The epic showdown between vampires and werewolves takes center stage as Joshua Noel, Will Rose, and Christian Ashley dive into one of pop culture's fiercest feuds. They each take a side in this legendary rivalry but not without a twist: their challenge is to uncover the silver linings lurking in the shadows of their opposing factions. Expect a lively discourse as they explore the lore behind these iconic creatures, the nuanced characteristics that make them both terrifying and relatable, and the lessons we can learn from their eternal struggle. From classic films to modern adaptations, these hosts dissect the qualities that define each side and ultimately reveal that, in the world of monsters, there's always a glimmer of good to be found. Buckle up for a wild ride filled with clever banter, unique insights, and a touch of humor that'll keep you entertained while pondering the deeper meanings behind these beloved legends.

A fierce debate brews as Joshua, Will, and Christian dive into the timeless feud between vampires and werewolves, exploring the nuances and complexities that lie beneath the surface of these iconic creatures. In a light-hearted yet thought-provoking manner, each host takes a side, passionately defending their chosen creature while also attempting to find the good in the opposing side. The episode, part of the flagship series 'Finding the Good in...' under the 2025 theme of polarization, illustrates how even the fiercest rivals can share common ground, be it in their motivations or their struggles with identity. Joshua brings his unique charm, presenting vampires as creatures of allure and tragedy, while Will argues for the raw, untamed nature of werewolves, emphasizing their connection to the primal instincts that reside within us all. Meanwhile, Christian offers a more philosophical take, discussing the moral implications of each creature's existence and the inherent struggles they face. As they dissect various IPs, from classic horror films to modern adaptations, listeners are treated to a witty banter filled with clever remarks and insightful commentary on the cultural significance of these mythical beings. The hosts challenge each other, and the audience, to reconsider their preconceived notions about what it means to be a monster and what it means to be human, creating a rich tapestry of discussion that is as entertaining as it is enlightening.

Takeaways:

• In this episode, the hosts engage in a playful debate, picking sides in the age-old feud between vampires and werewolves while hilariously attempting to find the good in both camps.
• Listeners are treated to a light-hearted exploration of various pop culture references, showcasing the unique traits and quirks of both vampires and werewolves that make them endearing characters.
• The hosts cleverly highlight how each side embodies different aspects of human nature, with vampires representing control and seduction, while werewolves symbolize primal instincts and the struggle between humanity and animalistic urges.
• Throughout the discussion, the idea of redemption arcs is explored, suggesting that both vampires and werewolves can serve as metaphors for personal growth and the battle against one’s darker impulses in a humorous yet thought-provoking manner.

.

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Get 10% off our 2025 exclusive t-shirt, "Finding the good in us all!" with this promo code:

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Don't miss any of our "Finding the Good" episodes:

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Listen to all of Christian's episodes:

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Foreign.

Who will win the ultimate fight for the night?

Vampires or werewolves?

Where we try to find the good in the other side of some of these iconic feuds in our fandom.

Today, we're looking at vampires and werewolves across several ips.

We're gonna have a fun time with it.

I am Joshua Noel.

I exist.

God put me on this planet to introduce other people.

And today I am introducing the two men I know with the fanciest haircuts.

The one and only Will Rose.

How's it going?

Yeah.

Christian.

Ashley.

Head gets rounder every day.

Joshua.

The head gets rounder every day.

And I lose a follicle every day.

Listen, I'm saying you get the best haircut when you have less hairs to worry about.

So you can really focus on one, you know, and that's.

It's just.

It's a really good strategy.

And I'm working on mine.

I got like.

I'm getting to that, like a Friar Tuck kind of look.

Yeah.

And I'm wondering if there's like bald werewolves out there at all, if there any.

And if the shine off the top of my head will ward off vampires.

One of the IPS I'm going to talk about have at least one bald werewolf.

But we'll get to that in a minute.

I am.

We got to do what we're geeking out on.

I'm going to surprise everybody.

I've been geeking out on Kingdom Hearts.

Specifically.

I'm playing three different versions of the first game at the same time right now.

That way I can compare them level by level as I think I've determined.

I'm not sure, but I actually think the Steam version might be the best version of the first game because it fixes the balance so that the magic isn't just absolutely the correct answer and the color scheme is okay.

For some reason.

All the other new renditions of Kingdom Hearts past the first one, they messed the color scheme up and it irritated me.

This version doesn't irritate me as much.

Christian, what have you been geeking out on lately?

You know, there are days I wonder if I'm on the spectrum, and then other days ago, well, other people are a little bit more off than I.

That's fine.

God created us all wonderfully, beautifully.

You know what?

I wouldn't be surprised if either of us were, and I would embrace it completely.

But me, I have been geeking out on just recently.

Watched A horror film called Shaman.

It's about some missionaries, I believe, in Ecuador having to cast out, exorcise a demon who, in the midst of this village, they're trying to reach.

It's one of the worst films I've ever seen.

Terrible characters all around.

Wouldn't recommend.

All right.

And Will.

What?

What do you mean?

I don't have anything to say.

That sounds like a horror film.

You're correct.

Right.

Well, we.

We are in spooky season.

So in prep for fall spooky season and what we're talking about on this particular episode, I've.

I've put up what we do in the Shadows, that series.

I've.

I've watched different clips.

I've seen memes I'm following from season one and Fallen all the way through, and I've heard of them.

I'm giggling and I'm laughing, and there's a couple of things that maybe the.

The people who make it don't think is that funny, but like a throwaway line.

But I'm giggling even louder than the rest of my family because that's kind of my sense of.

That's my sense of humor is right up my alley with my sense of humor, and I'm loving it.

Great.

Seriously, no, great movie.

I think that's one of those things my parents try to get me to see very seldomly.

My, like, man, I need to watch that when they.

When they say things.

Because usually it's police dramas and if they're listening.

I'm sorry, I just don't care that much about police dramas that aren't, like, specifically Monk or Psych or some ncis.

But that's.

That's a topic for another day.

Today we're talking about vampires and werewolves.

First, we're going to shout out one of our financial supporters.

Today we're giving all of our love to Trip Fuller.

Dude, you're awesome.

This is going to come out around the same time as Theology Beer Camp, so I don't know if it's.

It's probably too late for people to get tickets.

Maybe not.

If not, meet some of us over there.

Um, I'm not sure if I've sent this text yet, but I'm not going to be able to make it this year, and I'm sad about that.

So I'm going to extra shout out Tripp because I love him dearly and I'm heartbroken that I won't see him, but he lives in, like, the state next to me, so maybe I can drive over.

But guys, we Also want to remind you guys, if you want your own shout out, that probably won't be as long.

You can go to our fourth wall page and subscribe over there.

Become a member and we will shout you out on the show even if you're a free member.

Sometimes I just shout people out because I'm like, you know what?

I'm sure they're free because they want to support and can't.

And I just assume the best of everybody.

I also want to assume the best of everybody that if they could afford one of the limited time edition T shirts that go with our annual theme, Finding the Good, that they totally would.

And so I'm going to give a promo code in the description for 10% off.

If anybody wants that Finding the Good T shirt, check your show descriptions because I just decided on air that I was doing that, remember?

Of course, I also had to let you guys know that there's the playlist if you want to hear all of this series.

So we got a few episodes already in the queue there.

So check it out.

I think they've all been great.

I've loved elves and doors, love science and magic.

Will and I did Disney parents and Disney children.

It has been a blast, and I can't wait to see where it goes next.

This is the last one of the episodes I'll be on, but you'll get plenty of Christian.

The last two are Christian and tj.

All right, so they're gonna finish this one strong for us.

I believe in them, but for now, I will and I are going to say adieu to this year's annual theme with this episode talking about werewolves and vampires.

Nice.

And what IPs we're most familiar with with them.

So first let's go to some of the history of vampire and werewolf lore.

Christian is the author.

You know, we have the Doctor from Doctor who, but Christian's the author.

He's the first one to ever write anything down.

And he travels around time and writing things.

So, Christian, could you tell us how you invented werewolves and vampires?

Well, I can't lay claim to that one in particular.

And this is something that's common across many different cultures in the world.

We've got the Nosophoros of Greek myth.

Sometimes the Empusa are considered to be part of that.

We've got the Aswang of Filipino folklore.

Jiangxi in China, you have a culture.

They probably have a vampire myth out there.

Less common are werewolves, but there's plenty of cultures out there where were creatures are a big thing depending on where you are.

You have were leopards, were jackals, were crocodiles.

I mean we just have this tendency to see if we can.

Is it possible for a man or woman to change from their human appearance into something else?

And both of these kind of fit in different ways here.

And what we know of mythology for some of these things is very mixed because every culture has a different way of looking at things.

Some things staking a vampire is the only way you can kill it.

Some things, silver bullets and the like.

Well, guess where that got invented in the Wolfman movie.

A lot of the myths that we know about common wolfman lore come from the Universal horror films.

They invented pretty much everything on the spot for them.

And once you know that you go oh wow.

It's kind of, kind of interesting, but it's fine.

You know, when you're making stuff up like this, you know, there's no harm in doing something like that.

Obviously it was culturally relevant enough to where people still use it today.

Right.

I just to, just to piggyback on that a little bit.

I think in, in myths and cultures there's always this mystery of like shape shifters, you know, and what can.

Is there such thing as a human animal hybrid?

If we look at.

We can't do shape shifters too.

I know but I'm so like.

But if you're shifting, it's part of the process.

If you're shifting into like another animal, like a werewolf or were alligator, whatever, you know, what is it.

And then, and then Zeus, you know, disguised himself in, in certain animals and came down as, as bulls and other other animals.

So like this, the gods disguising themselves as other animals and cultures and things to, to spy or be among us is a part of the, the mythology or the long term mythology.

And so why.

But, but also you know, in terms of history of monsters and horror and imagining what monsters could get us or not get us or prowling us or devouring us take many shapes and sizes.

So this one as it's been personified in the classic horror movies and things, it is interesting to see what has stuck in terms of the myth around it and some of the ips that are out there around that and, and the whole like history of like the full moon, like it, it pulls on the tides.

People going, people going like oh there's, there's something about students acting up in class on full moons.

Teachers know this.

There's something a little bit.

Kids going a little bit wild when it comes to the moons and the tides and is there something connected to that too?

So I'm curious.

I didn't go a big deep dive in the history, but it's how they're all kind of connected with these things is pretty neat.

Yeah.

And just to comfort anybody wondering if Will ever becomes a werewolf, we don't need to be afraid because he'll only turn to a wolf at full night.

And I'm convinced his urge as a surfer will conquer his urge as a werewolf.

And you'll just see a wolf on a surfing board on the ocean every full moon.

I've definitely surfed at night on a full moon before.

I'm gonna make chat BT give me that image now because that's, that's one I need Will as a, as a werewolf surfing.

That's the channel original movie surfing.

Werewolf.

Teen teen instead of Teen Wolf.

50, 50 year old midlife wolf surfing.

Yeah.

Just to insert a little bit more here.

Most of what we think of as vampire in werewolf, there are versions of it throughout all the different cultures.

Like Christian was saying, most of what we're familiar with is going to come from your Slavic and Greek lore, which again goes to like, what Will talk about some of the gods.

Of course there was a difference of shapeshifters and we still see that in most of the IPs now.

And that's where it's like, if anybody wants a cop out, you can just say werewolf first vampire.

I choose shapeshifter, which is why Dracula doesn't really count as a vampire.

He also turned into wolves and different things.

If you look at your original Slavic, like story of Dracula, he wasn't considered a traditional vampire because he could turn into things other than bats.

And he does turn into a wolf in the story, which why most people, not most older stories, don't portray him that way.

But as Universal came along and we have that version of Dracula, we more think of him as a vampire.

But that's neither here nor there.

That's a whole other thing.

Mr. Bram Stoker had nothing to say about that.

That's another.

You know, it's just, you know, it's one of those, like, if you read like the Gothic.

What I like to do is find people who, like you can find people who archive letters.

People wrote about some of these stories during Gothic times.

And I love those because it's basically like you're seeing people geek out back in like 18th century and it's like, this is fun.

And some of it I'm like, I think these guys Lost the ball.

And some of it I'm like, that's probably would be my literate of will if I.

During that time, you know.

So, yeah, a lot of it too was to try and keep children away from being out at night.

You know, a lot of these folk stories have a purpose.

They're not just there for their own existing.

But it is during kind of your more gothic literature times where you see both, but you don't see the crossovers of vampires and werewolves until the Universal movie.

So, yeah, again, we're talking about the feud.

We're going back to those old Universal monster films.

But both you'll see dark magic conjuring.

All that kind of stuff would kind of be their origins in the Slavic stories.

And what's really fun is at some point the folklore of it all would basically say bad people and werewolves, when they died, would become vampires.

So that's your first real connection of the two is there was a belief at one point that werewolves, when they died, became vampires.

Not sure how that works.

Doesn't make any sense to me.

But it's interesting.

And also, bad people don't be bad.

You'll die.

I don't know why that's so.

I never.

That's one thing I never said why There are a couple monsters that I don't get.

And that's why, like, person Mickey, if I'm even on the spectrum, I'm like, sometimes I feel like maybe because I'm like angels that throw me back in time and I live my life to its fullest in a different time era.

Yeah, the show was cool, but that's not that scary.

Becoming a vampire and living forever.

Oh, no, I don't get it sometimes.

But that's fine.

I'm Josh with the wrong opinions for a reason.

So we do want to talk about which IPs were mainly pulling from.

From our perspective.

So, like each of us are going to pick a side, but we're kind of biased.

Right.

Like, I probably haven't seen everything Christian said.

Most of what Christian said on his rant, I didn't know what it meant.

And a lot of what we'll watched and read probably isn't the same as me.

So we're probably all coming from different perspectives here.

So we don't talk about, like, which ips were mainly pulling from.

And I'll let Will go first this time since Christian went first last time.

Yeah, on the vampire side, like I. I really a family favorite movie of ours and one of my wife's favorite movies of all Time because she grew up on.

It was Lost Boys.

And we love that movie.

We, we watch it every season.

It's Lost.

It's Lost Boys season in our, in our household.

I love Blade.

I love Interview with a Vampire.

I am legend, as you said.

I'm as I shared when I'm geeking out on what we do in the shadow.

So, so I do.

I, I do like some of the classic Universal monsters and, and Dracula there.

When it comes to werewolves, I'm.

I'm pulling from like, I'm a kid of the 80s, man.

So like Michael Jackson's Thriller video, that's.

That's shaped my mindset a lot when it comes to dancing choreography, dope beats, as the kids say.

Oh, yeah.

And.

And someone turning into a werewolf.

So I do like Underworld series.

Another 80s Michael J.

Fox Teen Wolf.

I mean, who doesn't want to be a teen wolf playing basketball and dominating his opponents as a werewolf, riding on top of a van, surfing.

Come on.

Like, if you haven't seen that movie, go watch it.

I haven't seen most of what you've listed for the.

I haven't seen.

There's another 80s.

There's another 80s movie that was filmed in Wilmington called Sur Silver Bullet and Stephen King filmed in Wilmington in the 80s Dilo De Laurentiis at his studio spread out Wilmington, North Carolina.

So, so there's that and then American and American Werewolf and London freaked me out as a kid.

And then there's the Howling.

So.

So all those.

Can't say I'm a big Twilight fan, but I know of it.

And so I'm going to divert away from that and any of my arguments from either of these sides.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I'm going to do my best not to geek shame because I know there's a lot of people who have legitimate reasons to like it.

And it made a couple years ago.

Sure did.

It sure did.

My family dove right into it.

But this is how I'll put my perspective on those films in the nicest way possible.

In college, when I was less.

When I cared less about offending people and, you know, trying not to.

Geek shame.

We were playing charades one night and it took two seconds when I got the card.

Twilight.

I literally made only two hand gestures for bad film.

And one of my closest friends, not even my best friend, immediately got it.

It took almost no time at all.

So, Christian, which IPs are you mainly pulling from in this conversation?

Before we pick sides, I'm going to.

Have to limit myself A lot.

Because I've read and watched a lot.

Yeah, just the main ones.

Yeah.

I mean, because obviously you got Bram Stoker's Dracula.

You've got the original novel, you've got movies made off of that.

Universal Horror Hammer horror films have always been huge with me.

Both vampires and werewolves.

Then of course there's Blade.

Gotta love Blade.

And everything that he brought to the film industry.

And from the comics too.

From the Tomb of Dracula, which was a series that ran in the 70s from Marvel.

He also had a fight with Spider man and like Giant size Spider Man.

Then his.

Well, we've got giant size comic book, not Giant size Spider Man.

Right, okay.

Yes.

Like I want to read Giant Spider Man.

That sounds fun.

Yeah.

We don't talk about Giant sized Man thing though.

See it as well.

There's hellsing on the anime side of things.

There's plenty of other werewolves to go there.

Literature.

Go Dresden Files.

Love that series so much.

You get werewolves.

Vampires are a huge threat in the books.

Trying to think of what else?

Oh, Buffy the Vampire Slayer.

I mean, it's in the title.

Love series.

Yeah, Tremendously well done.

Werewolves show up a little bit.

Vampires more so often given the name.

I'm trying to think.

And of course Alvin and the Chipmunks Meet the Wolfman, Classic cinematic masterpiece.

And Scooby Doo and the Reluctant Werewolf, also classic cinematic masterpiece.

For myself.

Before I reveal which side I'm picking.

A little bit different from the other guys.

I don't know if this is more or less mainstream.

We'll see Supernatural TV series has vampires and werewolves.

I'm going to pull from them, obviously the Universal monster movies.

We mentioned the Twilight films.

I'm not really going to pull from them, but I'm going to acknowledge them because I believe that the geeks who are fans of that deserve the respect because it's a big fandom for a reason.

As much as I want to belittle it.

The True Blood series.

Listen, I'm going to.

I'm going to reveal some things about myself that sometimes this is like the stuff that I geek out on that sometimes I don't, you know, put out in the open as much.

I love the True Blood series on hbo.

Forgot about that one.

Forgot about.

I love the Vampire Diaries and the originals.

I'm a huge fan.

Listen, I was right there with all the girlies when Damon did his eyebrow raise thing and I Was like, ah, I love them Elder Scrolls.

I'm gonna pull a lot from them, actually.

Marvel Comics.

And surprisingly, to some people, probably I'm also gonna pull some from Adventure Time.

Some of my favorite.

One of my favorite vampire stories actually, is a run on Adventure Time.

I'm going to go back.

Yeah, that was so good.

Stakes was such a good.

Sorry.

If you're going to watch any Adventure Time, if that's the only one, I think it's worth it, honestly.

Yes.

Because it stands on its own.

But I'm going to go back to Elder Scrolls before we pick a side, because how it divides things up is, I think, really well done to kind of understand kind of the dichotomy here.

So different from normal lore.

Normal lore.

It's just kind of like a curse or it's whatever.

We don't exactly know the origins of werewolves and vampires a lot of the times in Elder Scrolls, we do know the origins of the vampires and werewolves in the video game franchise.

They're from Daedric entities.

Christian, if I say these wrong, just correct me.

Molag Bal started the vampires, and he's kind of.

Actually, I had this pulled up on a.

Pull it up here in a second.

But the other one is Hircine started the werewolves.

Is that correct?

Yes.

Yeah.

The molecule stuff should probably not talk about in the family program.

You know, we're not going to get too deep into it, but we are going to.

I'm going to read off how they're described.

So the reason that they have a feud in the Elder Scrolls is because they're two different.

The Daedric are basically like demon gods, for sake of simplicity.

Is that an okay way of saying it?

That's perfectly fine.

Okay.

So the followers of Molag, BAAL or whatever, they are following a different demon God, basically, than the ones who are following Hircine.

So that's why the feud exists in this world is because the Daedric are jealous gods, evil jealous gods.

So you can't serve two.

You know, you got to pick your master, more or less.

And for some reason in this world, becoming a vampire cures year of werewolfism and becoming a werewolf cures your vampirism.

We're just not getting into that.

But the vampire God is of domination, undeath and corruption.

The werewolf God is the hunt, the thrill of life and death as a struggle, as a cycle.

So that's kind of what they're the gods of.

And that thus vampires act one way, werewolves act the other.

In line with the Daedric I think that puts really well the difference between vampires and werewolves.

So that's why I want to start with that.

Can we kind of agree on that?

Vampires kind of standing for domination, undeath, corruption.

Werewolves standing for, like, the hunt and a kind of maybe human cravenness.

Life and death cycle.

Yeah, yeah.

Now, can we also agree that, like, vampires is something about consuming another individual?

I guess, as a part of that, like, they both.

I would say they both are part of that.

Okay.

In different ways.

In different ways.

But that when I think of vampire of, like, sucking the soul of another person and transforming them into what they are, I think werewolves do that, do the same.

But the Beast Within, Jekyll and Hyde, Incredible Hulk, I. I kind of lean towards werewolves.

I push back a little bit on that just because a lot of the lore that I do that I'm following, like, Supernatural, vampires don't necessarily turn everybody.

They might just drink you and they don't want to turn you.

Marceline, if we're talking about, like, Adventure Time, she's just drinking the color red.

She's not even drinking blood.

Vampire Diaries, you have vampires that are drinking bloodbath.

So I don't think it's necessarily.

At least modernly, I think originally it probably was, but I think in modern pop culture, I don't think vampirism necessarily means draining a soul.

Well, that's the thing, though.

We're not going to have, like, a consistent, you know, tier for what a vampire is and what a werewolf is, because IP's over hundreds of years that have made their own, like, why a vampire can be weak to garlic in one series and not another.

No, why a werewolf is weak to silver in one and not another.

You know, it's just people doing their own thing with the tropes that have been built on before them.

Yeah.

Now, what I do think is consistent before we pick sides, because I think we can probably agree on this.

It seems pretty consistent for the most part, not all the time.

I think Supernatural is one of the exceptions to this.

For whatever reason, vampires are weak to werewolves, and vampires are kind of the ones that are hurting humans more than werewolves are.

Vampires are kind of controlling the humans almost.

Is that kind of a consistent with you guys?

Hypnotism, seduction.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that makes sense.

More often than not, you're dealing with a creature that's active more often than the other one in their changed form, so they have more time to be tactical and plan and connive because they're also pretty much immortal functionally.

And werewolves Are more than likely something that hasn't.

They can live longer depending on the story.

They're not going to have the time that a vampire would do.

What a patience.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So, so I'm going to make will go first because like, if I lived in the world of Elder Scrolls and I'm like, man, I don't know if which demon I want to serve Pastor, I'm going to go to my pastor, be like, pastor, which demon should I serve?

Should I be a vampire or werewolf?

And what are you going to tell me other than not to serve a demon, perhaps?

Yeah, I'm gonna say don't serve a demon.

But I, but I, I'm, I'm gonna go werewolves because I, I like dogs.

I like the songs.

That's fair.

Yeah, I like full moons because usually have big waves, big tides, the whole full moon thing, mystery.

I, I, I'm gonna go werewolf.

But I do see like, you know, I, I can't see the good the other.

I, I, in terms of.

Yeah, yeah.

Immortality.

Although we'll get there.

We'll get there.

But I'm, I'm gonna, I'm gonna go for, for now how I'm feeling.

I'm going to say I'm going werewolves.

I want to.

Yeah.

Creature of the night, that full moon comes out.

Time to go for a prowl, man.

All right, all right.

Christian, Christian, tell me.

Yeah, Master of the divine, which Daedric should I follow?

You should serve Talos like a good human, but forced to choose between the two and saying my morals are off, I'm going to choose werewolves out of these two.

And I'm not saying either one is like a good option, but, but on my side of things, I'm not directly breaking the covenant multiple times mentioned over in scripture of not drinking blood because blood is life and any being that would subsist on such a thing is inherently demonic in nature, is inherently evil because it's doing the antithetically acting against God's creation.

So vampires, of course, which makes them excellent villains, don't get me wrong, because they're acting in defiance of God in that way.

But I can't in good conscience go on that side.

Okay, I'm gonna respond to that before I give my answer.

So first, I'm not a biblical literalist.

I don't think there's actually any covenant about drinking blood.

I don't think that applies today.

However, I do think that giving the history of German and Slavic cultures, that probably was in the mind of the people who started the Vampire lore.

So, like, Christian's not wrong, man, that tasted bad.

I don't like saying that anyway, man.

You know, my gut said werewolf.

My.

Like, really, if I'm thinking about it morally and, like, what I stand for, what I don't stand for, and I'm like, man, vampires representing oppression.

No, I want to go werewolf.

And when I first picked this as one of our topics for our annual theme a year ago, I had in my mind how I was gonna argue for werewolves when everybody else, I thought, was gonna choose vampires because vampires are more popular.

Like, I had that in my mind for a year.

So this year, a couple weeks ago, actually, I started preparing.

I was like, I'm gonna.

I'm gonna have my argument.

Because I was assuming you guys were gonna say vampires.

Up until a few days ago, you.

Thought I would choose that demon.

Come on, come on.

Then as I started, like, writing stuff out, I think my lived experience has told me otherwise.

When I go through the stories that I like the most, I'd be really sad if the vampires lost, actually.

So characters are why I'm going to choose vampires over werewolves.

Because even though morally, I think werewolves are probably in the right more than vampire, and even though my gut wants to say werewolves because werewolf just identify more that, you know, like that nature primal thing.

But on the side of vampires, I have Marceline, I have Benny and Lafette from Supernatural.

I have Sookie Starkhouse.

I have Bill Compton.

I have Elijah Michaelson.

I have Damon.

I have Morbius.

I have Bl.

I just.

I don't know.

The characters I love just tend to be vampires.

I guess I'm stuck with this side, even if it seems to go against my.

My intuition a little bit.

But I will say, part of me really wanted to get on here and say.

Actually, instead of either, I'm gonna go with, why wolves?

Because that's also a thing.

In Supernatural, instead of a werewolf, you could become a Wy.

Wolf and become really contemplative every full moon.

Yeah.

Yes.

One of my favorite bits.

There's just sometimes, like, part two is just fantastic.

Okay, so we chose our sites.

Why do we think I'll throw this to Christian first?

This feud has continued to show up so many times in our different favorite shows.

It's shown up a lot in, like, what, 80 years now?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, you know what?

One thing humans are really good at doing.

Fighting.

Another good thing.

Humans.

I would never.

How dare you accuse me exactly.

Arguing about who would win in the fight.

So the moment you have two different forces of any kind, samurai, cowboy, ninja, Roman soldier, whatever, vampire, werewolf, you're gonna say, who would win in the fight?

Well, it's been a thing in Marvel.

It's been a thing in dc.

Can Thor beat the Hulk?

You know, can Superman beat Captain Marvel?

Or Shazam do this, blah, blah, blah.

Like it's.

It's a question we ask because we know, well, this person, they look like they're the best, but is the Flash actually faster than Superman could.

What's going on with that?

So we have vampires who are this inherently evil creature.

We have werewolves, who, yeah, there's a tragedy.

More aspect to them.

They're still inherently evil in that they attack prey and people who are defenseless and try and eat them.

So, like, well, we pitch put them against each other, like, who's going to come out on top?

Because that's what we like doing.

We like arguing.

There's a reason the who would win subreddit, as stupid as some of the arguments could get, sometimes, is as popular as it is, because we like arguing about who would win.

And we went, we have our team, we have our guy.

So we have.

And that's why you have the death battle program that I'm also not super big on, because I think they abuse feats way too much.

But you know what?

That's part of the fandom.

It's like we like arguing.

And they're going to say something.

I'm going to go with no.

When this specific issue here, it says this, and they're going to say, well, actually, in this issue here, it says this, which contradicts what you say.

So.

And of course, when we get werewolves and vampires, you have multiple types you can throw into the equation.

So it makes it even more convoluted, which means it's even harder to answer the question.

So it's fun to argue.

And I love arguing.

You know, I know TJ and Andy are part of why this year's polarization theme didn't become a series of episodes of who would win in a fight?

Because TJ hates power scaling, so he wouldn't let me.

And yeah, he is.

You know, Trip might be the podfather, but TJ is pod almighty.

So.

But Andy also brought up the point where he's like, wait, what about people who really, really love some of these fathoms?

Why would we do this?

And then I'm like, oh, man, Andy's right.

That's not really in tune with what our show's about.

So instead we made it finding the Good.

And I think it's been a better exercise overall rather than power scaling and talking about how, you know, Tyler Lockwood was overpowered in Vampire Diaries.

It's fine.

Will you have anything to add?

I have some more thoughts, but I wanted to throw it to Will first.

Yeah.

I think, you know, again, monsters at night, the dark, the unknown.

I think both being creatures of the night, they're not really day walkers, that they're controlled or werewolves are transformed by a full moon at night.

You know, those kinds of things.

I think who, who's going to have the most power over the darkness of night and the King of the monsters or you know, the, the funny.

And I just saw the episode and what we do in the shadows of the, the very loose truce between werewolves and vampires and why they, you, one or the other is not taken over America or the Northeast, wherever they are.

Very, very funny.

And what breaks those truths.

But I, yeah, I, I think, yeah, that the, the rivalry between these Creatures of the Night I think is legit and has adored it makes for fun, imaginative.

Who, what if humans are caught in the middle and who would win and what would happen?

I, I, I love the speculative fiction there, that, that they're kind of ironing out that stuff.

So I think the rivalry and Creature of the Night is, is good and, and it's not going to go away, that's for sure.

Yeah, yeah.

And I agree with all that.

I also think I'm, I'm doing the.

Yes, and, but I think you can actually trace back the theme.

So in most horror, it's not actually about the monster, but it, you know, reflecting on our own selves, our own sins, more or less.

Even though maybe a lot of directors and writers wouldn't use word sin, but it's fine.

Also, it does have to do with like the origins of the stories being kind of similar, them both appearing so much in Gothic literature.

It's natural for them to show up in the same stories, I think.

And Universal Monsters did a really good job of showing how like Frankenstein, Wolfman, a lot of these monsters, it's actually more about the battle within.

Right.

Wolfman doesn't want to become the monster and tear things apart, whereas Dracula, it's about power, it's about control.

And I think their, their motives are perfectly juxtaposed where the Wolfman doesn't want to be a monster and he's trying not to hurt other people, but he's, occasionally he gives into his primal nature.

Right.

Whereas the vampire has casted his body aside.

You know, those of us who are Christians who believe there is a reason God created us with a body can see the problems in some of this vampire stuff.

And I took the vampire side, but it's fine.

They cast the body aside.

They cast their primal nature aside so that why they could have control of their own life, they can have control over others.

They're the exact opposite of werewolves.

So seeing the motives juxtaposed, it makes perfect sense.

And then that's why I think.

Guys, I just hate.

I hate championing the show, honestly.

But I think Vampire Diaries did this so well, because the motives are pretty much the same, right?

Vampires want control of their life.

It started with a curse, and it continues as vampires usually do.

You know, the biting, you know, the curse, passing down, people being sired.

It's all about control yourself and others.

Werewolves are genetic.

In Vampire Diaries, you're born with this thing.

And if you accidentally kill someone in an accident or something, boom.

That thing in your genetics is triggered.

And all of a sudden, you become a wolf once every full moon.

And it has nothing to do with your own choices.

It's your own primal instinct.

And then seeing where in that show a werewolf bite kills a vampire, and then you have it all come to.

You know, you have Nicholas Klaus, who is the perfect hybrid, and he's trying to control the werewolves now.

And that's where I think it is.

It's.

Humans are just kind of the fodder.

Werewolves happen to not want to kill humans.

Vampires just want control.

They don't care.

They could care less if they kill humans or not.

They want control for the most part.

And that's where I see, for me, it's more of a Sodom and Gomorrah thing.

You know, where I'm like, abraham was God.

And I'm like, wait a minute.

I know vampires are evil, but.

But God, what if.

What if I find one Marceline?

What if I find one Daemon?

Can we save vampires for Bill Compton?

But realistically, they're about control.

They're about power as a whole, whereas werewolves are about trying to defeat their own primal nature.

So I think it just makes sense that the motives are juxtaposed and we see the feud continue.

I am in a rambly mood today, and I'm sorry, I feel like I explained why I chose my side already a little bit.

So I'm going to defer this question since I've talked so much and my voice is bothering me.

Christian, why have you chose the werewolf.

Outside of what I said before about blood drinking, I think there's a nobility inherent to some werewolf folklore and movies and comics and that you're having depending on who you are as a person.

When you're turned into a werewolf, you have to have that desire to deny yourself.

And that's a very human experience to begin with, is that we have to, along the way, learn, just because I have this impulse, just because I have this thought, just because I really want to engage in this sin, that it's not a good thing for me to do, that I am less of a human when I engage in these things.

I cause harm to other people.

And werewolves, it's quite literally they become less of a human when they engage in primal instincts that they would never do or maybe they would do if their inhibitions were, you know, overridden or they knew they could get away with it.

And that there's something incredibly noble about a person who does everything in their power to make sure they don't hurt someone like that.

They take every precaution that they can to prevent death, to prevent the loss of life, whether that be they attack an animal instead, or whether they keep themselves caged in a secure facility, or even if they know they're going to be out and about, they go after, let's say they go to Dexter kind of way and they go after serial or mobsters or, you know, sexual assaulters or whatever, because.

Well, that's an interesting story.

Yeah.

Can you use that power for good?

And yet, same thing could be said for certain things of vampirism, but I find it a lot harder to do because in order to exist, you have to take life from elsewhere.

And once again, it depends on what continuity you're in, what series you're in, whether that is, can you just drink a blood at a blood bank and you're fine, or is there a synthetic kind of blood you can drink?

Or do you actually have to go after evil people and drink from them?

But I think it's harder to do on the vampire see side of things than it is for a werewolf to justify behavior like that.

Yeah, I think of werewolves as really wrestling with the Satan center within and what comes out.

Which.

Which wolf are you gonna.

Which wolf are you gonna feed, you know, good or evil, you know, and that kind of thing.

And so what's going to take over for.

Towards you?

And I do, and I think of vampires, I definitely think of the objectification of the other person, the.

The one to consume the other person to drink.

Like they see Them as food, as a means by which their own pleasure or lust or hunger that they have.

And you could say the same with any monster.

Same with werewolves.

But I. I do think, you know, again, like, I'm watching what we do in the shadows, and they're like, oh, bring us virgins so we can.

Oh, they taste the best, you know, that.

That kind of thing.

And they're playing off this lore of, you know, again, I look at a buffet table, and I'm like, what do I like on this buffet table?

And I'm sure vampires look different types of humans.

What are they like, What.

What are their tastes?

And.

And werewolves are really wrestling with the animal within.

And, you know, to name drop a character that maybe Joshua doesn't know, since he named some characters.

I don't know.

I think of Rain Sinclair from the new.

From the New Mutants, the X Men who.

Wolfsbane who can transform into a wolf and.

And a werewolf kind of in between.

And they still retain their human intelligence.

They still retain their own personality.

They're just in wolf form.

And she tends to be religious, was raised in conservative animals household, so she was shamed as being a sinner, not only just having a mutant gene, but also becoming an evil wolf and all a demonic person.

She wrestles with who she is and her identity with that.

So when I'm thinking of, like, I guess vampires can retain their own personality when they become a vampire or trans, you know, transform to that, werewolves, I also think about, like, do I become more dog?

Like, do I become more animal?

Or do I retain my own.

My own personality, my own intelligence?

And that kind of comes into play when I think about those things too, but that's where I'm at.

Yeah.

And I think the reason I relate more to vampire creatures is probably characters, not creatures.

I always do feel a little bit off when I think about werewolves.

It almost just feels so normal to have that primal instinct where sometimes you just want to snap at people or you just have these cravings.

And I'm like, man, not to sound like that guy, but, like, a lot of times I just.

I don't have that.

Like, I don't have that.

Where I'm like, ah, I'm gonna get really mad.

I just want to tear into the other person.

Doesn't really happen for me, but I do feel this.

Like, the thing with vampires is that, like, consistent need to want to have control.

That's something I relate to.

I wish I didn't, but I do.

I relate to that.

I do constantly want to control this control our show.

And why am I letting them vote on episodes for next year's theme?

I will choose all of the episodes.

It's only Kingdom Hearts.

Look, I have that in me that I'm constantly having that fight, not, like occasionally having an urge to rip into somebody.

So I just feel like sometimes it's easier to relate to these characters.

And then Marceline, she chooses to drink red.

It's just hard to hate Marceline.

She just chose, I'm gonna drink the color red instead of blood, which is hilarious.

But, you know, you have Stefan at his best moments in Vampire Diaries, choosing the blood bags and stuff.

And, yeah, they're still gonna snap.

They're gonna have moments where they fall off the wagon and they're gonna get back up.

And it's kind of a. I think sometimes it's a metaphor for alcoholism or any kind of, you know, drug thing like that.

Elijah Michaelson existed for thousands of years.

And, you know, what kills pretty minimally is actually more of a good agent in the world.

So, like, sometimes you just see these things, like, yeah, they have these urges for control, but some of them still are able to choose good.

And if we're going to see the good in the other side, I have to see the bad in my own side, personally.

So I'm going to look at Blade.

I think the Blade roll does a really good job of showing the problems with vampire, that desire of control.

You start seeing these organizations where they're coming together and controlling people as a whole.

And there's a hierarchy, and it very much stands in for the church when it's at its worst.

We have a hierarchy.

We want to control people.

We have our own dogmatic rules.

And, you know, like, it's about control.

That's when I think the church is at its worst.

I think that's the worst side of vampirism.

And also it's the most prevalent part of vampirism.

The Stefans and Damon's and Bill Compton's are kind of the exception.

Elijah Michaelson is the exception.

Marceline is huge, the exception.

She was only able to do what she did because she's also the child of Satan.

Which I should add that to our inspiration ideas for next year anyway.

But, you guys, where did you see the good other side.

Because, like, seeing the bat on my side makes it easy to see where, even though I don't love Tyler Lockwood, that idea of the werewolf being the one setting people free, that primal urge, setting people free of the control of the vampires, I'm like, yeah, That's.

Hey, amen.

Yeah, for the vampire side of things.

I mean, it makes a lot of sense why people would want that because of how it's been portrayed in culture as this thing that is worthy of an admiration to an extent.

You go to interview with a vampire, you go with various.

I've never watched True Blood or Vampire Diaries, but I know enough to know that there's a little bit of glamorization there to show the sexual side of them, to make them look like, oh, this is peak beyond what humans could achieve.

Your attractiveness will increase.

Women, men will be fawning all over you.

And what part of us at one point in time hasn't wanted something like that to happen?

To be the most attractive person out there, to have everyone be like, oh, they're the one I need to be after and look for.

So that's definitely part that I can see where that would appeal to people.

And I actually happen to think of something.

I've never read the series, but in the Astro City comics, there's a character called the Confessor who is essentially like the Batman of the story.

And you find out along the way, from what I've read, that he has been a vampire for years, but he's also, I want to say, a Catholic.

And he had for years denied himself what other vampires would do so that he can still be a good person and you could write a very compelling story.

Because, like, I've never read that series, but, like, hearing about that character kind of makes me want to read Astro City by itself, because that's such a cool idea to have a character who otherwise would end up as the villain, and yet, because of faith, because of their own morality won't go beyond where everyone else has gone by this point in time.

So, like this, depending on your writer, you can have a cool idea like that, that, like I said, I think werewolves are a lot easier to write that for.

But a vampire, I could see why someone would be drawn to something like that.

I know it's like there's.

They have a character called the Samaritan, but the Confessor seemed like if you're a Batman creature, all right, who, you know, the reasons chose a bat because it's scary and you're in the middle of the night and you're a creature of the night, it makes sense that you'd be a vampire.

Yeah, I.

You know, again, seeing the good in the other, I. I see the same wrestling with a werewolf of.

Of.

Of trying to wrestle with their inner self and their choices.

And their lusts or their desires.

I see the same with the vampire.

You, we all wish we could be beautiful and attractive to the other person.

Maybe control their minds to, to, to make them want us and then transform them.

Be like us, but also eternal life, immortal, not necessarily undead.

But not having to die like that seems attractive.

But I, I, when I see the good and the other, this, this a vampire that wrestles with the same kind of desires and weaknesses that, that all humans do in terms of the quest for immortality, the wanting to be loved, wanting to control, you know, all that's there with, with vampires to see the good and the other.

I think they could, when done right, they wrestle with the same things that perhaps a werewolf can do.

Even though I see them as more, you know, domineering and objectifying other humans is to see the good in the other.

I guess any personality, if they're retaining their innate personality, maybe, maybe there's some out there who's like, I, I want to use this in a way for good, for others rather than to control and objectify or consume.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Which also I will say by finding the good in the other.

Wolfman is a million times better than Dracula.

I love him.

Which we'll talk about that in some, some of our drive in.

So, so it's fine.

Thinking a little bit deeper before we get to our wrap up stuff.

I do kind of want to throw to you guys.

So usually in our horror stories, and it's easy to see some of these basic ones, like when we're thinking about a vampire story, we're talking about these themes of control and we're looking at our own selves, like, do I have this need of control?

And we're talking about werewolves.

We're looking at this thing of like the primal instinct.

And maybe my primal instinct causes me to do bad things.

Sometimes when we have these monsters that usually are causing us to be introspective, fighting each other, does that distract from that introspection or does it cause us to think of like, what's the greater good or what's the worst evil?

Or like, how do we morally look at these stories where two creatures that we're supposed to root against are against one another and we're often asked to choose sides.

Hashtag Team Edward.

Just kidding.

Yeah, I guess like you go into what is redeemable, you know, is anybody redeemable?

Or is, is, is Dracula, you know, damned in a sense that there's no redemption or coming back.

You, you root for him because maybe, perhaps you see the good in the other.

And is it.

Is salvation or a redemption arc gonna happen for this particular monster, this particular person?

You know, you care for the person as you lead up to the.

The person's transform into a werewolf or gonna be a werewolf.

You're like, they.

They build that story up to say that, hopefully build a way that you care for them and then become the monster.

Like, no, that's not who you truly are.

Go be who you truly.

That's not your real.

Your real person.

So you want to see a redemption arc for anybody?

I think vampires and werewolves both.

Both count now if they're both fighting, like, an underworld, this, you know, ultimate battle, and humans are caught between the two, you're.

Are you rooting for a side or one side to win the other?

Do you pull for one, like, one team or the other?

I don't know.

Probably.

They want to set that up.

I need to go back and watch those series.

But.

But, yeah, I think everyone's deserving of a redemption arc, right?

Everybody.

Everybody.

Maybe not Clemson Christian.

That's just a callback to our sports geeks episode.

For those who want to.

Want to go watch that on YouTube.

Go.

Heels.

They play them this Saturday.

Go.

Not Clemson.

What about you, man?

As far as, like, do you think it's distracting from that introspection, or do you think it adds something to the conversation when we're thinking of, like, the morality behind them?

I guess it depends on the story being told.

Like, you know, when I'm watching a Hammer horror film, like, I'm actively going against Dracula, I want to see Peter Cushing kill Christopher Lee because that he is, by doing so, saving the world from a much larger threat.

As opposed to more modern movies, you know, the 90s.

Bram Stoker's Dracula tries to make him more of a tragic figure, and that's been kind of replayed multiple times.

Another Dracula adaptation since then.

And there is some tragedy to, you know, Vlad Dracul's story to where obviously in real world, he didn't become a vampire allegedly.

But to get to the point where he's at whatever these films are, you go, okay, that's where you started.

But I don't really have a lot of sympathy for you right now because you've had hundreds of years to, you know, be better, to deny yourself, but you've given in to the demon that is your new self in this vampiric form.

So I'm kind of rooting against you.

So when you're staked, in the end, I'm happy or when you survive at the end, I say, well, we've got a Karma Houdini in a film, and I'm not too happy about that when that happens.

Unless there's a sequel where eventually you're gonna die.

On the werewolf side of things.

Same thing is, how's that werewolf being portrayed?

Is it just an absolute monster, not in control of themselves?

Well, then I don't really have any sympathy for that person.

Except when they.

If they can convert back to human form and go, I don't want to be that thing.

Or maybe you have the person who gives into it and that makes them an even worse villain.

So when their death does eventually come, you go, yes, they got exactly what they deserved.

I'm happy to see that once again.

I guess it depends.

Yeah, yeah, I agree.

It definitely depends which media we're talking about.

In Elder Scrolls, the feud, yeah, it's pulls away.

And the only reason I think there's actually a feud is because if a player could both be vampire and werewolf, that that would just be not fun.

They'd be too good.

So.

Yeah, but in, like, other things Supernatural, when you have, like, Mini Lafitte and even some of the werewolves, different creatures, whatever, that shows kind of.

It doesn't really pit them against each other as much.

It's kind of more of like, hey, whatever created all of us, humans, werewolves, everything, maybe that's the evil thing that we should be going up against.

And it's about free will.

And.

Yeah, okay, I think more interesting, like Vampire Diaries and True Bloods, I like how they're used the feud in those stories, because I think the werewolves are brought in to remind us that the vampires are still evil.

Because I think what happens is, like, when you have a show that's about a vampire or a werewolf or whatever, eventually you start rooting for them.

And I think what the feud allows us to happen is remember, like, hey, wait a minute.

Even the people we're cheering for, sometimes they're not the best.

They're still bad, right?

Like, oh, hey, no, these vampires are good.

They're not killing as many people.

They're still killing people.

And sometimes the werewolves coming in and having that kind of battle forces people to think, wait a minute, maybe it would be good if the vampires were gone.

And I think having the feud reminds us, no matter how connected we get to one side or the other, when it comes to this kind of thing, they are still evil, you know?

So I think in that way, it can actually allow us to.

As much as we Want to relate to some of these characters to remember evil is evil.

Sometimes I think you got to call a spade a spade.

I love Daemon.

Daemon's evil.

You know, like, at the end of the day, some of these characters I might really love.

I think Marceline might be the only exception here.

They're all bad.

And sometimes it's helpful that even if we can recognize and empathize, as Disney keeps wanting us to do with villains, even if we empathize with them sometimes, we got to remember bad is still bad.

And it's good to cheer against it sometimes.

Probably most times, yeah.

Yeah.

All the time.

That seeing.

Seeing the saint in the center or knowing that we're all, you know, again, Lutheran theology, Satan, sinner, which wolf are you going to feed?

The saint or the sinner?

As you.

As you go through life, you're growing towards.

Hopefully you're working towards your.

Your sainth and not the other way around.

But you know that when you wrestle with that within, I think, where can you find the good in the other?

And perhaps there's a glimmer of hope, a glimmer of light, a redemption arc for every day, even.

Even within these monsters that.

Or horror films that we're part of or consume.

Yeah, yeah.

I mean, there for a while, I was cheering for certain relationships and Vampire Diaries to happen, and then Jake Lockwood shows up and he's like, wait, they're a freaking vampire.

And then I'm like, oh, wait, that's right.

Maybe I shouldn't cheer for the girl to get with the vampire.

So, yeah, with that, I have no shame anymore.

I've casted it all aside to do this episode for you guys.

And if you guys want to do something for us in return, you can support the show on Fourth Wall.

We are accepting sponsors now.

We will be doing an extra question for our members over there.

At the end of this recording, we're gonna.

We're gonna say Blade and the Werewolf by night, Jack Russell.

They fought once in Blade.

Trinity Comics.

We want to know, and we're gonna talk a little bit how this conflict might look in the mcu.

Because Jack Russell's a little different, a little different in the mcu.

But before we get there, we're gonna give some recommendations.

Christian, what are you recommending to our listeners today?

Well, I may have done this before, but who heck cares?

We didn't talk about it much today, the Stephen King side of things.

But you want to read a classic vampire novel, read some Salem's Lot.

You can be an idiot like me.

And read it at 2 in the morning in the middle of a thunderstorm and be creeped out of your mind as you were 16, 17 years old.

And it just becomes even better.

It's one of my favorite vampire novels of all time.

Stephen King, Salem plot.

All right, all right.

Will.

Will, what you got for us?

As.

As a child, the 80s.

I'm gonna fully recommend go watch the Lost Boys this, this Halloween, man.

They got comics in there.

They got these kids who like collecting comics, meet people in the comic book store and they read about.

They, they do their studying by reading comics.

They, they learn and become better human beings by reading comic books.

And, and it has an incredible soundtrack.

So.

So go, go, go watch and listen to Lost Boys.

Yeah, I'm gonna go.

We talked about this a little better.

Since we're all doing vampire or werewolf stories.

I think we are doing vampire stories.

Wow.

I guess the vampires won, guys.

They did.

I'm.

I'm gonna, I'm gonna recommend Adventure Time Stakes.

Even if you're not like a big cartoon watcher.

It's just a good story.

It's like four or five episodes.

I don't remember exactly how many.

It's a little short series that's part of the Adventure Time universe, I guess you could say.

Man, it's such good storytelling.

You get post apocalypse, you get child of a demon, you get vampires.

I don't think you get any where or why wolves.

But you get lots of comedy gold, including one of those like audio bits that live in your head, you know that just play over and over.

Anytime someone's like, that's not right.

My brain's just imagining Jake on the couch going, that's not right.

That's not right.

Okay, then I'm gonna throw.

Then I'm gonna throw Teen Wolf in there.

Michael J.

Fox.

You're gonna love it.

You're gonna love it.

So we're all.

We're all suggesting one vampire, one werewolf.

This is why did adventures time stakes, man.

What's.

What's a good werewolf?

You know what?

Actually Werewolf by Night.

The.

The Marvel one shot.

If you haven't seen it, that is some of the best MCU post in game.

And I say that about a bunch of stuff.

But I. I mean, I'm gonna.

Christian.

Nice.

Okay.

Put on the spot.

Will mentioned earlier Werewolf in London.

Fantastic film.

American were from London.

Fantastic film.

True.

Fantastic recommendations.

Great job, everybody.

Remember, if you want to help our show, you can rate review.

You can do all that stuff wherever you're listening.

And we also have to shout out one of our financial supporters today.

I am especially shouting out the one and only the beautiful man.

I'm gonna miss Trip Fuller.

You're the man.

We love you.

I hope Beer camp is the best beer camp ever and that I have.

I hope that I have huge FOMO that weekend.

I want to remind listeners you can get the limited time edition T shirt.

Remember I'm going to put a 10 code down in the show's description.

You can get 10 off of our annual theme T shirt Finding the Good on our website fourth wall.

You can also find all kinds of like extra bonuses and stuff over there.

Rate, review the show, free content.

It's a good place to go.

Also the playlist of all the episodes that are part of this series.

Finding the Good our annual theme.

Catch up now before Christian and TJ finish it off.

That link show notes playlist do it.

Remember we are all a chosen people, a geekdom of priests.