Joshua Noel, Justin Coleman, and Alex Matthews dive into the multiverse of storytelling this week as they dissect the epic narratives of Loki Season 2 and the Doctor Who episode, "The Story in the Engine." Right from the get-go, they ponder whether our narratives are preordained or if we wield the quill to write our own tales, with Loki's chaotic charm and the Doctor's whimsical wisdom leading the charge. The trio breaks down the fundamental themes of control versus freedom, showcasing how Loki, the God of Mischief, opts to hold stories together, while the Doctor liberates narratives by cutting loose the constraints. While they navigate through time travel conundrums, they also explore the cultural ramifications of these beloved characters and their unique journeys. With humor and insightful banter flowing freely, listeners are in for a thought-provoking ride through time, narrative, and the essence of storytelling itself.

Exploring the intersections of narratives in popular culture, the discussion kicks off with a deep dive into Loki Season 2 and its thematic parallels with the Doctor Who episode 'The Story in the Engine.' The trio—Joshua, Justin, and Alex—engage listeners by breaking down complex topics such as determinism versus free will, and how stories shape our understanding of identity and existence. With a laid-back vibe, they share personal anecdotes about their geeky obsessions, from video games to movies, setting a relatable tone for the more intricate discussions to follow. They emphasize the significance of character development in both Loki and Doctor Who, illustrating how these narratives reflect broader societal themes. The episode transitions to a nuanced analysis of how both shows tackle the concepts of control and chaos through their protagonists, Loki and the Doctor, ultimately leading to questions about personal agency in storytelling. The hosts' banter keeps the atmosphere light, though they tackle serious philosophical questions that resonate with listeners on a deeper level. As they wrap up, they encourage audience interaction, inviting listeners to share their own six-word stories, making this a dynamic and engaging episode for fans of both franchises.

Takeaways:

• The discussion highlights the philosophical questions raised in both 'Loki' season 2 and 'Doctor Who', particularly about free will versus determinism, suggesting that narratives may not be as predetermined as they seem.
• Joshua, Justin, and Alex explore the role of storytelling in shaping our identities, comparing Loki's journey of holding stories together to the Doctor's quest for freeing narratives, reflecting on the importance of connection and relationships.
• The podcast emphasizes the cultural impact of both series, noting how 'Loki' has redefined the God of mischief as a hero while 'Doctor Who' continues to explore the nuances of storytelling and imagination.
• Listeners are encouraged to reflect on their own stories, with the hosts sharing their six-word narratives, highlighting the personal connections and meanings derived from such storytelling exercises.
• The contrasting resolutions of the protagonists—Loki's sacrifice to hold stories together versus the Doctor's liberation of narratives—spark a conversation about the nature of control and the value of relationships in storytelling.
• Overall, the episode promotes a deeper understanding of how both 'Loki' and 'Doctor Who' address themes of identity, agency, and the significance of our individual and collective narratives.

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Systematic Geekology

Our show focuses around our favorite fandoms that we discuss from a Christian perspective. We do not try to put Jesus into all our favorite stories, but rather we try to ask the questions the IPs are asking, then addressing those questions from our perspective. We are not all ordained, but we are the Priests to the Geeks, in the sense that we try to serve as mediators between the cultures around our favorite fandoms and our faith communities.

Are all our narratives predetermined? Does the God of mischief hold our stories together, or do we control our own narratives?

Today we're going to be Comparing Loki Season 2 with Doctor who episode the Story in the Engine from the newest season. We're going to be doing our best to explain these IPS for listeners who aren't, like, fully caught up.

So, like, if this seems overwhelming, you're like, I don't even know what Doctor who's about. Time travel, or if you're like, Loki, I don't know. Well, we're gonna do our best to explain it to catch up.

So we think this episode is gonna be worth everyone's time because the messages and questions that these stories are suggesting are worth it. It's gonna be a good, fun ride. I am Joshua Noel. My job is to introduce other people, including a Reverend J. Coleman. Justin Coleman.

How's it going, man? Good to have you, Justin. All right. And we are also here with the one and only Alex Matthews, who is the Loki avatar on the logo.

So, like, as far as, like, expertise and whatever, like, you can't get more expertise than being Loki on a picture that your friend made for you. So, of course, as always, we're gonna start off just with what everyone's geeking out on recently, man.

For me, it's been Fallout, and I've had one of those, like. I don't know how to explain this.

I had, like, a lot of anxiety about starting the game because, like, I've been wanting to play these games for so long, and I've been putting it off for so long, and I finally got the game because I was on sale on Steam, and for some reason, it just took me a long time to hit the play button because I'm like, I've been waiting so long, and now I have anxiety about it. But so far, great ride. Starting with Fallout New Vegas, because I asked my friends Christian and tj, if I only played one, which one should it be?

And that's what they said, and I trust them. Justin, what have you been geeking out on lately, man?

Yeah, so lately there have been a couple different shows. I spent the entire month of July on a prayer retreat not watching any tv, anything like that.

And so I just had this, like, I gotta catch up on some stuff. So I watched the latest season of foundation, which was pretty, pretty interesting if y' all not caught that Sci Fi show.

And then also the latest season of Murderbot, both seasons of those two shows, wildly entertaining.

Have you seen the new season of Star Trek. My brain's.

Yes. I should also say I did do some Strange new Worlds. Yeah, it was a really interesting season.

A little bit more zany than previous, but yeah, I was down with it. It was good.

Yeah. Me, you and Christian need to. Need to get together. I'm going to do thoughts now that I think that was the last season.

Right.

So we got to reflect on the. On the series there. Alex. Alex, what about you? What do you be geeking out on?

I have been geeking out on Thunderbolt. I recently watched that movie. I thought I wasn't going to like it, but it's actually. It's actually pretty good. And my favorite character is Sentry.

Nice, nice. Yeah, I know a lot of people really like it. I had the opposite experience of you. I expected to really like it, and I really disliked that.

But I know why most people do like it and I appreciate that and I'm glad that it's bringing people joy.

Where you start from really makes a difference. I think I started pretty low and I was like, got to watch it. But I, you know, I moved toward Alex there as I. As the movie progressed.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, I do think, yeah, your expectations going in make a big difference. And yeah, also your look on retribution. I don't know. I don't know the terms.

I don't like when people aren't held accountable for their actions. That's all. But we can move on.

Yes.

Whereas if you want to see another Marvel movie, Captain America, it's funny because most people don't like that one and like Thunderbolts and I'm the opposite. But Captain America, the bad guy was held accountable for his actions, and I like that better.

So don't like Captain America, the Brave.

New World, the new one.

Oh, I haven't seen that one.

I love it. But a lot of people don't. Expectations go in expecting to hate it.

Okay, okay, that might help. I mean, that's kind of how I go in with most recent Marvel content.

Marvel movies.

Yeah. Ever since Endgame, to me, they just. It's not the same. I don't know.

I don't know. Some of my favorite Marvel movies have been post in game, though. But like, I do get it. Like, overall, the vibe I get. I know you're talking about.

But then, like, you have like, Guardians 3, Spider man, far From Home, you got the new Captain America movie. You got some of the shows. Falcon, Winter Soldier, Loki. I'm just.

I don't know.

Some of my favorite content. And then post in Game but as a whole, the vibe just isn't there.

It's like, yeah, yeah, some, some pieces are good, but are you the sum of your parts whole new episode? No, I'm just kidding.

Oh, man.

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We are first and foremost before we get into like the nuts and bolts of it because, like, this is going to be a lot about narrative in the power of narrative. But we got to know what we're talking about first.

So what are yalls relationships to these characters, this show, as far as like Loki, Doctor who, Marvel, maybe sci fi in general.

I've been a long time fan of Doctor who from watching late at night on Public Broadcasting System or whatever was on classic Doctor who. Became a fan of the Doctor. The fourth Doctor was my favorite Doctor in those days.

And then so when the new iteration of who came out, I was locked in.

Haven't missed a beat even in some of our more challenging times with the who but also Loki, really through this, what we might call Marvel's golden age.

At a certain point here, these earlier movies really locked into that character and have been really interested to see the progression of character across movies and television shows.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like it? I like it.

Okay, well, I'm gonna be honest. I never really like this. The episode you recommended to watch for this podcast. That's the only Doctor who episode I've ever seen.

Nice.

Yeah. So I. Yeah, I don't really know much about Doctor who.

I did know there was more than two of them, but from that episode I seen, I was like, oh, wait, I could get into this. But then I'm like, wait, no, I gotta start from the beginning, so. Because that's. I gotta start playing.

No.

Oh, wow.

Yeah. No. So I don't know if I really want to commit something like that.

Yeah.

Josh said there's like 60 seasons or something.

It depends how you count.

So I'm not really sure if I want to do that to myself. But, like, I'm still. I'm still thinking about one. You know what I mean? Like, I'm so behind.

Yeah, I love one piece, but it is daunting.

But, yeah, that's that with Doctor who. I think he's pretty cool, though. Pretty cool. Not sure if I want to get into all that, but it's like a big channel word.

We can't all geek out on everything. And that's why we have so many hosts, because maybe. Maybe 15 of us can cover most things.

Yeah. But Loki, he's always been one of my favorite Marvel characters. Like, even in the movies and things, I never saw him as, like.

I just thought of him as like, the scorned little brother that never got the love and never got the attention. He just wanted to shine, and he went the sometimes the worst way about it. But I never.

Like, he is a villain, but, like, I always kind of sympathize with him a little bit. I'm like, he just wanted to be loved deep down, like he has. Mommy, he just needs a therapist. He'll be okay. It's fine. It's fine. Yeah.

But in the Loki episodes after the first season, I was kind of mad at him because I'm like, he could have went, like, a completely different way. Yeah. And things would not have ended the way they did in season one. Like, I was so upset. I'm like, like, not gonna spoil it. But anyway. And then.

And then this second season, it was. I liked it. But then the ending, I was like, so I don't know. Like, I have mixed feelings about the ending. But then I.

But then I talked to my brother about it, and he was like, well, you gotta understand, he's also like. And I was like, okay, yeah, fair. I'm not gonna spoil the ending either. But I'm like, oh, it could have been. Like, he could have done something else.

And I don't know.

I mean, I think it's fine. I. I think to talk about what we're gonna talk about, we pretty much have to spoil both things. So people do need to know if you plan on watching it.

We're gonna.

Yeah, okay, let me just spoil it. Season one, I was mad that. What's her name? Cynthia?

Sylvie.

Sylvie. Yeah. First of all, I don't like her.

Because, oh, I love her.

Main bad. I was so against that. Why? Like, don't do that. Because. Created a mess.

And then second season found out, oh, no matter what they did, that was gonna happen anyway. And then Loki was like, okay, well, I'm either faced with killing Sylvie or I'm going to sit in the big chair and hold all of time.

Friends, I think we should just off Sylvie and call it a day. But just boring. Like, just.

I. I highly doubt that's the end of his story for some reason.

I, you know, I don't think so either because I don't know, my brother said that he's. He plays a part in Doomsday, but I don't know. I haven't done any research about that.

Yeah, me neither.

That's why I'm. I'm like, I'm not fully into my opinions about the second season. I'm like, okay, if he, if he comes back, then he's probably playing like a big part.

He's literally holding all the time. So.

Yeah.

But yeah, I love Loki. Still love him. Just, you know, I just think sitting at the edge of time holding a big tree is just really boring.

Watching your friends live there, I just think that's really boring. But okay, that's pop off. I guess that's fair.

I. Yeah. Not to be contrarian, I love Sylvie. I think she was probably wrong to kill he who remains, but I also would have done it. So I'm like, ah.

I don't, I don't hold it against her. I would have done the same thing. Screw that guy. I like, I get it. Like, I'm like, what, what do you mean? You could control the timeline?

Absolutely not. And then Loki kind of finding that, like, third option using sacrifice so that, like, there isn't a sacred timeline. We all can have our own story.

Like, I kind of like, like the poeticism. Also the imagery of the trees, just. That was just a pretty picture. Like, it looked cool. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know though.

Like, Loki, I've never really been huge into, like, I've liked him, but he's never been like a favorite, if that makes sense.

Because, like, growing up, when I read comics, even still when I read comics, I tend to Stay away from, like, the gods and, like, Superman and, like, that stuff. I like the really grounded story, like, Captain America, Daredevil, Spider Man. Like, Loki was there, and I was like, oh, he's cool.

But I've spent my whole life reading Captain America comics, so I really care more about this guy, you know, like, so I feel like it just has to do with, like, my own history kind of painting a bias watching the films. But, like, as far as Doctor who, I got into it. I can almost say exactly when I was in.

And then we became, like, best friends in college. He showed me, like, two episodes, and they were like, when the Doctor fights Satan. And I'm like, that was really weird, huh? That was cool.

And then I was like. Didn't think about it for like a year. And then out of nowhere, I was like, I kind of want to watch more of that show.

And I picked up, like, after what we watched, I was like, I'm just gonna go from there because there's no way I'm watching all of this. And had zero context for the fact that the Doctor just dies and regenerates. And I'm. I. He died. Was like, what do you mean? I got so mad.

And I think that's part of why I'm not a huge fan of Matt Smith. Because I had no idea that David wasn't just always going to be the Doctor. And I was like, it was this guy. I was livid.

But then I got into it, and I've talked about this on the show before. I got super hyper fixated on it. Watched all the old stuff that I could get my hands on because not all of it is available anymore.

I have a couple DVDs that can't play on American DVD players, so I may or may not have my PlayStation set. To think that I live in Britain so that I can watch it. Wow. I am super. Like, I love doctor. It's great.

My favorite is tenant 10 and then 14 and then doctor. The second doctor, probably after. Okay. Anyway, I won't go through my rankings. You know, I do that some other episodes.

But I also really do appreciate the Judy Gawas take that. We're gonna be talking to him about today. I think he was a fantastic 15th doctors. Definitely. He might make my top five.

I haven't put a Lot of thought into it, but he might. I really like him. I thought he was great. Kind of sad we're only gonna get the two seasons. Yeah, yeah. Now I'm sworn in things for Alex and I feel bad.

Sorry, sorry. My bad. I forgot. I forgot what we were doing here anyway. That's our history with characters.

What.

What impact in, you know, I'll. Let's throw this one to Justin first. What impact do you think these stories of, like, the Doctor and Loki have had on our culture at large?

Like these character specific. Because they're kind of big.

Yeah, these are huge. I mean, you know, you've got Doctor who that has been going on since the 60s. I mean, it is in the.

In sci fi, certainly one of the most dominant iconic shows that are. That are there. And the. What I love about Doctor who is there's this play. There's always this play with what is free will and what is determinism?

How do those work together? And it's. It's cool to be thinking about that now in a time when.

When algorithms and systems, you know, we wonder about, like, how much are these telling us who we are?

So we've, you know, that conversation was limited to the religious space for a while, for so long, and now we're asking questions about algorithms and systems shape, you know, who we are and, you know, Dr. Who having this insistence that imagination or. And story are bigger than an imposed grip. I mean, that's. So that's one of the cool things there.

Loki has grown culturally because of Tom Hiddleston's depiction.

Yeah, he's a great actor and also a handsome man.

Maybe that's, you know, so we, like, we begin to love this character in a way that the character wasn't quite loved in the comics, I think. And so, you know, this. This was the God of mischief that really. I think it was Marvel. Y' all have to correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't.

I don't recall this, you know, God of story being a part of things until. Until Marvel. But, you know, so this. So mischief, this God of mischief who becomes a God of story, can hold a multiverse together.

This whole idea of the. Of the multiverse and thinking about these kinds of possibilities has off. Has now become part of the common language.

You know, people will just say, well, you know, the multiverse of possibility, blank. And so I think it's been interesting to see how that.

I know that's a little bit beyond Loki, but how this whole idea of the multiverse has taken Root popular culture.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Doing that thing where. Let me switch. Okay. No, I agree.

And I'm really glad you brought up that whole determinism thing because that's always been kind of prevalent in Doctor who. You have, like, throughout some of the Matt Smith years especially, there's that whole narrative of, like, fixed points in time.

Because, like, anytime you're telling a story, like, it gets really difficult when you involve time. And all of a sudden the stories lasted because you have to be like, well, how do we explain him time traveling this long and stuff?

Still working the same. So they have to develop narrative devices like that. Otherwise things just don't make any sense at all.

But it is interesting also to see Loki, the God of mischief, take this role where you're seeing him wanting chaos, him wanting mischief, and then being introduced to the tva that saying, no, there's only one timeline. And it makes a lot of sense to me that he would be the one that then sees. Wait a minute. So you're not letting every possibility. There isn't chaos.

There is a single story. So it makes sense the God of chaos would eventually be the one that says, no, not one story. Every story. Yeah, like, that makes a lot of sense to me.

Well, since you brought up determinism and before we get into it, because I feel like we're all gonna have a little bit of a bias, because you can't not have this growing, especially in a faith tradition of any sort. We're all gonna have, like, kind of a tinted view on things. Alex and I grew up in a similar church.

I'm gonna throw this to Alex first, because the same denomination I'm now converted to Lutheranism, she is still part of a Pentecostal church, as far as I know. Okay, cool. How have you just, in your life, your experience with faith, wrestled with these questions of, like, determinism as opposed to free will?

You know, because when you throw God in and he knows the future and created all things and, you know, does he know the future? Does he not know the future? Did he let us have free will? Are we predestined? You got a lot of weird doctrines and stuff bouncing around.

How have you wrestled with it?

Well, I'm still wrestling with it, to be honest.

Aren't we all?

Yeah, because I don't know. Because on one hand you want to have free will, but let me just talk about this.

One hand, I want to have free will, but then in another hand, I don't know, it's because, man, wait. It was like I wanted to have free will. Right. I want to have free will.

But also, like, the idea of, like, all, like, every choice I'm going to make or anything that's going to happen, like, it's already, like, written out and set in stone.

Like, depending on the situation, they both could be comforting in a way, but, like, the situation being something that will work for me, you know, like, kind of like in a selfish type of thing. What was the question again?

Just how you wrestle with all of this. You know what you're wrestling on air. You're just demonstrating, right?

See, currently. I'm currently.

Literally right this second, right.

Now, right here, right now. I don't know. That's a hard question to answer because, I don't know.

I feel like everybody would want to have free will to do what they want, but at the same time, that also sounds, like, chaotic. Like, yeah, yeah, I get to do what I want, but I also don't know. I don't know what's gonna happen.

But then with everything, like, predetermined predestination, all that, like, it's not as chaotic. It's. It's more like. It's more orderly in a way, and it's like, okay, whatever happens was meant to happen.

Yeah.

I don't really know where else to go with that.

It can provide a level of comfort, and I definitely get that. I. Yeah. So, like, I feel like I grew up in. So the Pentecostal church we grew up in is kind of strange.

It's not like what I think most people think of when they think of Pentecostals, but, like, I grew up hearing kind of both sides of this. A little bit of, like, some preachers would kind of seem like they leaned into that whole, like, God knows everything. He's in control.

Whatever happens, it's what God meant to happen. I'm very leaned into that. And then I would have other preachers in the same church that would be like, you have a choice. It's your choice.

You can backslide. You can choose God. You can accept the Holy Spirit or not. And it was a lot. And I'm like, oh, but which one? And I don't know that.

For me, that was a long time. And ironically, what's helped me a lot is someone I don't fully agree with on. On any of this. Dr. Tom Ord.

Last few years, I've had him a lot of times on the whole church podcast, and we've argued with one another and friendly arguments, you know, church unity arguments.

But.

He has this Like God can't. And God can't, can create on his own. God doesn't know the future.

And, and he uses a lot of this stuff because he's trying to explain how an all loving, powerful God could allow some of the stuff that happens in the world if God predestined everything and knew the all of future.

And it's like, well then when my dog got shot in the face, God knew that was going to happen, created everything and just didn't do anything about it. And I'm like, I get where he's coming from. Like, I'm like, yeah, that is really frustrating.

And he develops this doctrine, this theology where he's basically, it's called, it's you know, open and relational theology.

And he kind of like proposes this version of God that's like, God wants to work with us and he doesn't know the future, but he wants the best for everyone and eventually, you know, everyone will be safe kind of thing. I think, I'm not 100% sure.

I'm not doctor or I don't know all of his beliefs, but like part of the pushback I've had with him is like, like I like a lot of what he's saying, but then I'm like, but if God didn't create everything out of nothing, then I have questions on how salvation is possible, you know what I mean? Like, if you weren't the one that created all of the things, why can't I just save myself? Why are we still dependent on this God?

Why do I even need the God character then? You know what I mean? Like the so. And that's where I push back on him a little bit. But I still take a lot from him where I go.

So I think I probably fall more in this camp of like, I'm not sure the future exists and if the future doesn't exist yet, God can't know the future. But I'm still wrestling with it too. Like I don't know all the answers.

But I, I do like a lot of those points because I'm like, I, I think it makes sense to me that we have to have choice. If we're gonna say God is all loving, then I have to be able to choose him. I have to be able to choose my actions.

And predeterminism kind of feels like I don't have a choice.

Yeah.

So that's where like I still will pull some from that or, but I'm just, I'm not completely there yet. Maybe one day he'll win me over. But right now, not yet. Right now I'm still like, I don't know, this ex Nilo thing seems kind of important. But it's.

Justin, as the Reverend, give us the correct answer. No. Where have you wrestled with this in your own faith and growing into it?

Well, I'll say a couple of things. One, just what you were talking about. There is a theological system made popular journal part of the 20th century process theology.

I think about theologians like Schubert, Ogden, his book on theology that helped to popularize this process theology, in my view, was a way to respond to questions of theodicyou know, why does this why do bad things happen to good people kind of stuff. I will say theodicy is primarily an American theological session that you don't always see at other parts of the world, in other parts of the world.

And so that, I think that says a lot about us. But in the process, the theological system, God changes. So God, some of the omnis about God are just not so.

And that theological system was of comfort to some who were really wrestling with how could God allow these kinds of things? So anyway, just take that for what you will.

I mean, there could be some research done on that, but there is a theological system that plays with that. And I think. But it also seems like a very American theological system to me. So.

But, you know, as a Protestant, generally speaking, I would say that I've always lived in this tension between predestination and free will because that's what everybody wants to talk about. And you know, Methodists, I'm United Methodist. And so Methodists tend to talk more about grace and our response to grace.

I don't see life as a rigid script, but more as an unfolding drama where God is both author and the actor and an actor in it.

And so when I think about this scripturally, I think that you can see very doctor who elements in Scripture because there are moments that seem like fixed moments in time and are almost narrated in that kind of way.

But then there are very clearly some moments where the free will of those who are engaging with God in the moment actually helps to determine something of the outcome of the moment. And so maybe it's a blend. I don't know what percentage to give, but maybe it's a blend. And honestly, I'm okay with that.

Yeah.

You know, ironically, Christian Ashley, who's probably the most conservative person on our show, is almost exactly the same stance as that, because the Bible does a little bit of both. Okay. So since you brought up process, I'm Going to touch on this, and we'll move past.

So all open and relational theologians will consider themselves process theologians, but not all process theologians will consider themselves open and relational. That makes sense. So it's like one of those, like, big little circle things.

I personally, and I'm still working through a lot of this, but like, Alfred Whitehead, that's my vibe.

And he's known as, like, one of the big process people who started it, but really, for me, it's more the relational stuff that he explains, like, as a mathematician and a scientist, where he kind of goes through this whole, like, yeah, if you think about it physically, all of your cells, you don't have the same cells as you did six years ago. Are you the same person?

I'm like, well, I mean, yeah, but if we took all your memories and put it in somebody else, you don't have your memories anymore. Are you still the same person? So it's like, I'm not my memories. I'm not the pieces that make me what am I?

Which also, sorry, Will, coincidentally, is the same question that every single Kingdom Hearts game has asked since the beginning of Kingdom Hearts. And I think for me, the answer Kingdom Hearts gives and the answer off road Whitehead gives is what resonates the most with me.

And it's going to come up later in the episode, I promise. We're defined by relationship. I'm not all these little cells. I'm how they relate to one another so that the cells look like this on a camera, right?

And the. The cells in my brain make me behave this way. And you know what I mean? Like, my memories work together with my emotions.

And you get this weirdo who talks about that one specific video game way too much, right? Like, that's who I am. And likewise, I'm defined by my relationships to you guys, to other people, how I treat other people.

And God is also defined by his relationships. The whole doctrine of the Trinity proves this. And.

And then you get the stuff in the Bible when we go back to, like, what Justin was talking about with, like, maybe it's a little bit of both. The end you have where the Bible says God changed his mind.

And the thing is, what happens is your conservative Christians read that and go, oh, that's not literal.

And then your progressive Christians will be like, well, that's the literal part, not that other part that you guys are talking about with the predestination and the. Realistically, the Bible says both. The Bible says God changes mind, and then it says God never changes. This says both things.

And we just get to wrestle with that. And of course, the best way to wrestle with that is by having Alex explained to us. Loki season two. Why in Loki Season two? Alex.

Okay, let me just warn everybody that I'm not the greatest at explaining things. I don't know why Josh is making me do this.

Because you are the Loki, the avatar. This is like the role you were predestined for.

Okay. All right, well, I'm gonna try my best. All right. So Loki 2 basically starts off where one immediately after he.

Because Sylvie pushes him through a time door. And he ends up at back at the tva, but at a different time in the past where no one knew him yet. And then he's time slipping.

So it's slipping between the past and the present where things are falling apart at the TVA because he who remains has perished. And because he's perished, he got other variants that are about to come and cause a bunch of chaos.

And then the time loom is getting overloaded because he who remains dead, the branches are branching, like at a. At a really fast rate. Too fast. Too many branches showing up at a time loop. Can't keep them all together. So the time loop is overloading.

And the only thing they can do to fix it is they go outside the ramp thing. I forgot all the words.

And this is great. I love this.

Okay. Ouroboros, he wrote the guidebook. Sort of what's timely. Also wrote the guidebook. Anyway, whatever. They both wrote it. Okay.

And basically the time book explains that they need this thing, a converter thing that helps the time loop expand so they could get more the branches in there so it won't overload. But they find out before they can fix it, they need he who remains essence to open the blast doors or whatever.

Because the blast doors had to be closed anyways, so they had to go back. Oh, Bran Slayer and Ms. Minute. See, this is why.

This is great. It doesn't need to be an in depth explanation.

Okay, Basically they find they find Timely before because Timely is the one who created the tva. And this is before he committed like anything crazy. He's just discovering time. Like he made the prototype of time loom and whatever.

He's an innocent man. And Sylvie catches on, tries to kill him, that she's actually. I'm not gonna kill him. He didn't do anything. Like, he started crying.

He didn't start crying. But he's like, I haven't done anything wrong. Like, I know my heart, my heart. But she's like, get him out of here. I'll take care of Renflare.

Honestly, she should have. She should have just done away with Renslayer right then and there.

But she had to push him through a stupid time door at the end of time to see the corpse. And then to find out that he remains, wiped all their memories. No one knows what happened.

She figures out that she was there when everything happened. He wiped the beverage. Like, I'm so bad. Like, like. Anyway, point is Loki, time slipping.

He figures out how to control time slipping where he literally, like control time. Kind of sort of like he who Remains.

So he has a conversation with he who Remains for dead the series, and the guy is like, yeah, you can do anything you want, but this is gonna happen. Time loop's gonna overload. Everything's gonna fall apart. It's a fail safe, all to protect the sacred time. Everything ends with a sacred timeline.

No such thing as, like branches, whatever. And then Loki's like, well, bet I' ma change that. And then what's his name? He remains. He's like, you could try, but I'll see you back here.

And there's a Loki tries, like all kinds of ways. And then he's ended up with a choice of, okay, either I kill Sylvie or I let things be. And then we just come back and the time loop implodes.

Whatever. So instead he goes with a third option that no one saw coming because I didn't.

And he goes outside, transforms into his awesome Loki, fit with the big old horns and destroys the time loop, catches all the threads, walks up these invisible stairs, makes a rip in the space to the end of time where the broken throne sits down. And the broken throne puts all the threads together and makes a tree. And he's there for the rest of the journey. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Okay, that is so. I couldn't have gotten close to that, Alex, so. I am so glad you were the one.

Yeah, that was so hard.

I think. Okay, so for context, the tree is part of Norse mythology. Loki being the goddess stories isn't.

Yeah, but you know, maybe he knew about the tree and that's why he knew to do this. Who knows? Let's see. I think simplified for people who haven't seen season one. Basically Loki as well as a bunch of other things.

If you do something like time travel and you create something that wasn't supposed to happen, then there's two branches of time. And where the TVA is is this place that can see all of time. It's kind of like sitting outside looking at it. Like a.

Like a stream, like an electric wire. And when something splits off, they just kind of like. Like a plant go and just prune it. So there's just one timeline.

Otherwise it gets so chaotic, like things just kind of don't work.

And then Loki, and then the girl version of Loki called Sylvie and a bunch of other people were from these other branches and escaped before their timeline was destroyed. Then you have people who weren't supposed to exist in the main timeline, and that's what the TVA is kind of made of.

And then everything that Alex said happens.

So basically, since time isn't able to be controlled, someone has to be able to hold the stories together, or else there's the time loop or only one time. So Loki kind of makes that sacrifices.

I'll be the one that holds everyone's stories together because he builds these relationships up through the seasons. And he's like, I'm not willing to see Sylvie's story end. I'm not willing to see Mobius's story end. Anyone's story ends. You know what?

I'm just going to hold all their stories. I'll be the character. And because he's a lowercase G God, he's able to do that basically because reasons accept it. Justin, different question.

Doctor who, the story in the Engine, a much shorter thing to explain. How would. How would you summarize this one?

I'm so glad I've been given this one. Seriously. So we say a couple. Couple things.

One little bit of prologue to the story in the Engine, and that is in the most recent iteration of Doctor who, the last Doctor, we do find storytelling, the power of the stories that are told, and. And the power behind the stories that are told is a little bit of a through line across the series with our most recent Doctor.

So it's sad again that we will only have these a couple seasons. But the story in the Engine was one of the most beautiful homages to the culture around the black barbershop that I have ever seen in film.

It was beautifully done because I, you know, I just grew up in barbershops where you. You hung out all day. You must commend the day to it. The day before appointments and things like that.

You just showed up and you camped out and what do people do? They just told stories. Told stories and. And whose. And if you were there for long enough, you could listen to stories.

Over time, they grew in power and majesty and flourish and hilarity. You know, this is like. This is the. This is the beautiful thing about the Barbershop.

So here we have the Doctor coming in to a Nigerian barbershop, and that. That he's gone to before, as in this iteration of the. The Doctor who is the first black male to play the part.

And so he talks about going there as a place of refuge, but has there's a barber who is not the storyteller. And this storyteller is. Believes that he's been controlling the whole narrative of. Of human imagination.

And so without the storyteller, human imagination collapses and the. But then you've got the Doctor, you know, insisting that imagination is alive because it's shared everybody.

But you learn across the episode, the storyteller has actually been the servant of the storytelling gods throughout time and. And really is. Has taken control of this. Of this web. So we've got a tree in Loki, we've got this web in. In. In Doctor who.

And so trying to take control of this really in some ways to get revenge on these gods that he was once the servant of, but now he will be the master storyteller. And then, you know, the Doctor does some work to undo. Undo this and, and free up this web. But that's essentially what happens in this.

Did I do okay job? I'm not as good as Alex with this, but I think that's great.

Yeah, no, no, it was. It was great. I honestly.

And Doctor who does this sometimes, or even, like, the ones that I love the most sometimes I'm like, I'm still not 100% sure I understand what the Doctor did. He reversed the polarity.

That's right. That's right. The conclusion is less important than the journey there often. And Doctor.

Yeah, but I think one of the things I really love, um, and I haven't experienced it personally, but the Doctor portrays it so well that, like, you can kind of connect with his feelings.

He talks about, like, how he goes here because he's treated differently now that he looks like a black man, and he goes to this place because it's a place of safety, and he kind of gets betrayed. His friends were in danger and they knew that the Doctor could save him, so they basically volunteered him as tribute.

Yeah, yeah.

And he gets trapped. And it's one of those, like, for me, it's one of the moments where the Doctor shines.

Like, this is like the kind of Doctor moment that I love the most, where he says, not only am I to forgive my friends because they betrayed me, because I understand they were scared. And. Yeah, you know what? I'm still a little bit mad about it. But I'm gonna forgive them.

Not only that, I'm gonna forgive the storyteller because I understand why he's seeking revenge. I understand why he's a bad guy.

And instead of just punching him, you know, like beating him up superhero style, he's like, you know what I'm gonna do? I'm gonna tell him what's even more powerful than what he thinks he's doing. Controlling the stories. He thinks that's powerful. But guess what?

Creating your own narrative is more powerful. I have a story in six words that happens to sound like Jesus's. I live, I die, I live. It's like everybody has a six word story.

And I'm like, oh, gosh, sometimes the doctor just says stuff. And I'm like, well, yeah, I don't need to know how you defeated the spider of time, but man, that speech, that did it for me.

So true. And also, I mean, you know, just say that. What a powerful commentary on our times when institutions that we love sometimes fail us.

And how do we respond to that failure and that betrayal? So good.

Yeah, well, and the thing is, from what you're describing of like, why barbershops are so powerful is like the sharing of imagination. And all the stories get wild and out as you spend the whole day there. Like, man, it actually makes a lot of sense.

The doctor was sharing in the story, he was sharing in their betrayal of him. And he changed the narrative by sharing in the narrative. And I think that's kind of what Jesus did, right?

Like, he shared in our humanity so that he can change the story of humanity. And that's what we are all called to do a little bit. I mean, I'm sorry, I'm getting preachy, but like, we're all called a little bit, right?

To like, before defined by our relationships. Man, as soon as I made friends with Alex, I now have a choice of how I treat our relationship.

Because what that's what if I'm defined by our relationship, she's also defined by this relationship. If I betray her, that's now part of her story. And we have to find a way. How do we want to work that story together? Do we want to work it for good?

Work it for evil? Does it matter if you do something evil to me? Do I want to turn evil back? Because guess what? It's not tit for tat. It's a shared story. And I'm just.

I can either perpetuate the betrayal that for some reason I'm saying Alex betrayed me, or let's go back to the other way. She could either perpetuate the betrayal if I betrayed her, or she could say, you know what?

I see that you betrayed me, but I'm going to forgive you and change that narrative, that shared story that we have to something better.

See, right there. See? That was a good sermon. We need to. I'm sorry, we need to pass the plate. So we usually do this at the end in but for all of our supporters.

Oh, man.

Oh, that's.

That's funny. But okay. Sorry. Ser to the side. Doctor who will do that to you, I promise. Wait, how would you rate and review each of these?

The Doctor who story in the Engine, Loki season two, if you had to put like a zero to ten on it. Alex, uh, where are you doing for each of these?

Okay, well, for Doctor who, I would say. I would say. I would say nine out of ten. Because I. I appreciated, like, nods like, African black culture and all that. And like, how.

Yeah, you know, stories, like, we have a choice of, like, how they go with our lives and things. So. Yeah, that was good. Loki season two, I don't know. I would say maybe seven out of ten.

Okay. All right. What's funny? I'm splitting the difference, and I'm pretty close to you on both. I'm giving both an 8 out of 10.

Okay.

I thought they were both great. Weirdly enough, I like Doctor who's message better, but I think the narrative wasn't as good because I think they did kind of get stuck in that.

We're not sure this makes sense. Doctor has cool speech. Stuff happens. Like, I do think they kind of lost the plot a little bit, but the message was great. The characters were great.

The placing was like. Everything else was great. It just. I do feel like they lost the beat a little bit at the plot.

Loki, on the other hand, I don't like the message as much. Characters are great. The story, perfect sense. Loki being the God of chaos.

That then's gonna hold all of our stories together so that everyone can live their own possible, you know, choices and have free will. I'm like, chaos, free will. Like, I'm. I don't know, man. There's a lot of symmetry here. And I feel like it kind of had a really well rounded ending.

Very poetic. And that tree looked really cool. But the message at the end where I'm. My problem is still kind of this.

No, I don't think one person has to hold the stories together. I think rather we share in the stories together. And that's where I'm like, it's not quite what I want with the message.

And maybe I'm being nitpicky, but it's fine. Justin, where are you at?

Yeah, no, it's really tough one, because we've got a whole season and one episode. It's really tough. But just to say on Doctor who, I'm with you on the. So how did it end, really? I'm kind of fuzzy on the landing of the plane.

I know it landed. I know there were survivors. I'm really.

It was a little bit of a blur there for a moment, but I'd give it a 9 if it were just talking about braiding hair and creating routes to freedom mapped through there like that whole. In this episode, you're fitting a lot in. So I'm. I'm with Alex on it. I love the. Just the celebration of blackness. That was a part of that.

And Josh, as you say, this whole commentary about the forgiveness and what that does to our stories and the healing story, that was good stuff.

Oh, yeah.

You gotta take off a percentage point because I still am like, so you asked me what happened to the web and the spider. I'm like, you know, stuff. It's all okay. It's all okay. That's all I can.

So.

But if I were to. Rather than compressing Loki, if I were just a blast, you know, episode and just think about it from that point of view.

I do think there was something powerful about the sacrifice. The. The willing to. Willingness to offer him self up and to.

To.

To hold the stories, support the stories. To support the stories of others. In a way, I thought that was. That was lovely in its own way. So really, I think my.

My numbers are very similar to Alex's. I'm gonna. I'm gonna. I'm gonna give Loki season two, as a. As a whole, a seven or eight.

All right.

I like it. I like it.

So doing the comparison bits, and I know we've already talked a lot about some of this stuff because we just can't help get ahead of ourselves, but I think the easiest place to start are kind of the antagonist. So he who remains, who's also known as King the Conqueror. For those wondering, his driving force is this kind of idea of like, there is one timeline.

If we don't have it all, there's either a time loop or it gets so crazy that nothing can exist and time will just kind of unfold on itself. So he's decided to take it upon himself to control which narrative will be the only narrative so that that doesn't happen.

So he's given himself all this control. And the storyteller, the barber in the Doctor who episode, his is more.

It's similar, but it's because he keeps being the one that's telling the stories. And he's like, well, none of these people would have stories. None of this stuff would happen if it wasn't for me and I didn't get credit.

Do you know what I'm gonna do? I'm now gonna be the one controlling all of the stories.

So he's not trying to limit the timeline as much as he's trying to gain power by controlling everyone's stories and kind of collecting them as if they're his own. And in a way, a little bit of appropriating. Right. He's trying to take the stories and claim them as his own. And you're like, oh, wait a minute.

That's. That's kind of something that we do a lot.

Maybe that's not great.

Anyway, comparing these two in their motives, how do you think they might be similar or different? I'll throw it to Justin first, because I feel like it's a hard question, and it'll give me an. Alex, time to think.

I will ramble long enough for you to come up with an answer. That's what he just said. That's fine.

I will believe in you.

I know the part I play in this story. He who remains, I don't know. We've got this kind of like this need to control.

And that is just his justification for existing is that there's a necessity in control. And the storyteller, I think, you know, really, it's just about his power, is a demand for recognition.

Josh, if you were talking a moment ago, I just thought, wow, this is like a talk about a underappreciated ghostwriter who just decides to take over. It's like a publishing nightmare. The ghostwriters, you know, rise up against everybody and. But both.

Both seem to be rooted in control and rooted in ego. I mean, you know, different shades of it, but I would say that's the. That's the. That's the similarity, control and ego between those two.

Yeah. Yeah, I think I agree. Can that be my whole Amen, preacher? Alex, did you want to add anything? I really do feel like he said that really well.

So I'm like, I'll let you guys do this.

I mean. Yeah, I agree. Like, their. Their common ground is control. They want to control the way stories are told. The way our story. The.

The way stories are told. Yes. And. But I Think the motives behind it are different.

Kang the Conqueror, he wants to control time and stories because he wants to protect everything from his other selves. Whereas the barber, he just wants to destroy everything because he's bad and angry, hurt, which understandably so.

I'll be mad, too, if I didn't give my credit, especially for doing what he did, telling all the stories of all. Of all the lowercase gods, stuff like, come on now.

What's funny is he even says that Loki is one of the gods. That little bit of like, this is great.

Perfect.

Yeah, yeah. No, no, I. I agree. It is interesting.

Kang does seem to have more of, like, a almost cosmic perspective, whereas the storyteller, as he calls himself, is kind of just so focused on, like, basically getting the credit that he never got that, like, I don't know.

It's like his is so limited like, that it's that he's became corrupted from his limited perspective of only himself and not seeing how he's affected by other relationships. Whereas King almost took too broad of a perspective. He couldn't see how it's affecting individuals because he's only caring about the whole.

And it's difficult to kind of find that balance. Yeah.

And I mean, I think in the. In the Storyteller, what you also see. I mean, I should say something a little bit.

I don't know if this is redeeming, but just for empathies, for sake of empathy. You know, this is also. So lots of stories of blackness were told in this episode, and that is another story. Blackness, you know, the.

The supporting of stories, maybe even being. Being the. Being the lead author of stories, but then still someone else receiving the credit. Having so many of our stories muted across time.

You know, we get them. We get a month for some stories to be told, but only the stories some people want to tell. Like, it's. It's. It's. There is a.

Again, I think part of what's powerful in that episode is from a variety of perspectives, you're getting stories of blackness, both the celebration we've spoken of, also in the pain that the storyteller represents. So, yeah, I think that's powerful.

Yeah. We did an episode on the Whole Church podcast about Bass Reeves, who is. Who the Lone Ranger is based off of, actually a black man. And the reason.

I'm trying to remember the name of the guy who wrote it, he's a friend of mine. I should know this, but the book is how the west was Whitewashed.

And like, you actually kind of see how so much of like, Our old western stories are actually for Mexican and black culture. That we were just like, no white guys did that. And it's like, nope, that's actually just not true.

So C. T. Kirk, CT Kirk, how the West Was Whitewashed. It's a small book, but man, it's really cool. But that's exactly kind of what this is based off of, right?

Like these are what the stories are, but other people are trying to claim the stories. And he's like, I actually, I was there. I actually wrote the story, it was me. So, yeah, I get it.

But, um, so it's not just about the antagonist, right?

Like, we, we do kind of see how the doctor and Loki kind of react to their antagonist and to what happens, and you get two very different conclusions. We've talked about this, but I kind of want to just get out there how we feel about both.

Where Loki says, I'm going to hold all stories together so everybody can live their narrative. And the doctor says, I'm going to cut everything loose again so that everybody can live their narrative.

How do we feel those responses are different and which one's correct? Justin? Alex, do you wanna go first? Justin went fetless last time.

Sure. Okay. Okay, remind me what the question was again so I can stay on track.

Man, I did such a. Such a build up and now I forgot. Basically the question is just for Loki.

He decided to hold all the stories together so that we all can live our own narrative. The doctor is like, cut it all loose so everybody can live their own narrative. Comparing these.

How do we feel about how our protagonist responded and which one's correct? Give a solid answer.

Okay. Don't know how solid is actually gonna be, but I, I think they both responded opposite of how they would. Okay, walk with me. Okay.

Okay.

Like they, like Loki, God of chaos, destruction. He decides, let me just hold everything together and preserve everything.

Oh, okay. Yeah.

The barber tells the stories, keeps things going so that culture's humanity build up on the stories. At the end, he wants to tear it all down. I just think they both responded very opposite of what they were.

Okay. Yeah.

Which is why I'm mad at Logan. So, like, you're not going to do that. But anyway, I get that.

Okay. All right.

All right.

Justin.

Yeah, I'm sitting here just like pondering through. Okay, so I think that we have two different responses to the authoritarianism that we see from our antagonist.

And, you know, because we've spoken about the sacrifice and then the, you know, liberation, sacrifice of Loki for, for, you know, for others. And, and the, in the. The Doctor, you know, liberating imagination. So, yeah, I mean, you've got.

They both critique authoritarianism and, and respond to authoritarianism in different ways. You know, relational one, one creative response. I don't know, you know, showing forgiveness as, as. As a, As a. As another way to respond.

So how I feel about them, I felt warm and fuzzy about them in different ways. When I was. I was watching it. I was moved by. I'm always moved by, you know, this sacrifice from others.

I mean, that you see that no greater love, right, than to lay one's life down for one's friends. And so you see that and echoes of that in that sacrifice of Loki.

But we also see the power of forgiveness to break the constraints of our reality and free up new possibilities. And we saw that in Doctor who. So, yeah, I got some, Some positive feels about them, but just in different ways.

Yeah, I might do a both and like, what Justin did earlier too, because, like, okay, so hang with me. I don't think it's true of he who remains King the Conqueror.

I'm not convinced he was motivated by a relationship, but I might just not remember the story very well. But if you look at Loki, why did he decide to make the sacrifice in the end?

It's because, like, for two seasons of the show, he's been building these relationships with different people and he sees their story and he doesn't want the story to end. So what's he do? He holds their stories together and he makes that sacrifice.

And like, it makes me think of, like, all the scriptures where it's like God has the whole world in his hands in the fun little song, right? How he's holding us and how God knows what's going to happen and he's got us, you know, like, oh, yeah, there's a lot of scripture there. I get it.

Like, God wants a relationship with us, so what's he going to do? He's going to hold our lives together so that we do have a choice. Okay.

And then like the doctor, it's this whole, like, yeah, I so much have these other relationship. Well, so first let me. The barber, the storyteller, his lack of relationship is what I think drove him, is none of these God people who.

He's been writing their story, none of them kept their relationship with him. What they do, they took the credit and kind of cast him aside. So I think the lack of relationship is what motivated him.

And then the doctors like all of these stories, all these people he's met, all of Humanity, his friend Belinda, the people in the barbershop. He's like, all of these stories important. All of them matter.

It reminds me, even though one of my least favorite doctors is Matt Smith, one of my favorite lines is from Matt Smith Smith in A Christmas Carol. And the Doctor is basically arguing with Ebenezer Scrooge. And this lady pulls out. He's like, who's that? And Scrooge is like, oh, nobody important.

And then I was like, fascinating. In 800 years, I've not yet met a single person who doesn't matter. And I love that line. I'm like, yes, that's the Doctor's motivation, right?

He has 800,000. Whatever. How many years of relationship? And he's like, no, every story matters so much.

Not that he's going to sacrifice so much that he's going to cut everything loose so that he can keep these relationships and keep making relationships. And that's the heart of God. God created so that he could be in relationship. And that's where I think things are a little bit different.

Like, the Doctor saves the day so that he can continue to be in relationship. Loki makes the ultimate sacrifice because of the relationships he had.

Whereas God, the God that I believe in, created so that he could be in relationship with us. So the creation came first. But the motivation being in relationship.

And that's what I think is so fascinating because you see aspects of the divine in both stories of like, yeah, God is the one who's going to hold all this together because he loves us so much. God is also the one that's going to cut everything loose and let us have free will because he wants genuine relationship with.

How do those things make sense together? I have no idea. And that's where Alex is going to share ultimate wisdom and tell us the answer. What's the answer to what?

Life, the universe and everything.

I don't know. I'm still trying to make that up.

When we do put this in perspective of not just cool little stuff that stories that we like to watch. And we think of like a God who created so that he could be in relationship with us.

And I'll argue he also created out of relationship because of the Trinity.

How does that idea of a God of relationship that we actually do believe in compared to how these heroes are interacting with the idea of relationship and narrative? I mean, we can make the Reverend go, wait, it's fun.

Let it go, Reverend. You got this. All right.

In conclusion, so in so Loki is about bearing burdens, holding branches, Time, love. Josh was talking about these things before Dr. Is about freeing humanity to bear their own stories. Loki becomes. Loki becomes another God.

Loki becomes. Or mythic figure, whatever. Atlas holding up the world in a kind of a way so that the. So that things could flourish. There is a.

There's a interesting burden that. Is there a joyful burden that he. A burden that he chooses. But there is a kind of a burden there.

The Doctor is a more liberationist theology operating in the Doctor handing power back. And so both endings, you know, challenge this. Like, do I want control or do I trust God? That God made us co creators in some way in the. In the story.

So anyway, that's what those make me think about. I don't even know if I answer your question. That's what I got to say.

Yeah, I'm with you. I think my only hold up is like I like both. I want to believe both, but it is hard for me to wrap my brain around both.

A God who cares so much that he wants to hold our story in his hand like Loki is doing or. And a God who loves us so much he wants to participate in relationship and in the stories like the Doctor does.

It's like I kind of want to want to have both. Can the Father be one and the Son be the.

Well, I mean that's.

And the Holy Spirit's what's holding them.

Together kind of goes back to what I said in the beginning. I mean this is um. It is. There are fixed moments in time and then there are. There are times that are up for our free will.

But you know, when we think about it like so that. So again I'm trusting that this God who created has also created free will.

So all of this is functioning in accordance with God's intended creation and how God intended things to unfold. And so the. That there are anchored moments and that there. There is free will is for me feels like two things that sometimes oppose the system.

But if, you know, in my theology of creation at least God made both. And so both in God's mind and God's heart and God's imagination, this is all the way it's supposed to be.

Maybe I just need to like sit in my chair and hold the story of the God one hand and the Gunther God in the other hand.

I see what you did there.

We mentioned in the episode of Doctor who, the story in the Engine, the Doctor makes this powerful statement that he says everybody has their own story. And he talks about how your story in six words. And he says for him, his story was I live I die, I live.

And he's talking about regenerating and how life is the important part of his story, I think, and accepting the fact that he's going to die and then live again. I want to know how. Well, two. Two questions in one. It's a two in one for everybody. What six words would you give Loki's story?

And what six words would you give your own story? And if you think I'm being unfair, I can answer first.

Yeah, that's right. You've been doing this. Answer first this time.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I see I have two for myself. And I can't decide which one's more accurate. I fail. I keep learning still. The other one would be the joy of the Lord shines.

And I'm just not sure which one's more accurate. So y' all pick for Loki. If I was gonna give Loki six words, he was adopted. Then adopted us. I think. I think that's where I'm going. Six words is hard.

All right, Alex, now you can go. That's what I was trying to do, too.

Okay, so six words for me.

I. I kind of feel bad.

Okay. I had to make sure it was okay. I knocked down. I try again. Didn't make it that far with local yet. Second lap. I got you.

All right, Justin.

Okay, first a question.

First a question. What was Loki's? The like classic Loki's? Like, no, not even classic. Was like. Like glorious. What was glorious?

Purpose. Glorious purpose. Burden. Glorious purpose.

Right, right, right, right. Okay, I need to take out a word.

Sorry I made this so hard once.

Villain. Now burdened. No, I still.

I don't have.

I got too many words. I got too many words in there. What's villain? But whatever kind of punctuation you need.

Since I had to reduce words that need to be in the middle, burdened with glorious love.

Ooh, Ooh. I like it. I like it. I like it. I feel like that buys a seventh word. So now we can have now burdened.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Now. So now within there, like, I had one God, like, seven better anyway, so I had to just. So. So there's. That's for Loki. Mine. I'm.

I'm going to try to bowl down the middle for West Indian stuff, just in case. Indian.

That's hard.

Methodists are. Are listening in grace found me. Love sustain.

Ooh. Ooh. That's really good. That's great, Reverend Great. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He earned the Reverend live. This is. This is proof.

My Master of Div. One more year. I've just.

All Right, Alex, bring us home. Six words for Loki from Loki herself.

Right, right, right. Okay, okay. Hurt and loss, healed and found.

Ooh.

Ooh. Yeah.

Six were just fun. Guys, Listeners, listeners, If you're commenting on.

On Spotify or Apple Podcast, or if you're in, like, our Facebook group or something, I want to hear everybody's six words. Because this was a lot of fun, actually. Yeah, yeah, it's hard. We want you to go through it.

All right, well, with that, then, let's go ahead and bring this one to our wrap. We are still. We have a bonus question, and I'm trying to think. Oh, you know what? The bonus question's great.

If the doctor walked into the tva, the way that it exists after Loki sacrifice, how might he react to it? There we go. It'll be a fun, fun, fun one. But if you want that, you got. You gotta wait.

You gotta wait till after the episode and then go to the Patreon or fourth wall or something. For now, though, we gotta give recommendations before we wrap this one up. And my recommendation, if you haven't been on a jet ski. Mobius is right.

Listen, Will says everybody geeks out on something. Will talks about how, like, he had someone in his congregation who really geeked out on stoplights.

You can't tell me Mobius isn't a geek for water jets. I think we should all try it. I think you might be on to something. That's my recommendation. All right, Alex, any recommendations for.

Recommendation?

You can just say water jet.

I don't know. Mine's kind of boring. Comparison wire jets. I would say books. Read a fun.

Read. How the West Was Whitewashed by C. T. Kirk, Justin.

Yeah.

That is it. That is it.

Greg.

I don't know what kind of recommendations I have. I recommend that. That the next episode of Doctor who that Alex watches on Alex's onboarding process.

That's Blink.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

That's supposed to be your first episode.

For those wondering. It's a gateway. It's a gateway.

Okay.

It was really weird that I started with Satan's bit. That is not anybody's first episode.

No. No one have I ever.

I am the only one. You could.

No one ever heard. That was their first episode. And they're still.

Yeah, yeah, I watched that. That nonsense and went, huh?

I want.

I think I want more, but I'm not sure. Took me a year to really decide.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I watched. I didn't have the same, but it was fine. We're both still here.

I really enjoyed those episodes, but they're very weird to start off. Don't start there.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaking of which, though, those are the review of the Satan Fit, I think is the first ever patron content that we've made. So if you guys. If you guys want an episode specifically about Doctor who Satan Fit, it's way back in the archives.

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We're going through some transitions and I don't know what we're using when you listen. Anyway, remember we are one very important thing for us to remember that we are all a chosen people, a geekdom, a priest. Till next time.