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Philias Bonus: The Q&A Episode
Episode 1025th July 2024 • Taboo Science • Ashley Hamer
00:00:00 00:29:34

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You requested and I delivered: I'm answering your Philias questions on the podcast. With the help of interviewer and podcast industry extraordinaire Arielle Nissenblatt, learn about the most controversial episodes, fascinating facts that didn't make it into the show, how I got people to talk about this stuff, and whether my mom listens (she absolutely does).

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Transcripts

Ashley:

Hi there, Taboo Science listeners.

Ashley:

This is a very special Q& A episode where I talk about my experience

Ashley:

making the Philias miniseries all about the science of kinks and fetishes.

Ashley:

If you're brand new to the podcast, I'd recommend pressing stop on this

Ashley:

one and listening to another just to get a feel for what this show is about.

Ashley:

You can always come back to this one if you want to.

Ashley:

The first episode of Philias is the episode entitled, How Many Kinks Exist?

Ashley:

And that's a great place to start.

Ashley:

For this episode, I recruited podcasting celebrity, Taboo Science

Ashley:

listener, and my co worker, Arielle Nissenblatt, to interview me.

Ashley:

I hope you like what you hear.

Ashley:

I'll be back at the end to let you know the future plans for the podcast.

Ashley:

Take it away, Arielle.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

My name's Arielle Nissenblatt.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

I am a big time podcast listener.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

I have a podcast recommendation newsletter called Earbuds Podcast

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Collective, and I've been working in the podcast space since 2017.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Right now, I am Ashley's coworker at Descript.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

I am on the community team there.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

So I live and breathe podcasts, both in my professional and in my personal life.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

And I am here today.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Because I am going to interview Ashley about Taboo Science.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

I have been listening for a few years now.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

I am especially a huge fan of the series that just wrapped up that

Arielle Nissenblatt:

I think we're going to be spending a lot of time talking about today.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

And I think everybody should be a fan of the show.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

So I'm here to spread the word.

Ashley:

Yay.

Ashley:

I'm super excited to talk to you.

Ashley:

So let's get started.

Ashley:

Get into it.

Ashley:

Let's go.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

So we have a bunch of questions here today, some that I

Arielle Nissenblatt:

have written, some that you have written that you kind of want to ask yourself,

Arielle Nissenblatt:

but you're going to have me do it.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Then we also have a bunch of questions from the internet, both from YouTube

Arielle Nissenblatt:

and from social media, from the people that have been following

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Taboo Science for some time now.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

So let's get started with some questions that I have for you.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

First, I think, this is front of mind for me, is why did you

Arielle Nissenblatt:

decide to do a miniseries on kink?

Ashley:

Yeah, I guess I wanted to do it because I have this really big database

Ashley:

of different topics that, um, are options for covering on the show, and I

Ashley:

started adding a lot of different kinks.

Ashley:

And I realized that I could just dive into all of them in one miniseries.

Ashley:

There's also just sort of a strategy to it.

Ashley:

I had heard that, that miniseries are a good way to like market your

Ashley:

show and to do something new and, um, get people like reinvested in it.

Ashley:

And so I thought this would be the perfect way to, uh, to kind

Ashley:

of, yeah, to figure it out.

Ashley:

And what I didn't realize, uh, overdoing a miniseries, is that it's, it's really cool

Ashley:

to start seeing the patterns between the related topics and you kind of become a

Ashley:

little bit of an expert in the thing that you're covering versus covering a bunch

Ashley:

of disparate topics and kind of having to learn on the go every single time.

Ashley:

You start to be like, oh yeah, no, I remember this fact from this other

Ashley:

topic and so we can tie them together.

Ashley:

Um, so I, I really loved it.

Ashley:

It was, it was great.

Ashley:

I, I want to do it again.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

In the past, did you do any miniseries that made you want to do

Arielle Nissenblatt:

this miniseries or is this your first one?

Ashley:

This is my first one.

Ashley:

Yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Cool.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Mini is an interesting word because you did a lot of episodes on Kink.

Ashley:

I did, yeah.

Ashley:

I guess it ended up being

Arielle Nissenblatt:

How many

Arielle Nissenblatt:

all together?

Ashley:

Nine?

Arielle Nissenblatt:

That's a lot.

Ashley:

Let me make sure.

Ashley:

Arielle Nissenblatt: That's a big miniseries.

Ashley:

Yeah, yeah.

Ashley:

I think it, I meant for it to be smaller than this and then, um, I

Ashley:

ended up, kinks just kept coming up.

Ashley:

I just had to, there were more and more that I wanted to do, so, yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Okay, so now let's get into the content

Arielle Nissenblatt:

of the miniseries on kink.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Did you have any preconceptions at the beginning of your exploration

Arielle Nissenblatt:

into these taboo topics that were shattered or that were reinforced?

Ashley:

So I think, like, I've always been very open minded about kink and, like,

Ashley:

I think it's very, you know, what people are into is, like, that's up to them.

Ashley:

It's not, you know, I'm not gonna yuck your yum, but I definitely had a few

Ashley:

that I was like, well, that one's weird.

Ashley:

Or like, that one's, I mean, people are, I don't know, I don't know about that one.

Ashley:

Like, why would anybody be into that?

Ashley:

Or, um, and I definitely had some just like judgy thoughts that

Ashley:

I just couldn't get rid of, um, about, about a few different ones.

Ashley:

And, um, I, I shattered them completely.

Ashley:

Like, I just, I mean, it completely, learning about all of these

Ashley:

kinks kind of made me realize that, like, they're all the same.

Ashley:

It's, it's all the same.

Ashley:

It's all just stuff that we're kind of, we find ways, I don't

Ashley:

want to say we're wired for it.

Ashley:

So it's like, I'm trying to figure out a better way to say it.

Ashley:

Like, we all just, we grow up, we experience the environment, we experience

Ashley:

things that turn us on, that kind of wire our brains in a new way, and

Ashley:

then we're into that thing, and then that thing is the thing that brings

Ashley:

us pleasure, and, and it's like, it doesn't really matter what it is.

Ashley:

Some people have things that are really common, some people have

Ashley:

things that are like way more niche, but they're, they're all kind of

Ashley:

just flavors of the same thing.

Ashley:

Uh, so I, I feel like now if I learn about a new kink that I've never heard of

Ashley:

before, it, it, I process it a lot better.

Ashley:

I process it of, of just like, oh cool, that's, that's very cool that,

Ashley:

that someone could be into that.

Ashley:

I, I totally understand.

Ashley:

Yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Our brains work in mysterious ways.

Ashley:

They do.

Ashley:

They do.

Ashley:

Yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

I first was exposed to the kinks beyond, you

Arielle Nissenblatt:

know, the classic ones that you hear of, like, feet, foot fetishes, which

Arielle Nissenblatt:

is, I think, your last episode.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

It was your white whale, as you called it.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

It was.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Um, and some of the other, like, I don't want to call them mainstream,

Arielle Nissenblatt:

they're not mainstream, but they're kinks for a reason, right?

Arielle Nissenblatt:

They're paraphilias for a reason.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

ABDL, I heard about for the first time listening to Dan Savage's podcast, Savage

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Love, and a bunch of other ones like that.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

I learned by listening to Dan Savage in like 2016, and I, that's what first

Arielle Nissenblatt:

exposed me to this, so I feel like me listening to Your miniseries, I

Arielle Nissenblatt:

was sort of desensitized to the, oh my god, people are into that, right?

Arielle Nissenblatt:

So it's very interesting and I'm curious how other people took it.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Did you get any people reaching out to say like, this is either

Arielle Nissenblatt:

super inappropriate or appropriate?

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Did anybody get mad?

Ashley:

So the only one that anyone ever got mad about was the zoophilia episode.

Ashley:

And a good number of people got mad about that one.

Ashley:

Really?

Ashley:

What, on YouTube?

Ashley:

On YouTube, on, I got some Instagram DMs, uh, and I think the big thing was there's

Ashley:

a consent issue there with animals.

Ashley:

Right.

Ashley:

And which I, you know, I tried my best to, to, to, you know, cover that and kind of

Ashley:

show where you did, where they, you know, where this community is coming from there.

Ashley:

Um, and I think a lot of people thought that I didn't come out

Ashley:

strong enough to say that like, it's wrong, but like, that's not

Ashley:

really what the show is there for.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

You're not an activist in this.

Ashley:

Yeah.

Ashley:

Like I'm, I'm here to humanize groups of people and I

Ashley:

humanized that group of people.

Ashley:

And that's, I mean, I, I was successful in that.

Ashley:

And I think there were still a lot of people who thought that that's not.

Ashley:

what I should have done.

Ashley:

And yeah, you know what?

Ashley:

I, like, to be completely honest, like, that's, that's still on my mind.

Ashley:

I'm still constantly processing that, because this is, some of this stuff

Ashley:

is the most controversial topics that I've ever covered in my life.

Ashley:

Uh, so that's a new skill that you have to learn.

Ashley:

that I feel like I am still learning, um, so I'm not saying that those people are

Ashley:

like 100 percent wrong, but I do feel like that's not the purpose of my show, and if

Ashley:

you want to hear a show that goes after zoophiles, you can find a ton of them.

Ashley:

There are a lot of people who are, who are against that.

Ashley:

Arielle Nissenblatt: Villainize, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Ashley:

I mean, otherwise, the feedback has been people, it's mostly people

Ashley:

emailing me saying like, this was such a humanizing episode, like, I feel

Ashley:

like I, you know, either they're in the community or they had heard about it,

Ashley:

and they just, they really appreciated how like nuanced and, um, sensitively

Ashley:

I, I covered a lot of the topics.

Ashley:

So yeah, I mean, most of the feedback has been good.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

So in past episodes, you know, all of the other taboo topics

Arielle Nissenblatt:

that you've covered leading up to this.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

What would you say, on average, how many emails would you get per episode?

Arielle Nissenblatt:

How many comments would you get on YouTube?

Arielle Nissenblatt:

And then, what I'm getting at here is, how much did it spike from this miniseries?

Ashley:

Yeah, the, the feedback has spiked a lot, uh, from this miniseries.

Ashley:

In the beginning, there still was, you know, I mean, it ramped up.

Ashley:

Um, and actually YouTube, the, I've had this whole process with YouTube

Ashley:

that maybe I'll, I'll mention too, but like, with YouTube, the The

Ashley:

feedback has just skyrocketed.

Ashley:

Yeah, generally, like, per episode, maybe I'll get two to five emails, and

Ashley:

then YouTube comments go from anywhere from 10 to, boy, I think the biggest

Ashley:

one has like 50 on it, or maybe more.

Ashley:

I haven't actually looked recently, but, um, yeah.

Ashley:

Lots of, lots of feedback.

Ashley:

Lots of, um, lot, a lot more feedback than I am used to as a podcaster, for sure.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

I think a lot of podcasters have trouble getting

Arielle Nissenblatt:

any feedback at all, but if you decide to cover a topic that you

Arielle Nissenblatt:

know a lot of people are going to have opinions about, that's one way.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

That's one way, and you do it well.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

That is one way of getting people to slide into those DMs.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Totally.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Um, Ashley, do you have one?

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Most important thing that you've learned.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Can you pinpoint a few lessons or one particular lesson?

Ashley:

Yeah, I think the biggest thing I've learned is

Ashley:

that we all experience shame.

Ashley:

I think, I think this, this podcast has really given me an education in shame.

Ashley:

Um, and that shame is something that when we experience it, our Knee jerk

Ashley:

reaction is to hide it and to cover it up and to not address it and doing

Ashley:

that causes all of the problems.

Ashley:

It's the, it makes, it just seeps into every part of your life and

Ashley:

it, it poisons your relationships and it, and it just makes it so

Ashley:

that you can't live as a full human.

Ashley:

Um, and I think that what I've learned is that if you are experiencing shame,

Ashley:

the best thing you can do is talk to someone about it that you trust,

Ashley:

either a friend, if you have someone that you trust, or, or a therapist.

Ashley:

Um, and obviously with kink, it's like you have to find the right

Ashley:

therapist because therapists can also cause, cause harm with that too.

Ashley:

But yeah, I think it's like, Shame is such a universal and um, and also the reaction

Ashley:

to shame is such a universal and I think it's, it's just I've realized like how

Ashley:

important it is to like, get that out of your system and like, because as soon as

Ashley:

you let it out into the world, it really, I think, from what I've heard from all

Ashley:

the people I've talked to is like, as soon as you get it out, you find out that

Ashley:

it's actually not as bad as you thought it was, and suddenly it dissipates.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Yeah, I mean, that's part of why podcasts like this

Arielle Nissenblatt:

and Reddit forums and other sorts of groups are so important for people to be

Arielle Nissenblatt:

able to search for online so that they don't feel alone, so that they don't

Arielle Nissenblatt:

feel like something's wrong with them.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

For sure.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

So thank you for creating.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Ashley, how did you get people to talk about such sensitive

Arielle Nissenblatt:

topics on this podcast?

Arielle Nissenblatt:

And, where I'm coming to from that is, I know that you work really

Arielle Nissenblatt:

hard to, you know, source the right guests for the right episodes.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

You, and you, and you Go after them and sometimes it takes a really long time.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

So, you had a combination in this series of like professors and people

Arielle Nissenblatt:

who've done research and then people who are advocates for the community,

Arielle Nissenblatt:

the kink community that they're in.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

So, how did you find all of those guests?

Ashley:

Yeah, so I, from the very beginning, I took my kind of template

Ashley:

from my asexuality episode, which was the first time that I had had a researcher and

Ashley:

someone from the community in the episode.

Ashley:

And I felt like it made it so well rounded and you got to hear the science,

Ashley:

but you also got to hear the emotion and like the personal experience of it.

Ashley:

And I knew that I wanted to do that with this.

Ashley:

Um, so the researchers were relatively easy as long as I could, you know,

Ashley:

convince them that I'm not a crackpot and I'm, I'm gonna make their, their research,

Ashley:

you know, make, make them look good.

Ashley:

And then, um, and the way that I did that was Every time I got another researcher

Ashley:

on board, I would just send that list to the next person, be like, I have these

Ashley:

people who are going to talk to me.

Ashley:

And sometimes they'd be like, oh, yeah, no, I, I'm a big fan of that person.

Ashley:

I'll go on your show.

Ashley:

So that really worked.

Ashley:

And then for the people to, from the community, that was something that I, I,

Ashley:

it took me a really long time to crack that because nobody wants to talk about,

Ashley:

you their private life on a podcast.

Ashley:

Uh, and so I didn't really know.

Ashley:

I, at first I was like, maybe Reddit, like maybe I can find, so I, I sent

Ashley:

some things out to people on Reddit and I never got any responses.

Ashley:

And, and I knew a few people who were into some of these things.

Ashley:

I won't say who, but like one of the, one of the people that I interviewed

Ashley:

on, on the show actually has, is like a very longtime friend of mine.

Ashley:

And I was just like, Oh yeah, definitely.

Ashley:

I'm going to talk to them about this.

Ashley:

But finally the way that I cracked it was podcasters, like.

Ashley:

Podcasters, there are already people who are podcasting about this.

Ashley:

Yeah, they're already, they're already out there.

Ashley:

Maybe their faces aren't, aren't out there, but their voices are out there.

Ashley:

And they, they seem like they would be happy to, to talk to me.

Ashley:

And that ended up being a really nice double edged sword because not only

Ashley:

were they willing to talk about it and able to talk about it, but also, you

Ashley:

know, you know, you know, of all people,

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Are you talking cross promos?

Ashley:

Yeah, like getting other podcasters on your show and then they

Ashley:

talk about it on their podcast and then other people come on to listen.

Ashley:

So.

Ashley:

That was a, that was a great, like a winning strategy that I landed on

Ashley:

that I was, I was super happy with.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Audience growth.

Ashley:

Yeah,

Arielle Nissenblatt:

yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

That's great.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Any other controversies that stand out to you?

Ashley:

I had a couple comments about the furry episode.

Ashley:

Hmm.

Ashley:

Um, just in like, like privately from people.

Ashley:

Hmm.

Ashley:

Uh, who maybe were in the community or adjacent to the community who actually

Ashley:

sort of pushed back on me saying that it's not a fetish because they're and and I've

Ashley:

I've tried to kind of wrestle with this too because it is very clear that there is

Ashley:

a furry fetish and it is very clear that like furry pornography is a huge part of

Ashley:

that community and The media has been so awful to furries that there's this, like,

Ashley:

knee jerk, like, pushback on, like, No, no, no, this is totally not a sex thing.

Ashley:

There's no sex involved.

Ashley:

Uh, this is all about just, just fun animals.

Ashley:

And it's like, um, some people kind of were suggesting that I was,

Ashley:

I didn't actually delve into the sex part as much as I could have.

Ashley:

Um, or, or even not, not delve in, but just, like, I think I was protesting

Ashley:

too much that it wasn't a sex thing.

Ashley:

Whereas, like, the sex thing actually is a bigger part of the

Ashley:

community that I portrayed and

Ashley:

yeah, um, and I think what that was just like, I really wanted to do right by my

Ashley:

guests and my guests were saying that

Arielle Nissenblatt:

there's a line.

Ashley:

Yeah, it's hard.

Ashley:

It's hard,

Arielle Nissenblatt:

right?

Arielle Nissenblatt:

There's a line.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

You're also not employed by a journalistic outlet that makes it so that you

Arielle Nissenblatt:

must equally represent both sides.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

This is up to you.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Ultimately, it's tricky.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

You can not.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

You can put disclaimers in there.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

You can say, here's my methodology.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Here's my ideology.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Here's why I'm thinking this, but that would be a boring episode.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

So you put out the episode that is entertaining and is educational and

Arielle Nissenblatt:

is respectful to the people whose time you are asking for as your guests.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

And then also your listeners.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

I think that providing them with a product that teaches them is great.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

And then obviously you are.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

admitting to some of the potential shortcomings by having this episode.

Ashley:

Yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

So let's now move to some questions from listeners.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Are you ready?

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Okay, this question comes from Paul, who is your follower on Twitter.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Paul asks, what was the most surprising thing that you learned, and what was the

Arielle Nissenblatt:

most fascinating thing that you learned?

Ashley:

Hmm, I, I learned a ton of fascinating things.

Ashley:

I think the thing that comes to mind most right now, that I actually, it

Ashley:

didn't make it into an episode, um, but I think I might make a YouTube short

Ashley:

on it or something, is that in the ABDL community, the diapers they buy, are

Ashley:

made by the same companies that make like medical supply diapers and they, these

Ashley:

companies basically, they saw that there was this community that was buying their

Ashley:

diapers not for a medical need and they were like, oh, Well, what do they want?

Ashley:

Like what we should talk to them.

Ashley:

And they did some user research and they're like, Oh, they

Ashley:

want cute pictures on them.

Ashley:

They want cute colors.

Ashley:

Like, okay, we'll do that.

Ashley:

And they made like a bunch of lines of different cute ABDL diapers,

Ashley:

which I feel like if you look at so many other industries where as soon

Ashley:

as anything, like, for example, I'm listening to a wonderful series on the

Ashley:

history of the magic wand vibrator, uh, and, and what they did, the Hitachi.

Ashley:

Hitachi makes all sorts of like kitchen machines and stuff like that, and

Ashley:

they had this personal massager that ended up becoming this, this like

Ashley:

legendary thing in the sex world.

Ashley:

And they were like, Oh, we're just going to stop making it because we

Ashley:

feel uncomfortable about that, even though it was selling incredibly well.

Ashley:

And someone actually, a different company had to, had to come in

Ashley:

and be like, do not do that.

Ashley:

Like, sell it to us.

Ashley:

We'll, we'll continue to make it.

Ashley:

Like that.

Ashley:

Like capitalism didn't save the day there, right?

Ashley:

It was just sort of like, they're like, no, no, no, we're,

Ashley:

this is associated with sex.

Ashley:

We don't want to be associated with sex, which is what so many companies would do.

Ashley:

And I think it's so cool that this diaper company was like, yeah, okay, cool.

Ashley:

We'll make some stuff for you.

Ashley:

Great.

Ashley:

More diapers for everybody.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Wow.

Ashley:

Yeah,

Arielle Nissenblatt:

that's great.

Ashley:

Yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

So that's surprising and fascinating.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Did you want to add something else?

Ashley:

Um, another one that maybe didn't make it in was that in the just

Ashley:

general Kinks 101, um, episode, Aella told me that violent porn is actually

Ashley:

most popular among women, not men.

Ashley:

And so a lot of people say, like, we need to, we need to stop violent

Ashley:

porn because it hurts women.

Ashley:

And she pointed out that, like, putting a stop to violent porn actually would

Ashley:

hurt women more because, like, they're the, they're the main consumers of this

Ashley:

stuff, which was so surprising to me, too.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

There you go.

Ashley:

Yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Wow.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

So, not only do you teach, you also learn.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Thank you to Paul for that question.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Let's go to this question from YouTube, from Jasmine Stealth 1.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

They write, After looking at this, I looked at your web, and I wonder,

Arielle Nissenblatt:

with a platform like this, and being introduced to all these things, has it

Arielle Nissenblatt:

affected your personal intimate spaces?

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Or are you just fascinated?

Arielle Nissenblatt:

And, of course, this is a very personal question.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

You can choose how much you would like to tell us, and how much you

Arielle Nissenblatt:

would like to keep to yourself.

Ashley:

Totally!

Ashley:

Uh, so yeah, basically the question is, like, Did you introduce any of this

Ashley:

into your own sex life, which I'm not.

Ashley:

No, I didn't.

Ashley:

I'll just say that.

Ashley:

I didn't like my sex life is the same.

Ashley:

Um, but what I was actually expecting was for me, not for, for my libido to

Ashley:

just tank because I was talking about all these things and like, in like this

Ashley:

very clinical way and, um, and very academic way that didn't happen either.

Ashley:

Really, nothing, nothing is different.

Ashley:

There's for me, nothing is different.

Ashley:

You just learned.

Ashley:

I just learned, I learned and I felt, uh, maybe I felt a little bit more

Ashley:

comfortable about my own sexuality, just like, because being able to talk

Ashley:

about this stuff just is, you know, it's a way to break taboos, right?

Ashley:

So, um, it, yeah, that made me, I mean, more comfortable about

Ashley:

my own sexuality in my own way.

Ashley:

Like, personal life.

Ashley:

It still sucks to talk about my podcast with, like, professional

Ashley:

colleagues, but, um, but yeah, not a lot, not a lot changed with that.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Does your family know that you made this miniseries?

Ashley:

My mom listens to every episode.

Ashley:

Which is a little, a little mortifying, um, but I do like to say she's the

Ashley:

one who taught me what circumcision was at the dinner table when we were

Ashley:

eating, uh, what were we eating?

Ashley:

Uh, okra.

Ashley:

It was okra in, in gumbo.

Ashley:

And she like, peeled off the outside of the okra to show what that, cause I, I

Ashley:

was like, I don't know, what is this?

Ashley:

No, no, she's a lawyer, but yeah, I was just, yeah, I was like, I was like a

Ashley:

tween and I was like, what circumcision?

Ashley:

She's like, well, uh, and she showed me, so she's not, she doesn't, she

Ashley:

doesn't blush about this stuff.

Ashley:

So I guess that's where I get it.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Going back to Jasmine's question about whether

Arielle Nissenblatt:

you introduced this into your life.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

I think another question we can pull from that is how did learning

Arielle Nissenblatt:

about ABDL make you feel differently about motherhood because of the

Arielle Nissenblatt:

connection to diapers, of course?

Ashley:

Right.

Ashley:

That was another one that I thought I was going to feel really uncomfortable about.

Ashley:

I, I really, when I got into it, I was like, this could, this could

Ashley:

bring up some weird feelings for me.

Ashley:

Um, and it didn't, it didn't because I'm just, I was so happy about that

Ashley:

because the thing is when I learned more about it, it's just a game.

Ashley:

It's just, it's, it's so far removed from actual babies

Ashley:

and actual, like any of that.

Ashley:

It's like, Um, I mean, I love, you know, to bring in Dan Savage, you know, kink

Ashley:

is cops and robbers with your pants down.

Ashley:

Like that's, it's a, it's a game, it's a role play.

Ashley:

Uh, it doesn't really have a lot of connection to real parenthood,

Ashley:

real babies, real diapers.

Ashley:

Um, so it actually, I was fine.

Ashley:

I was, a lot of this was like that.

Ashley:

A lot of this, I was like, oh, I don't know.

Ashley:

And then it was great.

Ashley:

It was great.

Ashley:

And then you were fine.

Ashley:

Yeah.

Ashley:

You're so resilient.

Ashley:

Actually, I will say the one that I did have to do a lot of thinking about, coming

Ashley:

back to this topic again, bazoophilia.

Ashley:

I had to, of course, I think it took me, because they, they pitched me on that.

Ashley:

And I, at first I was like, no.

Ashley:

And then.

Ashley:

I thought about it for a few weeks, and then I decided to do it was basically like

Ashley:

I had to just educate myself for a little while and kind of come around to it, which

Ashley:

I think was one of the reasons that some of these comments were frustrating because

Ashley:

I think I may have started out where they were, and then I thought about it.

Ashley:

Like, I really put in some hard work.

Ashley:

You did the thinking, yeah.

Ashley:

Yeah, and so the, I just saw that these people hadn't thought

Ashley:

about it, and it was frustrating.

Ashley:

But also, like, yeah, they just haven't had as much time with it as I have.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Yeah, they need to be exposed to it.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

And then, maybe over time, their minds open a bit.

Ashley:

Yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

But they would probably say, I don't want

Arielle Nissenblatt:

to open my mind to this, right?

Arielle Nissenblatt:

There's a lot of layers here.

Ashley:

True.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

We have one more question from a listener.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

This one comes from Oliver, who sent in the question via email.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

I'm curious whether there are any kinks slash fetishes you wanted to

Arielle Nissenblatt:

cover but couldn't, or any newly emerging kinks which need more

Arielle Nissenblatt:

research before they can be covered.

Ashley:

So there's so many kinks that need more research.

Ashley:

There are just, there are just a whole, there's a whole ocean of kinks

Ashley:

that have not been looked at at all research wise, um, and so that's,

Ashley:

that's why this is a mini series, right?

Ashley:

It's like, I can't do an entire podcast that's like 100 episodes

Ashley:

long on this, um, whereas, you know, some people, some people have.

Ashley:

Why are people into that?

Ashley:

Tina Horne's podcast that she, she just talked about on the most

Ashley:

recent episode, they do talk about.

Ashley:

different kinks, but they don't have that research angle.

Ashley:

So they, they have a little bit more freedom there.

Ashley:

But for me, I, yeah, I'm, I'm limited.

Ashley:

But one that I really wish that I had covered was actually sent in by,

Ashley:

by someone via email, was basically like, salirophilia, or like a love

Ashley:

of just, you know, gross stuff, um, which kind of goes in with,

Arielle Nissenblatt:

you alluded to that.

Ashley:

Yeah.

Ashley:

Yeah.

Ashley:

So I got, I like touched on it, but like people, you know, they, they were asking

Ashley:

about like people who buy soiled underwear on the internet, like what's up with that?

Ashley:

Or like, it's like dirty bath water or things like that.

Ashley:

Yeah.

Ashley:

Yeah.

Ashley:

And I, I, I looked into it and it's just, there isn't a lot there.

Ashley:

I would also love to do one on, on just like pee fetishes.

Ashley:

Not a lot there either.

Ashley:

Um, yeah.

Ashley:

Those are, those are the two, like, just the gross stuff, yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

That one gets a lot of coverage in media, I think,

Arielle Nissenblatt:

the pee fetish, but yeah, I guess not enough people doing research on it.

Ashley:

Yeah, I was able to do a tiny bit for that, like, sampler

Ashley:

episode that I did, but I would have loved to do a whole one.

Ashley:

Oh, well.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Okay.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Those were our questions from your audience.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Thank you to Paul, JasmineStealth1, and Oliver, much appreciated.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

And I think more people will probably have questions as they

Arielle Nissenblatt:

continue to discover your podcast.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

So where can they go to continue asking those questions?

Ashley:

Yeah.

Ashley:

Email me at ashley@tabooscience.show or just tweet at me at Taboo Science.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Awesome.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Ashley, any other questions, comments that you'd like to make before

Arielle Nissenblatt:

we close out this Q& A episode?

Ashley:

Hmm.

Ashley:

I feel like I just want to make it clear that like, I am a straight married

Ashley:

mother that, like, got into this, so it just feels, it feels very, as much

Ashley:

as I've always been interested in this, and I am a Dance Savage listener, and I

Ashley:

just like, like to think and talk about this stuff, I feel like an outsider.

Ashley:

I feel like an outsider looking in on these, these different communities, and,

Ashley:

like, I Like, at first, it started, it would, like, make me blush, and I feel

Ashley:

like I've, I've become desensitized to it a lot over, over the time.

Ashley:

Except at work.

Ashley:

Except at work!

Ashley:

And so, yeah, um, people are like, oh, what is your podcast about?

Ashley:

And I was like, let's change the subject!

Ashley:

Uh, but, um, it's been so fulfilling and great, and I've loved everyone that I've

Ashley:

met through it, um, and I, you know.

Ashley:

Yeah, it's, it's, it's changed me a bit.

Ashley:

Um, so that's been, yeah, it's been really nice.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

And you even got to tackle your white whale of

Arielle Nissenblatt:

doing an episode on foot fetishes.

Ashley:

Yes.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

So if you haven't listened to that episode yet, listeners,

Arielle Nissenblatt:

viewers, definitely go back because that's, uh, would you call that your, it's

Arielle Nissenblatt:

your white whale, it's your magnum opus.

Ashley:

It was, it was my white whale because It was first on my list.

Ashley:

I was like, obviously I'm going to do one on foot fetishes.

Ashley:

And then I just could not get anyone to respond to me to go on it.

Ashley:

And, uh, eventually I pulled it, I pulled it off.

Ashley:

I finally got, you know, Justin Lehmiller and, and Tina Horn on there.

Ashley:

But, um, yeah, it was, I was actively attempting to do that while

Ashley:

creating the rest of the season.

Ashley:

And finally, finally, I got it all together.

Ashley:

Yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

So podcasters, creators, if you have a specific

Arielle Nissenblatt:

interview in mind, keep pushing.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

You never know when it'll come through and make a really great episode.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Yeah.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

Well, Ashley, thank you so much for making this mini series and for inviting

Arielle Nissenblatt:

me to ask you questions about it.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

I really appreciate it.

Arielle Nissenblatt:

And I look forward to the next mini series and regular episodes.

Ashley:

Yay.

Ashley:

Thanks so much, Arielle.

Ashley:

This was great.

Ashley:

Thanks for listening.

Ashley:

Hope you sated your curiosity.

Ashley:

If you have more questions, definitely reach out.

Ashley:

How to do that, again, is by emailing ashley at tabooscience.

Ashley:

show or tweeting at tabooscience.

Ashley:

This is the final, final episode of Season 4, Philias, and I will be

Ashley:

taking a long break before Season 5.

Ashley:

So, if you want to stay updated on what's next, subscribe to the newsletter.

Ashley:

Just head to tabooscience.

Ashley:

show and enter your email address in the newsletter box.

Ashley:

In the meantime, why not give the show a rating and review on Apple Podcasts?

Ashley:

It'd be really nice.

Ashley:

Thank you, truly, for listening.

Ashley:

When we come back, I hope you tune in to Season 5.

Ashley:

I won't tell anyone.

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