In this episode of "Dare to Be More," we explore the transformative power of debating with Amelia Tchan, the 2026 Debating Captain at MLC School. Amelia shares how debating has shaped her ability to think critically, see multiple perspectives, and lead with confidence. From accidentally joining the team in year 7 to becoming captain, Amelia's journey demonstrates how co-curricular activities build essential life skills.

Featured Guest: Amelia Tchan, 2026 Debating Captain at MLC School

In This Episode, You'll Discover:

1. How debating teaches you to see issues from multiple perspectives
2. The importance of teamwork and collaboration in building strong arguments
3. Why "show don't tell" is the most effective leadership approach
4. How to balance academic excellence with co-curricular passions
5. The confidence that comes from an all-girls education environment

Key Topics Discussed:

1. The journey from accidental debater to debating captain
2. Building character through challenging experiences
3. Learning to argue positions you don't initially agree with
4. The difference between co-ed and all-girls debating styles
5. Leadership as representation and making activities accessible
6. Balancing multiple passions: law, physics, and even astronaut dreams

About MLC School: MLC School is a leading independent girls' school in Sydney, committed to empowering young women through academic excellence, character development, and innovative education. Our mission is to inspire girls to dare to be more.

Connect With Us:

1. Website: mlcsyd.nsw.edu.au
2. Instagram: @mlcsydney
3. Facebook: @MLCSchoolSydney
4. LinkedIn: MLC School

Co-host: Anthony Perl

1. Produced by: 'Podcasts Done for You'

Hashtags: #Debating #CriticalThinking #PublicSpeaking #MLCSchool #GirlsEducation #CharacterBuilding #StudentLeadership

How does debating transform young women into confident

2

thinkers and effective communicators?

3

Today I am joined by Amelia Chan

4

In this episode, we explore building

character through debating in including

5

how debating develops critical thinking

and multiple perspectives, the power

6

of teamwork and collaboration leading

by example rather than instruction.

7

And balancing academic excellence

with co-curricular passions.

8

I'm your host, Anthony Pearl.

9

Let's begin today's conversation.

10

Hello everyone and welcome to

another episode of Dare to Be More

11

and a fascinating topic we're gonna

cover today and building character.

12

And I'm so excited to have with me a

student that is joining us on the program.

13

Amelia, welcome to Dare to be more.

14

Amelia Tchan: Thank you.

15

Uh, my name's Amelia Chan.

16

I am going into year 12, so I'm a

year 11 student going into year 12.

17

I like watching movies.

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I'm really into watching and

analyzing movies, and I'm the

19

debating captain for 2026.

20

Anthony Perl: Which is a

bit of a fascinating thing.

21

We're gonna get into the

debating captain and what all

22

that means in a moment or two.

23

But I think also, just to give

people a bit of a background, we

24

were talking a little bit before

we started recording that you, uh,

25

started in the school in year seven,

so that's a fascinating way to.

26

Start the process of building character.

27

'cause you came into the school

only knowing one other person.

28

Amelia Tchan: Yeah, I did.

29

To be honest, I'd almost say

it was a good way to come.

30

I think having that one person

was obviously a safety net, so you

31

had someone to fall back on if you

ever felt like worried or anything.

32

But everyone when you got here, kind

of had their own friendship groups.

33

They'd formed pretty

tight friendships, but.

34

I don't know whether this

is true of every school.

35

I think it's probably, most kids

are generally nice, but especially

36

what I noticed was everyone was

so happy, almost like elated

37

to have these new people there.

38

They were desperate to pull you

in, or they were desperate to

39

get to know you or you know.

40

I had this one time, I was sitting

by the lockers in year seven and

41

I had a girl I'd spoken to once in

class come up to me with all of her

42

friends behind her and go, this is the

girl that I was talking to in class.

43

You know, this is the new one we

wanna, so it was a bit weird being new,

44

but it definitely wasn't scary or it

wasn't, you know, it wasn't terrible.

45

Anthony Perl: Well, it's a great

way to start building character

46

and I think this is an interesting

topic and I, I think as a.

47

Someone who's been in debating for a

while, if you were given this topic,

48

building character, I mean, what does

building character actually mean to

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you and what do you know from your own

perspective, what do you see it as?

50

Amelia Tchan: I feel like at

least when I read it, I was like.

51

To me, that means taking the base level

things of what matter to you or what make

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you, and all of those sorts of things.

53

And, and when they get put together in a

situation that's hard or in a situation

54

where you're stressed or in a situation

where it's a little bit difficult,

55

how those come together to make you a

better person on the other side of it.

56

So like.

57

When exams are tough or when things

are really stressful, or even if you're

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nervous to give a speech, that happens

all the time in debating, but that

59

it's all of those experiences that you

then figure out how to take and it, it

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builds your character in the sense that

you figure out who you actually are.

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You figure out how you deal with things.

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Anthony Perl: And take me back

to those first days of debating.

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First of all, what made

you want to do debating?

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Because that's a big thing for

a lot of people to stand in

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front of a group of people.

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Talk, let alone argue a point and

be in a competitive environment.

67

So what drew you in the first

place and do you remember what

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it was like that first one?

69

Amelia Tchan: Yeah.

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Year seven.

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I had no idea trials were on, so you

have to trial for the debating team here.

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No idea.

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They were on, and I had two of these girls

that I'd met like three days earlier that.

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We're trialing that afternoon for,

for debating, and they were like,

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oh my God, you should come along.

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It'll be so amazing.

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It'll be really fun.

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Just come with us.

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Come with us.

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And so I went with them and I trialed and

I got in and I was like, what do I do?

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I didn't even mean to, I didn't

mean to get here in the first place,

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but I'm so glad that I did because

during trials you give a fake

83

debate essentially, and you get up.

84

And that first speech that I gave and

the first topic that you get, it just.

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When you find something that you love

and when you find something that you're

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passionate about, it just clicks.

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And that was what it was for me.

88

It just clicked.

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Anthony Perl: And I gather after a period

of time, it comes a lot easier to you.

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And do you have some favorite

memories of opportunities that

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you've had around debating?

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Amelia Tchan: Yeah, no, it's a rich

opportunity, but one of my favorite

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things that we do is it started

like I think one of our first or

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second debates I did in year seven.

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We created this mascot that was like

this little cartoon frog that we draw on

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the whiteboard, the in the corner before

every debate to kinda give us good luck.

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And it became this tradition that we draw

it on this piece of paper at the end of

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the debate and give it to the opposition.

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So it was like our Good luck mascot and

we'd give it to them and we'd be like, you

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know, for fu good luck in future debates.

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And that was the second debate

I ever did in year seven.

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And I still do them to this day.

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Like I had a debate on Friday and we drew

the mascot and gave it to the opposition.

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So I feel like you build

such a tight knit community.

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Doing something that's not so niche,

but something that requires so

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much teamwork and you build such

a tight knit team that you build

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those little traditions like that.

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And I think those little traditions

are what make the community so

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strong and what make debating such

a special co-curricular to do.

110

Anthony Perl: And I think you

talk about character building and.

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Yes, there's the actual speaking part

about it, but what you just alluded

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to there, there's the teamwork.

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There's all of the things that go

into it, which build your character,

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which enable you to be able to stand

in front and actually argue a topic.

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Amelia Tchan: Yeah, a hundred percent.

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I think.

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Not to sound, you know, obviously

when you first start public speaking's

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terrifying and it definitely still is.

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Even though after you've been doing

it for so long, it still feels really

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nerve wracking to get up and speak.

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But towards the end of it, that

almost becomes the easiest part.

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I think the working together and building

an argument and when you disagree with

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each other, trying to figure out how

to still put together something that

124

is cohesive and you can all argue

collectively and at least semi believe in.

125

Ends up being the hardest

part to do, but definitely the

126

public speaking gets easier.

127

Anthony Perl: And tell me

about being debating captain.

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What does that mean to you and what do

you see that role as actually meaning?

129

Amelia Tchan: Yeah, I think at least for

me, it's more of a representative space.

130

So for the girls who are in the younger

years who are doing debating or who are

131

joining debating, the one thing that I

really wanna do in this role is kind of

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get rid of the daunting aspect to it.

133

Like we were talking about

even just a minute ago.

134

It is really scary to get up and public

speak, and I think I fully recognize that

135

it's so much easier as you keep going.

136

And I think if you can.

137

Get rid of the stereotype.

138

That debating is a terrifying

co-curricular to get into.

139

I think you get so much

more people in there.

140

So that's what the role means to me,

is not so much telling people how

141

to do things or telling people how

they should debate or teaching people

142

how to do things, but making it a

space where more people can do it.

143

That's what I really want out of it.

144

Anthony Perl: And I imagine there have

been times when you've been asked to

145

debate on a particular topic and you

haven't necessarily agreed or thought of

146

it in that particular way in the past.

147

So teaching you how to think in a

different way, I imagine there's

148

a fair amount of challenge.

149

In that and that also builds character.

150

Amelia Tchan: Oh, definitely.

151

I think you almost see that the

most in, um, because there's

152

five of you in the room who are

trying to figure out the topic.

153

Even if you don't personally disagree

with your side, there's always

154

gonna be someone in there that does.

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I mean, it's hard arguing something

that you don't believe in, but at

156

least what this has taught me is that.

157

There's always a way to frame

it in the other direction.

158

So even if on first glance you

look at it and you go, well, that's

159

wrong, or I don't believe in that.

160

Once you break it down and you

get into the nuances and the

161

complexities of it, there almost

always is something that you can see.

162

The the accuracy in or there is always

something that you can empathize

163

with, which I think means that it's

true for most things in the world.

164

Like obviously people have core

beliefs that they don't want to change

165

or that aren't changeable because

they genuinely believe in them.

166

But at least for most things, I

think there's always another way

167

to look at things, which debating

is definitely taught me how to

168

do, I think relatively well.

169

Anthony Perl: Yeah, I imagine

that any topic that comes

170

up in general conversation.

171

It enables you to kind of think about

it in a few different ways and you find

172

yourself going through those kinds of

processes when you hear a topic and

173

think, what do I actually think of that?

174

What should I think?

175

Yeah.

176

Which way should we go on that?

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Does it, do you find yourself

going through that process?

178

Amelia Tchan: Definitely, I, I

even find myself going through that

179

process when I'm having a normal

conversation at recess, all lunch.

180

I think it is almost infiltrated

to the point where I'm just like,

181

okay, I've gotta turn that part

off and I've just gotta, you know,

182

have a normal conversation now.

183

But yeah, no, it gets easier.

184

Definitely trying to think about things

in different ways and it's almost, it

185

almost makes things more interesting.

186

It feels like.

187

You're actually seeing things

for what they really are.

188

So

189

Anthony Perl: tell, tell me

as well about leadership.

190

I mean, what do you see as being your

role as a leader and how, how much

191

do you cherish that kind of concept?

192

Amelia Tchan: It's so important to me.

193

I think even, even since year

seven, my debating coaches have

194

been previous debating captains.

195

So that's always been something

that I really looked up to.

196

It's always been something that

was really important to me.

197

And to be in that role now is like insane.

198

I think the way that I look at it is

like a show, don't tell kind of vibe.

199

We ran this thing in, we ran

this thing this year at some

200

point that was talking about.

201

You get paired up with the younger

student and then you give your sides

202

to the pair and then you verse other

like kind of mixed grade teams, which I

203

think showed me exactly what I want to

be as a leader, which is I don't tell

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my younger partner exactly how to do

things or I don't tell her she's doing it

205

wrong if she does it differently to me.

206

But what I really wanna do is

show people a how I debate and I

207

guess the skill in that, but also.

208

Be just that it's really fun and you get

so much out of it, and if you embrace

209

the silliness of what you're arguing

it, it makes it a whole lot more fun.

210

So, yeah.

211

Anthony Perl: Yeah.

212

I mean, that's a great

attitude to have, right?

213

I love that.

214

Embracing the silliness.

215

Uh, but as, as a huge part of it,

because, you know, leadership's not

216

about telling people what to do.

217

It's about showing them how

to, uh, how to move forward.

218

Speaking of which, I mean, are there some

leaders that you look up to and, and that

219

might act as mentors, be they, you know,

in the school or outside of the school?

220

Amelia Tchan: Yeah, I think, obviously

I feel like most people, you ask

221

this question to are gonna say their

parents, but I think, you know,

222

the way that they have taught me

how to do things the way that they.

223

More accurately show me how to do things

is really inspiring to me because it

224

almost makes you want to do it rather

than feeling as though you're obliged to.

225

And I even think that applies.

226

I've always really looked up to Ms.

227

Gren.

228

She's head of senior school.

229

I don't know if you've spoken to

her yet, but she, at least for

230

me, she has this aura about her.

231

It makes me have this respect

for her that isn't rooted in her

232

position or in her leadership role.

233

I just genuinely.

234

Want her to think I'm a good person,

but also respect what she thinks and

235

what she says and how she does things.

236

And that's so inspiring for me in that

she doesn't have to be this really

237

scary figure or, you know, all of

that sort of stuff in order for me to

238

really respect the way that she leads.

239

Anthony Perl: I love that.

240

Tell me a little bit about

how you feel about being in

241

an all girls environment and.

242

How different that might be.

243

And indeed, I mean, when you are

debating, are you debating against

244

boys as well at times or is it,

is it strictly against girls?

245

Amelia Tchan: Yeah, we are debating co-ed.

246

So there's two competitions.

247

We do a co-ed one and then we do

an all girls one later in the year.

248

There's definitely differences, which

I'm sure would be true of an all

249

girls versus co-ed education as well.

250

I feel like that's indicative.

251

I had co-ed primary school, but I dunno

if I wanna compare it to that just

252

'cause you know, I left at age 12.

253

I feel like it's not all that

comparable, but at least.

254

In, in the only experience that I know

of being an all girls school, I love it.

255

Like, I think it's really it.

256

I don't wanna say it makes you more

confident in your answers or it makes

257

you less self-conscious, but it gives you

a platform to be like, I, my ideas are

258

extremely valuable and I, you know, if

I don't say anything then no one will.

259

And.

260

Think that's really, you can see

that in the different debating styles

261

when you're versing all boys teams.

262

It's obviously it works just

equally as just as well.

263

But there's definitely

a difference in style.

264

You know, they're a little bit louder,

they're a little bit a bit more rhetoric

265

in juice, so there's a lot more metaphors.

266

There's a lot more storytelling in

the way that they debate, which I

267

honestly think is really interesting.

268

But no, definitely being in an all

girl school, it's made me more.

269

Confident in what I'm doing and giving

me the space to pursue and figure out

270

exactly what I wanna do, rather than being

self-conscious when I'm bad at things.

271

Anthony Perl: I mean, speaking

of which, what is the vision

272

for you into the future?

273

Do you know what you want to do post

school and well into the future?

274

Beyond that?

275

Amelia Tchan: I think my problem at

the moment is not that I don't have

276

an idea, but that I've got too many

that are so different from each other

277

that I don't even know where to start.

278

I'm in the school mock trial team, so

that's, that's kind of influenced me

279

to wanna trial law and wanna, wanna

pursue that in, in being a barrister

280

and being, talking and pursuing.

281

I feel like that's very similar

to debating in that sense.

282

But I, I am really enjoying my

physics course at the moment.

283

I'm really into my sciences, so I'm like.

284

Maybe I wanna do that, that, and

then I wanted to be an astronaut

285

when I was in year five, and

I still haven't given that up.

286

So I don't know.

287

But I think the one thing is, if I can

take one takeaway from that, is like the

288

fact that MLC has given me the opportunity

to grow all of those individual passions

289

to the extent where I still can't

choose between them, because they've

290

all had such a platform to, for me to

think that they're all equally viable.

291

I'm really grateful for,

292

Anthony Perl: and we talk

about this building character.

293

How do you think that your

whole experience overall in

294

MLC beyond the basic education.

295

Has influenced the way you are and

the character and where you think it

296

will enable you to go into the future

with all of these possibilities?

297

Amelia Tchan: Yeah, I think the

opportunities that MRC has and the

298

way that they set you up for things

is just such a great baseline for

299

knowing that you can do anything.

300

So even though it's, it's, it's

because it's more easily accessible

301

or because those opportunities are.

302

Kind of given to you, or at least

semi-organized, you have this basis

303

to be like, well, I experienced X and

therefore I 100% can go on to do Y.

304

Like a little while ago I went

on a trip with my school on like

305

a relief aid trip to Borneo, and

that was the most incredible in

306

insane experience of my entire life.

307

And I think the fact that MLC was

able to give me that opportunity.

308

Meant that now I've not seen the

world, but my eyes are so much more

309

open to the things that are out there

and the things that exist and kind

310

of gives me that basis to then go out

and, and figure out how I'm gonna,

311

how I'm, what I'm gonna do with that.

312

That's not quite how I wanna

phrase it, but you know.

313

Because there's a baseline and because

everything is available, you're able

314

to pursue everything rather than just

the limited things that are available.

315

So I think, yeah, even just

the fact that it's there means

316

that you are able to access it.

317

Anthony Perl: It's amazing to

have had an experience like that.

318

And as you go into this whole opportunity

of being debating captain and HSC year,

319

all of those things that are coming,

how do you balance between the academic

320

side, the leadership side, the, you

know, extracurricular activities?

321

How do you find that balance?

322

Amelia Tchan: I think one thing I

pride myself on is I love having

323

my physical setup organized.

324

Like everything that's in my brain

has to go on paper, so what I've got

325

at least for my exam schedules and

my daily calendars and everything.

326

The second I am feeling worried or

stressed or kind of overwhelmed about

327

anything, what I do is I take it out

of my head and I put it on paper.

328

So.

329

If I've got six assessments

due within two weeks, and then

330

I'm like, what do I do here?

331

And they're all broken

into a thousand parts.

332

One thing that I would say I am

relatively good at figuring out

333

is, you know, what's my priority?

334

What's making me the most stressed?

335

What can I focus on to

make this feeling go away?

336

And kind of mind mapping it

so that I target exactly what

337

will make that feeling go away.

338

Anthony Perl: I love the way you

think and I think it's such a a, a

339

great way to approach things and it

definitely demonstrates the character

340

that you've built for yourself and

where you're going into the future.

341

It leads me to one final question we have

and we ask everyone who's appearing on the

342

podcast this question, dare to Be More,

which is the motto of the school, but

343

also the name of the podcast, particularly

in the context of building character.

344

What do you think Dare to be more means?

345

Amelia Tchan: Ooh.

346

I think, I think it means reaching

outside of your comfort zone.

347

I think it means knowing what you are,

even if what you are is great, and

348

knowing that you can always do more.

349

You can always, and, and that doesn't

necessarily mean you can always,

350

you know, get a better mark, or you

can always join a new co-curricular,

351

or you can physically do more.

352

I think it even just means know that you

can do more or you're capable of more.

353

In the way that you think, in the way

that you, in the way that you apply

354

yourself, in the effort you give to

the things that you are already doing.

355

I really like our motto.

356

It makes you think,

357

Anthony Perl: well, that is a

perfect way to end the program.

358

Amelia, thanks so much

for being a part of it.

359

Amelia Tchan: Thank you for having me.

360

Anthony Perl: Thank you for

joining us on Dare To Be More.

361

If you enjoyed this episode, please

subscribe wherever you get your

362

podcast so you never miss an episode.

363

Your likes and comments also

help more families discover

364

these valuable conversations.

365

For more information about MLC School

and their approach to girls education,

366

visit their website@cc.nsw.edu.au.

367

Check out the show notes

for more information.

368

The Dare To Be More Podcast is

produced by podcast Done for You.

369

I'm your host, Anthony Pearl,

and we invite you to join us next

370

time as we continue to explore

what it means to dare to be more.