Is technician pay really the problem, or is there a bigger picture? In this episode, expert trainer Andrew Uglow unpacks the most common complaint in the workshop: "I don’t get paid enough." Through honest conversation and practical insight, discover what truly drives satisfaction and success in the automotive industry.

In this episode, you’ll learn:

• How technician wages compare to other trades

• Why lifestyle choices and financial management matter as much as salary

• The impact of supply and demand on pay

• How to diagnose the real causes behind compensation complaints

• Practical strategies for addressing pay concerns beyond just raising wages

• Why teaching financial management can be more valuable than another raise

Get ready for candid stories, actionable advice, and a fresh perspective on building a rewarding career in the workshop.

------------------------------------------------------

Andrew has a variety of free downloads and tools you can grab.

Discover if your workshop is Retention Worthy© here or visit his website, https://www.solutionsculture.com where the focus is on bringing reliable profitability to automotive workshop owners and workshop management through the Retention, Engagement and Development of their Technical Professionals.

This podcast was produced by 'Podcasts Done for You' https://commtogether.com.au .

Technician pay reality check.

2

Are they really underpaid or

missing the bigger picture?

3

Join passionate automotive trainer

and coach Andrew Uglow as he tackles

4

the most common technician complaint.

5

I don't get paid enough.

6

In this episode, you'll learn why.

7

Comparing technician wages

to other trades, Mrs.

8

Crucial context, how lifestyle

choices impact financial perception

9

and discover practical strategies

for addressing compensation

10

concerns beyond just raising pay.

11

Along the way, Andrew shares some

great stories, including our simple

12

overtime test reveals, whether it's

really about the money and why teaching

13

financial management might be more

valuable than salary increases.

14

I'm your co-host Anthony Perl, and this

is the Frictionless Workshop podcast.

15

Let's get cranking.

16

Andrew, welcome to another series of

the podcast, and we've got a really

17

interesting topic we're gonna go

through in this series in particular.

18

But

19

Andrew Uglow: firstly, welcome.

20

Thanks Anthony.

21

It's good to be recording

another podcast again.

22

It's a funny dynamic, isn't it?

23

You, you think you've said everything

or, or maybe people think they've heard

24

everything that you have to say, whichever

way you look at it, and things emerge.

25

Things change you.

26

You come across new information

and it's like, well, actually, this

27

would be really useful for people.

28

It's always interesting because there's

29

Anthony Perl: always more, and I

think exactly what you just said.

30

Suddenly there is this different

perspective or there's something that

31

you've covered and we get the feedback

as we've had to explore things in a

32

different way, in a different light.

33

So I think in this series

we're going to really take the

34

technician's perspective, aren't we?

35

We're going to really have a look

in a lot more detail and things

36

that might be impacting them.

37

Andrew Uglow: Sure.

38

So when.

39

Customers come into a business.

40

So if I'm a, a service manager, a workshop

owner, customers come into my business,

41

they come into, essentially what they do

is they come into, within my business,

42

invest in the reliability of their car.

43

That's why they're there.

44

And they do that by purchasing

parts from me as the workshop or

45

the workshop manager and purchasing

skill from the people that I.

46

So when something isn't right

with a customer's car, we end

47

up with a customer complaint.

48

And so it usually forms into

one of two types of complaints.

49

My car is doing something that it

shouldn't, or conversely, it isn't doing

50

something that I was expecting it to.

51

And so we collect the data from the

customer and we go through a diagnostic

52

process, and perhaps one of the more.

53

Common diagnostic processes is the

six step troubleshooting process.

54

If you're not familiar with

that, Google that stuff.

55

It's a, it's a pretty good process.

56

And we then go through and unpack

and discover what's actually

57

going on with the vehicle.

58

Because very often what the customer's

complaint is, is a symptom as

59

opposed to the cause of a problem.

60

And so what I wanted to do

for this series is I wanted to

61

go and take that same frame.

62

And go, well, have we ever actually

sat down and done some diagnosis,

63

some six step troubleshooting, if

you like, on the technician's claims.

64

Complaints that they give

us by way of feedback.

65

And if you're a workshop service manager

or workshop owner, you'd be familiar with

66

the the complaints that technicians do.

67

And so I've collected a bunch of the

most common complaints that pop up in

68

training, so working with technicians

quite regularly, which I thoroughly enjoy.

69

And this is the sort of stuff that just

comes up in either, you know, the casual

70

conversations or like we'll be talking

about, you know, technology on car.

71

And this will emerge

out of the discussion.

72

Anthony Perl: I think it's a fascinating

point as well to kick this off, is

73

that you as someone independent coming

in, get to hear things that maybe

74

the owners and the managers get to

hear, but only in a different way.

75

Whereas the willingness to share in this

way is quite informal in many respects,

76

and allows it to be free flowing.

77

And I think it allows you to then take

a perspective and really address it.

78

And I think that's what we're

gonna do in this series.

79

So I think it's done with.

80

A lot of

81

Andrew Uglow: great insight.

82

Yeah.

83

And the technicians, because I don't

employ them, they don't work for me.

84

I don't have a stake in

their financial performance.

85

Like I definitely, as a trainer, as a

coach, I definitely have a stake in seeing

86

them be successful without question.

87

And at the same time, they can tell me

anything and there's no repercussions.

88

You know, there's no, well, you know,

you're fired or you can't say that, or

89

you, you know, we have to work within

the bounds of good HR policy for sure.

90

But the genuineness with which

this is expressed is, um,

91

really, really quite powerful.

92

Anthony Perl: So without a further

due, we are getting to the first of

93

the complaints, which is probably the

one that I guess is the most obvious

94

in many respects, whether how true it

is, well, let's explore some of this.

95

They don't get paid enough,

96

Andrew Uglow: and I'm sure as a

service manager or a workshop owner,

97

you'd had this technician comes to

you and go, I want you to pay me more.

98

I certainly know my

experience as a technician.

99

You know, I look at the

metrics that I'm measured by.

100

I look at my productivity, my

efficiency, my profitability.

101

If that's how I'm being tracked and I

go, actually, I'm doing really well.

102

I'm worth more money.

103

And so I approach the business and I

go, well, I'm not getting paid enough.

104

And that's a, that's a, that's

fairly heavy conversation, isn't it?

105

And so I, I wanna just

put on my diagnostic hat.

106

As a trainer, as a technician,

coach, and go, well, okay, let's put

107

on a a thinking cap and go, well,

are you not getting paid enough?

108

Is that actually a thing or is this,

is there something more to this?

109

Just like I would with

a customer's concern.

110

Customer says, my car's air

conditioning isn't cold.

111

Well, I go, well, okay, well, let's

go and test to see whether the

112

air conditioning's cold or not.

113

It might be, and it might be something.

114

With the customer.

115

The customer's not using it correctly,

or they've got it set to, I don't know,

116

something and it's how it's applied

versus what's actually happening.

117

And so let's go and test this.

118

I don't get paid enough and you

know, they don't pay me enough.

119

I should be paid more money.

120

These types of complaints.

121

And the first question I wanna ask is,

well, what are you comparing that to?

122

Because.

123

If you are comparing yourself to

the, you know, the CEO of Telstra

124

or you know Anthony Albanese as

the Prime Minister, well sure they

125

get paid a whole lot more money.

126

And how do you justify that comparison?

127

Well, that's an interesting

discussion, but like, what are

128

you actually comparing it to?

129

And, and so when we go and test

this, and the first question that

130

we look for when we are doing

any diagnosis is, is this valid?

131

Is it actually what the

customer's complaining about?

132

And is that a fault?

133

You know, so we go back to the idea,

well, I'm not getting paid enough.

134

Well, is that actually.

135

Correct.

136

Is that actually how you say it is?

137

And is that a problem?

138

And I'm gonna go, well, it may or may not

be how we say it is, but it's certainly a

139

problem because now I'm getting feedback.

140

Right now I'm getting

response from my technicians.

141

And if I don't address the concern.

142

It's the same as me not

addressing a customer's concern.

143

I'm gonna lose the customer, right?

144

So here I'm gonna lose my tech.

145

And the technicians are the

heart and soul of a workshop.

146

If you don't have good

productive technicians, how

147

can you possibly be profitable?

148

How can you satisfy customers?

149

How can you do any of these outcomes

that the business is built to do?

150

So compared to what?

151

And often, I don't know, we, we get, the

first comparison is with other trades.

152

Well compared to electricians, compared

to plumbers, compared to, that's,

153

that's the first one I'm gonna argue.

154

That's a reasonably fair comparison.

155

Like, I'm a trade, they're a trade, you

know, they're making more money than me.

156

It's not fair.

157

You should pay any more

money at a surface level.

158

Sorry.

159

That's fair.

160

The next one is by way of a comparison, is

well look at all the stuff I have to know.

161

You know, what's changed for plumbers in

the last 50 years, we've gone from play

162

pipes to bully volley uh, PVC pipes.

163

Which is like way easier and

much less hard and quicker.

164

And so they're even more

efficient than they were.

165

The adage goes, well,

excrements still runs downhill.

166

That hasn't changed.

167

So, so like, why are plumbers

making all this money?

168

There's been a change in

technology and how they do stuff.

169

Sure.

170

You know, laser levels and all this

sort of stuff, so I've gotta know

171

physics and chemistry and like, you

pick a topic, I, I have to know it.

172

Fluid dynamics, the list goes

on and, oh, why shouldn't I

173

get paid more for knowing that?

174

Of course.

175

The other thing that usually doesn't come

up for technicians is supply and demand.

176

Anthony Perl: Yeah.

177

I mean, that's an

interesting one, isn't it?

178

I mean, is there a lot of them?

179

Is there enough to actually

justify, well, there's so few.

180

We have to pay some of them more.

181

Is it geographic as well?

182

You know, there's lots of things

that come into that equation.

183

Yeah.

184

Andrew Uglow: One of the, like the

automotive industry, like I started in

185

the automotive industry a fair time ago.

186

I'm an automotive industry lifer.

187

You could argue that I'm

an automotive industry.

188

Tragic.

189

I've been in the industry longer than

I care to admit in excess of 30 years.

190

And when I started, there was

a school shortage, then there

191

was a lack of technicians, then

there was a lack of apprentices.

192

Then we couldn't find good people then.

193

And that's been the same.

194

Problem.

195

And if anything, it's intensified since,

and so you go back to supply and demand.

196

Well, okay, that's an issue.

197

There's not enough supply,

so the price should go up,

198

otherwise they move elsewhere.

199

But I still think we're dealing at a

surface level and we haven't really

200

got to the core of what's going on.

201

Certainly, it's been my

perspective that technicians are

202

human, like the rest of this.

203

And, and the grass is always

greener, isn't it, Anthony?

204

We look on the other side of

the fence and we go, poor.

205

Look at those people.

206

You know, I, I eighties, tragic.

207

I point to Mark Effler

and money for nothing.

208

And the song, you know, look at all

these people, look all the stuff

209

that these rock stars get, you know,

like that'd be the life, wouldn't it?

210

And I think what we forget to consider

certainly is the technicians maybe

211

don't give this sufficient thought.

212

Is that often the reason why the

grass is greener is because there's

213

more BS on that side of the fence.

214

There's BS makes the grass green.

215

There's, there's more stuff

to deal with and cope with.

216

Not that technicians don't

have a lot to deal with.

217

Not that we don't as service management

or workshop ownership have a lot to

218

weigh through, but I'm concerned about.

219

The validity of the test.

220

Now, there are some techs that are

definitely underpaid, and I like the

221

idea of paying people more, like taking

money off the table, taking it outta the

222

equation, so that now we don't want the

technicians just to work for our money.

223

That would be a really enormous mistake

and a really huge opportunity missed

224

because if they just work for my money,

I pay them more and they work for my

225

money, and sooner or later there'll

be another reason for a pay rise.

226

There'll be another reason for

a pay rise, and now we're into a

227

challenge where it's not profitable.

228

But I'm now relying on this technician

because maybe they are good.

229

Maybe they're outstandingly

efficient or profitable or whatever.

230

And so it's never enough.

231

And so I like the idea of having

technicians not work for money.

232

Like pay them well without question,

but don't have them work for your money.

233

That's going down a level They

need to work for something.

234

Other than money, like by all means

incentivize, by all means pay.

235

Well, that shouldn't be the reason

that they're turning up for work,

236

because that is playing at a really

shallow level, and it's playing a

237

really dangerous game because someone

will tap them on the shoulder and they

238

go, Hey Anthony, how about you come to

work for me for another, you know, five

239

bucks an hour or another, you know,

a hundred bucks a week, or whatever

240

it is, and techs will move for that.

241

The Frictionless Workshop Podcast is

242

Anthony Perl: brought to

you by Solutions Culture.

243

For details on how to get in touch

with Andrew, consult the show notes.

244

Below, and don't forget to subscribe

so you don't miss an episode.

245

Now, back to the podcast.

246

Yeah, particularly when you've got,

you know, a cost of living crisis

247

and regular differentiations in

interest rates and all of those things

248

that are happening all the time.

249

If, as you say, the focus

is on the money, then.

250

You take away the focus from

251

Andrew Uglow: the job.

252

Yeah, absolutely.

253

And I go back to, and I think this is

something that the automotive industry as

254

a whole is starting to get back to, but

has dropped the ball like quite badly, is

255

that it should be about professionalism.

256

Like they should come to work

because they're proud of their trade,

257

they're proud of their reputation,

they enjoy the challenge, they're

258

looking forward to contributing.

259

Asked a class full of technicians.

260

I said, how many people's

lives have you saved?

261

You know, we had a variety

of different people.

262

Some had been, some are still

in their apprenticeships.

263

They were late third year, early

fourth year, and other people have

264

been in the trade for 10, 15 years.

265

And I said, well, you know, how

many people's lives have saved

266

since you've been in there?

267

And it was, was the Microsoft Blue Circle.

268

You know, it was like, I've, I've

never even thought about this.

269

This was something that

I'd never even considered.

270

And I said, well, you've just

come up with subjective number.

271

How many cars have you worked on?

272

How many cars have had problems?

273

How many times have you,

you know, found funky?

274

Tires, brakes, suspension, you know,

whatever it is, engine issues, whatever.

275

You know, cars coming on tow trucks

that otherwise weren't functional,

276

that because you did the job properly.

277

This person now drives a safe VE

vehicle versus a dangerous vehicle.

278

How many lives have you saved?

279

And I go, this is why you

wanna be coming to work for me.

280

Because we save people's lives.

281

We delight customers.

282

Like, don't get me wrong, we.

283

Pay you well to do that.

284

And at the same time, the

business needs to be profitable.

285

There's a, a balance here.

286

There's a sweet spot for both

the tech and for the business.

287

And so, uh, the idea of working

for money, I think is really bad.

288

Interestingly enough that the guys

that have been in the trade for.

289

For longer, like 12, 15 years, they

were in tens of thousands of people

290

that just subjectively they go, I

would have to be tens of thousands.

291

I calculate how many cars I've worked

on, calculate how many have had serious

292

issues, and even semi-serious issues.

293

It'd be tens of thousands of people.

294

So if you think about, even if you didn't

kill someone that resulted in a collision

295

or that resulted in a, you know, you think

of all the stress, all the money, all the

296

like, that's a very impressive number.

297

And that was just one room full of people.

298

So why aren't we working for that?

299

Why isn't that on the

list of things, you know?

300

Why isn't that part of my

motivation as a technical

301

professional opportunity to improve?

302

Anthony Perl: Yeah.

303

It's a really interesting

situation, isn't it?

304

If you can then take

the money off the table.

305

The question then becomes is

that motivation actually there?

306

You know, what is the underlying

cause for them asking for more money?

307

Because is it really about

the money or is it about other

308

Andrew Uglow: things?

309

Right.

310

And so the way you would find

this out is you would test, right?

311

Just like you would test, is the

air conditioning really cold?

312

But I would run a, a test, I'd use aol.

313

I'd use a test to see if the air

conditioning was got, okay, so the

314

customer in this case, our technician

says, you don't pay me enough money.

315

Well, let's test that and so let's go.

316

If I gave you more hours and paid you

at a overtime rate, would that be okay?

317

That's gonna give you more money, right?

318

Sure.

319

The government do.

320

The government are awful.

321

I I, I won't, I won't use the word just

'cause I'm trying to use polite language.

322

They, they're not getting a

Christmas card from me anytime soon.

323

They're just, they're just not.

324

Yes.

325

I think they have opportunity.

326

It's the

327

Anthony Perl: dangerous part.

328

Oh, Don, if we start talking

politics, but I think everyone is you.

329

It's, it doesn't,

330

Andrew Uglow: they don't make it right.

331

And so they definitely

don't make it right.

332

And so for the tech, the

government sits into their pocket

333

for quite a significant sum.

334

You start going, well,

actually is this worth it?

335

And the flip side is if you wanna go

and do that equation, like that's a

336

whole nother frame to look through.

337

So as a business, I look

at the cost of labor.

338

So I pay the tech and then I pay the

super, and then I pay my payroll tax.

339

And so the cost to me for this

technician's labor is really quite

340

high versus what the technician's

getting in their pocket.

341

And so I have to charge out.

342

A cost rate to the customer.

343

So the customer's paying for all of this.

344

'cause at the end of the day,

if the customer can't afford

345

it, well what do you do?

346

You walk, you know, take public transport.

347

I don't know what's the alternative.

348

And so I have to charge out at my cost

rate, but I'm paying my technician

349

at the other rate, but I'm not making

all of that money in the difference.

350

The government's sticking their

hand into the text pocket, into the

351

customer's pocket and into my pocket.

352

And I'm very confident that there's a word

that begins with B that would describe

353

what that is and ends in master degree.

354

But and get the point of taxes.

355

But like how far?

356

Too far?

357

So we start talking about

the commercial elements here.

358

This becomes a very

difficult conversation.

359

And so I've asked these

questions for technicians, okay?

360

So you're not earning enough

money, you don't feel you're

361

being paid what you're worth.

362

Got it.

363

What if we pay you over?

364

I know.

365

I don't wanna sacrifice time.

366

I don't wanna be spending more of my time.

367

Working on cars 'cause I've got

backyards to do or I'd rather relax

368

or hobbies or whatever I wanna do.

369

And so we end up in, well is

it actually about the money?

370

Is that really because it was about

the money, it was purely dollar.

371

You'd take the overtime.

372

I certainly know I did as a tech.

373

There's overtime sign me up

like can I do more overtime?

374

Sure.

375

I get handled by the tax

department without question.

376

But that's why the tax department

exists, isn't it, to handle people.

377

At the same time, I end up with more

money, you know, and there's work

378

around, there's ways and means and

well, we're not gonna talk about that.

379

There's formal and informal payments.

380

There's all sorts of ways of doing this.

381

But certainly what I see with the

younger technicians is that it's,

382

you know, we talk about lifestyle

versus pay versus overtime, and

383

there are three competing tensions.

384

Yeah, it's about the money,

but it's not just the money.

385

It's more complex than just the, the

surface level complaint that we receive.

386

And so some of the other things that,

that I've tested, I've gone well.

387

You're earning this much

money, where's it going?

388

And that's an interesting conversation.

389

Okay, so, so you, you are single or you

know, you in a partner with a mortgage

390

and or kids, where's the money going?

391

And certainly for the younger guys that

are maybe in relationships, but not out

392

of home yet, or shared accommodation

or something like that, I, I, you know,

393

how much do you spend on food a week?

394

And like, it is eye watering.

395

The, the money that gets wasted.

396

Coming from a, a part Scottish family.

397

So one side of my family was part

Scottish and they're very in touch

398

with their inner Scotsman, deep

pockets, short arms, all of that.

399

My inner Scotsman has a moment.

400

It sort of goes pale and slumps

against the wall and collapses.

401

You're spending how much?

402

And so I go back to the complaint,

okay, well is it really about pay or

403

is there something else at play here?

404

And I asked the question then

of, of service management.

405

If they're managing their finances

badly, well paying them more money

406

isn't gonna solve the problem, right?

407

That's just a, a self perpetuating loop.

408

They get more money putter away on stuff.

409

There's no planning, there's

no responsibility, there's

410

no acumen around finance.

411

So we're just gonna start

another cycle, aren't we?

412

And so I ask it, is it worth going well,

how about rather than me paying you more

413

money, how about I pay for you to go

and do a class on financial management?

414

How would that sound?

415

Because I can claim that on tax, right?

416

I can call that workplace training and

you get to learn how to manage your money.

417

And so now you're actually not

spending your money up against a wall.

418

You're actually got some sense and

some logic and some reason around it.

419

So I go back to the question,

well, is it, is it really.

420

Just about the money because

it could be like you might be

421

under pain, but is it that?

422

How do you know until you test?

423

Anthony Perl: Thanks for

joining us for this deep dive

424

into Technician Pay Reality.

425

If you found this diagnostic approach

to compensation issues valuable, you

426

gonna love what's coming up next.

427

In our next episode, we're shifting

from dollars to Dignity as we tackle

428

the complaint that technicians

don't get enough recognition.

429

Andrew reveals why your.

430

Best people feel invisible and shares

groundbreaking research that shows

431

exactly how much positive feedback

transforms workplace culture.

432

Plus, we'll explore why promoting

your top technician might be the

433

worst decision you've ever made.

434

Don't miss the recognition revolution

coming up soon, so don't forget to

435

subscribe so you never miss an episode.

436

This is The Frictionless Workshop

Podcast, produced by podcast done for you.

437

Online all details in the show notes.