Joshua Noel and Christian Ashley dive deep into Disney's "Fun and Fancy Free," the third film from the package film era, and they’re ready to unpack its whimsical layers. Kicking things off, they chat about how this film blends two distinct stories—Bongo the bear’s quest for freedom and Mickey's escapades with the giant from Jack and the Beanstalk—while also touching on the broader themes of poverty and desperation that resonate even today. With a relaxed vibe, they share personal anecdotes, hilarious moments, and insightful critiques, all while dissecting how Disney's wartime budget constraints shaped the film's creation. They also ponder whether Bongo and Willie the Giant deserve a spot in the pantheon of beloved Disney characters. Throughout the episode, Joshua and Christian keep the banter light and witty, making it clear that while "Fun and Fancy Free" might not be the crown jewel of Disney's collection, it's still a fascinating piece of animation history worth exploring. So, grab your popcorn and settle in for a ride through nostalgia and commentary that’s as entertaining as it is thoughtful!

Diving into the whimsical world of Disney's animation, the latest episode of Systematic Geekology takes listeners on a nostalgic journey through the package film era, focusing on the lesser-known gem, 'Fun and Fancy Free.' Joshua Noel and Christian Ashley kick off this episode with their trademark lighthearted banter, setting the stage for an exploration of Disney's wartime creativity. They discuss the film's unique structure, a blend of two stories: 'Bongo the Bear' and 'Mickey and the Beanstalk,' framed by a slightly bizarre ventriloquist act. The hosts share personal anecdotes of their first encounters with the film and how it shaped their understanding of Disney's animation style. The conversation delves into the themes of freedom and love as seen through Bongo's journey from captivity to wild freedom, paralleling it with societal issues of the time. They highlight the film's charming characters, from Mickey's cleverness to the gentle giant, Willy, discussing how these characters often reflect more profound societal narratives than one might expect from a Disney film. Moreover, the episode touches on the animation techniques employed during the wartime era, showcasing how the constraints of the time led to innovative storytelling and character design. Overall, this episode is a delightful mix of nostalgia, insightful commentary, and playful humor, making it a must-listen for Disney enthusiasts and casual fans alike.

The conversation shifts into a comical yet insightful critique of 'Fun and Fancy Free,' as Joshua and Christian dissect the film with a blend of nostalgia and humor. They kick things off by reminiscing about their first encounters with the film, revealing how often they only saw parts of it, particularly the iconic Mickey and the Beanstalk segment. The hosts humorously recount the absurdities of the film, such as the premise of a ventriloquist entertaining a girl with puppet stories, which leads to a discussion on the effectiveness of storytelling in animation. They dive deep into the narrative, exploring Bongo's struggle for love and acceptance, and how it mirrors the harsh realities of life during the 1940s. Christian’s take on the giant, Willy, as an antihero reveals the complexities of character development in Disney films. The episode also tackles broader themes of societal struggles, cleverly linking the film’s narrative to contemporary issues of greed and poverty. Joshua and Christian engage in light-hearted banter while making poignant observations about the animation style, the clever reuse of backgrounds, and the innovative techniques that made the film visually appealing. The episode wraps up with ratings and a lively discussion about the film’s legacy, leaving listeners with a sense of nostalgia and a deeper appreciation for Disney's creative evolution during challenging times.

Takeaways:

• Joshua and Christian dive deep into Disney's 'Fun and Fancy Free', the third film in the package film era, exploring its unique storytelling structure and animation style that reflects the wartime context.
• The episode highlights the significance of the framing device with Jiminy Cricket, setting the stage for the whimsical yet poignant tales of Bongo the bear and Mickey's beanstalk adventure.
• Listeners learn how 'Fun and Fancy Free' illustrates themes of poverty and societal struggles, particularly in Mickey and the Beanstalk, prompting reflections on resource distribution and community support.
• Joshua and Christian share personal anecdotes about their first encounters with the film, revealing how nostalgia intertwines with their analysis of its cultural impact on Disney's legacy.

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Check out all of our Disney Animation Eras series:

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Hear more of our Disney episodes:

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Ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls, bears, mice and giants of all ages, we welcome you all to the wonderful world of Walt Disney's animation studios. Kinda. This is Mac Ecology talking about Walt Disney's animation studios.

We've been going through three films in each of Disney's animation eras and a few we made up because why not having a lot of fun with it? I am Joshua Noel. Today we are on the third film in the package film era, wartime era.

If that confuses some of you because we've been doing it so long, it's because we started this series doing two films per era, switched to three, and now we're going back around Encore, doing one more for the earlier eras to round it out to three films per era. So we are in the package film or wartime era of Disney animation today talking about Fun and Fancy3. Can't wait for this.

It's going to be a ton of fun. I'm already mentioned. I'm Joshua Noll. You're. Well, you're a res. Dis. Nerd. Here with the one and only true Keyblade master Christian Ashley.

How's it going?

That's from a previous recording. Did not mean to put that in there for this one. Yeah.

I wasn't even supposed to be here today, but apparently someone just had to take time off to like have a baby or something like that, you know? What an excuse.

You've seen the film though, right? Expert on fun and fancy free. Christian's the expert. It's gonna be a lot of fun. So what have you been geeking out on lately?

Let's see, my invention with Superman is continuing to go on and I'm really enjoying what they've. They've been doing with this season. Got a lot. We got the death of Superman going on. We got hints of maybe Darkseid showing up at some point in time.

Had a great episode recently with Mr. Mistel Flick and his wife. It was pretty fun.

Yeah, I've been. I've actually finally got around to finishing or starting and finishing binge watching the season two of Percy Jackson and the Olympians.

They've been doing a pretty good job. The show. A lot better than the movies from my understanding. I didn't read the books, but I'm like, I enjoy these more, so I guess they're better.

I don't know.

As someone who's read the books, this is a fairly faithful adaptation.

Nice. Nice. Yeah, it's fun. I know my cousin Ali's been on the show a few times. Was one of the original hosts and she loves it.

So I feel obligated to watch them. And I'm like, you know, these are pretty good. I just kept forgetting. There's so much stuff to watch. It's hard to remember everything.

But I'm enjoying it.

Yes.

I also enjoy recording this show with Christian. And if you guys enjoy us recording together and listening to it, then you should rate and review our show.

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We appreciate all of you and all of your time. Yeah, if we hear the rest of our Disney eras films, remember this is the third film in our package film era of Disney animation.

We've done plenty others. There's a link to the whole playlist also in the show description. There's lots of links down there.

Make sure you read through the show notes, follow us however you like, engage whatever way best suits you. We want to just have you joining us in all this geeky goodness and just being part of the community.

Yeah. Yeah. I was shocked to learn a couple of months ago that I had never actually seen this film and its totality until about two months ago.

And I had thought I'd seen it because I Had only ever seen the Mickey, Donald and Goofy with Willie the Giant part because that had been on, like, a separate VHS or something like that. Only that part of the film. And I had the framing device I had never seen before. The bongo part of the film I'd never seen seen before.

The only reason I know about the other parts of the film is because I was helping my brother move in Chicago. We had put the TV on in the background on Disney plus on, like, one of the random channels they had in Fun and Fancy Free were playing.

And while I'm like, screwing stuff together, I'm like, I don't remember that. I don't remember that because I've never seen it.

That is so funny. Yeah. I mean, I think, honestly I found out about it because of the House of Mouse show. I think they played part of the Giants.

And I have always been the weirdo who's like, where did that come from?

That's how I watched the original Three Musketeers for Disney and a few of the other movies and shorts they used to do is like, they play part of it on House of House. I'm like, there's gotta be more of that. And I would go find it. And that's how I eventually found fun of Hates Freeze.

I was probably in, like, middle school or something. I probably didn't tell anybody. I wouldn't watch it. But also, there's a reason anyone's ever seen the Jack and the Bing Stop part.

In my opinion, it's the good part. Yeah. Yeah. So, like, that's how, like, I remember the characters. Really, like House of Mouse. I remember seeing that giant pretty often. He was just.

He was a fun, silly giant. I was like, I don't know. I feel like Disney didn't invent Jack of the Beansock. Why is this giant here, like, him?

Not going to complain, but what about you? You just saw the movie for the first time a couple months ago.

You said you've seen the Jack and the Beanstalk part, but do you have any other memories of these characters or anything from. From ages before?

I remember loving that, however. Heck, I watched it back in the day.

Just the idea of poor Mickey, Donald and Goofy, like, struggling to get by and they're gifted with this opportunity to go up in this beanstalk. Yeah, I knew the jacket of Beanstalk Story, so it was very familiar to me. Ceiling Will in the giant as, like, the villain, but also not.

Is kind of weird. Like, in the framing device of the film, he shows up in the real world as it Were.

But, like, he's just kind of, like, looking for people and not, like, being villainous about it. It's very interesting now, compared to what I remember watching.

Yeah. That. Honestly, that's the only good part of seeing it as a film, is that I've just seen the short.

Is that in part, Giant, straight up walking around in real world. Just because it's like. To me, I thought it was just so funny how the one puppet was, like, going on about how sad he was, the giant died.

They're explaining, oh, it's a figment of your imagination. And then that happens. The guy thinks, like, what happened to him? A figment of his imagination. That, to me, funniest part of the whole.

The whole darn bit.

Yeah.

Like, that cracks me up every time, but that's great. So, yeah, not a lot of memories, really. But what we do remember, it's mostly the Jack in the Beanstop part.

I feel like every cartoon had an iteration of Jack and the Beans out. There's like, a Tom and Jerry one. I feel like Finney and Ferb did it at some point.

Like, pretty much any cartoon I could think of at some point was like, yeah, Jack and the Beanstalk. That. That needs to happen.

Public domain, baby.

Yeah. And usually it's pretty entertaining, I think. I like what they did here. Some of the changes. I like that the giant's a shapeshifter, not just a giant.

And I like, that was three of them and not just one, you know, oh, what a naive guy. Like, his friends were like, dude, what the heck are you talking about? And they all go onto the adventure together.

And it's not just, hey, sometimes people aren't crazy. It's. There's more to it. I feel like thematically, they wanted to say a lot more than they could say with what they did.

As you can tell, there's a lot about poverty, the system being broke, something being stolen from the town. Like, there's a lot of elements that I'm like, man, they could have really spun this out to a full movie, which is what they originally wanted to do.

But fun and such were short because of the war, and this is what we got. Instead, they just threw it in together with another story that was going to be a full movie.

And instead of either of them being a full movie, they both got to be part of a movie because budget constraints. Yeah. So how would you summarize the story? Stories of fun and fancy freak.

So, like I said, we have our framing device here in that there's this man who has some relation to the girl. It's a more innocent time, as it were, back in the day. Nothing nefarious about it. This would be seen with way different eyes.

Now, this guy, this ventriloquist, showing up with multiple dolls, dummies to spice up this girl's solo birthday party or something like that. I wasn't really paying attention that much to the first part. And some unfunny jokes are made. Some funny jokes are made. Yeah, go ahead.

I was gonna say it starts with Jiminy Cricket and then later transitions to that guy.

Oh, this is like, to me, this is where Jiminy Cricket really solidifies as one of the Disney mascots because, yeah, he was great in Pinocchio, but seeing him outside of Pinocchio in another feature length Disney film was kind of. It was unique.

Yeah, yeah. It's part of his thing too, is he's also there for that, like listening in on everything, on the events of the film and the stories being told.

And so the ventriloquist is telling the girl these stories. We start off with Bongo the bear who. Bongo is a circus bear. You know, think of the stereotypical, you know, unicycle performances.

You know, when you think of circus bear, that's what he does. But he's not fulfilled in his life. He loves, like, the attention, but at the same time he hates his job.

So one day you just like when the train is going by. By the way, I learned as I was doing research for this that this was intended to be like a pseudo sequel to Dumbo in some way.

Bongo was going to be like, either in that film or something like that. Or like they were going to show characters from Dumbo part of the circus. Interesting tidbit there. But he's forced out of the train. Yeah.

And is in the wild now. And as someone who's lives his entire life in captivity, knows nothing about the ways of the world, the natural world, as it were. So it's him.

He falls in love with some girl, bear learns that the only way to show affection in the bear world, which is a great lesson for all children to learn, is that when you want to show love and affection, you slap each other. Uh, which is once again, what an awesome message for today's children to hear, especially in loving relationships.

That's how you treat your spouse, potential girlfriend and the like. Wonderful.

And after he's learned how to slap really well and do all these tricks really well, he is accepted by the other bears, falls in love with the girl, and they're together.

Yeah. Uh, then that's why when I see Christian Ashley, I always greet him with a smack. It's. It's in the Bible too.

Greet one another with a holy smack on the cheek.

Yeah, it's my favorite part of Corinthians. So then we move to the next story, which is the more famous one, which is Mickey and the Beanstalk.

And Mickey, Donald and Goofy, as said before, are living in extreme poverty.

You know, the grand harp that was stolen from their kingdom, as it were, provided no rejuvenation in the fields and much wealth and everything, which is why the giant stole in the first place to take for his own. Or does he know that? Kind of hard to tell in the film. So they're left destitute.

They're like breaking apart these really thin slices of bread and beans just so they can survive for another day. It's actually pretty good animation.

A. A bean between the three of them.

Oh, that's right, a bean. And Donald goes crazy because he's tired of, like, living under these conditions.

And they go out, we're going to sell our cow to go make money, you know, as it is in the original folk tale. But many Mickey almost said many Mickey is instead encouraged to buy this bag of beans, magic beans.

And now, of course, it gets everyone upset, but in the middle of the night, the beans grow after having them tossed down underneath the house and they go into the clouds. They find a giant up there to find a harp.

They rescue the harp after dealing with, like, dragonflies and the like, are able to then descend and end up killing the giant.

But not really in the story by breaking down, you know, the beanstalk where we didn't get to the end of the film where Willie is in fact still alive, looking for Mickey and friends. And the girl's okay, I guess happy now.

Great birthday party. Saw a real life animated giant. Yeah, it's a. It's wild. Yeah, it's wild and fancy free.

Yes.

So, I mean, I don't have anything to say that that's what happens. You have a story about Bongo the bear that feels very similar to Dumbo. That's just instead of, oh, he's weird because of his birth defects.

It just is simply the part of, yeah, I want to be loved for who I am and not what I can do for people. It's like, okay, fair.

And then the second part's Jack and the Beanstalk story told a little bit differently with some different elements of, like, what's happening to the society as a whole. Not Just Jackson kind of, you know, it was cool. I liked it.

And both were kind of framed within this weird ventriloquist puppet person showing up to a girl's birthday. But, like, it's actually being narrated by Jiminy Cricket explaining to you that there's a ventriloquist. I don't know, man. That part is just.

Just out there. But you gotta think package film era. The other ones we've talked about, also pretty out there. Ichabod and Mr. Toad's.

The most normal of the package is three caballero. No, not normal at all. Like, very not normal. What was the other one that came before the Three Caballeros? That one was just. I almost did that.

The.

Whatever. The. I can't even pronounce it right now.

Oh, gosh. What is it? Three Caballeros.

That one.

Saludos, amigos.

Yeah. Yeah. That would have been impossible for us to review with the straight face. I think that might be Disney's worst film.

It's not bad, but it just does not measure up at all to the other Disney films.

Yeah.

So that said, Christian, you had us to rate this final Fancy free from 0 to 10. How are you rating this one?

I mean, if it was just Mickey and the Beanstalk, like, I'd give this a 10. But it is hindered by the fact that there are two other segments in this film. I guess maybe a six.

And I think, lay in mind, again, when I rate, I'm comparing to the other things. I'm not just giving it like, a 0 to 100%, like, grade.

Like, you know, I'm not giving it A, B, C, D. No, they're, like, compared to all other Disney films. Where does this sit? I'm giving it like, a two or a three.

Probably closer to two, but I'm gonna say three because there's probably some films I'm not thinking of, like, that there are worse. We mentioned some of the other ones in the back of the film. There are worse.

But there are also some of the package films that are the three caballeros, Igbo out of Mr. Toad that are better. And the package film is just not the best era of Disney on top of that. So, like, I can find better movies in the era and the other eras are better.

So it's like, I don't know. It's got to be pretty. Pretty low for me. And again, I'm not saying it's bad.

I think it's worth your time to watch in the background, you know, whatever. It's entertaining, but just doesn't measure up to other Disney films for me. Sorry. For those who maybe that's their favorite.

I don't know who you are, but I apologize. So we do want to talk some about the art and animation. You can kind of tell what they did to make this affordable.

Like a huge chunk of this film is them narrating just basically like a house video with an older man, a young girl and some puppets. The film filled lot of time with that because it's cheap.

More to some time, even the part where the animations interacting, if you notice the live action people in the animation are almost never in the screen at the same time. Way too expensive for the time for them to do that. Do you notice the actual scenes? It's a lot of reused backgrounds, like a whole lot.

Both Bongo and Final Fantasy were supposed to be full length films that they shortened, cut down to what they could and just kind of used what they had. The good part of that though is a lot of the animation is pretty cool. They do some wacky interesting things.

They do some like puns because like they couldn't rely on having a star cast. They couldn't rely on a budget. They just had to be good at drawing. It was Disney's nine old men, Walt himself being Mickey.

And they said, let's see what we can still get done. Even in World War II, because art still important. They did what they could. Yeah.

And this was one of Walt Disney's last times playing Mickey Mouse before he handed the voice off to someone else. So, you know, interesting stuff. I can't think of anything else that really makes this film stand out for me.

Do you any other like history, art, animation, gags that you were like? Oh, that was kind of cool. You didn't see a lot of animation interacting with the real world back then. So that was unique.

Like I said earlier, like the see through bread that they do and like you can like the haggard appearances of our trio in this film is really well done. The Dragonfly assault is pretty fun.

The, the bean salt growing in the night and them like jumping out of bed while they're still asleep is handled extremely well. Struggling to think, I guess the Bongo nature scenes are fine. I. I really don't care for it. So I'm struggling. I'm trying to like throw a bone. Yeah.

Oh, and we get the live action scenes with the mix of animation near the end with Willy like interacting with the house and bringing it up like for the time. That's the effects are pretty well done.

Yeah, yeah. I Think I agree. Yeah, The Beamstock, even just from an animation standpoint, the beanstalk one just stands out so much more to me.

They wanted the Golden Harp or the Singing Harp was supposed to be like another Disney mascot. They wanted it to be a big deal and it just didn't catch on. But Willy's giant shows up a lot more later on. He's in House of Mouse.

He's in a few other things. He's the Christmas Carol, he's the giant ghost. They reuse Willy a lot because that character stood out. People loved.

But what they did with the giant there, like, he was a funny character. He was so like, oh, the antagonist, you know, whatever. You're like, oh, yeah, okay.

I know I'm supposed to cheer against him, but he was still likable. So, you know, they did. And then I think part of why they made him a shape changer is why, like, package films.

You could tell there were some parts where we were on a budget, but Disney's nine old men were like, we still want to animate cool stuff. So I think they just made him a shapeshifter so they could animate some stuff and kind of show off a little bit because they were bored.

I really think that's part of why they were bored and wanted to show off a little bit. That's like three caballeros. That insane scene at the end to us now we're like, huh, Why'd they do that?

But like, if you were back then, you're like, whoa, how did they do that? The animation was revolutionary. And now we're like, that was kind of weird.

We're spoiled.

We don't have the context. Yeah, we don't have the context for how crazy it was to be able to achieve such animation feats.

But to do it on a budget and have a shape shifting giant, so pretty impressive. Okay, that out of the way.

Christian, if you had to pick a favorite scene, a favorite song, and a favorite character from Fun and Fancy Free, who you going with?

Scene? I mean, Donald's breakdown. Like, I feel for him. Yeah, he's doing some crazy things, but, like, brought to the point of starvation.

And after all the hard work they've done, they haven't produced anything. It makes perfect sense to me. I think that's a great voice acting, great animation around this because, like, you feel for this poor duck.

He's like, lost it. I. I love what they did there with that. Are there songs in this movie?

There's a few. There's a Fun and Fancy Free.

It's I. I'm okay. I don't doubt you. I just don't remember there being a song or if it did, it was like, okay, and I moved on with my life.

Or maybe it was because I was doing other things while watching the film. So who knows Characters, like. Well, I mean, it's hard not to like Lily. I mean, they make him almost look like a simpleton, but they don't do.

They do a kind of dopey voice, but not in a. Like, he's completely and utterly stupid. Like, yeah, he's simple, but he's not like, you know, an idiot. Like, there's still some menace behind him.

And I can definitely see later on why he called on with people. We've seen him as many times as we do. Like, he's on Mickey Mouse Clubhouse right now. I think that's still airing, you know, for the smaller children.

I've seen a couple of episodes. Like, and he's just a nice guy they're friends with. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, I think that's what it's hard for me because part of me wants to say Jiminy Cricket's my favorite character because he's Jiminy Cricket, guys, like. And he's a good narrator. He has the right reaction to everything of being like, what? Huh? Why? It is just the correct reaction.

But yeah, so I'm not gonna say him. I am gonna say Willie the Giant. Favorite character because same reason. My favorite scene is actually when.

So Mickey's trying to like, deceive him because, you know, you always have. Jack deceives the giant, they trick him, they get away. And it's like the way he deceives him is like, this giant just wants to be loved.

He wants to be liked. He is very selfish. He's self centered. And that's why he took the harp for himself. But he's not like, malevolent.

Like, he's not like, oh, I want to crush these stupid little humans. He just cares about himself too much. And like, Mickey's tricky. And like, oh, you could really transform into a fly.

And they're gonna take this fly swatter and swat the fly when he becomes a tiny fly, right? And like, instead he turns into a bunny because he keeps like, wouldn't it be cool if I was a bunny?

And they hold up the fly swatter and he's like, wait a minute. And that was so funny to me because, like, a. It was just funny that he turned into a pink little bunny. He's like, look at me.

And they thought they were gonna Go. It was funny scene, but also it really shows the heart of. It was like. And to me, this is always a big thing when you retell a story.

The changes someone makes to the story is probably the big point. And that's why I wish we could have seen this as a longer film. Because he wasn't trying to be malevolent.

What you see in the scene is, like, he wanted friends. He wanted, like, whatever, but they wanted to just squash him and move on. Treat him like he's just a bad guy, not a human who did some human thing.

I mean, he's a giant, so he's not a human, but you know what I mean?

So having that kind of, like, irony, so you have, like, the comedy, but then you're also like, not only was that funny, but also it's like, oh, yeah, Mickey trying to trick them so they could murder him when he wasn't actually trying to hurt them. Still seems kind of wrong. So it's like, I don't know. It's a layered scene for me. I like that. Maybe it's because I think too much,.

But I think that's fair.

Yeah.

Because.

Yeah.

It's not made in the film. Apparent in the film. Like, yeah, I'm doing this because I'm evil and I just really want this harp. Yeah.

He's conceited, a little selfish, but he's not like, I to hurt other people. And I know I'm hurting them by taking this harp.

Yeah. Yeah.

As far as we're aware.

Yeah. So I. Favorite song.

I'm trying to remember if this happened in a dream for Evan when they went to Giant Land, but there's a song of Goofy and Donald thinking that they're going to eat until they die. To me, it's just so darn funny. It's catchy, too.

But I'm like, man, if, like, the next time I go to Disney World and go to Liberty Tree Tavern and they're like, it's endless meat, all of a sudden the speaker played eat until I die. That would just be priceless. That would be great.

It'd be my rallying prize.

Yeah, I got this. I'll do it for you, Donald. Oh, man. I just. I don't know. I love that song. I think it's funny.

The whole film, like, that whole part of the film is so good. It's just so disappointing as a whole, what we got. Because, like, the giant part, I don't know, I just feel like it could have been so much more.

But that said, we do have Some interesting themes to talk about. We'll start with Bongo the bear, since that's the first part of the film. You see that he's yearning for freedom.

It really feels like so much of a rehash of Dumbo.

But you also see of like him not wanting to be controlled, and then he finds love by finding the other bears and that one girl who understands him, even though they do the weird slapping thing. But I think it's important to talk about love, is understanding love, not being controlling, that kind of stuff.

Christian, if we're thinking about it more seriously, how do you go about that kind of concept they're trying to show there?

I mean, you can go in the general sense of humanity, you can go into other way of animals. I'll focus on the animal choir first. I mean, at this time in history, like, circuses were filled to the brim with animals.

And today that is heavily frowned upon because people would see the conditions that they were kept under or the beatings that they would get if they didn't perform correctly.

And, you know, I have mixed feelings on that because, you know, it introduced a lot of these animals to people, the circus, across time, so that they can understand them a little better. Maybe we actually want to care about them even more, but at that same time, I don't care for how most of them were treated. It's that.

That weird moment of, like, I learned more about them because I got to see them in person. But behind the scenes, how are they being taken care of?

Not saying that every circus ever was abusive, but it happened enough to where legislation started getting passed. And it be like, hey, you should really stop doing this. To where, like, modern circuses focus way more on people than they do animals.

So there's that part. Then you get to the freedom part. Poor Bongo, I mean, I guess he has an arc. And the.

The idea of, I'm being told to do this, this is how they want me to be. What about what I want? Well, everyone goes through that. And like, how do you challenge that? Is it.

Are you actually supposed to be the thing that they want you to do? Are you going to do it your way, or are you supposed to be something completely different? Like it in a childish, childlike way?

Childish is the wrong way to say it. It does a good enough job for introducing the concept to children of, hey, just because someone says this doesn't mean you have to be that.

Yeah, yeah, no, I agree with the animal stuff once a. There's a reason the AZA will not accredit any circus.

For those who don't know, it's the Aquarium and Zoo association and its accreditation means that the animals are being taken care of. But it's weird because they typically don't accredit anyone who forces animals to entertain. But you do see, sometimes.

Most of the time, SeaWorld actually has been AZA accredited. They have been known to lose their accreditation a couple times. You know, I follow up on this stuff. It's important to me. It is.

Zoos are interesting and a lot of people are just against all animals being portrayed like this.

But, like, you gotta think, a lot of the zoos, the animals in that zoo will not live that long if they're not in that zoo, which is why they're there. They're being taken care of. They're being used to study so that we can help other animals. They're there because they won't survive in the wild.

Like, there is a reason for zoos, circuses, I don't think you can say the same thing for. So, fine, whatever. I guess I'm against circus animals, but, man, they're fun to see on tv.

But, like, I don't think I would go to a circus that was treating animals that way because I do care about such things. But, yeah, like, as far as love and stuff. Yeah. Understanding the person you love. You know, my wife, I don't expect her to understand Kingdom Hearts.

I expect her to understand that I love Kingdom Hearts. And When Kingdom Hearts 4 comes out, she's going to understand that I play it. Like I know her.

She's like, for Christmas, she found this really cool raincoat. That was Kingdom Hearts scene with all the Kingdom Hearts stuff on it. Does she know anything about it?

No, but she understands me and cares about me, and that's what love is. It's not controlling, saying, like, what I, like, do what I do. You can't play this video game at this time or you gotta do this with me. It's.

I understand you and I appreciate you for who you are, even if I'm not into the same thing all the time.

She knows she'll be a widow for like a month or two months while you devote yourself completely to that. And you taught her that by slapping her.

Not any of those last things that she said at all.

This, of course, couldn't happen because she's not real to begin with.

You've met my wife now.

I met the woman you hired to pretend to be your wife.

So, anyway, on to the next thing. Jack of the Big stock, the Mickey Mouse Version there's a systemic failure happening.

The whole city, everyone's collapsing because this harp gets taken from them. They're all in desperate poverty. The desperation shows differently why some people are angry all the time. Some people are fighting and fighting.

Mickey Mouse is like, I'm gonna try anything. Even throwing beans in the ground and hoping for a giant money making machine. I don't know, I don't understand the motivation there.

But they're magical beings. Like. Like everybody is just so desperate and that's what makes the giant bad.

Not that he's trying to hurt everyone, but that he took something from them and it really ruined the whole society. Watching it today was really weird for me because I'm like, I think that just describes the current president of the United States of America.

He I don't think is always out evil and wants to hurt everybody, but he just cares so much about himself that he's taking things and doing stuff for himself that does seem to harm other people.

Other people take a hit.

Yeah. And it's causing a lot of poverty and a lot of problems in our country and other countries.

Again, not making it political, but it's just one of the way I'm looking at it going, that's really realistic. Like that actually happens.

Like not a real giant, but where someone takes something and they're just not thinking of the repercussions and that turns them into a villain, even if they're not villainous. So I thought that was a really interesting aspect and again should have been a full movie. But Christian, would you like to comment on that?

Any that aspect of the film?

I mean, that makes perfect sense to me. It's like sometimes resources are taken from people and you don't even recognize it.

Whether that's you took someone else's time, you someone else's fame and all you were doing was something else and you intended this, but this came out instead. That's just personal.

Then we get to larger picture with people like you have this one specific resource, whatever, and they mine it or they plant for it. And as a result people over here have less water because of irrigation needed over here to produce this plant.

You know, the farmers aren't intending to for someone else to suffer drought conditions. But without the water, they don't have any way to feed their plants in that way.

In the same way that these people over here need that water to get stuff done that are not able to because farmer here is doing this. Like the farmer isn't inherently evil, but it feed.

They feel like villains because of the actions that they do versus, you know, like, certain water companies that want to bottle water and make sure no one else has access to it. That would actually be villainous because the intent is greed.

The intent is to cause harm for the sake of self when it comes to the poverty side of things. Once again, I really feel for our trio in this film.

Like, they are so haggard and, like, downtrodden and desperate that, like, they give in to a hope. And that's what why Mickey makes the decision that he does to buy those magic beans. He's like, well, I have this cow.

But, like, we could kill the cow maybe, but the meat will be gone eventually. What are we going to do? Well, maybe something could be grown in this ground. Maybe magic beans can actually grow in a drought condition. Who knows?

So we give in to hope, sometimes false hope. This actually turned in his favor, but he didn't know that for sure.

And that can bring us to desperation to make decisions we wouldn't otherwise make.

Yeah, yeah. It's. Yeah, also really funny that the ventriloquist and the puppet, the one puppet going, I do not want to hear this story.

If they eat that cow, I will stop listening. It's so funny. The other one's like, wait a minute, cheeseburgers. And I'm like, well, there is pretty clear which one I relate to most here anyway.

But, yeah, one of the things I find really interesting, this has been brought to my attention over the last couple years from a couple different friends, how this happens in real life and not directly political, but it's interesting how many times in different films you'll see these hicks and the Appalachians, they're portrayed as, like, savages, almost like the evil. You go into their town and they're, you know, whatever.

And, like, I think a lot of the times, people from more wealthy areas, especially up north, they think of Appalachians either as uncultured, uneducated, whatever, or they think that they genuinely don't care about other people. Like, they just have a negative vision. A lot of people in your Appalachians have a terrible vision of people up north and stuff.

And some of it's somewhat justified.

They've been tearing down all these trees and stuff to make these computer chips for all these fancy cars and electric, you know, whatever, and the video game systems and all the stuff. And mostly where we're getting that resource from is the Appalachians. We're destroying their towns and giving them nothing in return.

And they're just like, yeah, the north must be evil, and they need to know It. And like, the people at north are just like, oh, educated people up out there. They're just angry all the time.

And, you know, they have no idea what they're taking from these sounds. And it's like, huh, that's pretty much what happens in this film.

I don't think they were trying to be that deep with it, but I watched it going, man, this is just so weirdly relevant.

I agree.

They probably weren't thinking of this, but it is that you can get unintended aesops in a film or, yeah, like, oh, Walter didn't mean for that to happen. But if you think about it, go, okay, that makes sense. Yeah.

I'm like, ah, yeah. Maybe all kids just need to watch this growing up and we'll have a better world. But only this part, they don't need to watch Bongo.

They can leave that part.

We may. We may turn them into very things we don't want them to be while watching the other parts of the film.

Indeed. Indeed. All right, you want to say anything else about, like, the selfishness or anything else that we see thematically in this film?

Are you ready to move on to where we see these characters outside of the movie?

It is an inherently selfish thing to take the harp for yourself because it produces good things, because it can sing and all this good stuff that happens because something like that, it's meant for everyone, like. And yeah, it is. It is a villainous action to take it.

That does not inherently make Willie a villain, but when you keep acting this way, it's harder to support you. So we are taught to give our gifts to others, our talents to others. Like, that is day one, like Christianity right there. Yes.

We are a Christian podcast, and we bring it up when it has to.

Like, the literal word talent we get comes from the actual money back in the day that was given for a day's wage or what have you, or I can't remember which one of us. A day or a year. So use that wisely. Make something of this. Otherwise your creditor God is going to come back and go, hey, what'd you do?

I gave you this, I gave you that. Why didn't you love the people around you? Well.

Well, if I just hold it on to myself out of fear or because I don't want to work, then I don't love people as well as I say I do. Yeah. Yeah.

And it's not a one to one relationship, but it's interesting. I'm a general manager of a corporate store now, and it's fun. I've seen part of this before I became a manager.

But, like, it just really stands out to me now. You know what it is? Honestly, Sometimes I don't like speaking to things until I've gone through it.

To know that I'm not also one of the selfish bad guys, I have to put myself through the test. I'm like, okay, now I can talk about those other people because I'm not them. I just had to make sure.

But it's not saying you're not taking from anyone, but the amount of times, like, people, you know, in my position who can get a bonus if their store does really well, have all their workers work extra hard, do all this extra work, all this stuff, and, like, hey, they get paid hourly. That's cool. It's fine. Whatever. Boss gets a bonus. They got paid hourly into the story. But then a lot of them feel like, I work harder.

I don't get anything extra. They feel like they're not being appreciated, whatever. And then to me, who.

I think the really good GMs are the ones who are like, hey, that's their bonus. But also, hey, guys, we achieved something huge. I'm gonna throw a pizza party after work.

I want to give you all something to show you a token of appropriation. It's like, yeah, if you get something, appreciation, you should. Thank you, you should share it.

I don't think you should hold on to it and be like, it's all mine. Now I have this extra thing. Like, it just makes sense. Some things are a gift, a bonus. And sometimes it's good to share. Not all of it.

Not, like, equally. Like, okay, I'm gonna divide my bonus up and give everybody cash. That's not what I'm talking about.

I'm just saying, like, if you don't show any appreciation to the people who helped you get where you are, or if you don't share good things that happen to you when you have the chance to. You know, I think if you're wealthy, you should share your wealth. If you're poor, you should.

If you're in a church, the people in your church should be helping you. I don't expect the poor people to share their. You know what I mean?

I just think, like, if you have a golden harp that produces good things, you should share it.

So instead of appropriating their wealth for yourself, you appreciate them.

Ah, there we go. We turn my stuttering speech impediments your.

Robber baron mentality now that you're part of the machine.

Yeah, yeah, there we go. All right, question. Can you think of anywhere else that we see Bongo the Bear or Jiminy Cricket or Mickey Mouse outside?

I mean, as far as I'm concerned, Bongo didn't exist before this film. And he doesn't exist after this film. I don't know, maybe, you know. Yeah, exactly.

But yeah, Willie, like I said, House of Mouse, Disney House, Clubhouse, Christmas Carol. Surely there was something else he's been in.

Probably.

Is he in the parks at all?

A couple times. I know he's in the Art of Animation Resort at Disney World. And sometimes he's on merch.

If you go to like a Disney Expo or something, you know, he's cool. Bongo does appear a few other places. Christian, I hate to tell you, I genuinely apologize.

How dare you contradict.

Him and Lulu Bell both made somewhat regular appearances at the parks until the 90s.

He has a name.

When we were born. They also had a cameo appearance at the Breyer Bear show.

And two of the country bears at the Muppets Walt Disney World as an audience for Fozzie Bears, a stand up comedy act. But more importantly, he makes a couple short cameos in Disney's Christmas Carol.

And I think the most notable reappearance of Bongo that's actually a little bit funny. The second Aladdin film, the Return of Jafar.

During the one feswig party, one of the songs or whatever genie briefly turns into Bongo during one of the songs.

Just what?

Because they were like, you know what? Let's just do a little nonsense.

Your reference. Because we can.

Yeah, yeah.

More power to them. Okay.

Also this. I just looked this one up, I gotta be honest.

Reference now that's doing it for the art. I can appreciate that.

Phenomenal. Don't like Bongo. But man, hats off to whoever was on that Zootopia team and said wait a minute. That bear up there in the painted.

What if he was wearing Bongo's outfit and everybody else in the room went who the hell is. You know, hats off to that man. Thank you. Thank you for you and your work. Even if I do hate Bongo. That's. That's pretty clever. Oh man.

I think that's all I got. I'm. I'm bongoed out.

Dang it. You beat me to It. I was just about to make that joke.

So let's, let's start wrapping this up. Oh, man. At the end of the. At the end of this episode, we're gonna ask a question just for our official members.

What if both of these films were made into future length movies? How could they be improved? Half of that question's really easy. We'll see. What do we do with the other half?

For now though, Christian, do you have a recommendation for those listening?

Yeah. I recently saw the movie Hungry, which is a horror film with a hippo. Hippo. Hippo in the Louisiana bayou.

I was immensely surprised at how much I loved this film. I thought it was going to be a schlocky monster flick, but they use actual history to justify why it's there.

And they do some really good stuff with, you know, the suspense and the like. I actually really enjoyed Hungry, much like.

A recording we did earlier today. I was trying to look up what I was talking about.

That's why I write them down beforehand so I don't forget.

So I'm gonna do a really weird recommendation. I recommend that you guys check something out when it comes out that hasn't come out yet. Yeah.

So some Supernatural comics have actually turned out to be okay from the Supernatural television show. Coming up, they're doing Supernatural Wayward. It's gonna be a one off special in September. And after that there's gonna be two separate series.

Supernatural Dean Winchester and Supernatural Sam Winchester. I'm excited to see what they do. I've heard it was one of the Dynamite. Why can't I think of the name Dynamite? Dynamite. Yeah.

Dynamite Entertainment says one of their more ambitious events. So, you know, Dynamite doesn't usually do a ton of stuff. I'm willing to give it.

You know, it's not like when Marvel is like, oh, this is a big event for us, man. Every other Tuesday is a big event for you. Marvel. Dynamite says that I'm willing to listen. They don't say that all the time.

Everything will be changed forever.

Yeah, all the time. Everything's always changed forever, Marvel. We get it.

So I recommend you checking out some of those Supernatural comics with me when they come out because I'm excited for them. And with that, I do want to thank and shout out one of our financial supporters, Frank Taglauer.

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