and everything else?

Oh, thank you so much, Christian.

It's rejectionjunkies.com that's rejection junkies.

J U N K I e s rejectionjunkies.com and.

Or you can go to Amazon.

But anyway, you can order my book there.

You can do that quiz.

Are you a rejection junkie?

And if you put your phone number in, I will call you back and visit with you personally.

Now, why is that?

Well, I'm at the last season of my life.

I realize that.

And.

But it's just amazing how God's using my book Rejection Junkies and the truth that's in.

I'm counseling people in.

In Florida, Maryland, California, the bean fields of Iowa.

It's just amazing the people that I'm able to help at this time in my life.

Now here's why.

The truth I teach is evergreen truth that never changes.

The word of God never gets weak.

It's still powerful and Chris, I just want to say thank you so much for having me as your guest.

It's been a real honor.

Absolutely.

Thank you for joining us, sharing so much wisdom and knowledge about, you know, trying to understand what's holding us hostage and also learn how to grow emotionally again.

If we've been stunted, right, we're stuck.

And so just thank you for taking the time today.

And you're just such a joy to talk to and you know, you're very open to sharing your own stories and then your, you know, some of your client stories and just your testimony to God.

So thank you so much for joining us today.

It's my primary saying As I wrap.

Up today's episode, I just want to share a quick excerpt from the book Jesus Over Everything with you by author Lisa Whittle.

He says this most of all, I wish I had Understood what scholar N.T.

wright said, the authenticity that really matters is living in accordance with the genuine human being God is calling you to become.

And she says this I didn't know how to be me because I misunderstood the process of becoming.

Too often the unfinished class is blind to what the Spirit shaped us can be.

Over time, lies have felt true, damning and permanent.

We aren't weak for falling for them.

We are human.

But we need to put the truth of Jesus over them.

Now.

I hope this episode allows each of us to open our hearts a little bit more to see what we might be holding on to that's keeping us stuck and in patterns that aren't serving us and that aren't serving us to become the person God wants us to be.

And so whether you do your own work and reflection, you seek the understanding and look to the word of God, or whether you go and find a qualified counselor or a person at your church, let's just make sure that we're growing so that we can thrive and step into everything God has for us.

Thanks again for listening to the show and if you enjoyed today's episode, we would love it if you could take a minute to leave a rating and review on Apple Podcast because it helps our show get discovered by more people.

And if you'd like to be encouraged in your faith and in your life, go on to KristinFitch.com and sign up to get my newsletter.

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