In this episode we examine the true financial impact of staff turnover within the automotive workshop environment. Andrew

Uglow reveals why losing a productive technician is the most expensive event a business can face, often costing between

one and a half to two times their annual salary. The discussion explores the hidden costs that fail to appear on standard

reports and why the industry must move beyond the myth that technicians only leave for higher pay.

Andrew explains the critical importance of the net promoter score for technicians and why current industry trends represent a

nuclear fire on the front lawn for workshop owners. The episode emphasises the three pillars of retention, recognition,

reward, and resource, and reveals why people ultimately leave managers rather than businesses. By shifting the focus from

the visible tip of the iceberg to the underlying cultural issues, Andrew demonstrates how workshops can begin to solve their

own skills shortage through better engagement.

What You Will Learn:

• Why staff turnover is the most expensive event in your workshop

• How to calculate the true cost of losing a foreman or service manager

• What the plummeting industry net promoter score means for your business

• Why the excuse of more money is often a myth in departure interviews

• How to implement the three pillars of technician retention

• Why technician satisfaction is the real solution to the skills shortage

Key Takeaways:

• Staff turnover costs between 1.5 and 3.5 times a salary off the bottom line

• People leave managers, they do not leave businesses

• 70 percent of technicians in some surveys are detractors of the industry

• Measuring staff satisfaction should be as rigorous as measuring customer satisfaction

• Recognition, reward, and resource are the foundations of a stable team

Notable Quotes:

• "The most expensive event in a workshop is technicians leaving, and more expensive than that is foreman leaving."

• "We know the reality is that people leave managers, they don't leave businesses."

• "If the technicians were satisfied, I doubt we'd have the skills shortage that we do."

• "We've been stuck playing at the tip of the iceberg... and we've missed the really important things that are less visible."

Andrew has a variety of free downloads and tools you can grab.

Discover if your workshop is Retention Worthy here or visit his website, https://www.solutionsculture.com

(https://www.solutionsculture.com) where the focus is on bringing reliable profitability to automotive workshop owners and

workshop management through the Retention, Engagement and Development of their Technical Professionals.

This podcast was produced by 'Podcasts Done for You' https://commtogether.com.au (https://commtogether.com.au) .

The hidden cost of technician turnover.

2

Join passionate automotive trainer and

coach Andrew Uglow as he unpacks the

3

massive financial impact of losing your

best staff and why the skill shortage

4

might be a satisfaction problem.

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In this episode, you'll learn why

staff turnover is the most expensive

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event in your workshop and how to

measure the true cost of losing

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a foreman or service manager.

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Discover the three pillars of

technician retention and why the

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industry's net promoter score is

a warning sign we cannot ignore.

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Along the way, you'll hear stories

about the reality of departure

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interviews and the myth that

technicians only care about money.

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I'm your co-host Anthony Pearl, and this

is the Frictionless Workshop podcast.

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Let's get cranking

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So tell me, Andrew, you've

spent a lot of time talking to a

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lot of workshops at all levels of people.

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Is there something that is the

most expensive thing that is not

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being measured and not showing

up in a report that should?

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Andrew Uglow: Yeah.

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So the most expensive event in a workshop

is Technicians leaving and, and more

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expensive than that is foreman leaving.

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And you could even argue

perhaps at that same level as

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a service manager that leaves.

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I know if you lose a-- Like

we did our own research.

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We went and engaged with some HR

professionals who play in the automotive

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space, and we went and did a bit

of track and measure to work out.

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And some of the measures were

subjective because they don't exist,

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so we had to take best available.

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But for the most part, it's somewhere

between one and a half and two times

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what their wage is off your bottom line

when you lose a good tech, like a tech

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that's productive, that's contributing.

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Uh, if you lose a foreman,

you can double that.

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It'll be somewhere between two and

a half and three and a half times

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what the foreman's wage was, and,

and service managers are similar.

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If you don't have a good 2IC or a

good foreman, so if the f-service

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manager leaves and you've got a great

second in charge who can step up, or

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you've got a great foreman who can

keep the workshop running, then y-it's

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gonna really hit your bottom line.

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One of the things that doesn't

get measured is staff turn.

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That doesn't seem to be a line item

even subjectively for, for planning

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and, and costs and projections of,

well, what happens if I lose my foreman?

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What happens if I lose a tech?

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And now w-we are starting to see that

in places like Complete Dealer Solutions

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and Errol Fernandes do those sorts of

mapping, which shout out to you, Errol,

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if you're watching, if you're listening.

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Well done.

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Crazy important.

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But I talk to a foreman and I

go, "How many techs have you

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lost in the last 12 months?"

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"Oh, we've lost six."

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Just like, "Okay, how many of

those were you happy to lose?"

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Like, some people you, you

don't want in your business.

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You want them in your competitor's

business screwing them

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over, not screwing you over.

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And for the most part, they

go, "Oh, look, five of them.

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One of them was a bit special.

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We can do without him."

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But the, the other five, you know.

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And it's like, "Well,

why did that happen?"

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And we come up with anecdotal evidence,

but there was no departure interview.

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There was no anonymous feedback

form where people can just punch

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in what they thought, vent their

spleen without any consequence.

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Now, I appreciate that if there was just

one person to leave in the last month and,

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and you got one response on the anonymous

line, chances are you, we know who it is.

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But if that's funneled through

HR and anonymized, there are some

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profoundly useful things that you

might not learn any other way.

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And I go back to this

whole track and measure.

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Well, gee whiz, you,

you wanna be doing that.

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And often the myth of technicians

just want more money comes out

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of, "Oh, why are you leaving?"

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"More money."

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"Okay, I'm sure that was

part of it, but what else?

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Did you ask that question?

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And what else?

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Do the whys and why and why and why and

what else and what else and what else?"

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We usually just stop at money.

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"Oh Because that's less

confronting, that's less painful,

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that's less, uh, personal.

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You know, we, we know the reality

is that people leave managers,

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they don't leave businesses.

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So, you know, try those shoes on for size.

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Anthony Perl: It's the

knee-jerk reaction, right?

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That's what people are primed to say, and

it's almost doesn't have any true meaning.

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It's a bit like when you meet someone in

the street and you say, "Hi, how are you?"

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You don't- you're not really

that interested in how they

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are to that full extent.

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It is- Yeah … just a knee-jerk thing

that you say, let's get into the real

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conversation or let's keep moving.

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And that's the concern, isn't it?

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When the response is,

"Oh, it's about money."

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Particularly when, you know, I know

you've talked about in, in previous

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episodes as well, the high percentage,

I think if I'm not mistaken, I think

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you said as high as 60% of techs that

wouldn't recommend the industry to others.

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So when you've got that going

on, it can't be just about money.

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Andrew Uglow: Right.

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So this comes out of the WrenchWay survey.

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Now, I just want to take

a very short diversion.

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I've just asked the question,

does net promoter score matter?

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Because in the dealer world, we used to

have CSI, customer satisfaction index,

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and a lot of manufacturers moved to

promoter score from the book Raving Fans.

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I forget who the author was.

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But they're an advocate

of net promoter score.

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I believe it was them.

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I might have my books mixed up.

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But net promoter score basically

comes down to two questions.

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You know, would you recommend us?

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Would you recommend

our service department?

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W- were you satisfied or how satisfied

were you with the service that you

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received, and would you recommend us?

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With the recommendation

being the litmus test, right?

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This is the tell-all.

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This is the dipstick, right?

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How do I know I've got oil?

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I, I measure it on a dipstick.

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How do I know that the

customer was actually happy?

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They'd recommend me.

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That was the key defining metric

for customer satisfaction and

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customer retention can I offer.

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And so different manufacturers

have different scales and scopes.

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Most manufacturers demand a positive net

promoter score, so something above zero.

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Um, arguably anything 50 and

above is considered good.

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If you can start to hit 60s and 70s,

that's really quite outstanding.

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And if you're above 70, a- and

particularly into the 80s, that

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is like worthy of adoration and a

state or a street named after you.

124

Like that is just truly epic to have an

automotive business perform at that level

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because things in the automotive world

are highly stacked against the business.

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The business can do 99.99999%

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of things right and get that

tiny fraction of a percent wrong,

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and they get smashed for it.

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And it's, it's really, it's really

sad to be honest because they got

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so much right and that 1% was really

subjective and trivial in some cases.

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So when WrenchWay came out with their

survey, and I've got it here in front

132

of me, it's called Voice of Technician

133

promoter score question for technicians

and they said, "On a scale of one to

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10, how likely are you to recommend

the technician profession to a friend?"

135

Now here's, if you're not sitting

down, can I recommend that you

136

sit down because I was shocked,

like genuinely blown away at this.

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In 2024, so two years ago in 2024, the,

the net promoter score was minus 24.

138

Now this is US-based, and there's some

elements in the US that don't cross

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over to Australia, so I appreciate that.

140

In 2025, it moved from minus 24 to minus

52, so it more than doubled backwards

141

And then in 2026, we only had a

small minor decrease of minus 60.

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So when we say minus 60, 70%

of the industry were detractors

143

and only 10% were promoters.

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So just process that for a minute.

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In the US, 70% of people who are working

as technicians in the automotive industry

146

Ace it Because that's what a detractor is.

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They would not recommend it to a friend.

148

Now, I don't know about you, but for me,

if that isn't a nuclear fire on your front

149

lawn of urgency, I don't know what is.

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Unless, of course, you don't

believe net promoter scores.

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You just go, "Oh, net promoter

scores, it's all flawed and faulty,

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and the metrics are all wrong, and

they don't this and they don't that."

153

And, and for the people who are

going, "Well, you know, Andrew, how

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do you know that it wasn't just a

bunch of really upset technicians

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who responded to the survey?"

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Something like three and a half

thousand technicians responded to this.

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This isn't just an idle, trivial thing.

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The other pushback that I hear

is, "Well, Andrew, that's America.

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They have flat rate.

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We don't have flat rate.

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They have this, we don't have that.

162

You know, we've got better conditions.

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We've got holiday pay included.

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We've got this, we…"

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And sure, I, I, I take on board

that feedback because it's true.

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Um, our technicians are wildly better off

a- as a consequence of the things that

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we have by government legislation than

what they have in the US, no question.

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And that actually shows up.

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They break down the different reasons.

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And at the same time, let's, let's

pretend just for, for a number.

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Pick a number, Anthony.

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Let's spin the wheel and pick a number.

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If the dissatisfaction with the industry

is 70% of people are saying they don't

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like it, they're very, very dis- they're

detractors, they're very dissatisfied,

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what would be a good number

f- that would correlate here?

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35% of people?

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Is that a good number?

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You know, that, that would make us -25.

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Anthony Perl: The Frictionless

Workshop podcast is brought

180

to you by Solutions Culture.

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For details on how to get in touch with

Andrew, consult the show notes below.

182

And don't forget to subscribe

so you don't miss an episode.

183

Now,

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Andrew Uglow: back to the podcast

185

Anthony Perl: Do you know what's

interesting about this as well though, is

186

that it can be one thing that is happening

in the industry overall, and another thing

187

that's happening in the workshop business

environment, and you have to kind of work

188

between those two as well, don't you?

189

You could-- You can have

dissatisfaction with the industry

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and where it's going, but you can

have satisfaction with the part that

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you're playing within it as well.

192

So I think there's how does a,

you know, how do you actually

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measure that at a local level?

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I mean, is that a big red flag

that they actually need to do that?

195

Is that the starting point for

this here in saying, "Well, we

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know this industry figure exists.

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What, what is it actually for us?"

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Andrew Uglow: Yeah, great question.

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I, I'm, I'm gonna answer that

by offering two thoughts.

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The first thought is, if I'm satisfied

in my business, if I feel recognized

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and rewarded and resourced, which are

the three big chunks, like if you want

202

to distill down what you should do f-

with your technicians, it's those three:

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recognition, reward, and resource.

204

And perhaps we can unpack

those in another session.

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But if I feel that I have the

resources I need to succeed, I am

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recognized for my success, and I'm

rewarded for my success, how could

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I be dissatisfied with the industry?

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Or better, how could 70% of people

be dissatisfied with the industry?

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So one or more of those

things aren't happening.

210

Now, I appreciate that for the US,

reward is a big challenge because of

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how they, how they do their stuff.

212

But if a dealership, and I pick any

dealership, any brand that ran net

213

promoter score, was to get a, a change

year over year double backwards like they

214

did from '24 to '25, there would be a team

from the manufacturer in that dealership

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doing a deep dive, is what we call it,

and we would be working with the service

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manager, with the service advisors.

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There would be, the business development

manager would be dragging people

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out of the dealership and putting

them on training courses to make

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sure that they know the right things

to say, the right things to do.

220

There would be technical training.

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There would be people that

don't work there anymore.

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There would be a massive effort

applied to resolving and turning

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that round because you have to.

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How can you stay in business

where 70% of the business don't

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like you, don't wanna be there?

226

Now, I appreciate industry level, sure.

227

But don't tell me there isn't a corollary

between industry level and business level,

228

'cause there, there, there has to be.

229

There cannot not be.

230

And so y- I, I go, "Let's

play devil's advocate.

231

Let's pretend that we got 0% here."

232

We weren't as bad as the US, but

we got 0%, or we got 12% positive.

233

I'm sorry, that's a good result somehow?

234

We complain about, as an industry, we

complain about the skills shortage.

235

M- maybe there's a relationship

here between satisfaction

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and, and skills shortage.

237

Now I'm- hear what I'm saying

and what I'm not saying.

238

I'm not saying pay them more.

239

Like, sure, pay them more, but I'm

not saying you have to pay them more.

240

No, no, no, no.

241

We've

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been stuck playing at the tip of

the iceberg, and we've been doing

243

all the stuff that's visible and

obvious, and we've missed the really

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important things that are less visible,

counterintuitive, and less obvious.

245

And I go back to if the technicians

are dissatisfied or there's a reason

246

for that, sure, a percentage of them

are gonna be sooky la la whingers who

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weren't hugged enough as children.

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Absolutely.

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But some of them are gonna have

genuinely authentic reasons for why

250

they feel that way, and maybe it- if

we believe customers with net promoter

251

score scores, then m- maybe we wanna

go and test our technicians and find

252

out what's really happening for them.

253

Because if they were satisfied, I doubt

we'd have the skills shortage that we do.

254

Anthony Perl: Well, that's all

we have time for in this episode.

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But if you realize today that

there's a direct relationship between

256

technician satisfaction and the

skills shortage, it's time to start

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measuring staff satisfaction with the

same rigor you use for your customers.

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And to help you put these ideas into

gear, we've put together a dedicated

259

workbook that includes a breakdown

of today's episode and specific

260

activities to help you identify if your

workshop is truly retention worthy.

261

You can download your copy right

now via the link in our show notes.

262

Make sure you check out the show notes

as well for contact information for

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Andrew and his team at Solutions Culture

to help you strengthen your leadership.

264

In our next episode, Andrew will

explore the CAMPS ecosystem, the

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customers, advisors, managers,

parts, and sales teams that act

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as time vampires for your foreman.

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We'll explain why your foreman is

getting pushed off their mark by constant

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urgency, and how service managers can

help mitigate this systematic burnout.

269

We love your comments as they help

us frame future episodes, so don't

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forget to leave them as you like,

share, and subscribe so you never

271

miss an episode on whatever platform

you're listening to us on right now.

272

This podcast is produced by my

team at podcastdoneforyou.com.au,

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helping professionals share

their expertise through

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powerful podcast content.

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Until next time, keep your workshop

running smooth and frictionless.