What happens when your life doesn’t follow the path you thought it would?

A conversation on identity, belonging, and the courage to build a career that doesn’t look right on paper but feels right in your life.

In this episode of Psychologically Speaking, I’m joined by coach and podcast host Fiorenza Rossini to explore identity, belonging, and the unexpected turns our careers can take. From financial engineering to full-time coaching, Fiorenza shares what it means to step away from “safe” career paths and build a life that aligns with your values.

We talk about the psychology of belonging, multicultural identity, working parenthood, and why so many of us feel like we don’t quite fit until we find the right spaces.

If you’ve ever questioned your career, your direction, or where you belong, this conversation will feel like a deep exhale.

We cover:

• Career pivots and “non-linear” success
• Identity shifts (especially motherhood and work)
• The psychology of belonging and community
• Why traditional paths don’t fit everyone
• What actually drives fulfilment (hint: not just money)

I went off the beaten path um completely and m my work right now is very fulfilling.

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I love it.

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Brings me so much energy and it is not at all what was expected on paper.

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It's not at all related to what I studied and it's not at all where you know, I would have

guessed I would be

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welcome to the Psychologically Speaking podcast I'm your host Leela Ainge

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And today I am delighted to have the wonderful, fiorenza Rossini with me.

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I have been a guest on

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podcast, The Belonging Podcast.

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I really wanted to bring to you lots of different stories on how people's trajectories and

careers have experienced unexpected moments.

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So, Fiorenza

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Welcome to the Psychologically Speaking Podcast.

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Thank you so much for having me, Leila.

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I'm very excited.

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oh It's probably over a year since we recorded together and spoke about imposter

phenomenon.

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So I really appreciate you coming onto my lovely podcast.

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Shall we tell the listeners what your unexpected moment is in a nutshell or your

unexpected trajectory?

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And then we'll find out a little bit about you.

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Thank you.

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So I guess my unexpected or unexpectedness um is about how I went off the beaten path um

completely and m my work right now is very fulfilling.

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I love it.

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Brings me so much energy and it is not at all what was expected on paper.

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It's not at all related to what I studied and it's not at all where you know, I would have

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I'm really interested to get into this with you.

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First of all, tell us a little bit about what it is that you do at the moment and what it

is that's bringing you so much joy.

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So I'm a professional coach and I've been in the professional coaching space since let's

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from there it's been incremental steps which very much accelerated in 2019

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Mm-hmm.

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when I left my corporate job and I moved into full-time coaching or I made coaching my

full-time work and not a side hustle anymore.

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Career growth, career development, leadership have always been my areas of interest and

what I've helped people with along the years, over the years.

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I would say perhaps this would resonate with some coaches listening.

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I very much suffered from the coach syndrome for a while.

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I want to help everyone.

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I can help everyone on these topics.

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And it's only quite recently, actually,

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um that I noticed, I observed the big pattern in front of me that actually, yeah, most of

my clients are working parents.

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We do have that in common, not that I believe it's necessary to have, you know, to do

great work together, but there was a pattern and actually, yes, working with working

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parents, supporting them throughout the career journey, or if they are...

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at a career in pivot or just starting work or going back to work after a maternity leave

or a parental leave is something that I'm passionate about, is something that gives me

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lots of energy, I love doing.

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yeah, so I'm fully embracing this clarity now that I've kind of, yes, this is happening

and...

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actually I want to embrace it.

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So very convoluted answer, I clearly need to work on my messaging a bit more.

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So what I do is...

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really clear.

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And also you're tapping into quite a recent phenomenon because up until, I mean, my mum, I

know I was born in 78 and certainly the expectation that women would go back to work after

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having children is quite a modern one really.

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You know, I'm what, 47.

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So that's less than a 50 year gap.

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Women were more often than not.

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expected to go back to work.

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And so we, I can't ask my mum, when you were, when you had a toddler, how did you juggle

childcare and this, that and the other?

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Because, you know, her childcare was different.

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She was doing different things at that time.

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yeah, I think it's what a wonderful place to be in a wonderful group of people to be

supporting.

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I think so too.

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And I also think there's more and more pressure in terms of what it needs to be, what it

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um And often we do not have a big support system or just a support system available, oh

you know.

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next door or in a 10-minute WhatsApp call.

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So it can be quite overwhelming.

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It's uh a space and moment in time when so much happens.

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There's an identity shift that happens.

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It's big, right?

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uh

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identity, it's like pretty much the single theme running all the way through my own

research and knowing those identity shifts, they're not insignificant.

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These are like, you know, they're like earthquakes.

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And to your point earlier, we might not have people in our family that we can, or with our

own parents that we can talk about it.

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I mean, we could, but they might not relate because our experience is different.

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um And so having a circle, m a supportive circle of friends and professionals is quite

important.

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um

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I became a mom at the end of 2019 and then the pandemic hit.

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So I was navigating the identity shift that came with motherhood.

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And I loved motherhood.

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I loved motherhood in a way, actually, I love it more than what I had expected, if that

makes sense.

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And also it was...

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it was a global pandemic and it was, I was always saying, we were so much at home and in

hindsight, I think if the pandemic would have happened maybe a year later, my experience

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would have been completely different.

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It is interesting isn't it to think about it and I kind of cast my mind back to where I

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I'd just moved home and actually we'd lost a lot of our structure and friendship circles.

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uh Well not lost but we'd moved physically away from them.

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So when the pandemic hit we were in a new village and we didn't really know people.

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and it was only this week I realised just how much things have changed for us so my

brother-in-law's actually literally moved in round the corner and this week I wanted to

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attend a breakfast networking event in Derby and

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I couldn't get him to, know, breakfast club wasn't going to open soon enough for me to be

able to get there in time.

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And I just said, can I drop him off for his breakfast?

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And would you drop him to work?

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And they did that.

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And you know, that's the first time I think that I felt that, I've got this local.

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family that I can use in that way.

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Of course, my mum and my dad do loads for us and wider family, know, usually around

weekends and evenings, but having somebody very local, yeah, we're all in very different

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situations, perhaps, to how generations before were.

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And I did a little bit of research on our family tree on my husband's side and all of his

family lived within like a square mile radius of each other for decades.

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So, you know, you have this, em you have that when you go back generations and yet we live

as quite a sprawled out society now, even within family groups, can often be an hour away

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from each other.

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So that idea of needing that support is really, really needed.

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So tell me a little bit then about...

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I your background, who are you and where are you from?

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And you've got your lovely accent, of course.

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So tell us all about your culture and your heritage.

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And I suppose what the expectation was about the path that you would take, she talked

about studying something very different.

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just give us a little bit of a potted history.

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All right, so I was born in France.

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I grew up in France and I have a multicultural family.

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My mom is Italian and my dad is Turkish.

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uh And so growing up, it was a mix of languages, but mostly at home we spoke Italian and

then um French outside of the home.

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um

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and I was the perfect student type of child and that led me to study math and computer

science so I have a financial engineering degree.

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Would you believe that?

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uh

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know that about you.

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think that's so cool as well.

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uh

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Sometimes people are like, oh, I didn't know you have a nerdy side of, yeah, yeah.

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And I, so I went into those studies to be honest, for two reasons.

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A, I didn't know what I wanted to do and I don't, yeah, I didn't have any ideas.

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And I...

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You know, I was like, okay, everyone else has ideas and recommendation.

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Sure.

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I'll do that That's yeah, that's what I did.

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That's my second reason I applied to a few things and then I got into that and um In in

France, so most of my studies um Have been in France and I guess when you are academic

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where when you are an academic student and you don't have it all figured out, you don't

have a vocation that you found early on, it's quite common, I think still now, for

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students to be pushed on a scientific path.

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Because then it's like doors will be open, you can choose later on, you kind of delay the

decision point, which is what I did.

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I didn't...

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quite enjoy my university years.

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It was quite um visible to me that I...

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Yeah, it didn't come easy to me.

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I had to study more than others and I didn't like the topic.

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But also the grades were fine enough and I didn't know what to do and uh I just tagged

along basically.

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Perhaps if...

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it's wild that we're expected to know what we want to do as our careers, like in our

early, well, late teens, before our prefrontal cortex has finished doing its growing

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thing, we're expected to know what we want to do when we're 70 or something.

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I just think that's wild.

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I completely agree with that.

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um Also, to be honest, I didn't really know what was possible.

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You only get told about the big professions, So medicine or a teacher, what's visible from

a child or a teenager perspective.

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Once, actually, I had a chat with...

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um

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So she's a friend, she's been a friend for like 10, 15 years now, but when we met, she

told me about this.

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So she's Dutch and so she grew up in the Netherlands.

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I don't know if this was just in her town, in a city, or whether this is widespread in the

Netherlands, but basically she finished secondary school and she didn't know what to do.

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And there was this program that she did for a year that kind of helped

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students know more about different fields, different areas in a practical way to kind of

tip your toes in it and see how you feel, how you find it to help decide what to apply for

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subject-wise if you want to carry your study.

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And I was like, wow, this is amazing because this for her really, really made a

difference.

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And it put her on a path that she was like, yeah, this one I really want to try.

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And I wish I would have had something like that, you know?

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I you know, that idea that we just should know what we want and trying to figure it out.

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And I wonder if there's something there about being, you know, a woman, about maybe some

of the expectations that were and were not given to us as we were growing up.

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I mean, that thing you said about, didn't know what I could be.

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That hits for me.

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I know when I left secondary school, I went off to do A levels in the UK and I applied to

be a teacher just because I thought, that's a profession I know that I can probably do.

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And it was only that summer because I got accepted.

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I was like, I really don't want to do that.

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I don't want to be a teacher.

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And I went on to a business and IT course.

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And again, it was that...

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of pushing myself into a place where I knew there would be more opportunity to explore

because I just didn't know what I wanted to do.

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And I had no idea then that that course actually would be the very best thing that I would

ever do.

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And it would give me so many skills that I still use today.

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But yeah, it feels like serendipity plays a large part sometimes when you've not got those

role models or

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And I do then think to myself with my own child, because I now want him to know you can

really do anything you want to do.

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I do wonder how much that might shape his trajectory in a different way to mine.

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So it's always interesting that I think when we speak to women about who told you you

could be something or how did you know you could you could do something.

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So what was your first role then?

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What was your first career choice?

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Sorry.

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okay, what you said about how our past is influencing how we are parenting, right?

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When it comes to choices, I really resonate with that.

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I'm really trying to expose my son and his only six to so many different activities for

him to change from.

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So that

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he can find something that he really likes.

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And for sure, you know, I'm trying to perhaps fill in the blanks with things that I wish I

had.

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But I didn't just, you know, there wasn't a big reason for it.

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And, yeah, perhaps in the 90s, you had less clubs available.

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It wasn't really a thing.

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It was just childcare or not childcare.

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And, yeah, I think that is definitely um shaping.

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my suggestions.

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I think there's no getting away from it.

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We probably want a lot more for our children in this generation and it probably says a lot

about what we felt was available to us.

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The world just feels bigger.

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The world feels bigger, I think, when you get older.

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So let me know a little bit then about your first career move and what you did end up

doing.

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I ended up working in a bank.

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ah

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That was, I guess, one of the usual paths what you would do after my degree.

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I worked for a bank.

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I started in risk management and then moved into, how do I describe this, kind of business

management, project type of role, which I really liked actually.

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And yeah, so that was the type of that I was doing.

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last when I decided I wanted out.

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you

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And out you went and started doing something completely different.

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So what is it do you think that is so different about, you look where you sit now and you

think, where did I expect to be versus where I am?

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What are the key differences for you?

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Hmm, that's a great question.

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I think the first thing that comes to mind is I'm really not on a traditional path and I'm

aware of that and I'm quite happy with that.

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um

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Hold on, what's the question?

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Sorry, I've lost my tune.

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Just what is the difference between perhaps what you expected your life to be to where you

are now?

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What are the differences?

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Yeah.

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So less traditional for sure.

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Whether I guess I, ideally speaking, I wish that my university years would have served a

purpose and that, I could use all that time and that I've spent learning directly in what

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I'm doing for the longterm.

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Right.

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life is what it is um and that's not the case and it's fine because it led me to corporate

life and then corporate life led me to experiencing it which led me now so that's fine.

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um The other big difference is I'm working for myself um and not for a big corporate or

just a corporate and I think that's um

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a big difference in terms of where I imagined myself to be because I was imagining myself

growing up to work for a corporate.

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I think I wasn't clear on what I would be doing because I didn't.

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But that was the picture that I was having.

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Why do you think you have that picture?

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uh My mom was freelancing and working for an organization and my dad um was contracting

and I think I was very much given, um I was very much brought up with the idea that

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ah It's just less stressful.

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It's just, you know, you just kind of breeze more easily if you're working for an

organization.

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that's glorious.

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So were your parents probably more on the freelance self-employed side or were they

working within big organisations themselves?

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So my mom was um working for an organization and then because she was a translator, she

had also some uh freelance projects.

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uh And she, I could tell and I remember just the freelance project, how much stressful

that was, like, you know, to chase for payments and just the time it took.

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and just the late nights, that sort of things.

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um And my dad was a commercial rep.

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So I'm not sure what his status was.

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He's retired now.

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um But he worked for an organization, he had a big, the valuable piece of his salary was

the piece.

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uh It was this kind of, you know, it's how much hard work you put in and how much clients

you sign that then will em lead to how much you're earning type of thing.

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real precariousness then, so you grew up knowing what precariousness in demand and sales

and that.

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kind of energy and the resources that are required to maintain a business were interesting

then, isn't it?

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That not knowing what you were going to do led you down that safety route because they

were some of the messages you were getting from your main caregivers.

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It's like, you know, choose something that gives you security.

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Yeah, yeah.

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And yeah, here I am.

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oh

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Looking the trends and going, do you know, I've got no idea when my next invoice is going

to get paid.

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What a roller coaster.

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My parents are uh very kind of...

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uh Money is a big piece for them.

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It's a strong value.

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um Which actually, obviously money is important for me.

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But it's not my driver.

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um

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I would.

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What is it that drives you?

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uh

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Community, relationships, the energy I'm getting out of things over the money.

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If I have to choose between two clients, right?

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Safe work, different energy, different pay.

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Mm.

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unless obviously there's like a 90 % difference but I would favor the one that gives me

more energy and there's more alignment and there's more um chemistry with even if that

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pays slightly less.

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I feel like this would be a really good time to ask you about your podcast because your

podcast is called The Belonging Project and I listened to it before, for quite a while

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before you invited me on and the concept of what you've done there and how you've grown

that

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series and had all the different people on it it was just so inviting to me because it's

such a great topic but what was your inspiration for I suppose asking that question out

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loud what brings you belonging what was your inspiration?

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Belonging has always been a big topic for me.

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And I would say this goes back to probably having a multicultural family, being brought up

in a multicultural family.

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I felt French mostly, most days.

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because I was born in France and I was going to school and I had all the cultural

references and I didn't have a French name.

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And that is a small detail because it's just a name and now you have people having a

foreign name, but actually they are French and that's not questioned as much anymore.

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ah But it was for me still in the 90s.

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um

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And the impact of the question, where are you from?

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Being asked by your people.

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Mm.

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is quite big or it was, yeah, it impacted me.

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way more than what I would admit in the moment and I would of course just know brush it

off and play it cool.

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Because then it you know where it was leading me was then you don't belong.

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If they're asking this question there's something about belonging here.

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So, but also just more, I guess more, more personally, I wasn't really French by blood,

right?

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And I had a mom, my mom is from a country, my dad is from another country, where does that

put me, right?

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So, and because I haven't lived other than extended holidays,

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in each of their countries, then there's also something that we can't quite share.

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Mmm.

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So yeah, so the belonging piece was, um has always been important, has always been a

spread of, it contained a spread of questions ah or reflections rather.

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And then actually when I came to the UK, um especially in London being so international, I

felt like it could be me.

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Sorry, it felt like I could be me and I could, you know, choose to be more French or

choose to be more Italian, for example.

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um Or actually really be like, no, you know what?

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I've been here, I've been here for how many years now?

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For 16 years.

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I'm in London, what do mean where I'm from?

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You know?

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So, yeah.

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I love that and I'm intrigued.

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Tell me what have you learned from listening to other people's experiences of belonging?

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What have you taken away from your podcast series?

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So the big thing is I'm not alone.

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There are so many people wondering, questioning, is it that they belong?

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And just that in itself is huge and keeps me, know, makes me do it even more and kind of

carry on doing all those, makes me carry on having all those conversations.

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um The other thing is there are so many so many points in in life personal life or

professional life that can lead to questioning your belonging um and There's no Small

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moments or big moments in a way they're just moments and um It's so rich to see the value

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that those moments can have, the impact that those moments can have for people, because

they do somehow mark a turning point a little bit, perhaps in their own reflection and

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their...

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uh

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And of course there could be some kind of trauma and healing that could happen as well on

someone's belonging journey.

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I'm very grateful that people have, my guests have trusted me with their story on the

podcast.

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um I don't take it lightly and I'm grateful for that.

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It's very therapeutic as well to have all those conversations on belonging, to be honest.

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think that's what kind of came to mind for me is like, is you're talking about, you know,

expectations and not knowing what you could be or having to explore that and thinking that

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does sit quite closely to the belonging question that you've been asking for these years

on your podcast.

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And as a social scientist and psychologist, the identity piece for me is all about social

identity.

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It's about this transition from thinking of I or me to we.

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And that's what happens when we find belonging and we find community and we see ourselves

in people.

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And you've just described that beautifully about

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I arrive in London and it's international and I can be this or I can be that.

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But then a shift again, which is I don't have to pick just one thing.

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I can probably just be me and I can claim space.

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So it is that identity piece that you said right at the start is just so powerful and the

shifts that it makes.

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So I imagine then in your coaching practice with working parents that the big identity

shifts, they're showing up quite acute.

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than in your conversations with clients.

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Yes, absolutely.

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What's fascinating is that it's not always coming up or showing up at the same time or

yeah, at the same time in the coaching journey.

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For some, it's going to show up quite early on and others middle, others more towards the

end, like a light bulb moment.

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That's very, I find it very fascinating to see that the timing is very much unique.

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um for everyone and yeah the the growth that

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The rules that comes with...

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any identity shift, I think is also uh very fascinating to look at and just to sit in that

space with is having all those kind of realizations and thoughts.

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um

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just becoming a parent in itself uh is a huge transition and identity shift.

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And often you end up adding to that something on the professional um front, right?

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Because you think, okay, my life has changed, I've changed, then something has to change

with work as well, right?

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And I completely get that.

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I've been there, I've lived that.

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um

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often people change as well, neighborhoods, town, lifestyle, right?

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So you add that element.

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um So there's a lot, there's a lot going on.

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um yeah, I think I'm so glad you picked identity for your research because there's so

much.

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I'm really interested in, you know, what is it about social identity?

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What is it about being part of a group that...

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you know, gives us something and my research specifically I'm very interested in that

freelance community.

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So what you describe, and it's interesting isn't it because your parents were almost

looking out for you and being protective and saying you know this isn't an easy path and

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you described right at the beginning I haven't taken the beat path, you know, I've not

taken the well-worn path, I've decided to probably struggle through the brambles and

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you know, and get stuck along the way or whatever and it's this idea that so many of us

choose an unconventional and a difficult path so there must be enjoyment in choosing the

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difficult and that probably talks back to that.

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sitting in that growth space and the fact that as humans we need that, we need that

challenge, we need to be uncomfortable and we can't always have safety, you know, I wonder

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what your thoughts are on that.

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I think there is so much growth that can come from sitting with the uncomfortable.

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em

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In fact, I'm not sure there's any girls that can come in sitting with the comfortable

because then you're in your comfort zone.

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You know how to do that.

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Now, if we look at, OK, if I would have stayed in my corporate career, it wouldn't only

have been comfort zone.

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Of course, I would have been stretched and growth would have happened in a different way.

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And I think at that point for me it was, but which way do I want this to be?

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um And perhaps if it wasn't the companies, the companies I ended up working for, the

sector, the industry, perhaps my past would have been completely different.

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Perhaps I would have stayed as well.

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um

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My...

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I think my values were also getting clearer and clearer.

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What I wanted to have more of every day was clear.

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And I've met some amazing people in my corporate days.

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And I really mean that.

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And overall though, as a group, they were not my people.

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That's interesting you should say that.

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How did you know?

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How did you know they weren't your people?

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I think some were exceptionally amazing.

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But overall, I don't think I've shared the same values or the same aspirations or the same

um wishes, right?

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About growth, about life, everything was a bit of a mix.

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I just think it wasn't also the industry for me.

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And...

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If we look at freelance communities, for example, or entrepreneurs communities, as you

mentioned before, it's so funny because sometimes I don't have, know, I'm in an event in

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those communities and I don't necessarily have a one-to-one connection with someone.

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and

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But the feeling I get from being in those spaces is different.

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I feel that it could be a place where I can belong.

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Hmm, it could be.

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That's interesting again, isn't it?

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That idea that, this could be for me.

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there's almost like you can see a path off to the side, but there, whereas perhaps the

corporate space felt like there was closed doors or something, you know?

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That's the image that's coming to mind as you speak.

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I think it's just fascinating and, you know, obviously that idea then that what you value,

and you talked about this earlier on, that your value isn't centered around money, but yet

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your first career was in a bank, which is financial.

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And you talk about, you know, your parents, you know, quite uh money orientated.

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And so it is interesting.

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There's probably a meshing there, isn't there, you know, sitting with somebody else's

expectations and values and going on that growth journey of your own, which was actually,

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this isn't for me.

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I don't belong here, but not because...

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you know, people are unkind or whatever, but just because I need to be somewhere else or

somewhere better for me to be in this work, there's good work for me to do, which just

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take us into the really impactful work that you do with working parents.

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So you've been doing this work, coaching work for, is it around six years now then six,

seven years?

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Yes, yes and a little bit before that when it was my cytosol as well.

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So let's call it a decade.

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What are you seeing?

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Are there any changes in the types of challenges that people are bringing to your coaching

sessions?

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I've been reflecting that myself this year, but I'm intrigued to know what other coaches

are seeing at the moment.

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Yeah, that's a great question.

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m

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So I think it's, I have to mention that because I have grown and my clients in a way have

grown as well.

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For example, when I started, I wasn't supporting working parents.

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That kind of happened progressively.

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So that's, I mean, there's a big difference there.

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Mm.

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in terms of who I'm serving and perhaps the background that clients would bring to a

coaching journey.

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The other thing that I've seen come up a lot is impact, but I want to have an impact.

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uh So yes, people want to grow on paper in the organization and they want to have an

impact.

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And I think...

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it's becoming more and more something that I hear.

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um And it's been, you know, kind of going crescendo over the last few years.

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The other thing that is coming up a lot since the end of all the pandemic lockdowns and

return to work that is often forced, sorry, return to work as an in-person in the office

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that is being forced.

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is okay, networking, I need to get back on that.

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But I don't feel that it's something that I'm comfortable in.

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How can I improve?

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can I do?

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That is coming up a lot.

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And with that, sometimes coupled with confidence in standing up in front of a crowd and

giving a presentation or um

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Yeah, just speaking up in meetings that are in person because we've been for a while um

only on zoom.

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um And then more recently around the working parents, the flexibility, the inclusion, the

belonging that moms returning to work feel uh is something that is coming up.

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oh

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Every organization is probably, you know, is unique and, you know, every organization has

challenges and things that go well.

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But for sure, what I would say is it's a common concern, if not fear, that people have,

that moms have when they are returning to work.

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You're definitely in a very vulnerable place, even if you feel stronger.

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And this oxymoron of you can do the most mind blowing thing by growing a human and pushing

them out into the world or delivering them into the world.

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And you can feel invincible in some senses, but so fragile in others.

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And that...

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that says something.

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The bit that really caught my attention and something that I'm noticing with my coaching

practice as well is that impact thing is people, yes they want to obviously be making

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money to enjoy life and to provide but it seems less centered around themselves now it

seems very much more how can I help other people, how can I make an impact and be

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sustainable and how can I do stuff for the environment and

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I do think about the world we're living in right now and all the chaos that we see over

the pond and other bits that are going on.

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And you have to think that there's such a huge space for coaches who hold space for people

to navigate that belongingness, but also to navigate how they can give back.

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and give back in a value that isn't monetary as well.

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So it's really interesting to ask different coaches.

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It's been my number one networking question whenever I come across a coach.

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What are you noticing at the moment?

431

That's a weird catch, Leila.

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I think, do you know, I have this thing where I think sometimes we're expected not to talk

to other coaches or it's seen as quite kind of not a collegiate kind of profession, but we

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learn so much from each other and some of my best business friends are fellow coaches.

434

So Christina Clark, for example, is a very good friend of mine and I learned a lot from

her coaching practice for sure.

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And by us all kind of coming together and saying what questions are our clients asking?

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and looking outward to the social and to the bigger environment that we're in, I think we

can help people get the answers that they need in a better way.

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I love working with other coaches and putting out projects together.

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I think there's a lot of energy that can come from...

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just working as a team.

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That's actually something that I miss, I will say.

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The teamwork, which can happen, but only if I make it happen.

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uh Which is fine, it's fine, but uh I make sure that it can happen.

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Because it's nice to work on a common goal, common purpose together.

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burst something, right?

445

Professionally as well.

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feel like it's resource giving as well when you do that.

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So quite often when I, oh, I haven't got time to do this and I need to, you know, maybe

reserve my resources to, for my own clients and my own profitability and that kind of

448

stuff.

449

And that's absolutely okay.

450

But I think we forget that when you team up with other people and you're sharing the load

as well, and you share the mental load, you know, you don't have to share the workload,

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but the mental load is quite nice to, to share around.

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This year I've been doing hosting a group, a Goldsprint group, and it's been really

interesting to see how we even in that space, the collaboration, even though it's not us

453

working on our projects together, but even just the collaboration of minds coming together

in that community, it's resource giving, it energizes.

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And yeah, that's the best thing about working in a company for me is the other people and

the water cooler moments.

455

But yeah, you

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have to make that work and find it, don't you?

457

You have to make space for it.

458

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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And it's a fine line because there was a point in time, I'm getting better at it now,

where I would jump into many projects, even pro bono projects, um for the sake of

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collaborating and doing something together, which is fine and can work fine.

461

but probably would work better for me at a point in time when I will have more of it,

right?

462

More time.

463

Because right now I want to spend time with my daughter who is still a toddler and it's

going to be, you know, time's going to flow, time's going to fly.

464

I can't speak today.

465

And yeah, I need to be careful what I say yes to, what I commit to.

466

And that's you coming back to balancing your values out, isn't it?

467

I knew that this conversation was going to be amazing.

468

I always enjoy our kind of conversations that we have.

469

uh really enjoyed being a guest on your podcast.

470

I am now going to shamelessly plug your podcast and tell everybody who's listening to

mine, please go and follow the Belonging Project.

471

is, I think what you're going to find there is there is such a rich back catalog of

conversations, honest, interesting conversations with people who are talking about one

472

thing in very different ways.

473

And I have learned so much by listening to those conversations.

474

Leila, and you've done it wonderfully well, way better than what I would have done, so

thank you!

475

Thank you so much for being a guest on Psychologically Speaking for this season of

exploring, you know, what happens when we allow the unexpected to happen.

476

Thank you so much, Leila, for having me here today and also for your support.

477

It really means a lot.

478

Thank you.

479

I loved that conversation with Forenza The reflection room, my group coaching space is now

alive and I want to share with you a reflection that we used with the last cohort.

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This is something that you can use no matter where you are with your goals.

481

I want to invite you to reflect on your doing decisions.

482

And you can make this an extension of where you already are.

483

So the technique here is notice, decide and do.

484

So first of all, notice what if you already created movement with over the last few weeks,

what feels easier, clearer or more natural than it has done before.

485

Next, move into decisions.

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So what does this tell you about what's working for you right now?

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at your pace and your systems or the way you're approaching your goal or actions.

488

And the next one is do.

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And this is what is one action this week that would build on that progress rather than

starting something new.

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And this is for everybody who ever tells me in coaching sessions that they have shiny

object syndrome.

491

I hope you've enjoyed this.

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If you'd like to join the reflection room, get in touch.

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I've got a couple of spaces left and we have three months of wonderful deep reflection

with a small group of dedicated individuals who I know that you're going to love spending

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time with.

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That's all for now.