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MC Fireside Chats - April 9th, 2025

9th April 2025 • MC Fireside Chats • Modern Campground LLC

This MC Fireside Chats episode on April 9th, 2025, hosted by Brian Searl from Insider Perks, brought together a panel of experts to discuss the current state and future trends of the outdoor hospitality industry. The recurring guests, Joe Duemig, the owner and founder of App My Community, a company specializing in mobile apps for campground guest engagement and communication, and Kevin Thueson, a partner at KCN Campgrounds, a real estate investment firm operating a portfolio of nine KOA franchise parks, were joined by special guests Lucy Comer, the co-owner and founder of Hadspen Glamping, an off-grid glamping site in Southwest England, and Jen Rice, the general manager at Empire Recreation Management and WhoaZone, which develops water-based family entertainment centers. The central theme of the discussion revolved around the anticipated impact of the prevailing economic uncertainty and the rapidly evolving sociopolitical landscape on camper behavior in the 2025 season. Brian Searl initiated the conversation by referencing early data that suggested an uptick in reservations for early 2025 compared to the previous year. However, this optimistic outlook was immediately challenged by Kevin Thueson, who reported seeing a contrary trend within KCN Campgrounds, with reservations currently lagging behind the same period last year. He attributed this hesitancy among travelers to the continued uncertainty stemming from various factors, including the recent election and ongoing rapid changes. Joe Duemig offered a more nuanced perspective, suggesting that the impact of these uncertainties would likely vary significantly depending on the specific characteristics of individual campgrounds. He posited that factors such as the type of park (e.g., destination-focused versus en-route stops) and its geographical location would play a crucial role in determining its resilience. He voiced particular concern for campgrounds that heavily cater to snowbirds and those with a significant portion of their clientele coming from Canada, given the existing political tensions and reported decrease in border crossings. While acknowledging the historical trend of campgrounds performing well during economic downturns as a more affordable travel option, Joe Duemig cautioned that the recent increase in campground rates might alter this dynamic. He advised campground owners to proactively develop backup plans to mitigate potential negative impacts. Kevin Thueson further elaborated on the booking trends, suggesting that the current situation might not necessarily indicate a crisis but rather a reversion to pre-pandemic travel patterns. He recalled that before the surge in early and extended bookings during COVID-19, the majority of reservations were typically made much closer to the stay date. He also pointed out the significant decline in international travel since the onset of the pandemic and the slow pace of its recovery, which could influence the impact of current international travel advisories. He emphasized the importance of differentiating between overnight or journey-style parks, which traditionally experience slower reservation pick-up, and destination parks that often see bookings well in advance. Shifting the focus to the UK market, Lucy Comer provided an insightful perspective from Hadspen Glamping. She reported a substantial cost of living crisis in the UK, which has influenced travel patterns. Interestingly, despite this economic pressure, their bookings for April were double compared to the same month in the previous year. However, she also noted a clear trend of people opting for more local vacations and a significant decrease in international travel to their site. Lucy Comer highlighted that Hadspen Glamping’s success lies in offering a unique experience centered around sustainability, its off-grid nature, and its deep connection with the local environment and suppliers. She emphasized that they are selling an escape and an experience rather than simply accommodation. The conversation then transitioned to strategies for enhancing the guest experience. Kevin Thueson underscored the critical role of exceptional hospitality and actively engaging with guests as a key differentiator, particularly for campgrounds that might not have the newest facilities. He suggested practical ways to elevate the guest experience, such as organizing tournaments and events around existing amenities like mini-golf or newly added pickleball courts. Joe Duemig, drawing from his extensive travel experiences with his large family, echoed the sentiment about the importance of friendly and attentive customer service. He shared positive anecdotes from campgrounds that went the extra mile, such as offering free water sports equipment, proactively providing assistance, and offering small but impactful gestures like welcome drinks for adults and children. Jen Rice introduced WhoaZone, explaining its mission to revitalize existing bodies of water in various settings by installing inflatable water-based attractions for family entertainment. She emphasized the goal of encouraging outdoor recreation and providing an immersive and thrilling experience for guests, whether they are staying at a partnering campground or visiting for the day. Jen Rice highlighted that WhoaZone’s unique selling proposition is their deep operational experience, as they not only provide the equipment but also manage and operate the attractions, bringing a practical, on-the-ground perspective to their clients. Finally, the discussion touched upon the future of the industry, particularly concerning sustainability and the adoption of new technologies like electric vehicle (EV) charging stations. Lucy Comer discussed the challenges of implementing EV charging at an off-grid glamping site and the importance of ensuring that any technological additions are both effective and user-friendly for guests. Kevin Thueson provided a pragmatic view on investing in EV infrastructure, emphasizing the need to balance the potential demand with the financial implications for investors and the rapidly evolving nature of the technology. He suggested a cautious approach, monitoring the actual demand and the technological advancements before making significant capital investments, as overspending based on speculation could be risky. In conclusion, Brian Searl thanked the insightful panel for their contributions, providing listeners with contact information for Hadspen Glamping (hadspenglamping.co.uk), App My Community (appmycommunity.com), and WhoaZone (gowhoazone.com). He announced the upcoming Outwired podcast episode, promising further data-driven discussions on consumer behavior in the outdoor hospitality sector.

Brian Searl: 00:00:46

Welcome everybody to another episode of MC Fireside Chats.

: 00:00:48

My name's Brian Searl with Insider Perks.

: 00:00:50

Super excited to be here with you

for another episode of our podcast.

: 00:00:54

We have a couple recurring guests here.

: 00:00:55

We've got Joe Duemig from App

My Community who will introduce

: 00:00:58

himself in a second, as well as

Kevin Thueson from KCN Campgrounds.

: 00:01:01

Welcome back, gentlemen.

: 00:01:02

Glad to have you here.

: 00:01:03

We're missing a couple people today just

due to a couple other prior commitments,

: 00:01:06

but we have a couple special guests

here that we're gonna talk to you too.

: 00:01:10

So why don't we go around the room,

just Joe and Kevin, you wanna start

: 00:01:12

introduce yourself briefly and then

we can have Lucy and Jen do the same?

: 00:01:17

Joe Duemig: Yep.

: 00:01:17

So I'm Joe Duemig.

: 00:01:19

I am the owner and founder of App

My Community we make mobile apps

: 00:01:23

for campgrounds to engage with

guests and increase communication.

: 00:01:28

So that's me.

: 00:01:31

Brian Searl: Awesome.

: 00:01:31

Thanks Joe for being here.

: 00:01:32

I'm excited.

: 00:01:32

We're gonna talk about Australia, man.

: 00:01:33

I wanna talk about Australia a little bit.

: 00:01:35

Kevin, go ahead.

: 00:01:37

Kevin Thueson: Yeah.

: 00:01:37

My name's Kevin Thueson.

: 00:01:38

I'm one of the partners

of KCN Campgrounds.

: 00:01:41

We are a real estate investment

company that specializes in

: 00:01:45

buying campgrounds and RV parks.

: 00:01:48

We currently operate a portfolio of

nine parks spread across the country.

: 00:01:52

All of those are part of the

KOA franchise system, and we've

: 00:01:56

been working with investors in

buying parks for seven years now.

: 00:02:00

Brian Searl: Awesome.

: 00:02:01

Thanks for being here.

: 00:02:01

By the way, is the belief sign actually

backwards behind you or is it just

: 00:02:04

like the reverse camera effect thing?

: 00:02:06

Kevin Thueson: It's

just the reverse camera.

: 00:02:07

Brian Searl: Okay.

: 00:02:08

I didn't know if it was like a secret

code, like where you could get people

: 00:02:10

more more believing in KCN that

way or 'cause they had to study it

: 00:02:14

Kevin Thueson: It's just to see

if you're paying attention, Brian.

: 00:02:16

Brian Searl: Okay.

: 00:02:17

I'm very rarely paying attention.

: 00:02:18

You just caught me in a moment.

: 00:02:19

Lucy, go ahead.

: 00:02:21

Lucy Comer: Hi, I'm Lucy.

: 00:02:22

I am co-owner and founder of Hadspen

Glamping based in Southwest England.

: 00:02:28

Brian Searl: Welcome, Lucy.

: 00:02:29

Thanks for being here.

: 00:02:29

What time is it over there?

: 00:02:31

Lucy Comer: Nearly 7:00 PM

: 00:02:32

Brian Searl: Alright, thank

you so much for giving a

: 00:02:34

portion of your evening to us.

: 00:02:35

Lucy Comer: I don't mind.

: 00:02:37

Brian Searl: To discuss everything

you have going on there.

: 00:02:39

Jen?

: 00:02:40

Jen Rice: Hi, I'm Jen Rice.

: 00:02:42

I'm the general manager at Empire

Recreation Management and WhoaZone and

: 00:02:46

Empire Recreation Management or ERM.

: 00:02:49

We design and consult on really

water-based family entertainment

: 00:02:54

centers or water-based experiences

and developing your waterfront

: 00:02:57

specifically in campgrounds.

: 00:02:59

And the WhoaZone you can see

behind me if you're watching here.

: 00:03:02

But the WhoaZone are, again, water based

family entertainment centers really

: 00:03:06

developing waterfronts in existing areas.

: 00:03:08

We go in and activate that waterfront

to provide amenities for guests staying

: 00:03:12

on site and then day use as well.

: 00:03:15

Brian Searl: Awesome.

: 00:03:16

I'm excited to dive in here into all

the things we have to talk about.

: 00:03:18

I wanna spend five minutes here

and maybe a little bit longer, just

: 00:03:21

depending on what you guys want to

talk about, but primarily to the,

: 00:03:26

I guess the four of you would all

be able to weigh in on this, right?

: 00:03:28

Certainly even in the UK.

: 00:03:30

I want to talk about we've got a lot of

data that we've researched with Scott

: 00:03:34

Bahr, who appears in the show, who will

be later on our show on Outwired on

: 00:03:38

our other podcast about how the current

uncertainty, the economic climate, the

: 00:03:44

rapid changes that are happening even

today in the American administration.

: 00:03:49

Like not saying whether you're for or

against somewhere staying apolitical here

: 00:03:53

but just the rapid changes, like how do

we think that is going to impact camper

: 00:03:57

behavior, if at all in this season?

: 00:04:00

Because we've seen some early

signs that like reservations

: 00:04:03

are up in early 2025, over 2024.

: 00:04:06

Is that kind of hold and true

with what you guys are seeing or

: 00:04:08

anything you wanna comment on that?

: 00:04:09

I don't wanna spend the whole show on it.

: 00:04:11

Just briefly.

: 00:04:14

Kevin Thueson: I'll jump in.

: 00:04:15

I actually.

: 00:04:17

I'm seeing the opposite of

what you just said, Brian.

: 00:04:20

I think reservations are lagging right

now over where they were a year ago.

: 00:04:24

Brian Searl: Okay.

: 00:04:25

Kevin Thueson: Whe whether accurate

or not, I think there was a sentiment

: 00:04:28

going into the end of 2024 with

the election and a lot of unknowns.

: 00:04:34

Once that settled, I think people

were secretly hoping there would

: 00:04:37

be some kind of short transition

period and then we'd settle and

: 00:04:45

people would feel more comfortable.

: 00:04:46

And what we're seeing now is, the

uncertainty is obviously still there

: 00:04:50

for a whole lot of different reasons.

: 00:04:52

And my interpretation of that is I think

that people are still hesitant or on pause

: 00:04:59

right now in finalizing some of their

travel plans because of those unknowns.

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Brian Searl: Yeah.

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And that's what kind of makes me

like, I feel like I'm afraid that

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the data's not gonna be there until

June when the kids get outta school.

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And by that time, I'm afraid it's gonna be

too late to pivot for a lot of the parks.

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If something happens.

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And certainly lots of things

can change as they did in the

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last last three months really.

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Let's be honest.

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But last day, yeah, last day.

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Like for our audiences, who don't know

the, all the tariffs apparently are paused

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for 90 days now, but they're not paused.

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They're just reduced to 10%.

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But not for all countries, just for China.

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They're still going apparently.

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And they're raised to 125%.

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I don't know how people keep it straight.

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Kevin Thueson: Yeah.

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Brian Searl: You know how it impacts

Canada or Mexico yet, or the European

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Union, because he specifically cited in

his post that for the people who didn't

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retaliate, but Europe proved retaliation

this morning and so did Canada.

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Joe Duemig: I'm for the normal person.

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I don't think anyone is paying exact

attention to what the do and how they

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work to the, to an importer exporter.

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Their world has to be on fire right now.

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But in terms of the campground

industry it's one of those

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things where it's hard to tell.

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We've seen, recessions happen before

and a lot of times what happens

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is your more expensive travel.

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Now one of the things is campgrounds

have been raising rates over the past

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how many years to get a little closer

in line with roof accommodations.

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But it used to be where campgrounds,

when there was a recession, would have

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a better year because they were cheaper

and people were traveling closer.

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They weren't getting on flights,

they were staying close.

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I think it's really going to

depend on the type of campground.

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And where you're at.

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Obviously the snowbird season next

year could end up being very rough.

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We haven't seen what

that's gonna look like.

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We have no idea what's gonna be

happening in tomorrow, October.

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October is when those

season's starting, right?

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There's how many parks that cater

to Canadians and, there's still

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the same type of wishy washiness

skepticism, between the two countries.

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I think that those parks

can, might have a rough time.

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I think your summer parks, it

can probably go either way.

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Until so far, I don't think any of this

has shown up in anyone's pocketbooks.

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That's not that takes a little bit

of time to go down that downstream.

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And once it does, the question is do

they stop traveling altogether or do

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they stop traveling to, on flights?

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And so I think that's gonna be a kicker

and it's gonna be, I think it's gonna

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be something that's gonna be hard

to predict what people decide to do.

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Brian Searl: Yeah, I think what we're

consulting our clients on is just

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having a backup plan and planning for

the worst case scenario of all the

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possible things that could happen.

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And then hopefully you don't

have to deploy any of it.

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But at least you're

prepared for that to happen.

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I'm interested to hear two perspectives

here before we, and then we'll just

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move on to a different discussion.

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'cause I wanna make sure we have time

to talk to Lucy about her glamping

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resort into Jen about WhoaZone.

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I wanna hear Kevin's perspective

first, because what you just

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said, Joe, is very important.

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It's where your park

is, where it's located.

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Kevin owns a number of parks

in different locations, right?

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Some of them are on the

way to somewhere else.

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I'm really worried about those parks.

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I'm not I'm not so worried about the other

parks that are in destinations, but also

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then we've had the conversation about

what happens if national parks aren't the

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best experience that they were in previous

years because of layoffs or closures

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or staff trims or whatever, right?

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I'm interested to hear Kevin's take on

that, and then I'd love to just hear

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briefly, Lucy, if you wanna talk about

it, what your perception is from this,

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from the outside, even though the UK

is obviously being impacted by it.

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Lucy Comer: Yeah.

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: 00:08:43

More than happy to give

you our perspective.

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Brian Searl: Go ahead, Kevin.

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Kevin Thueson: So Brian I

think it's a really good point.

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But before getting into it I think

it's important to take a step back.

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Brian Searl: Okay.

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Kevin Thueson: And look at what, like

what has really happened over the last

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six to eight years versus what's been

happening over the last 12, 24, 36 months.

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Because it's really easy to get caught

up in reservations year over year

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are not doing what we want 'em to do.

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And then last year could

say the same, right?

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Like we've got, we're coming off of two,

three years of in general relatively

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flat, maybe down a little, maybe up

in certain markets in certain type of

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parks, but no one's been having, 20%

year over year growth on these, on camper

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nights in reservations, unless there's

some extenuating circumstance, right?

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Brian Searl: Yep.

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Kevin Thueson: And so we've seen this,

the booking window shrink over the last

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several years, and I think it's really

easy to get caught up in while it's just

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like the is this a problem or is it not?

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If you go back to pre-COVID trends.

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The average booking window was like

the majority of reservations were being

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made within a week or two of the stay.

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And I think we got really comfortable

very quickly with people booking

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six, eight months in advance.

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And yes, there are parks that are like

that and will always be like that.

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And those are really, like you

were saying, those destination

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parks, there's a wait list, there's

people trying to get there, they

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have to book as soon as possible.

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But on average, your typical campground

in RV Park, we're not really seeing

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those reservations until last minute and

we're just barely getting into April.

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A lot of seasonal parks are just opening,

so it's too early to tell whether or

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not this uncertainty and all these

sociopolitical issues are going to, like

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Joe was saying, trickle down to, our

guest's wallets or our parks themselves.

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We have to see it play out to see if

it's just a reversion back to what the

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traditional booking window used to be.

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Which, if we're being totally honest,

has always been a big appeal for RVers

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is the flexibility and, not having to

plan everything out and have this agenda.

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They wanna wake up in the morning

and decide today we're gonna go

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here or we're gonna go there.

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And for operators, I think we

experienced a lot of guest frustration

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in 2021, early 2022 of people

who couldn't do that anymore, and

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they missed the good old days.

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And I think to some extent

we're just getting back to

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those traditional behaviors.

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And if you don't apply the lens of let's

pull the, all the COVID craziness and

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the pandemic travel impact out of it.

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Are we really in a bad situation or are we

just back to what the normal behavior was?

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Brian Searl: I think that's a

very important perspective and

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I agree with everything you're

saying that we don't know.

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And I think I said that earlier in

the show, just that we need, we're

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not gonna know until June, right?

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When the kids get outta school for sure

is when the most parks are not gonna know.

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But what I think worries and concerns

me beyond the Canadian, like we

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have lots of Canadian data that the

border crossings are down, right?

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30% in Vancouver, 30% in Maine, right

above some of your parks in Utah.

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Kevin?

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I get not saying that you get

a lot of Canadian travelers.

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I don't know.

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I'm just saying.

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So we have that, a lot of that data,

we have 70% less trips booked to the

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United States by air from Canada.

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So that's having an impact.

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China just issued an advisory

that said their people shouldn't

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come over here and travel.

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They did that this morning.

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And so that's a lot of people who will

come to our national parks and stay at

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both public and private campgrounds.

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And tour the United States.

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And so those two things alone, combined

with every piece of data that Scott

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Bahr and I study, and we obsessively

look at this, I think we have no lives.

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I have no life.

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I can't speak for Scott.

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He's probably got a life.

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Everything that we look at doesn't clearly

indicate that things are headed the wrong

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direction, but it doesn't look positive.

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And so that's what.

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Kevin Thueson: Yeah.

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Brian Searl: Yeah.

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Kevin Thueson: I don't disagree with that.

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One thing I'll add to that, and

this is just from our parks, and

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again, every park's different,

every market's different.

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We lost a lot of the international

travel and the international

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guests during the pandemic.

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At the time when you know, in, in March

of: 2020

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and I would say, anecdotally, probably

30% of our guests in revenue came

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from international travelers, a lot of

cruise, Americas Europe, Asia and we

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could even narrow it down to specific

countries where they were coming from.

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When travel closed down, we lost

that customer base almost entirely.

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And it doesn't feel like, at

least within our portfolio, we've

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come even close to recovering.

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It was replaced in the short term by new,

US, North American guests that were new

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to camping and traveling and camping more.

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That's died off a little bit for the

people who came in and then left.

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But we still have the, the real strong

active camping household base, but I

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don't think we're anywhere near where

: 2019

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The Canadian thing, obviously,

I think there's some other

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extenuating factors there.

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That, that are driving that.

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But if, I think we'll feel an impact

from that, but I don't think it'll be

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as big as if this was happening back,

five, six years ago when a much more

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substantial amount of business was

coming from international markets.

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Brian Searl: Yeah, you might be right

obviously nobody, we're all guessing here.

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I'm interested to see, like I did read,

I did quickly read the KOA camping

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: 00:14:30

North American or whatever outdoor

hospitality report they call it.

275

: 00:14:33

I can't remember that came out

today and I didn't see anything

276

: 00:14:36

in international travel, but I

didn't look at every specific stat.

277

: 00:14:38

But that is a very interesting

question to figure out.

278

: 00:14:41

I'll see if I can ask Scott Bahr

later on our show whether that's

279

: 00:14:44

down over 2019 international travel

as a whole to the United States.

280

: 00:14:48

That would be interesting to find out.

281

: 00:14:50

Do you wanna touch anything on your

different types of RV parks, Kevin?

282

: 00:14:53

Or I know there's I agree with you.

283

: 00:14:54

There's nothing really to be pulled yet.

284

: 00:14:58

Because it's early, but.

285

: 00:15:00

Kevin Thueson: Yeah, I think to bifurcate

the data a little bit, to your comment

286

: 00:15:03

earlier, your overnight parks, your

journey style parks that are on your

287

: 00:15:07

way to somewhere else, those parks

have always had slow reservations.

288

: 00:15:12

So it, when we look at it, say and these

are just hypotheticals, but if our year

289

: 00:15:16

over year reservations are down 25%, if we

look at prior years, what that percentage

290

: 00:15:24

of people booking six months in advance

was compared to our annual revenues.

291

: 00:15:28

It's very small.

292

: 00:15:30

So yeah, we might be down single

double digits on future reservations

293

: 00:15:35

during Q1, but those Q1 reservations

typically only account for,

294

: 00:15:41

10- 15% of our annual revenue.

295

: 00:15:44

So it's not, it's just, it's really,

it's not enough data to really

296

: 00:15:49

Brian Searl: Yeah.

297

: 00:15:49

Kevin Thueson: Forecast

out what it's gonna mean.

298

: 00:15:50

But your comment was, I think, spot on

it, it doesn't necessarily confirm that

299

: 00:15:56

there's something bad happening, but

it also doesn't make us feel very good.

300

: 00:16:00

I think if everybody ran their reports and

saw that reservations were up year over

301

: 00:16:04

year, that would be a fantastic feeling.

302

: 00:16:07

But at the same time, that revenue's

gonna be down for the year.

303

: 00:16:11

Brian Searl: Yeah.

304

: 00:16:11

I think it just worries me from a,

like I have so many clients that

305

: 00:16:14

depend on my advice and I feel like

I hate not knowing things and being

306

: 00:16:18

able to give them a solid answer.

307

: 00:16:20

So we're just scrambling for all this

data, the best we can get it but.

308

: 00:16:23

Kevin Thueson: Forecasting has become

much more difficult the last few years.

309

: 00:16:30

Brian Searl: Yeah, for sure.

310

: 00:16:31

Lucy, your outside perspective?

311

: 00:16:33

Lucy Comer: Would you like my outside

perspective on America or would you like

312

: 00:16:36

the outside perspective about the UK?

313

: 00:16:39

Brian Searl: I would like your

outside perspective in any

314

: 00:16:40

direction you want to take it.

315

: 00:16:42

Lucy Comer: Okay.

316

: 00:16:42

We've been finding in the UK , there's

major cost of living crisis over here.

317

: 00:16:46

So whatever's happening in America, we

are kind of keeping it at arms distance

318

: 00:16:51

because of what's happening in the UK.

319

: 00:16:52

Having said that, we have got so last

year people were booking very last minute.

320

: 00:16:57

They weren't planning in advance.

321

: 00:16:59

Whereas this year our bookings for,

we've literally just opened last weekend.

322

: 00:17:02

Our bookings for April are

double what they were last April.

323

: 00:17:06

We're finding a lot of people are

wanting to stay a lot more local.

324

: 00:17:11

There's a lot less international.

325

: 00:17:13

travel and as a knock on a lot

less international visitors.

326

: 00:17:16

So last year we had quite a

few international visitors.

327

: 00:17:19

We haven't got any this year at all.

328

: 00:17:21

So I think it's very

much a worldwide thing.

329

: 00:17:24

It's not just specific to either

the UK or America or Europe.

330

: 00:17:29

People are just staying closer to home.

331

: 00:17:31

I think they don't like

the uncertainty so much.

332

: 00:17:33

Yeah, I mean we're busy.

333

: 00:17:35

We've got bookings right the way

up through all the way through

334

: 00:17:37

the summer which is massively

different from last year.

335

: 00:17:39

I think Covid really introduced

this like gung-ho, I'm gonna

336

: 00:17:45

go on holiday and go now.

337

: 00:17:46

And people were, and that's carried

through for a couple of years and we're

338

: 00:17:49

seeing it starting to tail off and

people are likely to plan a bit more now.

339

: 00:17:54

Brian Searl: Now are you saying, I'm

just curious with your international

340

: 00:17:56

travel, are you saying it's down all over?

341

: 00:17:59

Like even from, for example, France

and Spain and Croatia and people who

342

: 00:18:03

would come to the UK that are closer.

343

: 00:18:05

Lucy Comer: From certainly

from our perspective, yes.

344

: 00:18:07

I can't speak for the rest of the UK,

but our site certainly where we had

345

: 00:18:11

quite a large amount of international

travelers last year, we haven't got any.

346

: 00:18:16

And I don't know what that is.

347

: 00:18:18

The data that's been released

locally for my area is shown that

348

: 00:18:23

tourism generally is up as a whole.

349

: 00:18:25

So whether that's just international

visitors are being more diluted

350

: 00:18:30

by local visitors, I don't know.

351

: 00:18:33

It's quite hard to read the data

if I'm perfectly honest, because

352

: 00:18:36

it's so varied from place to place

in the UK 'cause we're so small.

353

: 00:18:41

Brian Searl: Yeah, we did look at, last

week we had Simon on from Camp Map and he

354

: 00:18:45

gave us a really nice report that was from

a big marketplace over there in Europe

355

: 00:18:50

and he was basically mirroring the same

data and trends that we've seen here.

356

: 00:18:53

Like shorter night stays, staying

closer to home, that kind of stuff.

357

: 00:18:57

I don't wanna cite any data 'cause I'm

old and don't remember what happened

358

: 00:18:59

yesterday, let alone last week.

359

: 00:19:01

But similar trends, right?

360

: 00:19:03

Lucy Comer: Yep.

361

: 00:19:03

Brian Searl: But it's interesting,

we're seeing the same thing in Canada.

362

: 00:19:06

Like for all the economic concerns that

we would share with other countries in the

363

: 00:19:10

world in Canada because of the US thing.

364

: 00:19:14

Everybody is saying home in our

campgrounds are like way up in

365

: 00:19:17

reservations 'cause everybody's

exploring Canada from what I've heard.

366

: 00:19:22

Anecdotally.

367

: 00:19:22

But it's interesting but points to

the same trend that you're seeing now.

368

: 00:19:25

People are staying home and that's

benefiting the UK campgrounds.

369

: 00:19:28

Lucy Comer: Absolutely.

370

: 00:19:30

Brian Searl: Which is a

great problem to have.

371

: 00:19:31

Lucy Comer: Yeah, it's a good problem

to have, but it's a whole new problem.

372

: 00:19:35

Brian Searl: All right, let's, I

want to get, I want to definitely

373

: 00:19:37

get to talking about your actual

glamping resort into woe zone.

374

: 00:19:40

And so is there anything else, Joe,

that you think is constructive that

375

: 00:19:43

we should add to this conversation or

from a camper perspective since you

376

: 00:19:46

travel so much or anything like that?

377

: 00:19:49

Joe Duemig: No, I don't know

of anything in particular.

378

: 00:19:51

I mean our stuff, like what we

do and what people I know do that

379

: 00:19:56

hasn't seemed to change too much.

380

: 00:19:58

And that's completely anecdotal

'cause we're talking about,

381

: 00:20:00

five different people.

382

: 00:20:01

But but yeah, I think we've covered

pretty much everything else.

383

: 00:20:05

Like I said, the parks that I'm really

concerned the most for, like the ones that

384

: 00:20:08

their entire clientele is from Quebec.

385

: 00:20:12

They speak French at their park.

386

: 00:20:13

Brian Searl: Yeah.

387

: 00:20:14

Joe Duemig: They have Canadian flags.

388

: 00:20:15

Those are the ones I'm really

concerned with for next season.

389

: 00:20:19

If things don't sell down I

have a lot of concern for them.

390

: 00:20:22

Brian Searl: Yeah, those two, I

mean that piece and then I like,

391

: 00:20:24

it really concerns me with the

places near national parks too.

392

: 00:20:28

And some of that is the staffing

and doge cuts and some of it is the

393

: 00:20:31

Canadian and international travel.

394

: 00:20:33

Joe Duemig: And that could go

either direction though, and

395

: 00:20:36

that could go either direction.

396

: 00:20:37

If it could parks are taking services away

from the campground, but still manning the

397

: 00:20:44

park, then those could go up because they

might, people might start staying more at

398

: 00:20:49

the local private campground as opposed

to the park the National Park Campground.

399

: 00:20:54

Brian Searl: It could the only reason

it concerns me is 'cause we ran this

400

: 00:20:56

on Outwired a few weeks ago back

in February, before like it really

401

: 00:20:59

got bad with tariffs and sentiment.

402

: 00:21:01

And we had Scott Bahr on the show

and he looked at the data we ran and

403

: 00:21:04

we said basically we use the really

powerful thinking model from open AI

404

: 00:21:08

and ran some research in advance and

said what happens if 10% of campers from

405

: 00:21:13

international, just 10% from Canada,

Europe and Asia, don't come to the

406

: 00:21:17

United States and don't stay at private

campgrounds within 30 to 60 minutes

407

: 00:21:21

of RV parks or national parks, sorry.

408

: 00:21:23

And it said the potential loss

revenue would be, I think $30 million.

409

: 00:21:28

And then if it's 50%, which is what the

AI thought it was anticipating, if all

410

: 00:21:32

the tariffs went into effect and all the

things happened, then it's $450 million in

411

: 00:21:36

lost revenue just for private campgrounds

in 30 to 60 minutes of a national park.

412

: 00:21:40

So that's why that worries me.

413

: 00:21:41

But you're right, it could go the

opposite direction too, and there could

414

: 00:21:43

be Americans that fill in that gap, right?

415

: 00:21:45

I don't know any of that.

416

: 00:21:47

But anyway, that's enough

negative potential talk.

417

: 00:21:50

Let's talk about happy things.

418

: 00:21:51

So how's been glamping, Lucy?

419

: 00:21:52

Tell us what you got over there.

420

: 00:21:54

Lucy Comer: So we opened we're

now in our third season opening.

421

: 00:21:57

We're based in Somerset in Southwest, UK.

422

: 00:22:00

We started it because

I've always gone camping.

423

: 00:22:04

I took my daughter when

she was two weeks old.

424

: 00:22:05

I took her camping.

425

: 00:22:06

So we started has been glamping

as a way to introduce camping to

426

: 00:22:10

people who aren't great at camping.

427

: 00:22:12

And there's quite a

lot of those in the UK.

428

: 00:22:14

So we opened this is our

first, second, fourth season.

429

: 00:22:18

First season we didn't have a full season.

430

: 00:22:20

We are a completely off-grid site there.

431

: 00:22:22

We're not connected to main's

electricity, main's water, main's

432

: 00:22:25

gas, everything's solar powered.

433

: 00:22:27

We've got LPG fridges, very

sustainable site set in rural Somerset.

434

: 00:22:32

And people come from all over to visit.

435

: 00:22:35

Brian Searl: So I'm curious,

how long have you been open?

436

: 00:22:37

I'm sorry if I missed that.

437

: 00:22:38

Lucy Comer: The three, so

this is our third year.

438

: 00:22:40

But the first year we didn't do a full

season opening 'cause I ended up having

439

: 00:22:44

spinal surgery halfway to season.

440

: 00:22:46

So we had to delay opening.

441

: 00:22:47

So this is our second full year.

442

: 00:22:49

Last year we were, it was our first

full year and in that year we won UK

443

: 00:22:54

Glamp Site of the Year Bronze Awards

for New Tourism Business of the year.

444

: 00:22:59

Glampsite of the year as well.

445

: 00:23:00

So it was a really

successful full first year.

446

: 00:23:04

Brian Searl: So I hope you're feeling

better from your spinal surgery.

447

: 00:23:06

First off.

448

: 00:23:07

Lucy Comer: Yeah, it, yeah, it

was, I don't go a speedboat.

449

: 00:23:08

It's long story, but yeah.

450

: 00:23:10

Don't go on speedboat.

451

: 00:23:10

You end up with an accident.

452

: 00:23:12

Brian Searl: That doesn't, yeah,

that doesn't sound very pleasant.

453

: 00:23:14

So tell me, I'm curious you've

obviously won a lot of awards.

454

: 00:23:17

What do you think made you stand

out and separated yourself from

455

: 00:23:21

some of your competition to

allow you to win those awards?

456

: 00:23:23

'cause it's not just one, right?

457

: 00:23:24

It's multiple.

458

: 00:23:25

So you clearly have done

something different.

459

: 00:23:27

Lucy Comer: Yeah, it's, I think

it's the quality we're offering.

460

: 00:23:30

We're a very sustainable site.

461

: 00:23:31

We're very involved with local suppliers.

462

: 00:23:34

We've used as many local suppliers

as we can where possible.

463

: 00:23:38

Sustainable tourism in the UK seems

to be a really growing industry.

464

: 00:23:43

And it's that escape from city life.

465

: 00:23:46

You can come to our site, you've got all

the modern amenities that you need, like

466

: 00:23:51

a hotel style accommodation, but it's set

in the countryside around a camping theme.

467

: 00:23:56

That's the appeal of it, is that

it's a complete disconnect from

468

: 00:24:00

this really busy, modern world that

people are finding themselves in.

469

: 00:24:04

Brian Searl: How important is it,

because we talk a lot about experiential

470

: 00:24:07

hospitality over here in I'm in

Canada, but in the United States too.

471

: 00:24:12

Differentiating your experience.

472

: 00:24:13

I think there's a lot to be said

by that normally, but also in.

473

: 00:24:17

Potentially down economic times,

just making yourself stand out and

474

: 00:24:21

apart from your competition, how

important do you think that story?

475

: 00:24:26

Lucy Comer: Yeah, I think it's a

really important story to get across.

476

: 00:24:29

Your, with our glamp insight and certainly

within the industry, we realize we are

477

: 00:24:34

not just, we're not selling accommodation,

we're selling an experience for people,

478

: 00:24:38

is a chance for people to experience

a type of life that they wouldn't

479

: 00:24:42

normally get in the city or even in

the towns that you get around us.

480

: 00:24:47

We are incredibly rural.

481

: 00:24:48

Our nearest neighbors are half a mile

away, so it's an experience rather

482

: 00:24:53

than a holiday accommodation we offer.

483

: 00:24:56

Brian Searl: What do you find the best

way is to tell your story to consumers?

484

: 00:24:59

Because it's one thing to put up a

website and say, Hey, we're sustainable

485

: 00:25:02

and we have eco-friendly composting

and we have solar panels, or whatever.

486

: 00:25:05

But it's another thing to actually

resonate with the guests and get that,

487

: 00:25:08

Lucy Comer: I think.

488

: 00:25:09

Brian Searl: Understand it.

489

: 00:25:10

Lucy Comer: Yeah, I think for us,

it's our love of what we do that comes

490

: 00:25:13

across I absolutely adore what we do.

491

: 00:25:16

Is it, we do have a,

another business on site.

492

: 00:25:18

That, but that's my husband's business.

493

: 00:25:20

This is mine.

494

: 00:25:21

And I think as long as you wear your heart

on your sleeve and you show people why you

495

: 00:25:27

love it, they fall in love with it too.

496

: 00:25:30

Brian Searl: Kevin, what

do you think about that?

497

: 00:25:31

'cause I know you emphasize service

at your properties quite a bit.

498

: 00:25:35

Kevin Thueson: Yeah, I think it's spot on.

499

: 00:25:37

It's for us it's hard to compete

sometimes with some of the larger.

500

: 00:25:44

Investment groups that can throw as

much money as possible at problems.

501

: 00:25:49

And our model is we're buying

existing campgrounds only, which

502

: 00:25:53

means they're built 40, 50 years ago.

503

: 00:25:55

And they're not the nicest always.

504

: 00:25:57

And we're, where we feel there's

an opportunity to stand out, has

505

: 00:26:02

to be on the guest experience

and the hospitality aspect.

506

: 00:26:06

And that is an arena

where anybody can compete.

507

: 00:26:10

It doesn't matter what your budget is.

508

: 00:26:12

It doesn't matter how big your company is.

509

: 00:26:14

If you can provide, like Lucy say,

if you can provide that experience,

510

: 00:26:19

that's special that people are gonna

remember, that they're gonna wanna

511

: 00:26:21

talk about that is different from

anything that any of us have experienced

512

: 00:26:26

at any hotel that we go to, right?

513

: 00:26:29

That's why people look to these

types of locations and experiences

514

: 00:26:33

because we've all been at hotels,

we know what it, we know what it

515

: 00:26:36

is and we want something different.

516

: 00:26:39

Brian Searl: I don't want you to give

away your secret sauce, but is there

517

: 00:26:41

anything else besides service that you

really feel levels up a KCN property?

518

: 00:26:46

And here's why I'm asking,

lemme set the precedent to that.

519

: 00:26:47

I think that there's obviously, like

all of your parks are KOAs, right?

520

: 00:26:52

I think there's a lot of

power behind the KOA brand.

521

: 00:26:55

There's a lot of good that it does.

522

: 00:26:56

It brings a lot of business into people

who are franchised with their brand and

523

: 00:26:59

they have obviously a very well-known and

highly regarded set of standards that they

524

: 00:27:03

make everyone keep up with, that obviously

helps you have a baseline and a foundation

525

: 00:27:08

that's probably ahead of a number of other

typical RV parks that would not be doing

526

: 00:27:14

that in across the United States, Canada.

527

: 00:27:16

So like service is one way that you

would set yourself apart from like

528

: 00:27:20

just, I also have a miniature golf

course, I also have a swing pool.

529

: 00:27:22

I also have patio sites.

530

: 00:27:23

I also have a dog run.

531

: 00:27:25

Are there other things that KCN does

or is thinking of doing, again, without

532

: 00:27:29

giving away your secret sauce, but

just that you think would set you

533

: 00:27:31

apart in an era of that experience?

534

: 00:27:36

Kevin Thueson: I don't know

that any of it's really secret.

535

: 00:27:38

A lot of it's kinda standard playbook

approach that a lot of people are doing.

536

: 00:27:43

For example it's just understanding

what guests are looking for, right?

537

: 00:27:47

And then trying our best to

listen to them and apply it.

538

: 00:27:51

There's no magic about increasing

your wifi speeds and improving

539

: 00:27:56

your distribution system so that

people can get connected and work

540

: 00:27:59

while they're traveling, right?

541

: 00:28:00

There's nothing special about it.

542

: 00:28:01

You just have to do it.

543

: 00:28:03

We try and take on the little

things and if you can deliver

544

: 00:28:07

consistently on small little things

over time, that builds momentum.

545

: 00:28:12

Brian Searl: A 100% agree.

546

: 00:28:14

I think my

547

: 00:28:15

Kevin Thueson: Outside of just making

sure that you're in the right markets and

548

: 00:28:18

you understand that, you're gonna be in

a place that people are gonna want to go.

549

: 00:28:22

You just have to not give

them a reason not to come.

550

: 00:28:25

Brian Searl: Which is a big part of it.

551

: 00:28:26

I guess where I wanted my, and all of

those are valid points and very important.

552

: 00:28:31

I think where my more so question

was is let's say we are headed into.

553

: 00:28:37

Joe used the R word recession.

554

: 00:28:38

Didn't say we were in

one, but used the R word.

555

: 00:28:40

So let's say we are headed into

a little bit tougher economic

556

: 00:28:44

times than we've had in the past,

just to play it conservatively.

557

: 00:28:47

Are there ways that you look at

from an operator standpoint at your

558

: 00:28:50

properties to say alright, I've

got six campgrounds around me close

559

: 00:28:56

to an, I'm just making something.

560

: 00:28:57

I'm not saying just one of your parks.

561

: 00:28:59

I've got six campgrounds around me that

all have miniature golf courses and all

562

: 00:29:01

have good wifi and all have good pools.

563

: 00:29:04

How do I level up that

service beyond that.

564

: 00:29:06

Service is obviously the number one,

the friendly human staff, right?

565

: 00:29:09

But is there anything else that you

would do as an operator to not be, but

566

: 00:29:14

after you've taken care of the basics?

567

: 00:29:16

Kevin Thueson: I don't think that we're

unique in this way, but we definitely see

568

: 00:29:19

there's two approaches to this business

and ours has been, let's lean in on the

569

: 00:29:26

fact that this is a people based business.

570

: 00:29:28

And how do we engage with our

guests and yes, we may have the same

571

: 00:29:32

amenities as somebody else, but are we

actively trying to connect with them?

572

: 00:29:39

As an example, if you were to take

mini golf, or we're putting in

573

: 00:29:43

pickleball courts at some of our

parks, that's a great amenity to have.

574

: 00:29:47

But you can level it up by saying, okay,

we're gonna, we're gonna organize a

575

: 00:29:51

tournament and we're gonna have prizes and

we're gonna try and get guests involved.

576

: 00:29:55

And there'll be a reason for

them to participate and, we

577

: 00:29:58

can do brackets and raise the

stakes and those types of things.

578

: 00:30:01

They're not difficult to do, but

it takes time, it takes energy,

579

: 00:30:05

which is always a challenge with the

people on our teams that are running

580

: 00:30:08

these parks on a day-to-day basis.

581

: 00:30:10

It's just hard.

582

: 00:30:11

It's a lot of work.

583

: 00:30:12

So to ask them and to get them to want

to do those things is a challenge where

584

: 00:30:17

the other side of the business is,

people come in some groups are coming

585

: 00:30:21

in from, maybe more of a self storage

background or apartment investing, and

586

: 00:30:27

now they're getting into RV because

there's a great financial return

587

: 00:30:32

possibility within this asset class.

588

: 00:30:34

But they apply that mentality

of let's automate everything.

589

: 00:30:37

Let's streamline it.

590

: 00:30:38

Fewer people, less interactions,

less friction points.

591

: 00:30:42

We've seen and you guys

have probably seen this too.

592

: 00:30:44

There are RV parks out there now that

are basically, there's nobody there.

593

: 00:30:48

It's all automated, electronic.

594

: 00:30:51

You get a QR code, you scan

it, that turns on your power.

595

: 00:30:55

They're gonna be guests that are

more than happy to not have to

596

: 00:30:58

talk to anybody or see anybody.

597

: 00:31:00

But the way that we approach

it is we think that's a small

598

: 00:31:03

set of the people who really

599

: 00:31:04

Brian Searl: Agreed

600

: 00:31:04

Kevin Thueson: Want to camping.

601

: 00:31:06

It'd be outside.

602

: 00:31:07

And so let's focus more on, how do we add

some to your point, some like some special

603

: 00:31:14

sauce or some flare to the amenities

that we have and the activities that we

604

: 00:31:18

do that would give somebody a reason to,

Hey, my kids are gonna have more fun at

605

: 00:31:23

this park 'cause they can do X, Y, and Z.

606

: 00:31:25

Versus if we go here,

it may be more simple.

607

: 00:31:27

We don't have to deal with people.

608

: 00:31:29

It's new or it's fresher, but once we

get there there's nothing for us to

609

: 00:31:33

do unless we figure it out ourselves.

610

: 00:31:35

Brian Searl: And that's, I think

what I was going after right?

611

: 00:31:36

Is your example of the pickleball

court and the tournaments is perfect.

612

: 00:31:40

It doesn't require a huge lift

from owners to do this stuff, but

613

: 00:31:43

it does require some thought and

understanding and looking at things

614

: 00:31:46

outside of the box and what can I do?

615

: 00:31:48

It's even as simple as like I have

a dog park or I have a dog park

616

: 00:31:51

and I hand out little baggies with

treats when you check in, right?

617

: 00:31:53

It's something as small as that.

618

: 00:31:55

So I'm curious, Joe, as you travel

around the country with your family,

619

: 00:31:58

how do you differentiate these places?

620

: 00:32:01

Is it like, what kind of experiences

have you seen or looked for?

621

: 00:32:06

Joe Duemig: I don't know.

622

: 00:32:06

So we obviously we are

not your average traveler.

623

: 00:32:09

One we're coupled with business.

624

: 00:32:11

For me it has to be a park that I

think not has to be we definitely

625

: 00:32:13

stay at parks that we don't think

would be a good business opportunity.

626

: 00:32:17

But we also travel six children,

so that obviously changes where

627

: 00:32:22

we end up going a lot of times.

628

: 00:32:24

So one of the things that turn

us off is bad customer service.

629

: 00:32:28

When they don't recognize you with the,

not recognize like know who you are, but

630

: 00:32:32

recognize your existence as you walk in

to the camp store, something like that.

631

: 00:32:36

Friendly staff is getting to be

the thing that separates any place

632

: 00:32:40

from anywhere else now because I

think I'm sure Lucy would say that

633

: 00:32:44

in the UK it's probably the same.

634

: 00:32:46

I imagine it's the same as it is here in

that it's been harder and harder to find

635

: 00:32:50

people that, enjoy their job, want to,

636

: 00:32:53

Brian Searl: Why do you think that is?

637

: 00:32:54

I don't mean to interrupt you,

but why do you think that is?

638

: 00:32:55

Because you think, like we've been

talking for so many years, KOA has given

639

: 00:32:58

sessions and OHI has given sessions and

say, associations have given sessions

640

: 00:33:02

and you know that this is best practices,

a smile at your guests and be friendly.

641

: 00:33:05

So why do you think after all these

years, instead of it trickling up,

642

: 00:33:08

it's trickling down or at least

it's perceived to be trickling down?

643

: 00:33:13

Joe Duemig: No idea.

644

: 00:33:14

I don't know.

645

: 00:33:15

You can make a bunch of assumptions,

but they're just assumptions.

646

: 00:33:17

Brian Searl: You've got to know.

647

: 00:33:18

That's who we have podcast about.

648

: 00:33:20

Joe Duemig: I know you enjoy 'em a lot.

649

: 00:33:23

Brian Searl: Okay.

650

: 00:33:23

Sorry.

651

: 00:33:23

Continue your thought, please.

652

: 00:33:24

I didn't wanna cut you off.

653

: 00:33:25

Joe Duemig: No, that that's really

it in terms of picking a place, we're

654

: 00:33:28

mostly picking where we're going first

and then finding a location around it

655

: 00:33:32

that looks to be fun and can provide

us the experience we want there.

656

: 00:33:37

So there's certain places that

we go that the experience that we

657

: 00:33:40

want, there is just a campground.

658

: 00:33:42

There's certain ones where pictures

on the website didn't, we sit at Lake

659

: 00:33:45

Siskiyou and near Mount Shasta California,

and the pictures did it because they

660

: 00:33:50

have a waterpark like you see on Jen's

background except instead of trees in

661

: 00:33:55

the background, Mount Shasta with a bunch

of snow on top of it was there in July.

662

: 00:34:01

And so that's that's just an experience

that you're not going to get many places.

663

: 00:34:05

And that's kinda what

drives where we travel.

664

: 00:34:08

Brian Searl: Okay.

665

: 00:34:08

So I have one more question for

you and then I'm gonna get to

666

: 00:34:09

Jen and talk about WhoaZone.

667

: 00:34:11

With all the clients that you have who

use App My Community, your apps surely

668

: 00:34:15

you've come across as you program,

you and your team program, these apps

669

: 00:34:20

with experiences and events and all

the things that, that go into that.

670

: 00:34:23

Surely you've come across some things

where you're like, wow, I would totally

671

: 00:34:26

stay there with my kids and do that.

672

: 00:34:28

Joe Duemig: Oh yeah.

673

: 00:34:28

There's a ton.

674

: 00:34:29

So actually one of our

early customers, they have.

675

: 00:34:33

Just as an amenity, which I very

rarely see this is they have a

676

: 00:34:37

bunch of different water equipment,

paddle boards, paddle boats all of

677

: 00:34:40

that stuff except it's free to use.

678

: 00:34:42

And then what happens is they're

allowed to book it at hours.

679

: 00:34:46

You go and book an hour at a time,

and so you can book two paddle

680

: 00:34:49

board boats for an hour and then

you book it through their app.

681

: 00:34:52

You go there, you show up and you get to

use it and turn it back in right after it.

682

: 00:34:56

It's just, they have a, probably

five different types and a total

683

: 00:35:02

of 10 to 15 pieces of equipment

that you can just rent out and use.

684

: 00:35:07

And it's not, it doesn't, it's not

an extra cost, it's just included in

685

: 00:35:10

the resort fee, which that's nice,

especially when you have six children.

686

: 00:35:14

Because for us, those costs just keep

going up, when you have incremental

687

: 00:35:18

costs on a per person basis.

688

: 00:35:20

So that is pretty awesome.

689

: 00:35:21

I'm on the spot, so I can't

give you a few other ones.

690

: 00:35:24

Brian Searl: Mean it, blew your mind.

691

: 00:35:25

That's what I'm looking for, right?

692

: 00:35:26

So you're like, wow, I've never

seen another park do that.

693

: 00:35:29

Joe Duemig: One of the things, so

we get all of our push notifications

694

: 00:35:31

from all of our apps, and so what

we typically do is we have a private

695

: 00:35:34

Facebook group just for our customers.

696

: 00:35:36

And anytime someone comes up with

something novel we'll take a few

697

: 00:35:39

screenshots and send it out to our

customer base saying, look, here's

698

: 00:35:42

what they're doing or what they did.

699

: 00:35:44

That's interesting.

700

: 00:35:45

And I'm, kinda at a loss of exact things,

cus customer service not necessarily

701

: 00:35:50

wowing you over but just that little

extra factor is one place they have

702

: 00:35:55

cookies and treats for the dogs.

703

: 00:35:56

And the children, they have both.

704

: 00:35:58

And so they covered both bases

there, which normally people cater

705

: 00:36:02

to one or the other versus both.

706

: 00:36:04

I'll think about it and we will

see if I can remember something by.

707

: 00:36:06

Brian Searl: Alright.

708

: 00:36:06

Think about it.

709

: 00:36:06

Lemme know.

710

: 00:36:07

I think the big takeaway here though is

you could, like you, you can, obviously,

711

: 00:36:11

we're gonna talk about WoahZone in

a second, do something amazing like

712

: 00:36:13

that, that is gonna, enhance the

experience at your park and that's

713

: 00:36:16

gonna bring a lot of guests, right?

714

: 00:36:17

But I think the other thing to communicate

here, and I just wanna make sure I say,

715

: 00:36:20

is that it doesn't always require I

don't know how much your stuff costs Jen.

716

: 00:36:23

I'm just gonna make something up, but

a $100,000 or a couple million dollars

717

: 00:36:26

for waterpark or whatever, right?

718

: 00:36:28

Investment to actually

change that guest experience.

719

: 00:36:30

And I think that's the important

thing that I want some of the

720

: 00:36:33

owners to know in the show.

721

: 00:36:34

You don't have to make that

investment to change this experience.

722

: 00:36:37

You just have to think about, and Jen

just left, she just left the show.

723

: 00:36:40

She's like that.

724

: 00:36:41

He took too long to get to me.

725

: 00:36:43

So hopefully she'll come back.

726

: 00:36:45

But I think that's the important

piece is it's just a little,

727

: 00:36:47

it's a little lift, right?

728

: 00:36:48

We were talking a couple weeks

ago on Outwired about grounding.

729

: 00:36:52

In the, like taking your shoes

off and like creating an area

730

: 00:36:55

or actually, no, that was my AI

post that on LinkedIn, nevermind.

731

: 00:36:58

That's what that was.

732

: 00:36:58

But we were never, were

talking about it on Outwired.

733

: 00:37:00

But just creating like a clean space

in grass that obviously you have to

734

: 00:37:03

manicure and you have to take care of

and it can't just be a gimmick, but like

735

: 00:37:06

it doesn't cost that much to do that.

736

: 00:37:08

And then it saw it in KOA's

report again this morning.

737

: 00:37:10

They were talking about it's an increase

in desires to do that grounding,

738

: 00:37:14

which is basically where you take

your socks off and walk around in your

739

: 00:37:17

bare feet and nature in the grass.

740

: 00:37:20

And so just those kinds of little

ideas I think are important to let

741

: 00:37:23

owners know that this stuff can

happen for them very quickly and very

742

: 00:37:28

easily if they're just willing to

think outside the box a little bit.

743

: 00:37:31

Then she just left again.

744

: 00:37:32

I was just gonna go to her.

745

: 00:37:34

Joe Duemig: I was gonna.

746

: 00:37:34

Brian Searl: It's killing my whole flow.

747

: 00:37:36

Joe Duemig: I was gonna pause, but now

I remember, and I think I might have

748

: 00:37:39

talked about this on the show before,

but there's a small nice, very nice

749

: 00:37:42

campground in Grove, Oklahoma that

as soon as you pull up, they wait

750

: 00:37:46

until you get all set up, you get one.

751

: 00:37:48

They checked on us while we were

set up and they need, they said, oh

752

: 00:37:50

you're set back a little further.

753

: 00:37:51

Do you need an extension cord?

754

: 00:37:52

And they brought out an

extension cord for us.

755

: 00:37:55

That was a nice, that they

noticed that we were gonna need

756

: 00:37:57

it before we even pulled in.

757

: 00:37:59

They waited until we were set up and

then brought us each a little glass

758

: 00:38:02

of champagne and probably not, I'm

sure it's not an expensive champagne,

759

: 00:38:06

but it makes you feel very welcomed.

760

: 00:38:08

And then on top of that, they do,

I don't know if it's only on the

761

: 00:38:11

weekends, but they take their cart and

they bring margaritas to each site.

762

: 00:38:17

And then we had six children,

so they brought strawberry

763

: 00:38:19

lemonades for each of them.

764

: 00:38:21

Obviously for most parks

that's gonna be a cost center.

765

: 00:38:23

That's, it's gonna be cost

prohibitive and time primitive.

766

: 00:38:26

There are 40 to 50 sites, but they

have two restaurants on property.

767

: 00:38:30

And so it's getting people to

feel that comfort with the place

768

: 00:38:34

and bring them to the restaurant.

769

: 00:38:35

We were much more inclined

to go both nights.

770

: 00:38:38

We were there, we ate at the

restaurants, they have two.

771

: 00:38:40

And so we sat at the nice restaurant

one night, we went and did trivia at the

772

: 00:38:44

sports bar that's above it the next night.

773

: 00:38:46

And obviously bringing

eight people in there.

774

: 00:38:49

They made a good amount

of money off of us.

775

: 00:38:51

And it might've just been the, that,

that user experience of getting, feeling

776

: 00:38:56

like, feeling like they cared when

they brought us margaritas after we,

777

: 00:39:00

at five o'clock oh look what's here.

778

: 00:39:01

It's, I think that's a thing.

779

: 00:39:04

It could be expensive, but

it couldn't do really well.

780

: 00:39:07

Brian Searl: And that linking it

together is interesting too, right?

781

: 00:39:09

Just the psychology of, and I

don't know what they brought you,

782

: 00:39:11

if that was from a restaurant.

783

: 00:39:13

I also don't know if they bring everybody

champagne or just celebrities like you.

784

: 00:39:16

I'm not sure.

785

: 00:39:17

But we'll assume that they do.

786

: 00:39:18

But linking that stuff together, right?

787

: 00:39:20

Like in thoughtful ways.

788

: 00:39:21

And obviously most campgrounds aren't

gonna have a restaurant on staff

789

: 00:39:24

on site, but if you can even give

them a little small good from good

790

: 00:39:28

thing item from your store, right?

791

: 00:39:29

That's cheap or super expensive, it

allows them to remember in their head

792

: 00:39:32

and recall that, oh, you have a store

with other things available, right?

793

: 00:39:35

Just stuff like that I think

is important to consider.

794

: 00:39:38

Jen, are you back with us?

795

: 00:39:39

I've tried to toss it

to you like 18 times.

796

: 00:39:41

That's maybe more an exaggeration.

797

: 00:39:43

Jen Rice: I'm here.

798

: 00:39:44

I don't know.

799

: 00:39:44

I look frozen.

800

: 00:39:45

Can you hear me?

801

: 00:39:46

Brian Searl: You are frozen.

802

: 00:39:47

I can hear you though.

803

: 00:39:48

Jen Rice: It's so horrible angle.

804

: 00:39:49

I'm sorry.

805

: 00:39:50

Brian Searl: There's no

water park behind you either.

806

: 00:39:51

You lost that.

807

: 00:39:52

Jen Rice: I know.

808

: 00:39:52

I lost, I had to switch

to my phone, you guys.

809

: 00:39:54

It turned all robotic.

810

: 00:39:57

Brian Searl: That's okay.

811

: 00:39:57

We have listeners on the podcast

too, so if we can hear you.

812

: 00:39:59

Let's let's talk about

WhoaZone real quick.

813

: 00:40:02

Jen Rice: Okay, awesome.

814

: 00:40:03

Yeah so like I mentioned, the WhoaZone.

815

: 00:40:05

We are water-based family entertainment

centers and we are really all

816

: 00:40:09

about, camera's not working.

817

: 00:40:11

All about activating an

existing body of water.

818

: 00:40:15

Whether it's inside of a campground,

a city park, a state park.

819

: 00:40:19

So our WhoaZone are actually located,

we've got three locations currently.

820

: 00:40:24

We're in Texas, Indiana, and Michigan,

and our WhoaZone locations currently

821

: 00:40:30

we've got one in a state park

and the others are in city parks.

822

: 00:40:33

And we're a public private

partnership and, our goal is to get

823

: 00:40:37

families recreating back in nature.

824

: 00:40:40

So similar to your visitors at the

campgrounds very similar target audience

825

: 00:40:45

where, it's getting them away from that

concrete and chlorine and experiencing,

826

: 00:40:50

a really thrilling type of attraction or

maybe a passive recreation out, out in

827

: 00:40:56

nature, kinda at these bodies of waters.

828

: 00:40:58

So most of our WhoaZone

are located on Lakefronts.

829

: 00:41:01

But we have had some locations on

kinda on the ocean front, on an inlet.

830

: 00:41:05

So really kinda, we've got a lot of

options when it comes to the low zone.

831

: 00:41:09

But it's really, about like

you guys talked about providing

832

: 00:41:12

that great guest experience.

833

: 00:41:14

I come from the theme park world my

goal is when a guest comes to visit us,

834

: 00:41:19

whether they're staying on site, at the

campground we partner with or they're

835

: 00:41:23

just visiting from down the road, is to

really provide that immersive experience

836

: 00:41:27

and a little bit of escape from reality.

837

: 00:41:30

Whether it's for an hour or two that

they're gonna spend with us or if

838

: 00:41:33

they're gonna spend the day with us.

839

: 00:41:36

Brian Searl: And I want you to

know that camera is being off, is

840

: 00:41:38

probably working in your favor.

841

: 00:41:39

'cause we're all just imagining

like these huge structures that are

842

: 00:41:42

just wonderful and amazing, like

it looked good behind you, right?

843

: 00:41:45

But now our imagination

are just going crazy.

844

: 00:41:47

So like you're just gonna have to

fulfill all these orders if people call.

845

: 00:41:50

And want things that you

don't currently have.

846

: 00:41:52

So just be aware of that.

847

: 00:41:53

Jen Rice: That sounds good.

848

: 00:41:54

Brian Searl: But I am curious, like we

see, I wouldn't say a lot, but there are

849

: 00:41:57

a handful of vendors that we come across

that offer a similar product to yours.

850

: 00:42:01

So I'm curious what differentiates your

product from the others in your mind?

851

: 00:42:06

Jen Rice: So think what differentiates

us is that not only can we provide the

852

: 00:42:10

product or provide the site design and

recommendations, but we are operators and

853

: 00:42:16

my role as the general manager, that is

my primary role is I operate the WhoaZone.

854

: 00:42:21

So we are in really in the trenches

similar to our customers and clients.

855

: 00:42:26

Where we're hiring on the seasonal

staff to launch for the summer

856

: 00:42:29

we're interacting with the guests.

857

: 00:42:31

So I think we bring that next level to the

table in that, we see it from all sides.

858

: 00:42:38

So it's not just, Hey, we're

gonna sell you an inflatable

859

: 00:42:41

waterpark, good luck, have fun.

860

: 00:42:43

We can really come in and, help

get it set up and whether that's us

861

: 00:42:47

coming in and actually operating it

as a WhoaZone or something similar

862

: 00:42:52

or providing consultative services

to help, get our clients there.

863

: 00:42:57

Brian Searl: All right.

864

: 00:42:57

I wanna put you on the spot like I

did, Joe, what's the craziest thing

865

: 00:43:00

you've ever built for somebody?

866

: 00:43:02

Jen Rice: Ooh, that's a good one.

867

: 00:43:05

Brian Searl: And if can't think of that.

868

: 00:43:06

If you can't think of that,

then I'll give you an out.

869

: 00:43:07

I'll say, what's the craziest

thing you would build if somebody

870

: 00:43:10

gave you the opportunity to.

871

: 00:43:12

Jen Rice: Oh goodness.

872

: 00:43:13

We have some, I can't spill the beans,

I don't think yet because we have some

873

: 00:43:16

really cool things on the radar that

are probably a summer: 2026

874

: 00:43:21

Brian Searl: You can tell us.

875

: 00:43:22

Nobody really watches the show though.

876

: 00:43:24

Jen Rice: But, think bigger

and wilder than ever.

877

: 00:43:27

Because I think, as we've seen

as new products come out the

878

: 00:43:30

guests, they just want more.

879

: 00:43:31

Again, I'm a, I'll say I'm a,

like I said, a theme park person.

880

: 00:43:34

I love a great rollercoaster.

881

: 00:43:36

And as they get bigger and badder,

we just want more and more.

882

: 00:43:39

And I think it's very similar for our

thrill seekers that visit us at woe

883

: 00:43:43

zone or that are purchasing equipment to

provide great experiences to their guests.

884

: 00:43:47

It's kinda how can we get crazier?

885

: 00:43:49

But, and I'll say with a very big caveat,

keeping guests safety at the forefront.

886

: 00:43:55

Because of course, we

are dealing with water.

887

: 00:43:57

Some of these lakes are very deep.

888

: 00:43:59

We've got dark water.

889

: 00:44:00

So ensuring that it's a safe

experience and that our team is trained

890

: 00:44:04

properly and adequately so that the

guests can really have that cool

891

: 00:44:08

experience that they're looking for.

892

: 00:44:10

Brian Searl: Which is why I can

never own a business like yours.

893

: 00:44:12

I don't like dealing with all the

regulations and concerns and thinking

894

: 00:44:15

about, I just wanna build crazy stuff.

895

: 00:44:17

Lucy, I'm curious for you with your, with

all the sustainability things you do,

896

: 00:44:21

and I know you talked about solar panels

and some other things, are there ways

897

: 00:44:24

that you feel like in the coming years

that you can really double down on that

898

: 00:44:28

sustainability and set yourself apart

from even the other glamping businesses

899

: 00:44:32

in the UK that do sustainability?

900

: 00:44:34

Lucy Comer: It's a hard one because

sustainability is constantly evolving.

901

: 00:44:38

And that there's always new

technologies that we can introduce

902

: 00:44:42

and new ways to do things.

903

: 00:44:43

And I think for us, as long as we

are, we keep on top of things and are

904

: 00:44:47

listening to our guests, to what they

want and how we can enhance their

905

: 00:44:51

stay, that's what we can be guided by.

906

: 00:44:53

So I would like to make us

more sustainable if we can.

907

: 00:44:57

But at the moment, I don't

know how it will depend on what

908

: 00:45:00

new technologies come around.

909

: 00:45:02

Brian Searl: Okay.

910

: 00:45:02

That's fair.

911

: 00:45:03

I know a little bit about it and but

not anywhere close to what you do.

912

: 00:45:06

So I was just curious if there was

something that was maybe too expensive

913

: 00:45:09

right now and maybe in year four or

five that you could do or those kind.

914

: 00:45:12

Lucy Comer: Yeah, so one of the things

is a lot of the guests we've got an awful

915

: 00:45:16

lot of electric cars over in the UK now.

916

: 00:45:17

And because.

917

: 00:45:19

'cause of where we are based in the UK

our nearest EV charger is six miles away.

918

: 00:45:25

So it's working out how we could

introduce that technology to an off grid

919

: 00:45:29

site that has no electricity supply.

920

: 00:45:32

And it, there are

technologies evolving with it.

921

: 00:45:34

And I think as long as we're keeping

up to date with that and what's

922

: 00:45:36

going on in the industry I think

that we can evolve that as it goes.

923

: 00:45:40

Brian Searl: And what guides your,

like when you're looking to add either

924

: 00:45:43

a sustainability feature or something

else to your glamping resort to enhance

925

: 00:45:46

it in some way, either the experience

or the efficiency of the operations or,

926

: 00:45:50

teams, staff what kind of guides your

decision on where to go first with that?

927

: 00:45:54

Because there's so many

things you could do.

928

: 00:45:55

Lucy Comer: Yeah, the problem

is that the scope is so large

929

: 00:45:58

as to where do you stop really.

930

: 00:46:00

You could you could introduce so much

that it then for example, with some

931

: 00:46:05

technology, you could introduce so much

sustainability with technology alone,

932

: 00:46:09

you're gonna bamboozle or your guest

and then that's not a guest enhancement.

933

: 00:46:14

Brian Searl: Be overwhelming.

934

: 00:46:15

Lucy Comer: Yeah, it can be.

935

: 00:46:16

So for us it's very much about testing it.

936

: 00:46:18

So we tested all of our solar panels

and that they were gonna give us

937

: 00:46:22

the power that we needed and that

they were simple to use and that

938

: 00:46:25

nothing was gonna go wrong with them.

939

: 00:46:27

So I think that's our guiding principle of

A, is it appropriate, and B, is it usable?

940

: 00:46:32

There's no point in putting it in if

it's not gonna be usable for guests.

941

: 00:46:36

Brian Searl: That's fair.

942

: 00:46:37

That's a good point.

943

: 00:46:37

Kevin, how do you guide this?

944

: 00:46:38

Where do you stop at KCN.

945

: 00:46:41

Kevin Thueson: There's a balance

and it's hard because there's a lot

946

: 00:46:43

of things we'd like to do, but we

always have to apply the lens of how

947

: 00:46:47

is this gonna impact our returns to

our investors and our financials.

948

: 00:46:51

And so there's a lot of things that

we would really like to do, but

949

: 00:46:55

financially we can't justify it.

950

: 00:46:57

And so we have to take steps to maybe

if we invest into these more specific

951

: 00:47:03

revenue generating improvements, that

will provide us a little bit more

952

: 00:47:09

flexibility in investing in these other

things that may be more guest focused,

953

: 00:47:14

that will have a qualitative impact

on the part versus a quantitative.

954

: 00:47:19

And so that's the challenge for us.

955

: 00:47:22

And when we look at some of our peer

groups that, maybe they don't have

956

: 00:47:26

outside capital and anyone who's an

operator who's going through this

957

: 00:47:30

thought process of do I bring in

investors, do I bring in partners?

958

: 00:47:33

It does change the way that you approach

this, where, if I was just a single park

959

: 00:47:37

operator and it was all my money, the way

that I invested would be very different.

960

: 00:47:40

Brian Searl: Yeah.

961

: 00:47:41

Kevin Thueson: It's this kind of

fiduciary aspect to how we spend money

962

: 00:47:45

that we have to be really careful about.

963

: 00:47:47

Brian Searl: Is there a threshold

and I know it's obviously different

964

: 00:47:49

depending on every use case and

service and how much money it

965

: 00:47:53

might potentially bring in or not.

966

: 00:47:54

So I know it's very nuanced and

I'm being very broad intentionally,

967

: 00:47:57

'cause we only have six minutes left.

968

: 00:47:59

But is there a threshold what you

look at, let's just use electric

969

: 00:48:02

car pests as an example, right?

970

: 00:48:03

Is there a threshold you look at the

X percentage of my guests are now

971

: 00:48:07

adopting this, or X percentage of

people in the US are adopting this.

972

: 00:48:10

So now it makes sense from a revenue

generating standpoint for me to add this.

973

: 00:48:14

Kevin Thueson: I think we tend

to not wanna be the knee jerk

974

: 00:48:18

reaction and go overboard.

975

: 00:48:21

I remember there were a lot of discussions

within our peer groups and at conferences

976

: 00:48:27

and events that I was at a few years ago

before the F-150 Lightning was released.

977

: 00:48:32

Yeah.

978

: 00:48:32

And there was a disproportionate amount of

panic of campground owners thinking well.

979

: 00:48:41

Crap, what do I do when all of my

guests show up with an electric

980

: 00:48:45

truck and their trailer, and they

need to plug both of them in.

981

: 00:48:49

And I don't think that means that people

went out and spent hundreds of thousands

982

: 00:48:53

of dollars in retrofitting their parks

for that, but they really thought, Hey,

983

: 00:48:57

I've gotta, I've gotta get ahead of this.

984

: 00:49:00

And my experience has been, it's important

to know where the trends are going and

985

: 00:49:07

pay attention to, how many electric

vehicles do you actually have coming in?

986

: 00:49:10

How many people come in

and ask if they can charge?

987

: 00:49:13

And if you can't provide it, and they

leave, a significant capital investment.

988

: 00:49:18

That is really only going to cater

to say maybe 15 to 20 people a year

989

: 00:49:23

might not make a whole lot of sense.

990

: 00:49:24

You could take that money and

put it into site upgrades or site

991

: 00:49:27

expansions to your core guests, and

that could have a much better return.

992

: 00:49:31

So again it's not a great answer to

your question, Brian, but a lot of

993

: 00:49:36

it just depends on where you are.

994

: 00:49:37

If we were buying in California,

which we're not, we'd probably be

995

: 00:49:41

investing a little bit more into that.

996

: 00:49:43

We've got, one of our parks is in

Sheridan, which we look at the data

997

: 00:49:50

for where our guests are coming

from, and the vast majority are

998

: 00:49:53

traveling over 800 miles to get there.

999

: 00:49:55

They're not camping close to home.

: 1000

00:49:57,637 --> 00:49:59,407

And how many of those

guests are coming in?

: 1001

00:49:59,407 --> 00:50:02,287

Electric vehicles on these long

road trips is probably a lot fewer.

: 1002

00:50:02,287 --> 00:50:05,017

So we wouldn't invest

that heavily in that park.

: 1003

00:50:05,197 --> 00:50:09,087

But, for a place that's a couple

hours outside of Denver that

: 1004

00:50:09,087 --> 00:50:10,347

might make a lot more sense.

: 1005

00:50:10,407 --> 00:50:14,067

So we, we have to be

pretty strategic about it.

: 1006

00:50:14,367 --> 00:50:17,667

But at the same time there's only so

much you can do because to completely

: 1007

00:50:18,567 --> 00:50:23,347

adjust the way that you've set up your

campgrounds to accommodate a small portion

: 1008

00:50:23,347 --> 00:50:25,137

of your guest is just cost prohibitive.

: 1009

00:50:25,697 --> 00:50:27,747

Brian Searl: Is there something

you would say to campground owners?

: 1010

00:50:27,747 --> 00:50:29,007

And I agree with everything you just said.

: 1011

00:50:29,007 --> 00:50:31,557

I don't think electric cars are

like, especially three years ago.

: 1012

00:50:31,957 --> 00:50:34,957

Were anywhere and now everybody's burned

their Teslas to the ground apparently.

: 1013

00:50:34,957 --> 00:50:36,427

There's less of them even on the road now.

: 1014

00:50:36,507 --> 00:50:37,797

But like I agree with you.

: 1015

00:50:37,797 --> 00:50:40,137

That was an overreaction

probably a few years ago, but

: 1016

00:50:40,137 --> 00:50:41,607

like it is coming eventually.

: 1017

00:50:42,037 --> 00:50:45,352

And so what would you say to an owner

who I agree with you, if you look out

: 1018

00:50:45,352 --> 00:50:49,032

your window at your campground and

there's only 15-20, or let's say it's

: 1019

00:50:49,032 --> 00:50:52,542

less than 5% of people who are coming

into electric vehicles, but you can see

: 1020

00:50:52,542 --> 00:50:55,632

these trends in the United States, and

I'm not saying we're there yet, right?

: 1021

00:50:56,442 --> 00:51:00,522

Or in the UK or wherever else where

there are more of these going off of car.

: 1022

00:51:00,522 --> 00:51:02,262

Lots and more people

are driving them around.

: 1023

00:51:02,262 --> 00:51:05,112

Is there a point where you look at that

and say, that's a marketing opportunity

: 1024

00:51:05,112 --> 00:51:09,062

and maybe I could do 10 or 15 or 20% if

I actually said I have charging stations?

: 1025

00:51:09,512 --> 00:51:10,382

Kevin Thueson: Yeah, absolutely.

: 1026

00:51:11,052 --> 00:51:14,142

If there's enough demand for it to make

sense, then yeah, I think you invest.

: 1027

00:51:14,192 --> 00:51:19,857

We want to on that front probably be

a little bit behind the curve instead

: 1028

00:51:19,857 --> 00:51:23,517

of Overinvesting hoping, field the

dreams approach that they'll come.

: 1029

00:51:23,577 --> 00:51:23,727

Brian Searl: Yeah.

: 1030

00:51:23,777 --> 00:51:26,447

Kevin Thueson: We wanted to have

enough that we know it'll get used.

: 1031

00:51:26,807 --> 00:51:32,337

And I don't wanna say that it's a

symbolic type of investment, but enough

: 1032

00:51:32,337 --> 00:51:36,207

to show guests that yes, we're aware

of this, we're investing into it.

: 1033

00:51:36,207 --> 00:51:37,617

This is our first phase.

: 1034

00:51:38,007 --> 00:51:42,002

Have a few chargers, we've put some

in, and we have a park in Kansas where

: 1035

00:51:42,002 --> 00:51:44,102

we put in the, into a super site.

: 1036

00:51:44,102 --> 00:51:47,552

We have an electric charging

pedestal and we have the RV charge.

: 1037

00:51:47,552 --> 00:51:52,532

So you could come in your F-150 lightning

and plug in and hook up your trailer.

: 1038

00:51:52,532 --> 00:51:56,882

So I do think it's important to show

that you are moving in that direction.

: 1039

00:51:56,882 --> 00:52:01,412

I just would be really careful

in overspending or making

: 1040

00:52:01,412 --> 00:52:05,417

decisions on speculation because

and I'm probably not the most.

: 1041

00:52:06,117 --> 00:52:07,317

In tune with this.

: 1042

00:52:07,317 --> 00:52:10,427

But my thought has

always been that's great.

: 1043

00:52:10,427 --> 00:52:11,327

We have these options.

: 1044

00:52:11,327 --> 00:52:13,517

We now have pedestals that

are specific for this.

: 1045

00:52:13,907 --> 00:52:17,537

But if the major impact of this

isn't gonna hit for five to seven

: 1046

00:52:17,537 --> 00:52:21,197

years, how much is that technology

going to change between now and then?

: 1047

00:52:21,197 --> 00:52:25,327

And if I spend a lot of money today to

be prepared for what's gonna happen in

: 1048

00:52:25,327 --> 00:52:30,977

five years, am I gonna have to invest

more to then be, current or modern?

: 1049

00:52:30,977 --> 00:52:34,877

Where maybe the park down the

street was behind on investing and

: 1050

00:52:34,877 --> 00:52:38,597

when they did it, they have the

newer models, they have the newer

: 1051

00:52:38,597 --> 00:52:40,577

equipment that becomes more appealing.

: 1052

00:52:40,577 --> 00:52:42,397

And that's, it's like trying

to time the stock market.

: 1053

00:52:42,637 --> 00:52:44,287

There's, you never know, right?

: 1054

00:52:44,797 --> 00:52:45,097

Brian Searl: Yeah.

: 1055

00:52:45,137 --> 00:52:46,502

Kevin Thueson: So I think

it's just being careful.

: 1056

00:52:47,922 --> 00:52:48,642

Brian Searl: Yeah, I agree with you.

: 1057

00:52:48,692 --> 00:52:53,162

I think, all so you will

always have good amenities.

: 1058

00:52:53,162 --> 00:52:54,452

You'll have good service.

: 1059

00:52:54,722 --> 00:52:57,602

You won't be the first to put in

a landing pad for flying cars.

: 1060

00:52:58,457 --> 00:52:59,297

Kevin Thueson: Probably not.

: 1061

00:52:59,837 --> 00:53:02,867

Brian Searl: China just approved their

first flying cars from two companies.

: 1062

00:53:03,227 --> 00:53:03,857

They're in the air.

: 1063

00:53:04,517 --> 00:53:05,777

It's coming faster than you think.

: 1064

00:53:05,777 --> 00:53:07,517

There's five American

that are producing them.

: 1065

00:53:07,967 --> 00:53:11,267

Kevin Thueson: When you text me

a picture of you on yours, then

: 1066

00:53:11,267 --> 00:53:12,948

I will start to invest so that

: 1067

00:53:13,092 --> 00:53:15,557

Brian Searl: I don't have enough money

for that stuff, kevin, we've already, it's

: 1068

00:53:15,557 --> 00:53:19,007

not even an advertiser in this show, Joe.

: 1069

00:53:19,277 --> 00:53:21,227

Joe don't you have 80

people working for you now?

: 1070

00:53:21,227 --> 00:53:24,617

Sponsor the show, Joe, me a

bang, give you some coffee.

: 1071

00:53:24,797 --> 00:53:25,307

Joe Duemig: Wine 80.

: 1072

00:53:25,967 --> 00:53:26,867

Unfortunately we're at the end.

: 1073

00:53:26,867 --> 00:53:28,517

I had a couple questions from Jen.

: 1074

00:53:28,587 --> 00:53:30,597

With her part, with her set up.

: 1075

00:53:30,777 --> 00:53:31,647

Brian Searl: People can hop off.

: 1076

00:53:31,647 --> 00:53:33,837

If you have a couple questions,

you're more than welcome to ask.

: 1077

00:53:33,837 --> 00:53:34,137

Joe Duemig: Great.

: 1078

00:53:34,477 --> 00:53:38,297

Jen the way you're set up and

you operate, so if you operate

: 1079

00:53:38,297 --> 00:53:40,587

in a park a WhoaZone at a park.

: 1080

00:53:41,307 --> 00:53:44,307

Would it be open to public or

is it only open to the park?

: 1081

00:53:44,907 --> 00:53:46,377

Jen Rice: Yeah, so great question.

: 1082

00:53:46,377 --> 00:53:50,617

So we are open to the public

open for day use and that's

: 1083

00:53:50,617 --> 00:53:52,347

our primary model at WhoaZone.

: 1084

00:53:52,607 --> 00:53:57,527

So we do charge even for, the campers on

site, but we do different promos again,

: 1085

00:53:57,527 --> 00:54:01,437

depending on the location and kind of the

amenities that, the campground owners or

: 1086

00:54:01,437 --> 00:54:03,627

that site wants to offer to their campers.

: 1087

00:54:04,887 --> 00:54:05,157

Joe Duemig: Okay.

: 1088

00:54:05,157 --> 00:54:08,427

And then have you dealt

much with power authorities?

: 1089

00:54:08,497 --> 00:54:12,937

We have customers that they've wanted

to put in this type of equipment,

: 1090

00:54:12,937 --> 00:54:16,117

but the lake that they're on is

actually owned by a power company.

: 1091

00:54:16,537 --> 00:54:21,007

And so negotiating with them to actually

be able to put that type of equipment

: 1092

00:54:21,007 --> 00:54:23,237

on there is a little more work.

: 1093

00:54:23,847 --> 00:54:24,777

Jen Rice: Great question.

: 1094

00:54:24,777 --> 00:54:28,077

And so I will say personally,

no I have not been involved with

: 1095

00:54:28,227 --> 00:54:30,747

kind of with power companies and

kinda getting the right approvals.

: 1096

00:54:30,877 --> 00:54:33,577

We do work quite a bit on different

lakes with the Army Corps of

: 1097

00:54:33,577 --> 00:54:37,427

Engineers or the DNR but our company

does have experience with that.

: 1098

00:54:37,427 --> 00:54:38,867

Again, just not me personally.

: 1099

00:54:39,407 --> 00:54:39,647

Joe Duemig: Okay.

: 1100

00:54:40,037 --> 00:54:40,247

Cool.

: 1101

00:54:41,387 --> 00:54:41,567

Alright.

: 1102

00:54:41,567 --> 00:54:43,707

And those are the questions I

had with you, with your model.

: 1103

00:54:43,707 --> 00:54:45,917

Just seeing how to work

with some of our customers.

: 1104

00:54:46,577 --> 00:54:47,057

Jen Rice: Definitely.

: 1105

00:54:47,057 --> 00:54:50,687

And if we, if we'd like to offline, I can

provide some additional resources as well.

: 1106

00:54:50,952 --> 00:54:51,242

Brian Searl: Okay.

: 1107

00:54:52,307 --> 00:54:52,697

Awesome.

: 1108

00:54:52,697 --> 00:54:53,327

Thank you guys.

: 1109

00:54:53,327 --> 00:54:53,927

I appreciate it.

: 1110

00:54:53,927 --> 00:54:54,827

I think we'll wrap up here.

: 1111

00:54:54,827 --> 00:54:55,967

I know it's really late for Lucy.

: 1112

00:54:55,967 --> 00:54:57,762

She's given us her evening,

so I appreciate staying.

: 1113

00:54:57,912 --> 00:55:00,122

Hopefully it was a not boring

discussion for you, Lucy.

: 1114

00:55:00,692 --> 00:55:00,892

Lucy Comer: No.

: 1115

00:55:01,072 --> 00:55:01,892

I'd love to be here.

: 1116

00:55:01,892 --> 00:55:02,252

Thank you.

: 1117

00:55:02,737 --> 00:55:04,747

Brian Searl: Tell us where they can

find out more about Hadspen Glamping.

: 1118

00:55:05,477 --> 00:55:09,207

Lucy Comer: So they can head to our

website, which is hadspenglamping.co.uk

: 1119

00:55:09,297 --> 00:55:10,407

All the information's on there.

: 1120

00:55:10,507 --> 00:55:13,117

Use the Contact us button and

you'll come directly through to me.

: 1121

00:55:13,237 --> 00:55:15,577

I am head of everything in the company.

: 1122

00:55:16,427 --> 00:55:18,167

Brian Searl: I just want you to

know, if you do start getting

: 1123

00:55:18,167 --> 00:55:21,197

international travel, it all came

from my show, so remember because.

: 1124

00:55:21,707 --> 00:55:22,187

Lucy Comer: Absolutely.

: 1125

00:55:23,417 --> 00:55:24,407

Brian Searl: That's where

it's gonna come from.

: 1126

00:55:24,977 --> 00:55:26,717

Joe, where can they find out

more about App My Community?

: 1127

00:55:27,207 --> 00:55:29,807

Joe Duemig: You can find more

information at appmycommunity.com

: 1128

00:55:30,147 --> 00:55:33,017

and yeah, if you hit the contact

button, contact us button.

: 1129

00:55:33,017 --> 00:55:35,387

It comes to me even if Brian

thinks we have 80 employees,

: 1130

00:55:36,557 --> 00:55:39,707

Brian Searl: 79, sorry, Jen

WhoaZone, where can they find more?

: 1131

00:55:40,037 --> 00:55:40,277

Jen Rice: Yep.

: 1132

00:55:40,617 --> 00:55:41,917

gowhoazone.com

: 1133

00:55:42,747 --> 00:55:44,427

and that's W-H-O-A.

: 1134

00:55:44,847 --> 00:55:46,227

So gowhoazone.com.

: 1135

00:55:46,902 --> 00:55:47,232

Brian Searl: Awesome.

: 1136

00:55:47,232 --> 00:55:49,512

Thank you guys for another good

episode of MC Fireside Chats.

: 1137

00:55:49,512 --> 00:55:50,592

I think it was a pretty good discussion.

: 1138

00:55:50,962 --> 00:55:53,302

We'll see you next week for another

episode and then in two hours, if

: 1139

00:55:53,302 --> 00:55:56,092

you're not sick of me yet, we have

our new podcast called Outwired.

: 1140

00:55:56,422 --> 00:55:58,222

We're gonna be doing with

Scott Bahr and Greg Emer.

: 1141

00:55:58,222 --> 00:56:02,092

We're gonna talk a lot about data, some of

the different things that we think impact

: 1142

00:56:02,092 --> 00:56:03,742

consumers' decisions more than others.

: 1143

00:56:03,742 --> 00:56:05,722

In other words, like hard

data versus soft data.

: 1144

00:56:06,112 --> 00:56:08,497

So like gas prices, does that

impact it more versus soft

: 1145

00:56:08,497 --> 00:56:09,992

data and things like that.

: 1146

00:56:09,992 --> 00:56:12,002

So we're gonna get into a good

discussion about that and break down

: 1147

00:56:12,002 --> 00:56:13,622

some data details and statistics.

: 1148

00:56:14,132 --> 00:56:15,422

So if you stick around,

we'll see you then.

: 1149

00:56:15,452 --> 00:56:16,922

Otherwise, we'll see you

next week on another episode.

: 1150

00:56:16,922 --> 00:56:17,432

Thanks guys.

: 1151

00:56:17,432 --> 00:56:17,792

See you later.

: 1152

00:56:17,792 --> 00:56:18,322

Joe Duemig: Thanks, Brian.

: 1153

00:56:18,322 --> 00:56:18,812

Jen Rice: Thank you.

: 1154

00:56:18,992 --> 00:56:19,497

Lucy Comer: Cheers, bye!

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MC Fireside Chats - April 9th, 2025