If you’re a coach selling a high-ticket program, this might be the most important thing you read all year.

Because there’s a brand new way to close $10,000 clients. It doesn’t use sales calls. It doesn’t require a closer. And it doesn’t rely on pressure or pushy tactics.

Instead, it works by showing your dream clients exactly what it’s like to be coached by you before they ever pay a penny.

It’s working right now. It’s real. And it’s completely changing how high-ticket sales are done.

Let’s dive into how it works and why it’s so powerful.

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00:00.42

Kennedy Kennedy

Is it even possible to close high ticket coaching clients without a sales call? And even if you're not in launch, that'll be really good. And recently I found out about this guy called Brian Harris, who said he can do this without a single closer. And I was like, right, we don't really have many guests on the show, but come and talk me about that, please, Brian. So going to do that today. Let's get going.

00:49.66

Kennedy Kennedy

Happy email marketing Wednesday. We're back again here. i hope you're well, having a good one. Here's fancy how interesting. That's recently. Um, and that is less than 25% of you who tune in into this show every single week are actually subscribers to the show. So make sure if you haven't already hit subscribe right here, right now. And that may, that way I know that you're enjoying what we're doing. I also can see that you're actually gonna receive these videos showing up in your newsfeed. and Now, recently, I produced a brand new new course, all ah what and I call Email Marketing Sorted. It's all about how I took one of my programs from $27,000 in sales to over half a million dollars in sales just by sending a few more emails and triggering three psychological triggers in people's brains.

01:33.70

Kennedy Kennedy

And I thought I'd give it you for free just for tuning in on the show. So go to emailmarketingsorted.com and you can download that whole thing, emailmarketingsorted.com and download it all. So welcome to the show. We don't really have guests on the show very often these days, but I've invited a guy called Brian Harris, who's the founder of Growth Tools, where they really specialize in client acquisition for people like you and me, for coaches who have high ticket programs. And they do it specifically by not using paid advertising and social media, but literally by borrowing other people's audiences. And all that was pretty interesting when I was talking to one of his one of his guys at the in the team. But when one one of his colleagues said that they were closing high ticket offers without a single sales call, I was like, okay, I've got to speak to Brian about this and see what the hell's going on. Because come on, we'd all like to be doing that, wouldn't we? So Brian, hello, welcome to the show.

02:27.82

Bryan Harris

Thanks for having me. looking forward to chatting.

02:29.44

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah, it's great to see you. So let's get into this. Let's get straight in. I mean, you're over there at Growth Tools. You're helping people just like yourselves, basically. It's kind of meta, a bit like us, right, to to do these to do these things and to close clients. When we talk about high ticket and you're able to close them, and before we get into the methodology that you've been refining and fine-tuning, when you're talking high ticket, what's your definition? What sort of price points are you able to make this methodology work at

02:57.09

Bryan Harris

$10,000 and up. So that's kind of the minimum.

03:00.06

Kennedy Kennedy

And what sort of ceiling have you seen on this methodology?

03:05.00

Bryan Harris

I don't know we've done it long enough to notice a ceiling yet. We're about a year in. ah i would call us 90% done. but that last 10% sometimes can take longer. So let's do a follow-up in five years and I'll give you utter confidence.

03:18.88

Bryan Harris

um But mechanically, if you go to first principles of just how sales happen and how people come to hire people to coach them specifically, and that might be a thing just to sit just for a second on,

03:29.54

Bryan Harris

really have to be wise and discerning when applying different sales methodologies and marketing methodologies to different product types because they all act differently. How you sell a membership in a book and a course ah is like the buying process is just different when you hire a coach, even more so than an agency or somebody.

03:37.49

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

04:18.20

Kennedy Kennedy

Okay.

04:18.30

Bryan Harris

i don't know yearlong hundred and fifty two or thousand dollars or so

04:18.30

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

04:21.76

Bryan Harris

is just the higher the price point, the higher the trust needed for the sell to happen. ah Typically, trust is developed in two areas, time together and talking together. And you can do those in a large variety of ways. But the higher the price point, usually the more of those two things you need to get somebody to actually feel comfortable enough, paying you a lot of money to be the most intimate advisor in the core area of their life they need help on. So those are the mechanics of it. So functionally, there's no price point ceiling. Experientially, we'll report back.

04:49.18

Kennedy Kennedy

Right. Yeah. Okay. you know Obviously, we're talking about this in a way that some people might be tuning in thinking, well, the topic that I talk about is not a very revealing or intimate or personal topic. But the truth is, it all is to people. Like if it's your finances, that's bloody horrifying for some people to talk about. If it's to do with your relationships, well, it's just relationships, you might say. It's it's it's all scary. It's all intimidating. So there's a level of trust that needs to be built every time.

05:16.42

Bryan Harris

Yeah. Yeah. People don't hire coaches for things they're good at and they don't pay money for things that aren't top level problems in their life.

05:21.03

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah.

05:24.26

Bryan Harris

So just by definition of someone, even subscribing your list or listening to your show, definitely booking a call or progressing in the sales process, however that's designed for you, you know, a couple of things for sure.

05:35.30

Bryan Harris

You know, this is a top five problem in their life and you know, You're pretty sure that they're looking for something. They're not looking to do it themselves because they probably have tried that and it's failed. So they're looking for someone who's been there, done that to actually walk you through that death shadow valley that you got through successfully. Now they want somebody to walk them through it that's been there.

05:52.96

Bryan Harris

So this is a top level pain in their life and they're looking for a guide.

05:53.08

Kennedy Kennedy

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

05:57.12

Bryan Harris

And that's just by definition and an intimate thing. whether it's finances or parenting or marriage or business or pick your thing. It doesn't matter. It's intimate for them for sure. And they probably feel a lot of shame and guilt in whatever area they've recurrently failed in. Like imagine you've struggled with your weight and being in shape your whole life or eating whatever version of that you've had.

06:16.51

Bryan Harris

ah Like one thing you don't feel is a lot of confidence around that thing. And one thing you for sure feel when you talk about is a lot of shame and guilt around it. Like for sure, those are just things you experience. You're not going to invite someone in to help you with that that you don't feel comfortable with.

06:29.26

Bryan Harris

So like number job in the sales process, they need to feel comfortable in you and they need to feel confident in the path you're going walk them down.

06:35.65

Kennedy Kennedy

really interesting because the most powerful human emotion that there is, is shame. And there's nothing more powerful and potent than shame. And so if we really think about what we solve, really has to be has we have to really go through shame in order to get like, and one of the kinds of shame that people have is I've tried to solve this problem before.

07:00.31

Kennedy Kennedy

I've tried using what chat GPT told me to do.

07:00.45

Bryan Harris

Yeah.

07:03.33

Bryan Harris

Yeah.

07:03.31

Kennedy Kennedy

I've tried that coach. I've tried that program. I've tried to figure out on my own or do what my parents said or whatever these things are. And we have to really take people through the trials of shame to get through it.

07:12.48

Bryan Harris

Hmm.

07:16.91

Kennedy Kennedy

So you start talking about This is really interesting because once you realize it's shame we're dealing with, it becomes really clear on the work that's really to be done. I think so often these days, we it it's easy to think you watch the big gurus in the space and go, oh, well, all they did was a webinar and they made a gazillion dollars.

07:32.96

Kennedy Kennedy

And you go, well, it's not kind of, you you don't have their level of anything to tor reflect on.

07:39.14

Bryan Harris

And that's not true anyway. Like I've worked with most of them.

07:40.100

Kennedy Kennedy

And it's, right.

07:42.69

Bryan Harris

This is not true. That's not the story that happens.

07:44.30

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

07:45.57

Bryan Harris

Like, so just like select or delete those out of our brain.

07:46.08

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

07:49.31

Bryan Harris

Like the person who was successful in five seconds by doing the thing, that story is inaccurate. It's not life.

07:54.72

Kennedy Kennedy

yeah Yeah, it's that it it takes 20 years to have an overnight success, right? Yeah, exactly. Okay, beautiful. So you started you started touching on, I think I really want to get into, which is what are the things we need to do in order to get people to buy from us?

08:08.53

Kennedy Kennedy

Before we get into your practical, how you've applied those things. And you talked about time spent and and and they need to and and they need to have believe in you and to believe in the path.

08:19.71

Bryan Harris

Yeah.

08:20.08

Kennedy Kennedy

I'd love you to talk a bit more about that.

08:22.24

Bryan Harris

08:35.52

Bryan Harris

It's so wild if you zoom back out a minute, like when people ah work with clients nearly when I'm not doing an interview like this, I'm just working with clients one on one. And um it's kind of wild to talk to people because I think if they don't have a newsletter, they don't have a YouTube show or a podcast, they're doing something wrong.

08:50.01

Bryan Harris

And i'm like, no, this is like a new thing in all of human history to think that your business to be successful must be a content production company.

08:50.68

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah.

08:58.04

Bryan Harris

Those are two drastically different things. um So most people think about marketing as content marketing. I got to put out content that gets people to know I exist. And then over time that I'm nurture them and get them to hire me.

09:09.22

Bryan Harris

And you can do that. ah The bar for that gets higher every year. And here's your, here's your metric for it. The crazier Mr. Beast gets the more extreme and more talents needed to capture attention and keep it.

09:24.55

Bryan Harris

And he's playing that game. to the highest level in humans ever played it. um And if you want to do that, like, go for it. A thing we have found to just be liberating, to be honest, because like I played that game for a while, was good at it. And then what's needed to make that work. The bar just went past what I wanted to do and what I was good at.

09:42.34

Bryan Harris

Another thing you can think about when you think about client acquisition is There are, instead of content marketing, you think about crisis marketing. So let's say you're um're you're a marriage coach. You work with marriages in crisis. And let's say they've been married for 10 or 15 years primarily, and now they're having kids and that's putting stress. And now they're thinking about getting divorced. It seems to be a whole divorce spike about the 10 to 15 year mark when kids start getting a little older and activities pile up. So you specialize in that.

10:08.84

Bryan Harris

Okay. Two fundamentally different approaches to marketing you could take. You can start a marriage podcast and a marriage newsletter and tell people about marriage all the time. That's fine. That's good. I guess it's a very hard client acquisition channel though.

10:20.36

Bryan Harris

The other side, like think about this fundamentally. There are factually thousands and thousands and thousands of people right now actively looking for someone to save their marriage because yesterday,

10:35.14

Bryan Harris

They got in a fight for like the 12th time this month and somebody finally said the divorce word. Maybe even said they want one or they're perceive but they're progressing this in the in the ah process of getting divorced.

10:46.31

Bryan Harris

Meaning you could market to people in the slow nurture kind of way, which is cool. Or you could just find the people who are in active crisis right now. And what's cool when you market to people in crisis, a couple of things. Number one, they are by definition, highly motivated to solve the problem right now.

11:06.02

Bryan Harris

They have time urgency. They have internal motivation and a ton of pain that's going to come up and hit them in their life if they don't solve the problem. But simultaneously, they usually don't have hope.

11:17.58

Bryan Harris

They might have think it's probably not possible to save it because like we have a client, Kirsten, she works with women who just found out their husbands had a porn addiction their entire marriage.

11:23.73

Kennedy Kennedy

you

11:27.16

Bryan Harris

So imagine you're that woman. You have no idea about that whole world. Every dude does, but you don't, maybe being the woman in that marriage, you just find you've been married for this dude for 20 years and he's been looking at porn every night the entire time. like You feel deceived. You feel betrayed. You feel shame and guilt. I should have been better. I should have looked better. I should have done different. All that stuff.

11:46.60

Bryan Harris

But what are you doing right now today? You're Googling, you're searching, you're texting all your women friends, you're in all the women groups, you're talking to your church, you're talking anybody you possibly can, trying to find a guide.

11:54.82

Kennedy Kennedy

Thank you.

11:56.70

Bryan Harris

You're trying to find someone to help you because you don't know what to do, but it is a top level crisis in your life. So here is maybe thesis number one. Just find those people.

12:07.54

Bryan Harris

Because all of sales and marketing gets like an order of magnitude simpler when you're selling to people who are actively looking for you right now and have a high degree of urgency and a high degree of pain if they don't find you.

12:21.75

Bryan Harris

So like your sales and marketing skill does not need to be high when you find 10 of those people a day. Literally, can you find 10 humans a day? If you're Kirsten, who just found out yesterday that their husband been has been looking at porn.

12:33.75

Bryan Harris

If so, you will never have a marketing and sales problem and you don't even have to be good at marketing and sales. All you have to do is talk to the human, tell them they have hope, show them, here's what I did.

12:39.81

Kennedy Kennedy

Thank you.

12:50.99

Kennedy Kennedy

I often talk about it as if I don't know very much about golf, but a lot of people, when they are, when they're marketing, they start marketing the people where the ball is still on the tee rather than when the ball's right next to the hole.

12:54.52

Bryan Harris

Mm.

13:05.85

Kennedy Kennedy

Well, if you're gonna start learning to play golf, start hitting the ball that's next to the hole into the, into the hole. And this is exactly I think this is so, this is so good and to hear ah and another person sort of saying the same thing.

13:16.80

Kennedy Kennedy

And then as time goes on, and if it starts to, I'm sorry.

13:17.75

Bryan Harris

looking for you. It's fundamental. It just found the people actively looking for you right now. And there's a ton of them. Get to the other people later. Like in the book, Scientific Advertising, what's that guy's name? Eugene Swartz. He talks about the levels of awareness of the problem.

13:31.48

Bryan Harris

The hardest to market two people to people, the people that are problem unaware. They don't even know they have a problem. But most people start trying to market to those people. I'm like, good luck. You will fail. Because like it's really hard to do that.

13:41.100

Kennedy Kennedy

It's really what he was thinking about this and thinking, am I doing that? The answer is if your marketing is currently trying to show people what their problem is, and you are so far away from a person who's ready to buy, you need really deep pockets and a really long timeline to move them from, oh I understand I've got a problem I didn't realize had a problem, but i have got a problem, to actually I want to solve the problem.

13:50.52

Bryan Harris

good luck

14:04.03

Kennedy Kennedy

Oh, it's quite urgent to solve. You've got a long way to go and what we should what we all And people do this backwards, as you say, they do ask backwards, right? Because they're starting from trying to tell people they've got a problem. Fine people are already like bleeding.

14:15.71

Kennedy Kennedy

They're already hopping into the emergency room with a leg hanging off.

14:16.50

Bryan Harris

Yeah. Yeah.

14:19.27

Kennedy Kennedy

There's blood flying up the wall. You don't need to tell that guy. You probably want to have that scene him, my friend. He fucking knows.

14:24.16

Bryan Harris

Yeah. Yeah. there's people are

14:25.62

Kennedy Kennedy

He knows.

14:26.72

Bryan Harris

And best of all, when coaching them, they're surrendered. They will actually follow you.

14:31.92

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah.

14:32.12

Bryan Harris

Like, okay, so this might be awkward for minute, but like track me. The best selling book of all time and the most viral idea of all time is the Bible. So at the very least, from a marketing perspective, you should study it to understand why did that thing work?

14:44.74

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

14:44.88

Bryan Harris

Like significantly more than any other idea any humans ever had come across their brain. And if you follow the leader of that movement, his name is Jesus. Just look who we helped. Look who he spent his time with.

14:55.81

Bryan Harris

They were always the broken people.

14:58.37

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

14:58.63

Bryan Harris

Why? Did he not want to help not broken people? No, it's just really hard to help somebody resisting you. Like, it's just difficult. But like, there's this parable, think it's Luke 14. um And he he has the servant guy and there's rich wanting to throw a banquet. And he's like, all right, who should we invite to the banquet? We got this awesome, we got the food menus fixed and everything. And the catering is perfect. And the place decorated. He's like, all right, go invite all my friends. So he goes and and invites all the friends.

15:20.71

Bryan Harris

And these are like upper middle class people. And they're all like, we got things to do and businesses to take care of. And we got the kids doing activities and no. And literally everyone said no. And the servant comes back and he's like, well, what do we do now? And he's like, oh, that's easy.

15:33.09

Bryan Harris

Just go invite all of the poor, the blind, the crippled, and the lame. Go find the homeless camp around the corner and pass out brochures there. So the servant goes and does it. And he comes back and he's like, all of them said yes.

15:44.76

Bryan Harris

And he's like, I know. He's like, but we got more space.

15:46.11

Kennedy Kennedy

Thank you.

15:47.18

Bryan Harris

What do we do? He's like, go find another homeless camp and invite more of them. What's fundamentally happening there and just how that idea spread. we They just went, the first people that started spreading that, it they just went and found the people that were broken and surrendered.

16:02.15

Bryan Harris

And turns out those people follow because they're motivated. They need hope. They need help. They need a guide and they will actually follow you. um So fundamentally in our marketing and sales, just find the people that need help.

16:13.27

Bryan Harris

Don't try to find the people that don't need help. Like it's hard.

16:15.52

Kennedy Kennedy

And here's what's amazing about when you sell to those people is they also get the most amazing results because the void that you're so you're filling is so much greater.

16:22.01

Bryan Harris

By far.

16:24.96

Kennedy Kennedy

This is not a manipulative tactic that we're talking about here, Brian.

16:27.33

Bryan Harris

No.

16:28.44

Kennedy Kennedy

I don't think, and I hope not, but this is about who needs the help the most. Like who can you have the most impact for? because if that Because that's the same person who's the easiest person to sell for.

16:50.25

Bryan Harris

Like unsolicited advice doesn't work as much as we want it to work. It just doesn't. You could see the solution from a mile away. If the person doesn't want your help, it doesn't matter what you know. So all we're saying is when someone, the higher degree of pain someone is in, the easier it is to help them. And usually here's what's wild.

17:08.28

Bryan Harris

The transformation usually happens really quick. Because there's no resistance to adopting the thing. I mean, I've just coached thousands of people. This is just as true of a thing as exists. Like, here's your test. If you're married, go tell your husband or wife something you think they should do.

17:23.18

Bryan Harris

And they don't let them ask you. Just go to tell them the advice right now and just see how it works for you.

17:28.62

Kennedy Kennedy

You might need that divorce help.

17:28.84

Bryan Harris

And then you have a couple about to get divorced and tell them the same thing.

17:32.24

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

17:33.00

Bryan Harris

They'll listen. She won't. He won't. Because like they've they're open. like Literally, they're just open to receiving help. And if people aren't open, the thing that produces surrender is suffering. It just does.

17:44.06

Kennedy Kennedy

And

17:44.28

Bryan Harris

People that are suffering will actually receive help. And people that aren't, won't.

17:47.80

Kennedy Kennedy

and of course, i'm not talking about creating suffering. We're just finding the people who have already put themselves in in that position.

17:51.43

Bryan Harris

Totally. Yeah. The world's full of it. There's broken people everywhere. Broken circumstances. I have it. You have it. All of us have it.

17:57.39

Kennedy Kennedy

Right, right.

17:57.90

Bryan Harris

It's all there. Yeah.

17:58.86

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah, yeah, 100%.

17:59.39

Bryan Harris

Right.

17:59.90

Kennedy Kennedy

So this is really critical for getting into this methodology, because if we've got the wrong people going through your methodology, it's obviously not going to work half as well, 10% as well as finding the people who really need that help at that at that time.

18:14.70

Kennedy Kennedy

Okay, so let's get into the practicality of what most of us have been doing for decades. Okay. is finding that we want to have a high ticket offer of 10k or higher and we want to help people and we want to enroll them in that and the thing we've all been taught forever from all those people on youtube you know those youtube people are the worst right those people on youtube and they tell us so you need a sales team in your setter you need dudadadadada and you said no we're going to try something different because you had all of that for years

18:49.32

Bryan Harris

Yeah. ah it And I'm not anti it. It just has a whole bunch of warts and rashes and problems that come with it.

18:59.86

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah. And that's why everyone's tuning in, aren't they? Because they're like, okay, I'm experiencing the pain of keeping my sales team motivated, keeping them retained, finding them, keeping making sure they don't say naughty things that they shouldn't have promised.

19:10.28

Bryan Harris

Gigantic thing with that.

19:13.21

Kennedy Kennedy

Like, you know, all the stuff we have to do with mopping up those those people.

19:17.62

Bryan Harris

yeah And here's the worst part. If you get really, really good at it, then you'll have a whole nother set of problems because as your profile grows, the fc FTC really starts paying attention to what you're saying. And salespeople are ah in this market selling high ticket coaching.

19:28.41

Bryan Harris

It is a gigantic problem ah mechanically to manage and do well.

19:30.66

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

19:32.96

Bryan Harris

It's just not easy.

19:34.58

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

19:35.12

Bryan Harris

It's really difficult. And those people tend to be some of the highest maintenance humans on the planet. Really good salespeople.

19:39.24

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

19:40.06

Bryan Harris

They're just like like they're just difficult. ah not anti them. i love them. i'm glad they exist. But boy, if I could run a business without them and have the same things happen as with them, I would rather do it without them.

19:51.66

Bryan Harris

Just to be frank, I think every business owner would like second that motion.

19:51.72

Kennedy Kennedy

right

19:55.06

Kennedy Kennedy

Sure. and is that And is that what started this process that of creating this new methodology? was Was going, you know what? I wish we could have this result, but without having the, I'm always looking over my shoulder say thinking, what did they promise?

20:10.74

Bryan Harris

Yeah. There's definitely a variable in it. The pain level of that is reasonably high. The amount of brain RPMs you spend per day, keeping that, those numbers in check and those people doing the right thing is just a lot.

20:23.82

Bryan Harris

So not the only factor, but definitely a huge variable in it.

20:26.41

Kennedy Kennedy

Mm-hmm.

20:26.52

Bryan Harris

um

20:26.56

Kennedy Kennedy

Mm-hmm.

20:27.63

Bryan Harris

Yeah. So for us, as we started transitioning to that, the fundamental questions became like, okay, what goes into making a sell? Like, how do you go from, they don't know you exist to the new exist and hire you. And there's three fundamental components.

20:39.15

Bryan Harris

First, you got to have their eyes. They have to know you exist. They can't hire you if they don't know about you. Second, you have to have their heart. So trust, you have to have a reasonable amount of trust to hire an intimate advisor to come in and help you. And number three,

20:51.32

Bryan Harris

Once you have their eyes and hearts, then you can get their wallet, meaning you can actually transact and they can commit to hiring you and paying you money and starting the thing.

21:00.72

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah. Okay.

21:00.91

Bryan Harris

And they got to go in that order.

21:00.92

Kennedy Kennedy

Mm-hmm.

21:02.22

Bryan Harris

Eyes, hearts, then wallets. So from a marketing in a sales perspective, all your fundamental questions really, they sit in the first two areas of how will I get eyes? So what's my marketing channel? Is it going to be YouTube or SEO or ads? Or we use one called bar and other people's audiences where we find people that have already done those things and they tell them about us and it just solves those two problems itself.

21:21.68

Bryan Harris

But choose choose your adventure there. And then when it gets to the point of I'm pretty confident that person has the crisis that I solve, I'm pretty confident I could help them.

21:30.78

Kennedy Kennedy

Right. Yeah.

21:33.56

Bryan Harris

Then how am I going to invite them into being coached by me? like How is that mechanically going to happen? um So a sales call typically sits in that spot. Once someone has, we bought the ad and they've come to the webinar, the next step is have a call to handle the transaction wallet part of things.

21:50.70

Bryan Harris

um So for us, what we started experimenting with was what we've come to call seven days of free coaching. So like people will listen to this podcast and some of them will be intrigued about what we're talking about.

22:02.34

Bryan Harris

Some of them will have client acquisition problems. they're like, yeah, my number, and it's actually number one problem in businesses. Like every small business is you're at a 50 million. Any survey, Harvard, Yale, Princeton does always comes back with revenue, clients, customers.

22:13.06

Kennedy Kennedy

you

22:14.71

Bryan Harris

It's a client acquisition. Don't have to get people. I want more, more customers to hire me. um So that's the problem we solve. So some people will be listening to this, but I got that problem. I sell coaching. I'm curious.

22:25.13

Bryan Harris

How does it work? How does Bopa work? How do you borrow the people's audiences? How do you make a really good offer? It's kind of like Brian, but I don't know if I'd want him to coach me. So our next step is just go to growthstools.com slash seven days.

22:36.94

Bryan Harris

And I want to, I'm just doing this by example, by the way, so you can understand the sales process and literally go do that. And I'll train you and our coaches will coach you. We'll literally get on zoom calls daily or review your homework.

22:47.08

Bryan Harris

We'll teach you the methodologies and should give you the tools you need. And by the end of that, you will know the answer to the two questions you need to answer, which is, is the path that Brian has gone down the one I should go down.

22:51.26

Kennedy Kennedy

you

22:58.98

Bryan Harris

And as Brian and his team, the people I want to walk beside me while I do it. So a sales call answers those two questions or what we've come to replace sales calls with is seven days of free coaching where we just do the same thing.

23:11.40

Bryan Harris

It's just a bit more programmatic. And what's cool for us, we're all coaches. So we just love walking beside people, do the hardest things of their life. um And that's just what we do. We happen to do it in this topic, but it covers other things as you walk business owners.

23:22.36

Bryan Harris

um So just come walk by us for seven days. We'll show you how we've done it. You can get a feel for us personally. you can get a feel for what we teach and how we think and act. And like at the end, if you liked it, you should hire us because we're really good at those two things and you will win like as you walk beside us.

23:36.74

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

23:37.69

Bryan Harris

ah

23:38.42

Kennedy Kennedy

This is so powerful. but i mean One of the things I often ah talked about is the best way to get someone to buy from you or become a client of yours is to show them what it's like to be a client of yours.

23:51.19

Bryan Harris

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

23:51.36

Kennedy Kennedy

So so so in this ah very linear sort of way, this methodology, you've you've you're replacing people sales calls. I want to talk about your benchmarks when we talked about replacing ah in a second. So I definitely talk about because you were very, very, very um adamant to put benchmarks in place to see if this was literally replacing sales calls or actually it was just a sort of watered down alternative. and We're going to get into the numbers and how it actually works a second.

24:19.04

Kennedy Kennedy

But the step-by-step process is you get in front of an audience in some way. That could be paid ads. It could be social media. It could be borrowing other people's audiences as you teach. And you invite them to come and experience what it's like.

24:31.91

Kennedy Kennedy

So they register.

24:32.40

Bryan Harris

Yeah.

24:33.78

Kennedy Kennedy

They now come in and they get seven days of free coaching. And what's the deliverables that you do? What do you give people during the seven days of free coaching to allow them to truly experience that to the point where they're willing after seven days, a single week to go, yeah I'm willing to spend 10K plus. what What am I doing in seven days?

24:58.22

Bryan Harris

Yeah. So three deliverables. And by the way, y'all can just go to growth tools.com slash seven days and see all this on a page and you can just visually see the components or go in it if you want to and experience it. So that's probably the better way to digest it. But three main features. The first thing is training.

25:11.85

Bryan Harris

So I've done that. I'm the trainer. So I give them a video each day. Pre-recorded. That's the only thing that's pre-recorded and canned. Second deliverable is.

25:20.21

Kennedy Kennedy

Oh, let me just let you hold your back on that the set that that.

25:20.78

Bryan Harris

Yep.

25:22.81

Kennedy Kennedy

Each day there's a brand new video from you and that is unlocked each day They couldn't even binge them if they tried.

25:25.32

Bryan Harris

Mm-hmm.

25:28.81

Kennedy Kennedy

It's literally unlocked as they on each day. how long is How long is one of those videos?

25:31.09

Bryan Harris

Yep.

25:32.75

Kennedy Kennedy

10, 20 minutes.

25:33.49

Bryan Harris

10, 20 minutes.

25:34.96

Kennedy Kennedy

and there's And they've got actions and activities and stuff to do from those those trainings?

25:39.09

Bryan Harris

Yeah. And key item here, how like my goal is not to train them how to do anything actually, because they're not ready to do things yet before someone can see transformation from actions on a difficult to achieve result.

25:51.66

Bryan Harris

They have to be fully convicted of the path. So all of the curriculum, all of the coaching. Now, this wouldn't be how someone would experience it. But fundamentally, what inspires what someone will go through is the whole goal of the marketing in a sales process is full conviction of the path and full conviction of the guide.

26:08.67

Bryan Harris

That's it. If you're fully convicted to do both of the say or how to get offer and you're fully convicted, I'm a trustworthy guy to walk beside you. You for sure will hire us.

26:16.09

Kennedy Kennedy

It's like, do you like the yellow brick road and do you want to follow Dorothy?

26:16.37

Bryan Harris

i

26:19.22

Bryan Harris

that's right. There's a red brick road too. You can go down like this isn't like a one way thing in most situations.

26:22.65

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

26:23.50

Bryan Harris

So, but let me fully show you the red yellow brick road. Let me walk beside you for a while and see if you'd like it. So all of the training is belief adoption of focused. It's not um let's mechanically work on the super weedsy details because here's what happens and we've all experienced this. We might to say it differently, but And this is a problem with a lot of the content marketing, actually. It's mostly action focused.

26:45.84

Bryan Harris

And if someone just goes and does actions without being fully aware, convicted of and bought into and burn the boats of this path, as soon as it gets hard, they're going to quit and turn around.

26:56.75

Bryan Harris

Going back to Jesus for a minute, just as a placeholder for like the most viral idea in human history.

26:59.33

Kennedy Kennedy

Interesting.

27:01.32

Bryan Harris

He was like, here's the fundamental message he had. He's like, all the broken things you've experienced, just turn and follow me and they'll be well. That's like the fundamental message of the entire thing. Turn and follow and you're good.

27:09.42

Kennedy Kennedy

in just

27:11.34

Bryan Harris

Now the cost is be willing to die. So high ticket. But from that, it isn't you don't have anything to do after you follow. But if you followed me, that means just just purely pragmatically, it means you've turned from whatever other path you were on.

27:27.31

Bryan Harris

Meaning for us, you've turned from ads and now you're going down Bopa or you turn from low ticket products to high ticket products.

27:29.75

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

27:34.83

Bryan Harris

if I'm giving actions to like real mechanical, weedy actions to someone as a coach and they haven't fully committed to high ticket and Bopa, I am totally wasting their time and maybe actively harming them because it ain't, it's not going to work for sure because it will get hard. And if you haven't fully committed, like you're told it's hard enough. If you're fully committed, you're totally screwed if you're halfway committed. So like from a coaching or just an effective product standpoint,

28:03.17

Bryan Harris

Sales and marketing is about full conviction to path and commitment to guide. Anything other than that is a distraction and maybe actively hurting them because they're just going to invest money or time in things.

28:07.77

Kennedy Kennedy

you

28:13.05

Bryan Harris

And then looking for actions that produce results. And the thing that produces a result is turning from the old way to the new way and going all in and saying, it's like apply this to marriage. This is how most people approach business related things, especially client acquisition.

28:26.95

Bryan Harris

They hear about a friend and who is married. They're like, oh, marriage sounds cool. All these benefits. and we have kids and Christmas and sex, all all this all this stuff. I should go get married. I heard my friend Grant did it. Let me try it out and see how it goes for me.

28:39.17

Bryan Harris

And i I can tell you a marriage that starts like that is totally screwed.

28:39.28

Kennedy Kennedy

Thank you.

28:43.14

Bryan Harris

Zero chance success. Not because they were a bad match, not because they're bad people, not because really anything other than the mindset they brought into it is totally wrong, like fundamentally not going to work.

28:53.54

Bryan Harris

But if you date for a while, check core value alignment, check in, just do the basics. You probably find flaws for sure. And then you commit and you make it work. You go in knowing we're gonna have fights, we're probably gonna wanna quit, we're probably gonna get annoyed, we're gonna fight about sex, money, communication, all the normal stuff, but we're gonna make it work one way or another.

29:10.60

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah.

29:13.35

Bryan Harris

That marriage is gonna be fantastically well. The only difference is we, in the beginning, set the mind to the reality of what's gonna happen and fully committed to it. But most people go into these marketing channels and their business in general, like, let me try it out, see how it goes. I heard testing was smart, let me test Facebook ads. Like, please don't, you're about to flush 50 grand down the toilet.

29:32.84

Bryan Harris

Um, not because Facebook is are bad ads are bad, they're really hard, but they're doable. Um, so same thing here before, like the, all the seven days is focused on fund them foundationally.

29:45.73

Bryan Harris

Again, a client would, or a prospect would experience it differently is let me show you the path in detail and let me get you to do some things down the path so you can understand it and visualize it for you. And let me just walk beside you so you can get a good feel for me too.

29:56.36

Bryan Harris

And at the end, I would love to coach you if it was a good fit, I'd love to coach you. Here's what that would look like.

30:01.86

Kennedy Kennedy

I love it. And all the way through that, of course, you get to show your personality, whatever that might be. And when I say personality, people often think, well, I'm not whimsical and witty. Well, don't try to be whimsical and witty then.

30:12.18

Bryan Harris

Nobody wants that.

30:13.28

Kennedy Kennedy

Like be sincere or be boring.

30:13.66

Bryan Harris

Be you, man. Just be you.

30:15.56

Kennedy Kennedy

Like I don't want a whimsical or witty tax advisor. I want them to be really sincere and boring as fuck.

30:18.52

Bryan Harris

Yeah.

30:20.44

Kennedy Kennedy

Because if they're not, they're not paying attention, right?

30:20.82

Bryan Harris

Yeah. I want you to be slightly neurotic, a little OCD, kind of boring to listen to, and then I hire you.

30:22.68

Kennedy Kennedy

So you have to be legit on it. Yeah.

30:27.81

Bryan Harris

Yeah. Yeah.

30:28.01

Kennedy Kennedy

I'm high. Absolutely. Are you? Yeah, exactly. That's, that's what I'm looking for. So I think, and so you're showing your personality, you're showing your models, you're having people do activities, which allow them to understand the path to, and and to, to evoke the emotions and to really commit to the process and, and understanding that journey that we're going go on all the while identifying with you and going, Oh yeah, I like the way he describes things.

30:35.10

Bryan Harris

Mm-hmm.

30:50.02

Kennedy Kennedy

I like the way he uses that kind of metaphor, or of course the opposite. I really hate his accent.

30:54.75

Bryan Harris

Yeah.

30:55.100

Kennedy Kennedy

I hate his hair.

30:56.56

Bryan Harris

Great.

30:57.20

Kennedy Kennedy

I hate the fact he talks about this or that. um

30:59.76

Bryan Harris

Yeah.

31:00.60

Kennedy Kennedy

but i always say I always say, I would rather people find out they don't like me before they pay me.

31:05.98

Bryan Harris

Amen. Yeah. Cause I, I mean, you want to have hell on earth and coaching, go get a bunch of clients who don't like you at all. um like good luck. Like, honestly, like on this podcast, I mentioned a Jesus analogy or two, because we do that in our program. And if you absolutely are repulsed by that, I get it.

31:21.92

Bryan Harris

I used to not at all, but like, that's cool. We're going to do that a little bit. We're going to be, we're going to have church over here or anything, but like, it's just like pragmatically makes sense. Actually. You're kind of crazy not to lean into the bestselling book and bestselling idea of all time and study it at least.

31:29.82

Kennedy Kennedy

Right. Right.

31:34.56

Bryan Harris

um But like, that's fine. Like I would rather them know, but none of it like for me,

31:39.68

Bryan Harris

I'm so not interested in persuading or convincing or arm twisting anybody. It's just like truly at the heart of hearts. I have been through this valley. I know what sucking at client acquisition and being on the stress wheel of paying myself and making, I know what that's like viscerally.

31:57.62

Bryan Harris

And I know there's a line of tens of thousands of people who are entering that, like literally right now in the calendar are going through that right now.

32:04.98

Kennedy Kennedy

Absolutely.

32:06.77

Bryan Harris

And I'm just like, Hey guys, all y'all I've been through that too. Let me tell you what happened. let me just give you my testimony of going through it. It was really hard and really one of the most difficult things I've ever gone through in life.

32:19.16

Bryan Harris

There's hope you can do it. There's a bunch of paths actually you can do, but I got one. If you want to do it, I'll walk with you because man, that was terrifying.

32:27.44

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah.

32:27.54

Bryan Harris

So if if you're into that, let's go. If you're not like, great, there's plenty of people. Go find them.

32:31.27

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah.

32:32.46

Bryan Harris

and So there's like no, when you focus on crisis people, like you just don't have to do any of that stuff.

32:32.59

Kennedy Kennedy

Absolutely.

32:37.02

Bryan Harris

You can just be since be you, truly, completely you. And the people that are attracted to you will probably.

32:40.27

Kennedy Kennedy

and and it's not What I like about the going for what you call crisis people or the the people who are in the most need is they don't need motivating. They are internally motivated. So you don't need to create external marketing hype because there is internal motivation.

32:54.79

Kennedy Kennedy

There is internal urgency. There is internal scarcity. So if you're if you're really – if anyone here watching or listening –

32:59.10

Bryan Harris

Yeah.

33:03.28

Kennedy Kennedy

is thinking, I don't really like countdown timers and launching and opening and closing. If you don't like that, or you want to do that only occasionally, you want to have to not, don't have to use that every single time.

33:14.56

Kennedy Kennedy

You can appeal to the internal motivators. And the easiest way to do that is to find somebody who's already got that triggered inside of them. You know, that's,

33:21.92

Bryan Harris

than anything you could manufacture anyway. So yeah.

33:24.40

Kennedy Kennedy

Right, right. Exactly. Okay, so let's just go back to this process. so We've now got people, rather than a sales call, we've got a 10K plus offer. We've got people enrolling in our seven days of free coaching. Oh, before we do move on to the but to that actually how do we convert them? So going to have seven days of coaching. You're going to have a video from you each day with a piece of content. where You're explaining the path, sorts good stuff.

33:49.36

Kennedy Kennedy

Did you test five days and 10 days? Why seven?

33:52.62

Bryan Harris

We didn't test it. We just did seven days. It seemed about right.

33:55.49

Kennedy Kennedy

Okay, cool. Yeah, that's really good to know.

33:56.38

Bryan Harris

Yeah.

33:57.05

Kennedy Kennedy

So that's kind of variable. And I mean, I think longer than seven, you're going to end it with some drop-off.

34:00.88

Bryan Harris

I'm pushing the ends of it anyway. Like three felt too short. I'm like, what can we even do in three days? So that seemed about right.

34:05.33

Kennedy Kennedy

Right. Yeah.

34:06.94

Bryan Harris

Right.

34:06.92

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah.

34:07.18

Bryan Harris

It's actually about the sales cycle on a sales call anyway.

34:07.12

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah. And it means...

34:09.96

Bryan Harris

Like if you average out our last 10,000 calls, like, you know, it's about a five to eight day process with followups and everything.

34:09.96

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

34:16.31

Bryan Harris

So it seemed about right.

34:16.66

Kennedy Kennedy

Sure.

34:17.80

Bryan Harris

Yeah.

34:18.08

Kennedy Kennedy

seems about right. Okay. And it gives you enough time to catch up on a day if they missed the previous day's training without running out of stuff. Okay, cool.

34:23.67

Bryan Harris

Mm

34:23.72

Kennedy Kennedy

So we're getting a video from you each day where we get to dont identify with all that sort of good stuff we just talked about. And in addition to that, obviously, there's this whole idea of to spend certain amount of time, people need to have significance activated in them.

34:30.31

Bryan Harris

hmm.

34:36.80

Kennedy Kennedy

that They need to feel like they're not just a number in a crowd. They need to feel seen, which is a psychological mode of a call called significance.

34:44.12

Bryan Harris

Mm-hmm.

34:44.44

Kennedy Kennedy

You do that through two elements of coaching. Can you talk us through that little

34:49.56

Bryan Harris

Yeah. So each training has an assignment to do. They're pretty light in seven days of coaching. They're more deep work than like highly tactical, like really the extremely pragmatic business things that are underpinning. But anyway, at the end of each training, I give you an assignment.

35:03.04

Bryan Harris

You post your assignment and our coach, we have two people that do this coaching. ah They go and give you a loom like video feedback on that element. So you get personal one-on-one video feedback on each assignment.

35:16.23

Bryan Harris

The second, the third thing. So we get training. assignment review. And usually that's done within a few hours.

35:19.100

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah. Mm-hmm.

35:21.26

Bryan Harris

So you don't have to wait very long at all. They're in there doing that every day. It's all they do. And the third thing is, um live office hours. So each day we have a live 30 minute Zoom session.

35:30.50

Bryan Harris

We just keep the schedule. We host this in circle just because it's a good container for all of it. So we just go live on Zoom. Like we're optimizing for time with you and talking to you. And the more different ways I can spend time with you, you can see my face and I can see your face and we can talk asynchronously or synchronously the better.

35:44.75

Bryan Harris

Because that's just warming you up to the guide and helping you understand the path clear, which are you know the two optimization points. So those are the three elements. Training that leads to an assignment review that leads to office hours every day.

35:55.94

Kennedy Kennedy

And this is all happening in inside of a circle, so a community environment as well. So I guess there's also an element that's that I'm not the only person suffering with the thing you solve.

36:04.04

Bryan Harris

Yeah. Makes a big difference.

36:04.100

Kennedy Kennedy

Like this is a common problem. that Therefore, I've got hope.

36:07.02

Bryan Harris

Yep.

36:08.76

Kennedy Kennedy

Other people have gone through this. Therefore, it is a proven path. So it actually has social proof built into the very fact that it's delivered through a community, right?

36:17.78

Bryan Harris

Yep. That's right. I used to resist that. i actually went years and years and years without any community element to my coaching at all.

36:23.64

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

36:23.76

Bryan Harris

And that that was stupid in retrospect. ah I mean, it's like single parenting. and a child as a hermit in the woods, like that child's going to be weird. There's no way around it.

36:36.58

Bryan Harris

like We are built for community. We just are like, you need it in parenting. you Every human needs it. Or you wind up with these, like I'm in a men's group every Tuesday. yesterday was tuesday and i had a knockdown drag out one of the dudes and it was needed it was good it refined me it refined him but like we needed that conflict you can see it when people don't have community will smith getting up and slapping chris rock a few years ago here's what i know for sure about will smith that dude has nobody that'll call him out on anything because the second he got called out he lost his mind i'm like what are you doing dude like

37:09.48

Bryan Harris

You don't have dudes who make fun of you enough. You don't have dudes that will call you out on being an idiot. Because if cause if you did, that wouldn't have triggered you like that.

37:17.48

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

37:17.86

Bryan Harris

So like we do weird things when we're not around other people, especially if it's a big, hairy result we're going after. Having a great marriage, having our personal finances master.

37:29.14

Bryan Harris

Growing a business, man, those are hard problems to solve. Like, and they take time. They take months and years to master. And if you're doing that by yourself, just practically about three to six months in, you' would have been fully convicted of the path. You'll be fully convicted of the guide about six months in. If all you have is the guide helping you, that's it.

37:49.02

Bryan Harris

You'll hit hard spot and you'll almost for sure quit because you're talking yourself into all these lies and all these stories that aren't true, but like, You know, if all you have is your parent telling you there's only so much my 10 year old and eight year old and six year old will listen to me.

38:01.66

Bryan Harris

I need the kids on the bus to make fun of them. I need the parents in the neighborhood to help parent them. as I need a community like actually to help them, not some marketing tactic like for the actual result to happen.

38:09.67

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah. Yeah.

38:11.30

Bryan Harris

I need other humans in your life telling the same thing in different ways that you actually hear. So anyway, that's a long answer to say, yes, you need that.

38:18.83

Kennedy Kennedy

you do You do need that. Okay, that's awesome. So we've got them now in a community, which means they're also not being an echo chamber of in in an echo chamber of their own thoughts. Because when they're echo chamber of their own thoughts are are negative because this is getting hard, or I've never thought about about this before, or this is challenging it's different.

38:30.52

Bryan Harris

me

38:33.23

Kennedy Kennedy

But they see others on it. They're sort of almost riding the the current of the group. They're in the stampede. So it's it's hard to stop when you're in the stampede, right? Okay, love all of that.

38:44.88

Kennedy Kennedy

So we're now at the we're now in this seven-day process where watching the videos, where the person's doing the tasks, the micro tasks, the deep work, and they're getting on some office hours.

38:57.50

Kennedy Kennedy

They're getting the feedback on their on their work, on the Loom videos in the community. They're doing all that stuff. At one point in the seven days, do you begin act? I mean, i'm assuming you're seeding the offer quite early But when do when and how do we actually do the transactional part of, here's what we've got that's available for you to buy, to take the next. When are we doing the offer stack? when are we And how are we taking the the payment? How that bit work?

39:22.33

Bryan Harris

So at the five day mark, if they've been active, then we will send them a DM, send them a private message and start overtly telling them with a bonus to buy about the offer.

39:28.45

Kennedy Kennedy

Okay.

39:34.81

Bryan Harris

At the seven day mark, if you, no matter what your activity level is, everyone, no matter where they've been, will start the sales conversation. Now there's one primary rule that,

39:48.12

Bryan Harris

makes us, well, one primary rule we have now with no sales calls is before we talk to them about that, and we could, we have a thing called a Q and a call. So if somebody has a logistic questions about the product, we'll jump on, but they're like the most opposite from a sales call thing you could imagine. They're just specifics about how does training work and who's my coach and stuff like that.

40:06.07

Bryan Harris

um Not real sales conversations, just logistic questions, but to get deep in the process of that, to have a Q and a call or to do anything deep, like we have to upfront, share the price and the features.

40:18.87

Bryan Harris

So in every high ticket sales thing that's effective, those things are done on a sales call behind the gate where you don't know them up front. They're not on a website. They're not posted publicly. You don't talk about them. You defer questions to sales call.

40:29.78

Bryan Harris

So the fundamental difference mechanically, before we talk to you in detail, we're just going to tell you up front what the price and the features are. In fact, we're literally in conversations today about moving that to day zero.

40:41.53

Bryan Harris

Just tell them at the very beginning, actually, versus even waiting to further along. Put it publicly on the website. There's nothing to hide about this at all. That's

40:47.77

Kennedy Kennedy

and and And if anything, it it may be, and theoretically, it may actually ah increase the perceived value of the free seven days if it's positioned as, hey, you're about to get seven days.

40:59.35

Kennedy Kennedy

Our normal program is normally the full ticket price. So that your price anchor is kind of high and they you might have even more adherence and completion on the seven days, potentially.

41:03.82

Bryan Harris

that's right.

41:10.47

Kennedy Kennedy

Okay, interesting.

41:10.91

Bryan Harris

Yeah. so That'd be interesting to mess around with. ah Yeah. So at the five or seven day mark, depending on their activity level, we'll start a direct message one-on-one conversation, conversation with them where we'll tell the price on the offer.

41:22.19

Kennedy Kennedy

And who's doing that is that? Is that their coach? Is that ah is that a is that a salesperson?

41:26.50

Bryan Harris

Coach.

41:27.35

Kennedy Kennedy

That is their coach.

41:28.33

Bryan Harris

Yep. So everything we do, we have to teach to coaches who suck at sales marketing.

41:29.03

Kennedy Kennedy

Interesting.

41:32.36

Bryan Harris

So like ah everything we do, like this whole thing, like we got to be able to give to people who don't want to be salesperson, aren't a salesperson, never had sales training, don't know how have objection handle.

41:32.42

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

41:40.88

Bryan Harris

They hear a wallet. I don't have the money and they have an abort conversation. Like we got to be able to give this to those people and it worked. Because that's never, it was very rarely actually true. um so you have to be able to work through that. So anyway, um so yeah, we need not sell skill trained people to do it. So our three kind of benchmarks, you mentioned those earlier.

41:59.08

Bryan Harris

We need not sales people to be able to do this.

42:01.25

Kennedy Kennedy

yes

42:01.86

Bryan Harris

We need the conversion rate, meaning lead to sell. We need it to be the same or higher than sales calls. And we need the average order value, a cash collected up front at the point of sell to be the same or higher.

42:14.85

Bryan Harris

If those three things are true,

42:15.18

Kennedy Kennedy

Right, so you're not even willing to play the numbers game of, well, we don't even have the cost of a salesperson. You're literally like like-for-like conversion percentage cash collected at on day zero to be identical.

42:25.97

Bryan Harris

It has to be for lots of reasons. If not, then what you're going to have to do, if any of those numbers are lower, then functionally what's really happening is you're forcing your marketing department to be much better.

42:38.82

Bryan Harris

And then it is harder to have an elite marketing department than a really good sales team. So here's what I've heard. A lot of people talk about what I've encountered over this last year as we've been working on this. A lot of people who say they do no sell call funnels or whatever, but almost always what they've done is lower the price to a thousand dollars.

42:54.50

Bryan Harris

And even then the lead to conversion rate is like half of what it would be if they sales team selling a ten k So they've cut their cash collected up front by 10 times and they still don't convert as well.

43:01.69

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

43:06.50

Bryan Harris

So it's like, is that a no call funnel?

43:07.51

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah.

43:08.92

Bryan Harris

and that doesn That sounds like you've just screwed yourself completely.

43:09.22

Kennedy Kennedy

but Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

43:12.33

Bryan Harris

And it is. It usually when you dig super weedsy down, it's like, yeah it feels better to a bunch of people who don't want to be salespeople. But me numbers wise, you're really like giving bad advice. Because that person be better. You get a founder on the phone and they can usually close even if they suck at sales.

43:25.54

Bryan Harris

The problem comes you start start trying to scale that. So anyway, that that's been the sales process is it starts with an invitation. ah As long as we've had a good experience with the person and we want to coach them, it starts with an invitation once they've been active at day five or day seven.

43:41.38

Kennedy Kennedy

Interesting. And that conversation is what, like, how, how does that process work? It's like, you've been engaged. Do you want to continue? It will be, it will be a shame for this to end now kind of thing.

43:51.01

Bryan Harris

So by the time they get an invite from us, they know the method. They know us thoroughly because that's what the seven days of re-coaching does. You can't not have ah you can't not know that stuff at that point. And they also know all the program details because we just overtly shared it with them.

44:05.09

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah.

44:05.26

Bryan Harris

So any questions at this point? are weedsy questions about product fulfillment or weedsy questions about methodology. And those are the questions you want. They're easy questions. um There could be a payment plan related question in there too. But again, those are really easy questions to have. They're all high buying intent conversations. Really the only conversations I wanna have after day seven are high buying intent. If we had to jump on a and a call, cool. We'll just ask mechanical questions.

44:31.66

Bryan Harris

If we need to talk back and forth in DMS of like, yeah, who will my coach be? And that schedule won't work. It's just, those are easy questions to answer and they're just fulfillment questions.

44:38.86

Kennedy Kennedy

And I guess you've also got this small percentage oh you got youve got a percentage of people who just ghost that engagement because they're just there for the seven days free stuff.

44:38.95

Bryan Harris

What I don't want to be.

44:44.88

Bryan Harris

Yeah. And that's cool.

44:45.72

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

44:46.24

Bryan Harris

That's fine with me. Like, I don't, I don't really want to talk to those people at all at that point.

44:48.96

Kennedy Kennedy

exactly.

44:49.20

Bryan Harris

Cause if you went through all of that.

44:49.47

Kennedy Kennedy

It sort of self-weeds them out, doesn't it?

44:51.91

Bryan Harris

Yeah. And you're not convicted. to follow us and do that. And like, I actually don't want to talk to you at that point and nothing, nothing against It's just not time yet. You're not surrendered. You're not open. There isn't anything negative. It's just like, you're not a person I can help you yet actually.

45:04.80

Kennedy Kennedy

Absolutely, yeah.

45:05.73

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah, that's great. So we're now on day five or seven. We're now in the DMs on Circle or any platform, wherever it's going to be. And we are having those conversations. Yeah. They ask you the weedy questions, their payment plan, their I can't make Tuesdays, their, you know, and does it work if my shirt's blue, you know, all all but the detailed questions, which you you know the answers to.

45:27.21

Kennedy Kennedy

And occasionally those questions will mean it's just not a fit. That's cool. See you later. um And then how does payment work? It's like they're ready to go. You send them a payment link and they pay on the page.

45:37.69

Bryan Harris

Yep, that's the first DM has a link to buy and about a third of people just buy without any back and forth conversation of any sort. um Yeah, they literally like here's the Stripe link, hire us and we'll talk to- tomorrow and have your own morning call.

45:50.34

Bryan Harris

um It's really simple. Like it's really not complex at all. it doesn't have to be complex.

45:55.71

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

45:55.85

Bryan Harris

um And if they have questions about mechanics or deliverables, then we just talk about them.

45:57.25

Kennedy Kennedy

So that's our first DM.

46:01.08

Kennedy Kennedy

That's awesome. So that DM they get, it's it's quite a long DM. It's going to have, hey, you know some acknowledgement intro bit. It's going to have a link to the full rundown of the deliverables of the program and a link to the Stripe in the DM.

46:15.35

Kennedy Kennedy

Or is the link to the Stripe in the informational page for with all the information on?

46:20.74

Bryan Harris

Yeah, we we are currently, in the last three months we've tinkered with the process we're on right now the most is trying a couple different configurations to see what generates the least amount of questions and the least amount of tire kickers.

46:27.33

Kennedy Kennedy

Got it. Of course. Yeah, I know you've been testing this outfit like hell because you've been done in the same, man.

46:32.26

Bryan Harris

Yeah, yeah.

46:33.29

Kennedy Kennedy

You can tell. I mean, it's awesome.

46:35.11

Bryan Harris

Yeah, so we're we're tinkering a good bit, like literally like today we're messing with that message. But currently there's a couple things that have to happen. How you do it, you know, it probably can be done several different ways, but you have to share price.

46:46.63

Bryan Harris

You have to share features. Now we had a message we were running for a couple of months. it was really long. And it's like, this is like, this is too much actually. um You're generating a whole bunch of questions because what you want to get in coaching and in sales is the right questions, is not the not the wrong question.

47:00.45

Bryan Harris

you don't want to generate objections yourself by giving too much information.

47:02.72

Kennedy Kennedy

Right. Okay.

47:04.77

Bryan Harris

And that's like not obvious until you've done this a while. And you're like, yeah you shouldn't be asking about the schedule of our training. That shouldn't be a question we talk about in the sales process because we have we handle that a lot of different ways.

47:16.45

Bryan Harris

Schedule is never a problem. But if we talk about the intimate details of every time of a thing, we're just going to generate a thousand scheduled objections. And they're like, you don't even need that because we handle it well in fulfillment. So no one will ever have a scheduling problem.

47:31.43

Bryan Harris

But if I tell you every detail, you're going to invent all these objections because naturally you want to. So there's a little bit of an art, like what we've done basically make that message shorter. Say the price, say two or three c sentences on each of the three main deliverables and give them the link to hire you.

47:39.69

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah.

47:44.39

Bryan Harris

And let them, and this is coaching too, by the way, training works like this. If you try to explain every detail of a process, it's too much. They can't absorb it even if they want to. There's an art to give them the simple framework and let them, if they have them, ask you questions and then respond to them and let that lead them into deeper understanding of the thing.

48:02.95

Bryan Harris

Same thing in the sales process. Because at this point, by the way, if someone is going to engage, they are convicted of us in the path. So we know we have someone at this point who's in crisis. They're somewhere on the crisis spectrum. They might not be a 10 out of 10 red alert, but they're not a zero either, or they wouldn't be talking still.

48:18.66

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

48:18.89

Bryan Harris

ah So they're in crisis, we know. They're liking us and liking the method, we know. Now it's simply like emotionally, they have committed. to sell Any level of conversation we have at this point is simply letting the the logical brain justify and reconcile with the emotional brain.

48:35.99

Bryan Harris

So we want to just eliminate any level of logistical problems they have. And we don't to invent a bunch of logistical problems for them in the process of that. So um Yeah, so any questions at this point are going to be about how would this apply for me? Or I've had a bad experience with coaches in the past. And those are easy to answer questions for any human that's just trying to be relational with somebody.

48:56.69

Bryan Harris

um So yeah, that message is price, details, here's a link. We also currently are doing a bonus for someone who's been through seven days. I got a three-day window. We'll go find for them out of our network, 10 audiences that want to partner with them.

49:15.35

Bryan Harris

because our main method is getting other people's audiences to promote you. So and for the first three days, we'll give them that. It's a level of urgency. It isn't a price reduction. I hate all that stuff, but it is a additional value add for them if they want to hire. So there is a little urgency in the three day window to make a decision now and not wait.

49:30.17

Bryan Harris

um Because once people get into, once so they're emotionally committed to get a logical brain, just weird crap happens for you over here.

49:30.36

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, yeah.

49:36.34

Bryan Harris

ah You'll just get your own way a bunch, even if you are in crisis, even if you're fully committed.

49:36.69

Kennedy Kennedy

yeah

49:40.50

Bryan Harris

So that helps them get past the logical kind of reconciliation.

49:43.42

Kennedy Kennedy

It's almost like um preemptive buyer's remorse, isn't it?

49:43.70

Bryan Harris

whatre

49:46.64

Kennedy Kennedy

Like your your logical brain goes, might I regret this? I've regretted things before. What have I regretted? Oh, there was this one time. And you start telling yourself all these freaking stories in your head. um whereas that And that's why i i always love as well.

49:57.14

Bryan Harris

sweet.

49:59.32

Kennedy Kennedy

I love that you guys do this. So aligned in that I'm way prefer to give somebody something extra than... if if they take action now rather than doing a discount because you know it's like get more for the same price yeah okay it's like when do you get the you go buy a new car and they're going to give you the the the xl version of the car for the price of the l version of the car then or the then you're going to go for it that and that's why it worked that's why it's always worked um and it doesn't devalue the product or service i think it's

50:20.98

Bryan Harris

pretty sweet

50:28.50

Bryan Harris

and we give a discount if they pay in full. So, cause we want the other thing you have to do. Well, there's several things we can get weeds in price, but like we want as many people to pay us for the first year up front as possible.

50:38.74

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah. Cash

50:39.13

Bryan Harris

that That actually is in their best interest and our best interest. So they don't totally know this on the front end. They don't see it that way, but it is fundamentally true. If they fully commit to a year financially and consciously out loud with their mouth, um,

50:53.26

Bryan Harris

they're going to be more locked in. And secondarily, like our business finances are going to be better, but primarily their result rate will be higher because there'll be less likely to quit in month three to six when it's hard.

50:58.52

Kennedy Kennedy

yeah cash flow

51:04.37

Bryan Harris

um So we got to optimize for that as well. So we give a discount if you pay in full, but not a discount if you buy now or a discount if you have in a three-day window or something. It's like, we'll give you extra things. And if you want to pay all front, which is in your best interest in ours, then we'll we'll do that.

51:17.79

Bryan Harris

So that works well.

51:18.10

Kennedy Kennedy

and extra That's awesome. That's great. Is there any part of this that we've accidentally skipped over that you think is really important we want to know about? I feel like I've got it. just want to make sure there's nothing at you think. No, you guys, you need to know this.

51:30.81

Bryan Harris

I think the first the what I love teaching first is it the first principles of a thing. Like what what is the fundamental thinking of this and why does that work? And now here's how we've skimmed it.

51:42.67

Bryan Harris

Here's the frame we put on it and the headline we put it and the way we've described it. But you can take the fundamental first principles. and We talked about the fundamental first principles of sales and marketing, ah many things here. So like those things are just deeply true.

51:56.61

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

51:56.92

Bryan Harris

Like you can not like ah that's up to you. doesn't really matter to me, but like people that are surrendered, people that have suffered, they follow, they just do. So go find those people and help them. They need it the most anyway.

52:07.38

Bryan Harris

um Those things are just true. How you skin it and do it. Like you could probably do it a lot of different ways where you're into like daily experimentation every day. And like, I just tell you, like it works.

52:19.57

Bryan Harris

You can totally do it. Yeah.

52:21.05

Kennedy Kennedy

There is something I just thought, I think it's amazing, like keeping those core principles. One of the practical things is um this is not cohorted, so i'm i I'm assuming. So literally somebody could join today, their seven-day start today. Is that how it works?

52:32.60

Bryan Harris

Yeah, you don't want to cohort it. It just gets too complex logistically.

52:35.32

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because then you've got all the day ones and you've got seven rounds of it and oh my God, what a nightmare.

52:36.28

Bryan Harris

um Every day. You need to be able to every day or you'll wind up, know, people, have people in the marketing process, you don't have people's committed attention. you have short windows. So If you come in, if somebody listens to this podcast, it's like, i want to do that. like ah Legitimately, I want fruit seven days of free coaching. I'm curious in BOPA and high ticket stuff. like You should do that. GrowthSools.com slash seven days.

52:57.30

Bryan Harris

But and if they got to wait till next Monday to start, I've almost for sure lost them because I don't have enough commitment yet. I need them to be go able to schedule an onboarding call and be on it this afternoon. And if you do that, boy, like you're locked in or tomorrow if that time doesn't work.

53:07.79

Kennedy Kennedy

Right.

53:10.10

Kennedy Kennedy

Right. Yeah. no

53:13.29

Bryan Harris

But like, I need you to be able to start immediately because I got short attention span in marketing. I have longer attention span when you're a client because you paid and you paid attention and you're just more locked in.

53:20.80

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah.

53:22.10

Bryan Harris

But right now it needs to be able to work quick.

53:22.38

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah.

53:23.90

Bryan Harris

I don't need to be able to wait or you will never pass the no sales team test.

53:24.94

Kennedy Kennedy

Right. And that's interesting. You mentioned

53:28.13

Bryan Harris

Like your conversion rate will just suffer drastically.

53:29.81

Kennedy Kennedy

will will drop and that's an interesting thing that you said that i love that detail uh which i'm pleased we accidentally stumbled across that that's genius which is when they enroll they get an onboarding call one-to-one and that happens either the same day or the next day that's within 24 hours right every single day is that seven days a week like you have them covered on saturday sunday

53:45.16

Bryan Harris

Yep. We have those every day. So it's like today and we literally have a calendar that can just choose from

53:53.08

Bryan Harris

five days and weekdays.

53:53.97

Kennedy Kennedy

Five days a week. Okay, cool. So if they join on Saturday, they can they they're going to book it in for Monday.

53:58.44

Bryan Harris

Yeah.

53:58.65

Kennedy Kennedy

But their seven days of coaching...

53:59.22

Bryan Harris

People don't show up to weekly calls anyway, like show rates. And we have, and we've done, i don't know how many, so ah tens of thousands of sales calls.

54:02.94

Kennedy Kennedy

Yeah.

54:05.37

Bryan Harris

They just don't show up anyway. So, uh,

54:06.71

Kennedy Kennedy

Right, right. But their seven days still start on the Saturday if they join the Saturday.

54:10.51

Bryan Harris

ah say Say that one more time. Sorry.

54:13.55

Kennedy Kennedy

Their seven days of free coaching start on the Saturday if they join the Saturday. It's just that they're onboarding all of them.

54:17.24

Bryan Harris

No, it'll start from onboarding call forward. So onboarding call is the kickoff.

54:21.41

Kennedy Kennedy

Got it. Okay. Got it.

54:22.92

Bryan Harris

Yep.

54:22.89

Kennedy Kennedy

Got it. So it gets tricky. Okay. Understood. Okay. Yeah. Brilliant. Oh, awesome. Well, folks, if you want to go and experience what it's like to go through this and actually see the details of it because I've tried to squeeze out as much of this out of Brian as I possibly could.

54:35.58

Bryan Harris

Great question, by the way.

54:36.16

Kennedy Kennedy

And I hopefully, I was, I was brutal, man. So you nailed it, by the way. Thanks for, thanks for letting squeeze it all out. is great. um But if you want to go and experience it, I'm certainly going to go and do this. That's that's not me just giving um airtime to that. I literally, I'm so curious to see how this goes. We're going to go to growthtools.com.

54:52.51

Kennedy Kennedy

So that's growthtools.com slash seven days. That's the number seven, right? So yeah, growthtools.com slash seven days. And of course, we'll put the link to that in the description as well. If you want to go and see what it's all about, if you also want to experience it, but also...

55:06.50

Kennedy Kennedy

Check out how Brian and the team at Growth Tools are using other people's audiences to grow their businesses reliably, consistently. Because as I always say, you do not need to go and build an audience.

55:21.28

Kennedy Kennedy

You need to assemble an audience that somebody else has already built. So awesome stuff, man.

55:25.72

Bryan Harris

Amen to that.

55:26.96

Kennedy Kennedy

um Thank you so much for joining me, man. I really appreciate it. This was great fun.

55:31.74

Bryan Harris

Yeah. Thank you for having me.

55:32.99

Kennedy Kennedy

Absolutely. Folks, if you haven't already, make sure you hit subscribe to the show and I'll see you all next Email Marketing Wednesday.