In episode 58 of the Potential Leader Lab Podcast, we explore the evolution of leadership beyond the cult of me, using Maslow's hierarchy of human needs as a foundation.

🤔 Our Discussion 🤔

I'll share insights on the importance of self-transcendence, its connection to self-actualization, and how moving beyond ourselves in service to others can lead to meaningful fulfillment that feels effortless.

Together we'll touch on Friedrich Nietzsche’s concept of authenticity and Dan Pink's insights from his best-selling book "Drive" on motivation, aligning these ideas with the levels of Maslow's revised hierarchy. By examining the interconnectedness of various philosophies and psychological theories, my hope is that you'll gain a deeper understanding of why true leadership entails transcending personal needs to contribute to a larger purpose.

We'll also discuss practical applications of these concepts, including self-reflection, aligning your strengths with higher causes, and acting in ways that ripple outward to positively impact others.

★ Key Topics ★

• 0:31 Overview of Maslow's Hierarchy
• 01:17 Linking Self-Actualization and Transcendence
• 02:48 Maslow's Hierarchy Explained
• 03:27 Nietzsche on Authenticity
• 04:23 Psychology and Philosophy Interconnection
• 05:35 Nietzsche's Ubermensch Concept
• 07:53 Maslow on Self-Transcendence
• 09:28 Viktor Frankl's Meaning Search
• 10:32 Choosing Motivation Over Discipline
• 11:46 Aligning Improvement with Service
• 12:16 CS Lewis on Selflessness
• 13:14 Self-Centeredness vs. Connection
• 13:37 Legacy Through Self-Transcendence
• 14:57 Applying Authentic Strengths
• 15:43 Using Strengths to Contribute
• 16:32 Impact of Our Actions
• 17:09 Sustaining Self-Transcendence Actions
• 17:58 Self-Actualization and Transcendence Link
• 18:47 Beyond Individualism

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👋 Find Perry Maughmer 👋

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/perrymaughmer

Subscribe: perrymaughmer.com/podcast

Contact: perrymaughmer.com/contact

📚 Learning Resources Mentioned 📚

Drive: The Surprising Truth About What Motivates Us by Daniel H. Pink

https://amzn.to/4huFFOq

Perry Maughmer believes the world deserves better leadership; that in every human interaction there is the opportunity to either build others up or tear them down; and that leadership is the choice we make in those moments.

These beliefs led Perry to create the Potential Leader Lab. He wanted to offer those who share his beliefs the space and safety to explore transformative ideas, experiment with new behaviors, and evolve into the leaders they were meant to be and that the world needs.

This is a framework he has used again and again with his Vistage peer advisory groups and companies like Turn-Key Tunneling, Convergint, Haughn &  Associates, I Am Boundless, Ketchum & Walton, LSP Technologies, and Ahlum & Arbor.

Perry lives and works on the shores of Buckeye Lake in Ohio, in the mountains of northwest Georgia, and on the beach in Anna Maria, Florida with his amazingly creative wife Lisa. They have 2 rescue dogs and are intermittently visited by their 3 wonderful children throughout the year. Perry & Lisa are living life in crescendo and focused on exploring, experimenting, and evolving their vision of a life they have no desire to retire from.

Copyright 2025 Perry Maughmer

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#leadershipdevelopment #personalgrowth #existentialism #danielpink #perrymaughmer #leadershippodcast #podcast #leadershipdynamics #leadership #leadershipcoaching #leadershipskills #leadershiptips #leadershipinspiration #nietzsche #maslows_hierarchy_needs #maslow #viktorfrankl #danielpink #cslewis

Welcome to the Potential Leader Lab, and I am your host, Perry Maughmer. And today on episode 58, we are going to talk about the evolution of leadership beyond the cult of me. So today, we're gonna talk about, we're gonna talk about Maslow's hierarchy of human needs. Now, I've touched on this many times. I'm I'm a big fan. But we're gonna kinda maybe uncover and, discuss the overlooked ideas involved in Maslow's hierarchy. Now so Maslow Maslow's hierarchy was first introduced in 1943. He refined it in 1954, and then he also added what I'm gonna talk about today with self transcendence in 1969.

Now most of the time, you're gonna see a pyramid of Maslow's hierarchy that ends with self actualization. So what I'm what Maslow's later work posited was self transcendence not self actualization was the ultimate human need. Now remember, this is the hierarchy of human needs.

It's it's are the things that we need. Right? So how are these things connected? How are

self actualization and self transcendence connected? Well, why do we even strive to become our best self? You know, that's the question. And and really the answer is only to move beyond ourselves in service to others. And how does this transformation dissolve the need for willpower and self discipline? We'll touch on that. How does self transcendence free us from the cult of me that dominates our society today? Just pick up any social platform. And why does seeking happiness on our own best for our own self alone fail to bring fulfillment? We're gonna we're gonna talk about those things. So, Maslow's hierarchy. They're the the five levels. Now, here they are.

So at the so we go to the bottom, we go we go from the bottom to the top. Physiological needs. So the first thing I need is basic survival requirements. I need food, water, shelter, and sleep. Now once I have those, then I need safety. The need for emotional and physical security, including stability, protection, and freedom from harm. If I have that, then I go to love and belonging, connection, relationships, acceptance within social groups, family, friendships. Then esteem, self respect, recognition, sense of accomplishment.

Once I have that, then I can actually work on self actualization. The fulfillment of my own personal potential, creativity, and the pursuit of meaningful goals that align with my values. Now Maslow Maslow said we need all of those things, but we essentially need to fulfill them in order. That if we don't have physiological needs, we can't really if we're not if we don't have food and water enough to eat and drink, then we're not gonna be basic we're not gonna be focused on self actualization. And we can see that. I mean, it's not this is not a stretch. I mean, this is this is very interesting and foundational, but it makes perfect sense. I I fulfill those needs in order, and that allows me the time, the energy to focus on self actualization.

Now I'm gonna bring in a couple of different, like, side I'm a a couple of tangential kind of, concepts here that align with this. One is, Friedrich Nietzsche's concept of authenticity from existentialism. And it centers on the idea of living a life true to your own values and your own individuality and your

own instincts, rather than conforming to societal norms or external expectations. It embraces a

kind of a personal responsibility and accountability and and rejects what Nietzsche called the herd mentality and and courageously creating one's own meaning and purpose in kind of an inherently meaningless world. So I bring that in because that authenticity is like self actualization. How do I the fulfillment of personal potential creativity and pursuit of meaningful goals. So the reason I bring this other in here, we're gonna talk about some stuff by Dan Pink as well, is that this this concept kinda spans across a bunch of different platforms. And so, for me, when I see that, it adds kind of a level of gravity to the concept. When I see kind of a similar concept show up in psychology, then it shows up in business writing than it shows up in philosophy. It it's very interesting interesting to see because it adds it adds kind of, weight to it for me. Validity to it for me.

Now, Nietzsche said to transcend the herd mentality, we would you know, he he advocated for the rise of the Ubermensch or the Overman or Superman. And that's the person who's willing to reject societal norms and create their own values and live authentically by embracing the challenges and responsibilities you get from owning stuff. If you that self determination. And now this requires kind of a radical rethinking of tradition, a willingness to face discomfort and the courage to live in alignment with your own personal truths even in the face of opposition or isolation. Now, self actualization is much the same way. You're you're looking inside to become the best version of yourself, to pursue goals that are meaningful to you in alignment with your values. So there's a lot of similarities between these two things. Now, later, as I said, 1969, Maslow added self transcendence.

Now that's the drive to go beyond yourself and contribute to something greater, such as the well-being of others or some some higher purpose. Right? And Maslow actually was quoted as saying, the self only finds its actualization in giving itself to some higher goal outside of oneself. It only finds actualization in giving itself to some higher goal outside of itself. And there's a lot of nuance here and it's often overlooked because it has to do with moving outside of myself. It it's no longer me. It's no longer what see these are all needs, right? So if you if you go back through all those needs, they're very me centered. This is other centered.

And so I think this

is where I this is where I kind of coined that that phrase cult of me. That's amplified today and and, what's best for me? What do I need? What do I deserve? You listen to any any marketing, you know, you deserve this, you deserve that, you deserve this vacation, you deserve to drive that car. All of those things. Right? Now it I'm also gonna bring in Dan Pink's work in drive, where

he talks about motivation and motivations created through autonomy, mastery, and purpose. Sound familiar? You know, purpose, mastery. Well, mastery, self actualization, purpose, self transcendence. And autonomy go back to Nietzsche. Right? The will the willingness and ability to pursue something on your own. And autonomy connects the

self esteem and the self actualization because it's the freedom to make choices that fosters independence and personal growth. And then purpose resonates with self transcendence where individuals find meaning through contributing to something greater than themselves. And then finally, mastery aligns with esteem and self actualization because it achieves a

need for achievement in pursuit of one's full potential. Now now we're gonna

the whole reason for this isn't just to say, oh, there was another thing at the top of the pyramid. That's kinda silly. We wouldn't just do that. It's not just something to lay on top of it. Here's what I believe. I believe that self where self actualization self transcendence is actually a natural progression from self actualization. We can't do transcendence without actualization, but transcendence is the goal, not the actualization. Because once we've cultivated inner strength and clarity, we're compelled to direct our energy outward because now we have to do something with it that moves beyond us.

That's the key here. And the reason that's the reason that's really, really important is because self actualization alone feels incomplete because we don't have a transcendent purpose. That goes back to all the existential questions we ask ourselves. Why am I here? What's the meaning of life? All of these big questions. That is a once we figure out what is our transcendent purpose. And the hierarchy of needs is really the what, and the self transcendence part is the why. Like, I'm going through the effort to get all these because I need it. And then at the end, I'm figuring out what is now I have all this.

How do I give it back? How do I connect it to something bigger than me? Because I wanna be associated with something bigger than just myself because myself is not enough. There's not enough meaning in it. And we can actually bring in Viktor Frankl here. Right? Because there's a lot of alignment with Frankl's work along with self actualization and transcendence because his his work on the search for meaning ties into it by emphasizing the pursuit of purpose and significance as a fundamental human drive because that ties directly into Maslow. And Frankl's idea that meaning is often found in responsibility, in relationships, and growth through suffering, and that complements Pink's focus on purpose as a key motivator and underscores the existential foundation of authentic living and fulfillment. So all of these things, again, you can see elements of this in Viktor Frankl's Man's Search For Meaning, Dan Pink's book Drive, Maslow's Hierarchy of Human Needs, all the work of Friedrich Nietzsche. So now, we're we can clearly step back and go, man, there's something here. Like, all of these folks are seeing this.

And we have different words to describe it, different formulas to get to it, different diagrams, but we're talking about the same thing. We're talking about realizing our the best version of ourself in service of something greater than ourselves. And that's a that's a huge shift because I believe, if we go to motivation, where I believe because willpower and discipline will fail us, always.

We cannot rely on those things. We cannot rely on willpower and and, discipline. If we do, we're gonna lose.

So, we wanna create something in in my terminology that we cannot do. See, I don't I don't wanna force us to do it. I wanna I wanna create a scenario where we cannot not do it. And I believe that's the overlap of self actualization and self transcendence. If we look at those 2 and we see they each are a circle and we move them closer together, so there's some level of overlap between my best version of myself and what I give back to society and what I how I can be of service to other people. Once those things overlap, in that overlap, my argument is we can't not do that. It just flows effortlessly from us. I don't think of it as work.

It doesn't look like work. It doesn't feel like work. I don't have to consciously engage in it. It just it is what I do because it is who I am. And we dissolve that reliance on willpower and discipline at that point. I don't know. I no longer have to talk about motivation because I can't not do it. And self transcendence arises from deeply engaging in that reality, not escaping it.

We're not trying to get away. We're not we're not we're not trying to get away from anything. What we're trying to do is lean into what we who we are in service to other people. So why do we even do any of this? And we've touched on a couple of these things. And right now, and I I feel compelled to share the the, CS Lewis had a quote that I that just echoes through my mind all the time. And that is, we should not think less of ourselves. We should just think of ourselves less. So this isn't about not feeling important and and and being small and all those things that, you know, this is not we we have to be careful of the either or.

We have to be careful of the black and white thinking. It doesn't serve us well. So this isn't I, I am either this or I'm that. This is, How do I achieve both? Because we have an intrinsic drive for growth and mastery. And why do we even aspire to become our best selves? What what's in it for us? And my argument is is it's part of who we are. We want to become the best version of ourselves as long as we can connect it to how do we serve other people as a result. It's not just about personal fulfillment, it's about preparing ourselves to make a meaningful impact on other people. That's the reason it's all worth it.

It's hard work. Self actualization is tough work. To continually strive to become better, the bet the very the very best version of yourself is tough. It requires effort and the only reason the only thing that makes it worth it is how we can have a meaningful impact on other people. Because when we the paradox is if we focus solely on self, we diminish our capacity for deeper connection and purpose. If we're me focused, if we're involved in the cult of me, and I see myself as the center of the universe, and everything rotates around me, I am diminishing my capacity to connect, and build relationships,

and find purpose because purpose has to be outside of me. And

self transcendence allows us to create legacy, to create community,

to contribute to a shared future. I can't do that if

all I'm thinking about is me. And to be quite honest, self transcendence moves us far beyond the kind of the self centered narratives of social media and societal validation, and it shifts our focus to genuine connection and service. You don't have to worry about shouting in into the void anymore. Waving your arms about I mean, if you if you think about it, and I again, this is just one person's opinion, but if you look on any social platform, it's just imagine a 5 year old waving their arms frantically going, look at me, look at me, look

at me. Because that's essentially what we're doing. Is that building anything of meaning? Are we connecting to anything meaningful in that way?

So, here's some practical applications. So, how do we embrace self transcendence? Well, first of all, we got to go we do have to go inward to go outward, so we have to identify our authentic strengths. This will take some self reflection, personal development to uncover what you bring what you uniquely bring to the world because everybody here, everybody within earshot has something special they bring to the world. Find it, leverage it, figure it out. Spend some time. The easiest way is ask those that you care deeply about. Ask those people close to you what is unique about you? What is that thing that you bring to the world that we need? Now, then we align that with a cause or a purpose. Find find a mission or value that resonates deeply with you.

You'll know. You don't have to think. Believe me, if you have to consider it, it isn't it. When you know, you'll know. Again, we're trying to find something you cannot do. Explore opportunities to mentor or volunteer or contribute without expecting anything in return. Explore, experiment, evolve. Right? We're exploring and experimenting.

There's no right answer here. There's no one silver bullet to this thing. You don't know until you try it. You can't think your way into this. You have to act your way into it. Embrace the interconnectedness. Recognize that your actions ripple outwards and influence other people you may never see, Like, your impact goes far beyond you and the people that you talk to. The way you impact people has a domino effect that you'll never see the end of.

And, you have to consistently and continually act your way into being. And, you do that by engaging in actions aligned with self transcendence. We define ourselves and our purpose by our actions. You get to choose. You choose who you are, and you choose how you define yourself and how you continually redefine yourself. Explore your strengths, experiment with ways to give back, and evolve through that journey of service. And if you move beyond the cult of me, you're gonna get you're gonna find yourself able to build deeper, more authentic relationships and make deeper, more authentic contributions to society. So today, here's what we talked about.

Self actualization, self transcendence are not separate, but they're deeply, deeply interconnected. I would suggest that true fulfillment comes not just from becoming our best selves, but from using that growth to contribute to something larger than ourselves. I don't think seeking happiness or personal fulfillment alone will ever lead to lasting meaning. Only in transcending ourselves can we find true purpose. We saw the connectedness of Dan Pink's work and Viktor Frankl and Friedrich Nietzsche and Abraham Maslow. The whole point of this, I think when we find the overlap between self actualization and self transcendence, we tap into an intrinsic drive where purposeful action becomes effortless.

We can't not do it. The benefit? Self transcendence frees us from the societal obsession with individualism, allowing us to engage meaningfully in the world. It also releases the pressure to achieve in

the traditional sense because all we do a lot on all these platforms is compare ourselves to other people. I won't even get into how we're comparing ourselves with the fake version of other people and only their curated life, but remember Teddy Roosevelt and what he said, comparison is the thief of joy. So here's here's what I'd ask you, How can you move beyond personal achievement to create a positive impact on other people? And I'd like for you to this kind of call to action, embrace the journey of growth, not just for yourself, but for the world around you. Because as we as we know, our goal is to create a better world for those we care deeply about. I appreciate you tuning in, and I'll talk to you soon.